It’s only a sub-sample but.. – politicalbetting.com

MattW said:

Pagan2 said:

OnboardG1 said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Farooq said:

highwayparadise306 said:

highwayparadise306 said:

SandyRentool said:

DavidL said:

Jordan seriously expensive.

Worse than Switzerland?

How much is a Big Mac in Zurich? I do like Macdonalds though.

I meant I do like Macdonalds.

They're ok, but a nice warm tin of Campbells on a winter's night is to die for.

Tomato soup with cheese on toast on a cold night...

I like Campbell's Condensed Mushroom Soup (the only tinned mushroom soup that actually tastes of anything at this point) but it's a bugger to get around here. Whenever I see it in Tesco I buy six cans of it.

make your own I use this recipe
https://www.bbcgoodfood.com/recipes/mushroom-soup

That reads like a good one to batch cook in a slow cooker and then portion-freeze, and microwave and grater strong cheese on.

Personally I'd perhaps add crumbled black pudding for extra depth.

Sandpit said:

This is where Stokes could turn around a match.

pigeon said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

When did Rishi Sunak become England's batting coach?

Fake news. He's being lined up to replace Southgate after the forthcoming Slovakia debacle.

pigeon said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

When did Rishi Sunak become England's batting coach?

Fake news. He's being lined up to replace Southgate after the forthcoming Slovakia debacle.

TimS said:

Leon said:

The debate about tatty Taunton and hollowed out British market towns occurred as I was walking around Le Conquet in north Finistere. ANOTHER beautiful French town with a thriving centre and not an empty shop to be seen

So this is in some ways a British thing. Or don’t the French use the internet?

It’s happened in rural France too but in a slightly different way more redolent of Counties like Kent and Sussex.

One settlement in an area - usually either the prettiest or most accessible - becomes a hub with the restaurants, decent shops and weekly market. These towns do much better than most of their English counterparts. The other similarly sized settlements in the immediate area get hollowed out and become dormitories with one or two bar-Tabacs and a proximarche.

So around us Cluny and Cormatin - which are both pretty and well connected - get the market, the festivals, the restaurants and boutiques, and the tourists. Others like St Gengoux, St Bonnet de Joux, Salornay-sur-Guye make do with one of two shops (though Salornay does have a decent boulangerie a pizzeria).

Pagan2 said:

MattW said:

Pagan2 said:

OnboardG1 said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Farooq said:

highwayparadise306 said:

highwayparadise306 said:

SandyRentool said:

DavidL said:

Jordan seriously expensive.

Worse than Switzerland?

How much is a Big Mac in Zurich? I do like Macdonalds though.

I meant I do like Macdonalds.

They're ok, but a nice warm tin of Campbells on a winter's night is to die for.

Tomato soup with cheese on toast on a cold night...

I like Campbell's Condensed Mushroom Soup (the only tinned mushroom soup that actually tastes of anything at this point) but it's a bugger to get around here. Whenever I see it in Tesco I buy six cans of it.

make your own I use this recipe
https://www.bbcgoodfood.com/recipes/mushroom-soup

That reads like a good one to batch cook in a slow cooker and then portion-freeze, and microwave and grater strong cheese on.

Personally I'd perhaps add crumbled black pudding for extra depth.

Possibly a good addition will try it next time I make it, I have used crumbled barnstone blue with it in the past so can recommend that

pigeon said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

When did Rishi Sunak become England's batting coach?

Fake news. He's being lined up to replace Southgate after the forthcoming Slovakia debacle.

TimS said:

Leon said:

The debate about tatty Taunton and hollowed out British market towns occurred as I was walking around Le Conquet in north Finistere. ANOTHER beautiful French town with a thriving centre and not an empty shop to be seen

So this is in some ways a British thing. Or don’t the French use the internet?

It’s happened in rural France too but in a slightly different way more redolent of Counties like Kent and Sussex.

One settlement in an area - usually either the prettiest or most accessible - becomes a hub with the restaurants, decent shops and weekly market. These towns do much better than most of their English counterparts. The other similarly sized settlements in the immediate area get hollowed out and become dormitories with one or two bar-Tabacs and a proximarche.

So around us Cluny and Cormatin - which are both pretty and well connected - get the market, the festivals, the restaurants and boutiques, and the tourists. Others like St Gengoux, St Bonnet de Joux, Salornay-sur-Guye make do with one of two shops (though Salornay does have a decent boulangerie a pizzeria).

Theuniondivvie said:

pigeon said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

When did Rishi Sunak become England's batting coach?

Fake news. He's being lined up to replace Southgate after the forthcoming Slovakia debacle.

Aiming a bit high, England penalties coach to start with.

another_richard said:

TimS said:

Leon said:

The debate about tatty Taunton and hollowed out British market towns occurred as I was walking around Le Conquet in north Finistere. ANOTHER beautiful French town with a thriving centre and not an empty shop to be seen

So this is in some ways a British thing. Or don’t the French use the internet?

It’s happened in rural France too but in a slightly different way more redolent of Counties like Kent and Sussex.

