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BoJo goes next week but what then? – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 8,489
edited September 15 in General
imageBoJo goes next week but what then? – politicalbetting.com

With all looking set for a handover next week a big question remains and that is what is Boris Johnson going to do when he is no longer Prime Minister.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 10,314
    Prediction: he is Tory leader again, but not PM.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 4,502
    Emulating Churchill with some wilderness years before the country turns to him again in its hour of need? :wink:
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 23,688
    PFT:

    Shamima Begum was born and raised in Tower Hamlets. She's as British as I am.

    Regardless of the legal niceties, I have no doubt that had Begum been white, and born to white British parents, the powers that be wouldn't have been desperately flailing around to find a way of denying or removing her British citizenship.

    Perhaps not quite the same, but these nice white middle class parents were met with the full force of the law:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-oxfordshire-48676894

    Edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Letts

    On 18 August 2019 it was reported that the British government had revoked Letts' British citizenship. However, the Home Office declined to comment on the case.[38] In response, Canadian Public Safety Minister Ralph Goodale described the move as a "unilateral action to off-load [the UK's consular] responsibilities," leaving Canada responsible for further diplomatic assistance for Letts.[39]
  • Selebian said:

    Emulating Churchill with some wilderness years before the country turns to him again in its hour of need? :wink:

    That's the plan but substitute wilderness months for years.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 42,932
    This doesn't look like a good sign. South Korea reported its widest trade deficit on record.

    image

    https://twitter.com/DavidInglesTV/status/1565129496868851712
  • 148grss148grss Posts: 1,447
    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.
  • Betfair next prime minister
    1.06 Liz Truss 94%
    17.5 Rishi Sunak 6%

    Next Conservative leader
    1.05 Liz Truss 95%
    18 Rishi Sunak 6%
  • 148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    That might, ironically, have been roughly the plan before Boris was rudely defenestrated. Imo he was planning to follow the Wilson route out of parliament in time to make serious money.
  • 148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I assumed he would resign his seat - he's a massive egotist and has been humiliated. However, the party has apparently decided it did a booboo and now sings his praises. So yes, why not stay? Remain an MP. Do lots of lecture circuit stuff. "Accidentally" say something controversial and negative about the government. Sit tight as an open threat to Mistress Truss.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525
    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
  • 148grss148grss Posts: 1,447

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I assumed he would resign his seat - he's a massive egotist and has been humiliated. However, the party has apparently decided it did a booboo and now sings his praises. So yes, why not stay? Remain an MP. Do lots of lecture circuit stuff. "Accidentally" say something controversial and negative about the government. Sit tight as an open threat to Mistress Truss.
    But they're singing his praises in the way that people do at their racist uncle's funeral - he's dead now, so we shouldn't speak ill of him. Maybe there is some internal remorse about kicking him out, but if they hadn't, they wouldn't suddenly be happy with him now, nor would the electorate. If he tried to come back to life, as it were, I don't see people only singing praise; his foibles will be important again
  • MattWMattW Posts: 15,025
    Cyclefree said:

    What then?

    Le Deluge, presumably.

    That would be quite fun.

    Does BoJo have a crest and motto yet?

    A quote from Marie Antoinette seems eminently suitable. "Let me eat cake"?
  • paulyork64paulyork64 Posts: 2,448
    Who in America is paying money to listen to Theresa May do lectures?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 15,025
    FPT:

    Leon said:

    @Cyclefree

    Indeed. I enjoy vigorous debate as much as I enjoy *other things* but it’s probably a bit early for a stramash over types of sexual intercourse

    Just dropped by en route to pick damsons. Happy Autumn to one and all.
    Where in the country are the damsons out?

    My favourite public damsons spot is the lanes around Bradwell on the Blackwater.

    Not likely this year, but I need to get into Derbyshire for bilberries soon.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525
    FPT for @NickPalmer

    Asexuality is absolutely a valid life choice. And one to be respected. I have asexual friends who are happy and productive citizens

    I just don’t believe a life without sex would willingly be chosen by a third of men aged 18-24. That’s outwith the findings of any sexual survey in history. It’s not a healthy sign

  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 15,917
    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    When he was a motoring journalist reviewing cars he somehow managed to drive and review cars whilst the mileage stayed the same.

    https://news.sky.com/story/boris-johnson-cost-gq-magazine-4-000-in-parking-tickets-former-editor-claims-12598087

    "When the cars were delivered to his house in Islington, the car company always made a note of the mileage, something that is standard practice.

    "The mileage would also be noted when they came to pick them up again. And on more than one occasion - OK, on many, many, many occasions - the mileage was precisely the same. So I leave you to draw your own conclusions."
  • TOPPING said:

    Cyclefree said:

    TOPPING said:

    eek said:

    Cyclefree said:

    It was not the British courts which stripped Shamima Begum of her citizenship. It was the Home Secretary. That decision was challenged by her lawyers and the challenge failed. As did the challenge to the Home Secretary's decision not to allow her to return to this country to pursue an appeal. But that does not mean that it was the courts which took the decision.

    While that is the case - it still went to a tribunal where it was argued that the removal was valid because

    "In February 2020, a tribunal ruled that removing Ms Begum's citizenship was lawful because she was "a citizen of Bangladesh by descent", so removing her British nationality wouldn't make her stateless."

    even though Bangladesh has continually stated that she doesn't have (nor qualifies for) Bangladesh Citizenship.....

    Wasn't the claim that Bangladesh has stated that she doesn't have (nor qualifies for) Bangladesh Citizenship put before the tribunal? So presumably the tribunal rejected that claim?
    Yes. A Special Immigration Appeals Commission ruled she has Bangladeshi citizenship. Bangladesh('s government) says she doesn't. Begum has sought to appeal the decision, but is unable to as she cannot enter the country.
    Indeed, so we are agreed.

    The current position is one determined by the Courts. The Tribunal determined that she did have Bangladeshi citizenship, despite arguments made prior to the Tribunal that she didn't. And while she has a right to an appeal, the Supreme Court has ruled on the public safety matters prior to that.

    People are rightly allowed appeals in our country, but that doesn't mean prior rulings can just be ignored pending the closure of any and all appeals.

    The current situation is that which the courts, from the SIAC all the way up to the Supreme Court, have ruled upon.
    Surely Bangladesh has the final say on whether she is a Bangladeshi citizen?
    Yes - and that would have to be tested in the Bangladeshi courts ultimately. It hasn't been, to my knowledge. The English courts are entitled when making a ruling here to rely on expert evidence about foreign law.

    But note there is a difference between saying that someone is a citizen and saying that someone may be eligible for citizenship. A person may not be in the first category but still fall into the second.
    Bangladesh has said she isn't a citizen. Case closed.
    How is that any different to "The UK has said she isn't a citizen. Case closed."

    The courts are presented the evidence and they make the decisions. Just because a government, whether its the UK government or the Bangladeshi one says something, does not make it true.
    You really are dancing on pinheads.
    1. UK government applies to have British citizenship removed because she is eligible for Bangladeshi citizenship
    2. Bangladesh confirms no she isn't and never was
    3. UK keeps lying to the simple minded and ideological zealots. Who keep repeating the lie.
    You're the one dancing on pinheads.

    This matter was put before the courts and the courts issued their ruling.

    It is my understanding that SIAC ruled she *is* a Bangladeshi citizen.

    "SIAC found (in its decision on the first preliminary issue) that she also holds Bangladeshi citizenship by descent through her parents by virtue of section 5 of the Bangladesh Citizenship Act 1951." https://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2020/918.html

    You may think you know better than the courts, but I respect the rule of law.
    I'm not certain why you quoted me so. I was merely laying out what I understand SIAC to have said.

    I respect the rule of law. I have not suggested anyone should smuggle Begum into the UK.

    I think the current law should be changed. I know you think the current law should be changed on many issues, but I don't go around saying you aren't respecting the rule of law because you think that.
    My apologies that it wasn't clear, it was Rochdale that I was saying wasn't respecting the rule of law. I was quoting you as secondary confirmation of what the SIAC have said, not responding to you, sorry that wasn't clear.

    Saying the law should be changed is reasonable, but unless or until the law is changed the law stands as it is. Saying the law should be changed is completely different from as Rochdale is saying that the law isn't being applied or people are "lying" about it.
  • 148grss148grss Posts: 1,447
    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    We get the sense that he doesn't like hard work from all the people who work with or for him calling him lazy. When you're in the positions he's in output still happens, but half of what he does in politics can be done by staff and he is just the performer (who still doesn't often learn his lines), and the stuff he did outside of politics was writing thoughtless trash that doesn't have to be true or well researched so can just be dumped in a column.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 19,934
    "Russian oil chief Maganov dies in 'fall from hospital window'"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62750584
  • FishingFishing Posts: 3,744
    edited September 1
    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    I think he's motivated when something grips him, usually a big crusade like Brexit, the vaccination campaign or the war in Ukraine. But when it's something complex, tedious and involving tradeoffs and shades of grey, like 90% of government, he mostly loses interest.

