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A Tory coronation? – politicalbetting.com

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    turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 15,206
    MikeL said:

    Rory hasn't holed a single putt.

    With average putting he would be three or maybe four ahead.

    The pedant in me says that cannot be true, or he’d still be on the first green, endlessly going back and forth...
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,432
    OT Open golf: Cameron Smith has joined Rory in the lead.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,909

    Some of you have very good employers. My firm's idea of being "progressive" is to give us a 2hr webinar on how to deal with stress.

    My American international megacorp's compulsory training gave us a certificate in dealing with an active shooter.
    Do the Americans realise, that this is very much only ever an American problem? Even other countries with lots of guns, still manage to avoid mentally ill people shooting up random places on a regular basis.
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,858

    Well England and the ICC have fucked West Indian cricket.

    England are poised to deliver a crushing blow to West Indies cricket and their own travelling supporters with no men’s Test tour of the Caribbean scheduled for at least the next five years.

    According to a draft of the future tours programme for the period May 2023 to February 2027 – seen by the Guardian and due to be finalised at the ICC’s AGM in Birmingham this month – the England men’s team are scheduled to play just eight white-ball fixtures in the Caribbean during this time.

    These come in a single tour early in the cycle – straight after the 50-over World Cup in India next year and thus likely to involve a weakened squad – with England’s only other visit thereafter being the T20 World Cup in 2024. It leaves a minimum five-year gap between Test tours of the Caribbean for England after their 2-1 defeat in March.

    This is likely to dismay the hordes of England supporters who flock to the region for the trip of a lifetime – around 10,000 were present in Barbados this year, with about 3,000 for the Tests in Antigua and Grenada – and the financial knock-on effect to Cricket West Indies will be significant.

    England Test tours are worth at least $10m (£8.4m) to CWI (nearly double when combined with limited-overs cricket). There is also a larger impact, with recent visits to have featured both Test and white-ball cricket estimated to have been worth up to $100m to the region’s economy.

    While bilateral internationals can be loss-makers for West Indies, England tours remain a significant revenue source for CWI in a global cricket economy that is skewed heavily against such a high-cost, low-income part of the world. West Indies have more than proved their strength as opponents too, with England registering just one Test series win in the Caribbean since 1968.


    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/17/england-fans-face-minimum-five-year-wait-for-west-indies-test-tour

    That's doubly shameful because the West Indies helped to dig the ECB out of a financial hole by going ahead with the tour during Covid in 2020.

    This is only the beginning though. As the T20 franchise competitions expand Test cricket will be shunted to the margins.
    There’s a decent conservative (but not liberal or libertarian) case that Test Cricket should be subsidised.

    Along with things like pubs, rural post offices, abandoned parish churches, voluntary stream train revivalists, historic county borders etc etc.
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    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,124

    All we wfh-lovers have rediscovered love of the office this week - air conditioning beckons. We'd stay all night Monday if we could.

    My garden office has an air source heat pump that works as an air conditioner when it's hot. It's coming into its own right now. I wonder if the whole family might be sleeping in it on Monday night...
  • Options
    OnboardG1OnboardG1 Posts: 1,291
    edited July 2022

    All we wfh-lovers have rediscovered love of the office this week - air conditioning beckons. We'd stay all night Monday if we could.

    My garden office has an air source heat pump that works as an air conditioner when it's hot. It's coming into its own right now. I wonder if the whole family might be sleeping in it on Monday night...
    Air source heat pumps that use direct cycle rather than hooking into the hot water system are brilliant for this sort of condition. A YT channel I follow pointed out that you can easily do a like for like swap of air-conditioning systems in the US for a multi-modal heat pump and get AC and cheaper heating. It's just a bit tricky to do that in the UK because most houses aren't set up for that sort of heating system.
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    ClippPClippP Posts: 1,688
    Foxy said:

    Cyclefree said:

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
    You don't need to rely on Badenoch's statement. You just need to look at what Mordaunt said twice on the record in the Commons on the issue and what she has said in recent days about what her position always is. To put it at its politest they don't match. You can also compare what she has said in recent days about the inquiry into girls transitioning she says she commissioned and what the Department wrote at the time to those who inquired about what the inquiry she commissioned was actually about. Again, there is a mismatch.

    There is also a separate issue about possible conflicts of interest. Mordaunt's brother is an LGBT activist. He has been busy deleting some of his tweets on this topic on recent days. According to reports, he was with Mordaunt a lot at the Commons when she was Minister responsible for this topic. What exactly was his role and input, if any? It may have been nothing. But family members who do not stand for office or who do not have formal role as advisors should be careful about staying out of political issues and Ministers should ensure that they do.

    The broad issue with Mordaunt is her judgment. Someone who was really fit to be PM would not have allowed herself to get into such a mess over this. It shows poor judgment and inexperience at best and at worst a lack of integrity.
    Mostly I think it shows a HYUFD like stubbornness about admitting she was wrong.
    So Mordaunt may be considered to be a real Tory?????
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,612

    Well England and the ICC have fucked West Indian cricket.

    England are poised to deliver a crushing blow to West Indies cricket and their own travelling supporters with no men’s Test tour of the Caribbean scheduled for at least the next five years.

    According to a draft of the future tours programme for the period May 2023 to February 2027 – seen by the Guardian and due to be finalised at the ICC’s AGM in Birmingham this month – the England men’s team are scheduled to play just eight white-ball fixtures in the Caribbean during this time.

    These come in a single tour early in the cycle – straight after the 50-over World Cup in India next year and thus likely to involve a weakened squad – with England’s only other visit thereafter being the T20 World Cup in 2024. It leaves a minimum five-year gap between Test tours of the Caribbean for England after their 2-1 defeat in March.

    This is likely to dismay the hordes of England supporters who flock to the region for the trip of a lifetime – around 10,000 were present in Barbados this year, with about 3,000 for the Tests in Antigua and Grenada – and the financial knock-on effect to Cricket West Indies will be significant.

    England Test tours are worth at least $10m (£8.4m) to CWI (nearly double when combined with limited-overs cricket). There is also a larger impact, with recent visits to have featured both Test and white-ball cricket estimated to have been worth up to $100m to the region’s economy.

    While bilateral internationals can be loss-makers for West Indies, England tours remain a significant revenue source for CWI in a global cricket economy that is skewed heavily against such a high-cost, low-income part of the world. West Indies have more than proved their strength as opponents too, with England registering just one Test series win in the Caribbean since 1968.


    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/17/england-fans-face-minimum-five-year-wait-for-west-indies-test-tour

    So United Kingdom screws West Indies yet again? And do NOT mean just by sticking their wickets!

    VERY old story.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,013
    Finally, a solution to the chemtrails problem:


  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,124
    OnboardG1 said:

    Kemi would be the best for the country.

    I had been skeptical about her before the contest because I’d heard bad things, but as far as I can now tell it was fake news.

    Rishi is a declinist from Davos.
    Penny is inept, I think.
    Truss is slightly mad.

    Kemi would represent a clean break and a sign that the country is ready to move on.

    Move on to what though? 'Culture wars' and vacuous nonsense like this:

    "As PM I would fix the way Government machine works."
    "doing less for better"
    "My government will discard the priorities of Twitter and focus on the people's priorities."
    "We need to do things differently in government."


    And, rather wonderfully:

    "If you are telling the public what they want to hear, then you only help yourself."
    They are sound bites but not vacuous

    1/2/4 basically say that the government isn’t good at delivering and needs to be reformed so it is more efficient

    3/5 say that a government needs a vision - that it shouldn’t be responding just to what Twitter/the media says nor what they thing the public want to hear … they need to focus on doing what they believe

    I struggle to see how this is anything other than a platitude farm.

    Note: The you is the royal you referring to Badenoch, not any specific poster.
    1. Everyone says this. "Fix the way government works" has been a filler line since my Dad was a babe.
    2. Doing less for better is the political equivalent of "Work smarter not harder". It is an empty phrase unless you can reasonably explain what you aren't going to do.
    3. I'm not sure the present government, or any government thus far, has given a damn about Twitter. Even right-wing twitter. It's a strawman. State what you believe people's priorities to be and then explain how you will address them. Otherwise this is meaningless.
    4. Again, unless you specify "different" this is meaningless. You could invade France or scrap the state pension and it would be different.
    5. This is a fine sentiment, but you've promised tax cuts and not explained what you'll cut to pay the piper. Details.
    We regularly drag Starmer on here (often rightly) for talking in these sorts of soundbites without presenting a compelling vision and this isn't any different. All I get is a sort of ill-defined small-stateism with no meat on it. That could change tonight at the debate but I bet it doesn't.
    It's not even obvious that doing less better is a good choice. There are plenty of things that I would rather have the government do badly than not even try to do them at all.
  • Options
    pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,132
    Stereodog said:

    At the risk of being torn asunder I’m surprised that no one on here is talking about portable air conditioning units. You can buy one for about the price of a couple of nights in an air conditioned hotel. I got one after being nagged by Canadian husband (every house has A/C) and honestly I wouldn’t look back. Yes they’re bulky and noisy but they make our flat tolerable even in this heat. Air coolers are no good because they just add humidity into the room.

    I used to have one but I couldn't stand the bloody racket and, in any case, it was very heavy and hopelessly difficult to drain the water from. Perhaps the technology has improved in the last few years to make them more practical, but I doubt it.
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,980
    rcs1000 said:

    Finally, a solution to the chemtrails problem:


    Good god.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,329
    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Finally, a solution to the chemtrails problem:


    Good god.
    I blame the heat.
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    solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,623
    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Finally, a solution to the chemtrails problem:


    Good god.
    I liked the specificness of vinegar.

    I want to know which other liquids she tried before deciding it was vinegar that works.
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    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,612
    rcs1000 said:

    Finally, a solution to the chemtrails problem:


    So who's HER first choice for next PM? Seems more likely to be paid-up Con Party member than RCS.
  • Options
    OnboardG1OnboardG1 Posts: 1,291

    OnboardG1 said:

    Kemi would be the best for the country.

    I had been skeptical about her before the contest because I’d heard bad things, but as far as I can now tell it was fake news.

    Rishi is a declinist from Davos.
    Penny is inept, I think.
    Truss is slightly mad.

    Kemi would represent a clean break and a sign that the country is ready to move on.

    Move on to what though? 'Culture wars' and vacuous nonsense like this:

    "As PM I would fix the way Government machine works."
    "doing less for better"
    "My government will discard the priorities of Twitter and focus on the people's priorities."
    "We need to do things differently in government."


    And, rather wonderfully:

    "If you are telling the public what they want to hear, then you only help yourself."
    They are sound bites but not vacuous

    1/2/4 basically say that the government isn’t good at delivering and needs to be reformed so it is more efficient

    3/5 say that a government needs a vision - that it shouldn’t be responding just to what Twitter/the media says nor what they thing the public want to hear … they need to focus on doing what they believe

    I struggle to see how this is anything other than a platitude farm.