One settlement in an area - usually either the prettiest or most accessible - becomes a hub with the restaurants, decent shops and weekly market. These towns do much better than most of their English counterparts. The other similarly sized settlements in the immediate area get hollowed out and become dormitories with one or two bar-Tabacs and a proximarche.

So around us Cluny and Cormatin - which are both pretty and well connected - get the market, the festivals, the restaurants and boutiques, and the tourists. Others like St Gengoux, St Bonnet de Joux, Salornay-sur-Guye make do with one of two shops (though Salornay does have a decent boulangerie a pizzeria).

For what I see in England its those towns which were big enough to have major chain stores such as M&S, Boots, Debenhams that look tatty as they now have big empty blocks in prominent places.

Plus those people who previously had been attracted by the big shops now stop visiting entirely.

Towns at about 10k often seem to be doing better with redundant retail premises being converted into bars and restaurants.

Leon said:

TimS said:

Leon said:

The debate about tatty Taunton and hollowed out British market towns occurred as I was walking around Le Conquet in north Finistere. ANOTHER beautiful French town with a thriving centre and not an empty shop to be seen

So this is in some ways a British thing. Or don’t the French use the internet?

It’s happened in rural France too but in a slightly different way more redolent of Counties like Kent and Sussex.

One settlement in an area - usually either the prettiest or most accessible - becomes a hub with the restaurants, decent shops and weekly market. These towns do much better than most of their English counterparts. The other similarly sized settlements in the immediate area get hollowed out and become dormitories with one or two bar-Tabacs and a proximarche.

So around us Cluny and Cormatin - which are both pretty and well connected - get the market, the festivals, the restaurants and boutiques, and the tourists. Others like St Gengoux, St Bonnet de Joux, Salornay-sur-Guye make do with one of two shops (though Salornay does have a decent boulangerie a pizzeria).

That’s interesting - merci

I do wonder if Brittany is doing exceptionally well, even within France. It all seems so kempt and clean and affluent, even the grotty bits would be nice bits - sadly - inmany parts of the UK

I’ve now been all over it for three weeks - driving in, through and around, the most rundown town I’ve seen is Douarnanez which is still rather attractive and about as nice as, say, Truro. Towns like Vannes, Dinan or Pont Aven ooze opulence. Someone downthread says my comparison twixt Taunton and Le Conquet is unfair because size, well then take Quimper, it has almost the exact same population as Taunton - circa 60,000 - and Quimper is thriving and I saw no empty shops

Tourism is pulling in vast amounts of money, I sense, and a lot of wealthy Parisians are moving here full time or buying second homes

pigeon said:

Pagan2 said:

algarkirk said:

RochdalePioneers said:

DavidL said:

I am not getting a lot of joy out of this election but the thing I find most irritating is the number of muppets minded to vote for Reform and, indirectly, 10 years of socialist government. There have been suggestions for a while that IQs are falling but this is a jump off a tall bridge.

You begin to wonder if democracy is just too hard for some people.

Question - what is the difference between "socialist government" and the Conservatives?

Punative taxes to record levels? Tick
Wasting billions on crap public services? Tick
Open door migration letting anyone in? Tick
Nanny state nonsense about what we eat and smoke? Tick

People don't fear "socialist government" or any of the idiotic threats Sunak and the press team are making, because we live that every day already.

The Overton window is so narrow there is almost nothing substantive to discuss. Once you have a welfare state, free state education, NHS, industrial policy, consumer protection, regulation about everything, and a few other things a social democrat state with highly regulated capitalism is the only option. State managed expenditure has increased every year and this will continue. It is unavoidable.

The left have one further option - this + socialist state control of all commerce too. No serious right wing option has emerged with a working model in Europe yet. This is one of the most remarkable and underestimated facts of political policy. The Conservative party's two biggest fails since the war are: Lack of European statecraft, leading to the disaster of Brexit; and the failure to practice conservatism in any respects at all.

Not something I advocate by any means just an observation on all governements of the past

Wars used to cull the poor, now we no longer really have mass casualty wars its a new problem for governements of all stripes to have a burgeoning underclass and they have no idea how to deal with it

More broadly we have a terrible problem with dependency, chiefly due to a combination of low paid employment and ridiculous housing costs (meaning that many working people end up reliant on social security) and vast numbers of pensioners. The situation is theoretically recoverable, but some of the measures required - especially millions of houses and attendant infrastructure, and requiring people to work until 70 or possibly slightly beyond that - are so unpopular that they'll probably never get done. I'll certainly be surprised in a good way of Labour manages to meet its building commitments, and astonished if the houses are decent rather than shoddily constructed little identikit rabbit hutches marooned amidst acres of car parking.

OldKingCole said:

another_richard said:

TimS said:

Leon said:

The debate about tatty Taunton and hollowed out British market towns occurred as I was walking around Le Conquet in north Finistere. ANOTHER beautiful French town with a thriving centre and not an empty shop to be seen

So this is in some ways a British thing. Or don’t the French use the internet?

