RochdalePioneers said:

Morning all! Interesting to read that MPs may want to speak to Mrs Johnson - mainly because the press can't. There is a black hole which although light cannot escape it (because of the rumoured super-injunction) can at least be seen because of its impact.

Wasn't the last time Mrs Johnson was seen when Bonzo was physically dragging her down the road to vote in the local elections...?

Wonder in which luxurious pad she is in hiding

turbotubbs said:

ydoethur said:

Peter_the_Punter said:

rcs1000 said:

IshmaelZ said:

Farooq said:

Peter_the_Punter said:

@JosiasJessop

Hi JJ. Wanted to get back to you on a little question I put to you a week or so ago.

I said there were only two rivers in the world that flow South to North, the Nile and the other is in Gloucestershire - the Isbourne.

I took a lot of flak from posters saying there were many more than that but I think they were taking a loose view of the definition. The Isbourne flows due North for its entire length, from its source on Cleeve Hill to the point it joins the Avon near Evesham. There may be others that run S/N, I grant, but very few that follow the compass so directly.

Hope that clears matters up.

Atb

PtP

The Hulahula river in Alaska starts at 144°00'40.8"W and ends at 144°01'24.6"W, 109km to the north.
The projection from source to mouth is 359.76 degrees, almost exactly true north

The Nile is all over the shop. I think the original point was, all fucking humongous rivers (Congo Orinoco Amazon Zambezi) run roughly EW or WE, except Nile which is roughly SN.

Errr

What about the Mississippi - https://www.google.com/search?q=mississippi+river+basin&oq=Mississippi+River+basin&aqs=chrome.0.0i512l8.4127j0j7&client=ms-android-samsung-rvo1&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8#imgrc=oGsFqE3Qi5JigM

Runs N/S doesn't it? Nile and Isbourne run S/N.

As does the River Conwy, to take only the most obvious example missing from the earlier list.

Edit - in another link to @Big_G_NorthWales so does the River Lossie.

I think the original is intended to be ‘flows S to N through the it’s entire course’, but also includes the Nile, which is obvious bunkum.
Ultimately it’s a factoid, not a fact.

Well, the Conwy still does. Almost due north the whole way. There's one part where one of the headwaters flows north to south leaving Llyn Conwy but where it becomes an actual river at Capel Garmon from there it's due north all the way.

MoonRabbit said:

Roger said:

I'm sure everyone will have seen this from Andrew Marr but just in case they haven't or they doubt what a piece of shit we have for a Prime Minister watch it again

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mLtO8i9MIU

Is it just me, or do you all have the feeling Boris Johnson is running out of road?

Boris Johnson isn't going to win the election on the votes of Andrew Marr followers.

As Trump put it, "we love the uneducated." And they won't turn out for Priti, Raab or Truss.

turbotubbs said:

ydoethur said:

Peter_the_Punter said:

rcs1000 said:

IshmaelZ said:

Farooq said:

Peter_the_Punter said:

@JosiasJessop

Hi JJ. Wanted to get back to you on a little question I put to you a week or so ago.

I said there were only two rivers in the world that flow South to North, the Nile and the other is in Gloucestershire - the Isbourne.

I took a lot of flak from posters saying there were many more than that but I think they were taking a loose view of the definition. The Isbourne flows due North for its entire length, from its source on Cleeve Hill to the point it joins the Avon near Evesham. There may be others that run S/N, I grant, but very few that follow the compass so directly.

Hope that clears matters up.

Atb

PtP

The Hulahula river in Alaska starts at 144°00'40.8"W and ends at 144°01'24.6"W, 109km to the north.
The projection from source to mouth is 359.76 degrees, almost exactly true north

The Nile is all over the shop. I think the original point was, all fucking humongous rivers (Congo Orinoco Amazon Zambezi) run roughly EW or WE, except Nile which is roughly SN.

Errr

What about the Mississippi - https://www.google.com/search?q=mississippi+river+basin&oq=Mississippi+River+basin&aqs=chrome.0.0i512l8.4127j0j7&client=ms-android-samsung-rvo1&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8#imgrc=oGsFqE3Qi5JigM

Runs N/S doesn't it? Nile and Isbourne run S/N.

As does the River Conwy, to take only the most obvious example missing from the earlier list.

Edit - in another link to @Big_G_NorthWales so does the River Lossie.