    Note: The you is the royal you referring to Badenoch, not any specific poster.
    1. Everyone says this. "Fix the way government works" has been a filler line since my Dad was a babe.
    2. Doing less for better is the political equivalent of "Work smarter not harder". It is an empty phrase unless you can reasonably explain what you aren't going to do.
    3. I'm not sure the present government, or any government thus far, has given a damn about Twitter. Even right-wing twitter. It's a strawman. State what you believe people's priorities to be and then explain how you will address them. Otherwise this is meaningless.
    4. Again, unless you specify "different" this is meaningless. You could invade France or scrap the state pension and it would be different.
    5. This is a fine sentiment, but you've promised tax cuts and not explained what you'll cut to pay the piper. Details.
    We regularly drag Starmer on here (often rightly) for talking in these sorts of soundbites without presenting a compelling vision and this isn't any different. All I get is a sort of ill-defined small-stateism with no meat on it. That could change tonight at the debate but I bet it doesn't.
    It's not even obvious that doing less better is a good choice. There are plenty of things that I would rather have the government do badly than not even try to do them at all.
    Oh, I agree, I don't think there's anything you can reasonably stop doing. However, that's a distinct point in itself. Whether you agree with her small-state thinking or not, her pronouncements to date are void of meaning except at the most surface level. It's similar to Johnson, except he at least put the odd wild promise in place and stitched it together with a dodgy narrative. Most of the candidates have just stitched together a word cloud from a con member focus group and replaced any actual policy proposals with bits from it.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,329

    Well England and the ICC have fucked West Indian cricket.

    England are poised to deliver a crushing blow to West Indies cricket and their own travelling supporters with no men’s Test tour of the Caribbean scheduled for at least the next five years.

    According to a draft of the future tours programme for the period May 2023 to February 2027 – seen by the Guardian and due to be finalised at the ICC’s AGM in Birmingham this month – the England men’s team are scheduled to play just eight white-ball fixtures in the Caribbean during this time.

    These come in a single tour early in the cycle – straight after the 50-over World Cup in India next year and thus likely to involve a weakened squad – with England’s only other visit thereafter being the T20 World Cup in 2024. It leaves a minimum five-year gap between Test tours of the Caribbean for England after their 2-1 defeat in March.

    This is likely to dismay the hordes of England supporters who flock to the region for the trip of a lifetime – around 10,000 were present in Barbados this year, with about 3,000 for the Tests in Antigua and Grenada – and the financial knock-on effect to Cricket West Indies will be significant.

    England Test tours are worth at least $10m (£8.4m) to CWI (nearly double when combined with limited-overs cricket). There is also a larger impact, with recent visits to have featured both Test and white-ball cricket estimated to have been worth up to $100m to the region’s economy.

    While bilateral internationals can be loss-makers for West Indies, England tours remain a significant revenue source for CWI in a global cricket economy that is skewed heavily against such a high-cost, low-income part of the world. West Indies have more than proved their strength as opponents too, with England registering just one Test series win in the Caribbean since 1968.


    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/17/england-fans-face-minimum-five-year-wait-for-west-indies-test-tour

    So United Kingdom screws West Indies yet again? And do NOT mean just by sticking their wickets!

    VERY old story.
    One of my pals is 40 in 2 years time and we thought that a caribbean test would be an excellent way to mark the landmark. Damn.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,931
    edited July 2022
    pigeon said:

    Stereodog said:

    At the risk of being torn asunder I’m surprised that no one on here is talking about portable air conditioning units. You can buy one for about the price of a couple of nights in an air conditioned hotel. I got one after being nagged by Canadian husband (every house has A/C) and honestly I wouldn’t look back. Yes they’re bulky and noisy but they make our flat tolerable even in this heat. Air coolers are no good because they just add humidity into the room.

    I used to have one but I couldn't stand the bloody racket and, in any case, it was very heavy and hopelessly difficult to drain the water from. Perhaps the technology has improved in the last few years to make them more practical, but I doubt it.
    Got one going in here, the room is about 25 or so.

    Downstairs with no aircon, but blinds shut has stayed below 22 all day (Outside is 31)
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,909
    Great catch from Stokes. Finally broken this partnership.
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    StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 7,064
    ydoethur said:

    FTP:

    Farooq said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    Scandinavia and Holland would beg to differ. There people's life chsnces are tilted in their favour.

    Despite the rhetoric, you're much less likely to be lucky in terms of social mobility in the U.S., because in fact most of the time, it's not actually luck.
    It is good to want to uplift people, but sometimes you can't. All you can really do is offer assistance and cooperation in their own decision to improve their life.
    There was a horrific and funny (if you like graveyard humour)story about the Nazi attempts to deal with social misfits - who were just as precedent then as today.

    They actually started from the premise of “saving” Aryans. So they tried all kinds of programs to rehabilitate alcoholics, support problem families etc. all surprisingly liberal and modern, really…

    The story went downhill from there. And ended up where you’d expect a Nazi social program to end up.
    The Nazis were quite good at some things. The above st
    nova said:

    Jonathan said:

    Cookie said:

    Jesus Christ.
    In case anyone was feeling unduly chipper, let me relate a conversation I just had.
    Walking down Great Ducie Street, Manchester, I saw an altercation between a gaunt looking fella in a tracksuit and a shabby looking old woman. I caught the eye of the fella, who apologised, and, in step, going in the same direction, explained himself: that was his mum, she was on heroin and couldn't sort himself out, and he was looking like being made homeless because she kept going round to his flat and causing trouble. And he was almost totally blind, as was his sister, having been born to a woman on heroin. And he had almost no teeth, since being hit in the face with a tire iron six months ago. And just one thing after another. Here was a fella who life took one gigantic shit on at the start followed by a succession of smaller but still substantial ones regularly along the way.
    I say this not to make any particular point but just to reflect on how unbelievably awful some people have it.

    A terrible tale. When I hear it, it reminds me why I vote Labour, that capitalism is not enough and that socialism would make a big difference. Capitalism is not kind to people who have bad luck.

    However, I also remember that history shows us that no single political ideology or that government has all the answers. So it's not as simple as voting left and all will be well. We need balance.

    So I really hope, somehow miraculously, our overall political culture manages to extract the best of right and left and maybe some new ideas and finds a way to make a better life for people with terrible luck.
    It's not really possible to make life better for people who don't have any luck. The best that can be done for those people is to believe that their luck can change.
    That's a pretty shocking statement.

    If a family member came round to my house and started causing trouble, the police might get involved, but there's virtually no chance my neighbours complaints would get me thrown out of a house I own.

    When was the last time you were in a situation where you could have been hit in the face by a tire iron? Someone in the situation he's described is much more likely to be a victim of violence.

    Is there no world in which his mum was given more support as a heroin user when she was pregnant, or as a new mum?

    It may be that random luck pushes one person closer to the edge than another, but there are plenty of ways that a society can help make sure the edge is just that bit further away.
    If the person is set on reaching that edge, they will do so. Others should, as I've said, be there to help that guy turn it around when he is ready to do so, but it has to start with him, and the starting point is his own belief that it can get just a little better, and easier, than it is today.
    I'm fascinated to know where the original comment was going, Ken.
    I thought someone might be.

    The Nazi emphasis on the healthy body, even on bodily perfection, was a good thing imo, which they completely ruined, and effectively abolished from polite discourse, by misidentifying the cause of it as racial, when it was environmental, and within that, primarily nutritional. And when the Nazis got something wrong, boy did they get it wrong.
    Jesus Christ.

    Do you have a perfect body, LuckyGuy?
    And if not, why not?
    Unbelievable.

    I'd have been wheeled into the gas chamber - no doubt.
    Case in point of what I mean.

    And no, I don't have the perfect body, but physical perfection should be seen merely as an outward sign of perfect health, which is something we all deserve, whatever our startinf point. And that is a good aspiration. And I don't mean a westernised view of perfection being applied universally, I mean good diets creating healthy individuals of all races and colours.
    Leni Riefenstahl had similar thoughts about the Nuba.
    Indeed.

    Western society is obsessed with body image to a degree which makes the Nazis looked bored by it, though.
    Girls (and probably some guys) often use make up to simulate high cheekbones, and that's fine and totally their prerogative, but the well developed bone structure that they're painting on is something that comes with generational good nutrition. That's the 'physical perfection' I'm referring to, not plucking your nostrils and getting injected with botulism.
    Injected with *botulism?*!!!!
    Botox is derived from the same toxin that causes botulism

    It’s his typical approach - I saw it described quite well as CMOR

    Cherrypick
    Misrepresent

    Can’t remember the other 2 so may be not that good!

  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,987
    DavidL said:

    Well England and the ICC have fucked West Indian cricket.

    England are poised to deliver a crushing blow to West Indies cricket and their own travelling supporters with no men’s Test tour of the Caribbean scheduled for at least the next five years.

    According to a draft of the future tours programme for the period May 2023 to February 2027 – seen by the Guardian and due to be finalised at the ICC’s AGM in Birmingham this month – the England men’s team are scheduled to play just eight white-ball fixtures in the Caribbean during this time.

    These come in a single tour early in the cycle – straight after the 50-over World Cup in India next year and thus likely to involve a weakened squad – with England’s only other visit thereafter being the T20 World Cup in 2024. It leaves a minimum five-year gap between Test tours of the Caribbean for England after their 2-1 defeat in March.

    This is likely to dismay the hordes of England supporters who flock to the region for the trip of a lifetime – around 10,000 were present in Barbados this year, with about 3,000 for the Tests in Antigua and Grenada – and the financial knock-on effect to Cricket West Indies will be significant.

    England Test tours are worth at least $10m (£8.4m) to CWI (nearly double when combined with limited-overs cricket). There is also a larger impact, with recent visits to have featured both Test and white-ball cricket estimated to have been worth up to $100m to the region’s economy.

    While bilateral internationals can be loss-makers for West Indies, England tours remain a significant revenue source for CWI in a global cricket economy that is skewed heavily against such a high-cost, low-income part of the world. West Indies have more than proved their strength as opponents too, with England registering just one Test series win in the Caribbean since 1968.


    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/17/england-fans-face-minimum-five-year-wait-for-west-indies-test-tour

    So United Kingdom screws West Indies yet again? And do NOT mean just by sticking their wickets!

    VERY old story.
    One of my pals is 40 in 2 years time and we thought that a caribbean test would be an excellent way to mark the landmark. Damn.
    Batting or bowling?
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,931
    Really want Mcilroy to win - just think how short his price will be at future majors.
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    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,612
    Sandpit said:

    Some of you have very good employers. My firm's idea of being "progressive" is to give us a 2hr webinar on how to deal with stress.

