Even the oldies are now giving Johnson negative ratings – politicalbetting.com

Farooq said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

The evil of the British Empire for one. A scar on us for time immemorial..

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

America's democracy is something they had to wrestle us for. The idea that we bestowed it upon them is a hellava a take.

Carnyx said:

Farooq said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

Is this even serious?

We conquered the world. And it was mainly good. We didn’t push over a wall and kill some Italian teens during a football match. Get a grip

Ok. Fair enough - if we are going simplistic (it wasn’t just Italian teens and it wasn’t just a simple case of some Liverpool fans pushing over a wall out of nothing).

Amritsar - we just controlled a riot as quickly as possible - naughty Indian teens….

Thing is you are probably the poster I agree most with on here for my sins but I’m staggered how miffed you have been by booing a pretty rubbish hymn - if it had been “I vow to thee my country” then I would be in my tank towards Anfield Road but really, perspective?

I hear you.

Maybe I always had this secret Simon Heffer-esque contempt for ugly, contemptible, obese, do-nothing Liverpool? But I hid it. OK, they booed our 96-year Queen during the year of her Platinum Jubilee, and a year or two after our widowhood. Maybe I could have contained myself, if they had done only that. But booing a beautiful religious hymn with the most profound lyrics ever written about humanity yielding with grace to mortality, WTAF??

They are monkeys. They are an element in working class British culture - fat, wanky, ugly, dumb, inadequate, Philistine, pathetic and gruesomely proud of it - which I utterly despise. Let them sink into the Irish Sea. Millwall have more nobility

I get you but you are in danger of going full-Roger…..

What would Bill Shankly or Ian Paisley have thought of them booing the Queen, or booing the National Anthem, and then booing ABIDE WITH ME?

I do not think they would have expressed admiration. And their bewildered contempt would be justified. We have regressed as a nation and a culture and Liverpool fans are the pimply, wobbly, nihilistic cutting edge. Well done, lads

Do you think you might be overreacting to some booing? It's no violence to express an opinion.

Leon's completely missing the point. The fans are showing a discriminating sense of musical criticism.

Taz said:

dixiedean said:

Just seen an attempted stabbing. In the middle of the road. At 8 o'clock daylight.
Summat in the air today.

In rural Northumberland ?

Casino_Royale said:

Farooq said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

The evil of the British Empire for one. A scar on us for time immemorial..

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

America's democracy is something they had to wrestle us for. The idea that we bestowed it upon them is a hellava a take.

They literally based their constitution on our Bill of Rights and Magna Carta. Their argument was that as sons of liberty (Englishmen) royal governance had strayed from the true path.

Try reading some history and thinking for yourself rather than imbibing fashionable contemporary propaganda.

People will respect you more.

SandyRentool said:

ydoethur said:

SandyRentool said:

News from the by-election front line:

My train is just pulling in to Wakey Westgate. and none of those baling off look like rapid Yorkshire Party supporters to me.

(Waves out of train window to Mr Herdson!)

Only really slow ones?

Autocorrect is the new comedy.

Foxy said:

pigeon said:

Gardenwalker said:

Leon said:

dixiedean said:

Leon said:

dixiedean said:

Has anyone else tried contacting HMRC recently?
Tried three times today. Simply say they are too busy. Goodbye.
Not even the joy of an hour on hold
They've deducted me money for a tax credit overpayment completely without warning.

They’re all working from fucking home. We tried to tell you. It’s shit

You don't need to be sitting in an office to answer a phone.
That's just an excuse.

But this is why this shit is happening. It is a disaster for the British economy, if it continues

As an international flintic dildo maker and salesman, I can say it is clearly impacting my industry (seriously). The people that are back in the office are On their Game, they respond quickly, they do their job. The people who are WFH reply much slower, they are less alert in general, and less aware of industry news and gossip, and they are hard to hear on phone calls (“Oh sorry that’s my husband slapping the dog” - GO BACK TO THE FUCKING OFFICE THEN)

I reckon we are about to discover there is a reason we have big cities and complex offices, and the cities and offices that function properly will entirely out-compete the people sitting in their stupid gardens. This is not an invention of the Tory party because of its commercial property owning donors

I moderately agree with this.

Some sectors are coping well with WFH,
Others, not. Customer service generally is down, not just in the public sector.

This should come as a surprise to no-one. Who would want to work in a call centre-type occupation - whether office or home based - if they had a better alternative? And, in a low unemployment environment, better alternatives (consisting of practically every other kind of job imaginable) are easier than usual to come by.