I think the original is intended to be ‘flows S to N through the it’s entire course’, but also includes the Nile, which is obvious bunkum.
Ultimately it’s a factoid, not a fact.

The river Bann in Ulster is another North/South river, flowing from Lough Neagh to the north coast near Coleraine. Also the Rhein flows mostly north/south as does the Rhone in France

turbotubbs said:

malcolmg said:

turbotubbs said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Morning all! Interesting to read that MPs may want to speak to Mrs Johnson - mainly because the press can't. There is a black hole which although light cannot escape it (because of the rumoured super-injunction) can at least be seen because of its impact.

Wasn't the last time Mrs Johnson was seen when Bonzo was physically dragging her down the road to vote in the local elections...?

So apparently they had their daughter christened at the weekend. Not sure how that ties in with the other story, but who knows.

any evidence of that

https://dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10866149/Boris-Johnson-wife-Carrie-hold-private-christening-daughter-Romy.html

Not sure that "reports" stories in the Heil counts as evidence. Remember that their output now splits into three distinct sections:
1. Pro-Boris lies. EU forced us to remove crown logos from pint glasses
2. Long lens celeb photos, often of young totty doing shocking things like being young and having legs
3. Opinion pieces attacking young celeb totty for scandalising decent society with their legs

RochdalePioneers said:

turbotubbs said:

malcolmg said:

turbotubbs said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Morning all! Interesting to read that MPs may want to speak to Mrs Johnson - mainly because the press can't. There is a black hole which although light cannot escape it (because of the rumoured super-injunction) can at least be seen because of its impact.

Wasn't the last time Mrs Johnson was seen when Bonzo was physically dragging her down the road to vote in the local elections...?

So apparently they had their daughter christened at the weekend. Not sure how that ties in with the other story, but who knows.

any evidence of that

https://dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10866149/Boris-Johnson-wife-Carrie-hold-private-christening-daughter-Romy.html

Not sure that "reports" stories in the Heil counts as evidence. Remember that their output now splits into three distinct sections:
1. Pro-Boris lies. EU forced us to remove crown logos from pint glasses
2. Long lens celeb photos, often of young totty doing shocking things like being young and having legs
3. Opinion pieces attacking young celeb totty for scandalising decent society with their legs

Absolutely - could be utter bollix as you say. But where is the evidence she has run off with .....? Just fandoms on twitter?

Morris_Dancer said:

Good morning, everyone.

Mr. Moonshine, Galadriel was one of the most powerful elves in Middle Earth, and holder of one of the three elven rings.

Sadly, he was also a compulsive gambler, who lost the ring in a game of poker to Han Solo.

Stuartinromford said:

IshmaelZ said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Morning all! Interesting to read that MPs may want to speak to Mrs Johnson - mainly because the press can't. There is a black hole which although light cannot escape it (because of the rumoured super-injunction) can at least be seen because of its impact.

Wasn't the last time Mrs Johnson was seen when Bonzo was physically dragging her down the road to vote in the local elections...?

Oh fuck there's another one is there about ......... running off with ....?

Don't see it affects us if we haven't been served with it.

Thing I've never understood about superinjunctions.

If people don't know they exist, what's the mechanism that makes them effective?

My favourite one was the Ryan Giggs one, which everyone knew about within about a week, and Joshua Rozenberg began a BBC analysis of it with these immortal words.

'Well, the law is clear. There's a court order in place which says we cannot name Ryan Giggs as the holder of this superinjunction.'

rcs1000 said:

Pagan2 said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Pagan2 said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Pagan2 said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Pagan2 said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Pagan2 said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Pagan2 said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

I don’t consider Johnson the lesser or two evils no. Just as bad as Corbyn

You considered Corbyn a great bloke for a long while, forgive us if we therefore look at your character judgement with a somewhat dubious feeling.

Aren’t you the poster that holds up cashiers by paying in exact change

wow paying money is a crime now.....only in lefty minds

No you're the bloke that wants to bring back imperial even though nobody under the age of 903 understands it

I dont care if its brought back or not I merely commented that there were reasons why sometimes lsd was superior. Stop fibbing or find a post where I have advocated its return. Closest you will find is this one

"people should be able to sell in any measure with the caveat that other meausure should be shown such as price per 100g . I dont want to shut the young out from being able to make good purchasing decisions"

and that wasnt arguing for its return merely saying I dont think people should be disbarred from selling or buying in any units they like as long as they are marked with the price also in a commonly undestood measure.