    My American international megacorp's compulsory training gave us a certificate in dealing with an active shooter.
    Do the Americans realise, that this is very much only ever an American problem? Even other countries with lots of guns, still manage to avoid mentally ill people shooting up random places on a regular basis.
    Hell yes. And American lawyers want to make sure that their foreign employees, consultants, etc. who come to US on company business have LESS grounds for suing them IF they get used for target practice.

    And maybe sue the National Rifle Association, Republican National Committee, their allies & paymasters instead?
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,637
    Living room temperature has topped out at 26.1degC today. Fan keeping me cool.

    However Wor Lass decided that it is fine to be outside doing some gardening and dragged me out to move some large, heavy planted-up pots. FFS. At least she hadn't watered them first.
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    pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,132
    Pulpstar said:

    Really want Mcilroy to win - just think how short his price will be at future majors.

    Not happening. He couldn't hit a bull in the butt with a bass fiddle this afternoon.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,329
    dixiedean said:

    DavidL said:

    Well England and the ICC have fucked West Indian cricket.

    England are poised to deliver a crushing blow to West Indies cricket and their own travelling supporters with no men’s Test tour of the Caribbean scheduled for at least the next five years.

    According to a draft of the future tours programme for the period May 2023 to February 2027 – seen by the Guardian and due to be finalised at the ICC’s AGM in Birmingham this month – the England men’s team are scheduled to play just eight white-ball fixtures in the Caribbean during this time.

    These come in a single tour early in the cycle – straight after the 50-over World Cup in India next year and thus likely to involve a weakened squad – with England’s only other visit thereafter being the T20 World Cup in 2024. It leaves a minimum five-year gap between Test tours of the Caribbean for England after their 2-1 defeat in March.

    This is likely to dismay the hordes of England supporters who flock to the region for the trip of a lifetime – around 10,000 were present in Barbados this year, with about 3,000 for the Tests in Antigua and Grenada – and the financial knock-on effect to Cricket West Indies will be significant.

    England Test tours are worth at least $10m (£8.4m) to CWI (nearly double when combined with limited-overs cricket). There is also a larger impact, with recent visits to have featured both Test and white-ball cricket estimated to have been worth up to $100m to the region’s economy.

    While bilateral internationals can be loss-makers for West Indies, England tours remain a significant revenue source for CWI in a global cricket economy that is skewed heavily against such a high-cost, low-income part of the world. West Indies have more than proved their strength as opponents too, with England registering just one Test series win in the Caribbean since 1968.


    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/17/england-fans-face-minimum-five-year-wait-for-west-indies-test-tour

    So United Kingdom screws West Indies yet again? And do NOT mean just by sticking their wickets!

    VERY old story.
    One of my pals is 40 in 2 years time and we thought that a caribbean test would be an excellent way to mark the landmark. Damn.
    Batting or bowling?
    Drinkling. Mainly rum with the odd pint for a bit of offspin.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,987
    Christ it's depressing.
    After Tugendhat "we need to liberate Putin's oil fields" presumably by invading Siberia or summat, now Sunak's at it.
    "Review or repeal all 2400 EU laws before the election."
    All of them? Even the sensible ones?
    At three a day? A maximum of 5 hours personal scrutiny each? If he does nowt else. No Commons time for anything else.
    Good job the economy is in such fine fettle.
  • Options
    OnboardG1OnboardG1 Posts: 1,291

    Living room temperature has topped out at 26.1degC today. Fan keeping me cool.

    However Wor Lass decided that it is fine to be outside doing some gardening and dragged me out to move some large, heavy planted-up pots. FFS. At least she hadn't watered them first.

    That's some top trolling. This is why I prefer the er... wild gardening trend. There's only so many times I can hack raspberries back before I just give up.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,329
    dixiedean said:

    Christ it's depressing.
    After Tugendhat "we need to liberate Putin's oil fields" presumably by invading Siberia or summat, now Sunak's at it.
    "Review or repeal all 2400 EU laws before the election."
    All of them? Even the sensible ones?
    At three a day? A maximum of 5 hours personal scrutiny each? If he does nowt else. No Commons time for anything else.
    Good job the economy is in such fine fettle.

    SIgh. This sort of madness is just depressing.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,031
    Scott_xP said:

    Latest @ConHome leadership run offs for the final two:

    - Rishi Sunak beats Penny Mordaunt
    - Liz Truss beats Rishi Sunak and Penny Mordaunt

    https://conservativehome.com/2022/07/17/next-tory-leader-run-offs-sunak-would-now-beat-mordaunt-truss-would-beat-both-of-them/

    Looks like a Truss v Sunak final 2 then, which Truss at present would be favourite to win but still time for Sunak to catch up
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,612

    How come Betfred restricted my account to penny stakes and let others put on £30k?

    If Rory wins Open it's going to cost us at least £750k. One golf expert in London got £30k on at 12/1

    https://twitter.com/Betfred/status/1548702683514736641

    The fix is in?

    "This bar is to be closed at once! . . . I'm shocked to find out that gambling is going on."

    "Your winnings, m'sieur."

    "Oh, thank you!"
  • Options
    pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,132
    Pulpstar said:

    pigeon said:

    Stereodog said:

    At the risk of being torn asunder I’m surprised that no one on here is talking about portable air conditioning units. You can buy one for about the price of a couple of nights in an air conditioned hotel. I got one after being nagged by Canadian husband (every house has A/C) and honestly I wouldn’t look back. Yes they’re bulky and noisy but they make our flat tolerable even in this heat. Air coolers are no good because they just add humidity into the room.

    I used to have one but I couldn't stand the bloody racket and, in any case, it was very heavy and hopelessly difficult to drain the water from. Perhaps the technology has improved in the last few years to make them more practical, but I doubt it.
    Got one going in here, the room is about 25 or so.

    Downstairs with no aircon, but blinds shut has stayed below 22 all day (Outside is 31)
    Similarly hot outside, flat rendered tolerable by keeping windows and curtains shut. None of those tricks is going to be adequate tomorrow, however, so off to hide in a hotel.

    I have discovered that there appears to be such a thing now as a portable aircon unit that doesn't have that hopeless ceremony where you have to try to lift to whole bloody thing off the floor and tip the water into the bath without breaking your back in the process. Further investigation required.
  • Options
    OnboardG1OnboardG1 Posts: 1,291
    pigeon said:

    Pulpstar said:

    pigeon said:

    Stereodog said:

    At the risk of being torn asunder I’m surprised that no one on here is talking about portable air conditioning units. You can buy one for about the price of a couple of nights in an air conditioned hotel. I got one after being nagged by Canadian husband (every house has A/C) and honestly I wouldn’t look back. Yes they’re bulky and noisy but they make our flat tolerable even in this heat. Air coolers are no good because they just add humidity into the room.

    I used to have one but I couldn't stand the bloody racket and, in any case, it was very heavy and hopelessly difficult to drain the water from. Perhaps the technology has improved in the last few years to make them more practical, but I doubt it.
    Got one going in here, the room is about 25 or so.

    Downstairs with no aircon, but blinds shut has stayed below 22 all day (Outside is 31)
    Similarly hot outside, flat rendered tolerable by keeping windows and curtains shut. None of those tricks is going to be adequate tomorrow, however, so off to hide in a hotel.

    I have discovered that there appears to be such a thing now as a portable aircon unit that doesn't have that hopeless ceremony where you have to try to lift to whole bloody thing off the floor and tip the water into the bath without breaking your back in the process. Further investigation required.
    I assume that portable air conditioners operate by sinking the heat into the water reservoir? I'm always a bit suspicious of those since the heat banked in the water needs to go somewhere, presumably back out into the room again.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,013
    edited July 2022

    Mr. Jessop, it's true renewables have been increased and evil coal has been cut.

    But I'll take dirty electricity and the lights being on over the talk there is now of lights going out over winter because ideology was put above practicality when it comes to energy. An enthusiasm for cutting power plants for 'green' reasons has not been matched by a commitment to make up the shortfall.

    More nuclear plants should have been built to help bridge the gap. But the only nuclear moves that have been made are May's terrible Chinese deal and some verbal diarrhoea from the outgoing jester.

    Hopefully everything will be fine but the fact it's even a question is alarming.

    The reason there is a risk that our lights will go out is because hydrocarbon prices have gone through the roof, because of Russia's invasion of Ukraine.

    For years, the UK imported spot LNG cargoes for $4/mmbtu, and we imported piped gas from Norway at around $7-8/mmbtu.

    Since the Russian invasion of Ukraine, spot LNG cargoes now trade at about $34-40/mmbtu, while Norwegian gas (which is on oil linked contracts) is probably $10-11.

    Ah, but what if we hadn't closed our coal plants down?

    Well, I'm afraid that shipborne coal prices have also gone through the roof. If you want a tonne of Newcastle* coal delivered in December, it will cost you more than $400. The usual price is $50-80.

    Around 10% of the world's energy came from Russia. If you stop the flow of that energy, then everyone is scrambling around to find sources of hydrocarbons. And the countries that will do the best will be those that get the greatest proportion of their energy from domestic renewables, because they won't suddenly be faced with massive energy import bills.

    * Australian Newcastle coal, the global benchmark

    Edit to add: it is sensible to have strategic reserves of gas, coal and oil, as most major developed countries do. Unfortunately, we are almost unique in having such low levels of gas storage, having (inexplicably) shut it all at exactly the same time that we increased our dependence on natural gas.
  • Options
    MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,289
    edited July 2022
    I wonder if in fact England will do a non WTC Tour to WI outside FTP - I would have thought it's quite likely.

    We always do some of those - because WTC is only 6 series total every 2 years - ie 3 per year when we actually usually play 4 - ie one outside WTC.

    And we've just done a WTC away to WI so not actually surprising we don't go there in the next 2 WTC cycles.
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,612

    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Finally, a solution to the chemtrails problem:


    Good god.
    I liked the specificness of vinegar.

    I want to know which other liquids she tried before deciding it was vinegar that works.
    Thomas Edison tested +6k fibers for filaments before HE got it right. Guessing it took her FAR fewer tries.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,031
    Foxy said:

    Cyclefree said:

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
    You don't need to rely on Badenoch's statement. You just need to look at what Mordaunt said twice on the record in the Commons on the issue and what she has said in recent days about what her position always is. To put it at its politest they don't match. You can also compare what she has said in recent days about the inquiry into girls transitioning she says she commissioned and what the Department wrote at the time to those who inquired about what the inquiry she commissioned was actually about. Again, there is a mismatch.

    There is also a separate issue about possible conflicts of interest. Mordaunt's brother is an LGBT activist. He has been busy deleting some of his tweets on this topic on recent days. According to reports, he was with Mordaunt a lot at the Commons when she was Minister responsible for this topic. What exactly was his role and input, if any? It may have been nothing. But family members who do not stand for office or who do not have formal role as advisors should be careful about staying out of political issues and Ministers should ensure that they do.

