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It is still odds-on that BoJo will survive as PM till 2024 or later – politicalbetting.com

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  • Are many people really that bothered about a deal with the SNP?

    In 2015 it came up a lot in the English marginals, usually unprompted.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    Sean_F said:

    ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    Even back in the late seventies I was aware that paki and yid were offensive terms.
    I can go back further with ‘yid’ and yes it was offensive. You could get away with ‘five’ though.

    Don’t recall anyone being called ‘Paki’ before the late seventies.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,907
    edited November 2021
    kinabalu said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    HYUFD said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Yeah.
    Although the really interesting thing about 40-37 is that there would be no combination which would produce a majority at all. Apart from 3.
    Lab SNP.
    CON SNP
    LAB CON.

    You would feel the SNP would be in a strong position. Would not like to speculate what might happen.
    And how would voters behave if that were the prospect? Difficult to say.
    Labour have been soft on the indyref2 for a while now. A Lab-SNP coaltion doesn't seem that unlikely.
    Starmer would likely give the SNP indyref2 if he needs their confidence and supply to become PM in a hung parliament.

    Probably with devomax as a carrot to Scots to try and get them to vote No again
    I agree with this analysis apart from the devomax bit (although you may be right there too)

    Us Yoons know that Tories/Bozo are best for the union.
    Why don't you want to have the vote, win it, and kill Sindy off good and proper instead of this 'delay delay' approach?
    You won't kill Sindy off unless a second vote is held a genuine generation after 2014, which is at minimum 10-15 years after. Canada proved that when the second Quebec independence referendum was only held in 1995, 15 years after the first in 1980.

    Otherwise the SNP would demand indyref3 the next day you already having given in to them once and held indyref2 within a generation of indyref1, unless No won by a landslide
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,479
    JBriskin3 said:

    Are many people really that bothered about a deal with the SNP?

    True Scots are - because it means whether or not we get a "non-divisive" referendum.
    Well the referendum will surely happen anyway at some point: it’s inevitable when support for indy consistently polls above 45%.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,479

    I hope soon a Labour lead will appear to lift me up :(

    You should be much cheered by the goings on of yesterday.

    The fiasco may not gain immediate traction (although, I may be surprised) but Johnson removed quite a lot of his Teflon yesterday. Not only did he damage himself but he raised questions about the Conservative brand. If voters start to struggle (one of my customers in Gloucester went bang on Monday morning with the loss of 300 jobs- Complete Utilities- I just lost about a grand) the Three Line Whip nonsense will bite the party hard.
    Sorry to hear that. Hope your business life improves soon.
  • ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    I think they need to appoint me Chief Executive and Executive Chairman of YCCC and I'll fix all the problems.

    A strong Yorkshire means a strong England.
    I have always found Yorkshire kind of annoying, for a few reasons:

    1. Claiming to be in the North, even though parts of it are closer to London than to the Scottish border
    2. Yorkshire Tea, which self-evidently isn't produced in Yorkshire
    3. Being referred to by its residents as God's own Country, which seems rather boastful and potentially blasphemous, especially if you've ever spent time in some of the ropier bits
    4. Geoffrey Boycott.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254

    JBriskin3 said:

    Are many people really that bothered about a deal with the SNP?

    True Scots are - because it means whether or not we get a "non-divisive" referendum.
    Well the referendum will surely happen anyway at some point: it’s inevitable when support for indy consistently polls above 45%.
    SNP have been polling very high for a very long time it's true - hence the "Nicola, Queen of Scots" thread.

    Hopefully it will start to drop eventually.
  • HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    HYUFD said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Yeah.
    Although the really interesting thing about 40-37 is that there would be no combination which would produce a majority at all. Apart from 3.
    Lab SNP.
    CON SNP
    LAB CON.

    You would feel the SNP would be in a strong position. Would not like to speculate what might happen.
    And how would voters behave if that were the prospect? Difficult to say.
    Labour have been soft on the indyref2 for a while now. A Lab-SNP coaltion doesn't seem that unlikely.
    Starmer would likely give the SNP indyref2 if he needs their confidence and supply to become PM in a hung parliament.

    Probably with devomax as a carrot to Scots to try and get them to vote No again
    I agree with this analysis apart from the devomax bit (although you may be right there too)

    Us Yoons know that Tories/Bozo are best for the union.
    Why don't you want to have the vote, win it, and kill Sindy off good and proper instead of this 'delay delay' approach?
    You won't kill Sindy off unless a second vote is held a genuine generation after 2014, which is at minimum 10-15 years after. Canada proved that when the second Quebec independence referendum was only held in 1995, 15 years after the first in 1980.

    Otherwise the SNP would demand indyref3 the next day you already having given in to them once and held indyref2 within a generation of indyref1, unless No won by a landslide
    You will never kill off indyrefs

    I have lived with them since the early 1950s
  • LOL at Dirty Desmond.

    Richard Desmond, the billionaire former owner of adult television channels and top-shelf magazines, has spent years having his Wikipedia edited in a failed attempt to remove any suggestion he is a “pornographer”.

    The former owner of the Daily Express and Channel 5, and one of Britain’s richest men, appears to have become fixated with his biography on the open-source encyclopedia. To this end, an account operating on behalf of Desmond has repeatedly edited the article to replace the description of him as a “pornographer” with the term “philanthropist”.

    According to legal documents seen by the Guardian, Desmond says he cannot factually be described as a pornographer because that term applies only to individuals who publish illegal and obscene material. Desmond says the top-shelf magazines and television channels he owned for decades were instead in the legitimate “adult material” category distributed in high-street shops and on Sky.

    The former owner of the magazines Asian Babes and Readers’ Wives, who owned adult outlets from the 1980s until 2016, has now hired lawyers to demand Wikipedia permanently deletes any mentions of the word “pornographer” from his biography.

    Lawyers acting for the businessman this week asked Wikipedia administrators to investigate edits to the page, actively monitor it in case the word is reinstated, and keep “genuine, factually correct, edits by Mr Desmond” on the page.

    “The use of the term ‘pornographer’ when applied to our client is at least factually wrong, gratuitous and insulting, and at most commercially damaging,” they wrote.

    His lawyers claim that Wikipedia editors who describe Desmond as a pornographer may be commercial motivated as part of a “strategy by business competitors to harm his public image”.

    “Attempts have been made to rectify the factual errors by Mr Desmond numerous times. Despite this, each time, editors have reinstated the term ‘pornographer’,” the lawyers wrote.

    As part of Desmond’s legal threat, the lawyers confirmed he has spent three years having his own Wikipedia page edited through an account with the username NewsEditor1959. Although it is unclear who is operating the account, it has been used to remove references to Desmond’s work in the adult industry and add substantial sections about his donations to charities such as Moorfields eye hospital.


    https://www.theguardian.com/media/2021/nov/05/richard-desmond-in-legal-battle-with-wikipedia-over-term-pornographer
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,817

    ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    I think they need to appoint me Chief Executive and Executive Chairman of YCCC and I'll fix all the problems.

    A strong Yorkshire means a strong England.
    I have always found Yorkshire kind of annoying, for a few reasons:

    1. Claiming to be in the North, even though parts of it are closer to London than to the Scottish border
    2. Yorkshire Tea, which self-evidently isn't produced in Yorkshire
    3. Being referred to by its residents as God's own Country, which seems rather boastful and potentially blasphemous, especially if you've ever spent time in some of the ropier bits
    4. Geoffrey Boycott.
    William the Bastard and Henry VIII the Engexit Pope certainly agreed with you.
  • Sean_F said:

    ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    Even back in the late seventies I was aware that paki and yid were offensive terms.
    Yet even in 2021 you can't see that posting them on pb might be a bad thing.
  • ClippPClippP Posts: 1,904

    Sean_F said:

    ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    Even back in the late seventies I was aware that paki and yid were offensive terms.
    I can go back further with ‘yid’ and yes it was offensive. You could get away with ‘five’ though.

    Don’t recall anyone being called ‘Paki’ before the late seventies.
    Just a thought... Are "Pakistani" and "Jewish" held to be offensive terms?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,582

    LOL at Dirty Desmond.

    Richard Desmond, the billionaire former owner of adult television channels and top-shelf magazines, has spent years having his Wikipedia edited in a failed attempt to remove any suggestion he is a “pornographer”.

    The former owner of the Daily Express and Channel 5, and one of Britain’s richest men, appears to have become fixated with his biography on the open-source encyclopedia. To this end, an account operating on behalf of Desmond has repeatedly edited the article to replace the description of him as a “pornographer” with the term “philanthropist”.