There’s not a single case where imperial is easier or more sensible than metric.

Name an example

3 people go out for a meal far easier to split in L s d coinage I think was the example I posted. I haven't argued imperial was easier or more difficult. Once again putting words in my mouth I never uttered. If you believe I have argued so then post the link....clue you can't because I never said it.

What on Earth are you on about

I am talking about you lying about what I said. Put up or shut up with your allegations

You’re dangerously silly.

You said an advantage of imperial is that you can divide by three. Ever heard of a calculator?

I said an advantage of L s d is easy to divide by three. I didnt mention imperial. They were two different conversations. L s d is easily divisible by 2 3 4 6 8, decimal currency is only easily divisible by 2 4,5 and 10

Well yes, having three separate elements (pounds, shilling and pence) makes it easier to split by three. In fact, it makes it easier to divide by any number, because not only do have more divisors, you alsio have a higher degree of resolution - a pound is split into 240 old pence.

Nevertheless, in a world of computers operating on binary and decimal numbers, this ease for human calculations is a drawback for the machines. While you can find hexadecimal numbers (2^8), you will find none based around three powers, with varying units per power.

Since hardly anyone can actually remember the coins they're nostalgic about the government should just make a new system but using the old words. They can leapfrog the foreign competition in information technology by making it all binary based, like:

1 penny
256 pennies = 1 farthing
256 farthings = 1 groat

CD13 said:

I see the Grammar school issue bobs up again. Interesting that the man who led the Labour charge against Gramar schools was Tony Crossland who was educated at 'Highgate school'. Is that the local secondary school?

We had four boys in our family, born from 1947 to 1952 on the local council estate. Three went to the local grammar school, one to the local secondary. Incidentally, the grammar school was the one Jonathan van Tam went to later. The difference between the schools .... discipline. The facilities were similar, the teachers the same mixed bunch. I hated the extra discipline, but perhaps, this Birbalsingh lady has the right idea after all?

Or could it be competition? Smart kids pushing each other harder and harder. The classes covering more ground, in more depth. Like an army, classes tend to move at the speed of the slowest member.

Of course, without an Empire, you could argue that producing masses of classically trained administrators isn't the best use of our resources.

The rise of automation and AI is going to take a large bite out of the services jobs around financial services currently absorbing Oxbridge types.

It might be an interesting medium term project for a forward looking administration. Another Brexit opportunity cost, I guess.

MoonRabbit said:

Roger said:

I'm sure everyone will have seen this from Andrew Marr but just in case they haven't or they doubt what a piece of shit we have for a Prime Minister watch it again

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mLtO8i9MIU

Is it just me, or do you all have the feeling Boris Johnson is running out of road?

Boris has been running out of road for months, but more tarmac just seems to get laid.

kjh said:

Boris has been running out of road for months, but more tarmac just seems to get laid.

I feel sorry for Johnson that he’s reduced to pretending he’ll bring back grammar schools when what he really wants to do is pretend they are going to build a bridge to Northern Ireland
https://twitter.com/twlldun/status/1531171213065715712

stjohn said:

kjh said:

MoonRabbit said:

Roger said:

I'm sure everyone will have seen this from Andrew Marr but just in case they haven't or they doubt what a piece of shit we have for a Prime Minister watch it again

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mLtO8i9MIU

Is it just me, or do you all have the feeling Boris Johnson is running out of road?

Boris has been running out of road for months, but more tarmac just seems to get laid.

So he's still in a sticky position.

Very frequently when he gets laid...

ydoethur said:

stjohn said:

kjh said:

MoonRabbit said:

Roger said:

I'm sure everyone will have seen this from Andrew Marr but just in case they haven't or they doubt what a piece of shit we have for a Prime Minister watch it again

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mLtO8i9MIU

Is it just me, or do you all have the feeling Boris Johnson is running out of road?

Boris has been running out of road for months, but more tarmac just seems to get laid.

So he's still in a sticky position.

Very frequently when he gets laid...

He's in the stickiest situation since Sticky the Stick Insect got stuck on a sticky bun.

Good morning everybody.

On topic, I suspect that Johnson won't be out before the next GE unless another well-paid option comes along, one which permits the foolish to think he's a Great Man.
At the GE, though he'll either spectacularly crash and burn ..... see the Conservatives in Canada a few years ago,..... or triumph, due to some event that ATM we cannot foresee.