Then, of course, the harder businesses find it to recruit workers willing to put up with a constant barrage of shouting from enraged customers, the smaller the available pool of call handlers, the worse the service becomes, the more rage the remaining staff have to put up with, and the more likely they are to get out as soon as they can find another minimum wage crap job that's less liable to cause them to have a nervous breakdown.

It's the sort of vicious cycle that can only be broken by a spike in joblessness that forces workers to endure the misery, for want of anywhere else to go.

Yes, you have fairly accurately described why our admin booking centre staff and clinic clerks have mostly left. It is rather hampering tackling our outpatient backlogs.

Farooq said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

The evil of the British Empire for one. A scar on us for time immemorial..

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

America's democracy is something they had to wrestle us for. The idea that we bestowed it upon them is a hellava a take.

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

The evil of the British Empire for one. A scar on us for time immemorial..

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

MBE - does it stand for "Masturbating over the British Empire"?

Carnyx said:

Casino_Royale said:

Farooq said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

The evil of the British Empire for one. A scar on us for time immemorial..

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

America's democracy is something they had to wrestle us for. The idea that we bestowed it upon them is a hellava a take.

They literally based their constitution on our Bill of Rights and Magna Carta. Their argument was that as sons of liberty (Englishmen) royal governance had strayed from the true path.

Try reading some history and thinking for yourself rather than imbibing fashionable contemporary propaganda.

People will respect you more.

And the Declaration of Arbroath. Give the Scots some credit, too.

Though the (then) colonials were dam' right about the English bits too. They were being taxed like Englishmen without being treated like them.

ydoethur said:

Carnyx said:

Casino_Royale said:

Farooq said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

The evil of the British Empire for one. A scar on us for time immemorial..

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

America's democracy is something they had to wrestle us for. The idea that we bestowed it upon them is a hellava a take.

They literally based their constitution on our Bill of Rights and Magna Carta. Their argument was that as sons of liberty (Englishmen) royal governance had strayed from the true path.

Try reading some history and thinking for yourself rather than imbibing fashionable contemporary propaganda.

People will respect you more.

And the Declaration of Arbroath. Give the Scots some credit, too.

Though the (then) colonials were dam' right about the English bits too. They were being taxed like Englishmen without being treated like them.

They were hardly taxed at all. They just thought they should literally not be taxed at all.

dixiedean said:

ping said:

dixiedean said:

Just seen an attempted stabbing. In the middle of the road. At 8 o'clock daylight.
Summat in the air today.

Horrible. That sort of thing would shake me up. Hope you’re ok.

Thanks.
Bloke chased bloke on bikes. Knocked him off, then produced knife and repeatedly tried to stab him on the ground. Fortunately, assailant was superbly weedy and completely off his head.
Bloke on ground was a hulking sober guy. So no harm done. They left with much shouting. And the intervention of inevitable screaming girl.
Not much fun.

dixiedean said:

ping said:

dixiedean said:

Just seen an attempted stabbing. In the middle of the road. At 8 o'clock daylight.
Summat in the air today.

Horrible. That sort of thing would shake me up. Hope you’re ok.

Thanks.
Bloke chased bloke on bikes. Knocked him off, then produced knife and repeatedly tried to stab him on the ground. Fortunately, assailant was superbly weedy and completely off his head.
Bloke on ground was a hulking sober guy. So no harm done. They left with much shouting. And the intervention of inevitable screaming girl.
Not much fun.

Andy_JS said:

Thought-provoking article.

"Could black African Brits be about to go Tory?
This socially conservative, upwardly mobile group could cause problems for Labour in big cities.
Rakib Ehsan"

https://www.spiked-online.com/2022/05/18/could-black-african-brits-be-about-to-go-tory/

Farooq said:

Casino_Royale said:

Farooq said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

The evil of the British Empire for one. A scar on us for time immemorial..

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

America's democracy is something they had to wrestle us for. The idea that we bestowed it upon them is a hellava a take.

They literally based their constitution on our Bill of Rights and Magna Carta. Their argument was that as sons of liberty (Englishmen) royal governance had strayed from the true path.

Try reading some history and thinking for yourself rather than imbibing fashionable contemporary propaganda.

People will respect you more.

Based on, yes. Makes you wonder why we killed so many of them trying to stop them.

Casino_Royale said:

Farooq said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

The evil of the British Empire for one. A scar on us for time immemorial..

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

America's democracy is something they had to wrestle us for. The idea that we bestowed it upon them is a hellava a take.