    According to legal documents seen by the Guardian, Desmond says he cannot factually be described as a pornographer because that term applies only to individuals who publish illegal and obscene material. Desmond says the top-shelf magazines and television channels he owned for decades were instead in the legitimate “adult material” category distributed in high-street shops and on Sky.

    The former owner of the magazines Asian Babes and Readers’ Wives, who owned adult outlets from the 1980s until 2016, has now hired lawyers to demand Wikipedia permanently deletes any mentions of the word “pornographer” from his biography.

    Lawyers acting for the businessman this week asked Wikipedia administrators to investigate edits to the page, actively monitor it in case the word is reinstated, and keep “genuine, factually correct, edits by Mr Desmond” on the page.

    “The use of the term ‘pornographer’ when applied to our client is at least factually wrong, gratuitous and insulting, and at most commercially damaging,” they wrote.

    His lawyers claim that Wikipedia editors who describe Desmond as a pornographer may be commercial motivated as part of a “strategy by business competitors to harm his public image”.

    “Attempts have been made to rectify the factual errors by Mr Desmond numerous times. Despite this, each time, editors have reinstated the term ‘pornographer’,” the lawyers wrote.

    As part of Desmond’s legal threat, the lawyers confirmed he has spent three years having his own Wikipedia page edited through an account with the username NewsEditor1959. Although it is unclear who is operating the account, it has been used to remove references to Desmond’s work in the adult industry and add substantial sections about his donations to charities such as Moorfields eye hospital.


    https://www.theguardian.com/media/2021/nov/05/richard-desmond-in-legal-battle-with-wikipedia-over-term-pornographer

    Private Eye are going to have so much fun with that one!
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,355
    MattW said:

    Carnyx said:

    DougSeal said:

    Family pornography? Is he talking about stepmom porn?

    The campaign to make it illegal to photograph breastfeeding without consent met an obstacle in the Lords when Lord Wolfson of Tredegar argued it could spoil family pornography. The minister said it would be rough on a man who photographed his wife on the beach “for his own sexual gratification” and “unintentionally” included a woman he didn’t know with her breast out suckling. Wolfson’s holiday snaps must be fascinating.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/the-times-diary-dean-chases-his-flock-away-w0kb9jdwj

    This is the most batshit insane thing I have ever heard.
    One does wonder if he thinks it's OK to sort of accidentally in the background snap a lady whose mammaries are out purely for the purpose of getting the vitamin D in.

    I had to check which Wolfson Lord he is, and he's the one in the MoJ, of all places. Interesting.

    Presimably we are agreed that "pornography" is a Hansard (Lords' version) typo for "photography", and that this is the Times Diary going all carry on - or imitating that Blair video that @TSE posted, which succeeded in demonstrating that Clue has precisely one joke, in total?
    The word pornography was not used by Lord Wolfson, but it's not an inaccurate description of what he was talking about.

    "I will try to use the initials from the amendment. A takes a photo of his wife, partner or girlfriend on a beach in her bikini, intending to use that image for his own sexual gratification. Another woman, B, is on the same beach, breastfeeding her baby, and is unintentionally caught by A in the picture."

    Is a direct quote from Hansard.
    https://hansard.parliament.uk/Lords/2021-11-03/debates/5311B2A0-EF1E-404F-AF74-A7ED540B04DE/PoliceCrimeSentencingAndCourtsBill?highlight=wolfson#main-content

    (6th mention of Wolfson on the page)
  • Sandpit said:

    LOL at Dirty Desmond.

    Richard Desmond, the billionaire former owner of adult television channels and top-shelf magazines, has spent years having his Wikipedia edited in a failed attempt to remove any suggestion he is a “pornographer”.

    The former owner of the Daily Express and Channel 5, and one of Britain’s richest men, appears to have become fixated with his biography on the open-source encyclopedia. To this end, an account operating on behalf of Desmond has repeatedly edited the article to replace the description of him as a “pornographer” with the term “philanthropist”.

    According to legal documents seen by the Guardian, Desmond says he cannot factually be described as a pornographer because that term applies only to individuals who publish illegal and obscene material. Desmond says the top-shelf magazines and television channels he owned for decades were instead in the legitimate “adult material” category distributed in high-street shops and on Sky.

    The former owner of the magazines Asian Babes and Readers’ Wives, who owned adult outlets from the 1980s until 2016, has now hired lawyers to demand Wikipedia permanently deletes any mentions of the word “pornographer” from his biography.

    Lawyers acting for the businessman this week asked Wikipedia administrators to investigate edits to the page, actively monitor it in case the word is reinstated, and keep “genuine, factually correct, edits by Mr Desmond” on the page.

    “The use of the term ‘pornographer’ when applied to our client is at least factually wrong, gratuitous and insulting, and at most commercially damaging,” they wrote.

    His lawyers claim that Wikipedia editors who describe Desmond as a pornographer may be commercial motivated as part of a “strategy by business competitors to harm his public image”.

    “Attempts have been made to rectify the factual errors by Mr Desmond numerous times. Despite this, each time, editors have reinstated the term ‘pornographer’,” the lawyers wrote.

    As part of Desmond’s legal threat, the lawyers confirmed he has spent three years having his own Wikipedia page edited through an account with the username NewsEditor1959. Although it is unclear who is operating the account, it has been used to remove references to Desmond’s work in the adult industry and add substantial sections about his donations to charities such as Moorfields eye hospital.


    https://www.theguardian.com/media/2021/nov/05/richard-desmond-in-legal-battle-with-wikipedia-over-term-pornographer

    Private Eye are going to have so much fun with that one!
    It's going to be another Streisand effect.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,131
    edited November 2021
  • Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Surly the problem would also go away if the pro-Indy side won?
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727

    LOL at Dirty Desmond.

    Richard Desmond, the billionaire former owner of adult television channels and top-shelf magazines, has spent years having his Wikipedia edited in a failed attempt to remove any suggestion he is a “pornographer”.

    The former owner of the Daily Express and Channel 5, and one of Britain’s richest men, appears to have become fixated with his biography on the open-source encyclopedia. To this end, an account operating on behalf of Desmond has repeatedly edited the article to replace the description of him as a “pornographer” with the term “philanthropist”.

    According to legal documents seen by the Guardian, Desmond says he cannot factually be described as a pornographer because that term applies only to individuals who publish illegal and obscene material. Desmond says the top-shelf magazines and television channels he owned for decades were instead in the legitimate “adult material” category distributed in high-street shops and on Sky.

    The former owner of the magazines Asian Babes and Readers’ Wives, who owned adult outlets from the 1980s until 2016, has now hired lawyers to demand Wikipedia permanently deletes any mentions of the word “pornographer” from his biography.

    Lawyers acting for the businessman this week asked Wikipedia administrators to investigate edits to the page, actively monitor it in case the word is reinstated, and keep “genuine, factually correct, edits by Mr Desmond” on the page.

    “The use of the term ‘pornographer’ when applied to our client is at least factually wrong, gratuitous and insulting, and at most commercially damaging,” they wrote.

    His lawyers claim that Wikipedia editors who describe Desmond as a pornographer may be commercial motivated as part of a “strategy by business competitors to harm his public image”.

    “Attempts have been made to rectify the factual errors by Mr Desmond numerous times. Despite this, each time, editors have reinstated the term ‘pornographer’,” the lawyers wrote.

    As part of Desmond’s legal threat, the lawyers confirmed he has spent three years having his own Wikipedia page edited through an account with the username NewsEditor1959. Although it is unclear who is operating the account, it has been used to remove references to Desmond’s work in the adult industry and add substantial sections about his donations to charities such as Moorfields eye hospital.


    https://www.theguardian.com/media/2021/nov/05/richard-desmond-in-legal-battle-with-wikipedia-over-term-pornographer

    Would it be cynical to draw a connection between his income from pornography and his charity donations to Moorfields ensuring a continued market by protecting people's sight? Or is it simple atonement as he knows that viewing pornography makes you go blind? :wink:
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,926
    Apropos of nothing, I think I need new glasses.
  • Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Surly the problem would also go away if the pro-Indy side won?
    It would be brexit many times over with opponents wanting to rejoin RUK
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,125
    dixiedean said:

    eek said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    @Charles and @MaxPB and @Richard_Nabavi

    You guys know about this stuff. If the FDA and its brethren accelerate approval of the Pfizer drug, how long before they can ramp up production and these pills reach Europe? What's a likely time-scale?