Or one of his wives or children will, from somewhere legally safe, tell all!

IshmaelZ said:

OK apart from the Nile, Mississippi, Volga, Lena and Ob, what NS oriented rivers have the Romans ever given us?

Essequibo.

Surely a Guyana half like yourself has heard of that one?

IshmaelZ said:

OK apart from the Nile, Mississippi, Volga, Lena and Ob, what NS oriented rivers have the Romans ever given us?

The Fenland Ouse? Flows into the Wash. The Rhine flows North for most of it's route, then turns West.

pm215 said:

rcs1000 said:

Nevertheless, in a world of computers operating on binary and decimal numbers, this ease for human calculations is a drawback for the machines. While you can find hexadecimal numbers (2^8), you will find none based around three powers, with varying units per power.

I believe the LEO (Lyons Electronic Office) computers of the 1950s had special support for handling Lsd currency values. These days of course the cost of converting input values down to pence to work on them would be peanuts...

Well duh.

At the same time, why would you complicate, rather than simplify?

Why would you choose to have (rather than having one forced on your through tradition) a numerical system that contained three different orders of magnitude, all of which required base ten to express, but which were not actually in base ten?

Answer: you wouldn't.

Beibheirli_C said:

turbotubbs said:

ydoethur said:

Peter_the_Punter said:

rcs1000 said:

IshmaelZ said:

Farooq said:

Peter_the_Punter said:

@JosiasJessop

Hi JJ. Wanted to get back to you on a little question I put to you a week or so ago.

I said there were only two rivers in the world that flow South to North, the Nile and the other is in Gloucestershire - the Isbourne.

I took a lot of flak from posters saying there were many more than that but I think they were taking a loose view of the definition. The Isbourne flows due North for its entire length, from its source on Cleeve Hill to the point it joins the Avon near Evesham. There may be others that run S/N, I grant, but very few that follow the compass so directly.

Hope that clears matters up.

Atb

PtP

The Hulahula river in Alaska starts at 144°00'40.8"W and ends at 144°01'24.6"W, 109km to the north.
The projection from source to mouth is 359.76 degrees, almost exactly true north

The Nile is all over the shop. I think the original point was, all fucking humongous rivers (Congo Orinoco Amazon Zambezi) run roughly EW or WE, except Nile which is roughly SN.

Errr

What about the Mississippi - https://www.google.com/search?q=mississippi+river+basin&oq=Mississippi+River+basin&aqs=chrome.0.0i512l8.4127j0j7&client=ms-android-samsung-rvo1&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8#imgrc=oGsFqE3Qi5JigM

Runs N/S doesn't it? Nile and Isbourne run S/N.

As does the River Conwy, to take only the most obvious example missing from the earlier list.

Edit - in another link to @Big_G_NorthWales so does the River Lossie.

I think the original is intended to be ‘flows S to N through the it’s entire course’, but also includes the Nile, which is obvious bunkum.
Ultimately it’s a factoid, not a fact.

The river Bann in Ulster is another North/South river, flowing from Lough Neagh to the north coast near Coleraine. Also the Rhein flows mostly north/south as does the Rhone in France

Naver in north Sutherland, and others following the same grain of structure.

I was summoned to Whitehall to be asked if Ordnance Survey would return to yards and feet and the one inch map series . Had to explain we had gone metric in the 1930’s with OSGB36 😂 (1)

I was then told the Americans used feet and so it was possible . Explained the Americans moved to a metric system well before us in mapping and so it was illogical to return to feet especially now with GPS (2)

This went down even less well - so then I asked which foot was their preference . The US foot , the British foot or the Internationally agreed foot . The meeting then ended (4)

https://twitter.com/gpsbaby/status/1531040401204944898

IshmaelZ said:

OK apart from the Nile, Mississippi, Volga, Lena and Ob, what NS oriented rivers have the Romans ever given us?

Let’s not cross that Rubicon.

DavidL said:

rottenborough said:

NickPalmer said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Monkeys said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

'People love Boris Johnson. They want to see him, they want to touch him, they want to have their kids photographed with him. Keir Starmer hasn't got a tenth of his charisma.'

Andrew Pierce discusses the Prime Minister's popularity.

