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LAB could be taking a big risk with ads like this – politicalbetting.com

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  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614

    Sandpit said:

    Someone in Sharjah is waving a WBA flag

    Not guilty!
    Are you actually there?
    Yep!

  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,688

    Omnium said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    maaarsh said:

    The only way is down for cases now, the last virgin territory for Covid is gone and the fall is accelerating.

    let us hope that hospitalisations and deaths also drop. Case numbers don't matter - so we're told - as long as the other two metrics are down.
    What's the sweet spot of just enough people getting ill/dying to keep Boris in trouble, but not enough to make his haters feel like they're wishing bad on people?
    Gosh, you are so very protective of your "Boris". Who would you support if he was playing Arsenal?
    There there. Sorry to have touched a nerve by calling Sir Keir, "Sir Keir"
    Yep, anybody disses your Boris and you get right on their case, don't you, touching their nerves and stuff.
    Disses - Oh to be back in the 90s
    Now EYE seem to have touched a nerve and you're stuck thinking up replies. :smile:

    You should leave it out, mate, I'm not worth it.
    Don't undersell yourself Kinabalu. Of course you are worth it!
    Dodgy old Mr K. Worth it... the jury must be out!
    He's a diamond!
    He can be a cheery rough rock so far as I'm concerned, so long as he's cheery. Mr K?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,715
    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 14,772
    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    I was talking about the distinction between claiming for airpods on expenses and acting as the Member for Randox in Parliament. Blair is no longer standing for election.
  • isamisam Posts: 40,721
    edited November 2021
    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    maaarsh said:

    The only way is down for cases now, the last virgin territory for Covid is gone and the fall is accelerating.

    let us hope that hospitalisations and deaths also drop. Case numbers don't matter - so we're told - as long as the other two metrics are down.
    What's the sweet spot of just enough people getting ill/dying to keep Boris in trouble, but not enough to make his haters feel like they're wishing bad on people?
    Gosh, you are so very protective of your "Boris". Who would you support if he was playing Arsenal?
    There there. Sorry to have touched a nerve by calling Sir Keir, "Sir Keir"
    Yep, anybody disses your Boris and you get right on their case, don't you, touching their nerves and stuff.
    Disses - Oh to be back in the 90s
    Now EYE seem to have touched a nerve and you're stuck thinking up replies. :smile:

    You should leave it out, mate, I'm not worth it.
    If I had known it would upset you this much, I'd never have called Sir Keir, "Sir Keir"
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,715
    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Someone in Sharjah is waving a WBA flag

    Not guilty!
    Are you actually there?
    Yep!

    ENVIOUS!
  • I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Claudia Webb is currently an Independent and the Labour Party or any other party for that matter has no direct influence on whether she chooses to resign or stay.

    Demanding Rayner's resignation because Paterson resigned may be a fair point. But you should also be demanding Matt Hancock and several other MPs from the Labour and Conservative Parties fall on their swords too for over indulging in Apple products at the taxpayers expense.

    It suits me if Rayner is defenestrated for her ear buds. It would make it much easier to throw Johnson to the dogs over Carrie's wallpaper...or doesn't that count?
    Your second paragraph is the crucial one. Any of them caught doing anything crooked should resign. They are supposed to be deciding our laws and the rules by which they expect us to lead our lives. How can they do that if they themselves are crooked.

    Saying it was only £249 instead of millions is really like saying it was only 1 murder instead of 50. Someone who murders 1 is just as much a murderer as someone who murders 50. Someone who steals from the taxpayer to the tune (or the itune) of £249 is just as much a crook as someone who does it for millions.
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    Like to see Livingston get a bit of a bat. We may need his power hitting later, especially without Roy.

    And I get my wish.
    Malan would need to get off strike for Livingstone to have a go
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    maaarsh said:

    The only way is down for cases now, the last virgin territory for Covid is gone and the fall is accelerating.

    let us hope that hospitalisations and deaths also drop. Case numbers don't matter - so we're told - as long as the other two metrics are down.
    What's the sweet spot of just enough people getting ill/dying to keep Boris in trouble, but not enough to make his haters feel like they're wishing bad on people?
    Gosh, you are so very protective of your "Boris". Who would you support if he was playing Arsenal?
    There there. Sorry to have touched a nerve by calling Sir Keir, "Sir Keir"
    Yep, anybody disses your Boris and you get right on their case, don't you, touching their nerves and stuff.
    Disses - Oh to be back in the 90s
    Now EYE seem to have touched a nerve and you're stuck thinking up replies. :smile:

    You should leave it out, mate, I'm not worth it.
    If I had known it would upset you this much, I'd never have called Sir Keir, "Sir Keir"
    I wouldn't emphasise it, actually. British politics could do with a Bath to clean it up, and he is one.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    edited November 2021

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    I was talking about the distinction between claiming for airpods on expenses and acting as the Member for Randox in Parliament. Blair is no longer standing for election.
    Was Paterson worse than Blair?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 50,753
    Surely 1 ball on the stumps and Malan is out of there? Or do SA want him just burning deliveries?
  • JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    I was talking about the distinction between claiming for airpods on expenses and acting as the Member for Randox in Parliament. Blair is no longer standing for election.
    iirc the original Airpods complaint was that Rayner had charged the taxpayer for engraving her name on them. Only after it turned out that was free did "concern" change to her having bought them in the first place.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    edited November 2021

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Claudia Webb is currently an Independent and the Labour Party or any other party for that matter has no direct influence on whether she chooses to resign or stay.

