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The latest polling is giving us widely different numbers – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 8,489
edited August 7 in General
imageThe latest polling is giving us widely different numbers – politicalbetting.com

It is very hard to draw any conclusions from the most recent polling seen in the Wikipedia table above. The reason, of course, is the very wide differences the various firms are showing.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 4,797
    First
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,054
    Second like Richi Rich.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 41,239
    Third rate like Truss
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 103,337
    The interesting thing is the Tories seem generally stuck in the 33-35% range, it is the Labour share of the vote that seems variable.

    One of the early lessons I learned on PB was from Sir Bob Worcester who told me to watch the share of the vote, not the lead.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 16,479
    Betfair next prime minister
    1.13 Liz Truss 88%
    8.4 Rishi Sunak 12%

    Next Conservative leader
    1.13 Liz Truss 88%
    8.2 Rishi Sunak 12%
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 22,950
    The question is how the Dems get abortion on the ballot.

    The simplistic approach for Red states would be to use ballot initiatives to get a direct vote on the issue.

    However there is a history of voters backong Dem positions on ballot initiatives but then GOP politicians for Congress/President. The most recent example was the 15 dollar minimum wage referendum in Florida - voted for the wage increase then voted for the Presidential candidate who opposed the wage increase.

  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 34,333
    Summer polling when the only real political news the leadership contest is going to be a bit all over the place.

    I think though both parties have a fairly soft edge to their share hinging on certainty to vote.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 16,479
    edited August 3
    Nancy Pelosi ties Chinese cyber-attacks to need for Taiwan visit
    And as if to confirm the link, a DDoS takes out Taiwan's presidential website ahead of senior politico's arrival

    https://www.theregister.com/2022/08/03/pelosi_taiwan_visit_cyberattacks/
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 37,175
    edited August 3
    All the polls are consistent with each other if you look at it in terms of the Tory vote share and then the Labour + LibDem + Green vote share. The former is almost entirely within the 30 to 35 range, the latter is almost entirely 55 to 60.

    PM Truss needs to push the Tory number to 40. That will mean taking the vast majority of Don't Knows back into the Tory fold.
  • IcarusIcarus Posts: 706
    IanB2 said:

    Third rate like Truss

    You are being generous to Truss. A third rate ship of the line was still a formidable weapon with 74 -80 guns usually as 2 deckers. She is closer to being an unrated Sloop.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 52,128
    Sandpit said:

    Second like Richi Rich.

    Sir Richard Rich definitely came first, every single time. The consequences for those who lost out to him tended to be unfortunate.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Rich,_1st_Baron_Rich
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 59,344
    Mr. Observer, been a fair amount of soft rain here recently. Hopefully helping with the reservoirs and flora a bit.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 31,220
    I see this as being a major issue facing Starmer at the moment: the Tories are currently repelling many voters who might consider voting for them. That's half of Starmer's job done. What he's not done is solidly convince those voters repelled by the Tories to vote Labour. Yet.

    And *if* the new Conservative leader can attract back a lot of those voters, Starmer's job is suddenly much harder again.

    IMO Starmer really needs to set forth a positive vision and policies, and have his shadow cabinet pound out that vision and policies at every interview.

    Instead, Labour seems internally consumed by the strikes.
  • ChrisChris Posts: 8,373
    ydoethur said:

    Sandpit said:

    Second like Richi Rich.

    Sir Richard Rich definitely came first, every single time. The consequences for those who lost out to him tended to be unfortunate.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Rich,_1st_Baron_Rich
    After Truss's victory, Sunak will presumably return to government as Attorney-General for Wales.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 102,735
    edited August 3
    Until the new leader is elected polling means little, especially as they likely get a poll bounce
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 9,513
    edited August 3

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 53,486
    Why was no request made to EDF to keep the two nuclears at Hinkley B in service for another two years, rather than shutting them this week and losing a gigawatt of power? A delay was among the options presented in the Government’s “worst-case” modelling for a crisis this winter.

    Telegraph

    FFS
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 42,730

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Pissed it down here, yesterday.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 4,668
    When it comes to positive energy, there are radiators and sponges. Having just read that blog Leon copied, Jack Monroe is a sponge. Self pitying and tiresome to read.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 34,333
    Chris said:

    ydoethur said:

    Sandpit said:

    Second like Richi Rich.

    Sir Richard Rich definitely came first, every single time. The consequences for those who lost out to him tended to be unfortunate.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Rich,_1st_Baron_Rich
    After Truss's victory, Sunak will presumably return to government as Attorney-General for Wales.
    I think Sunak will do a Jeremy Hunt, and not want to be in the Cabinet, but rather be an influential backbencher on committees etc. I don't see him leaving Parliament just yet.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 102,735
    edited August 3
    Alistair said:

    The question is how the Dems get abortion on the ballot.

    The simplistic approach for Red states would be to use ballot initiatives to get a direct vote on the issue.

    However there is a history of voters backong Dem positions on ballot initiatives but then GOP politicians for Congress/President. The most recent example was the 15 dollar minimum wage referendum in Florida - voted for the wage increase then voted for the Presidential candidate who opposed the wage increase.

    In every Southern state except Florida, Kentucky, Arkansas and Oklahoma states do not allow for ballot initiatives, only legislative referral.

    It is in the South where opposition to abortion is highest. Plus it will be the governor and state legislature who will determine that state's position on abortion now the US SC has ruled there is no constitutional right to an abortion

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Initiatives_and_referendums_in_the_United_States
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 34,333

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
    Browns first crisis was summer floods as I remember.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 20,393

    I see this as being a major issue facing Starmer at the moment: the Tories are currently repelling many voters who might consider voting for them. That's half of Starmer's job done. What he's not done is solidly convince those voters repelled by the Tories to vote Labour. Yet.