Are some people here on the same stuff as this guy?

https://twitter.com/GBNEWS/status/1530943752029757443

It's true that Starmer doesn't have his charisma but that doesn't mean Boris isn't a turnoff for a good proportion of the electorate. Starmer is there to make the Labour party boring again for a while so it's not even a bad quality to have.

I am very confused why boring is a bad attribute. Anyone ever heard Wilson or Attlee speak?

Wilson was quite a witty speaker in his day, was he not? Are you sure it is not his accent putting you off?

I've just found this on Youtube: a half-hour interview with Wilson before the first 1974 election. Can you imagine Boris doing this? Will there be a windfall tax? One odd thing to our ears is the talk of housewives in regard to food prices. Also a discussion of wage increases in time of inflation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaasnLeYdIE

Interesting - he sounds quite Corbynite to modern ears. Price controls! Rent controls! Very assured speaker, though.

Isn't the failure of price controls in 1970s one of the lessons that Corbyn didn't learn? I ask as a genuine economic question rather than just having a go.

Yeah, thank goodness we don't have anything as stupid as price caps for energy now which drove half the companies out the market. How absurd would that be?

Not only that, but now people are blaming the government for price rises.

Without the silly intervention of a price cap, government could be seen as on the side of the consumer, pressuring the energy companies.

Carnyx said:

kjh said:

Foxy said:

dixiedean said:

HYUFD said:

Gardenwalker said:

Foxy said:

Gardenwalker said:

I’m not convinced “bobbies on the beat” *doesn’t* work, if one can use the term in the fullest sense.

To me it implies policemen who take have the time and focus to really understand a specific local community and can therefore act prophylactically, as it were.

The 1997 pledge card pledged to halve the time to sentencing for young offenders.

That sort of pledge should run again. Waiting lists for trial dates are a scandal. In practice a lot of cases are going to have to be abandoned otherwise.

The Tory record on crime is appalling.
Also on health care.
Also on standards of living.

I can’t think of a government - not since Major’s Tories indeed - with a poorer record to take to the voters on the three most salient issues.

In 1997, crime was falling thanks to Howard and unemployment was low and the economy was growing, certainly a better legacy on that than Brown Labour in 2010

There can be no doubt whatsoever that in 1997 Britain was a land of pure delight at the wisdom and foresight of its benign and wise rulers.

1997 was quite some election. I really enjoyed it.

That the economy had picked up didn't endear the government to the voters.

Same here. I was at a party and when the Northavon result came in as a LD win we all looked at each other going where the f*** is Northavon? A bit of thought and we could probably worked out it was north of the Avon.

Yes, but which Avon? There are at least three ignoring soundalikes.

Because it's from the Welsh 'Afon' meaning 'river.'

It's always amused me that so many people river to the 'River Avon' unaware that it's a tautology.

THis thread has ... not allowed to tell you.

ydoethur said:

Stuartinromford said:

IshmaelZ said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Morning all! Interesting to read that MPs may want to speak to Mrs Johnson - mainly because the press can't. There is a black hole which although light cannot escape it (because of the rumoured super-injunction) can at least be seen because of its impact.

Wasn't the last time Mrs Johnson was seen when Bonzo was physically dragging her down the road to vote in the local elections...?

Oh fuck there's another one is there about ......... running off with ....?

Don't see it affects us if we haven't been served with it.

Thing I've never understood about superinjunctions.

If people don't know they exist, what's the mechanism that makes them effective?

My favourite one was the Ryan Giggs one, which everyone knew about within about a week, and Joshua Rozenberg began a BBC analysis of it with these immortal words.

'Well, the law is clear. There's a court order in place which says we cannot name Ryan Giggs as the holder of this superinjunction.'

Talking of superinjunctions, I was chatting with a non-political friend in Glasgow yesterday who claimed that Sturgeon’s absence from public life is nothing to do with COVID but in fact a result of the #BalmoralHotelIncident and consequent bruising (which is almost certainly rubbish as the alleged “incident” has been doing the rounds for ages) - but it does show how some of this “bubble” rubbish can cut through.

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Surely the tunnel to NI must be announced again soon

Not necessarily.

The tunnel was an absurd thing that Boris wanted.

Grammar schools and imperial units are absurd things that Conservative MPs, The Mail and The Telegraph want.

That he has gone from talking about his wants to other people's wants is progress, of a sort.