They literally based their constitution on our Bill of Rights and Magna Carta. Their argument was that as sons of liberty (Englishmen) royal governance had strayed from the true path.

Try reading some history and thinking for yourself rather than imbibing fashionable contemporary propaganda.

People will respect you more.

Leon said:

wooliedyed said:

Abide yes
I Vow to Thee yes
For those in peril yes

Jerusalem. No. No. Not at all. Garbage.

This is interesting. Abide With Me is a source of discord in… India


https://www.classicfm.com/music-news/abide-with-me-scrapped-indian-ceremony/

for the obvious reasons. It’s colonial but it’s also beautiful

BartholomewRoberts said:

bondegezou said:

Sandpit said:

dixiedean said:

Leon said:

dixiedean said:

Has anyone else tried contacting HMRC recently?
Tried three times today. Simply say they are too busy. Goodbye.
Not even the joy of an hour on hold
They've deducted me money for a tax credit overpayment completely without warning.

They’re all working from fucking home. We tried to tell you. It’s shit

You don't need to be sitting in an office to answer a phone.
That's just an excuse.

The irony is that a call centre can actually fit really well with both WFH and flexible hours.

BUT, and it’s a big but, it needs the organisation to be structured differently to an in-person call centre, with processes to match. You need a larger group of both L2 technical agents and supervisors, and the managers need to take a different view of their metrics which requires modern phone and IT systems.

I get the impression that much of the public sector and quasi-public sector simply went home in March 2020, plugged their desk phone into a router, used their own laptop to connect to a VPN and a Citrix window, but the organisations never specifically set themselves up for WFH.

A call centre is also a training-heavy environment, and training / teambuilding exercises are best done in person to maintain consistency.

There were lots of call centres before the pandemic that used staff working from their own homes (with appropriate structures in place). It’s always been a job that is well suited to working from home and to employees wanting different working hours. It’s just we, the consumer, didn’t notice.

The problem is that private call centres operate on a principle that they need to work effectively or they don't get business so they don't get paid, so they make sure their operations work.

Public ones - not so much.

I had a rather worrying encounter a few months ago with the Council for a home I used to live in but moved out of in 2019. I'd paid my Council Tax in full by Direct Debit and had notified them when I moved homes and set up a Direct Debit for my new home but then a few years later got a "final demand" letter for overdue Council Tax for 2020-21. I called them and spoke to someone who was working from home and said that I had moved out before this period so it wasn't me who owed the tax, he told me not to worry, promised to get it resolved and would put a hold on the account until they could figure out what had gone wrong.

Two months later I got a Court Summons for unpaid Council Tax, with a court date set for what was then 3 weeks time. I tried calling the Council again but after pressing all the relevant options got a message "our queue is full please try again later". That kept happening again and again for two weeks. Tried emailing them, got an autoreply saying they're currently taking an average of 6 weeks to respond to emails, but the Court Summons was for 3 weeks time.

After a few weeks of calling them every day I eventually got in the queue and through to a human who found my email to them and accepted the proof that I wasn't living at that address for the time in question and the Council had been informed of that. But utterly remarkable that they could take six weeks to respond to an email, but have Court Summons issued for 3 weeks, and the queue 'full'.

If you call a company like Sky you'll get through to someone probably working from home - but at least you'll get through to someone and they take your issue seriously. At least if you threaten to cancel your contract they do.

MoonRabbit said:

Casino_Royale said:

Farooq said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

The evil of the British Empire for one. A scar on us for time immemorial..

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

America's democracy is something they had to wrestle us for. The idea that we bestowed it upon them is a hellava a take.

They literally based their constitution on our Bill of Rights and Magna Carta. Their argument was that as sons of liberty (Englishmen) royal governance had strayed from the true path.

Try reading some history and thinking for yourself rather than imbibing fashionable contemporary propaganda.

People will respect you more.

Was Magna Carta based or inspired on anything that preceded it, such as further afield in Europe, or from Ancient times? If an original creation, who penned it, do we know the names of authors?

MoonRabbit said:

dixiedean said:

ping said:

dixiedean said:

Just seen an attempted stabbing. In the middle of the road. At 8 o'clock daylight.
Summat in the air today.

Horrible. That sort of thing would shake me up. Hope you’re ok.

Thanks.
Bloke chased bloke on bikes. Knocked him off, then produced knife and repeatedly tried to stab him on the ground. Fortunately, assailant was superbly weedy and completely off his head.
Bloke on ground was a hulking sober guy. So no harm done. They left with much shouting. And the intervention of inevitable screaming girl.
Not much fun.