    And *if* the new Conservative leader can attract back a lot of those voters, Starmer's job is suddenly much harder again.

    IMO Starmer really needs to set forth a positive vision and policies, and have his shadow cabinet pound out that vision and policies at every interview.

    Instead, Labour seems internally consumed by the strikes.

    On the strikes, I think there are two drivers.

    One - most working people aren't supporting the strikers. Most working people are not union members and see those who are as a bit entitled. So to go out and openly support them is to stand against most working people and thus Labour voters.
    Two - most of the unions are unaffiliated to Labour and openly against Starmer. Why do politically difficult things when the people you would be doing it for oppose you?

    Labour is no longer the party of the trade union movement. So many have become unaffiliated, a few are openly hostile, a couple of those remaining in the camp (Unite especially) need to be ejected. If the hard left unionists dislike this reality, why did they all disaffiliate and spin out into bullshit like TUSC?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 42,730
    HYUFD said:

    Until the new leader is elected polling means little, especially as they likely get a poll bounce

    Any bounce won't mean much, either, unless it's sustained or should it persuade her to take a mad election gamble.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 2,073
    HYUFD said:

    Alistair said:

    The question is how the Dems get abortion on the ballot.

    The simplistic approach for Red states would be to use ballot initiatives to get a direct vote on the issue.

    However there is a history of voters backong Dem positions on ballot initiatives but then GOP politicians for Congress/President. The most recent example was the 15 dollar minimum wage referendum in Florida - voted for the wage increase then voted for the Presidential candidate who opposed the wage increase.

    In every Southern state except Florida, Kentucky, Arkansas and Oklahoma states do not allow for ballot initiatives, only legislative referral.

    It is in the South where opposition to abortion is highest

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Initiatives_and_referendums_in_the_United_States
    The South has always been rather wary of democracy.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 59,344
    Dr. Foxy, that's correct. Tons of rain round where I live (thankfully high enough not to be flooded).
  • ChrisChris Posts: 8,373
    Chris said:

    The article sees this an expression of her "support for domestic fossil fuel extraction".

    Surely it's more a question of her seeking support from fossils?
    And did those geeks in ancient time
    walk upon England's mountains green?
    And was the solar panel pod
    on England's pleasant pastures seen?
    And did the ghastly wind turbine
    shine forth upon our clouded hills?
  • eekeek Posts: 20,666
    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 31,220

    Why was no request made to EDF to keep the two nuclears at Hinkley B in service for another two years, rather than shutting them this week and losing a gigawatt of power? A delay was among the options presented in the Government’s “worst-case” modelling for a crisis this winter.

    Telegraph

    FFS

    From the little I've read on the subject, it is a question of whether they can be safely run, given the cracks in the graphite. They've been kept going an extra couple of years already, and the station has generated power for 15 years more than was planned when it was built. It *could* be extended to work over the winter, but would require a new safety case to go before the regulator, and work. There is now not enough time before winter to get the safety case approved and the work done. even if the case is approved.

    I've no idea to what extent the cracks pose a risk; but it becomes a trade-off of the risks of a reactor having a serious issue compared to the risks of going short of that much power this winter. I have zero clue on that.

    I'm in favour of nuclear power, but let's not muck around with it.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 34,333
    Right now the KS abortion vote has 140,000 more votes than the two governor primaries combined, which means nearly 20% of voters came out just to vote on the amendment

    https://twitter.com/dwbeard/status/1554668357131149312?t=HOf8w8CFKkAEUwzaqK0BnA&s=19

    So definitely a motivation to vote. In KS only affiliated voters can vote in the Primaries, so a significant number of independents turned out to maintain abortion rights.

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 71,746
    HYUFD said:

    Alistair said:

    The question is how the Dems get abortion on the ballot.

    The simplistic approach for Red states would be to use ballot initiatives to get a direct vote on the issue.

    However there is a history of voters backong Dem positions on ballot initiatives but then GOP politicians for Congress/President. The most recent example was the 15 dollar minimum wage referendum in Florida - voted for the wage increase then voted for the Presidential candidate who opposed the wage increase.

    In every Southern state except Florida, Kentucky, Arkansas and Oklahoma states do not allow for ballot initiatives, only legislative referral.

    It is in the South where opposition to abortion is highest. Plus it will be the governor and state legislature who will determine that state's position on abortion now the US SC has ruled there is no constitutional right to an abortion

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Initiatives_and_referendums_in_the_United_States
    The Kansas situation has arisen specifically because abortion is protected in the state constitution. Remember Dobbs affirms the constitution is neutral on abortion (Overruling Roe which granted the right) - so it's down to the states.
    The GOP will not ask the people specifically on the issue where it is not part of the state constitution as it was in Kansas
  • eekeek Posts: 20,666

    Why was no request made to EDF to keep the two nuclears at Hinkley B in service for another two years, rather than shutting them this week and losing a gigawatt of power? A delay was among the options presented in the Government’s “worst-case” modelling for a crisis this winter.

    Telegraph

    FFS

    Probably can't be done because Bozo and co are no longer in a position to make decisions that are financial....
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 4,797
    Foxy said:

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
    Browns first crisis was summer floods as I remember.
    His first crisis was when he became PM as he was a fool with no plan. Everything he touched turned to disaster
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 42,730
    Foxy said:

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
    Browns first crisis was summer floods as I remember.
    And who can forget Boris's mop skills ?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 34,333

    I see this as being a major issue facing Starmer at the moment: the Tories are currently repelling many voters who might consider voting for them. That's half of Starmer's job done. What he's not done is solidly convince those voters repelled by the Tories to vote Labour. Yet.