It’s happened in rural France too but in a slightly different way more redolent of Counties like Kent and Sussex.

One settlement in an area - usually either the prettiest or most accessible - becomes a hub with the restaurants, decent shops and weekly market. These towns do much better than most of their English counterparts. The other similarly sized settlements in the immediate area get hollowed out and become dormitories with one or two bar-Tabacs and a proximarche.

So around us Cluny and Cormatin - which are both pretty and well connected - get the market, the festivals, the restaurants and boutiques, and the tourists. Others like St Gengoux, St Bonnet de Joux, Salornay-sur-Guye make do with one of two shops (though Salornay does have a decent boulangerie a pizzeria).

For what I see in England its those towns which were big enough to have major chain stores such as M&S, Boots, Debenhams that look tatty as they now have big empty blocks in prominent places.

Plus those people who previously had been attracted by the big shops now stop visiting entirely.

Towns at about 10k often seem to be doing better with redundant retail premises being converted into bars and restaurants.

Nearest local ‘big town’ ….. Braintree …. has an ‘out of town’ centre, Braintree Village which appears to have decimated the traditional town centre.

TimS said:

Leon said:

TimS said:

Leon said:

The debate about tatty Taunton and hollowed out British market towns occurred as I was walking around Le Conquet in north Finistere. ANOTHER beautiful French town with a thriving centre and not an empty shop to be seen

So this is in some ways a British thing. Or don’t the French use the internet?

It’s happened in rural France too but in a slightly different way more redolent of Counties like Kent and Sussex.

One settlement in an area - usually either the prettiest or most accessible - becomes a hub with the restaurants, decent shops and weekly market. These towns do much better than most of their English counterparts. The other similarly sized settlements in the immediate area get hollowed out and become dormitories with one or two bar-Tabacs and a proximarche.

So around us Cluny and Cormatin - which are both pretty and well connected - get the market, the festivals, the restaurants and boutiques, and the tourists. Others like St Gengoux, St Bonnet de Joux, Salornay-sur-Guye make do with one of two shops (though Salornay does have a decent boulangerie a pizzeria).

That’s interesting - merci

I do wonder if Brittany is doing exceptionally well, even within France. It all seems so kempt and clean and affluent, even the grotty bits would be nice bits - sadly - inmany parts of the UK

I’ve now been all over it for three weeks - driving in, through and around, the most rundown town I’ve seen is Douarnanez which is still rather attractive and about as nice as, say, Truro. Towns like Vannes, Dinan or Pont Aven ooze opulence. Someone downthread says my comparison twixt Taunton and Le Conquet is unfair because size, well then take Quimper, it has almost the exact same population as Taunton - circa 60,000 - and Quimper is thriving and I saw no empty shops

Tourism is pulling in vast amounts of money, I sense, and a lot of wealthy Parisians are moving here full time or buying second homes

I wonder if climate change and a series of intolerably hot summers in the Midi have been a boon to the West coast.

Leon said:

TimS said:

Leon said:

TimS said:

Leon said:

The debate about tatty Taunton and hollowed out British market towns occurred as I was walking around Le Conquet in north Finistere. ANOTHER beautiful French town with a thriving centre and not an empty shop to be seen

So this is in some ways a British thing. Or don’t the French use the internet?

It’s happened in rural France too but in a slightly different way more redolent of Counties like Kent and Sussex.

One settlement in an area - usually either the prettiest or most accessible - becomes a hub with the restaurants, decent shops and weekly market. These towns do much better than most of their English counterparts. The other similarly sized settlements in the immediate area get hollowed out and become dormitories with one or two bar-Tabacs and a proximarche.

So around us Cluny and Cormatin - which are both pretty and well connected - get the market, the festivals, the restaurants and boutiques, and the tourists. Others like St Gengoux, St Bonnet de Joux, Salornay-sur-Guye make do with one of two shops (though Salornay does have a decent boulangerie a pizzeria).

That’s interesting - merci

I do wonder if Brittany is doing exceptionally well, even within France. It all seems so kempt and clean and affluent, even the grotty bits would be nice bits - sadly - inmany parts of the UK

I’ve now been all over it for three weeks - driving in, through and around, the most rundown town I’ve seen is Douarnanez which is still rather attractive and about as nice as, say, Truro. Towns like Vannes, Dinan or Pont Aven ooze opulence. Someone downthread says my comparison twixt Taunton and Le Conquet is unfair because size, well then take Quimper, it has almost the exact same population as Taunton - circa 60,000 - and Quimper is thriving and I saw no empty shops

Tourism is pulling in vast amounts of money, I sense, and a lot of wealthy Parisians are moving here full time or buying second homes

I wonder if climate change and a series of intolerably hot summers in the Midi have been a boon to the West coast.

i discussed exactly that with a Breton hotelier this week! - and her answer is Oui

londonpubman said:

The cricket's so shyte I have turned over to ITV to watch Keir!