My election campaign right now, reduce crime, and reduce government waste.

MoonRabbit said:

bigjohnowls said:

El_Capitano said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

MoonRabbit said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

MoonRabbit said:

wooliedyed said:

malcolmg said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Looks like another MP under investigation

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-61493206

LOL, G you cannot persuade anyone that that is in any way even remotely as a bad as a Tory, they are real criminals, the guy had a couple of Nurofen in his pocket.

Agree with you here Malc, this is a squirrel story and actually makes the allegations against 'whomever' starkly worse looking

Which side of the bed will Big G get out of tomorow? The right? Or the moderate centre right? 🙂

You can rest assured it will never be the right and anyway you said you loved me ?

Of course I ❤️ you. You do sound a bit het up by it all today though?

Was politics in the old days before I came along all about how many investigations you can get you opponents under, or is this a new phase that is a bit, not quite the point of politics really?

I posted clip of Lady Thatcher at PMQs in recent thread - she’s is just simply explaining the difference in her philosophy and policies in regards theirs. That just made politics simple, explain your point of view.

And they were all terribly polite and respectful to each other as they done it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Q9vYjqQ5Ek

To be honest I am not the least het up but as my beloved will affirm I have this tendency to enjoy winding people up and maybe on occasions it shows

It is fair to say that politics is more tribal and at times just nasty but as far as I am concerned I want Boris to go so I can rejoin the party as I really fear a Starmer led labour party would borrow far too much and I am not convinced they would restrict public sector pay including doctors and nurses as would be necessary

Christ on a bike Big G, the Tories have been running Britain into an early grave consistently for the last 12 years and all you can say is "I'm worried that Labour might give nurses a pay rise"?

El_Capitano said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

MoonRabbit said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

MoonRabbit said:

wooliedyed said:

malcolmg said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Looks like another MP under investigation

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-61493206

LOL, G you cannot persuade anyone that that is in any way even remotely as a bad as a Tory, they are real criminals, the guy had a couple of Nurofen in his pocket.

Agree with you here Malc, this is a squirrel story and actually makes the allegations against 'whomever' starkly worse looking

Which side of the bed will Big G get out of tomorow? The right? Or the moderate centre right? 🙂

You can rest assured it will never be the right and anyway you said you loved me ?

Of course I ❤️ you. You do sound a bit het up by it all today though?

Was politics in the old days before I came along all about how many investigations you can get you opponents under, or is this a new phase that is a bit, not quite the point of politics really?

I posted clip of Lady Thatcher at PMQs in recent thread - she’s is just simply explaining the difference in her philosophy and policies in regards theirs. That just made politics simple, explain your point of view.

And they were all terribly polite and respectful to each other as they done it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Q9vYjqQ5Ek

To be honest I am not the least het up but as my beloved will affirm I have this tendency to enjoy winding people up and maybe on occasions it shows

It is fair to say that politics is more tribal and at times just nasty but as far as I am concerned I want Boris to go so I can rejoin the party as I really fear a Starmer led labour party would borrow far too much and I am not convinced they would restrict public sector pay including doctors and nurses as would be necessary

Christ on a bike Big G, the Tories have been running Britain into an early grave consistently for the last 12 years and all you can say is "I'm worried that Labour might give nurses a pay rise"?

SKS is still proposing a minimum wage of £10 less than the Tories I think

Proper fiscal Conservatism. It’s got my vote.

(Seriously, I will NEVER NEVER NEVER vote Labour)

MoonRabbit said:

dixiedean said:

Thanks.
Bloke chased bloke on bikes. Knocked him off, then produced knife and repeatedly tried to stab him on the ground. Fortunately, assailant was superbly weedy and completely off his head.
Bloke on ground was a hulking sober guy. So no harm done. They left with much shouting. And the intervention of inevitable screaming girl.
Not much fun.

My election campaign right now, reduce crime, and reduce government waste.

Carnyx said:

MoonRabbit said:

Sandpit said:

MoonRabbit said:

malcolmg said:

MoonRabbit said:

Fairliered said:

MoonRabbit said:

Fairliered said:

Gardenwalker said:

Carnyx said:

Gardenwalker said:

algarkirk said:

Gardenwalker said:

Labour can’t win if voters think they will rely on the SNP.

Keir needs to go all out on them.