    Demanding Rayner's resignation because Paterson resigned may be a fair point. But you should also be demanding Matt Hancock and several other MPs from the Labour and Conservative Parties fall on their swords too for over indulging in Apple products at the taxpayers expense.

    It suits me if Rayner is defenestrated for her ear buds. It would make it much easier to throw Johnson to the dogs over Carrie's wallpaper...or doesn't that count?
    Your second paragraph is the crucial one. Any of them caught doing anything crooked should resign. They are supposed to be deciding our laws and the rules by which they expect us to lead our lives. How can they do that if they themselves are crooked.

    Saying it was only £249 instead of millions is really like saying it was only 1 murder instead of 50. Someone who murders 1 is just as much a murderer as someone who murders 50. Someone who steals from the taxpayer to the tune (or the itune) of £249 is just as much a crook as someone who does it for millions.
    There was an actual Victorian judge who dismissed a charge against a pickpocket because the indictment stated he was charged on 144 counts and only enumerated 143 of them.
  • JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    The biggest difference between the Tories and Labour is that the latter have been out of power, and therefore without the opportunities, for over a decade.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    Will it cause an international incident if England just walk off the pitch now?

    (Fair play, they’re playing straight).
  • ydoethur said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Claudia Webb is currently an Independent and the Labour Party or any other party for that matter has no direct influence on whether she chooses to resign or stay.

    Demanding Rayner's resignation because Paterson resigned may be a fair point. But you should also be demanding Matt Hancock and several other MPs from the Labour and Conservative Parties fall on their swords too for over indulging in Apple products at the taxpayers expense.

    It suits me if Rayner is defenestrated for her ear buds. It would make it much easier to throw Johnson to the dogs over Carrie's wallpaper...or doesn't that count?
    Your second paragraph is the crucial one. Any of them caught doing anything crooked should resign. They are supposed to be deciding our laws and the rules by which they expect us to lead our lives. How can they do that if they themselves are crooked.

    Saying it was only £249 instead of millions is really like saying it was only 1 murder instead of 50. Someone who murders 1 is just as much a murderer as someone who murders 50. Someone who steals from the taxpayer to the tune (or the itune) of £249 is just as much a crook as someone who does it for millions.
    There was an actual Victorian judge who dismissed a charge against a pickpocket because the indictment stated he was charged on 144 counts and only enumerated 143 of them.
    Wow. :) Love these snippets from history.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,583
    .
    Omnium said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Labour are of course worse - much worse. Paterson illustrates an uncomfortable situation though with MPs getting paid by commercial interests.
    I don't have any connection with the Labour Party anymore, so I have no dog in the race, however, can you run that by me again with illustrations to help. Illustrations in crayon will be fine.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    England are not going to win from here.

    But they are going to knock SA out.
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    Can we have that longest 6s graphic again please lads
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    maaarsh said:

    Can we have that longest 6s graphic again please lads

    Boom, takes the record.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,715
    maaarsh said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    Like to see Livingston get a bit of a bat. We may need his power hitting later, especially without Roy.

    And I get my wish.
    Malan would need to get off strike for Livingstone to have a go
    And he has, and he has!
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    maaarsh said:

    Can we have that longest 6s graphic again please lads

    @DavidL gets his wish with a vengeance!
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    edited November 2021
    Glad I didn’t park behind that stand! Well out of the ground.
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    ydoethur said:

    England are not going to win from here.

    But they are going to knock SA out.

    They're going to need lots of Malan on strike to win. Just a pitching wedge to hit a 6 on this ground.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,557
    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
  • Knocked out with consecutive sixes? Sounds familiar...
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,112

    Carnyx said:

    Omnium said:

    Sandpit said:

    4!

    A poor choice. It's a surprisingly unimportant number.
    The smallest even non-prime?
    Also the first non-negative, non-zero integer which isn't equal to its own square.
    Isn’t that two? Or am I missing something?

    Remember, I’m a Physics teacher: number theory and groups only start to be useful in some of the wilder shores of particle physics that I didn’t fully understand when I was studying them.
    Sorry - quiote right. Woozy from Moderna booster. Also the first square above one which isn't equal to its own root ...
  • A Blue Collar blue print to rebuild America:

    Watch: President Biden celebrated the House passage of a $1 trillion bill to repair and modernize the nation’s aging infrastructure, a key legislative goal. https://nyti.ms/3BSqGJ4

    https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1457030059890548744?s=20
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    He's already had 6 6s in an over in his career. Meat & drink for our Liam.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    Hang on a minute, we actually might get these runs…
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    I think England have made the calculation that since whatever happens they've done what they need to, they might as well have a thrash and see what happens.