    That would be fine if he had built a competent team to attend to the detailed business of government, but he didn't. He hired the crank Dominic Cummings instead.
  • DynamoDynamo Posts: 651
    edited September 1
    A lot of what people say about Johnson is influenced by what they think about Trump, even though the men and their environments differ enormously.

    It was said that Johnson would be clinging on to the No10 doorframe. He has even been called a "narcissist". (He obviously isn't one. Or at least, if you run with the thesis that he is, then you'd have to conclude he has Oscar-level acting skills to masquerade as somebody who isn't.) Some say he's going to be the king over the water. (Perhaps he should pivot to supporting Scottish independence if he wants to be a full-on 45er?)

    He's more likely to make some speeches in the US, churn out a couple of books, pen the occasional article for the Speccie, and do some paintings. I hope he publishes his memoirs. I'd love to hear more from him about the "condescending" people and the "deep state". And about Michael Gove the "snake" for that matter!
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525
    148grss said:

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    We get the sense that he doesn't like hard work from all the people who work with or for him calling him lazy. When you're in the positions he's in output still happens, but half of what he does in politics can be done by staff and he is just the performer (who still doesn't often learn his lines), and the stuff he did outside of politics was writing thoughtless trash that doesn't have to be true or well researched so can just be dumped in a column.
    A column for which he was paid £300,000 a year

    Did the Telegraph do this out of charity? Or because he was good at it, and attracted readers?

    The “Boris is lazy” stuff is just, well, lazy. It doesn’t hold up to scrutiny

  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 10,416
    MattW said:

    Cyclefree said:

    What then?

    Le Deluge, presumably.

    That would be quite fun.

    Does BoJo have a crest and motto yet?

    A quote from Marie Antoinette seems eminently suitable. "Let me eat cake"?
    Mockingbird on Crossed Violins holding a crest that says "Fuck Business".
  • 148grss said:

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    We get the sense that he doesn't like hard work from all the people who work with or for him calling him lazy. When you're in the positions he's in output still happens, but half of what he does in politics can be done by staff and he is just the performer (who still doesn't often learn his lines), and the stuff he did outside of politics was writing thoughtless trash that doesn't have to be true or well researched so can just be dumped in a column.
    Its part of why overall he was such a successful and good Prime Minister, he has the talent of knowing who to delegate to more than more control freak Prime Ministers have done.

    No PM can do everything themselves, they need to know their own limitations and know what can be delegated.
  • Dynamo said:

    A lot of what people say about Johnson is influenced by what they think about Trump, even though the men and their environments differ enormously.

    It was said that Johnson would be clinging on to the No10 doorframe. He has even been called a "narcissist". (He obviously isn't one. Or at least, if you run with the thesis that he is, then you'd have to conclude he has Oscar-level acting skills to masquerade as somebody who isn't.) Some say he's going to be the king over the water. (Perhaps he should pivot to supporting Scottish independence if he wants to be a full-on 45er?)

    He's more likely to make some speeches in the US, churn out a couple of books, pen the occasional article for the Speccie, and do some paintings. I hope he publishes his memoirs. I'd love to hear more from him about the "condescending" people and the "deep state". And about Michael Gove the "snake" for that matter!

    1. He did cling to the doorframe. Every previous Prime Minister would have had to resign multiple times over.
    2. He is a natural clown. We know that Bumbling Boris is an act - his given name is Alex. He ruffles the hair and crumples his clothes deliberately. He rocks up to do speeches and does the same hick "sorry I'm late, where am I" routine with the same jokes
    3. Since the Tory party have chosen to rehabilitate him in the long gap between announcing he was reigning and the actual event itself, he is free to sit on the backbenches AND write articles for the media and go on lecture tours in America AND be the focal point for the Tory MPs who dislike the hell on earth that is the Truss government.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 5,475
    edited September 1
    Dynamo said:

    A lot of what people say about Johnson is influenced by what they think about Trump, even though the men and their environments differ enormously.

    It was said that Johnson would be clinging on to the No10 doorframe. He has even been called a "narcissist". (He obviously isn't one. Or at least, if you run with the thesis that he is, then you'd have to conclude he has Oscar-level acting skills to masquerade as somebody who isn't.) Some say he's going to be the king over the water. (Perhaps he should pivot to supporting Scottish independence if he wants to be a full-on 45er?)

    He's more likely to make some speeches in the US, churn out a couple of books, pen the occasional article for the Speccie, and do some paintings. I hope he publishes his memoirs. I'd love to hear more from him about the "condescending" people and the "deep state". And about Michael Gove the "snake" for that matter!

    Of all the things that Johnson is accused of, not being a narcissist is probably the most deeply unfair accusation I've seen levelled at him.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525
    Fishing said:

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    I think he's motivated when something grips him, usually a big crusade like Brexit, the vaccination campaign or the war in Ukraine. But when it's something complex, tedious and involving tradeoffs and shades of grey, like 90% of government, he mostly loses interest.

    That would be fine if he had built a competent team to attend to the detailed business of government, but he didn't. He hired the crank Dominic Cummings instead.
    Yes I agree with that. And yes one of his big failings was his inability to recruit and retain a talented team, in Number 10, to sweat the small stuff

    It’s a bit of a mystery, because he was good at it as Mayor. And he can definitely spot talent - eg Kate Bingham on vaccines
  • Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    When he was a motoring journalist reviewing cars he somehow managed to drive and review cars whilst the mileage stayed the same.

    https://news.sky.com/story/boris-johnson-cost-gq-magazine-4-000-in-parking-tickets-former-editor-claims-12598087

    "When the cars were delivered to his house in Islington, the car company always made a note of the mileage, something that is standard practice.

    "The mileage would also be noted when they came to pick them up again. And on more than one occasion - OK, on many, many, many occasions - the mileage was precisely the same. So I leave you to draw your own conclusions."
    That as no driving is required, in future we will have AI car reviews. From E-type to Type-E.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,708
    https://twitter.com/RichardJMurphy/status/1564157639621312512

    Very important thread from Richard Murphy.

    Altering existing subsidy contracts might be difficult but giving the current Market/Strike difference back to UK consumers (Both business and residential) could be done almost immediately.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 4,502

    Who in America is paying money to listen to Theresa May do lectures?

    Insomniacs? :wink:

  • Andy_JS said:

    "Russian oil chief Maganov dies in 'fall from hospital window'"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62750584

    Russia has 84 words for defenestration.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 5,475

    Dynamo said:

    A lot of what people say about Johnson is influenced by what they think about Trump, even though the men and their environments differ enormously.

    It was said that Johnson would be clinging on to the No10 doorframe. He has even been called a "narcissist". (He obviously isn't one. Or at least, if you run with the thesis that he is, then you'd have to conclude he has Oscar-level acting skills to masquerade as somebody who isn't.) Some say he's going to be the king over the water. (Perhaps he should pivot to supporting Scottish independence if he wants to be a full-on 45er?)

    He's more likely to make some speeches in the US, churn out a couple of books, pen the occasional article for the Speccie, and do some paintings. I hope he publishes his memoirs. I'd love to hear more from him about the "condescending" people and the "deep state". And about Michael Gove the "snake" for that matter!

    1. He did cling to the doorframe. Every previous Prime Minister would have had to resign multiple times over.
    2. He is a natural clown. We know that Bumbling Boris is an act - his given name is Alex. He ruffles the hair and crumples his clothes deliberately. He rocks up to do speeches and does the same hick "sorry I'm late, where am I" routine with the same jokes
    3. Since the Tory party have chosen to rehabilitate him in the long gap between announcing he was reigning and the actual event itself, he is free to sit on the backbenches AND write articles for the media and go on lecture tours in America AND be the focal point for the Tory MPs who dislike the hell on earth that is the Truss government.
    On your last point, I do hope that you meant to write resigning, rather than reigning.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,608
    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I think he wants a comeback, and I don't see why that's hard work.
    He'll be an absentee MP, making plenty of money and waiting to take over once he sees Truss is vulnerable.
    Then when the time is right, he gets someone more organized than him to run his campaign.