Carnyx said:

turbotubbs said:

malcolmg said:

turbotubbs said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Morning all! Interesting to read that MPs may want to speak to Mrs Johnson - mainly because the press can't. There is a black hole which although light cannot escape it (because of the rumoured super-injunction) can at least be seen because of its impact.

Wasn't the last time Mrs Johnson was seen when Bonzo was physically dragging her down the road to vote in the local elections...?

So apparently they had their daughter christened at the weekend. Not sure how that ties in with the other story, but who knows.

any evidence of that

https://dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10866149/Boris-Johnson-wife-Carrie-hold-private-christening-daughter-Romy.html

"evidence" is the operational word. Not something from the DM. I mean, it can't be private if the DM was there, so there's a massive contradiction there.

Cuts both ways though. Evidence of Galadriel leaving the nest thats not randoms on twitter?

Farooq said:

kjh said:

HYUFD said:

Farooq said:

HYUFD said:

Gardenwalker said:

Foxy said:

Gardenwalker said:

I’m not convinced “bobbies on the beat” *doesn’t* work, if one can use the term in the fullest sense.

To me it implies policemen who take have the time and focus to really understand a specific local community and can therefore act prophylactically, as it were.

The 1997 pledge card pledged to halve the time to sentencing for young offenders.

That sort of pledge should run again. Waiting lists for trial dates are a scandal. In practice a lot of cases are going to have to be abandoned otherwise.

The Tory record on crime is appalling.
Also on health care.
Also on standards of living.

I can’t think of a government - not since Major’s Tories indeed - with a poorer record to take to the voters on the three most salient issues.

In 1997, crime was falling thanks to Howard and unemployment was low and the economy was growing, certainly a better legacy on that than Brown Labour in 2010

Source?
This shows a different story:
https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/GBR/united-kingdom/crime-rate-statistics

Crime fell in 1995 and 1996 when Howard was Home Secretary on those stats, thanks for confimring

What? You said 97. They went up in 97. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt and pick the range he was home secretary. No that doesn't work either. You can't state something and when shown to be wrong change the facts. Just for once put your hands up.

Worst of all, I wasn't telling him he was wrong, I was just trying to fact-check it. I found some figures which disagreed, and I was just wondering what figures he was looking at.

Time and time again, HYUFD just comes out with total crap, and most of the time I feel like I'm the only one checking. He has a weird reputation on here for having the facts at his fingertips, but half his facts are lies.

Yes and I was absolutely right. crime was falling in the last 2 years of the Tory government before Labour took over in 1997

kjh said:

HYUFD said:

Farooq said:

HYUFD said:

Gardenwalker said:

Foxy said:

Gardenwalker said:

I’m not convinced “bobbies on the beat” *doesn’t* work, if one can use the term in the fullest sense.

To me it implies policemen who take have the time and focus to really understand a specific local community and can therefore act prophylactically, as it were.

The 1997 pledge card pledged to halve the time to sentencing for young offenders.

That sort of pledge should run again. Waiting lists for trial dates are a scandal. In practice a lot of cases are going to have to be abandoned otherwise.

The Tory record on crime is appalling.
Also on health care.
Also on standards of living.

I can’t think of a government - not since Major’s Tories indeed - with a poorer record to take to the voters on the three most salient issues.

In 1997, crime was falling thanks to Howard and unemployment was low and the economy was growing, certainly a better legacy on that than Brown Labour in 2010

Source?
This shows a different story:
https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/GBR/united-kingdom/crime-rate-statistics

Crime fell in 1995 and 1996 when Howard was Home Secretary on those stats, thanks for confimring

What? You said 97. They went up in 97. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt and pick the range he was home secretary. No that doesn't work either. You can't state something and when shown to be wrong change the facts. Just for once put your hands up.

Yes and for the majority of 1997 we had a Labour government and crime then went up even more in 1998 in Labour's second year of power having fallen in the last 2 years of the Tory government thanks to Howard. So I was 100% correct so don't you try pushing your anti Tory ideological agenda to distort the facts!

Gardenwalker said:

dixiedean said:

rottenborough said:

‘I’m with the gays’: How new revelations of Carrie Johnson gathering on Boris’ birthday may derail his premiership

Telegraph.

Is there a link for that?

Presumably this the ABBA party.
That didn’t happen.

Another day, another party.

No wonder Nadine is trying to circle the wagons.

Grey's report didn't get him.

"Gays" report might?