    The broad issue with Mordaunt is her judgment. Someone who was really fit to be PM would not have allowed herself to get into such a mess over this. It shows poor judgment and inexperience at best and at worst a lack of integrity.
    Mostly I think it shows a HYUFD like stubbornness about admitting she was wrong.
    No senior politician ever admits they are wrong or they are over, you might say you have changed your mind and get away with it but that is it
  • Options
    turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 15,206
    pigeon said:

    Stereodog said:

    At the risk of being torn asunder I’m surprised that no one on here is talking about portable air conditioning units. You can buy one for about the price of a couple of nights in an air conditioned hotel. I got one after being nagged by Canadian husband (every house has A/C) and honestly I wouldn’t look back. Yes they’re bulky and noisy but they make our flat tolerable even in this heat. Air coolers are no good because they just add humidity into the room.

    I used to have one but I couldn't stand the bloody racket and, in any case, it was very heavy and hopelessly difficult to drain the water from. Perhaps the technology has improved in the last few years to make them more practical, but I doubt it.
    We have one which we use to render the bedroom nice and cool for sleeping.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,712
    OnboardG1 said:

    pigeon said:

    Pulpstar said:

    pigeon said:

    Stereodog said:

    At the risk of being torn asunder I’m surprised that no one on here is talking about portable air conditioning units. You can buy one for about the price of a couple of nights in an air conditioned hotel. I got one after being nagged by Canadian husband (every house has A/C) and honestly I wouldn’t look back. Yes they’re bulky and noisy but they make our flat tolerable even in this heat. Air coolers are no good because they just add humidity into the room.

    I used to have one but I couldn't stand the bloody racket and, in any case, it was very heavy and hopelessly difficult to drain the water from. Perhaps the technology has improved in the last few years to make them more practical, but I doubt it.
    Got one going in here, the room is about 25 or so.

    Downstairs with no aircon, but blinds shut has stayed below 22 all day (Outside is 31)
    Similarly hot outside, flat rendered tolerable by keeping windows and curtains shut. None of those tricks is going to be adequate tomorrow, however, so off to hide in a hotel.

    I have discovered that there appears to be such a thing now as a portable aircon unit that doesn't have that hopeless ceremony where you have to try to lift to whole bloody thing off the floor and tip the water into the bath without breaking your back in the process. Further investigation required.
    I assume that portable air conditioners operate by sinking the heat into the water reservoir? I'm always a bit suspicious of those since the heat banked in the water needs to go somewhere, presumably back out into the room again.
    No, I think the water is just because colder air holds less moisture, so collects as condensation.
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,637
    OnboardG1 said:

    Living room temperature has topped out at 26.1degC today. Fan keeping me cool.

    However Wor Lass decided that it is fine to be outside doing some gardening and dragged me out to move some large, heavy planted-up pots. FFS. At least she hadn't watered them first.

    That's some top trolling. This is why I prefer the er... wild gardening trend. There's only so many times I can hack raspberries back before I just give up.
    I embraced "No Mow May". And kept it going through June and into July.
  • Options
    FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 3,891
    edited July 2022
    OnboardG1 said:

    pigeon said:

    Pulpstar said:

    pigeon said:

    Stereodog said:

    At the risk of being torn asunder I’m surprised that no one on here is talking about portable air conditioning units. You can buy one for about the price of a couple of nights in an air conditioned hotel. I got one after being nagged by Canadian husband (every house has A/C) and honestly I wouldn’t look back. Yes they’re bulky and noisy but they make our flat tolerable even in this heat. Air coolers are no good because they just add humidity into the room.

    I used to have one but I couldn't stand the bloody racket and, in any case, it was very heavy and hopelessly difficult to drain the water from. Perhaps the technology has improved in the last few years to make them more practical, but I doubt it.
    Got one going in here, the room is about 25 or so.

    Downstairs with no aircon, but blinds shut has stayed below 22 all day (Outside is 31)
    Similarly hot outside, flat rendered tolerable by keeping windows and curtains shut. None of those tricks is going to be adequate tomorrow, however, so off to hide in a hotel.

    I have discovered that there appears to be such a thing now as a portable aircon unit that doesn't have that hopeless ceremony where you have to try to lift to whole bloody thing off the floor and tip the water into the bath without breaking your back in the process. Further investigation required.
    I assume that portable air conditioners operate by sinking the heat into the water reservoir? I'm always a bit suspicious of those since the heat banked in the water needs to go somewhere, presumably back out into the room again.
    A hose out of the window. Noisy though.

    I bought one a week ago for my dad, just in case, and I think it will come in useful. Bungalows are difficult to keep cool and if it is 25C inside at 31C outside (as today), 41C outside isn't going to be healthy.

    I doubt there will be vast amounts of water to remove as it isn't going to be at all humid tomorrow and Tues.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,827

    OnboardG1 said:

    Living room temperature has topped out at 26.1degC today. Fan keeping me cool.

    However Wor Lass decided that it is fine to be outside doing some gardening and dragged me out to move some large, heavy planted-up pots. FFS. At least she hadn't watered them first.

    That's some top trolling. This is why I prefer the er... wild gardening trend. There's only so many times I can hack raspberries back before I just give up.
    I embraced "No Mow May". And kept it going through June and into July.
    I did that for 2 years when my council started charging for garden waste collection.
  • Options
    turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 15,206
    OnboardG1 said:

    pigeon said:

    Pulpstar said:

    pigeon said:

    Stereodog said:

    At the risk of being torn asunder I’m surprised that no one on here is talking about portable air conditioning units. You can buy one for about the price of a couple of nights in an air conditioned hotel. I got one after being nagged by Canadian husband (every house has A/C) and honestly I wouldn’t look back. Yes they’re bulky and noisy but they make our flat tolerable even in this heat. Air coolers are no good because they just add humidity into the room.

    I used to have one but I couldn't stand the bloody racket and, in any case, it was very heavy and hopelessly difficult to drain the water from. Perhaps the technology has improved in the last few years to make them more practical, but I doubt it.
    Got one going in here, the room is about 25 or so.

    Downstairs with no aircon, but blinds shut has stayed below 22 all day (Outside is 31)
    Similarly hot outside, flat rendered tolerable by keeping windows and curtains shut. None of those tricks is going to be adequate tomorrow, however, so off to hide in a hotel.

    I have discovered that there appears to be such a thing now as a portable aircon unit that doesn't have that hopeless ceremony where you have to try to lift to whole bloody thing off the floor and tip the water into the bath without breaking your back in the process. Further investigation required.
    I assume that portable air conditioners operate by sinking the heat into the water reservoir? I'm always a bit suspicious of those since the heat banked in the water needs to go somewhere, presumably back out into the room again.
    Ours pumps out warm air through an ‘elephant trunk’ to the outside.
  • Options
    FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    HYUFD said:

    Foxy said:

    Cyclefree said:

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
    You don't need to rely on Badenoch's statement. You just need to look at what Mordaunt said twice on the record in the Commons on the issue and what she has said in recent days about what her position always is. To put it at its politest they don't match. You can also compare what she has said in recent days about the inquiry into girls transitioning she says she commissioned and what the Department wrote at the time to those who inquired about what the inquiry she commissioned was actually about. Again, there is a mismatch.

    There is also a separate issue about possible conflicts of interest. Mordaunt's brother is an LGBT activist. He has been busy deleting some of his tweets on this topic on recent days. According to reports, he was with Mordaunt a lot at the Commons when she was Minister responsible for this topic. What exactly was his role and input, if any? It may have been nothing. But family members who do not stand for office or who do not have formal role as advisors should be careful about staying out of political issues and Ministers should ensure that they do.

    The broad issue with Mordaunt is her judgment. Someone who was really fit to be PM would not have allowed herself to get into such a mess over this. It shows poor judgment and inexperience at best and at worst a lack of integrity.
    Mostly I think it shows a HYUFD like stubbornness about admitting she was wrong.
    No senior politician ever admits they are wrong or they are over, you might say you have changed your mind and get away with it but that is it
    Well, you're wrong

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-wales-politics-40219464
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jacob-rees-mogg-owen-paterson-vote-b1958546.html
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-politics-19654028
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,712
    I see the government has a plan to keep ambulances from waiting in the heat. No more than 30 min permitted. Not sure where we are supposed to put all the folk instead...

    BREAKING: All hospitals in England told to take "immediate steps" to find extra space for patients so that no ambulance waits longer than 30mins. This must be done despite the extra burden on hospital staff, say NHS chiefs. https://t.co/Jb71x4PC3w
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,330
    HYUFD said:

    Foxy said:

    Cyclefree said:

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
    You don't need to rely on Badenoch's statement. You just need to look at what Mordaunt said twice on the record in the Commons on the issue and what she has said in recent days about what her position always is. To put it at its politest they don't match. You can also compare what she has said in recent days about the inquiry into girls transitioning she says she commissioned and what the Department wrote at the time to those who inquired about what the inquiry she commissioned was actually about. Again, there is a mismatch.

    There is also a separate issue about possible conflicts of interest. Mordaunt's brother is an LGBT activist. He has been busy deleting some of his tweets on this topic on recent days. According to reports, he was with Mordaunt a lot at the Commons when she was Minister responsible for this topic. What exactly was his role and input, if any? It may have been nothing. But family members who do not stand for office or who do not have formal role as advisors should be careful about staying out of political issues and Ministers should ensure that they do.

    The broad issue with Mordaunt is her judgment. Someone who was really fit to be PM would not have allowed herself to get into such a mess over this. It shows poor judgment and inexperience at best and at worst a lack of integrity.
    Mostly I think it shows a HYUFD like stubbornness about admitting she was wrong.
    No senior politician ever admits they are wrong or they are over, you might say you have changed your mind and get away with it but that is it
    That is a weakness, not a strength
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,909
    Foxy said:

    I see the government has a plan to keep ambulances from waiting in the heat. No more than 30 min permitted. Not sure where we are supposed to put all the folk instead...

    BREAKING: All hospitals in England told to take "immediate steps" to find extra space for patients so that no ambulance waits longer than 30mins. This must be done despite the extra burden on hospital staff, say NHS chiefs. https://t.co/Jb71x4PC3w

    Presumably that means all planned non-emergency admissions will get cancelled, again?
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,031
    Farooq said:

    HYUFD said:

    Foxy said:

    Cyclefree said:

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
    You don't need to rely on Badenoch's statement. You just need to look at what Mordaunt said twice on the record in the Commons on the issue and what she has said in recent days about what her position always is. To put it at its politest they don't match. You can also compare what she has said in recent days about the inquiry into girls transitioning she says she commissioned and what the Department wrote at the time to those who inquired about what the inquiry she commissioned was actually about. Again, there is a mismatch.