    And *if* the new Conservative leader can attract back a lot of those voters, Starmer's job is suddenly much harder again.

    IMO Starmer really needs to set forth a positive vision and policies, and have his shadow cabinet pound out that vision and policies at every interview.

    Instead, Labour seems internally consumed by the strikes.

    On the strikes, I think there are two drivers.

    One - most working people aren't supporting the strikers. Most working people are not union members and see those who are as a bit entitled. So to go out and openly support them is to stand against most working people and thus Labour voters.
    Two - most of the unions are unaffiliated to Labour and openly against Starmer. Why do politically difficult things when the people you would be doing it for oppose you?

    Labour is no longer the party of the trade union movement. So many have become unaffiliated, a few are openly hostile, a couple of those remaining in the camp (Unite especially) need to be ejected. If the hard left unionists dislike this reality, why did they all disaffiliate and spin out into bullshit like TUSC?
    Polls show quite strong support for the strikers, and even the vox pops at railway stations are surprisingly supportive. People understand that if the unionised workers get screwed, the non-unionised will do even worse.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 42,730
    Sandpit said:

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    Can everyone agree that Tweets so old as to have been sent from a Blackberry, are not relevant to anything?
    Well it does tell us that she's been a somewhat incontinent Tweeter for quite some time.

    And yesterday's contretemps indicate she still hasn't learned to think before pronouncing.
  • Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 11,651
    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    I am no Truss fan, but I wonder what saddo found that? There really are people with such sad lives that they spend hours trawling through opponents old tweets from a decade ago to find a tweet that was based on the passing of a celebrity that at that time most people did not know was a pedo.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 71,746
    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    How many hours would that take, or if it was to be done in quick time I presume it'd need an IT professional. Quite honestly there's better use of people's time and money than going through all their old tweets and eliminating ones that might be inconvienient.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 7,399
    Nigelb said:

    HYUFD said:

    Until the new leader is elected polling means little, especially as they likely get a poll bounce

    Any bounce won't mean much, either, unless it's sustained or should it persuade her to take a mad election gamble.
    I wonder whether there will be a bounce after all the blue on blue stuff and screaming u turns. There is a reason new leaders get a bounce and that reason is being destroyed.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 25,994
    edited August 3
    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    Can everyone agree that Tweets so old as to have been sent from a Blackberry, are not relevant to anything?
    Well it does tell us that she's been a somewhat incontinent Tweeter for quite some time.

    And yesterday's contretemps indicate she still hasn't learned to think before pronouncing.
    Also, 11 years isn't that long - the right-wing papers or the Tory Party certainly wouldn't think so if they found what they saw as a particularly juicy faecal nugget to fling at some opponent.
  • Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 11,651
    HYUFD said:

    Until the new leader is elected polling means little, especially as they likely get a poll bounce

    Of the dead cat variety I fear.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 25,994
    Pulpstar said:

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    How many hours would that take, or if it was to be done in quick time I presume it'd need an IT professional. Quite honestly there's better use of people's time and money than going through all their old tweets and eliminating ones that might be inconvienient.
    Using the same account (by renaming) for general stuff, then UKG business, and now party election business, too, I see. Not a good principle in any walk of life.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 1,719
    O/T but Andrew Neil must have been on here yesterday as he’s picked up the baton re the New York Times today in the mail.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-11074443/Why-useful-idiots-New-York-Times-putting-boot-Brexit-Britain.html
  • eekeek Posts: 20,666

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    I am no Truss fan, but I wonder what saddo found that? There really are people with such sad lives that they spend hours trawling through opponents old tweets from a decade ago to find a tweet that was based on the passing of a celebrity that at that time most people did not know was a pedo.
    Twitter has a search engine - it's incredibly easy to take an account and search for a word or phrase.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,520
    Foxy said:

    I see this as being a major issue facing Starmer at the moment: the Tories are currently repelling many voters who might consider voting for them. That's half of Starmer's job done. What he's not done is solidly convince those voters repelled by the Tories to vote Labour. Yet.

    And *if* the new Conservative leader can attract back a lot of those voters, Starmer's job is suddenly much harder again.

    IMO Starmer really needs to set forth a positive vision and policies, and have his shadow cabinet pound out that vision and policies at every interview.

    Instead, Labour seems internally consumed by the strikes.

    On the strikes, I think there are two drivers.

    One - most working people aren't supporting the strikers. Most working people are not union members and see those who are as a bit entitled. So to go out and openly support them is to stand against most working people and thus Labour voters.
    Two - most of the unions are unaffiliated to Labour and openly against Starmer. Why do politically difficult things when the people you would be doing it for oppose you?

    Labour is no longer the party of the trade union movement. So many have become unaffiliated, a few are openly hostile, a couple of those remaining in the camp (Unite especially) need to be ejected. If the hard left unionists dislike this reality, why did they all disaffiliate and spin out into bullshit like TUSC?
    Polls show quite strong support for the strikers, and even the vox pops at railway stations are surprisingly supportive. People understand that if the unionised workers get screwed, the non-unionised will do even worse.
    I think people recognise that these really are tough economic conditions - they've seen their energy bills go up a lot and so are sympathetic to workers looking to maintain their pay/have less of a pay cut. Even my non-political friends are talking about it.
  • eekeek Posts: 20,666
    Foxy said:

    I see this as being a major issue facing Starmer at the moment: the Tories are currently repelling many voters who might consider voting for them. That's half of Starmer's job done. What he's not done is solidly convince those voters repelled by the Tories to vote Labour. Yet.

    And *if* the new Conservative leader can attract back a lot of those voters, Starmer's job is suddenly much harder again.