Farooq said:

HYUFD said:

Farooq said:

kjh said:

HYUFD said:

Farooq said:

HYUFD said:

Gardenwalker said:

Foxy said:

Gardenwalker said:

I’m not convinced “bobbies on the beat” *doesn’t* work, if one can use the term in the fullest sense.

To me it implies policemen who take have the time and focus to really understand a specific local community and can therefore act prophylactically, as it were.

The 1997 pledge card pledged to halve the time to sentencing for young offenders.

That sort of pledge should run again. Waiting lists for trial dates are a scandal. In practice a lot of cases are going to have to be abandoned otherwise.

The Tory record on crime is appalling.
Also on health care.
Also on standards of living.

I can’t think of a government - not since Major’s Tories indeed - with a poorer record to take to the voters on the three most salient issues.

In 1997, crime was falling thanks to Howard and unemployment was low and the economy was growing, certainly a better legacy on that than Brown Labour in 2010

Source?
This shows a different story:
https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/GBR/united-kingdom/crime-rate-statistics

Crime fell in 1995 and 1996 when Howard was Home Secretary on those stats, thanks for confimring

What? You said 97. They went up in 97. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt and pick the range he was home secretary. No that doesn't work either. You can't state something and when shown to be wrong change the facts. Just for once put your hands up.

Worst of all, I wasn't telling him he was wrong, I was just trying to fact-check it. I found some figures which disagreed, and I was just wondering what figures he was looking at.

Time and time again, HYUFD just comes out with total crap, and most of the time I feel like I'm the only one checking. He has a weird reputation on here for having the facts at his fingertips, but half his facts are lies.

Yes and I was absolutely right. crime was falling in the last 2 years of the Tory government before Labour took over in 1997

You: "In 1997, crime was falling"
Me: looks like it was rising
You: IT WAS FALLING IN [other years] I WAS RIGHT

Away with your gaslighting

Yes crime was falling when the Tories left office in 1997, in both the previous 2 years of 1996 and 1995 when Howard was Home Secretary.

However Labour was in government for 7 out of 12 of the months of 1997, so unfortunately by the end of 1997 new Home Secretary Straw and Labour's legacy of failure on crime was starting to show in the figures, as it did even more so the following year, 1998, when crime rose by 6% on the very stats you linked to!

Farooq said:

HYUFD said:

Farooq said:

HYUFD said:

Farooq said:

kjh said:

HYUFD said:

Farooq said:

HYUFD said:

Gardenwalker said:

Foxy said:

Gardenwalker said:

I’m not convinced “bobbies on the beat” *doesn’t* work, if one can use the term in the fullest sense.

To me it implies policemen who take have the time and focus to really understand a specific local community and can therefore act prophylactically, as it were.

The 1997 pledge card pledged to halve the time to sentencing for young offenders.

That sort of pledge should run again. Waiting lists for trial dates are a scandal. In practice a lot of cases are going to have to be abandoned otherwise.

The Tory record on crime is appalling.
Also on health care.
Also on standards of living.

I can’t think of a government - not since Major’s Tories indeed - with a poorer record to take to the voters on the three most salient issues.

In 1997, crime was falling thanks to Howard and unemployment was low and the economy was growing, certainly a better legacy on that than Brown Labour in 2010

Source?
This shows a different story:
https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/GBR/united-kingdom/crime-rate-statistics

Crime fell in 1995 and 1996 when Howard was Home Secretary on those stats, thanks for confimring

What? You said 97. They went up in 97. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt and pick the range he was home secretary. No that doesn't work either. You can't state something and when shown to be wrong change the facts. Just for once put your hands up.

Worst of all, I wasn't telling him he was wrong, I was just trying to fact-check it. I found some figures which disagreed, and I was just wondering what figures he was looking at.

Time and time again, HYUFD just comes out with total crap, and most of the time I feel like I'm the only one checking. He has a weird reputation on here for having the facts at his fingertips, but half his facts are lies.

Yes and I was absolutely right. crime was falling in the last 2 years of the Tory government before Labour took over in 1997

You: "In 1997, crime was falling"
Me: looks like it was rising
You: IT WAS FALLING IN [other years] I WAS RIGHT

Away with your gaslighting

Yes crime was falling when the Tories left office in 1997, in both the previous 2 years of 1996 and 1995 when Howard was Home Secretary.