BartholomewRoberts said:

Pagan2 said:

pigeon said:

Pagan2 said:

algarkirk said:

RochdalePioneers said:

DavidL said:

I am not getting a lot of joy out of this election but the thing I find most irritating is the number of muppets minded to vote for Reform and, indirectly, 10 years of socialist government. There have been suggestions for a while that IQs are falling but this is a jump off a tall bridge.

You begin to wonder if democracy is just too hard for some people.

Question - what is the difference between "socialist government" and the Conservatives?

Punative taxes to record levels? Tick
Wasting billions on crap public services? Tick
Open door migration letting anyone in? Tick
Nanny state nonsense about what we eat and smoke? Tick

People don't fear "socialist government" or any of the idiotic threats Sunak and the press team are making, because we live that every day already.

The Overton window is so narrow there is almost nothing substantive to discuss. Once you have a welfare state, free state education, NHS, industrial policy, consumer protection, regulation about everything, and a few other things a social democrat state with highly regulated capitalism is the only option. State managed expenditure has increased every year and this will continue. It is unavoidable.

The left have one further option - this + socialist state control of all commerce too. No serious right wing option has emerged with a working model in Europe yet. This is one of the most remarkable and underestimated facts of political policy. The Conservative party's two biggest fails since the war are: Lack of European statecraft, leading to the disaster of Brexit; and the failure to practice conservatism in any respects at all.

Not something I advocate by any means just an observation on all governements of the past

Wars used to cull the poor, now we no longer really have mass casualty wars its a new problem for governements of all stripes to have a burgeoning underclass and they have no idea how to deal with it

More broadly we have a terrible problem with dependency, chiefly due to a combination of low paid employment and ridiculous housing costs (meaning that many working people end up reliant on social security) and vast numbers of pensioners. The situation is theoretically recoverable, but some of the measures required - especially millions of houses and attendant infrastructure, and requiring people to work until 70 or possibly slightly beyond that - are so unpopular that they'll probably never get done. I'll certainly be surprised in a good way of Labour manages to meet its building commitments, and astonished if the houses are decent rather than shoddily constructed little identikit rabbit hutches marooned amidst acres of car parking.

Labour won't meet those targets even if it is their deepest desire, simple fact is there aren't enough construction workers nor the supply of building materials. The problem is exacerbated by the fact we are over the 50% mark for people who take more from the state than they give. For those people voting for more is a no brainer.

As many might have noted I tend rightwards . However I do believe there should be a safety net, free education to 18 and a health service which is free at point of use.

I also believe though that the state does too much and we should trim back what we do. I would rather the state did less but funded it properly than it tries to do too much and half arses everything.

For starters I would do a clawback on state pensions, every 5£ over say 5k private pension should mean 1£ off your state pension

NI on pensions

A lifetime health care costs cap with an insurance based top off

As examples

There is no shortage of skilled tradies in this country who could be building homes if they were easily able to do so without planning restrictions.

Pagan2 said:

pigeon said:

Pagan2 said:

algarkirk said:

RochdalePioneers said:

DavidL said:

I am not getting a lot of joy out of this election but the thing I find most irritating is the number of muppets minded to vote for Reform and, indirectly, 10 years of socialist government. There have been suggestions for a while that IQs are falling but this is a jump off a tall bridge.

You begin to wonder if democracy is just too hard for some people.

Question - what is the difference between "socialist government" and the Conservatives?

Punative taxes to record levels? Tick
Wasting billions on crap public services? Tick
Open door migration letting anyone in? Tick
Nanny state nonsense about what we eat and smoke? Tick

People don't fear "socialist government" or any of the idiotic threats Sunak and the press team are making, because we live that every day already.

The Overton window is so narrow there is almost nothing substantive to discuss. Once you have a welfare state, free state education, NHS, industrial policy, consumer protection, regulation about everything, and a few other things a social democrat state with highly regulated capitalism is the only option. State managed expenditure has increased every year and this will continue. It is unavoidable.

The left have one further option - this + socialist state control of all commerce too. No serious right wing option has emerged with a working model in Europe yet. This is one of the most remarkable and underestimated facts of political policy. The Conservative party's two biggest fails since the war are: Lack of European statecraft, leading to the disaster of Brexit; and the failure to practice conservatism in any respects at all.

Not something I advocate by any means just an observation on all governements of the past

Wars used to cull the poor, now we no longer really have mass casualty wars its a new problem for governements of all stripes to have a burgeoning underclass and they have no idea how to deal with it

More broadly we have a terrible problem with dependency, chiefly due to a combination of low paid employment and ridiculous housing costs (meaning that many working people end up reliant on social security) and vast numbers of pensioners. The situation is theoretically recoverable, but some of the measures required - especially millions of houses and attendant infrastructure, and requiring people to work until 70 or possibly slightly beyond that - are so unpopular that they'll probably never get done. I'll certainly be surprised in a good way of Labour manages to meet its building commitments, and astonished if the houses are decent rather than shoddily constructed little identikit rabbit hutches marooned amidst acres of car parking.

Labour won't meet those targets even if it is their deepest desire, simple fact is there aren't enough construction workers nor the supply of building materials. The problem is exacerbated by the fact we are over the 50% mark for people who take more from the state than they give. For those people voting for more is a no brainer.