    It feels like Europe - the mainland anyway - is now in a sprint between the winter wave and the arrival of these antivirals

    I’ve just returned from Spain, where they had a mask mandate in the middle of summer / warm bit of autumn. That to me seem unwise, as presumably it’s better to munch your exit wave when the weather is good, as masking simply delays it?
    We have a mask mandate in Los Angeles County - it's basically shops, public transport, the communal areas of office building (lifts), plus the ridiculous dance in restaurants when you get up to use the bathroom.

    The US still has very onerous Federal rules on airplanes (where they get very annoyed with you if you remove your mask for more than a few seconds), and in airports.
    I’ve just come back from Greece where nobody minded too much about masks.

    Nor did anyone on the Ryanair flight back. I mean, you are of course supposed to wear them but nobody is going to make you.
    On flights in the US, if you refuse to wear a mask, you will be told to, and if you refuse you will get put on the No Fly List. Compliance is therefore basically 100%.
    The USA land of the free, provided you don't upset someone enough to make a list.
    Their special freedom seems to mainly consist of the freedom to own a huge arsenal of death weapons.
    There's much credence given over there to the notion that an armed citizenry is the best ultimate safeguard against the government itself. Ironically, if Donald Trump was to get back, I could start to see a germ of sense in that!
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,375
    Sandpit said:

    ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    I think they need to appoint me Chief Executive and Executive Chairman of YCCC and I'll fix all the problems.

    A strong Yorkshire means a strong England.
    They need a serious clearout of the top echelons of the club, including the coaching staff, the board and the permanent executive. The whole lot of them need to go, to retain the confidence of the members and sponsors.
    The way they've been performing recently, a clear-out of the playing staff wouldn't go amiss either.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,582
    .
    Carnyx said:

    LOL at Dirty Desmond.

    Richard Desmond, the billionaire former owner of adult television channels and top-shelf magazines, has spent years having his Wikipedia edited in a failed attempt to remove any suggestion he is a “pornographer”.

    The former owner of the Daily Express and Channel 5, and one of Britain’s richest men, appears to have become fixated with his biography on the open-source encyclopedia. To this end, an account operating on behalf of Desmond has repeatedly edited the article to replace the description of him as a “pornographer” with the term “philanthropist”.

    According to legal documents seen by the Guardian, Desmond says he cannot factually be described as a pornographer because that term applies only to individuals who publish illegal and obscene material. Desmond says the top-shelf magazines and television channels he owned for decades were instead in the legitimate “adult material” category distributed in high-street shops and on Sky.

    The former owner of the magazines Asian Babes and Readers’ Wives, who owned adult outlets from the 1980s until 2016, has now hired lawyers to demand Wikipedia permanently deletes any mentions of the word “pornographer” from his biography.

    Lawyers acting for the businessman this week asked Wikipedia administrators to investigate edits to the page, actively monitor it in case the word is reinstated, and keep “genuine, factually correct, edits by Mr Desmond” on the page.

    “The use of the term ‘pornographer’ when applied to our client is at least factually wrong, gratuitous and insulting, and at most commercially damaging,” they wrote.

    His lawyers claim that Wikipedia editors who describe Desmond as a pornographer may be commercial motivated as part of a “strategy by business competitors to harm his public image”.

    “Attempts have been made to rectify the factual errors by Mr Desmond numerous times. Despite this, each time, editors have reinstated the term ‘pornographer’,” the lawyers wrote.

    As part of Desmond’s legal threat, the lawyers confirmed he has spent three years having his own Wikipedia page edited through an account with the username NewsEditor1959. Although it is unclear who is operating the account, it has been used to remove references to Desmond’s work in the adult industry and add substantial sections about his donations to charities such as Moorfields eye hospital.


    https://www.theguardian.com/media/2021/nov/05/richard-desmond-in-legal-battle-with-wikipedia-over-term-pornographer

    Donations to an eye hospital. Hmm.
    Asian Babes and Readers’ Wives - sites for sore eyes.
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,590
    England cases down aggressively, hospital admissions down 15% on last week, and total hospital occupancy down on yesterday and same day last week.
  • Yorkshire CC scandal is dominating the news and is so wrong

    Some of the things I have read on twitter are really disgraceful

    Not sure if Yorkshire CC will survive this to be honest
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,375
    Sean_F said:

    ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    Even back in the late seventies I was aware that paki and yid were offensive terms.
    Yes, I lived in Leeds in the 70s and 80s, near Headingley. The local skinheads, loosely affiliated to the National Front, had a favourite sport. It was called "Paki-bashing", and was, sadly, quite widespread. The idea that anybody in Leeds, even back then, didn't know that 'Paki' was offensive is ludicrous.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254

    Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Surly the problem would also go away if the pro-Indy side won?
    It would be brexit many times over with opponents wanting to rejoin RUK
    It would make things like the NI Protocol look like child's play.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,582
    India smashing the runs at quite a rate! 70/1 after five overs.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,403
    maaarsh said:

    England cases down aggressively, hospital admissions down 15% on last week, and total hospital occupancy down on yesterday and same day last week.

    So - lockdown coming then...
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    Sandpit said:

    India smashing the runs at quite a rate! 70/1 after five overs.

    That's quite a run rate.
  • rpjsrpjs Posts: 3,787
    rcs1000 said:

    Pro_Rata said:

    MattW said:

    Quincel said:

    Just huge value on him staying in post. The bar for Tory MPs to turn on a sitting PM with this kind of majority and any poll lead at all is vast.

    Hmmm.

    What's the first likely date for an election? And could he fluff it?

    (When will the boundary commission report, and that be implemented.)
    In terms of likely last possible date of the next election, a periodic reminder that the repeal of FTPA would set this as 23rd January 2025 (parliament automatically dissolving on 16/12, 5 years after first sitting, and the election taking place, 25 working days later plus 4 Bank Holidays later). (Can't remember if dissolution counts as day one in this, but I count day 25, including Scottish New Year BHs as Fri 24/1 if not).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Next_United_Kingdom_general_election?wprov=sfla1

    For the avoidance of doubt, I'm not expecting the next GE to take place in 2025, it's just a curiosity I'm rather taken by.
    Are you sure?

    I thought all the previous legislation relating to parliament length had been repealed, and furthermore the prerogative power of the Queen to agree (with her ministers) to dissolve parliament. Therefore if you simply remove the FTPA, you end up with no mechanism for dissolving parliament, and no limit on the lengths of parliament.
    Which is why the current Dissolution and Calling of Parliament Bill doesn’t just repeal the FPTA but purports to revive the royal prerogative to dissolve Parliament "as if the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011 had never been enacted".

    Which is interesting, as I understand most constitutional and legal scholars believed that once a royal prerogative was extinguished it could not be revived. However the current bill also has provisions to make any question of the legality of its provisions non-justiciable. So that’s alright then.
  • Sandpit said:

    India smashing the runs at quite a rate! 70/1 after five overs.

    Who are they playing?
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,274
    Carnyx said:

    LOL at Dirty Desmond.

    Richard Desmond, the billionaire former owner of adult television channels and top-shelf magazines, has spent years having his Wikipedia edited in a failed attempt to remove any suggestion he is a “pornographer”.

    The former owner of the Daily Express and Channel 5, and one of Britain’s richest men, appears to have become fixated with his biography on the open-source encyclopedia. To this end, an account operating on behalf of Desmond has repeatedly edited the article to replace the description of him as a “pornographer” with the term “philanthropist”.

    According to legal documents seen by the Guardian, Desmond says he cannot factually be described as a pornographer because that term applies only to individuals who publish illegal and obscene material. Desmond says the top-shelf magazines and television channels he owned for decades were instead in the legitimate “adult material” category distributed in high-street shops and on Sky.

    The former owner of the magazines Asian Babes and Readers’ Wives, who owned adult outlets from the 1980s until 2016, has now hired lawyers to demand Wikipedia permanently deletes any mentions of the word “pornographer” from his biography.

    Lawyers acting for the businessman this week asked Wikipedia administrators to investigate edits to the page, actively monitor it in case the word is reinstated, and keep “genuine, factually correct, edits by Mr Desmond” on the page.

    “The use of the term ‘pornographer’ when applied to our client is at least factually wrong, gratuitous and insulting, and at most commercially damaging,” they wrote.

    His lawyers claim that Wikipedia editors who describe Desmond as a pornographer may be commercial motivated as part of a “strategy by business competitors to harm his public image”.

    “Attempts have been made to rectify the factual errors by Mr Desmond numerous times. Despite this, each time, editors have reinstated the term ‘pornographer’,” the lawyers wrote.