However Labour was in government for 7 out of 12 of the months of 1997, so unfortunately by the end of 1997 new Home Secretary Straw and Labour's legacy of failure on crime was starting to show in the figures, as it did even more so the following year, 1998, when crime rose by 6% on the very stats you linked to!

I'm not interested at all in trying to defend one party or another, I'm just holding YOU to account on your "facts".

If you have month-on-month stats, we can go down to the month level but without that we can just chalk it down to you saying something false and then wriggling around trying to make it true by changing it.

Yet again.

There is nothing to account for. I was correct, crime was falling in the last years of the Tory government ie 1995 and 1996 and then rose in the first years of the New Labour government ie the majority of 1997 and all of 1998.

Of course you are interested in defending one party or the other as like kjh you have an anti Tory agenda. You can throw your toys out the pram because you dislike the facts but the facts support what I said, crime was falling under Howard as Home Secretary

.

ydoethur said:

Carnyx said:

kjh said:

Foxy said:

dixiedean said:

HYUFD said:

Gardenwalker said:

Foxy said:

Gardenwalker said:

I’m not convinced “bobbies on the beat” *doesn’t* work, if one can use the term in the fullest sense.

To me it implies policemen who take have the time and focus to really understand a specific local community and can therefore act prophylactically, as it were.

The 1997 pledge card pledged to halve the time to sentencing for young offenders.

That sort of pledge should run again. Waiting lists for trial dates are a scandal. In practice a lot of cases are going to have to be abandoned otherwise.

The Tory record on crime is appalling.
Also on health care.
Also on standards of living.

I can’t think of a government - not since Major’s Tories indeed - with a poorer record to take to the voters on the three most salient issues.

In 1997, crime was falling thanks to Howard and unemployment was low and the economy was growing, certainly a better legacy on that than Brown Labour in 2010

There can be no doubt whatsoever that in 1997 Britain was a land of pure delight at the wisdom and foresight of its benign and wise rulers.

1997 was quite some election. I really enjoyed it.

That the economy had picked up didn't endear the government to the voters.

Same here. I was at a party and when the Northavon result came in as a LD win we all looked at each other going where the f*** is Northavon? A bit of thought and we could probably worked out it was north of the Avon.

Yes, but which Avon? There are at least three ignoring soundalikes.

Because it's from the Welsh 'Afon' meaning 'river.'

It's always amused me that so many people river to the 'River Avon' unaware that it's a tautology.

There's a Judge Judge, so why not a River River ?

Keystone said:

HYUFD said:

Keystone said:

CD13 said:

I see the Grammar school issue bobs up again. Interesting that the man who led the Labour charge against Gramar schools was Tony Crossland who was educated at 'Highgate school'. Is that the local secondary school?

We had four boys in our family, born from 1947 to 1952 on the local council estate. Three went to the local grammar school, one to the local secondary. Incidentally, the grammar school was the one Jonathan van Tam went to later. The difference between the schools .... discipline. The facilities were similar, the teachers the same mixed bunch. I hated the extra discipline, but perhaps, this Birbalsingh lady has the right idea after all?

Or could it be competition? Smart kids pushing each other harder and harder. The classes covering more ground, in more depth. Like an army, classes tend to move at the speed of the slowest member.

Of course, without an Empire, you could argue that producing masses of classically trained administrators isn't the best use of our resources.

The rise of automation and AI is going to take a large bite out of the services jobs around financial services currently absorbing Oxbridge types.

It might be an interesting medium term project for a forward looking administration. Another Brexit opportunity cost, I guess.

Oxbridge does computer science and engineering too you know

But the best engineering departments are not there, any more than the best law or medical courses.

Best engineering departments UK 1 Cambridge, 2 Oxford, 3 Imperial

https://www.timeshighereducation.com/student/best-universities/best-universities-engineering-degrees-uk

turbotubbs said:

malcolmg said:

turbotubbs said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Morning all! Interesting to read that MPs may want to speak to Mrs Johnson - mainly because the press can't. There is a black hole which although light cannot escape it (because of the rumoured super-injunction) can at least be seen because of its impact.

Wasn't the last time Mrs Johnson was seen when Bonzo was physically dragging her down the road to vote in the local elections...?

So apparently they had their daughter christened at the weekend. Not sure how that ties in with the other story, but who knows.

any evidence of that

https://dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10866149/Boris-Johnson-wife-Carrie-hold-private-christening-daughter-Romy.html

cheers