    In many ways - Boris Johnson is perfectly suited to being leader of the opposition. He's phenomenally good at getting headlines and attention. I think he'd welcome not having to actually be bothered by difficult decisions & instead just being able to criticize and say he would do things better.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 10,416
    IshmaelZ said:
    I disagree that Ukraine is a significant item in the new PM's in tray - beyond the obvious opportunities for self-aggrandisment on the 'Gram.

    Biden is controlling the pace of the help to Ukraine and hence the course of the war. The British PM doesn't have to "do" much about it on a daily basis.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 19,811
    edited September 1
    Leon said:

    FPT for @NickPalmer

    Asexuality is absolutely a valid life choice. And one to be respected. I have asexual friends who are happy and productive citizens

    I just don’t believe a life without sex would willingly be chosen by a third of men aged 18-24. That’s outwith the findings of any sexual survey in history. It’s not a healthy sign

    Yes, agree with that. and canned entertainment (whether streaming or gaming or social media chatting, all of which I enjoy some of the time) definitely misses a dimension compared with direct human contact, whether sex or cuddles or even just having a cuppa together.
  • 148grss148grss Posts: 1,447
    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    We get the sense that he doesn't like hard work from all the people who work with or for him calling him lazy. When you're in the positions he's in output still happens, but half of what he does in politics can be done by staff and he is just the performer (who still doesn't often learn his lines), and the stuff he did outside of politics was writing thoughtless trash that doesn't have to be true or well researched so can just be dumped in a column.
    A column for which he was paid £300,000 a year

    Did the Telegraph do this out of charity? Or because he was good at it, and attracted readers?

    The “Boris is lazy” stuff is just, well, lazy. It doesn’t hold up to scrutiny

    He's a rich guy who went to the right schools and knows the right people, and some people seem to find him charming. Report after report about his inattentiveness and unwillingness to do the hard graft, of aides and staffers saying he doesn't read his briefs. When he had the Brussels beat it was well discussed at the time that he didn't do any real journalism - he made up anti EU tosh to throw as red meat to the readers.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    Well, I do know him a bit, and my impression is that he avoids hard work, because he's found that he can get by without it. If you have a fast mind (and he does) you can get maybe 70% of your tasks done in 20% of the time available, and if you're also charming and amusing (and he is), you can top that up to an apparent 110%.

    I empathise a bit - I have a quick mind too (minus the charisma), and it's quite seductive not to bother with the 100%, especially as I don't find that really putting in the effort gets me to 100% quality anyway - more like 85%. Not comparing myself to the PM, but maybe there's a similar process going on. I've got this week off work, and in theory I could be taking the time to really understand some complex issue. Instead, it's more fun just to chat here.
    I know this mindset because I share it, too

    It astonishes me how I can get away with doing such a small amount of work - 2 hours a day? - and still make a decent living. Unlike Boris I don’t then take on multiple tasks and careers on top of that. I loaf

    Tho this raises an interesting philosophical question: is there a proper amount of work?

    It was likely the industrial revolution which firmly entrenched the idea you should do 8-10 hours work a day. Before that people often did less. Hunter gatherers spend about 2 hours a day hunting. The rest is loafing. Like lions
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Yes, never mind the headline pro or con position, read it for things like

    "So next week she will start uniquely weak for a Prime Minister, with no base of positive support anywhere."

    "It is at this point that having a weightless Prime Minister will cause problems. She will need to call for sacrifices from a public that never voted for her. She will need to persuade demonstrably sceptical MPs to vote for unpopular policies and risk their own jobs for her. How is she going to inspire and lead in those circumstances?"

    "It seems more likely that there may be a policy moment (Theresa May found herself facing a vote of confidence over the Brexit withdrawal agreement and never recovered her authority). This means that Liz Truss will need to be careful to be seen to be broadly consistent with her leadership campaign — or to get her betrayals in quickly before there will be any appetite to replace her. Does she realise this?"
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,708
    edited September 1
    Dura_Ace said:

    IshmaelZ said:
    I disagree that Ukraine is a significant item in the new PM's in tray - beyond the obvious opportunities for self-aggrandisment on the 'Gram.

    Biden is controlling the pace of the help to Ukraine and hence the course of the war. The British PM doesn't have to "do" much about it on a daily basis.
    The war seems to be doing well for Russia with their gas reserves now worth an absolute fortune and the USA with the world flocking to the good old greenback.
    What's not to like about it if you're Putin or Biden ?
    Xi's even making bank off it by arbing Russia's gas to more neutral nations in open disguise.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525

    Leon said:

    FPT for @NickPalmer

    Asexuality is absolutely a valid life choice. And one to be respected. I have asexual friends who are happy and productive citizens

    I just don’t believe a life without sex would willingly be chosen by a third of men aged 18-24. That’s outwith the findings of any sexual survey in history. It’s not a healthy sign

    Yes, agree with that. and canned entertainment (whether streaming or gaming or social media chatting, all of which I enjoy some of the time) definitely misses a dimension compared with direct human contact, whether sex or cuddles or even just having a cuppa together.
    We are all becoming Japanese. Not great
  • DynamoDynamo Posts: 651
    edited September 1

    Dynamo said:

    A lot of what people say about Johnson is influenced by what they think about Trump, even though the men and their environments differ enormously.

    It was said that Johnson would be clinging on to the No10 doorframe. He has even been called a "narcissist". (He obviously isn't one. Or at least, if you run with the thesis that he is, then you'd have to conclude he has Oscar-level acting skills to masquerade as somebody who isn't.) Some say he's going to be the king over the water. (Perhaps he should pivot to supporting Scottish independence if he wants to be a full-on 45er?)

    He's more likely to make some speeches in the US, churn out a couple of books, pen the occasional article for the Speccie, and do some paintings. I hope he publishes his memoirs. I'd love to hear more from him about the "condescending" people and the "deep state". And about Michael Gove the "snake" for that matter!

    Of all the things that Johnson is accused of, not being a narcissist is probably the most deeply unfair accusation I've seen levelled at him.
    He's not a narcissist. Perhaps he's a bit vain. I don't know. I've never met him. I doubt it, given how he dresses. He seems a bit cocky, but most politicians are. "Narcissist" is the playground insult du jour. If someone is a narcissist they are unbearable to live in a house with and they see other people (all other people) as you and I might see inanimate objects. Some people really are narcissists and the best people to describe what they're like are those who've suffered from their behaviour in the long term and close up. Donald Trump is a narcissist. Have you watched the video of where Johnson accidentally knocks over a young boy in a rugby match? I didn't like the way he asks "Are *you* OK?", with the emphasis on the "you", because it's a bit self-centred and bit like saying "I'm all right - how about you?" But he doesn't score anything like the mark needed for being a narcissist. The tone of his voice suggests that he does genuinely care about the lad's wellbeing, just as almost every other sane adult would. A narcissist wouldn't give a f***.

    Here is a narcissist:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iimj0j4NYME
  • 148grss148grss Posts: 1,447
    edited September 1
    Dynamo said:

    A lot of what people say about Johnson is influenced by what they think about Trump, even though the men and their environments differ enormously.

    It was said that Johnson would be clinging on to the No10 doorframe. He has even been called a "narcissist". (He obviously isn't one. Or at least, if you run with the thesis that he is, then you'd have to conclude he has Oscar-level acting skills to masquerade as somebody who isn't.) Some say he's going to be the king over the water. (Perhaps he should pivot to supporting Scottish independence if he wants to be a full-on 45er?)

    He's more likely to make some speeches in the US, churn out a couple of books, pen the occasional article for the Speccie, and do some paintings. I hope he publishes his memoirs. I'd love to hear more from him about the "condescending" people and the "deep state". And about Michael Gove the "snake" for that matter!

    But Johnson has been on the political landscape a lot longer than Trump has, as a serious contender. Trump was always a media icon, but Johnson has been on TV and such as a politician since I was a kid. I think people conflate their times in leadership, but that's because they coincided, but I think people can separate the men.

    Johnson's "narcissism", to me, is more of a British class elite kind. He said as a child he wanted to be "King of the World". He grew up in a family, with a name, where that level of ambition was possible without actually much skill. He has some skills - he can give a speech, must have some kind of charm and charisma (I don't see it), and he obviously has an education (I don't think that is the same thing as being bright, but he may also be naturally bright). But what is clear is that he never cared about public service - he cared about being the Prime Minister. And to me that's where the attacks of narcissism make sense.
  • Off topic I realise, but I just had a letter from my bank saying they are concerned that I am 'frequently' withdrawing cash from the post office, and I should be using such things as tap and go to pay for my goods. I should also be using their app to control my spending.
    It is perhaps ironic that this morning neither the app nor online banking are available from my bank!

    Welcome to the cashless society. It is ironic Gordon Brown wasted squillions to save a working banking system to bring us to dependency on various bits of flaky IT.