As many might have noted I tend rightwards . However I do believe there should be a safety net, free education to 18 and a health service which is free at point of use.

I also believe though that the state does too much and we should trim back what we do. I would rather the state did less but funded it properly than it tries to do too much and half arses everything.

For starters I would do a clawback on state pensions, every 5£ over say 5k private pension should mean 1£ off your state pension

NI on pensions

A lifetime health care costs cap with an insurance based top off

As examples

Andy_JS said:

Video of Channel 4's investigation into Reform in Clacton.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmkMpYbOoO0

OldKingCole said:

72-7

OnboardG1 said:

Andy_JS said:

Video of Channel 4's investigation into Reform in Clacton.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmkMpYbOoO0

Pub bore party attracts pub bores shock. Not sure what's worse. The racism or the innumeracy.

londonpubman said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Are we all ready for the OAP screaming match from the US later on?

I think it's 9pm EST so 2am BST??

I'm not staying up for that. I will be staying up next Thursday.

Pagan2 said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

Pagan2 said:

pigeon said:

Pagan2 said:

algarkirk said:

RochdalePioneers said:

DavidL said:

I am not getting a lot of joy out of this election but the thing I find most irritating is the number of muppets minded to vote for Reform and, indirectly, 10 years of socialist government. There have been suggestions for a while that IQs are falling but this is a jump off a tall bridge.

You begin to wonder if democracy is just too hard for some people.

Question - what is the difference between "socialist government" and the Conservatives?

Punative taxes to record levels? Tick
Wasting billions on crap public services? Tick
Open door migration letting anyone in? Tick
Nanny state nonsense about what we eat and smoke? Tick

People don't fear "socialist government" or any of the idiotic threats Sunak and the press team are making, because we live that every day already.

The Overton window is so narrow there is almost nothing substantive to discuss. Once you have a welfare state, free state education, NHS, industrial policy, consumer protection, regulation about everything, and a few other things a social democrat state with highly regulated capitalism is the only option. State managed expenditure has increased every year and this will continue. It is unavoidable.

The left have one further option - this + socialist state control of all commerce too. No serious right wing option has emerged with a working model in Europe yet. This is one of the most remarkable and underestimated facts of political policy. The Conservative party's two biggest fails since the war are: Lack of European statecraft, leading to the disaster of Brexit; and the failure to practice conservatism in any respects at all.

Not something I advocate by any means just an observation on all governements of the past

Wars used to cull the poor, now we no longer really have mass casualty wars its a new problem for governements of all stripes to have a burgeoning underclass and they have no idea how to deal with it

More broadly we have a terrible problem with dependency, chiefly due to a combination of low paid employment and ridiculous housing costs (meaning that many working people end up reliant on social security) and vast numbers of pensioners. The situation is theoretically recoverable, but some of the measures required - especially millions of houses and attendant infrastructure, and requiring people to work until 70 or possibly slightly beyond that - are so unpopular that they'll probably never get done. I'll certainly be surprised in a good way of Labour manages to meet its building commitments, and astonished if the houses are decent rather than shoddily constructed little identikit rabbit hutches marooned amidst acres of car parking.

Labour won't meet those targets even if it is their deepest desire, simple fact is there aren't enough construction workers nor the supply of building materials. The problem is exacerbated by the fact we are over the 50% mark for people who take more from the state than they give. For those people voting for more is a no brainer.

As many might have noted I tend rightwards . However I do believe there should be a safety net, free education to 18 and a health service which is free at point of use.

I also believe though that the state does too much and we should trim back what we do. I would rather the state did less but funded it properly than it tries to do too much and half arses everything.

For starters I would do a clawback on state pensions, every 5£ over say 5k private pension should mean 1£ off your state pension

NI on pensions

A lifetime health care costs cap with an insurance based top off

As examples

There is no shortage of skilled tradies in this country who could be building homes if they were easily able to do so without planning restrictions.

Sorry but there is, firms are poaching workers off each other because they can't get enough for example brickies
and yes because we don't train enough

highwayparadise306 said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Are we all ready for the OAP screaming match from the US later on?

It should be a blast.

wooliedyed said:

Survation should be updating their MRP tomorrow with a final update next week, something to chew on

Theuniondivvie said:

pigeon said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

When did Rishi Sunak become England's batting coach?

Fake news. He's being lined up to replace Southgate after the forthcoming Slovakia debacle.

Aiming a bit high, England penalties coach to start with.

TheScreamingEagles said:

wooliedyed said:

Survation should be updating their MRP tomorrow with a final update next week, something to chew on

Matt Goodwin's mob is publishing a poll tomorrow.

another_richard said:

Pagan2 said:

pigeon said:

Pagan2 said:

algarkirk said:

RochdalePioneers said:

DavidL said:

I am not getting a lot of joy out of this election but the thing I find most irritating is the number of muppets minded to vote for Reform and, indirectly, 10 years of socialist government. There have been suggestions for a while that IQs are falling but this is a jump off a tall bridge.