    Very entertaining.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,688

    .

    Omnium said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Labour are of course worse - much worse. Paterson illustrates an uncomfortable situation though with MPs getting paid by commercial interests.
    I don't have any connection with the Labour Party anymore, so I have no dog in the race, however, can you run that by me again with illustrations to help. Illustrations in crayon will be fine.
    I have no crayons. I think they're only used in the Labour manifesto these days.

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,557
    ydoethur said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Claudia Webb is currently an Independent and the Labour Party or any other party for that matter has no direct influence on whether she chooses to resign or stay.

    Demanding Rayner's resignation because Paterson resigned may be a fair point. But you should also be demanding Matt Hancock and several other MPs from the Labour and Conservative Parties fall on their swords too for over indulging in Apple products at the taxpayers expense.

    It suits me if Rayner is defenestrated for her ear buds. It would make it much easier to throw Johnson to the dogs over Carrie's wallpaper...or doesn't that count?
    Your second paragraph is the crucial one. Any of them caught doing anything crooked should resign. They are supposed to be deciding our laws and the rules by which they expect us to lead our lives. How can they do that if they themselves are crooked.

    Saying it was only £249 instead of millions is really like saying it was only 1 murder instead of 50. Someone who murders 1 is just as much a murderer as someone who murders 50. Someone who steals from the taxpayer to the tune (or the itune) of £249 is just as much a crook as someone who does it for millions.
    There was an actual Victorian judge who dismissed a charge against a pickpocket because the indictment stated he was charged on 144 counts and only enumerated 143 of them.
    Victorian values.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 14,772
    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    I was talking about the distinction between claiming for airpods on expenses and acting as the Member for Randox in Parliament. Blair is no longer standing for election.
    Was Paterson worse than Blair?
    I think so, yes, because in Paterson's case it was for personal gain, but I think that's a less important distinction. Also, there was a greater element of deception in Paterson's case, as he didn't declare his payments when writing his letters, whereas I believe the Ecclestone donation to Labour was declared within the rules.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,112
    edited November 2021

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    I was talking about the distinction between claiming for airpods on expenses and acting as the Member for Randox in Parliament. Blair is no longer standing for election.
    Also, however, the F1 thing was to influence policy. The ear buds, not so much, as you say.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
    It doesn't justify the Paterson case.

    I'm just saying that Blair's corruption was much, much worse than Paterson's
  • Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
    For me to vote for labour or the lib dems they need to make an offer that is acceptable to me
  • AslanAslan Posts: 1,673
    Carnyx said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    I was talking about the distinction between claiming for airpods on expenses and acting as the Member for Randox in Parliament. Blair is no longer standing for election.
    Also, however, the F1 thing was to influence policy. The ear buds, not so much, as you say.
    What's wrong with claiming air pods for expenses? If you need them for listening to business calls on the train between Westminster and your constituency, that seems reasonable.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,838
    edited November 2021
    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    maaarsh said:

    The only way is down for cases now, the last virgin territory for Covid is gone and the fall is accelerating.

    let us hope that hospitalisations and deaths also drop. Case numbers don't matter - so we're told - as long as the other two metrics are down.
    What's the sweet spot of just enough people getting ill/dying to keep Boris in trouble, but not enough to make his haters feel like they're wishing bad on people?
    Gosh, you are so very protective of your "Boris". Who would you support if he was playing Arsenal?
    There there. Sorry to have touched a nerve by calling Sir Keir, "Sir Keir"
    Yep, anybody disses your Boris and you get right on their case, don't you, touching their nerves and stuff.
    Disses - Oh to be back in the 90s
    Now EYE seem to have touched a nerve and you're stuck thinking up replies. :smile:

    You should leave it out, mate, I'm not worth it.
    Don't undersell yourself Kinabalu. Of course you are worth it!
    Dodgy old Mr K. Worth it... the jury must be out!
    He's a diamond!
    He can be a cheery rough rock so far as I'm concerned, so long as he's cheery. Mr K?
    Yep, thanks for asking. I'm neutral to positive. Usual feeltone for me. And I'm about to cast off Johnson and embrace the Breeders Cup.

    But just one last one for the road on the Magnificent Muscly Man aka Perfidious Posh -

    I heard Lou Macari on the radio this morning talking about his work with the homeless. What an admirable bloke he seemed, and I bet is. What particularly struck me, with BoJo's antics again in the spotlight, was we were listening to a 'person' with no trace of an intervening 'persona'. Eg, and cf Macari, you see clips of Jimmy Savile talk about his charity work and it's 100% persona, ie act, which causes the person to be hidden. A strong and constant 'persona' like that, which isn't the same thing as 'personality', doesn't have to be hiding something sinister, as with Savile, but such people make me uneasy. If you can develop one of these 'persona' things it helps you to amuse and entertain, and there’s nothing wrong with that, it’s why stage comics often have them, also certain posters on PB, but it also allows you to conceal, fool, deflect, distract, and to barefaced lie on matters large and small without compunction. Back to Johnson, this is imo the essence of our problem. We've elected a persona not a person as PM. It’s the first time we’ve done this and I really hope it’s the last.