    Once we are all cashless, the government will be able to monitor everyone's spending, and block anyone it dislikes.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 9,850
    edited September 1
    Pulpstar said:

    https://twitter.com/RichardJMurphy/status/1564157639621312512

    Very important thread from Richard Murphy.

    Altering existing subsidy contracts might be difficult but giving the current Market/Strike difference back to UK consumers (Both business and residential) could be done almost immediately.

    I disagree with his proposal to violate contracts, that's not appropriate, but absolutely agreed that contracted Market/Strike differences going to the Government should be returned back to consumers.

    As an icing on the cake, it could even be named on the bill as a "Green Rebate", because that's exactly what it is.

    If we could harness the meltdown that would trigger from people like @MISTY then that would be even better.
  • Leon said:

    Fishing said:

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    I think he's motivated when something grips him, usually a big crusade like Brexit, the vaccination campaign or the war in Ukraine. But when it's something complex, tedious and involving tradeoffs and shades of grey, like 90% of government, he mostly loses interest.

    That would be fine if he had built a competent team to attend to the detailed business of government, but he didn't. He hired the crank Dominic Cummings instead.
    Yes I agree with that. And yes one of his big failings was his inability to recruit and retain a talented team, in Number 10, to sweat the small stuff

    It’s a bit of a mystery, because he was good at it as Mayor. And he can definitely spot talent - eg Kate Bingham on vaccines
    Different game, different rules. Being Prime Mnister isn't the same as being Mayor of Britain.

    Deputy mayors are nobodies. Highly able nobodies, but nobodies all the same. Go on, name three of them, without looking up. Perfect role for talented people who don't want to climb the greasy pole but do want to do a bloody good job in their specialism.

    Cabinet ministers are somebodies. Rivals, potential successors. That causes two problems. One is that it's not easy to appoint the best able nobodies, because they won't do the stuff to become an MP and hence eligible to become ministers. Different ways of doing democracy balance that differently, but it's one of the checks and balances that makes the British system mostly work.

    The second problem is one of BoJo's apparent personality flaws- his need to be the tallest poppy. When push came to shove, his Cabinet picks were more about loyalty than ability. Really great PMs were able to appoint rivals and enemies to big jobs and Johnson didn't do that.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525
    Dynamo said:

    Dynamo said:

    A lot of what people say about Johnson is influenced by what they think about Trump, even though the men and their environments differ enormously.

    It was said that Johnson would be clinging on to the No10 doorframe. He has even been called a "narcissist". (He obviously isn't one. Or at least, if you run with the thesis that he is, then you'd have to conclude he has Oscar-level acting skills to masquerade as somebody who isn't.) Some say he's going to be the king over the water. (Perhaps he should pivot to supporting Scottish independence if he wants to be a full-on 45er?)

    He's more likely to make some speeches in the US, churn out a couple of books, pen the occasional article for the Speccie, and do some paintings. I hope he publishes his memoirs. I'd love to hear more from him about the "condescending" people and the "deep state". And about Michael Gove the "snake" for that matter!

    Of all the things that Johnson is accused of, not being a narcissist is probably the most deeply unfair accusation I've seen levelled at him.
    He's not a narcissist. Perhaps he's a bit vain. I don't know. I've never met him. I doubt it, given how he dresses. He seems a bit cocky too, but most politicians are. "Narcissist" is the playground insult du jour. If someone is a narcissist they are unbearable to live in a house with and they see other people (all other people) as you and I might see inanimate objects. Some people really are narcissists and the best people to describe what they're like are those who've suffered from their behaviour in the long term and close up. Donald Trump is a narcissist. Have you watched the video of where Johnson accidentally knocks over a young boy in a rugby match? I didn't like the way he asked "Are *you* OK?", with the emphasis on the "you", because it's a bit self-centred and bit like saying "I'm all right - how about you?" But he doesn't score anything like the mark needed for being a narcissist. The tone of his voice suggests that he does genuinely care about the lad's wellbeing, just as almost every other sane adult would. A narcissist wouldn't give a f***.
    Like most mindsets, narcissism is surely a spectrum. It’s not binary

    I’d say Boris is definitely on that spectrum, he’s quite selfish (it seems) and will happily sacrifice others for Boris but he’s not a pathological case like Trump

    I have a friend quite far down the spectrum. It is wearying indeed. Only tolerable in small doses
  • Pulpstar said:

    https://twitter.com/RichardJMurphy/status/1564157639621312512

    Very important thread from Richard Murphy.

    Altering existing subsidy contracts might be difficult but giving the current Market/Strike difference back to UK consumers (Both business and residential) could be done almost immediately.

    I disagree with his proposal to violate contracts, that's not appropriate, but absolutely agreed that the Market/Strike difference should be returned back to consumers.

    As an icing on the cake, it could even be named on the bill as a "Green Rebate", because that's exactly what it is.

    If we could harness the meltdown that would trigger from people like @MISTY then that would be even better.
    Murphy's idea is based on the same point made before on pb, that energy is a rigged market because price is based not on scarcity but on the most expensive final fraction of production and the rest makes windfall profits.
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 6,864
    Pulpstar said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    IshmaelZ said:
    I disagree that Ukraine is a significant item in the new PM's in tray - beyond the obvious opportunities for self-aggrandisment on the 'Gram.

    Biden is controlling the pace of the help to Ukraine and hence the course of the war. The British PM doesn't have to "do" much about it on a daily basis.
    The war seems to be doing well for Russia with their gas reserves now worth an absolute fortune and the USA with the world flocking to the good old greenback.
    What's not to like about it if you're Putin or Biden ?
    Xi's even making bank off it by arbing Russia's gas to more neutral nations in open disguise.
    Yes, it is looking good for the US and Putin. And Xi is nobody's patsy.

    Europe is the fall guy in all this.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525
    Why did I say “we are all becoming Japanese” when I could have said “we are all turning Japanese”?

    Pop culture pun FAIL
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Off topic I realise, but I just had a letter from my bank saying they are concerned that I am 'frequently' withdrawing cash from the post office, and I should be using such things as tap and go to pay for my goods. I should also be using their app to control my spending.
    It is perhaps ironic that this morning neither the app nor online banking are available from my bank!

    Welcome to the cashless society. It is ironic Gordon Brown wasted squillions to save a working banking system to bring us to dependency on various bits of flaky IT.

    Once we are all cashless, the government will be able to monitor everyone's spending, and block anyone it dislikes.
    I have a single £5 note in my phone case, and it has been the same £5 note since the third week of May (left over from a sailing trip where I needed proper money to tip with). This is already a lost battle, I think I saw the other day Starbucks don't do cash any more?
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 6,864
    Leon said:

    Dynamo said:

    Dynamo said:

    A lot of what people say about Johnson is influenced by what they think about Trump, even though the men and their environments differ enormously.

    It was said that Johnson would be clinging on to the No10 doorframe. He has even been called a "narcissist". (He obviously isn't one. Or at least, if you run with the thesis that he is, then you'd have to conclude he has Oscar-level acting skills to masquerade as somebody who isn't.) Some say he's going to be the king over the water. (Perhaps he should pivot to supporting Scottish independence if he wants to be a full-on 45er?)

    He's more likely to make some speeches in the US, churn out a couple of books, pen the occasional article for the Speccie, and do some paintings. I hope he publishes his memoirs. I'd love to hear more from him about the "condescending" people and the "deep state". And about Michael Gove the "snake" for that matter!

    Of all the things that Johnson is accused of, not being a narcissist is probably the most deeply unfair accusation I've seen levelled at him.
    He's not a narcissist. Perhaps he's a bit vain. I don't know. I've never met him. I doubt it, given how he dresses. He seems a bit cocky too, but most politicians are. "Narcissist" is the playground insult du jour. If someone is a narcissist they are unbearable to live in a house with and they see other people (all other people) as you and I might see inanimate objects. Some people really are narcissists and the best people to describe what they're like are those who've suffered from their behaviour in the long term and close up. Donald Trump is a narcissist. Have you watched the video of where Johnson accidentally knocks over a young boy in a rugby match? I didn't like the way he asked "Are *you* OK?", with the emphasis on the "you", because it's a bit self-centred and bit like saying "I'm all right - how about you?" But he doesn't score anything like the mark needed for being a narcissist. The tone of his voice suggests that he does genuinely care about the lad's wellbeing, just as almost every other sane adult would. A narcissist wouldn't give a f***.
    Like most mindsets, narcissism is surely a spectrum. It’s not binary

    I’d say Boris is definitely on that spectrum, he’s quite selfish (it seems) and will happily sacrifice others for Boris but he’s not a pathological case like Trump

    I have a friend quite far down the spectrum. It is wearying indeed. Only tolerable in small doses
    Is the friend this character @SeanT who you have now and then mentioned?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Leon said:

    Why did I say “we are all becoming Japanese” when I could have said “we are all turning Japanese”?