    There is also a separate issue about possible conflicts of interest. Mordaunt's brother is an LGBT activist. He has been busy deleting some of his tweets on this topic on recent days. According to reports, he was with Mordaunt a lot at the Commons when she was Minister responsible for this topic. What exactly was his role and input, if any? It may have been nothing. But family members who do not stand for office or who do not have formal role as advisors should be careful about staying out of political issues and Ministers should ensure that they do.

    The broad issue with Mordaunt is her judgment. Someone who was really fit to be PM would not have allowed herself to get into such a mess over this. It shows poor judgment and inexperience at best and at worst a lack of integrity.
    Mostly I think it shows a HYUFD like stubbornness about admitting she was wrong.
    No senior politician ever admits they are wrong or they are over, you might say you have changed your mind and get away with it but that is it
    Well, you're wrong

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-wales-politics-40219464
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jacob-rees-mogg-owen-paterson-vote-b1958546.html
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-politics-19654028
    And after that Jacob couldn't even get enough nominations to stand despite considering a bid
  • Options
    FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    HYUFD said:

    Farooq said:

    HYUFD said:

    Foxy said:

    Cyclefree said:

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
    You don't need to rely on Badenoch's statement. You just need to look at what Mordaunt said twice on the record in the Commons on the issue and what she has said in recent days about what her position always is. To put it at its politest they don't match. You can also compare what she has said in recent days about the inquiry into girls transitioning she says she commissioned and what the Department wrote at the time to those who inquired about what the inquiry she commissioned was actually about. Again, there is a mismatch.

    There is also a separate issue about possible conflicts of interest. Mordaunt's brother is an LGBT activist. He has been busy deleting some of his tweets on this topic on recent days. According to reports, he was with Mordaunt a lot at the Commons when she was Minister responsible for this topic. What exactly was his role and input, if any? It may have been nothing. But family members who do not stand for office or who do not have formal role as advisors should be careful about staying out of political issues and Ministers should ensure that they do.

    The broad issue with Mordaunt is her judgment. Someone who was really fit to be PM would not have allowed herself to get into such a mess over this. It shows poor judgment and inexperience at best and at worst a lack of integrity.
    Mostly I think it shows a HYUFD like stubbornness about admitting she was wrong.
    No senior politician ever admits they are wrong or they are over, you might say you have changed your mind and get away with it but that is it
    Well, you're wrong

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-wales-politics-40219464
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jacob-rees-mogg-owen-paterson-vote-b1958546.html
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-politics-19654028
    And after that Jacob couldn't even get enough nominations to stand despite considering a bid
    You're supposed to say "oh yes, I was wrong" at this stage :trollface:
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,909
    Pant’s on fire!
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,987
    Did the NHS just realise it is hot?
    Maybe Leon could work for them as he's not much better to do now.
    He noticed about 10 days ago.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,712
    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    I see the government has a plan to keep ambulances from waiting in the heat. No more than 30 min permitted. Not sure where we are supposed to put all the folk instead...

    BREAKING: All hospitals in England told to take "immediate steps" to find extra space for patients so that no ambulance waits longer than 30mins. This must be done despite the extra burden on hospital staff, say NHS chiefs. https://t.co/Jb71x4PC3w

    Presumably that means all planned non-emergency admissions will get cancelled, again?
    Not day case surgery, endoscopy, cardiac catheters etc, but anything requiring a bed probably.



  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,827
    edited July 2022

    HYUFD said:

    Foxy said:

    Cyclefree said:

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
    You don't need to rely on Badenoch's statement. You just need to look at what Mordaunt said twice on the record in the Commons on the issue and what she has said in recent days about what her position always is. To put it at its politest they don't match. You can also compare what she has said in recent days about the inquiry into girls transitioning she says she commissioned and what the Department wrote at the time to those who inquired about what the inquiry she commissioned was actually about. Again, there is a mismatch.

    There is also a separate issue about possible conflicts of interest. Mordaunt's brother is an LGBT activist. He has been busy deleting some of his tweets on this topic on recent days. According to reports, he was with Mordaunt a lot at the Commons when she was Minister responsible for this topic. What exactly was his role and input, if any? It may have been nothing. But family members who do not stand for office or who do not have formal role as advisors should be careful about staying out of political issues and Ministers should ensure that they do.

    The broad issue with Mordaunt is her judgment. Someone who was really fit to be PM would not have allowed herself to get into such a mess over this. It shows poor judgment and inexperience at best and at worst a lack of integrity.
    Mostly I think it shows a HYUFD like stubbornness about admitting she was wrong.
    No senior politician ever admits they are wrong or they are over, you might say you have changed your mind and get away with it but that is it
    That is a weakness, not a strength
    And will outfox the opposition, as they will not expect it.

    Believing if they admit having been wrong 'they are over' is precisely the problem. It means bad decisions, or even decisions made in good faith which are not working out, are pushed for far too long, because of the embarrassment.

    Making or persisting with the wrong course of action because you think it will look weak to change direction is a major cause of crap decisions. It's not wise, it's not sensible, it's not pragmatic. Doing the wrong thing is, well, wrong.

    It's only a problem to admit you are wrong if you never learn from it and keep on getting it wrong. But if you never admit it of course you are going to keep getting things wrong.
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,793
    Sandpit said:

    Pant’s on fire!

    I'm not sure that the heritage ticket works.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,047

    Living room temperature has topped out at 26.1degC today. Fan keeping me cool.

    However Wor Lass decided that it is fine to be outside doing some gardening and dragged me out to move some large, heavy planted-up pots. FFS. At least she hadn't watered them first.

    I got the inflatable pool out today (pumping it up always takes *ages*, and filled it up (*).) His best friends came around for two and a half hours this afternoon, and they had massive amounts of fun splashing about, with me liberally soaking them with the hose at random intervals..

    It was warm, but I sat in the shade of the garage and read Brenda Blethyn's autobio.

    Heaven. After school tomorrow I think I'll just take him straight home and throw him into the pool, clothes and all.

    (*) As a modern may (tm), I felt *slightly* guilty about the waste of water.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,827
    HYUFD said:

    Farooq said:

    HYUFD said:

    Foxy said:

    Cyclefree said:

    ydoethur said:

    Cyclefree said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Nigelb said:

    I don't even know how to think about this...

    Raab attacks Truss’s record as Tory leadership race enters critical 72 hours
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/17/raab-attacks-truss-record-tory-leadership-race-critical-72-hours

    Sharp from Kemi

    Her successor as equalities minister, Kemi Badenoch, also running for the leadership, has said Mordaunt’s stance in the past was to push for self-identification. That contradicts Mordaunt’s insistence in Friday’s Channel 4 debate that she was “never in favour of self-ID”.

    Badenoch told the Sunday Times: “I’m not going to call her a liar, I think it’s very possible she genuinely did not understand what she was signing off. It’s a very complex area.”
    You can tell she's had legal training. That's what's known as funnelling in cross-examination or in any sort of investigative interviewing. Either Mordaunt is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my post at 4:30pm.

    Contrary to what she appears to be claiming, Badenoch did NOT succeed Mordaunt as equalities minister. She succeeded Baroness Williams of Trafford as Minister for Equalities. Mordaunt was Minister for Women and Equalities until 24th July 2019. Badenoch was appointed to the more junior role of Minister for Equalities on 14th February 2020. Between those two dates, Amber Rudd had held the more senior position until September 2019 and was then succeeded by Truss. So, on the evidence of this, either Badenoch is a liar or she's a bit thick and incompetent.
    See my comment of 4.20pm.
    Not disagreeing, but if Badenoch is claiming she succeeded Mordaunt when she never even held the same role as Mordaunt, let alone succeeded her, I wouldn't trust the rest of her statement.
    You don't need to rely on Badenoch's statement. You just need to look at what Mordaunt said twice on the record in the Commons on the issue and what she has said in recent days about what her position always is. To put it at its politest they don't match. You can also compare what she has said in recent days about the inquiry into girls transitioning she says she commissioned and what the Department wrote at the time to those who inquired about what the inquiry she commissioned was actually about. Again, there is a mismatch.

    There is also a separate issue about possible conflicts of interest. Mordaunt's brother is an LGBT activist. He has been busy deleting some of his tweets on this topic on recent days. According to reports, he was with Mordaunt a lot at the Commons when she was Minister responsible for this topic. What exactly was his role and input, if any? It may have been nothing. But family members who do not stand for office or who do not have formal role as advisors should be careful about staying out of political issues and Ministers should ensure that they do.

    The broad issue with Mordaunt is her judgment. Someone who was really fit to be PM would not have allowed herself to get into such a mess over this. It shows poor judgment and inexperience at best and at worst a lack of integrity.
    Mostly I think it shows a HYUFD like stubbornness about admitting she was wrong.
    No senior politician ever admits they are wrong or they are over, you might say you have changed your mind and get away with it but that is it
    Well, you're wrong

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-wales-politics-40219464
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jacob-rees-mogg-owen-paterson-vote-b1958546.html
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-politics-19654028
    And after that Jacob couldn't even get enough nominations to stand despite considering a bid
    You think that was the reason? "I was going to back JRM, but he admitted he was wrong to stick up for Paterson".
  • Options
    RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 27,263
    Afternoon all! My 11yr old daughter has been having sailing lessons this weekend, so needed picking up from Peterhead at 4pm. So we went out after lunch and had a wander around Slains castle. https://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/crudenbay/slainscastle/index.html

    This is a unique place - an imposing structure on top of sheer cliffs, a ruin for a century that you can wander around and even spiral staircases you can climb up floor after floor.

    The most boggling part - it is simply there. No access control, no custodian heritage organisation, nothing to stop you falling from the top of the tower or out a window down the cliffs.

    Every time I come, its always WOW.
  • Options
    jonny83jonny83 Posts: 1,261
    https://twitter.com/IainDale/status/1548705431400374275?t=HWXk2DKaFJNdFPcuxgYOLA&s=19

    "I've spoken to a Tory Minister today, who totally confirms what Susan Williams says. This minister is not a Mordaunt supporter. They won't go on the record because they think they will face a media shitstorm. They totally back up @PennyMordaunt in saying she never backed Self ID."
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,827
    Foxy said:

    I see the government has a plan to keep ambulances from waiting in the heat. No more than 30 min permitted. Not sure where we are supposed to put all the folk instead...