    There, that's well and truly said now. I can relax and kick back.
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    edited November 2021
    Aslan said:

    Carnyx said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    I was talking about the distinction between claiming for airpods on expenses and acting as the Member for Randox in Parliament. Blair is no longer standing for election.
    Also, however, the F1 thing was to influence policy. The ear buds, not so much, as you say.
    What's wrong with claiming air pods for expenses? If you need them for listening to business calls on the train between Westminster and your constituency, that seems reasonable.
    Did she put the contract for them out to tender?

    Edit to add 😀
    I know they are not comparable.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,112
    Aslan said:

    Carnyx said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    I was talking about the distinction between claiming for airpods on expenses and acting as the Member for Randox in Parliament. Blair is no longer standing for election.
    Also, however, the F1 thing was to influence policy. The ear buds, not so much, as you say.
    What's wrong with claiming air pods for expenses? If you need them for listening to business calls on the train between Westminster and your constituency, that seems reasonable.
    Quite; bit expensive but useful in a way in which duck houses are not, still less influencing policy on food/tobacco.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,557
    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
    It doesn't justify the Paterson case.

    I'm just saying that Blair's corruption was much, much worse than Paterson's
    Because he was PM, yes.
    Thank goodness No10 is above that kind of behaviour now.
  • AslanAslan Posts: 1,673

    A Blue Collar blue print to rebuild America:

    Watch: President Biden celebrated the House passage of a $1 trillion bill to repair and modernize the nation’s aging infrastructure, a key legislative goal. https://nyti.ms/3BSqGJ4

    https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1457030059890548744?s=20

    Great jobs numbers, infrastructure passed, paid leave and climate policies coming next. Biden comeback starts here.
  • Labour are doing this wrong. 'Corrupt' is too strong a word to be persuasive for those who aren't already very anti-Tory, That's why Alastair Campbell used the milder word 'sleaze' so effectively in the 90s.

    Instead they should go in heavily on the government's arrogance, framing it repeatedly with the line that 'they don't think the rules apply to them'. It's a charge which will stick much more effectively than accusing the government of outright corruption.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    Nigelb said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
    It doesn't justify the Paterson case.

    I'm just saying that Blair's corruption was much, much worse than Paterson's
    Because he was PM, yes.
    Thank goodness No10 is above that kind of behaviour now.
    All it took from Blair was a smirk at the camera while saying that he was a "Pretty Straight Guy"

    cf.

    Blanket media coverage of BoJo
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,715
    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
    It doesn't justify the Paterson case.

    I'm just saying that Blair's corruption was much, much worse than Paterson's
    Because you expected better of the Vicar of St Albions?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729

    Labour are doing this wrong. 'Corrupt' is too strong a word to be persuasive for those who aren't already very anti-Tory, That's why Alastair Campbell used the milder word 'sleaze' so effectively in the 90s.

    Instead they should go in heavily on the government's arrogance, framing it repeatedly with the line that 'they don't think the rules apply to them'. It's a charge which will stick much more effectively than accusing the government of outright corruption.

    well, yes, because it's true. As they have demonstrated many times.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    35 from the last three overs. It’s been done before…
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254

    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
    It doesn't justify the Paterson case.

    I'm just saying that Blair's corruption was much, much worse than Paterson's
    Because you expected better of the Vicar of St Albions?
    No because lobbying is legal

    Paying PM 1M GBP to change policy is not.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    IshmaelZ said:

    ydoethur said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Claudia Webb is currently an Independent and the Labour Party or any other party for that matter has no direct influence on whether she chooses to resign or stay.

    Demanding Rayner's resignation because Paterson resigned may be a fair point. But you should also be demanding Matt Hancock and several other MPs from the Labour and Conservative Parties fall on their swords too for over indulging in Apple products at the taxpayers expense.

    It suits me if Rayner is defenestrated for her ear buds. It would make it much easier to throw Johnson to the dogs over Carrie's wallpaper...or doesn't that count?
    Your second paragraph is the crucial one. Any of them caught doing anything crooked should resign. They are supposed to be deciding our laws and the rules by which they expect us to lead our lives. How can they do that if they themselves are crooked.

    Saying it was only £249 instead of millions is really like saying it was only 1 murder instead of 50. Someone who murders 1 is just as much a murderer as someone who murders 50. Someone who steals from the taxpayer to the tune (or the itune) of £249 is just as much a crook as someone who does it for millions.
    There was an actual Victorian judge who dismissed a charge against a pickpocket because the indictment stated he was charged on 144 counts and only enumerated 143 of them.
    Gross.
    Now that was a good pun.
  • I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Claudia Webb is currently an Independent and the Labour Party or any other party for that matter has no direct influence on whether she chooses to resign or stay.

    Demanding Rayner's resignation because Paterson resigned may be a fair point. But you should also be demanding Matt Hancock and several other MPs from the Labour and Conservative Parties fall on their swords too for over indulging in Apple products at the taxpayers expense.