You begin to wonder if democracy is just too hard for some people.

Question - what is the difference between "socialist government" and the Conservatives?

Punative taxes to record levels? Tick
Wasting billions on crap public services? Tick
Open door migration letting anyone in? Tick
Nanny state nonsense about what we eat and smoke? Tick

People don't fear "socialist government" or any of the idiotic threats Sunak and the press team are making, because we live that every day already.

The Overton window is so narrow there is almost nothing substantive to discuss. Once you have a welfare state, free state education, NHS, industrial policy, consumer protection, regulation about everything, and a few other things a social democrat state with highly regulated capitalism is the only option. State managed expenditure has increased every year and this will continue. It is unavoidable.

The left have one further option - this + socialist state control of all commerce too. No serious right wing option has emerged with a working model in Europe yet. This is one of the most remarkable and underestimated facts of political policy. The Conservative party's two biggest fails since the war are: Lack of European statecraft, leading to the disaster of Brexit; and the failure to practice conservatism in any respects at all.

Not something I advocate by any means just an observation on all governements of the past

Wars used to cull the poor, now we no longer really have mass casualty wars its a new problem for governements of all stripes to have a burgeoning underclass and they have no idea how to deal with it

More broadly we have a terrible problem with dependency, chiefly due to a combination of low paid employment and ridiculous housing costs (meaning that many working people end up reliant on social security) and vast numbers of pensioners. The situation is theoretically recoverable, but some of the measures required - especially millions of houses and attendant infrastructure, and requiring people to work until 70 or possibly slightly beyond that - are so unpopular that they'll probably never get done. I'll certainly be surprised in a good way of Labour manages to meet its building commitments, and astonished if the houses are decent rather than shoddily constructed little identikit rabbit hutches marooned amidst acres of car parking.

Labour won't meet those targets even if it is their deepest desire, simple fact is there aren't enough construction workers nor the supply of building materials. The problem is exacerbated by the fact we are over the 50% mark for people who take more from the state than they give. For those people voting for more is a no brainer.

As many might have noted I tend rightwards . However I do believe there should be a safety net, free education to 18 and a health service which is free at point of use.

I also believe though that the state does too much and we should trim back what we do. I would rather the state did less but funded it properly than it tries to do too much and half arses everything.

For starters I would do a clawback on state pensions, every 5£ over say 5k private pension should mean 1£ off your state pension

NI on pensions

A lifetime health care costs cap with an insurance based top off

As examples

What is needed is to find ways of helping those who contribute less than average to contribute more.

Not to punish those who work hard and save and contribute more than average.

If you do the latter people will spend more earlier, look for other ways to save and then retire earlier.

As these people will be the highest skilled and highest earning then having them retire earlier is very damaging economically.

Sandpit said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

.

Pagan2 said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

Pagan2 said:

pigeon said:

Pagan2 said:

algarkirk said:

RochdalePioneers said:

DavidL said:

I am not getting a lot of joy out of this election but the thing I find most irritating is the number of muppets minded to vote for Reform and, indirectly, 10 years of socialist government. There have been suggestions for a while that IQs are falling but this is a jump off a tall bridge.

You begin to wonder if democracy is just too hard for some people.

Question - what is the difference between "socialist government" and the Conservatives?

Punative taxes to record levels? Tick
Wasting billions on crap public services? Tick
Open door migration letting anyone in? Tick
Nanny state nonsense about what we eat and smoke? Tick

People don't fear "socialist government" or any of the idiotic threats Sunak and the press team are making, because we live that every day already.

The Overton window is so narrow there is almost nothing substantive to discuss. Once you have a welfare state, free state education, NHS, industrial policy, consumer protection, regulation about everything, and a few other things a social democrat state with highly regulated capitalism is the only option. State managed expenditure has increased every year and this will continue. It is unavoidable.

The left have one further option - this + socialist state control of all commerce too. No serious right wing option has emerged with a working model in Europe yet. This is one of the most remarkable and underestimated facts of political policy. The Conservative party's two biggest fails since the war are: Lack of European statecraft, leading to the disaster of Brexit; and the failure to practice conservatism in any respects at all.

Not something I advocate by any means just an observation on all governements of the past

Wars used to cull the poor, now we no longer really have mass casualty wars its a new problem for governements of all stripes to have a burgeoning underclass and they have no idea how to deal with it

More broadly we have a terrible problem with dependency, chiefly due to a combination of low paid employment and ridiculous housing costs (meaning that many working people end up reliant on social security) and vast numbers of pensioners. The situation is theoretically recoverable, but some of the measures required - especially millions of houses and attendant infrastructure, and requiring people to work until 70 or possibly slightly beyond that - are so unpopular that they'll probably never get done. I'll certainly be surprised in a good way of Labour manages to meet its building commitments, and astonished if the houses are decent rather than shoddily constructed little identikit rabbit hutches marooned amidst acres of car parking.