    Pop culture pun FAIL

    Yes. I really think so.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 36,642

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    Well, I do know him a bit, and my impression is that he avoids hard work, because he's found that he can get by without it. If you have a fast mind (and he does) you can get maybe 70% of your tasks done in 20% of the time available, and if you're also charming and amusing (and he is), you can top that up to an apparent 110%.

    I empathise a bit - I have a quick mind too (minus the charisma), and it's quite seductive not to bother with the 100%, especially as I don't find that really putting in the effort gets me to 100% quality anyway - more like 85%. Not comparing myself to the PM, but maybe there's a similar process going on. I've got this week off work, and in theory I could be taking the time to really understand some complex issue. Instead, it's more fun just to chat here.
    Every person I know who knows him says he is lazy, dating back to his schooldays. He was then and he is now and I think we have all seen that these past few years.

    Of course he is also immensely gifted and I'm sure has no problem whatsoever knocking out (phnarr) 1,000 amusing words for a Spectator or DT audience which is a bit like shooting fish in a barrel but that's not to say there's no market for it. It is absolutely "real work" - it's just that it is the type that he has a natural affinity for.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525

    Leon said:

    Dynamo said:

    Dynamo said:

    A lot of what people say about Johnson is influenced by what they think about Trump, even though the men and their environments differ enormously.

    It was said that Johnson would be clinging on to the No10 doorframe. He has even been called a "narcissist". (He obviously isn't one. Or at least, if you run with the thesis that he is, then you'd have to conclude he has Oscar-level acting skills to masquerade as somebody who isn't.) Some say he's going to be the king over the water. (Perhaps he should pivot to supporting Scottish independence if he wants to be a full-on 45er?)

    He's more likely to make some speeches in the US, churn out a couple of books, pen the occasional article for the Speccie, and do some paintings. I hope he publishes his memoirs. I'd love to hear more from him about the "condescending" people and the "deep state". And about Michael Gove the "snake" for that matter!

    Of all the things that Johnson is accused of, not being a narcissist is probably the most deeply unfair accusation I've seen levelled at him.
    He's not a narcissist. Perhaps he's a bit vain. I don't know. I've never met him. I doubt it, given how he dresses. He seems a bit cocky too, but most politicians are. "Narcissist" is the playground insult du jour. If someone is a narcissist they are unbearable to live in a house with and they see other people (all other people) as you and I might see inanimate objects. Some people really are narcissists and the best people to describe what they're like are those who've suffered from their behaviour in the long term and close up. Donald Trump is a narcissist. Have you watched the video of where Johnson accidentally knocks over a young boy in a rugby match? I didn't like the way he asked "Are *you* OK?", with the emphasis on the "you", because it's a bit self-centred and bit like saying "I'm all right - how about you?" But he doesn't score anything like the mark needed for being a narcissist. The tone of his voice suggests that he does genuinely care about the lad's wellbeing, just as almost every other sane adult would. A narcissist wouldn't give a f***.
    Like most mindsets, narcissism is surely a spectrum. It’s not binary

    I’d say Boris is definitely on that spectrum, he’s quite selfish (it seems) and will happily sacrifice others for Boris but he’s not a pathological case like Trump

    I have a friend quite far down the spectrum. It is wearying indeed. Only tolerable in small doses
    Is the friend this character @SeanT who you have now and then mentioned?
    No, he goes by the name “Lord Xipe Totec” which tells you all you need to know
  • Braking news: Cops slammed for spamming Waze to slow drivers down

    Traffic cops in Surrey, England, have drawn criticism after revealing how they game Waze to spook drivers into slowing down while out on patrol.

    Waze is a satnav-like phone app that lets users, among other things, report the presence of police on the roads. When that happens, an icon appears at that location for everyone nearby to see, alerting them to the cops being there.

    So what the officers do is this: while driving around on patrol, they open Waze, and every so often report their presence as they go, placing markers on the map. Nearby drivers see these icons and slow down in hope of avoiding getting a fine. They may assume speed traps have been set up all over the place, whereas in reality it's just a cop car cruising neighborhoods spamming the service.

    https://www.theregister.com/2022/09/01/surrey_police_waze_traffic/

    The article goes on to explain that American police have the opposite view, that this same Waze functionality allows all sorts of baddies to evade the police.
  • Unboxed, the ‘festival of Brexit’ has been a massive flop:

    Has anyone attended any of these events? I did look at their website a few months ago but it all looked like a load of guff to me so didn’t bother. I’m surprised any arty, creative types got involved at all. But I guess £120m opens doors.

    The DM are furious. Not like them.


    Best rated comments below the article are surprising for the DM though. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11166831/Brexit-Fury-120million-arts-festival-celebrate-Brexit-pro-Remain-flop.html
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,708

    Pulpstar said:

    https://twitter.com/RichardJMurphy/status/1564157639621312512

    Very important thread from Richard Murphy.

    Altering existing subsidy contracts might be difficult but giving the current Market/Strike difference back to UK consumers (Both business and residential) could be done almost immediately.

    I disagree with his proposal to violate contracts, that's not appropriate, but absolutely agreed that the Market/Strike difference should be returned back to consumers.

    As an icing on the cake, it could even be named on the bill as a "Green Rebate", because that's exactly what it is.

    If we could harness the meltdown that would trigger from people like @MISTY then that would be even better.
    Murphy's idea is based on the same point made before on pb, that energy is a rigged market because price is based not on scarcity but on the most expensive final fraction of production and the rest makes windfall profits.
    " and the rest makes windfall profits" 'the rest' currently including the treasury who you can bet are greedily eyeing the Market/Strike windfalls and adding them to the pot of general taxation received.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    Well, I do know him a bit, and my impression is that he avoids hard work, because he's found that he can get by without it. If you have a fast mind (and he does) you can get maybe 70% of your tasks done in 20% of the time available, and if you're also charming and amusing (and he is), you can top that up to an apparent 110%.

    I empathise a bit - I have a quick mind too (minus the charisma), and it's quite seductive not to bother with the 100%, especially as I don't find that really putting in the effort gets me to 100% quality anyway - more like 85%. Not comparing myself to the PM, but maybe there's a similar process going on. I've got this week off work, and in theory I could be taking the time to really understand some complex issue. Instead, it's more fun just to chat here.
    Every person I know who knows him says he is lazy, dating back to his schooldays. He was then and he is now and I think we have all seen that these past few years.

    Of course he is also immensely gifted and I'm sure has no problem whatsoever knocking out (phnarr) 1,000 amusing words for a Spectator or DT audience which is a bit like shooting fish in a barrel but that's not to say there's no market for it. It is absolutely "real work" - it's just that it is the type that he has a natural affinity for.
    I’ve met him, and know many that know him well, and a fairer analysis is given upthread: he gets bored easily, he cuts corners, his attention wanders

    That’s not quite the same as laziness
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 9,850
    edited September 1

    Pulpstar said:

    https://twitter.com/RichardJMurphy/status/1564157639621312512

    Very important thread from Richard Murphy.

    Altering existing subsidy contracts might be difficult but giving the current Market/Strike difference back to UK consumers (Both business and residential) could be done almost immediately.

    I disagree with his proposal to violate contracts, that's not appropriate, but absolutely agreed that the Market/Strike difference should be returned back to consumers.

    As an icing on the cake, it could even be named on the bill as a "Green Rebate", because that's exactly what it is.

    If we could harness the meltdown that would trigger from people like @MISTY then that would be even better.
    Murphy's idea is based on the same point made before on pb, that energy is a rigged market because price is based not on scarcity but on the most expensive final fraction of production and the rest makes windfall profits.
    How's that a rigged market?

    In a market all actors generally receive the market value for their goods and services. If some firms have lower costs than others, then they don't get paid less accordingly, they make a bigger profit which encourages either them to expand (thus making more profit) or others to invest like them, which ultimately brings the price down.

    That renewable firms are making a profit isn't a problem, its what is driving vast renewable investment. If they weren't making a profit, we wouldn't be getting the investment in renewables.

    Invest in renewables and our demand for gas comes down, reducing gas prices, so reducing the cost of electricity. Invest enough to cease to need gas at all, the price comes down even further.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 17,626
    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    The Tory Court Jester Over the Water, more like.
  • What kind of person do YouGov think I am?

    Onlyfans?