    IMO Starmer really needs to set forth a positive vision and policies, and have his shadow cabinet pound out that vision and policies at every interview.

    Instead, Labour seems internally consumed by the strikes.

    On the strikes, I think there are two drivers.

    One - most working people aren't supporting the strikers. Most working people are not union members and see those who are as a bit entitled. So to go out and openly support them is to stand against most working people and thus Labour voters.
    Two - most of the unions are unaffiliated to Labour and openly against Starmer. Why do politically difficult things when the people you would be doing it for oppose you?

    Labour is no longer the party of the trade union movement. So many have become unaffiliated, a few are openly hostile, a couple of those remaining in the camp (Unite especially) need to be ejected. If the hard left unionists dislike this reality, why did they all disaffiliate and spin out into bullshit like TUSC?
    Polls show quite strong support for the strikers, and even the vox pops at railway stations are surprisingly supportive. People understand that if the unionised workers get screwed, the non-unionised will do even worse.
    +1 - I don't get the anti-union tirade. Even the HR departments of the railway companies agree that the Unions have valid points here (apart from Aslef but then I don't think anyone likes Aslef).
  • pm215pm215 Posts: 416

    I see this as being a major issue facing Starmer at the moment: the Tories are currently repelling many voters who might consider voting for them. That's half of Starmer's job done. What he's not done is solidly convince those voters repelled by the Tories to vote Labour. Yet.

    FWIW, that is also pretty much the way Starmer analysed his own situation when he was interviewed on the _Rest is Politics_ podcast (plus an extra completed step 0 of "clean up the antisemitism mess". So I think we should probably expect a shift towards trying to lay out a policy stall. Whether he'll be successful at that is a different question, of course.
  • eekeek Posts: 20,666
    Carnyx said:

    Pulpstar said:

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    How many hours would that take, or if it was to be done in quick time I presume it'd need an IT professional. Quite honestly there's better use of people's time and money than going through all their old tweets and eliminating ones that might be inconvienient.
    Using the same account (by renaming) for general stuff, then UKG business, and now party election business, too, I see. Not a good principle in any walk of life.
    It's her personal account so I'm not surprised it works like that and there are benefits (for her) from doing so as it maximises her audience / reach).

    So for another example Donald Trump using his personal account rather than the one set up for a US President to use (obviously if he was re-elected he would be using the US President account this time round).
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 28,959

    I see this as being a major issue facing Starmer at the moment: the Tories are currently repelling many voters who might consider voting for them. That's half of Starmer's job done. What he's not done is solidly convince those voters repelled by the Tories to vote Labour. Yet.

    And *if* the new Conservative leader can attract back a lot of those voters, Starmer's job is suddenly much harder again.

    IMO Starmer really needs to set forth a positive vision and policies, and have his shadow cabinet pound out that vision and policies at every interview.

    Instead, Labour seems internally consumed by the strikes.

    Good morning everyone. Fine bright morning here!
    It might be helpful instead of ignoring the Don't Knows, or redistributing them on the basis of the way they voted last time, to include an actual figure.
    AIUI, at the moment, if a polling company holds the thousand voters and only 60% of them express a preference, then we get the preferences of those 60%. It will be interesting to know how many people just don't know!
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 9,347
    Icarus said:

    IanB2 said:

    Third rate like Truss

    You are being generous to Truss. A third rate ship of the line was still a formidable weapon with 74 -80 guns usually as 2 deckers. She is closer to being an unrated Sloop.
    Its funny that the rating system leads to very inappropriate descriptions of non-ship characteristics. A third rate ship of the line was a superb weapon of war. as you say.
  • northern_monkeynorthern_monkey Posts: 1,045
    Yes, of course I can't resist posting this. No, it won't change anyone's view. Still...

    Spiralling inflation, crops left in the field and travel chaos: 10 reasons Brexit has been disastrous for Britain - https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/aug/03/spiralling-inflation-crops-left-in-the-field-and-travel-chaos-10-reasons-brexit-has-been-disastrous-for-britain

    I'd love to dig out choice quotes but there's so many, and we 've all heard the arguments many times before, so I won't waste my time. Except for this, which is perhaps becoming the default opinion outside the diehards: 'She sighs, and then echoes something I have heard from just about everyone I have spoken to: a sense of rules, arrangements that make no sense, and are upturning people’s lives. “It’s such a waste of everyone’s time,” she says. “Why do it?”'

    The answer, of course, is to allow the Tories the go even further in dividing and wrecking the UK, for the continued enrichment of their super-wealthy donors. A venal truly cosmopolitan elite, proper citizens of nowhere, for whom the UK is nothing but a tempting resource to be plundered.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 22,323

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    I am no Truss fan, but I wonder what saddo found that? There really are people with such sad lives that they spend hours trawling through opponents old tweets from a decade ago to find a tweet that was based on the passing of a celebrity that at that time most people did not know was a pedo.
    Good grief, can you imagine the frothing rage the Sun, Mail and Express would get themselves into if that tweet had been from Starmer?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 25,994

    Icarus said:

    IanB2 said:

    Third rate like Truss

    You are being generous to Truss. A third rate ship of the line was still a formidable weapon with 74 -80 guns usually as 2 deckers. She is closer to being an unrated Sloop.
    Its funny that the rating system leads to very inappropriate descriptions of non-ship characteristics. A third rate ship of the line was a superb weapon of war. as you say.
    It was originally to define the responsibility level (in e.g. terms of the workload and number of crew) and thus *pay rates* of the officers such as the captain, rather than the ship - as I learn from, coincidentally, reading Brian Lavery's newish book on HMS Victory.
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 3,077
    edited August 3
    Pulpstar said:

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    How many hours would that take, or if it was to be done in quick time I presume it'd need an IT professional.
    There's (free) software available to download all the tweets from a user's timeline. For someone who knows what they're doing it'd be an hour or so's work to set it up, and then it's running cost-free from then on. It's the sort of thing that every Fleet Street newsroom should have installed tbh.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 46,536

    The interesting thing is the Tories seem generally stuck in the 33-35% range, it is the Labour share of the vote that seems variable.