Labour won't meet those targets even if it is their deepest desire, simple fact is there aren't enough construction workers nor the supply of building materials. The problem is exacerbated by the fact we are over the 50% mark for people who take more from the state than they give. For those people voting for more is a no brainer.

As many might have noted I tend rightwards . However I do believe there should be a safety net, free education to 18 and a health service which is free at point of use.

I also believe though that the state does too much and we should trim back what we do. I would rather the state did less but funded it properly than it tries to do too much and half arses everything.

For starters I would do a clawback on state pensions, every 5£ over say 5k private pension should mean 1£ off your state pension

NI on pensions

A lifetime health care costs cap with an insurance based top off

As examples

There is no shortage of skilled tradies in this country who could be building homes if they were easily able to do so without planning restrictions.

Sorry but there is, firms are poaching workers off each other because they can't get enough for example brickies
and yes because we don't train enough

Firms poaching off each other is the free market in action.

Nobody has a divine right to minimum wage labour.

Maybe the builders can hire more apprentices, instead of complaining about a lack of skilled workers or asking government for more immigrants.

Leon said:

Obesity is also an issue for Brits. If you’re a fat lazy twat, and many of us are, then you can’t be bothered walking into town waddling under your own weight, you get it all delivered or jump in your car, like the super-obese Americans. Thus you get even fatter and even less inclined to walk and so on and so forth

Andy_JS said:

Leon said:

Obesity is also an issue for Brits. If you’re a fat lazy twat, and many of us are, then you can’t be bothered walking into town waddling under your own weight, you get it all delivered or jump in your car, like the super-obese Americans. Thus you get even fatter and even less inclined to walk and so on and so forth

Isn't obesity becoming more of a thing in France these days?

highwayparadise306 said:

Andy_JS said:

Leon said:

Obesity is also an issue for Brits. If you’re a fat lazy twat, and many of us are, then you can’t be bothered walking into town waddling under your own weight, you get it all delivered or jump in your car, like the super-obese Americans. Thus you get even fatter and even less inclined to walk and so on and so forth

Isn't obesity becoming more of a thing in France these days?

An Anerican Import. Sedentary lifestyle for some and too many readymade supermarket meals and takeaway poison.

BartholomewRoberts said:

Sandpit said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

.

Pagan2 said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

Pagan2 said:

pigeon said:

Pagan2 said:

algarkirk said:

RochdalePioneers said:

DavidL said:

I am not getting a lot of joy out of this election but the thing I find most irritating is the number of muppets minded to vote for Reform and, indirectly, 10 years of socialist government. There have been suggestions for a while that IQs are falling but this is a jump off a tall bridge.

You begin to wonder if democracy is just too hard for some people.

Question - what is the difference between "socialist government" and the Conservatives?

Punative taxes to record levels? Tick
Wasting billions on crap public services? Tick
Open door migration letting anyone in? Tick
Nanny state nonsense about what we eat and smoke? Tick

People don't fear "socialist government" or any of the idiotic threats Sunak and the press team are making, because we live that every day already.

The Overton window is so narrow there is almost nothing substantive to discuss. Once you have a welfare state, free state education, NHS, industrial policy, consumer protection, regulation about everything, and a few other things a social democrat state with highly regulated capitalism is the only option. State managed expenditure has increased every year and this will continue. It is unavoidable.

The left have one further option - this + socialist state control of all commerce too. No serious right wing option has emerged with a working model in Europe yet. This is one of the most remarkable and underestimated facts of political policy. The Conservative party's two biggest fails since the war are: Lack of European statecraft, leading to the disaster of Brexit; and the failure to practice conservatism in any respects at all.

Not something I advocate by any means just an observation on all governements of the past

Wars used to cull the poor, now we no longer really have mass casualty wars its a new problem for governements of all stripes to have a burgeoning underclass and they have no idea how to deal with it

More broadly we have a terrible problem with dependency, chiefly due to a combination of low paid employment and ridiculous housing costs (meaning that many working people end up reliant on social security) and vast numbers of pensioners. The situation is theoretically recoverable, but some of the measures required - especially millions of houses and attendant infrastructure, and requiring people to work until 70 or possibly slightly beyond that - are so unpopular that they'll probably never get done. I'll certainly be surprised in a good way of Labour manages to meet its building commitments, and astonished if the houses are decent rather than shoddily constructed little identikit rabbit hutches marooned amidst acres of car parking.

Labour won't meet those targets even if it is their deepest desire, simple fact is there aren't enough construction workers nor the supply of building materials. The problem is exacerbated by the fact we are over the 50% mark for people who take more from the state than they give. For those people voting for more is a no brainer.

As many might have noted I tend rightwards . However I do believe there should be a safety net, free education to 18 and a health service which is free at point of use.

I also believe though that the state does too much and we should trim back what we do. I would rather the state did less but funded it properly than it tries to do too much and half arses everything.

For starters I would do a clawback on state pensions, every 5£ over say 5k private pension should mean 1£ off your state pension

NI on pensions

A lifetime health care costs cap with an insurance based top off

As examples

There is no shortage of skilled tradies in this country who could be building homes if they were easily able to do so without planning restrictions.