    It suits me if Rayner is defenestrated for her ear buds. It would make it much easier to throw Johnson to the dogs over Carrie's wallpaper...or doesn't that count?
    Your second paragraph is the crucial one. Any of them caught doing anything crooked should resign. They are supposed to be deciding our laws and the rules by which they expect us to lead our lives. How can they do that if they themselves are crooked.

    Saying it was only £249 instead of millions is really like saying it was only 1 murder instead of 50. Someone who murders 1 is just as much a murderer as someone who murders 50. Someone who steals from the taxpayer to the tune (or the itune) of £249 is just as much a crook as someone who does it for millions.
    False equivalence again. No-one's been murdered. Nothing's been stolen. Airpods and other tech kit are legitimate expenses, even if cheaper alternatives are available. Apple might be expensive but it works, is robust and is usually foolproof. As a techie, I'd have no objection to any MP buying Apple. (There is a separate argument that it would be better if tech kit were centrally supplied and supported by a parliamentary IT department but it isn't.)
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    Jason Roy is apparently suffering from a torn left calf.

    Which is very bad news for him and clearly rules him out probably of the winter tours as well as the rest of the T20WC
  • Mr Pedley, late of this Parish:

    Public opinion is complicated. The fact headline voting intention figures don’t move much a couple of days after event X doesn’t make it unimportant. Look at leader ratings, perceptions of govt / opposition, look at several polls not just one, take the long view.

    Or don’t....

    Put another way. One event is unlikely to permanently change anything unless it’s a really really major event. More important is the drip drip drip of negativity vs the govt measured against the fact voters aren’t buying Labour as an alternative.


    https://twitter.com/keiranpedley/status/1457034346318151699?s=20
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,688
    kinabalu said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    maaarsh said:

    The only way is down for cases now, the last virgin territory for Covid is gone and the fall is accelerating.

    let us hope that hospitalisations and deaths also drop. Case numbers don't matter - so we're told - as long as the other two metrics are down.
    What's the sweet spot of just enough people getting ill/dying to keep Boris in trouble, but not enough to make his haters feel like they're wishing bad on people?
    Gosh, you are so very protective of your "Boris". Who would you support if he was playing Arsenal?
    There there. Sorry to have touched a nerve by calling Sir Keir, "Sir Keir"
    Yep, anybody disses your Boris and you get right on their case, don't you, touching their nerves and stuff.
    Disses - Oh to be back in the 90s
    Now EYE seem to have touched a nerve and you're stuck thinking up replies. :smile:

    You should leave it out, mate, I'm not worth it.
    Don't undersell yourself Kinabalu. Of course you are worth it!
    Dodgy old Mr K. Worth it... the jury must be out!
    He's a diamond!
    He can be a cheery rough rock so far as I'm concerned, so long as he's cheery. Mr K?
    Yep, thanks for asking. I'm neutral to positive. Usual feeltone for me. And I'm about to cast off Johnson and embrace the Breeders Cup.

    But just one last one for the road on the Magnificent Muscly Man aka Perfidious Posh -

    I heard Lou Macari on the radio this morning talking about his work with the homeless. What an admirable bloke he seemed, and I bet is. What particularly struck me, with BoJo's antics again in the spotlight, was we were listening to a 'person' with no trace of an intervening 'persona'. Eg, and cf Macari, you see clips of Jimmy Savile talk about his charity work and it's 100% persona, ie act, which causes the person to be hidden. A strong and constant 'persona' like that, which isn't the same thing as 'personality', doesn't have to be hiding something sinister, as with Savile, but such people make me uneasy. If you can develop one of these 'persona' things it helps you to amuse and entertain, and there’s nothing wrong with that, it’s why stage comics often have them, also certain posters on PB, but it also allows you to conceal, fool, deflect, distract, and to barefaced lie on matters large and small without compunction. Back to Johnson, this is imo the essence of our problem. We've elected a persona not a person as PM. It’s the first time we’ve done this and I really hope it’s the last.

    There, that's well and truly said now. I can relax and kick back.
    Just once, just this once, I guess we'll let you off the hook. Admittedly I can't speak for the others on PB! Have you seen the state of me.. or them!
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    ydoethur said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    ydoethur said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Claudia Webb is currently an Independent and the Labour Party or any other party for that matter has no direct influence on whether she chooses to resign or stay.

    Demanding Rayner's resignation because Paterson resigned may be a fair point. But you should also be demanding Matt Hancock and several other MPs from the Labour and Conservative Parties fall on their swords too for over indulging in Apple products at the taxpayers expense.

    It suits me if Rayner is defenestrated for her ear buds. It would make it much easier to throw Johnson to the dogs over Carrie's wallpaper...or doesn't that count?
    Your second paragraph is the crucial one. Any of them caught doing anything crooked should resign. They are supposed to be deciding our laws and the rules by which they expect us to lead our lives. How can they do that if they themselves are crooked.