    One of the early lessons I learned on PB was from Sir Bob Worcester who told me to watch the share of the vote, not the lead.

    That's an interesting observation.

    The question is what it would look like if there was a general election tomorrow and the choice was imminent.

    My guess is the Tory vote share would be 36-38%.
  • eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    I am no Truss fan, but I wonder what saddo found that? There really are people with such sad lives that they spend hours trawling through opponents old tweets from a decade ago to find a tweet that was based on the passing of a celebrity that at that time most people did not know was a pedo.
    Good grief, can you imagine the frothing rage the Sun, Mail and Express would get themselves into if that tweet had been from Starmer?
    QTWAIN.

    When he passed it wasn't public knowledge that he was a paedo, that came out post-mortem. That a politician would say RIP to a celebrity is neither here nor there.

    What's far more concerning is those who did know or see the evidence he was a paedo but did nothing about it, or covered it up.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 7,399
    Sandpit said:

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    Can everyone agree that Tweets so old as to have been sent from a Blackberry, are not relevant to anything?
    Yep and as Nigel says it is sad someone trawled through tweets and thought this was worth publicising. It is however a lesson about Twitter if you have ambitions in the public life. At the time this was a perfectly innocent tweet.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 25,994

    Pulpstar said:

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    How many hours would that take, or if it was to be done in quick time I presume it'd need an IT professional.
    There's (free) software available to download all the tweets from a user's timeline. For someone who knows what they're doing it'd be an hour or so's work to set it up, and then it's running cost-free from then on. It's the sort of thing that every Fleet Street newsroom should have installed tbh.
    Does that erase all, or just between certain dates? One would assume the latter. Not very helpful deleting the Savile one if it wipes your current campaigning tweets.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 31,220
    On that Truss tweet: if it was published at a time when Saville was still seen as being 'okay', then it's minutely embarrassing but fine. If she tweeted that as the truth was coming out, then it's terrible.

    It was October 29th 2011, which was apparently the day he died. What did the papers say the next day?

    This is what the Guardian had to say:
    https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2011/oct/30/jimmy-savile-top-of-pops-dead
    And the BBC:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-15053431
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 20,393
    Foxy said:

    I see this as being a major issue facing Starmer at the moment: the Tories are currently repelling many voters who might consider voting for them. That's half of Starmer's job done. What he's not done is solidly convince those voters repelled by the Tories to vote Labour. Yet.

    And *if* the new Conservative leader can attract back a lot of those voters, Starmer's job is suddenly much harder again.

    IMO Starmer really needs to set forth a positive vision and policies, and have his shadow cabinet pound out that vision and policies at every interview.

    Instead, Labour seems internally consumed by the strikes.

    On the strikes, I think there are two drivers.

    One - most working people aren't supporting the strikers. Most working people are not union members and see those who are as a bit entitled. So to go out and openly support them is to stand against most working people and thus Labour voters.
    Two - most of the unions are unaffiliated to Labour and openly against Starmer. Why do politically difficult things when the people you would be doing it for oppose you?

    Labour is no longer the party of the trade union movement. So many have become unaffiliated, a few are openly hostile, a couple of those remaining in the camp (Unite especially) need to be ejected. If the hard left unionists dislike this reality, why did they all disaffiliate and spin out into bullshit like TUSC?
    Polls show quite strong support for the strikers, and even the vox pops at railway stations are surprisingly supportive. People understand that if the unionised workers get screwed, the non-unionised will do even worse.
    I'm not so confident. Sadly the "I Me Mine" mentality is hard baked into the public psyche. Tories up Labour down whilst all this is going on.

    The principle should be simple - people deserve a pay rise. But we can't give everyone a pay rise so instead we go after the driver of the need for such rises and squash the energy bill spike.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 46,536

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Southam Observer does Billie Myers.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 9,513
    edited August 3
    Isn't there a twitter bot that posts tweets deleted by MPs?

    If she'd tried to delete it from her tweet history then it would only have drawn attention to it.

    Edit: Yes. Yes there is. https://mobile.twitter.com/deletedbymps
  • kjhkjh Posts: 7,399

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    I am no Truss fan, but I wonder what saddo found that? There really are people with such sad lives that they spend hours trawling through opponents old tweets from a decade ago to find a tweet that was based on the passing of a celebrity that at that time most people did not know was a pedo.
    Good grief, can you imagine the frothing rage the Sun, Mail and Express would get themselves into if that tweet had been from Starmer?
    QTWAIN.

    When he passed it wasn't public knowledge that he was a paedo, that came out post-mortem. That a politician would say RIP to a celebrity is neither here nor there.

    What's far more concerning is those who did know or see the evidence he was a paedo but did nothing about it, or covered it up.
    You are right (see my other post), but the papers would still do it. Not fair, but that is the danger of posting to Twitter.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,054
    edited August 3
    eek said:

    Carnyx said:

    Pulpstar said:

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    How many hours would that take, or if it was to be done in quick time I presume it'd need an IT professional. Quite honestly there's better use of people's time and money than going through all their old tweets and eliminating ones that might be inconvienient.
    Using the same account (by renaming) for general stuff, then UKG business, and now party election business, too, I see. Not a good principle in any walk of life.
    It's her personal account so I'm not surprised it works like that and there are benefits (for her) from doing so as it maximises her audience / reach).