    As part of Desmond’s legal threat, the lawyers confirmed he has spent three years having his own Wikipedia page edited through an account with the username NewsEditor1959. Although it is unclear who is operating the account, it has been used to remove references to Desmond’s work in the adult industry and add substantial sections about his donations to charities such as Moorfields eye hospital.


    https://www.theguardian.com/media/2021/nov/05/richard-desmond-in-legal-battle-with-wikipedia-over-term-pornographer

    Donations to an eye hospital. Hmm.
    Mother always said you'd go blind... ;)
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,590
    maaarsh said:

    England cases down aggressively, hospital admissions down 15% on last week, and total hospital occupancy down on yesterday and same day last week.

    Given all of this, can confidently say deaths are falling and it's only the reporting lag which will hide that fact for a while.
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    POOPWAS

    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1456654298503385089

    Not much support for him staying on.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,582

    Sandpit said:

    India smashing the runs at quite a rate! 70/1 after five overs.

    Who are they playing?
    Scotland!
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,261
    Really rattling through the Boosters now

    334,000 in a day. Good work
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,295
    34k cases, & numbers in hospital declining in all 4 nations, looks like pretty good news.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,817
    dr_spyn said:

    POOPWAS

    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1456654298503385089

    Not much support for him staying on.

    Rather surprising it's Tory voters who are more against Mr Paterson than the average voter.

    Probably because some of them realise the damage he's doing to the party. Interesting to know which kind of voter, mind.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,125
    edited November 2021
    RobD said:

    Apropos of nothing, I think I need new glasses.

    I got some 3 weeks ago - a pair of Lennon style little round photochromics. If you have the face for them they look pretty good. Wish I'd done lazer eye when I was younger though and got the problem fixed at source. Unless you're also too old that's what I'd recommend. Lazer eye. Then a life without glasses, just pure unadorned face.
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,375
    Leon said:

    Really rattling through the Boosters now

    334,000 in a day. Good work

    I thought our booster programme was in disarray?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,907

    Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Surly the problem would also go away if the pro-Indy side won?
    As the Tories would have won a majority in England and Wales, that would just mean Starmer's majority went away when Scottish MPs left the Commons
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,479

    maaarsh said:

    England cases down aggressively, hospital admissions down 15% on last week, and total hospital occupancy down on yesterday and same day last week.

    So - lockdown coming then...
    rkrkrk said:

    34k cases, & numbers in hospital declining in all 4 nations, looks like pretty good news.

    Are you still in favour of Plan B?
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,571
    Way, way off-topic:

    Quite funny if you're into trains: they're getting quite agricultural in their efforts to get the crashed trains out of the tunnel at Salisbury. finesse? Nah. Just yank it out ...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsHXWUMsLdM
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,907

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    HYUFD said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Yeah.
    Although the really interesting thing about 40-37 is that there would be no combination which would produce a majority at all. Apart from 3.
    Lab SNP.
    CON SNP
    LAB CON.

    You would feel the SNP would be in a strong position. Would not like to speculate what might happen.
    And how would voters behave if that were the prospect? Difficult to say.
    Labour have been soft on the indyref2 for a while now. A Lab-SNP coaltion doesn't seem that unlikely.
    Starmer would likely give the SNP indyref2 if he needs their confidence and supply to become PM in a hung parliament.

    Probably with devomax as a carrot to Scots to try and get them to vote No again
    I agree with this analysis apart from the devomax bit (although you may be right there too)

    Us Yoons know that Tories/Bozo are best for the union.
    Why don't you want to have the vote, win it, and kill Sindy off good and proper instead of this 'delay delay' approach?
    You won't kill Sindy off unless a second vote is held a genuine generation after 2014, which is at minimum 10-15 years after. Canada proved that when the second Quebec independence referendum was only held in 1995, 15 years after the first in 1980.

    Otherwise the SNP would demand indyref3 the next day you already having given in to them once and held indyref2 within a generation of indyref1, unless No won by a landslide
    You will never kill off indyrefs

    I have lived with them since the early 1950s
    Quebec has not had another since 1995, despite No winning that just 51%-49%
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,590
    Today's England cases reported the lowest for over a month, and it's not even a weekend reporting day, and testing is back up after half term. Can only be 7-10 days from journalists stopping saying cases are rising now!
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727

    ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    I think they need to appoint me Chief Executive and Executive Chairman of YCCC and I'll fix all the problems.

    A strong Yorkshire means a strong England.
    I have always found Yorkshire kind of annoying, for a few reasons:

    1. Claiming to be in the North, even though parts of it are closer to London than to the Scottish border
    2. Yorkshire Tea, which self-evidently isn't produced in Yorkshire
    3. Being referred to by its residents as God's own Country, which seems rather boastful and potentially blasphemous, especially if you've ever spent time in some of the ropier bits
    4. Geoffrey Boycott.
    Boycott, I'll concede. You can have YCCC too.

    As a southerner naturalised in Yorkshire I answer the others as follows:
    1. Anything north of Watford Gap is north. Plus Yorkshire folk say bath, not barth.
    2. Yorkshire tea is indeed produced in Yorkshire. The raw ingredients come from elsewhere. Next you'll be claiming that BP petrol isn't really British! :open_mouth:
    3. God's Own Country? Well Jacob Rees-Mogg says it isn't.[1] Case closed?

    [1] https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/politics/jacob-rees-mogg-yorkshire-is-not-gods-own-country-somerset-is-3146769
  • All over for Scotland in 6.3 overs
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,817

    Way, way off-topic:

    Quite funny if you're into trains: they're getting quite agricultural in their efforts to get the crashed trains out of the tunnel at Salisbury. finesse? Nah. Just yank it out ...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsHXWUMsLdM

    I was actually going to suggest we needed some Deltic photos in view of the track today's discussion has taken, but this will do very nicely. But I wouldn't want to stand downrange of the likely debris trajectory if something went pop - never mind a whiplashing cable. Ooh.
  • 34,029 and 193 deaths
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368
    edited November 2021

    I hope soon a Labour lead will appear to lift me up :(

    You should be much cheered by the goings on of yesterday.

    The fiasco may not gain immediate traction (although, I may be surprised) but Johnson removed quite a lot of his Teflon yesterday. Not only did he damage himself but he raised questions about the Conservative brand. If voters start to struggle (one of my customers in Gloucester went bang on Monday morning with the loss of 300 jobs- Complete Utilities- I just lost about a grand) the Three Line Whip nonsense will bite the party hard.
    Sorry to hear that. Hope your business life improves soon.
    No, I'm OK.

    A grand lighter than expected but no harm done.

    I feel for those 300 people working directly for Complete Utilities who were notified by email on Monday morning not to come into work because they had no job. These people might think twice about voting for the likes of Owen Paterson whining that life is unfair because he had to take a 30 day HoC ban because he was busy trousering £100K a year instead of fighting the corner for his constituents.

    Thanks anyway.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,582
    JBriskin3 said:

    Sandpit said:

    India smashing the runs at quite a rate! 70/1 after five overs.

    That's quite a run rate.
    Rahul got 50 from 18 balls. Then was out the next ball!

    All over now, India 89/2, with a massive six to finish, in only 6.3 overs.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    edited November 2021
    Leon said:

    Really rattling through the Boosters now

    334,000 in a day. Good work

    Including your truly. My wife and I reached the 6-month period since 2nd jab on Wednesday. We hadn't had a letter or other communication inviting us to apply, and still haven't, but I logged on to the NHS booking website on Wednesday afternoon, and it said we were eligible. We were able to get appointments for the next morning, at Boots in Fleet St. All highly efficient.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,367

    Sean_F said:

    ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    Even back in the late seventies I was aware that paki and yid were offensive terms.
    Yes, I lived in Leeds in the 70s and 80s, near Headingley. The local skinheads, loosely affiliated to the National Front, had a favourite sport. It was called "Paki-bashing", and was, sadly, quite widespread. The idea that anybody in Leeds, even back then, didn't know that 'Paki' was offensive is ludicrous.
    The argument seems to be that although "Paki" was offensive in the 70s / 80s by 2010 it was merely banter.

    No, sorry that's only true if you are completely stupid, I can't think of any word that has become less offensive over time.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,132

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    @Charles and @MaxPB and @Richard_Nabavi

    You guys know about this stuff. If the FDA and its brethren accelerate approval of the Pfizer drug, how long before they can ramp up production and these pills reach Europe? What's a likely time-scale?