  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 24,281
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    Well, I do know him a bit, and my impression is that he avoids hard work, because he's found that he can get by without it. If you have a fast mind (and he does) you can get maybe 70% of your tasks done in 20% of the time available, and if you're also charming and amusing (and he is), you can top that up to an apparent 110%.

    I empathise a bit - I have a quick mind too (minus the charisma), and it's quite seductive not to bother with the 100%, especially as I don't find that really putting in the effort gets me to 100% quality anyway - more like 85%. Not comparing myself to the PM, but maybe there's a similar process going on. I've got this week off work, and in theory I could be taking the time to really understand some complex issue. Instead, it's more fun just to chat here.
    Every person I know who knows him says he is lazy, dating back to his schooldays. He was then and he is now and I think we have all seen that these past few years.

    Of course he is also immensely gifted and I'm sure has no problem whatsoever knocking out (phnarr) 1,000 amusing words for a Spectator or DT audience which is a bit like shooting fish in a barrel but that's not to say there's no market for it. It is absolutely "real work" - it's just that it is the type that he has a natural affinity for.
    He's very good at what he's good at.
    Unfortunately, several of the skillsets required to stay at the absolute pinnacle simply aren't there. And it eventually finds you out.
    Compare the careers of George Best and Cristiano Ronaldo for example.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 15,917

    Off topic I realise, but I just had a letter from my bank saying they are concerned that I am 'frequently' withdrawing cash from the post office, and I should be using such things as tap and go to pay for my goods. I should also be using their app to control my spending.
    It is perhaps ironic that this morning neither the app nor online banking are available from my bank!

    Welcome to the cashless society. It is ironic Gordon Brown wasted squillions to save a working banking system to bring us to dependency on various bits of flaky IT.

    Once we are all cashless, the government will be able to monitor everyone's spending, and block anyone it dislikes.
    Indeed, it will be something like:

    Customer: Why can't I access any of my money?
    Bank: We can't tell you, the Home Secretary has blocked it and under money laundering rules we can't tell you more.
    Customer: Can I appeal?
    Bank: Yes, sure, you just need to select the right appeal depending on why its been blocked.
    Customer: So I can't really appeal?
    Bank: Not really, but its a big enough fig leaf to allow supposed libertarians on pb to defend the indefensible creeping authoritarianism of their government.
  • IshmaelZ said:

    Off topic I realise, but I just had a letter from my bank saying they are concerned that I am 'frequently' withdrawing cash from the post office, and I should be using such things as tap and go to pay for my goods. I should also be using their app to control my spending.
    It is perhaps ironic that this morning neither the app nor online banking are available from my bank!

    Welcome to the cashless society. It is ironic Gordon Brown wasted squillions to save a working banking system to bring us to dependency on various bits of flaky IT.

    Once we are all cashless, the government will be able to monitor everyone's spending, and block anyone it dislikes.
    I have a single £5 note in my phone case, and it has been the same £5 note since the third week of May (left over from a sailing trip where I needed proper money to tip with). This is already a lost battle, I think I saw the other day Starbucks don't do cash any more?
    Even racecourses have gone cashless, to the dismay of punters who find they cannot pick up their winnings from bookmakers and immediately spend them in the champagne bar. Bosses love it because handling cash is expensive, creates a security risk, and slow. Cashless bars need fewer bar staff because tapping is a damn sight quicker than having someone walk to the till and back again with change.

    As rcs1000 often reminds us, automation means fewer jobs which means higher better productivity (and more unemployed people on benefits but that's a different league table).
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525

    What kind of person do YouGov think I am?

    Onlyfans?



    Are they all porn sites?! I only know Only Fans. Ex wife makes money from it
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Unboxed, the ‘festival of Brexit’ has been a massive flop:

    Has anyone attended any of these events? I did look at their website a few months ago but it all looked like a load of guff to me so didn’t bother. I’m surprised any arty, creative types got involved at all. But I guess £120m opens doors.

    The DM are furious. Not like them.


    Best rated comments below the article are surprising for the DM though. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11166831/Brexit-Fury-120million-arts-festival-celebrate-Brexit-pro-Remain-flop.html

    I had never heard of it, seems to have been on the go since may.

    In other news, I thought Liz's "fiscal event" vs budget was rather good satire on the theme of war vs Special Military Operation. I have just found out it's for real.
  • Off topic I realise, but I just had a letter from my bank saying they are concerned that I am 'frequently' withdrawing cash from the post office, and I should be using such things as tap and go to pay for my goods. I should also be using their app to control my spending.
    It is perhaps ironic that this morning neither the app nor online banking are available from my bank!

    Who do they think they are

    You deal with your money as you wish @OldKingCole
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 15,917
    dixiedean said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    Well, I do know him a bit, and my impression is that he avoids hard work, because he's found that he can get by without it. If you have a fast mind (and he does) you can get maybe 70% of your tasks done in 20% of the time available, and if you're also charming and amusing (and he is), you can top that up to an apparent 110%.

    I empathise a bit - I have a quick mind too (minus the charisma), and it's quite seductive not to bother with the 100%, especially as I don't find that really putting in the effort gets me to 100% quality anyway - more like 85%. Not comparing myself to the PM, but maybe there's a similar process going on. I've got this week off work, and in theory I could be taking the time to really understand some complex issue. Instead, it's more fun just to chat here.
    Every person I know who knows him says he is lazy, dating back to his schooldays. He was then and he is now and I think we have all seen that these past few years.

    Of course he is also immensely gifted and I'm sure has no problem whatsoever knocking out (phnarr) 1,000 amusing words for a Spectator or DT audience which is a bit like shooting fish in a barrel but that's not to say there's no market for it. It is absolutely "real work" - it's just that it is the type that he has a natural affinity for.
    He's very good at what he's good at.
    Unfortunately, several of the skillsets required to stay at the absolute pinnacle simply aren't there. And it eventually finds you out.
    Compare the careers of George Best and Cristiano Ronaldo for example.
    Where did it all go wrong George?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Off topic I realise, but I just had a letter from my bank saying they are concerned that I am 'frequently' withdrawing cash from the post office, and I should be using such things as tap and go to pay for my goods. I should also be using their app to control my spending.
    It is perhaps ironic that this morning neither the app nor online banking are available from my bank!

    Welcome to the cashless society. It is ironic Gordon Brown wasted squillions to save a working banking system to bring us to dependency on various bits of flaky IT.

    Once we are all cashless, the government will be able to monitor everyone's spending, and block anyone it dislikes.
    Indeed, it will be something like:

    Customer: Why can't I access any of my money?
    Bank: We can't tell you, the Home Secretary has blocked it and under money laundering rules we can't tell you more.
    Customer: Can I appeal?
    Bank: Yes, sure, you just need to select the right appeal depending on why its been blocked.
    Customer: So I can't really appeal?
    Bank: Not really, but its a big enough fig leaf to allow supposed libertarians on pb to defend the indefensible creeping authoritarianism of their government.
    Hold physical gold. Baked beans. Tinfoil.
  • Leon said:

    What kind of person do YouGov think I am?

    Onlyfans?



    Are they all porn sites?! I only know Only Fans. Ex wife makes money from it
    I've never quite understood how Only Fans works. In particular, how do punters find out what is available before signing up? Is there an extensive searchable database?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 27,910
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    Well, I do know him a bit, and my impression is that he avoids hard work, because he's found that he can get by without it. If you have a fast mind (and he does) you can get maybe 70% of your tasks done in 20% of the time available, and if you're also charming and amusing (and he is), you can top that up to an apparent 110%.

    I empathise a bit - I have a quick mind too (minus the charisma), and it's quite seductive not to bother with the 100%, especially as I don't find that really putting in the effort gets me to 100% quality anyway - more like 85%. Not comparing myself to the PM, but maybe there's a similar process going on. I've got this week off work, and in theory I could be taking the time to really understand some complex issue. Instead, it's more fun just to chat here.
    I know this mindset because I share it, too

    It astonishes me how I can get away with doing such a small amount of work - 2 hours a day? - and still make a decent living. Unlike Boris I don’t then take on multiple tasks and careers on top of that. I loaf

    Tho this raises an interesting philosophical question: is there a proper amount of work?

    It was likely the industrial revolution which firmly entrenched the idea you should do 8-10 hours work a day. Before that people often did less. Hunter gatherers spend about 2 hours a day hunting. The rest is loafing. Like lions
    With lions, the males tend to sit around while the females hunt. (And you don't want to know about their family relationships.) I trust the similarity of name is purely accidental.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,708

    Pulpstar said:

    https://twitter.com/RichardJMurphy/status/1564157639621312512

    Very important thread from Richard Murphy.