    So for another example Donald Trump using his personal account rather than the one set up for a US President to use (obviously if he was re-elected he would be using the US President account this time round).
    In 2012, Boris Johnson, who’d registered @MayorOfLondon back in 2008 or 2009, changed his account name to @BorisJohnson to use for his re-election campaign.

    It was one of the first Twitter faux-pas, and he had to recant the change and set up a new account (without 250k followers) for his personal campaign use.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2012/mar/20/boris-johnson-mayoral-twitter-account

    Since then, politicians have had to keep one account for their personal use, and institutions keep another for elected officials to use in their role.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 4,668
    kjh said:

    Sandpit said:

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    Can everyone agree that Tweets so old as to have been sent from a Blackberry, are not relevant to anything?
    Yep and as Nigel says it is sad someone trawled through tweets and thought this was worth publicising. It is however a lesson about Twitter if you have ambitions in the public life. At the time this was a perfectly innocent tweet.
    I find the tweet quite shocking. Shocking that the worst a trawl of her tweets found was her noting the death of a local pop celeb who at the time was primarily known for being on the telly and his charity work. She’s been in Cabinet for years and led a life before politics. If this is the worst dirt on Truss that can be found, we might all need to recalibrate our expectations of her.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 44,323

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
    Gordon Brown
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Is it because I lied when I was seventeen?
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Even when the sun is shining
    I can't avoid the lightning

    Sums up his Premiership really.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 22,323
    edited August 3

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    I am no Truss fan, but I wonder what saddo found that? There really are people with such sad lives that they spend hours trawling through opponents old tweets from a decade ago to find a tweet that was based on the passing of a celebrity that at that time most people did not know was a pedo.
    Good grief, can you imagine the frothing rage the Sun, Mail and Express would get themselves into if that tweet had been from Starmer?
    QTWAIN.

    When he passed it wasn't public knowledge that he was a paedo, that came out post-mortem. That a politician would say RIP to a celebrity is neither here nor there.

    What's far more concerning is those who did know or see the evidence he was a paedo but did nothing about it, or covered it up.
    QTWAIN?

    You cannot imagine the frothing rage the Sun, Mail and Express would get themselves into if that tweet had been from Starmer?

    And I always thought you had a good imagination... but maybe that was just when it came to sunlit Brexit uplands ;-)
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 7,115
    DavidL said:

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
    Gordon Brown
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Is it because I lied when I was seventeen?
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Even when the sun is shining
    I can't avoid the lightning

    Sums up his Premiership really.
    Though if Prime Ministerial lying was what caused rain, we'd currently be experiencing a flood that not even Noah's Ark could save us from.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 22,323
    DavidL said:

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
    Gordon Brown
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Is it because I lied when I was seventeen?
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Even when the sun is shining
    I can't avoid the lightning

    Sums up his Premiership really.
    Still rather have Brown than the current incumbent though.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 23,489

    DavidL said:

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
    Gordon Brown
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Is it because I lied when I was seventeen?
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Even when the sun is shining
    I can't avoid the lightning

    Sums up his Premiership really.
    Still rather have Brown than the current incumbent though.
    I'd certainly rather have the problems he had than what the current government is up against. Mind you, maybe we will get bank runs at some point in the next couple of years.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 18,308

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    I am no Truss fan, but I wonder what saddo found that? There really are people with such sad lives that they spend hours trawling through opponents old tweets from a decade ago to find a tweet that was based on the passing of a celebrity that at that time most people did not know was a pedo.
    Good grief, can you imagine the frothing rage the Sun, Mail and Express would get themselves into if that tweet had been from Starmer?
    QTWAIN.

    When he passed it wasn't public knowledge that he was a paedo, that came out post-mortem. That a politician would say RIP to a celebrity is neither here nor there.

    What's far more concerning is those who did know or see the evidence he was a paedo but did nothing about it, or covered it up.
    That post is disgraceful.

    ‘When he passed’ is the sort of euphemistic crap imported from the US that must be fought with might and main. The disgusting old paedo DIED.
    CARKED IT.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 42,730

    Icarus said:

    IanB2 said:

    Third rate like Truss

    You are being generous to Truss. A third rate ship of the line was still a formidable weapon with 74 -80 guns usually as 2 deckers. She is closer to being an unrated Sloop.
    Its funny that the rating system leads to very inappropriate descriptions of non-ship characteristics. A third rate ship of the line was a superb weapon of war. as you say.
    There's a large number of nautical terms from the age of sail still in regular use that no longer have quite the same meaning.
    Slush fund; clean slate; bitter end ... etc.

    Most people know where copper bottomed originated, but how many would have got the three above without looking them up ?

  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 22,323
    tlg86 said:

    DavidL said:

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
    Gordon Brown
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Is it because I lied when I was seventeen?
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Even when the sun is shining
    I can't avoid the lightning

    Sums up his Premiership really.
    Still rather have Brown than the current incumbent though.
    I'd certainly rather have the problems he had than what the current government is up against. Mind you, maybe we will get bank runs at some point in the next couple of years.
    We'll be facing 17% inflation more like:

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/03/inflation-will-soar-to-astronomical-levels-over-next-year-thinktank-warns
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 31,220

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    I am no Truss fan, but I wonder what saddo found that? There really are people with such sad lives that they spend hours trawling through opponents old tweets from a decade ago to find a tweet that was based on the passing of a celebrity that at that time most people did not know was a pedo.
    Good grief, can you imagine the frothing rage the Sun, Mail and Express would get themselves into if that tweet had been from Starmer?
    QTWAIN.

    When he passed it wasn't public knowledge that he was a paedo, that came out post-mortem. That a politician would say RIP to a celebrity is neither here nor there.