    BREAKING: All hospitals in England told to take "immediate steps" to find extra space for patients so that no ambulance waits longer than 30mins. This must be done despite the extra burden on hospital staff, say NHS chiefs. https://t.co/Jb71x4PC3w

    I have heard terrible things about problems with ambulance services, who were already struggling to address significant delays. Being told something like that doesn't seem likely to help, since it presumes that for some reason they wouldn't have wanted to try to solve the problem until told to.
  • Options
    OnboardG1OnboardG1 Posts: 1,291

    OnboardG1 said:

    pigeon said:

    Pulpstar said:

    pigeon said:

    Stereodog said:

    At the risk of being torn asunder I’m surprised that no one on here is talking about portable air conditioning units. You can buy one for about the price of a couple of nights in an air conditioned hotel. I got one after being nagged by Canadian husband (every house has A/C) and honestly I wouldn’t look back. Yes they’re bulky and noisy but they make our flat tolerable even in this heat. Air coolers are no good because they just add humidity into the room.

    I used to have one but I couldn't stand the bloody racket and, in any case, it was very heavy and hopelessly difficult to drain the water from. Perhaps the technology has improved in the last few years to make them more practical, but I doubt it.
    Got one going in here, the room is about 25 or so.

    Downstairs with no aircon, but blinds shut has stayed below 22 all day (Outside is 31)
    Similarly hot outside, flat rendered tolerable by keeping windows and curtains shut. None of those tricks is going to be adequate tomorrow, however, so off to hide in a hotel.

    I have discovered that there appears to be such a thing now as a portable aircon unit that doesn't have that hopeless ceremony where you have to try to lift to whole bloody thing off the floor and tip the water into the bath without breaking your back in the process. Further investigation required.
    I assume that portable air conditioners operate by sinking the heat into the water reservoir? I'm always a bit suspicious of those since the heat banked in the water needs to go somewhere, presumably back out into the room again.
    A hose out of the window. Noisy though.

    I bought one a week ago for my dad, just in case, and I think it will come in useful. Bungalows are difficult to keep cool and if it is 25C inside at 31C outside (as today), 41C outside isn't going to be healthy.

    I doubt there will be vast amounts of water to remove as it isn't going to be at all humid tomorrow and Tues.
    Ah, right, makes sense. Bit limiting to need it close to the window but not much to be done about it. Better than frying.
  • Options
    FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    edited July 2022

    Afternoon all! My 11yr old daughter has been having sailing lessons this weekend, so needed picking up from Peterhead at 4pm. So we went out after lunch and had a wander around Slains castle. https://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/crudenbay/slainscastle/index.html

    This is a unique place - an imposing structure on top of sheer cliffs, a ruin for a century that you can wander around and even spiral staircases you can climb up floor after floor.

    The most boggling part - it is simply there. No access control, no custodian heritage organisation, nothing to stop you falling from the top of the tower or out a window down the cliffs.

    Every time I come, its always WOW.

    Yes, I know it well. If you have the guts to stand at the top of that tallest tower, you're braver than most. It's actually quite horrifying to be stood there with a 4 storey drop one side and the spiral staircase ready to swallow you up in the other three directions. Any feeling of faintness and you're doomed, and not a rail or a warning sign in sight.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,031
    edited July 2022
    jonny83 said:

    https://twitter.com/IainDale/status/1548705431400374275?t=HWXk2DKaFJNdFPcuxgYOLA&s=19

    "I've spoken to a Tory Minister today, who totally confirms what Susan Williams says. This minister is not a Mordaunt supporter. They won't go on the record because they think they will face a media shitstorm. They totally back up @PennyMordaunt in saying she never backed Self ID."

    Mind you it unfortunately looks to have killed her campaign, if Sunak is sensible he will now lend her some votes in the final round to knock out Truss so he and Mordaunt face the membership vote.

    On the ConHome survey he now narrowly beats Mordaunt but still loses to Truss
  • Options
    FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 3,891
    kle4 said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    Living room temperature has topped out at 26.1degC today. Fan keeping me cool.

    However Wor Lass decided that it is fine to be outside doing some gardening and dragged me out to move some large, heavy planted-up pots. FFS. At least she hadn't watered them first.

    That's some top trolling. This is why I prefer the er... wild gardening trend. There's only so many times I can hack raspberries back before I just give up.
    I embraced "No Mow May". And kept it going through June and into July.
    I did that for 2 years when my council started charging for garden waste collection.
    Most of my garden remains unmown, although there's very little that you could call lawn. Mostly woodland herb layer, pond (with a collection of various sedges), rabbit grazing or, er, cactus patch.

    And yes, it is just a suburban garden.

    Not sure what the neighbours make of the 80ft birch trees (we planted them, it was all boring grass when we started). The Giant Sequoia was just for the lolz, you understand.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,712
    dixiedean said:

    Did the NHS just realise it is hot?
    Maybe Leon could work for them as he's not much better to do now.
    He noticed about 10 days ago.

    No, that directive came from DoH Friday 15th. My own Trust has been putting out comms on the heatwave for a week or so, telling staff to expedite discharges etc. Though as we do that as quickly as possible, I am not sure what we are supposed to do more.

    Mondays are always bad for beds anyway. It's almost as if closing acute medical bed capacity over the last decades and running with no slack in the system is not as efficient as it sounds to a bunch of twenty something MBAs working as Management Consultants.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,827
    jonny83 said:

    https://twitter.com/IainDale/status/1548705431400374275?t=HWXk2DKaFJNdFPcuxgYOLA&s=19

    "I've spoken to a Tory Minister today, who totally confirms what Susan Williams says. This minister is not a Mordaunt supporter. They won't go on the record because they think they will face a media shitstorm. They totally back up @PennyMordaunt in saying she never backed Self ID."

    If they won't go on the record why should anyone believe them? Why are they so cowardly as to not face some media attention when it would advance the truth? Is the truth not important enough to face that?

    I say dismiss their claim entirely, as we should with any anonymous briefing.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,931
    Metro
    @MetroUK
    Yesterday
    Londoners warned not to travel on Monday or Tuesday due to extreme heat ⚠️

    Is travel more dangerous if you're a Londoner or something ?
  • Options
    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 7,676
    dixiedean said:

    Christ it's depressing.
    After Tugendhat "we need to liberate Putin's oil fields" presumably by invading Siberia or summat, now Sunak's at it.
    "Review or repeal all 2400 EU laws before the election."
    All of them? Even the sensible ones?
    At three a day? A maximum of 5 hours personal scrutiny each? If he does nowt else. No Commons time for anything else.
    Good job the economy is in such fine fettle.

    Siberia was not traditionally ethnically Russia, so by Putin’s logic, it should be liberated! Let’s revive the 1918 Siberian Republic, or even the Khanate of Sibir (1420-1598)! This will be easier than getting Mordaunt to be consistent on something, or getting Badenoch to offer a specific policy measure.
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,793
    Pulpstar said:

    Metro
    @MetroUK
    Yesterday
    Londoners warned not to travel on Monday or Tuesday due to extreme heat ⚠️

    Is travel more dangerous if you're a Londoner or something ?

    Genuinely you could die if you take a tube train.
  • Options
    pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,132
    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    I see the government has a plan to keep ambulances from waiting in the heat. No more than 30 min permitted. Not sure where we are supposed to put all the folk instead...

    BREAKING: All hospitals in England told to take "immediate steps" to find extra space for patients so that no ambulance waits longer than 30mins. This must be done despite the extra burden on hospital staff, say NHS chiefs. https://t.co/Jb71x4PC3w

    Presumably that means all planned non-emergency admissions will get cancelled, again?
    Not day case surgery, endoscopy, cardiac catheters etc, but anything requiring a bed probably.
    Makes sense, although I was under the impression that the main problem with A&E was patient demand outstripping the capacity of the available staff to cope with it, hence the waits outside in ambulances, and that bedblocking preventing existing A&E patients from being moved on was a secondary issue?

    One can obviously understand why NHS high command and the Government will both be shitting themselves over patients stuck in ambulances in the heatwave, of course. Five hours in back of absolutely roasting hot ambulance = a lot of dead patients, and probably no small number of sick ambulance crew as well.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,502
    Pulpstar said:

    Metro
    @MetroUK
    Yesterday
    Londoners warned not to travel on Monday or Tuesday due to extreme heat ⚠️

    Is travel more dangerous if you're a Londoner or something ?

    Isn't it more Londoners use public transport and parts of the tube/buses aren't that well air conditioned.
  • Options
    TresTres Posts: 2,230
    Rail tracks have a tendency to misbehave in extreme heat.
  • Options
    RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 27,263
    Farooq said:

    Afternoon all! My 11yr old daughter has been having sailing lessons this weekend, so needed picking up from Peterhead at 4pm. So we went out after lunch and had a wander around Slains castle. https://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/crudenbay/slainscastle/index.html

    This is a unique place - an imposing structure on top of sheer cliffs, a ruin for a century that you can wander around and even spiral staircases you can climb up floor after floor.

    The most boggling part - it is simply there. No access control, no custodian heritage organisation, nothing to stop you falling from the top of the tower or out a window down the cliffs.

    Every time I come, its always WOW.

    Yes, I know it well. If you have the guts to stand at the top of that tallest tower, you're braver than most. It's actually quite horrifying to be stood there with a 4 story drop one side and the spiral staircase ready to swallow you up in the other three directions. Any feeling of faintness and you're doomed, and not a rail or a warning sign in sight.
    And it was windy today! But at least its a solid structure. Yesterday I was filming at Findlater Castle https://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/sandend/findlatercastle/index.html

    There is much less of it left standing, but its much more of a challenge. There used to be a drawbridge from the clifftop across to the promontory it was built on. Long gone, and the path is scrambly in places with no room for error. Then when you get there you're in rooms that are full of holes in the floor and drops out over the cliff if you start to slide...
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,712
    Pulpstar said:

    Metro
    @MetroUK
    Yesterday
    Londoners warned not to travel on Monday or Tuesday due to extreme heat ⚠️

    Is travel more dangerous if you're a Londoner or something ?

    I expect the tube will be pretty awful in the heat, buses too, rail is running at reduced speed, and sitting in a car running the AC quite popular.

  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,502
    Tres said:

    Rail tracks have a tendency to misbehave in extreme heat.

    Yup, that's why my train was cancelled for Tuesday.
  • Options
    pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,132
    Omnium said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Metro
    @MetroUK
    Yesterday
    Londoners warned not to travel on Monday or Tuesday due to extreme heat ⚠️

    Is travel more dangerous if you're a Londoner or something ?

    Genuinely you could die if you take a tube train.
    And FWIW I'm sure the railways nationally have been telling people only to travel if essential as well. But yes, experience suggests that the Tube network is particularly vulnerable. Parts of it are so bloody hot under normal Summer conditions that I'm surprised they haven't been shut down, to save the staff from perishing from heatstroke quite apart from any risk to passengers.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,305

    Tres said:

    Rail tracks have a tendency to misbehave in extreme heat.