Sorry but there is, firms are poaching workers off each other because they can't get enough for example brickies
and yes because we don't train enough

Firms poaching off each other is the free market in action.

Nobody has a divine right to minimum wage labour.

Maybe the builders can hire more apprentices, instead of complaining about a lack of skilled workers or asking government for more immigrants.

Just Googled bricklaying apprenticeships and I see some being advertised . . . with a wage of £5.28 per hour.

My sympathies for those who can't find employees at £5.28 per hour.

Leon said:

Obesity is also an issue for Brits. If you’re a fat lazy twat, and many of us are, then you can’t be bothered walking into town waddling under your own weight, you get it all delivered or jump in your car, like the super-obese Americans. Thus you get even fatter and even less inclined to walk and so on and so forth

Sandpit said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

Sandpit said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

.

Pagan2 said:

BartholomewRoberts said:

Pagan2 said:

pigeon said:

Pagan2 said:

algarkirk said:

RochdalePioneers said:

DavidL said:

I am not getting a lot of joy out of this election but the thing I find most irritating is the number of muppets minded to vote for Reform and, indirectly, 10 years of socialist government. There have been suggestions for a while that IQs are falling but this is a jump off a tall bridge.

You begin to wonder if democracy is just too hard for some people.

Question - what is the difference between "socialist government" and the Conservatives?

Punative taxes to record levels? Tick
Wasting billions on crap public services? Tick
Open door migration letting anyone in? Tick
Nanny state nonsense about what we eat and smoke? Tick

People don't fear "socialist government" or any of the idiotic threats Sunak and the press team are making, because we live that every day already.

The Overton window is so narrow there is almost nothing substantive to discuss. Once you have a welfare state, free state education, NHS, industrial policy, consumer protection, regulation about everything, and a few other things a social democrat state with highly regulated capitalism is the only option. State managed expenditure has increased every year and this will continue. It is unavoidable.

The left have one further option - this + socialist state control of all commerce too. No serious right wing option has emerged with a working model in Europe yet. This is one of the most remarkable and underestimated facts of political policy. The Conservative party's two biggest fails since the war are: Lack of European statecraft, leading to the disaster of Brexit; and the failure to practice conservatism in any respects at all.

Not something I advocate by any means just an observation on all governements of the past

Wars used to cull the poor, now we no longer really have mass casualty wars its a new problem for governements of all stripes to have a burgeoning underclass and they have no idea how to deal with it

More broadly we have a terrible problem with dependency, chiefly due to a combination of low paid employment and ridiculous housing costs (meaning that many working people end up reliant on social security) and vast numbers of pensioners. The situation is theoretically recoverable, but some of the measures required - especially millions of houses and attendant infrastructure, and requiring people to work until 70 or possibly slightly beyond that - are so unpopular that they'll probably never get done. I'll certainly be surprised in a good way of Labour manages to meet its building commitments, and astonished if the houses are decent rather than shoddily constructed little identikit rabbit hutches marooned amidst acres of car parking.

Labour won't meet those targets even if it is their deepest desire, simple fact is there aren't enough construction workers nor the supply of building materials. The problem is exacerbated by the fact we are over the 50% mark for people who take more from the state than they give. For those people voting for more is a no brainer.

As many might have noted I tend rightwards . However I do believe there should be a safety net, free education to 18 and a health service which is free at point of use.

I also believe though that the state does too much and we should trim back what we do. I would rather the state did less but funded it properly than it tries to do too much and half arses everything.

For starters I would do a clawback on state pensions, every 5£ over say 5k private pension should mean 1£ off your state pension

NI on pensions

A lifetime health care costs cap with an insurance based top off

As examples

There is no shortage of skilled tradies in this country who could be building homes if they were easily able to do so without planning restrictions.

Sorry but there is, firms are poaching workers off each other because they can't get enough for example brickies
and yes because we don't train enough

Firms poaching off each other is the free market in action.

Nobody has a divine right to minimum wage labour.

Maybe the builders can hire more apprentices, instead of complaining about a lack of skilled workers or asking government for more immigrants.

Just Googled bricklaying apprenticeships and I see some being advertised . . . with a wage of £5.28 per hour.

My sympathies for those who can't find employees at £5.28 per hour.

Presumably they’re looking for 16-year-olds with no bricklaying skills, in which case that’s not too bad. But after a couple of years, they’ll be getting £15-£20 as bricklayers?

Leon said:

Andy_JS said:

Leon said:

Obesity is also an issue for Brits. If you’re a fat lazy twat, and many of us are, then you can’t be bothered walking into town waddling under your own weight, you get it all delivered or jump in your car, like the super-obese Americans. Thus you get even fatter and even less inclined to walk and so on and so forth

Isn't obesity becoming more of a thing in France these days?

Yes it is and it is noticeable in the young, however they are still notably thinner than us

67% of UK adults are obese or overweight, it’s 47% in France - but rising fast (as you say)

We really need generic Ozempic to be handed out to everyone, like putting fluoride in the water