    What's far more concerning is those who did know or see the evidence he was a paedo but did nothing about it, or covered it up.
    That post is disgraceful.

    ‘When he passed’ is the sort of euphemistic crap imported from the US that must be fought with might and main. The disgusting old paedo DIED.
    Although it doesn't address the UK/US usage, it's interesting to see 'when he passed' in Google NGrams:
    https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=when+he+passed&year_start=1800&year_end=2019&corpus=26&smoothing=3

    Usage dipped down until 1980, then increased.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 18,804

    Why was no request made to EDF to keep the two nuclears at Hinkley B in service for another two years, rather than shutting them this week and losing a gigawatt of power? A delay was among the options presented in the Government’s “worst-case” modelling for a crisis this winter.

    Telegraph

    FFS

    Boris Johnson asleep on the job?
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 35,987
    Talking of a bounce for the new leader, and following on from my hot take from the membership front line, where I said that all of my mate's friends were for Rishi, I now think that if he gets it (big if, obvs) then he will have a large bounce as people might think (aided by Rishi's team if they know what's good for them) that he was the nice bloke who handed out free money while everyone else was trying to stop him doing so.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 42,730

    Foxy said:

    I see this as being a major issue facing Starmer at the moment: the Tories are currently repelling many voters who might consider voting for them. That's half of Starmer's job done. What he's not done is solidly convince those voters repelled by the Tories to vote Labour. Yet.

    And *if* the new Conservative leader can attract back a lot of those voters, Starmer's job is suddenly much harder again.

    IMO Starmer really needs to set forth a positive vision and policies, and have his shadow cabinet pound out that vision and policies at every interview.

    Instead, Labour seems internally consumed by the strikes.

    On the strikes, I think there are two drivers.

    One - most working people aren't supporting the strikers. Most working people are not union members and see those who are as a bit entitled. So to go out and openly support them is to stand against most working people and thus Labour voters.
    Two - most of the unions are unaffiliated to Labour and openly against Starmer. Why do politically difficult things when the people you would be doing it for oppose you?

    Labour is no longer the party of the trade union movement. So many have become unaffiliated, a few are openly hostile, a couple of those remaining in the camp (Unite especially) need to be ejected. If the hard left unionists dislike this reality, why did they all disaffiliate and spin out into bullshit like TUSC?
    Polls show quite strong support for the strikers, and even the vox pops at railway stations are surprisingly supportive. People understand that if the unionised workers get screwed, the non-unionised will do even worse.
    I'm not so confident. Sadly the "I Me Mine" mentality is hard baked into the public psyche. Tories up Labour down whilst all this is going on.

    The principle should be simple - people deserve a pay rise. But we can't give everyone a pay rise so instead we go after the driver of the need for such rises and squash the energy bill spike.
    Though the reality is that periods of persistent high inflation greatly increase pay differentials between those with and without bargaining power.
    Deserve doesn't come into it.

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/03/inflation-will-soar-to-astronomical-levels-over-next-year-thinktank-warns
    ...NIESR said gas price rises and the escalating cost of food would send inflation to 11% before the end of the year while the retail prices index (RPI), which is used to set rail fares and student loans repayments, is expected to hit 17.7%...
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 44,323

    DavidL said:

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
    Gordon Brown
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Is it because I lied when I was seventeen?
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Even when the sun is shining
    I can't avoid the lightning

    Sums up his Premiership really.
    Though if Prime Ministerial lying was what caused rain, we'd currently be experiencing a flood that not even Noah's Ark could save us from.
    Very true. I vaguely recall in one of the early Pratchetts there was a lorry driver who was (unknown to him) the son of a rain god and it rained everywhere he went. That might explain it better.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 23,135
    Well there's full employment and good pay rises.

    But the Guardian considers them bad things when the private sector working class get them.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 9,513
    edited August 3

    DavidL said:

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
    Gordon Brown
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Is it because I lied when I was seventeen?
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Even when the sun is shining
    I can't avoid the lightning

    Sums up his Premiership really.
    Though if Prime Ministerial lying was what caused rain, we'd currently be experiencing a flood that not even Noah's Ark could save us from.
    It wasn't lying, it was his countenance. If ever there was a countenance made for rain it was gloomy Gordon's glowering gaze.

    The weather had to save us from the dissonance of seeing him in the sunshine.

    Anyway, he seems happier in retirement. At least, his brooding presence across the Forth from me hasn't brought years of unending rain.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 18,308

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    I am no Truss fan, but I wonder what saddo found that? There really are people with such sad lives that they spend hours trawling through opponents old tweets from a decade ago to find a tweet that was based on the passing of a celebrity that at that time most people did not know was a pedo.
    Good grief, can you imagine the frothing rage the Sun, Mail and Express would get themselves into if that tweet had been from Starmer?
    QTWAIN.

    When he passed it wasn't public knowledge that he was a paedo, that came out post-mortem. That a politician would say RIP to a celebrity is neither here nor there.

    What's far more concerning is those who did know or see the evidence he was a paedo but did nothing about it, or covered it up.
    That post is disgraceful.

    ‘When he passed’ is the sort of euphemistic crap imported from the US that must be fought with might and main. The disgusting old paedo DIED.
    Although it doesn't address the UK/US usage, it's interesting to see 'when he passed' in Google NGrams:
    https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=when+he+passed&year_start=1800&year_end=2019&corpus=26&smoothing=3

    Usage dipped down until 1980, then increased.
    Saying 'passed on' or 'passed away' may have come from America, but a very long time ago. It's only 'passed' on its own that's a recent American intruder. It sounds quite stupid really, like they missed a question on Mastermind.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,054

    Well there's full employment and good pay rises.