    Saying it was only £249 instead of millions is really like saying it was only 1 murder instead of 50. Someone who murders 1 is just as much a murderer as someone who murders 50. Someone who steals from the taxpayer to the tune (or the itune) of £249 is just as much a crook as someone who does it for millions.
    There was an actual Victorian judge who dismissed a charge against a pickpocket because the indictment stated he was charged on 144 counts and only enumerated 143 of them.
    Gross.
    Now that was a good pun.
    Thank you, here all week.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    IshmaelZ said:

    ydoethur said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    ydoethur said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Claudia Webb is currently an Independent and the Labour Party or any other party for that matter has no direct influence on whether she chooses to resign or stay.

    Demanding Rayner's resignation because Paterson resigned may be a fair point. But you should also be demanding Matt Hancock and several other MPs from the Labour and Conservative Parties fall on their swords too for over indulging in Apple products at the taxpayers expense.

    It suits me if Rayner is defenestrated for her ear buds. It would make it much easier to throw Johnson to the dogs over Carrie's wallpaper...or doesn't that count?
    Your second paragraph is the crucial one. Any of them caught doing anything crooked should resign. They are supposed to be deciding our laws and the rules by which they expect us to lead our lives. How can they do that if they themselves are crooked.

    Saying it was only £249 instead of millions is really like saying it was only 1 murder instead of 50. Someone who murders 1 is just as much a murderer as someone who murders 50. Someone who steals from the taxpayer to the tune (or the itune) of £249 is just as much a crook as someone who does it for millions.
    There was an actual Victorian judge who dismissed a charge against a pickpocket because the indictment stated he was charged on 144 counts and only enumerated 143 of them.
    Gross.
    Now that was a good pun.
    Thank you, here all week.
    We shall all be net beneficiaries.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,583

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Claudia Webb is currently an Independent and the Labour Party or any other party for that matter has no direct influence on whether she chooses to resign or stay.

    Demanding Rayner's resignation because Paterson resigned may be a fair point. But you should also be demanding Matt Hancock and several other MPs from the Labour and Conservative Parties fall on their swords too for over indulging in Apple products at the taxpayers expense.

    It suits me if Rayner is defenestrated for her ear buds. It would make it much easier to throw Johnson to the dogs over Carrie's wallpaper...or doesn't that count?
    Your second paragraph is the crucial one. Any of them caught doing anything crooked should resign. They are supposed to be deciding our laws and the rules by which they expect us to lead our lives. How can they do that if they themselves are crooked.

    Saying it was only £249 instead of millions is really like saying it was only 1 murder instead of 50. Someone who murders 1 is just as much a murderer as someone who murders 50. Someone who steals from the taxpayer to the tune (or the itune) of £249 is just as much a crook as someone who does it for millions.
    I thought paragraph 3 got to the nub of the argument.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
    It doesn't justify the Paterson case.

    I'm just saying that Blair's corruption was much, much worse than Paterson's
    Because you expected better of the Vicar of St Albions?
    No because lobbying is legal

    Paying PM 1M GBP to change policy is not.
    As anyone in F1 knew, Bernie was a very shrewd negotiator.

    He managed to get his policy enacted by Tony, and didn’t have to pay a penny for it.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 50,753
    Think that's the game.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    Umph. Advantage back to the Saffers with that one.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 14,772
    Aslan said:

    Carnyx said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    I was talking about the distinction between claiming for airpods on expenses and acting as the Member for Randox in Parliament. Blair is no longer standing for election.
    Also, however, the F1 thing was to influence policy. The ear buds, not so much, as you say.
    What's wrong with claiming air pods for expenses? If you need them for listening to business calls on the train between Westminster and your constituency, that seems reasonable.
    I guess one thing with the airpods is the blurred boundary between personal and business equipment. I have a pair of bluetooth earbuds for my own personal use, so if I was an MP to claim for them on expenses would be taking the piss. I did claim on my work expenses for a headset with a microphone to plug into my laptop to use on business calls, but in that case I chose a basic set that kept within the expenses limit, and I've only very rarely used it for personal use - I wouldn't have bought one for personal use.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    Sandpit said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
    It doesn't justify the Paterson case.

    I'm just saying that Blair's corruption was much, much worse than Paterson's
    Because you expected better of the Vicar of St Albions?
    No because lobbying is legal

    Paying PM 1M GBP to change policy is not.
    As anyone in F1 knew, Bernie was a very shrewd negotiator.

    He managed to get his policy enacted by Tony, and didn’t have to pay a penny for it.
    It was the most corrupt thing I've ever seen in politics and all it took from Tony was a smirk at the cameras.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,557
    Sandpit said:

    35 from the last three overs. It’s been done before…

    Determined to jinx this ?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,715
    Sandpit said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
    It doesn't justify the Paterson case.

    I'm just saying that Blair's corruption was much, much worse than Paterson's
    Because you expected better of the Vicar of St Albions?
    No because lobbying is legal

    Paying PM 1M GBP to change policy is not.
    As anyone in F1 knew, Bernie was a very shrewd negotiator.

    He managed to get his policy enacted by Tony, and didn’t have to pay a penny for it.
    Indeed, but very good to people who worked for him. If they deserved it.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    Dale Steyn on commentary, asked how many he would want to defend off the last over, 'thirty!'
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,583
    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
    It doesn't justify the Paterson case.