    Altering existing subsidy contracts might be difficult but giving the current Market/Strike difference back to UK consumers (Both business and residential) could be done almost immediately.

    I disagree with his proposal to violate contracts, that's not appropriate, but absolutely agreed that the Market/Strike difference should be returned back to consumers.

    As an icing on the cake, it could even be named on the bill as a "Green Rebate", because that's exactly what it is.

    If we could harness the meltdown that would trigger from people like @MISTY then that would be even better.
    Murphy's idea is based on the same point made before on pb, that energy is a rigged market because price is based not on scarcity but on the most expensive final fraction of production and the rest makes windfall profits.
    How's that a rigged market?

    In a market all actors generally receive the market value for their goods and services. If some firms have lower costs than others, then they don't get paid less accordingly, they make a bigger profit which encourages either them to expand (thus making more profit) or others to invest like them, which ultimately brings the price down.

    That renewable firms are making a profit isn't a problem, its what is driving vast renewable investment. If they weren't making a profit, we wouldn't be getting the investment in renewables.

    Invest in renewables and our demand for gas comes down, reducing gas prices, so reducing the cost of electricity. Invest enough to cease to need gas at all, the price comes down even further.
    "In a market all actors generally receive the market value for their goods and services."

    All actors certainly are NOT receiving the market value for their goods and services. I'm receiving 5.99p/kwH for each unit of solar I export to the grid and that new windfarm Hornsea is receiving 5.5p/kwh for each unit they send to the grid.
    Now whilst we're both perfectly happy with these arrangements as they're part of longstanding contracts that were previously subsidising my solar and historic wind (Where strike prices agreed were higher) the UK consumer is currently benefitting sweet fuck all from these lower priced inputs to the grid.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525

    Leon said:

    What kind of person do YouGov think I am?

    Onlyfans?



    Are they all porn sites?! I only know Only Fans. Ex wife makes money from it
    I've never quite understood how Only Fans works. In particular, how do punters find out what is available before signing up? Is there an extensive searchable database?
    Punters are teased with free material and promised better stuff beyond the paywall

    The sums are usually tiny so it’s worth the risk
  • IshmaelZ said:

    Unboxed, the ‘festival of Brexit’ has been a massive flop:

    Has anyone attended any of these events? I did look at their website a few months ago but it all looked like a load of guff to me so didn’t bother. I’m surprised any arty, creative types got involved at all. But I guess £120m opens doors.

    The DM are furious. Not like them.


    Best rated comments below the article are surprising for the DM though. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11166831/Brexit-Fury-120million-arts-festival-celebrate-Brexit-pro-Remain-flop.html

    I had never heard of it, seems to have been on the go since may.

    In other news, I thought Liz's "fiscal event" vs budget was rather good satire on the theme of war vs Special Military Operation. I have just found out it's for real.
    Yes; apparently a wheeze to avoid OBR forecasts that are needed for a "budget".
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,708
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    https://twitter.com/RichardJMurphy/status/1564157639621312512

    Very important thread from Richard Murphy.

    Altering existing subsidy contracts might be difficult but giving the current Market/Strike difference back to UK consumers (Both business and residential) could be done almost immediately.

    I disagree with his proposal to violate contracts, that's not appropriate, but absolutely agreed that the Market/Strike difference should be returned back to consumers.

    As an icing on the cake, it could even be named on the bill as a "Green Rebate", because that's exactly what it is.

    If we could harness the meltdown that would trigger from people like @MISTY then that would be even better.
    Murphy's idea is based on the same point made before on pb, that energy is a rigged market because price is based not on scarcity but on the most expensive final fraction of production and the rest makes windfall profits.
    How's that a rigged market?

    In a market all actors generally receive the market value for their goods and services. If some firms have lower costs than others, then they don't get paid less accordingly, they make a bigger profit which encourages either them to expand (thus making more profit) or others to invest like them, which ultimately brings the price down.

    That renewable firms are making a profit isn't a problem, its what is driving vast renewable investment. If they weren't making a profit, we wouldn't be getting the investment in renewables.

    Invest in renewables and our demand for gas comes down, reducing gas prices, so reducing the cost of electricity. Invest enough to cease to need gas at all, the price comes down even further.
    "In a market all actors generally receive the market value for their goods and services."

    All actors certainly are NOT receiving the market value for their goods and services. I'm receiving 5.99p/kwH for each unit of solar I export to the grid and that new windfarm Hornsea is receiving 5.5p/kwh for each unit they send to the grid.
    Now whilst we're both perfectly happy with these arrangements as they're part of longstanding contracts that were previously subsidising my solar and historic wind (Where strike prices agreed were higher) the UK consumer is currently benefitting sweet fuck all from these lower priced inputs to the grid.
    Another subtle point. Whilst the algorithm remains unchanged it will increase inflation over and above what it should be - so the cost of renewable electricity (As it's all index linked) will rise to higher than it otherwise should. Which of course feeds back into inflation.
    The current system works for Gazprom, BP, Shell and short term the treasury (Even though they'll pay more but whoever iseyeing up that pot won't be thinking about that currently) but not so much for anyone else.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525
    edited September 1
    Another dash of data to add to the *Were The Lockdowns Worth It* cake-mix. From the USA


    The Pandemic Erased Two Decades of Progress in Math and Reading

    The results of a national test showed just how devastating the last two years have been for 9-year-old schoolchildren, especially the most vulnerable.



    https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/01/us/national-test-scores-math-reading-pandemic.amp.html
  • Leon said:

    What kind of person do YouGov think I am?

    Onlyfans?



    Are they all porn sites?! I only know Only Fans. Ex wife makes money from it
    Kinda. Camgirl sites and the occasional hookup.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 27,910
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    Well, I do know him a bit, and my impression is that he avoids hard work, because he's found that he can get by without it. If you have a fast mind (and he does) you can get maybe 70% of your tasks done in 20% of the time available, and if you're also charming and amusing (and he is), you can top that up to an apparent 110%.

    I empathise a bit - I have a quick mind too (minus the charisma), and it's quite seductive not to bother with the 100%, especially as I don't find that really putting in the effort gets me to 100% quality anyway - more like 85%. Not comparing myself to the PM, but maybe there's a similar process going on. I've got this week off work, and in theory I could be taking the time to really understand some complex issue. Instead, it's more fun just to chat here.
    Every person I know who knows him says he is lazy, dating back to his schooldays. He was then and he is now and I think we have all seen that these past few years.

    Of course he is also immensely gifted and I'm sure has no problem whatsoever knocking out (phnarr) 1,000 amusing words for a Spectator or DT audience which is a bit like shooting fish in a barrel but that's not to say there's no market for it. It is absolutely "real work" - it's just that it is the type that he has a natural affinity for.
    Re writing, it's much easier to knock off a general audience piece for a newspaper or magazine than it is to do a full scholarly paper. The former can be comment, it has far less detail to check, it is shorter, and so on. The latter has to be watertight and documented and all the bases and loopholes covered. It takes far, far longer to do. Indeed, they're so different that they almost need different brains - it's only the keyboard and screen that are in common. Being a Speccy columnist versus PM is like that. In the former, a CBA attitude is easy - you just pick a different topic or route. In the latter, it's fatal.

  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 27,910
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    What kind of person do YouGov think I am?

    Onlyfans?



    Are they all porn sites?! I only know Only Fans. Ex wife makes money from it
    I've never quite understood how Only Fans works. In particular, how do punters find out what is available before signing up? Is there an extensive searchable database?
    Punters are teased with free material and promised better stuff beyond the paywall

    The sums are usually tiny so it’s worth the risk
    So all fluff really?
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 9,850
    edited September 1
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    https://twitter.com/RichardJMurphy/status/1564157639621312512

    Very important thread from Richard Murphy.

    Altering existing subsidy contracts might be difficult but giving the current Market/Strike difference back to UK consumers (Both business and residential) could be done almost immediately.

    I disagree with his proposal to violate contracts, that's not appropriate, but absolutely agreed that the Market/Strike difference should be returned back to consumers.

    As an icing on the cake, it could even be named on the bill as a "Green Rebate", because that's exactly what it is.

    If we could harness the meltdown that would trigger from people like @MISTY then that would be even better.
    Murphy's idea is based on the same point made before on pb, that energy is a rigged market because price is based not on scarcity but on the most expensive final fraction of production and the rest makes windfall profits.
    How's that a rigged market?

    In a market all actors generally receive the market value for their goods and services. If some firms have lower costs than others, then they don't get paid less accordingly, they make a bigger profit which encourages either them to expand (thus making more profit) or others to invest like them, which ultimately brings the price down.