    But the Guardian considers them bad things when the private sector working class get them.
    If FoM were still in place, there would be massive pressure on the minimum wage and housing costs right now, alongside rising unemployment.

    The absence of these, of course, doesn’t make the news.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 23,135
    Andy_JS said:

    Why was no request made to EDF to keep the two nuclears at Hinkley B in service for another two years, rather than shutting them this week and losing a gigawatt of power? A delay was among the options presented in the Government’s “worst-case” modelling for a crisis this winter.

    Telegraph

    FFS

    Boris Johnson asleep on the job?
    Is no one else in Whitehall capable of thinking for themselves and making decisions ?

    However competent and hard working the man at the top is they cannot and should not be making all the decisions themselves.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 24,543
    Column, on the third candidate in the Tory leadership race and Truss's biggest rival - gravity. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/aug/03/boris-johnson-liz-truss-tory-members
  • CookieCookie Posts: 7,362
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
    Gordon Brown
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Is it because I lied when I was seventeen?
    Why Does It Always Rain on Me?
    Even when the sun is shining
    I can't avoid the lightning

    Sums up his Premiership really.
    Though if Prime Ministerial lying was what caused rain, we'd currently be experiencing a flood that not even Noah's Ark could save us from.
    Very true. I vaguely recall in one of the early Pratchetts there was a lorry driver who was (unknown to him) the son of a rain god and it rained everywhere he went. That might explain it better.
    I think that was Douglas Adams.
    I've a feeling it was So Long and Thanks for All the Fish. The fourth book in the hitchhikers' trilogy.
    One of the happiest books ever written. I always think Adams must have been in an unusually good place when he wrote that.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 34,749
    Tory leadership race ‘where we are’ update.







  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 8,095
    From John Harris too. I seem to recall he was something of a Leave hero during the Brexit campaign - the Guardian leftie who understood why the lower orders were disgruntled and disenfranchised by the status quo.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 44,323

    Well there's full employment and good pay rises.

    But the Guardian considers them bad things when the private sector working class get them.
    Oh and there are record exports to the EU, but I can't find that on the list strangely enough.
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 1,929

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Rainfall across England and Wales in July was just 31% of average levels, the lowest for at least two decades.

    https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadukp/charts/hadukp_daily_plots.html

    Looking back through that data it's notable how wet the month of July was while Brown was PM. 2007 191% of average, 2008 147%, 2009 195%. What a dreary run.
    Brown turned Scottish weather into British weather.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 42,730

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    I am no Truss fan, but I wonder what saddo found that? There really are people with such sad lives that they spend hours trawling through opponents old tweets from a decade ago to find a tweet that was based on the passing of a celebrity that at that time most people did not know was a pedo.
    Good grief, can you imagine the frothing rage the Sun, Mail and Express would get themselves into if that tweet had been from Starmer?
    QTWAIN.

    When he passed it wasn't public knowledge that he was a paedo, that came out post-mortem. That a politician would say RIP to a celebrity is neither here nor there.

    What's far more concerning is those who did know or see the evidence he was a paedo but did nothing about it, or covered it up.
    QTWAIN?

    You cannot imagine the frothing rage the Sun, Mail and Express would get themselves into if that tweet had been from Starmer?

    Along with half of PB.

    It's not as though anyone's arguing this is disqualificatory. Though it might prompt those who admire her unfiltered nature to think about the potential downside as well.

  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 9,347

    On another note, I so miss the rain. It’s really eating into me now. The drying out of everything is just horrible to see. It’s almost physical - like I can feel it happening. Water is life.

    Southam Observer does Billie Myers.
    It will rain again soon, I'm going to Devon for a holiday...

    Seriously though, it will rain again soon. The westerlies will be back driving in the wet weather systems from the west.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 3,692
    On topic, the divergence in polling could be the public saying, "ask a silly question ..."

    I can't think of anything as meaningless as silly season mid-term VI polls when the governing party is between leaders.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 7,362

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    I am no Truss fan, but I wonder what saddo found that? There really are people with such sad lives that they spend hours trawling through opponents old tweets from a decade ago to find a tweet that was based on the passing of a celebrity that at that time most people did not know was a pedo.
    Good grief, can you imagine the frothing rage the Sun, Mail and Express would get themselves into if that tweet had been from Starmer?
    QTWAIN.

    When he passed it wasn't public knowledge that he was a paedo, that came out post-mortem. That a politician would say RIP to a celebrity is neither here nor there.

    What's far more concerning is those who did know or see the evidence he was a paedo but did nothing about it, or covered it up.
    That post is disgraceful.

    ‘When he passed’ is the sort of euphemistic crap imported from the US that must be fought with might and main. The disgusting old paedo DIED.
    No it isn't. A slightly old-fashioned euphemism for death was used. It doesn't imply anything in particular about the man himself.
    Or else there is a particularly low bar for disgrace nowadays.
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 3,077
    Carnyx said:

    Pulpstar said:

    eek said:

    You would have thought someone would have spent a while checking Liz's twitter for awkward tweets


    How many hours would that take, or if it was to be done in quick time I presume it'd need an IT professional.
    There's (free) software available to download all the tweets from a user's timeline. For someone who knows what they're doing it'd be an hour or so's work to set it up, and then it's running cost-free from then on. It's the sort of thing that every Fleet Street newsroom should have installed tbh.
    Does that erase all, or just between certain dates? One would assume the latter. Not very helpful deleting the Savile one if it wipes your current campaigning tweets.
    Nonono, “download” as in “a tool for a journalist or campaigner to find all Liz Truss’s past tweets and store a copy on their own computer”. Not as in “erase”.

This discussion has been closed.