There is a problem here as things stand. If the Tories carry on committing suicide then SKS anti SNP stance may be possible. But assuming some sort of normal can break out in government, Labour will not be able to get to a majority without counting in the SNP in some form. They simply hold too many seats.

SKS may need us to believe something that he in fact does not. So we might not either.

Yes, it’s a problem or a paradox.

This is why I advocate a very public anti-SNP approach from Labour from now until the next election.

Vote SNP, get Tory.

That only applies in Scotland. Where Labour is pretty crap at present in MP terms. One almost Tory MP in Morningside of all places. And Labour victories over SNP do nothing to reduce the Tory majority. Plus at the same time, Slab is pretending not to ally with Tories but is doing so all over the country?

I don’t know why Labour are allying with the Tories in Scotland. It doesn’t make sense to me at all.

My enemy’s enemy …

Sort of on subject, how many million Union Jacks have Rangers fans taken to Seville?

Not all of their Union Jacks. They will have kept a few million at home for Orange Walks.

So which posters are rooting for Rangers tonight? And which rooting for the German side? Are you suspecting the majority of PBers cheering for Rangers, actually have English accents?

Since I was named Minister of Sport in PrImeminister TSE first PB cabinet, I’ve been taking my brief at least as seriously as Nadine Doris, my opposite number in government.

So Rangers Protestant, Celtic Catholic? Any type of Protestant including CoE, or a particular denomination? And then the Union Jacks - so typical Rangers fan so solid unionist does not vote SNP?

It’s like painting a picture of the Balkan’s 🫢

That is unadultered pish that only a Little Englander could come out with. Get an education.

Those are actual questions to get an education. I’m aware football allegiance Spain is very political. The only two things i know of in England remotely like that, people of a certain religious persuasion like, or feel they should support, Tottenham. And enmity between West Ham and Millwall could be something to do with not supporting a dockyard strike?

The Rangers with Union Jacks. Does that mean they don’t vote SNP? are they hard bitten unionists with no truck for independence, if they happy to drape in that flag?

If So, does it mean they get fans from far afield, not just Glasgow, on basis it’s the Union team?

Was it ever that sectarian between the supporters of Celtic and Rangers, or more to do with districts of town grew up in. Or even, historically, are there clear Catholic and Protestant areas of town?

Genuine questions, possibly better answered on PB than Google.

By all means educate me.

Glasgow football is very sectarian, more than anywhere else in GB. The Rangers fans are Protestants and the Celtic fans Catholics.

Is there any similar thing between the Liverpool sides? Or the Edinburgh teams?

Edinburgh fans generally grew out of that thinking some decades back, compared to Glasgow, though there are traces - if only in the very name and strip of Hibernian FC.

But originally the sectarianism was rooted in social structure - nativist Protestant Scots vs incoming RC Irish immigrants (though the split is not neat: consider the Irish Presbyterians). The RC Irish got the crap jobs until relatively recently, the decent jobs being kept for Protestant working classes. "What school did you go to?" was an absolute killer question in a job interview.

The Scottish Tories were originally the Unionist Party - unionist in the Irish sense in politics and attitudes. Labour grew out of a self-defence party for the RC Irish underdogs.

One of the signs of the end days as far as Slab is concerned is the rapprochement some time ago between the SNP (as itis called now) and the RC hierarchy. That is, yet again, the SNP stealing the birthright of Slab as far as Slab are concerned. It is also very odd, to somone of my age, to see Slab trying to make overtures to the Orange Order, and even offer grants to Orange Walks on at least one occasion (that was very quickly reverse-ferreted, but in the old days ...)

The reason that most religious schools today in Scotland are RC is because in the old days the default option for ordinary was C of S - but that has withered away in recent decades, leaving the RCs and the odd Episcopalian, but RC rolls are declining, but pressure on budgets is always there ... There was a LA some years back, which pointedly built two new high schools together, RC and non RC, absolute mirror images, the hall on each side and so on separated only by a non-structural wall, easily demolished. Their view was that they couldn't afford the inefficiency much longer and so were dam' well going to prepare for when they had to close down one more RC school.

Edit: this depended very much on area. West Central Belt, hellish. Others, not so much. Friend of mine came from a Fife coal mining community. Ther was a huge culture shock on both sides when the NCB imported WCB miners from failing pits to help staff the new superpits in Fife. The locals made it very clear to the incomers that down the pit everyone had to look out for each other and there was going to be no room for division in their place.