    Yup, that's why my train was cancelled for Tuesday.
    @Sunil_Prasannan is going to be out of luck, isn't he?
  • Options
    FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    @RochdalePioneers
    If you haven't been to the Bullers yet, this is a good time of year for it. The car park between Cruden Bay and Longhaven offers the shortest access, and if you take the branch southwards after you pass the little houses, you get the favourite nesting cliffs of the puffins. They're there this time of year.

    There has been a lot of sea bird deaths in the area from avian flu, so I don't know how the puffins are doing, but they're probably still numerous enough to easily spot. Evening is a good time to see them.
  • Options
    EabhalEabhal Posts: 5,906
    ydoethur said:

    Tres said:

    Rail tracks have a tendency to misbehave in extreme heat.

    Yup, that's why my train was cancelled for Tuesday.
    @Sunil_Prasannan is going to be out of luck, isn't he?
    He cancelled his trip.
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,124
    Pulpstar said:

    Metro
    @MetroUK
    Yesterday
    Londoners warned not to travel on Monday or Tuesday due to extreme heat ⚠️

    Is travel more dangerous if you're a Londoner or something ?

    No but it doesn't matter if anything happens to non-Londoners. 😉
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,712
    pigeon said:

    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    I see the government has a plan to keep ambulances from waiting in the heat. No more than 30 min permitted. Not sure where we are supposed to put all the folk instead...

    BREAKING: All hospitals in England told to take "immediate steps" to find extra space for patients so that no ambulance waits longer than 30mins. This must be done despite the extra burden on hospital staff, say NHS chiefs. https://t.co/Jb71x4PC3w

    Presumably that means all planned non-emergency admissions will get cancelled, again?
    Not day case surgery, endoscopy, cardiac catheters etc, but anything requiring a bed probably.
    Makes sense, although I was under the impression that the main problem with A&E was patient demand outstripping the capacity of the available staff to cope with it, hence the waits outside in ambulances, and that bedblocking preventing existing A&E patients from being moved on was a secondary issue?

    One can obviously understand why NHS high command and the Government will both be shitting themselves over patients stuck in ambulances in the heatwave, of course. Five hours in back of absolutely roasting hot ambulance = a lot of dead patients, and probably no small number of sick ambulance crew as well.
    Yes, the problem is the number of beds to admit into, the back door of ED rather than the front one. I expect a lot of the minor stuff won't appear, but that isn't really a problem. They hang around for ages, but don't take up a lot of resources generally.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,502
    ydoethur said:

    Tres said:

    Rail tracks have a tendency to misbehave in extreme heat.

    Yup, that's why my train was cancelled for Tuesday.
    @Sunil_Prasannan is going to be out of luck, isn't he?
    Yeah, no trains on Tuesday between King's Cross and York/Leeds.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,047
    pigeon said:

    Omnium said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Metro
    @MetroUK
    Yesterday
    Londoners warned not to travel on Monday or Tuesday due to extreme heat ⚠️

    Is travel more dangerous if you're a Londoner or something ?

    Genuinely you could die if you take a tube train.
    And FWIW I'm sure the railways nationally have been telling people only to travel if essential as well. But yes, experience suggests that the Tube network is particularly vulnerable. Parts of it are so bloody hot under normal Summer conditions that I'm surprised they haven't been shut down, to save the staff from perishing from heatstroke quite apart from any risk to passengers.
    When I lived and worked in London, I grew to dislike it. Then when I moved away and visited London, I loved it. Eventually I realised the main reason: as a visitor I would generally travel outside rush hour. As a worker, I would often travel during rush hours. When I travel during rush hour as a visitor (not often nowadays, admittedly), I hate the experience. rush-hour travel is utterly soul-destroying.

    I disliked it so much I used to go into work at seven in the morning to avoid the worst of the morning rush.
  • Options
    FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775

    Farooq said:

    Afternoon all! My 11yr old daughter has been having sailing lessons this weekend, so needed picking up from Peterhead at 4pm. So we went out after lunch and had a wander around Slains castle. https://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/crudenbay/slainscastle/index.html

    This is a unique place - an imposing structure on top of sheer cliffs, a ruin for a century that you can wander around and even spiral staircases you can climb up floor after floor.

    The most boggling part - it is simply there. No access control, no custodian heritage organisation, nothing to stop you falling from the top of the tower or out a window down the cliffs.

    Every time I come, its always WOW.

    Yes, I know it well. If you have the guts to stand at the top of that tallest tower, you're braver than most. It's actually quite horrifying to be stood there with a 4 story drop one side and the spiral staircase ready to swallow you up in the other three directions. Any feeling of faintness and you're doomed, and not a rail or a warning sign in sight.
    And it was windy today! But at least its a solid structure. Yesterday I was filming at Findlater Castle https://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/sandend/findlatercastle/index.html

    There is much less of it left standing, but its much more of a challenge. There used to be a drawbridge from the clifftop across to the promontory it was built on. Long gone, and the path is scrambly in places with no room for error. Then when you get there you're in rooms that are full of holes in the floor and drops out over the cliff if you start to slide...
    Well, you say it's solid, but walk around a bit and you can see huge stones with distinctive circular holes on the ground. Those things used to be a the apex of the triangles way at the top. Something brought them down, so why not the ones where you were climbing.
    But it's probably fine. If your legs don't go to jelly like mine do.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,305
    edited July 2022
    Foxy said:

    I see the government has a plan to keep ambulances from waiting in the heat. No more than 30 min permitted. Not sure where we are supposed to put all the folk instead...

    BREAKING: All hospitals in England told to take "immediate steps" to find extra space for patients so that no ambulance waits longer than 30mins. This must be done despite the extra burden on hospital staff, say NHS chiefs. https://t.co/Jb71x4PC3w

    Because obviously you leave them outside on ambulances all the time just because you can't be bothered to treat them.
  • Options
    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,155
    Foxy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Metro
    @MetroUK
    Yesterday
    Londoners warned not to travel on Monday or Tuesday due to extreme heat ⚠️

    Is travel more dangerous if you're a Londoner or something ?

    I expect the tube will be pretty awful in the heat, buses too, rail is running at reduced speed, and sitting in a car running the AC quite popular.

    The origins of today’s deeper-seated problems date to 1890, when the first deep tunnels were built under the Thames from Stockwell to the City, on what is now known as the Northern Line. More tunnels bored at depths below 20 metres followed over the next century - on the Bakerloo, Central, Victoria, Waterloo & City, Jubilee and Piccadilly lines - to form today’s Deep Tube network.

    Temperatures were initially cool, and matched the ambient heat of the earth surrounding the tunnels (around 14°C in 1900). But that was before millions of passengers and a service frequency unimaginable to Victorian and Edwardian planners were added to the mix.

    Unbeknown to 19th century engineers, up to 79% of energy dissipated by trains, people and infrastructure is transferred to London’s native clay around the tunnel bores - thus the temperature of this giant heat sink has slowly climbed to today’s balmy average of 20-25°C.

    Without the valuable gift of hindsight, LU’s early engineers failed to provide adequate ventilation to dissipate this heat, and mid-tunnel shafts were either too few in number or non-existent.


    https://www.railmagazine.com/infrastructure/stations/cooling-the-tube
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,305
    Eabhal said:


    ydoethur said:

    Tres said:

    Rail tracks have a tendency to misbehave in extreme heat.

    Yup, that's why my train was cancelled for Tuesday.
    @Sunil_Prasannan is going to be out of luck, isn't he?
    He cancelled his trip.
    Wise man, but disappointing for him. I'd love a trip to the Highlands right now.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,047

    Farooq said:

    Afternoon all! My 11yr old daughter has been having sailing lessons this weekend, so needed picking up from Peterhead at 4pm. So we went out after lunch and had a wander around Slains castle. https://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/crudenbay/slainscastle/index.html

    This is a unique place - an imposing structure on top of sheer cliffs, a ruin for a century that you can wander around and even spiral staircases you can climb up floor after floor.

    The most boggling part - it is simply there. No access control, no custodian heritage organisation, nothing to stop you falling from the top of the tower or out a window down the cliffs.

    Every time I come, its always WOW.

    Yes, I know it well. If you have the guts to stand at the top of that tallest tower, you're braver than most. It's actually quite horrifying to be stood there with a 4 story drop one side and the spiral staircase ready to swallow you up in the other three directions. Any feeling of faintness and you're doomed, and not a rail or a warning sign in sight.
    And it was windy today! But at least its a solid structure. Yesterday I was filming at Findlater Castle https://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/sandend/findlatercastle/index.html

    There is much less of it left standing, but its much more of a challenge. There used to be a drawbridge from the clifftop across to the promontory it was built on. Long gone, and the path is scrambly in places with no room for error. Then when you get there you're in rooms that are full of holes in the floor and drops out over the cliff if you start to slide...
    I passed that on my coastal walk (I think it's technically the *new* Slains Castle? - the 'old'' one is further north?) and it seems so perfect for restoration. It is crying out for renovation and reuse.

    I loved it. I only explored it for a few minutes as I was walking on, but it was so atmospheric.

    So: better as a ruin, or restored for reuse? Would Eilean Donan be better as a ruin or restored?
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,047
    DougSeal said:

    Foxy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Metro
    @MetroUK
    Yesterday
    Londoners warned not to travel on Monday or Tuesday due to extreme heat ⚠️

    Is travel more dangerous if you're a Londoner or something ?

    I expect the tube will be pretty awful in the heat, buses too, rail is running at reduced speed, and sitting in a car running the AC quite popular.

    The origins of today’s deeper-seated problems date to 1890, when the first deep tunnels were built under the Thames from Stockwell to the City, on what is now known as the Northern Line. More tunnels bored at depths below 20 metres followed over the next century - on the Bakerloo, Central, Victoria, Waterloo & City, Jubilee and Piccadilly lines - to form today’s Deep Tube network.

    Temperatures were initially cool, and matched the ambient heat of the earth surrounding the tunnels (around 14°C in 1900). But that was before millions of passengers and a service frequency unimaginable to Victorian and Edwardian planners were added to the mix.

    Unbeknown to 19th century engineers, up to 79% of energy dissipated by trains, people and infrastructure is transferred to London’s native clay around the tunnel bores - thus the temperature of this giant heat sink has slowly climbed to today’s balmy average of 20-25°C.

    Without the valuable gift of hindsight, LU’s early engineers failed to provide adequate ventilation to dissipate this heat, and mid-tunnel shafts were either too few in number or non-existent.


    https://www.railmagazine.com/infrastructure/stations/cooling-the-tube
    That's slightly ridiculous. LU's early engineers a century or so ago would not have *cared* about the temperature the passengers faced on a handful of days of the year. It would have been a non-issue for them.
  • Options
    WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,503
    edited July 2022
    Half an hour till the big debate jamboree. I haven't felt so excited in years.