    I'm just saying that Blair's corruption was much, much worse than Paterson's
    Because he was PM, yes.
    Thank goodness No10 is above that kind of behaviour now.
    All it took from Blair was a smirk at the camera while saying that he was a "Pretty Straight Guy"

    cf.

    Blanket media coverage of BoJo
    I don't think your final statement is true at all. Johnson is quite often protected by his fellow media colleagues. See the substituting of 2016 footage for Johnson's 2019 Cenotaph gaffe, amongst others.

    The problem appears to be Johnson is pulling strokes on a daily basis, some trivial, some, more serious, and some, like Wednesday/Thursday absolutely outrageous.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    14 required from the last over. No-one’s leaving early!
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,557
    Sandpit said:

    14 required from the last over. No-one’s leaving early!

    Both gettable and defensible.
  • Aslan said:

    Carnyx said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    I was talking about the distinction between claiming for airpods on expenses and acting as the Member for Randox in Parliament. Blair is no longer standing for election.
    Also, however, the F1 thing was to influence policy. The ear buds, not so much, as you say.
    What's wrong with claiming air pods for expenses? If you need them for listening to business calls on the train between Westminster and your constituency, that seems reasonable.
    I guess one thing with the airpods is the blurred boundary between personal and business equipment. I have a pair of bluetooth earbuds for my own personal use, so if I was an MP to claim for them on expenses would be taking the piss. I did claim on my work expenses for a headset with a microphone to plug into my laptop to use on business calls, but in that case I chose a basic set that kept within the expenses limit, and I've only very rarely used it for personal use - I wouldn't have bought one for personal use.
    IANAaccountant but isn't this what "benefits in kind" are about?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    What a catch.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254

    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
    It doesn't justify the Paterson case.

    I'm just saying that Blair's corruption was much, much worse than Paterson's
    Because he was PM, yes.
    Thank goodness No10 is above that kind of behaviour now.
    All it took from Blair was a smirk at the camera while saying that he was a "Pretty Straight Guy"

    cf.

    Blanket media coverage of BoJo
    I don't think your final statement is true at all. Johnson is quite often protected by his fellow media colleagues. See the substituting of 2016 footage for Johnson's 2019 Cenotaph gaffe, amongst others.

    The problem appears to be Johnson is pulling strokes on a daily basis, some trivial, some, more serious, and some, like Wednesday/Thursday absolutely outrageous.
    BoJo should probably just do an interview with the beeb and say "we're pretty straight guys"

    Worked immensely well for Blair.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    That’s that!
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    So far, so rubbish from England in this over.

    Well, I said they wouldn't win.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,715
    Rabada on a hat-trick
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729

    Rabada on a hat-trick

    Bit of a turnaround after three dismal overs upfront!
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,715
    And gets it!
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    …but I did get to see a hat-trick in person!
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,557
    .
    ydoethur said:

    So far, so rubbish from England in this over.

    Well, I said they wouldn't win.

    Impressive in its own way….
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    Scores on the doors then-

    Is it SA or Aus in the semi's ?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 66,729
    JBriskin3 said:

    Scores on the doors then-

    Is it SA or Aus in the semi's ?

    Aus.
  • eekeek Posts: 24,797
    JBriskin3 said:

    Scores on the doors then-

    Is it SA or Aus in the semi's ?

    Australia as soon as England hit 132 runs
  • Sounds like WW3 has broken out here: my cats are not happy…
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    Thanks @eek and @ydoethur

    South Africa are the cricketing team I have a soft spot for.

    Otherwise it's Scotland and England all the way!
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,715
    Jason Roy out on the field, on crutches.
  • Sounds like WW3 has broken out here: my cats are not happy…

    I might be imagining it but there seem to be more bangs and fewer lights in the sky this year.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,557
    Mercedes a good half second off the pace in Mexico.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,583

    Sounds like WW3 has broken out here: my cats are not happy…

    I heard the fishing crisis was heating up and Johnson was considering declaring war on France to divert from the Paterson crisis, but I hadn't considered the feline angle. I suppose fish is an important political issue for cats.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,517

    ydoethur said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Claudia Webb is currently an Independent and the Labour Party or any other party for that matter has no direct influence on whether she chooses to resign or stay.

    Demanding Rayner's resignation because Paterson resigned may be a fair point. But you should also be demanding Matt Hancock and several other MPs from the Labour and Conservative Parties fall on their swords too for over indulging in Apple products at the taxpayers expense.

    It suits me if Rayner is defenestrated for her ear buds. It would make it much easier to throw Johnson to the dogs over Carrie's wallpaper...or doesn't that count?
    Your second paragraph is the crucial one. Any of them caught doing anything crooked should resign. They are supposed to be deciding our laws and the rules by which they expect us to lead our lives. How can they do that if they themselves are crooked.