    It feels like Europe - the mainland anyway - is now in a sprint between the winter wave and the arrival of these antivirals

    I’ve just returned from Spain, where they had a mask mandate in the middle of summer / warm bit of autumn. That to me seem unwise, as presumably it’s better to munch your exit wave when the weather is good, as masking simply delays it?
    We have a mask mandate in Los Angeles County - it's basically shops, public transport, the communal areas of office building (lifts), plus the ridiculous dance in restaurants when you get up to use the bathroom.

    The US still has very onerous Federal rules on airplanes (where they get very annoyed with you if you remove your mask for more than a few seconds), and in airports.
    I’ve just come back from Greece where nobody minded too much about masks.

    Nor did anyone on the Ryanair flight back. I mean, you are of course supposed to wear them but nobody is going to make you.
    Infections are getting bad in Greece, and rising fast. The death rate is now twice ours (and we're already bad compared with other western European countries):

    https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1456586903302639620

    So it's not just weather.
    The East-West vaccine divide is incredibly stark, and it's almost certainly behind the dire death performance of the East.
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,590
    Sandpit said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    Sandpit said:

    India smashing the runs at quite a rate! 70/1 after five overs.

    That's quite a run rate.
    Rahul got 50 from 18 balls. Then was out the next ball!

    All over now, India 89/2, with a massive six to finish, in only 6.3 overs.
    All rather late given they already lost to the only 2 real teams in their group. Even the fortune of being in the soft group full of minnows wasn't enough to save them.
  • Jesus.. didn't realise it was (allegedly) this bad

    Adil Ray OBE
    @adilray
    Allegations that a Muslim prayer mat was used by Yorkshire cricket players to clean up the mess from having sex with a woman on her period and players p**sed on an Asian players head are vile. We need answers & action now. I fear a DCMS review won’t cut it. This is much bigger.
    9:56 AM · Nov 5, 2021·Twitter for iPhone
    https://twitter.com/adilray/status/1456561106147758084
  • "Top Democratic officials said they were confident they could complete both measures [infrastructure and welfare bills] by day’s end,"

    NY Times live blog
  • maaarsh said:

    Today's England cases reported the lowest for over a month, and it's not even a weekend reporting day, and testing is back up after half term. Can only be 7-10 days from journalists stopping saying cases are rising now!

    Still saying it just now on Sky and just do not seem to want to acknowledge they could be wrong
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,132
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    @Charles and @MaxPB and @Richard_Nabavi

    You guys know about this stuff. If the FDA and its brethren accelerate approval of the Pfizer drug, how long before they can ramp up production and these pills reach Europe? What's a likely time-scale?

    It feels like Europe - the mainland anyway - is now in a sprint between the winter wave and the arrival of these antivirals

    I’ve just returned from Spain, where they had a mask mandate in the middle of summer / warm bit of autumn. That to me seem unwise, as presumably it’s better to munch your exit wave when the weather is good, as masking simply delays it?
    We have a mask mandate in Los Angeles County - it's basically shops, public transport, the communal areas of office building (lifts), plus the ridiculous dance in restaurants when you get up to use the bathroom.

    The US still has very onerous Federal rules on airplanes (where they get very annoyed with you if you remove your mask for more than a few seconds), and in airports.
    I’ve just come back from Greece where nobody minded too much about masks.

    Nor did anyone on the Ryanair flight back. I mean, you are of course supposed to wear them but nobody is going to make you.
    Infections are getting bad in Greece, and rising fast. The death rate is now twice ours (and we're already bad compared with other western European countries):

    https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1456586903302639620

    So it's not just weather.
    It's hard to know what is going on without also knowing the state of lockdowns - if any - in individual countries

    Is there anywhere that tells you this? in one handy graphic?
    No.

    Not least because it's complicated. Germany has no national retrictions at all, leaving it all to the individual Lander.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254

    All over for Scotland in 6.3 overs

    Thrashed again then. I haven't been able to watch the matches - Have we won any matches once we got to Group 2?
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,590

    "Top Democratic officials said they were confident they could complete both measures [infrastructure and welfare bills] by day’s end,"

    NY Times live blog

    they've made the bill even more toxic to the senate, it's all a futile gesture to try and move the news cycle on from Virginia.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,403

    Leon said:

    Really rattling through the Boosters now

    334,000 in a day. Good work

    I thought our booster programme was in disarray?
    Brisk trade in Bath today. Interestingly they were accepting walk-ins, sadly its at the race-course, so three miles out of the city. Useful though. Still no side effects. Starting to wonder if she missed the arm...
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,817

    Leon said:

    Really rattling through the Boosters now

    334,000 in a day. Good work

    Including your truly. My wife and I reached the 6-month period since 2nd jab on Wednesday. We hadn't had a letter or other communication inviting us to apply, and still haven't, but I logged on to the NHS booking website on Wednesday afternoon, and it said we were eligible. We were able to get appointments for the next morning, at Boots in Fleet St. All highly efficient.
    Us too this morning, letter from the health board (in Scotland) a week or two back, appointment today for flu plus booster, one in each arm. Moderna booster (after AZ mains).

    Seemed to be very high turnout indeed - the staff were busy, none of the slack that comes when a proportion don't respond.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    rkrkrk said:

    34k cases, & numbers in hospital declining in all 4 nations, looks like pretty good news.

    Massive fall
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,403
    maaarsh said:

    Today's England cases reported the lowest for over a month, and it's not even a weekend reporting day, and testing is back up after half term. Can only be 7-10 days from journalists stopping saying cases are rising now!

    And NO RESTRICTIONS. Will all the idiots who were gunning for Plan B or worse admit they were wrong?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,132
    kamski said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Charles said:

    Leon said:

    Charles said:

    Leon said:

    Charles said:

    Leon said:

    @Charles and @MaxPB and @Richard_Nabavi

    You guys know about this stuff. If the FDA and its brethren accelerate approval of the Pfizer drug, how long before they can ramp up production and these pills reach Europe? What's a likely time-scale?

    It feels like Europe - the mainland anyway - is now in a sprint between the winter wave and the arrival of these antivirals

    The site will already have been inspected and approved. Little white pills can be churned out very quickly. It only depends if there is any bespoke equipment needed, which I doubt
    Ta. So it's all about approval. And then they arrive days later? Could be a total game-changer

    Pfizer say they will seek approval in the USA by Thanksgiving: November 25

    I imagine that approval will be miraculously swift, if the pills are as good as they seem. So they *could* be in European mouths by Christmas, if the EMA is as nimble?
    You need the site inspection by the EMA as well as the dossier review.
    So what's a likely time-scale, in your opinion? How long before these arrive at a GP near you or Kamski?
    Depends how quickly Pfizer file with the EMA but they are not quick. Travel logistics for the site inspection will be tricky as well
    Could you put a figure on it? Sorry to harangue you but you have expertise

    Ten weeks? Twenty?

    The difference could be utterly crucial as cases and deaths begin to rise in Europe
    There's a very curious north-south divide in Europe right now: Germany, Belgium, the Netherlands, Norway, Denmark (which had previously been completely spared) are all seeing soaring cases, while in the South the numbers have barely budged. I wonder how much of this is weather related.
    I think the long period of good late summer/early autumn weather here in Germany played a big part in keeping numbers relatively low up until recently. But there's also:

    Vaccination rates in Portugal and Spain and Italy are higher than in Germany. I blame the strong German tradition of "alternative" medicine.

    Regulations are stricter in some places (definitely in Italy), and seem to be much more strictly enforced in both Italy and Spain. Enforcement of the few rules (mainly 3g rules) is very lax in my experience round here. It's the freedom-loving Germans again!

    Numbers with immunity from prior infection are probably also quite a bit lower.


    What happened to that guy with the immunological dark matter theory?
    The vaccine split in Germany is almost entirely East-West.
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,590

    maaarsh said:

    Today's England cases reported the lowest for over a month, and it's not even a weekend reporting day, and testing is back up after half term. Can only be 7-10 days from journalists stopping saying cases are rising now!