    Incredible, I tell you.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,827
    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    I see the government has a plan to keep ambulances from waiting in the heat. No more than 30 min permitted. Not sure where we are supposed to put all the folk instead...

    BREAKING: All hospitals in England told to take "immediate steps" to find extra space for patients so that no ambulance waits longer than 30mins. This must be done despite the extra burden on hospital staff, say NHS chiefs. https://t.co/Jb71x4PC3w

    Because obviously you leave them outside on ambulances all the time just because you can't be bothered to treat them.
    The good doctor has to get to the golf course sometime!
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,858
    edited July 2022
    kle4 said:

    jonny83 said:

    https://twitter.com/IainDale/status/1548705431400374275?t=HWXk2DKaFJNdFPcuxgYOLA&s=19

    "I've spoken to a Tory Minister today, who totally confirms what Susan Williams says. This minister is not a Mordaunt supporter. They won't go on the record because they think they will face a media shitstorm. They totally back up @PennyMordaunt in saying she never backed Self ID."

    If they won't go on the record why should anyone believe them? Why are they so cowardly as to not face some media attention when it would advance the truth? Is the truth not important enough to face that?

    I say dismiss their claim entirely, as we should with any anonymous briefing.
    Baroness Williams *did* go on the record.

    So the evidence you have “for” is some some alleged contradictions in Hansard (I haven’t checked), and indirect allegations from other candidates.

    “Against” you have Penny’s own denials, supported by Baroness Williams, and this anonymous briefing. There is also the fact that Amber Rudd was Equalities Minister between Mordaunt and Badenoch, which is not what Badenoch seemed to suggest in the debate.

    I for one suspect the whole thing is a “beat-up”, and I am much more troubled by her refusal to concede that the UK did have a veto on Turkey’s EU accession, and some of her weird policy pronouncements.

    One final note: no other candidate has faced the kind of briefings that Penny has had against her.
  • Options
    FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    edited July 2022

    Farooq said:

    Afternoon all! My 11yr old daughter has been having sailing lessons this weekend, so needed picking up from Peterhead at 4pm. So we went out after lunch and had a wander around Slains castle. https://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/crudenbay/slainscastle/index.html

    This is a unique place - an imposing structure on top of sheer cliffs, a ruin for a century that you can wander around and even spiral staircases you can climb up floor after floor.

    The most boggling part - it is simply there. No access control, no custodian heritage organisation, nothing to stop you falling from the top of the tower or out a window down the cliffs.

    Every time I come, its always WOW.

    Yes, I know it well. If you have the guts to stand at the top of that tallest tower, you're braver than most. It's actually quite horrifying to be stood there with a 4 story drop one side and the spiral staircase ready to swallow you up in the other three directions. Any feeling of faintness and you're doomed, and not a rail or a warning sign in sight.
    And it was windy today! But at least its a solid structure. Yesterday I was filming at Findlater Castle https://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/sandend/findlatercastle/index.html

    There is much less of it left standing, but its much more of a challenge. There used to be a drawbridge from the clifftop across to the promontory it was built on. Long gone, and the path is scrambly in places with no room for error. Then when you get there you're in rooms that are full of holes in the floor and drops out over the cliff if you start to slide...
    I passed that on my coastal walk (I think it's technically the *new* Slains Castle? - the 'old'' one is further north?) and it seems so perfect for restoration. It is crying out for renovation and reuse.

    I loved it. I only explored it for a few minutes as I was walking on, but it was so atmospheric.

    So: better as a ruin, or restored for reuse? Would Eilean Donan be better as a ruin or restored?
    Farther south. There's barely anything left of Old Slains Castle, just a corner. Not worth the trouble getting down a pretty rocky track. Collieston and Newburgh nearby are much better to visit. Seals on the beach at Newburgh, sometimes a hundred at a time.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,458

    RobD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Finally, a solution to the chemtrails problem:


    Good god.
    I liked the specificness of vinegar.

    I want to know which other liquids she tried before deciding it was vinegar that works.

    pigeon said:

    Omnium said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Metro
    @MetroUK
    Yesterday
    Londoners warned not to travel on Monday or Tuesday due to extreme heat ⚠️

    Is travel more dangerous if you're a Londoner or something ?

    Genuinely you could die if you take a tube train.
    And FWIW I'm sure the railways nationally have been telling people only to travel if essential as well. But yes, experience suggests that the Tube network is particularly vulnerable. Parts of it are so bloody hot under normal Summer conditions that I'm surprised they haven't been shut down, to save the staff from perishing from heatstroke quite apart from any risk to passengers.
    When I lived and worked in London, I grew to dislike it. Then when I moved away and visited London, I loved it. Eventually I realised the main reason: as a visitor I would generally travel outside rush hour. As a worker, I would often travel during rush hours. When I travel during rush hour as a visitor (not often nowadays, admittedly), I hate the experience. rush-hour travel is utterly soul-destroying.

    I disliked it so much I used to go into work at seven in the morning to avoid the worst of the morning rush.
    Back when I was young and more stupid, I believed I could do good by talking to politicians.

    As an incidental thing, I found that all MPs shift their travel to avoid rush hour. Which meant they had a rather different view of public transport than most….
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,305
    kle4 said:

    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    I see the government has a plan to keep ambulances from waiting in the heat. No more than 30 min permitted. Not sure where we are supposed to put all the folk instead...

    BREAKING: All hospitals in England told to take "immediate steps" to find extra space for patients so that no ambulance waits longer than 30mins. This must be done despite the extra burden on hospital staff, say NHS chiefs. https://t.co/Jb71x4PC3w

    Because obviously you leave them outside on ambulances all the time just because you can't be bothered to treat them.
    The good doctor has to get to the golf course sometime!
    Somebody wood say that.
  • Options

    kle4 said:

    jonny83 said:

    https://twitter.com/IainDale/status/1548705431400374275?t=HWXk2DKaFJNdFPcuxgYOLA&s=19

    "I've spoken to a Tory Minister today, who totally confirms what Susan Williams says. This minister is not a Mordaunt supporter. They won't go on the record because they think they will face a media shitstorm. They totally back up @PennyMordaunt in saying she never backed Self ID."

    If they won't go on the record why should anyone believe them? Why are they so cowardly as to not face some media attention when it would advance the truth? Is the truth not important enough to face that?

    I say dismiss their claim entirely, as we should with any anonymous briefing.
    Baroness Williams *did* go on the record.

    So the evidence you have “for” is some some alleged contradictions in Hansard (I haven’t checked), and indirect allegations from other candidates.

    “Against” you have Penny’s own denials, supported by Baroness Williams, and this anonymous briefing. There is also the fact that Amber Rudd was Equalities Minister between Mordaunt and Badenoch, which is not what Badenoch seemed to suggest in the debate.

    I for one suspect the whole thing is a “beat-up”, and I am much more troubled by her refusal to concede that the UK did have a veto on Turkey’s EU accession, and some of her weird policy pronouncements.

    One final note: no other candidate has faced the kind of briefings that Penny has had against her.
    This is true. She's the candidate to "stop".
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,712
    kle4 said:

    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    I see the government has a plan to keep ambulances from waiting in the heat. No more than 30 min permitted. Not sure where we are supposed to put all the folk instead...

    BREAKING: All hospitals in England told to take "immediate steps" to find extra space for patients so that no ambulance waits longer than 30mins. This must be done despite the extra burden on hospital staff, say NHS chiefs. https://t.co/Jb71x4PC3w

    Because obviously you leave them outside on ambulances all the time just because you can't be bothered to treat them.
    The good doctor has to get to the golf course sometime!
    Perhaps I will skip golf tommorow afternoon...
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,712
    ydoethur said:

    kle4 said:

    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    I see the government has a plan to keep ambulances from waiting in the heat. No more than 30 min permitted. Not sure where we are supposed to put all the folk instead...

    BREAKING: All hospitals in England told to take "immediate steps" to find extra space for patients so that no ambulance waits longer than 30mins. This must be done despite the extra burden on hospital staff, say NHS chiefs. https://t.co/Jb71x4PC3w

    Because obviously you leave them outside on ambulances all the time just because you can't be bothered to treat them.
    The good doctor has to get to the golf course sometime!
    Somebody wood say that.
    We have to club together to iron out these issues.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,827

    kle4 said:

    jonny83 said:

    https://twitter.com/IainDale/status/1548705431400374275?t=HWXk2DKaFJNdFPcuxgYOLA&s=19

    "I've spoken to a Tory Minister today, who totally confirms what Susan Williams says. This minister is not a Mordaunt supporter. They won't go on the record because they think they will face a media shitstorm. They totally back up @PennyMordaunt in saying she never backed Self ID."

    If they won't go on the record why should anyone believe them? Why are they so cowardly as to not face some media attention when it would advance the truth? Is the truth not important enough to face that?

    I say dismiss their claim entirely, as we should with any anonymous briefing.
    Baroness Williams *did* go on the record.

    So the evidence you have “for” is some some alleged contradictions in Hansard (I haven’t checked), and indirect allegations from other candidates.

    “Against” you have Penny’s own denials, supported by Baroness Williams, and this anonymous briefing. There is also the fact that Amber Rudd was Equalities Minister between Mordaunt and Badenoch, which is not what Badenoch seemed to suggest in the debate.

    I for one suspect the whole thing is a “beat-up”, and I am much more troubled by her refusal to concede that the UK did have a veto on Turkey’s EU accession, and some of her weird policy pronouncements.

    One final note: no other candidate has faced the kind of briefings that Penny has had against her.
    I don't believe or disbelieve the Mordaunt accusations about the woke stuff, I find them rather boring. Others going on record only further makes the point about dismissing the comments of those who were off the record though. If Williams was willing to go on the record and they aren't, they are a coward or a liar.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,305
    Foxy said:

    kle4 said:

    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    I see the government has a plan to keep ambulances from waiting in the heat. No more than 30 min permitted. Not sure where we are supposed to put all the folk instead...

    BREAKING: All hospitals in England told to take "immediate steps" to find extra space for patients so that no ambulance waits longer than 30mins. This must be done despite the extra burden on hospital staff, say NHS chiefs. https://t.co/Jb71x4PC3w

    Because obviously you leave them outside on ambulances all the time just because you can't be bothered to treat them.
    The good doctor has to get to the golf course sometime!
    Perhaps I will skip golf tommorow afternoon...
    Seems a bit rough.
  • Options
    Jim_MillerJim_Miller Posts: 2,512
    Somewhere beyond admitting error: Louisiana Governor Earl Long -- for whom words like "colorful", and "eccentric", are insufficient -- once campaigned promising no new taxes. After inauguration, he immediately called for a tax increase.

    When reporters contfronted him about this, he said, simply: "Boys, I lied!" Which, I have to admit with some embarrassment, I like.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earl_Long
This discussion has been closed.