    That renewable firms are making a profit isn't a problem, its what is driving vast renewable investment. If they weren't making a profit, we wouldn't be getting the investment in renewables.

    Invest in renewables and our demand for gas comes down, reducing gas prices, so reducing the cost of electricity. Invest enough to cease to need gas at all, the price comes down even further.
    "In a market all actors generally receive the market value for their goods and services."

    All actors certainly are NOT receiving the market value for their goods and services. I'm receiving 5.99p/kwH for each unit of solar I export to the grid and that new windfarm Hornsea is receiving 5.5p/kwh for each unit they send to the grid.
    Now whilst we're both perfectly happy with these arrangements as they're part of longstanding contracts that were previously subsidising my solar and historic wind (Where strike prices agreed were higher) the UK consumer is currently benefitting sweet fuck all from these lower priced inputs to the grid.
    That's why I said 'generally', those on contracts get their contracted rate, whether that be subsidising you or you selling under the market rate, for the duration of the contract.

    Those who are not contracted and are on the market rate, generally get the market rate though, not a lower rate simply because they're more efficient and their costs are lower.

    If the Treasury are getting a windfall from these cost savings, then as I said that Treasury windfall should be rebated back to the consumers paying the bills as a Green Rebate rather than Green Levy.

    If renewable firms not on contracts like yours are getting a windfall because they're on the market rate and their costs are low, then good for them and that ought to be taxed as part of ordinary taxation on their profits and their profits ought to encourage further investments in renewables.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525
    Carnyx said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    Well, I do know him a bit, and my impression is that he avoids hard work, because he's found that he can get by without it. If you have a fast mind (and he does) you can get maybe 70% of your tasks done in 20% of the time available, and if you're also charming and amusing (and he is), you can top that up to an apparent 110%.

    I empathise a bit - I have a quick mind too (minus the charisma), and it's quite seductive not to bother with the 100%, especially as I don't find that really putting in the effort gets me to 100% quality anyway - more like 85%. Not comparing myself to the PM, but maybe there's a similar process going on. I've got this week off work, and in theory I could be taking the time to really understand some complex issue. Instead, it's more fun just to chat here.
    Every person I know who knows him says he is lazy, dating back to his schooldays. He was then and he is now and I think we have all seen that these past few years.

    Of course he is also immensely gifted and I'm sure has no problem whatsoever knocking out (phnarr) 1,000 amusing words for a Spectator or DT audience which is a bit like shooting fish in a barrel but that's not to say there's no market for it. It is absolutely "real work" - it's just that it is the type that he has a natural affinity for.
    Re writing, it's much easier to knock off a general audience piece for a newspaper or magazine than it is to do a full scholarly paper. The former can be comment, it has far less detail to check, it is shorter, and so on. The latter has to be watertight and documented and all the bases and loopholes covered. It takes far, far longer to do. Indeed, they're so different that they almost need different brains - it's only the keyboard and screen that are in common. Being a Speccy columnist versus PM is like that. In the former, a CBA attitude is easy - you just pick a different topic or route. In the latter, it's fatal.

    That’s really not true. Otherwise all the people doing the hard, scholarly papers would be knocking out easy columns for £300,000 a year. They aren’t, because it is in fact difficult. Few have the skill. Those that do are therefore well rewarded

    One of these skills is concision. Making an interesting point in as few words as possible, while remaining memorable and vivid

    A lot of people who can technically “write” can’t do this, they write far too much and bore the reader
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 42,739
    edited September 1
    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    Nah, you’re getting him wrong, and not paying enough attention to testimony from those that have known him best. He’s bright enough to be able to (or to think that he is) wing those roles with the minimum of preparation or application, then he landed in the one job that you can’t do that way, and got found out.

    There’s a difference between being busy, and making a real effort.
  • Leon said:

    What kind of person do YouGov think I am?

    Onlyfans?



    Are they all porn sites?! I only know Only Fans. Ex wife makes money from it
    Kinda. Camgirl sites and the occasional hookup.
    Yougov is doing your day job for you. Just add all those sites to Appendix C of your report on dodgy sites bankers should avoid. Obviously, you'll need to do a modicum of due diligence research to check Yougov has not slipped in a fake site to the question.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525
    We should never have closed the schools. It is an enormous tragedy
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 1,307
    Ah, OnlyFans. A great British tech success story that politicians can’t talk about.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 42,739

    Who in America is paying money to listen to Theresa May do lectures?

    As a more general point (as I sit readying for breakfast in the shadow of Mount Washington), it is genuinely remarkable what it seems to be possible to get some Americans to pay money for.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 8,508

    Leon said:

    What kind of person do YouGov think I am?

    Onlyfans?



    Are they all porn sites?! I only know Only Fans. Ex wife makes money from it
    Kinda. Camgirl sites and the occasional hookup.
    Maybe they have analytics on you? Which they paid good money for. When they could have read this site and got it all for free 😆
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 1,307
    IanB2 said:

    Who in America is paying money to listen to Theresa May do lectures?

    As a more general point (as I sit readying for breakfast in the shadow of Mount Washington), it is genuinely remarkable what it seems to be possible to get some Americans to pay money for.
    In this case it may be just that there are so many of them (Americans, that is). There aren’t enough ex-presidents to go around, so an ex prime minister will do in a pinch.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 28,525
    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:

    148grss said:

    Do we really think he cares enough to fight for a comeback, or does he just want to make quick money by writing columns and doing talks at fancy dinners? I mean, a comeback sounds like hard work, and we know Johnson hates hard work.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he resigns as an MP rather than get kicked out by the electorate, that he'll become the Tory King over the Water, and he'll just make money doing the kind of stuff all ex PMs do.

    I dunno where people get the idea “Boris hates hard work”

    In his time he’s been a successful foreign correspondent, editor of the Spectator, mayor of London, Brexit campaigner, Commons MP, Cabinet Minister, and Prime Minister

    He’s also been a novelist, columnist and TV presenter. And he doesn’t slack when it comes to the laydeez

    You can dodge tasks in life, to an extent, but you can’t do all that without some real graft

    Boris’ “problem” is that he is very bright so he can make all this seem bumblingly effortless: so that is what people perceive
    Nah, you’re getting him wrong, and not paying enough attention to testimony from those that have known him best. He’s bright enough to be able to (or to think that he is) wing those roles with the minimum of preparation or application, then he landed in the one job that you can’t do that way, and got found out.

    There’s a difference between being busy, and making a real effort.
    We will have to disagree

    I actually believe he was a pretty good prime minister, given an unbelievably difficult hand to play. For a start he won a majority and therefore got Brexit done: winning is a vital part of politics

    He then faced a global pandemic. He made errors there - masks, borders, too many boffins - but he also achieved notable successes: vaccines, resisting lockdown 4

    He handled Ukraine so well he is now a Ukrainian national hero

    That’s not bad. Remoaners will never accept it, because they loathe him irrationally, but his CV is quite decent

    He was brought down by personal quirks and flaws, not inability. He’s arrogant and thought the rules didn’t apply to him, he’s a libertine so he let the staff play

  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 8,508
    carnforth said:

    Ah, OnlyFans. A great British tech success story that politicians can’t talk about.

    Good time filler when at work, perusing “tractor sites”

  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 17,626
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    FPT for @NickPalmer

    Asexuality is absolutely a valid life choice. And one to be respected. I have asexual friends who are happy and productive citizens

    I just don’t believe a life without sex would willingly be chosen by a third of men aged 18-24. That’s outwith the findings of any sexual survey in history. It’s not a healthy sign

    Yes, agree with that. and canned entertainment (whether streaming or gaming or social media chatting, all of which I enjoy some of the time) definitely misses a dimension compared with direct human contact, whether sex or cuddles or even just having a cuppa together.
    We are all becoming Japanese. Not great
    Are you having an attack of The Vapors?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Leon said:

    We should never have closed the schools. It is an enormous tragedy

    Yes. There are stats somewhere for the increase in highly-likely-to-be-abuse type injuries at Great Ormond Street. At least tenfold.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 24,281
    Boris speech.
    Very pro-nuclear. And pro-wind. Not impressed with fracking.
    Very substantial sums of help forthcoming.
    Why on Earth this is happening now is an intriguing question.
  • DynamoDynamo Posts: 651
    IanB2 said:

    Who in America is paying money to listen to Theresa May do lectures?

    As a more general point (as I sit readying for breakfast in the shadow of Mount Washington), it is genuinely remarkable what it seems to be possible to get some Americans to pay money for.
    Such as? Self-help "bibles"? Poodle parlour services?
This discussion has been closed.