    And NO RESTRICTIONS. Will all the idiots who were gunning for Plan B or worse admit they were wrong?
    Of course not. Even by saying that you're just showing yourself to be calously indifferent to the suffering of others. They are moral heros we can all learn from.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,367
    edited November 2021

    Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Surly the problem would also go away if the pro-Indy side won?
    That opens up a slightly different problem. Labour would be starting trying to win with a majority approaching 120 rather 80.
  • Jesus.. didn't realise it was (allegedly) this bad

    Adil Ray OBE
    @adilray
    Allegations that a Muslim prayer mat was used by Yorkshire cricket players to clean up the mess from having sex with a woman on her period and players p**sed on an Asian players head are vile. We need answers & action now. I fear a DCMS review won’t cut it. This is much bigger.
    9:56 AM · Nov 5, 2021·Twitter for iPhone
    https://twitter.com/adilray/status/1456561106147758084

    That was the tweet I did not repeat

    It is just horrific
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727

    Jesus.. didn't realise it was (allegedly) this bad

    Adil Ray OBE
    @adilray
    Allegations that a Muslim prayer mat was used by Yorkshire cricket players to clean up the mess from having sex with a woman on her period and players p**sed on an Asian players head are vile. We need answers & action now. I fear a DCMS review won’t cut it. This is much bigger.
    9:56 AM · Nov 5, 2021·Twitter for iPhone
    https://twitter.com/adilray/status/1456561106147758084

    The thing I'm wondering, is whether this is really only a YCCC problem or whether this was much more widespread in cricket and, indeed, other sports. I fear the latter.
  • ClippP said:

    Sean_F said:

    ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    Even back in the late seventies I was aware that paki and yid were offensive terms.
    I can go back further with ‘yid’ and yes it was offensive. You could get away with ‘five’ though.

    Don’t recall anyone being called ‘Paki’ before the late seventies.
    Just a thought... Are "Pakistani" and "Jewish" held to be offensive terms?
    I think yes, if you repeatedly reference someone's ethnic origin, say every time you speak to them.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,125
    JBriskin3 said:

    kinabalu said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    HYUFD said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Yeah.
    Although the really interesting thing about 40-37 is that there would be no combination which would produce a majority at all. Apart from 3.
    Lab SNP.
    CON SNP
    LAB CON.

    You would feel the SNP would be in a strong position. Would not like to speculate what might happen.
    And how would voters behave if that were the prospect? Difficult to say.
    Labour have been soft on the indyref2 for a while now. A Lab-SNP coaltion doesn't seem that unlikely.
    Starmer would likely give the SNP indyref2 if he needs their confidence and supply to become PM in a hung parliament.

    Probably with devomax as a carrot to Scots to try and get them to vote No again
    I agree with this analysis apart from the devomax bit (although you may be right there too)

    Us Yoons know that Tories/Bozo are best for the union.
    Why don't you want to have the vote, win it, and kill Sindy off good and proper instead of this 'delay delay' approach?
    If the Union side were to win again the next day you'd have indyref3 trending on twitter.
    No doubt. But the SNP would have to drop it as a front & centre commitment otherwise they'd shed loads of support in the middle and lose office. Another clear No would take the issue off the table for a long time as regards serious politics.
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,287
    rcs1000 said:

    Pro_Rata said:

    MattW said:

    Quincel said:

    Just huge value on him staying in post. The bar for Tory MPs to turn on a sitting PM with this kind of majority and any poll lead at all is vast.

    Hmmm.

    What's the first likely date for an election? And could he fluff it?

    (When will the boundary commission report, and that be implemented.)
    In terms of likely last possible date of the next election, a periodic reminder that the repeal of FTPA would set this as 23rd January 2025 (parliament automatically dissolving on 16/12, 5 years after first sitting, and the election taking place, 25 working days later plus 4 Bank Holidays later). (Can't remember if dissolution counts as day one in this, but I count day 25, including Scottish New Year BHs as Fri 24/1 if not).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Next_United_Kingdom_general_election?wprov=sfla1

    For the avoidance of doubt, I'm not expecting the next GE to take place in 2025, it's just a curiosity I'm rather taken by.
    Are you sure?

    I thought all the previous legislation relating to parliament length had been repealed, and furthermore the prerogative power of the Queen to agree (with her ministers) to dissolve parliament. Therefore if you simply remove the FTPA, you end up with no mechanism for dissolving parliament, and no limit on the lengths of parliament.

    This would severely limit future betting opportunities, so I oppose it.
    Yes, clause 4 of the Draft Fixed Term Parliaments Act 2011 (Repeal) Bill deals with automatic dissolution and the Commentary states that the 25 day gap remains (I'm not sure if some of the other provisions do provide some wiggle).
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    kinabalu said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    kinabalu said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    HYUFD said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Yeah.
    Although the really interesting thing about 40-37 is that there would be no combination which would produce a majority at all. Apart from 3.
    Lab SNP.
    CON SNP
    LAB CON.

    You would feel the SNP would be in a strong position. Would not like to speculate what might happen.
    And how would voters behave if that were the prospect? Difficult to say.
    Labour have been soft on the indyref2 for a while now. A Lab-SNP coaltion doesn't seem that unlikely.
    Starmer would likely give the SNP indyref2 if he needs their confidence and supply to become PM in a hung parliament.

    Probably with devomax as a carrot to Scots to try and get them to vote No again
    I agree with this analysis apart from the devomax bit (although you may be right there too)

    Us Yoons know that Tories/Bozo are best for the union.
    Why don't you want to have the vote, win it, and kill Sindy off good and proper instead of this 'delay delay' approach?
    If the Union side were to win again the next day you'd have indyref3 trending on twitter.
    No doubt. But the SNP would have to drop it as a front & centre commitment otherwise they'd shed loads of support in the middle and lose office. Another clear No would take the issue off the table for a long time as regards serious politics.
    SNP were campaigning the next day last time round - why would they do anything different from that?
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,590
    You can tell it's a good day of data as some of the more prominent self-appointed covid-centrists have avoided updating the graphs which appear without fail when it goes the other way.
  • Selebian said:

    Jesus.. didn't realise it was (allegedly) this bad

    Adil Ray OBE
    @adilray
    Allegations that a Muslim prayer mat was used by Yorkshire cricket players to clean up the mess from having sex with a woman on her period and players p**sed on an Asian players head are vile. We need answers & action now. I fear a DCMS review won’t cut it. This is much bigger.
    9:56 AM · Nov 5, 2021·Twitter for iPhone
    https://twitter.com/adilray/status/1456561106147758084

    The thing I'm wondering, is whether this is really only a YCCC problem or whether this was much more widespread in cricket and, indeed, other sports. I fear the latter.
    The latter I fear, I posted when this story happened, live on TV, nobody seemed fussed.

    Essex captain Tom Westley has publicly apologised on behalf of the team after a Muslim player had beer poured on him.

    Batsman Feroze Khushi was on the balcony at Lord's with the rest of the squad as Essex displayed the trophy following Sunday's draw with Somerset.

    Khushi, 21, was 12th man for the five-day final at the home of cricket.

    "As a group, we have come together and discussed the event, and on reflection, we are disappointed we let this happen," Westley said on social media.

    "On behalf of myself and the team, we would like to apologise for any offence that was caused during our celebrations at Lord's on Sunday.

    "At Essex we believe we have built a strong dressing room culture that supports one another both on and off the field."

    Westley added that the squad would in future be more responsible and aware of their actions and will "continue to learn and develop" with the help of the England and Wales Cricket Board and Professional Cricketers' Association.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/54337950
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,799
    Excellent fall in cases today. 28k in England on a weekday is well below expectations, if we see this drop continue the national strategy since our full unlockdown in July is fully vindicated. I just wonder whether the constant critics will ever admit that the UK got it right and the other European countries addicted to NPIs didn't.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,571
    Carnyx said:

    Way, way off-topic:

    Quite funny if you're into trains: they're getting quite agricultural in their efforts to get the crashed trains out of the tunnel at Salisbury. finesse? Nah. Just yank it out ...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsHXWUMsLdM

    I was actually going to suggest we needed some Deltic photos in view of the track today's discussion has taken, but this will do very nicely. But I wouldn't want to stand downrange of the likely debris trajectory if something went pop - never mind a whiplashing cable. Ooh.
    I was wondering exactly that about the cable. Enough tension in that to seriously injure someone.

    I guess that unit of the train at least isn't going to be salvageable: it must be getting some forces through it at odd angles...
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,375
    eek said:

    Sean_F said:

    ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    Even back in the late seventies I was aware that paki and yid were offensive terms.
    Yes, I lived in Leeds in the 70s and 80s, near Headingley. The local skinheads, loosely affiliated to the National Front, had a favourite sport. It was called "Paki-bashing", and was, sadly, quite widespread. The idea that anybody in Leeds, even back then, didn't know that 'Paki' was offensive is ludicrous.
    The argument seems to be that although "Paki" was offensive in the 70s / 80s by 2010 it was merely banter.