    Saying it was only £249 instead of millions is really like saying it was only 1 murder instead of 50. Someone who murders 1 is just as much a murderer as someone who murders 50. Someone who steals from the taxpayer to the tune (or the itune) of £249 is just as much a crook as someone who does it for millions.
    There was an actual Victorian judge who dismissed a charge against a pickpocket because the indictment stated he was charged on 144 counts and only enumerated 143 of them.
    Wow. :) Love these snippets from history.
    You might like this site; the Old Bailey's historical records from 1674 to 1913. Lots of fascinating details of life.

    https://www.oldbaileyonline.org/
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,688

    Sounds like WW3 has broken out here: my cats are not happy…

    I might be imagining it but there seem to be more bangs and fewer lights in the sky this year.
    Clearly with such good government as we have nobody is so enthusiastic....
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,557
    Red Bull 1-2 in qualifying absolutely nailed on.
  • Newcastle just gone bottom of the Premiership

    I hour left to correct it
  • When are the next polls due ?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 91,392

    Mr Pedley, late of this Parish:

    Public opinion is complicated. The fact headline voting intention figures don’t move much a couple of days after event X doesn’t make it unimportant. Look at leader ratings, perceptions of govt / opposition, look at several polls not just one, take the long view.

    Or don’t....

    Put another way. One event is unlikely to permanently change anything unless it’s a really really major event. More important is the drip drip drip of negativity vs the govt measured against the fact voters aren’t buying Labour as an alternative.


    https://twitter.com/keiranpedley/status/1457034346318151699?s=20

    Hes totally right.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,715

    Newcastle just gone bottom of the Premiership

    I hour left to correct it

    Heads will roll?
  • isamisam Posts: 40,721
    edited November 2021
    kle4 said:

    Mr Pedley, late of this Parish:

    Public opinion is complicated. The fact headline voting intention figures don’t move much a couple of days after event X doesn’t make it unimportant. Look at leader ratings, perceptions of govt / opposition, look at several polls not just one, take the long view.

    Or don’t....

    Put another way. One event is unlikely to permanently change anything unless it’s a really really major event. More important is the drip drip drip of negativity vs the govt measured against the fact voters aren’t buying Labour as an alternative.


    https://twitter.com/keiranpedley/status/1457034346318151699?s=20

    Hes totally right.
    The days after some kind of scandal are the ones to avoid looking at polls, if you are interested in the long term. If you are betting on a poll lead before a certain date, then obviously they are of interest. Many shrewdies I have worked with in betting live by ignoring a bad/the last run/game, whilst the mugs rush in based on recency

    Look at his pinned tweet


  • AslanAslan Posts: 1,673

    Newcastle just gone bottom of the Premiership

    I hour left to correct it

    Serves the blood money bastards right.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,583
    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I have just watched the advert and my conclusion is many will respond

    He has resigned as an MP Angela

    Has Claudia Webb, and how about the £249 you falsely claimed for Air pods Angela

    Indeed. £107m contracts handed without tender to donors is exactly the same as £249 for Air Pods.
    Paterson has paid with his job, Rayner tries to take the moral high while having been found out herself

    Can you not see the hypocrisy
    I don't like Rayner, but no, I can't.
    Rayner's actions were not the frugal, careful with the taxpayers behaviour that I'd prefer to see, but it doesn't compare to selling yourself as an MP to the highest bidder.

    I see that Big_G's outrage at the behaviour of Paterson didn't last long, and he's now moved on to consoling himself with imagining that Labour are just as bad. That sort of false equivalence is one of the things that allows corruption to flourish.
    Yeah - they're all Pretty Straight Guys at Labour.
    If you refuse to distinguish between bad and worse then you let the worse off the hook, and you can make a distinction without excusing the bad.
    Just how worst was Blair when he accepted a 1M quid donation from Bernie?
    IIRC that was to the party, not personally. But I agree a very bad look.
    and he gave the money back.

    Admittedly only after he had given Ecclestone the deal he wanted on tobacco advertising.

    More swinging and missing than in a golf lesson for beginners at the moment.
    I don’t recall many defending his behaviour at the time. It was pretty disgusting, and it was likely only public opinion that made him return the cash.
    How any of that justifies current day corruption is frankly beyond me.

    Perhaps is just a way for the Big G tendency to continue voting for Boris while expressing contempt for him.
    It doesn't justify the Paterson case.

    I'm just saying that Blair's corruption was much, much worse than Paterson's
    Because he was PM, yes.
    Thank goodness No10 is above that kind of behaviour now.
    All it took from Blair was a smirk at the camera while saying that he was a "Pretty Straight Guy"

    cf.

    Blanket media coverage of BoJo
    I don't think your final statement is true at all. Johnson is quite often protected by his fellow media colleagues. See the substituting of 2016 footage for Johnson's 2019 Cenotaph gaffe, amongst others.

    The problem appears to be Johnson is pulling strokes on a daily basis, some trivial, some, more serious, and some, like Wednesday/Thursday absolutely outrageous.
    BoJo should probably just do an interview with the beeb and say "we're pretty straight guys"

    Worked immensely well for Blair.
    Sunak sounds like Blair. It might work if Sunak spells it out. Johnson, not so much, infact, not at all.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,688
    The BBC making up their own news. Major's interview really wasn't enough to make such a big story.
This discussion has been closed.