    No, sorry that's only true if you are completely stupid, I can't think of any word that has become less offensive over time.
    Fuck? As in, a word that's become less offensive over time. When I were a lad, it was a complete no-no, whereas these days - well, I believe it's very common, even on television and in the cinema......
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,582

    Jesus.. didn't realise it was (allegedly) this bad

    Adil Ray OBE
    @adilray
    Allegations that a Muslim prayer mat was used by Yorkshire cricket players to clean up the mess from having sex with a woman on her period and players p**sed on an Asian players head are vile. We need answers & action now. I fear a DCMS review won’t cut it. This is much bigger.
    9:56 AM · Nov 5, 2021·Twitter for iPhone
    https://twitter.com/adilray/status/1456561106147758084

    Err, that doesn’t sound good, especially given that there appears to be a pattern of behaviour rather than isolated incidents.

    Disband the club and start again?
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,189
    edited November 2021
    rcs1000 said:

    kamski said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Charles said:

    Leon said:

    Charles said:

    Leon said:

    Charles said:

    Leon said:

    @Charles and @MaxPB and @Richard_Nabavi

    You guys know about this stuff. If the FDA and its brethren accelerate approval of the Pfizer drug, how long before they can ramp up production and these pills reach Europe? What's a likely time-scale?

    It feels like Europe - the mainland anyway - is now in a sprint between the winter wave and the arrival of these antivirals

    The site will already have been inspected and approved. Little white pills can be churned out very quickly. It only depends if there is any bespoke equipment needed, which I doubt
    Ta. So it's all about approval. And then they arrive days later? Could be a total game-changer

    Pfizer say they will seek approval in the USA by Thanksgiving: November 25

    I imagine that approval will be miraculously swift, if the pills are as good as they seem. So they *could* be in European mouths by Christmas, if the EMA is as nimble?
    You need the site inspection by the EMA as well as the dossier review.
    So what's a likely time-scale, in your opinion? How long before these arrive at a GP near you or Kamski?
    Depends how quickly Pfizer file with the EMA but they are not quick. Travel logistics for the site inspection will be tricky as well
    Could you put a figure on it? Sorry to harangue you but you have expertise

    Ten weeks? Twenty?

    The difference could be utterly crucial as cases and deaths begin to rise in Europe
    There's a very curious north-south divide in Europe right now: Germany, Belgium, the Netherlands, Norway, Denmark (which had previously been completely spared) are all seeing soaring cases, while in the South the numbers have barely budged. I wonder how much of this is weather related.
    I think the long period of good late summer/early autumn weather here in Germany played a big part in keeping numbers relatively low up until recently. But there's also:

    Vaccination rates in Portugal and Spain and Italy are higher than in Germany. I blame the strong German tradition of "alternative" medicine.

    Regulations are stricter in some places (definitely in Italy), and seem to be much more strictly enforced in both Italy and Spain. Enforcement of the few rules (mainly 3g rules) is very lax in my experience round here. It's the freedom-loving Germans again!

    Numbers with immunity from prior infection are probably also quite a bit lower.


    What happened to that guy with the immunological dark matter theory?
    The vaccine split in Germany is almost entirely East-West.
    Not entirely. Bavaria and Baden-Württemberg have fewer vaccinated than Meck-Pomm and Berlin. Also I would be a bit suspicious of how accurate the numbers are.

    https://impfdashboard.de/
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,496
    JBriskin3 said:

    kinabalu said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    HYUFD said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Yeah.
    Although the really interesting thing about 40-37 is that there would be no combination which would produce a majority at all. Apart from 3.
    Lab SNP.
    CON SNP
    LAB CON.

    You would feel the SNP would be in a strong position. Would not like to speculate what might happen.
    And how would voters behave if that were the prospect? Difficult to say.
    Labour have been soft on the indyref2 for a while now. A Lab-SNP coaltion doesn't seem that unlikely.
    Starmer would likely give the SNP indyref2 if he needs their confidence and supply to become PM in a hung parliament.

    Probably with devomax as a carrot to Scots to try and get them to vote No again
    I agree with this analysis apart from the devomax bit (although you may be right there too)

    Us Yoons know that Tories/Bozo are best for the union.
    Why don't you want to have the vote, win it, and kill Sindy off good and proper instead of this 'delay delay' approach?
    If the Union side were to win again the next day you'd have indyref3 trending on twitter.
    Boris has a good political reason not to hold Ref2 - if he loses it it is bad for the union and for Boris, but if he wins it it is good for Labour, and therefore bad for the Tories, because the SNP will be for a few years a harmless centre left party that can ally with Labour against the Tories. Which would make voting Labour much easier for unionists who want a stable government. Ref2 is lose/lose for Boris.

  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368

    Selebian said:

    Jesus.. didn't realise it was (allegedly) this bad

    Adil Ray OBE
    @adilray
    Allegations that a Muslim prayer mat was used by Yorkshire cricket players to clean up the mess from having sex with a woman on her period and players p**sed on an Asian players head are vile. We need answers & action now. I fear a DCMS review won’t cut it. This is much bigger.
    9:56 AM · Nov 5, 2021·Twitter for iPhone
    https://twitter.com/adilray/status/1456561106147758084

    The thing I'm wondering, is whether this is really only a YCCC problem or whether this was much more widespread in cricket and, indeed, other sports. I fear the latter.
    The latter I fear, I posted when this story happened, live on TV, nobody seemed fussed.

    Essex captain Tom Westley has publicly apologised on behalf of the team after a Muslim player had beer poured on him.

    Batsman Feroze Khushi was on the balcony at Lord's with the rest of the squad as Essex displayed the trophy following Sunday's draw with Somerset.

    Khushi, 21, was 12th man for the five-day final at the home of cricket.

    "As a group, we have come together and discussed the event, and on reflection, we are disappointed we let this happen," Westley said on social media.

    "On behalf of myself and the team, we would like to apologise for any offence that was caused during our celebrations at Lord's on Sunday.

    "At Essex we believe we have built a strong dressing room culture that supports one another both on and off the field."

    Westley added that the squad would in future be more responsible and aware of their actions and will "continue to learn and develop" with the help of the England and Wales Cricket Board and Professional Cricketers' Association.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/54337950
    I can't help but feel that the sort of culture you have been highlighting at Headingly and Chelmsford is promoted when politicians claim their dog-whistles are nothing more than "satire".
  • Selebian said:

    ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    I think they need to appoint me Chief Executive and Executive Chairman of YCCC and I'll fix all the problems.

    A strong Yorkshire means a strong England.
    I have always found Yorkshire kind of annoying, for a few reasons:

    1. Claiming to be in the North, even though parts of it are closer to London than to the Scottish border
    2. Yorkshire Tea, which self-evidently isn't produced in Yorkshire
    3. Being referred to by its residents as God's own Country, which seems rather boastful and potentially blasphemous, especially if you've ever spent time in some of the ropier bits
    4. Geoffrey Boycott.
    Boycott, I'll concede. You can have YCCC too.

    As a southerner naturalised in Yorkshire I answer the others as follows:
    1. Anything north of Watford Gap is north. Plus Yorkshire folk say bath, not barth.
    2. Yorkshire tea is indeed produced in Yorkshire. The raw ingredients come from elsewhere. Next you'll be claiming that BP petrol isn't really British! :open_mouth:
    3. God's Own Country? Well Jacob Rees-Mogg says it isn't.[1] Case closed?

    [1] https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/politics/jacob-rees-mogg-yorkshire-is-not-gods-own-country-somerset-is-3146769
    On the basis that JRM is always wrong I will concede 3. On 1. you are basically denying the existence of the Midlands, where I think most of Yorkshire is located. On 2., I think the petrol refining process is a more substantive procedure than mixing up tea leaves from several countries and putting them in a perforated bag. Yorkshire tea is not from Yorkshire (it is from India, Sri Lanka and Kenya).
  • MaxPB said:

    Excellent fall in cases today. 28k in England on a weekday is well below expectations, if we see this drop continue the national strategy since our full unlockdown in July is fully vindicated. I just wonder whether the constant critics will ever admit that the UK got it right and the other European countries addicted to NPIs didn't.

    You'll be waiting a long time I think...
  • Family porn man


    Thankfully we don't get to see what is going on below the waist.
    His lucky family though..
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,134

    Jesus.. didn't realise it was (allegedly) this bad

    Adil Ray OBE
    @adilray
    Allegations that a Muslim prayer mat was used by Yorkshire cricket players to clean up the mess from having sex with a woman on her period and players p**sed on an Asian players head are vile. We need answers & action now. I fear a DCMS review won’t cut it. This is much bigger.
    9:56 AM · Nov 5, 2021·Twitter for iPhone
    https://twitter.com/adilray/status/1456561106147758084

    If that's true then yes, it is much bigger.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,125
    edited November 2021
    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    HYUFD said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Yeah.
    Although the really interesting thing about 40-37 is that there would be no combination which would produce a majority at all. Apart from 3.
    Lab SNP.
    CON SNP
    LAB CON.

    You would feel the SNP would be in a strong position. Would not like to speculate what might happen.
    And how would voters behave if that were the prospect? Difficult to say.
    Labour have been soft on the indyref2 for a while now. A Lab-SNP coaltion doesn't seem that unlikely.
    Starmer would likely give the SNP indyref2 if he needs their confidence and supply to become PM in a hung parliament.

    Probably with devomax as a carrot to Scots to try and get them to vote No again
    I agree with this analysis apart from the devomax bit (although you may be right there too)

    Us Yoons know that Tories/Bozo are best for the union.
    Why don't you want to have the vote, win it, and kill Sindy off good and proper instead of this 'delay delay' approach?
    You won't kill Sindy off unless a second vote is held a genuine generation after 2014, which is at minimum 10-15 years after. Canada proved that when the second Quebec independence referendum was only held in 1995, 15 years after the first in 1980.

    Otherwise the SNP would demand indyref3 the next day you already having given in to them once and held indyref2 within a generation of indyref1, unless No won by a landslide
    Nope. Disagree. If it were another No and the SNP went into the next Scottish election demanding another one they wouldn't win it. These are massive massive events. The Scots won't want to keep holding them. They'd be nuts to want that. So the SNP choice at the next election would be (i) demand another Ref and lose or (ii) drop it to try and win. Either way, Sindy over for now. That's the prize that unionists should target. This way it just drags on and on and makes Sindy more likely as the ultimate outcome.
  • maaarsh said:

    Today's England cases reported the lowest for over a month, and it's not even a weekend reporting day, and testing is back up after half term. Can only be 7-10 days from journalists stopping saying cases are rising now!

    And NO RESTRICTIONS. Will all the idiots who were gunning for Plan B or worse admit they were wrong?

    Andrew Lilico
    @andrew_lilico
    ·
    16m
    There's a highly non-trivial chance cases will be below 25k/day in England before the broadcasters even start to acknowledge that cases aren't still rising!
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,370
    Tom Harrison threatening to take direct charge of Yorkshire.

    Just when you thought they couldn't be in a worse mess...
  • Family porn man


    Thankfully we don't get to see what is going on below the waist.
    His lucky family though..
    All keenly looking forward to Dad's next erotic tableau vivant event.
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,590
    Boosters now on track to crack the 15m level before the end of this month, which was the benchmark for covering the vast majority of potential deaths and hospitalisations during the first wave of jabs last January.

    Only trick now will be the government avoiding being sppoked by the usual NHS winter pressure, now several interested parties have megaphones and know how to use them.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,189
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    @Charles and @MaxPB and @Richard_Nabavi

    You guys know about this stuff. If the FDA and its brethren accelerate approval of the Pfizer drug, how long before they can ramp up production and these pills reach Europe? What's a likely time-scale?

    It feels like Europe - the mainland anyway - is now in a sprint between the winter wave and the arrival of these antivirals

    I’ve just returned from Spain, where they had a mask mandate in the middle of summer / warm bit of autumn. That to me seem unwise, as presumably it’s better to munch your exit wave when the weather is good, as masking simply delays it?
    We have a mask mandate in Los Angeles County - it's basically shops, public transport, the communal areas of office building (lifts), plus the ridiculous dance in restaurants when you get up to use the bathroom.

    The US still has very onerous Federal rules on airplanes (where they get very annoyed with you if you remove your mask for more than a few seconds), and in airports.
    I’ve just come back from Greece where nobody minded too much about masks.

    Nor did anyone on the Ryanair flight back. I mean, you are of course supposed to wear them but nobody is going to make you.
    Infections are getting bad in Greece, and rising fast. The death rate is now twice ours (and we're already bad compared with other western European countries):

    https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1456586903302639620

    So it's not just weather.
    It's hard to know what is going on without also knowing the state of lockdowns - if any - in individual countries

    Is there anywhere that tells you this? in one handy graphic?
    No.

    Not least because it's complicated. Germany has no national retrictions at all, leaving it all to the individual Lander.
    Though the differences are probably quite minor between most states. There are 3g rules (occasionally 2g, but this seems to be up to venues to decide), and mask mandates. Then there are details about how many thousands can attend an event outside if there is no dancing or whatever. We still have masks inside in schools when not sat at own desk, which other states have dropped - that's about the biggest difference I know of right now, but obviously I'm not checking the rules all the time.

    Checking whether people are vaccinated or tested or recovered to enter pubs etc is very lax here, at least up to now - not like in parts of Spain where they apparently really scan the QR codes, and check your ID matches.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,125

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    HYUFD said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Andy_JS said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    The latest polling still has the Tories comfortably winning most seats and most polls still have Boris preferred as PM to Starmer.

    Unless that changes, Boris will survive up to 2024. Plus of course the longer he stays as PM the more his valued on the lecture circuit increases post Premiership. If he wants to be in the Blair and Thatcher league of speakers and earning millions on the lecture circuit he needs to be there for a decade at least

    How many points ahead do Labour have to be for most seats crossover?
    40 to 37 just manages it on new boundaries if everyone else stays the same.
    Ominously, no majority is possible on those numbers without the SNP.
    Except Grand Coalition of course.
    Labour's SNP problem never seems to go away. The only way it would is if somehow another independence referendum is held before the next election and the pro-Indy side loses it, which would mean they wouldn't be able to demand another one from Labour so soon.
    Yeah.
    Although the really interesting thing about 40-37 is that there would be no combination which would produce a majority at all. Apart from 3.
    Lab SNP.
    CON SNP
    LAB CON.

    You would feel the SNP would be in a strong position. Would not like to speculate what might happen.
    And how would voters behave if that were the prospect? Difficult to say.
    Labour have been soft on the indyref2 for a while now. A Lab-SNP coaltion doesn't seem that unlikely.
    Starmer would likely give the SNP indyref2 if he needs their confidence and supply to become PM in a hung parliament.

    Probably with devomax as a carrot to Scots to try and get them to vote No again
    I agree with this analysis apart from the devomax bit (although you may be right there too)

    Us Yoons know that Tories/Bozo are best for the union.
    Why don't you want to have the vote, win it, and kill Sindy off good and proper instead of this 'delay delay' approach?
    You won't kill Sindy off unless a second vote is held a genuine generation after 2014, which is at minimum 10-15 years after. Canada proved that when the second Quebec independence referendum was only held in 1995, 15 years after the first in 1980.

    Otherwise the SNP would demand indyref3 the next day you already having given in to them once and held indyref2 within a generation of indyref1, unless No won by a landslide
    You will never kill off indyrefs

    I have lived with them since the early 1950s
    There's only been one!
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,582

    eek said:

    Sean_F said:

    ydoethur said:

    Fucking hell, next he'll admit to not knowing 'Paki' is an offensive term.

    Yorkshire head coach Andrew Gale is being investigated by bosses over anti-Semitic social media messages, it has emerged amid the club's deepening racism crisis.

    In a now deleted post on Twitter from November 2010, the then club captain told Paul Dews, who was head of media at Leeds United Football Club at the time, to "Button it y--!"

    Gale told the Jewish News website, which first reported the tweet, that he was “completely unaware” of the offensive nature of the term at the time he sent the message.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2021/11/05/yorkshire-cricket-racism-storm-chairman-quits-hits-ecb-latest/

    Good grief.

    I am starting to think Yorkshire CCC won't survive this.
    Even back in the late seventies I was aware that paki and yid were offensive terms.
    Yes, I lived in Leeds in the 70s and 80s, near Headingley. The local skinheads, loosely affiliated to the National Front, had a favourite sport. It was called "Paki-bashing", and was, sadly, quite widespread. The idea that anybody in Leeds, even back then, didn't know that 'Paki' was offensive is ludicrous.
    The argument seems to be that although "Paki" was offensive in the 70s / 80s by 2010 it was merely banter.

    No, sorry that's only true if you are completely stupid, I can't think of any word that has become less offensive over time.
    Fuck? As in, a word that's become less offensive over time. When I were a lad, it was a complete no-no, whereas these days - well, I believe it's very common, even on television and in the cinema......
    George Carlin could probably do his “Seven words you can’t say on television” bit, in the early evening these days.
This discussion has been closed.