IshmaelZ said:

Leon said:

wooliedyed said:

Hold Thou Thy cross before my closing eyes
Shine through the gloom and point me to the skies
Heaven's morning breaks, and earth's vain shadows flee
In life, in death, o Lord, abide with me
Abide with me, abide with me

The protagonist is slipping away, calling to their saviour to stay with them and carry them home to Eternity.

How can that possibly not move anyone?? It's just beautiful.

Even “better”, the writer was a dogmatic and humourless Anglican prelate of Scots origin who had showed no facility for good poetry and profound thought ever in his life, until he was two weeks before his death from tuberculosis, when he suddenly produced these immortal lines, as the grave claimed him

By some accounts he finished it the day before he died

Superb. A sublime moment of human defiance in the face of our shared mortality. And Liverpool fans decided to boo that? They are free to do so, and I am free to despise them, their team, and their city, for all eternity, for their disgusting, boorish philistinism

I read it as an expression of religious doubt in the face of approaching death - I did anyway and that account confirms it. He is pleading for reassurance that God is not a fraud and that death is not just death.

stodge said:

Evening all

News from elsewhere - in Slovenia, as his party hits 44% in the latest poll, Robert Golob looks set to become prime minister of a coalition of Svoboda, Social Democrats and the Left which will have 55 of 96 seats in the new Parliament.

Interesting polling from France for the legislative election as NUPES advances into a narrow lead. NUPES is basically to France what Golob's coalition is to Slovenia. NUPES is Melenchon's party joined with the Greens , Socialists, Communists and a few others. In the old National Assembly, they had 58 seats between them but could now win 160-185 seats.

Ensemble! is Macron's LREM party plus a couple of others.

The latest poll as follows (changes from 2017):

NUPES: 27.5% (+2.5)
Ensemble!: 27% (-5)
National Rally: 21% (+8)
Les Republicans: 10% (-12)
Reconquete: 5% (+5)

Despite that, Ensemble! could win a narrow overall majority with National Rally and NUPES making gains and Les Republicans taking big losses.

Leon said:

The Frankfurt fans are much more impressively energetic and fervent. What happened to Scottish fans?

BartholomewRoberts said:

bondegezou said:

Sandpit said:

dixiedean said:

Leon said:

dixiedean said:

Has anyone else tried contacting HMRC recently?
Tried three times today. Simply say they are too busy. Goodbye.
Not even the joy of an hour on hold
They've deducted me money for a tax credit overpayment completely without warning.

They’re all working from fucking home. We tried to tell you. It’s shit

You don't need to be sitting in an office to answer a phone.
That's just an excuse.

The irony is that a call centre can actually fit really well with both WFH and flexible hours.

BUT, and it’s a big but, it needs the organisation to be structured differently to an in-person call centre, with processes to match. You need a larger group of both L2 technical agents and supervisors, and the managers need to take a different view of their metrics which requires modern phone and IT systems.

I get the impression that much of the public sector and quasi-public sector simply went home in March 2020, plugged their desk phone into a router, used their own laptop to connect to a VPN and a Citrix window, but the organisations never specifically set themselves up for WFH.

A call centre is also a training-heavy environment, and training / teambuilding exercises are best done in person to maintain consistency.

There were lots of call centres before the pandemic that used staff working from their own homes (with appropriate structures in place). It’s always been a job that is well suited to working from home and to employees wanting different working hours. It’s just we, the consumer, didn’t notice.

The problem is that private call centres operate on a principle that they need to work effectively or they don't get business so they don't get paid, so they make sure their operations work.

Public ones - not so much.

I had a rather worrying encounter a few months ago with the Council for a home I used to live in but moved out of in 2019. I'd paid my Council Tax in full by Direct Debit and had notified them when I moved homes and set up a Direct Debit for my new home but then a few years later got a "final demand" letter for overdue Council Tax for 2020-21. I called them and spoke to someone who was working from home and said that I had moved out before this period so it wasn't me who owed the tax, he told me not to worry, promised to get it resolved and would put a hold on the account until they could figure out what had gone wrong.

Two months later I got a Court Summons for unpaid Council Tax, with a court date set for what was then 3 weeks time. I tried calling the Council again but after pressing all the relevant options got a message "our queue is full please try again later". That kept happening again and again for two weeks. Tried emailing them, got an autoreply saying they're currently taking an average of 6 weeks to respond to emails, but the Court Summons was for 3 weeks time.

After a few weeks of calling them every day I eventually got in the queue and through to a human who found my email to them and accepted the proof that I wasn't living at that address for the time in question and the Council had been informed of that. But utterly remarkable that they could take six weeks to respond to an email, but have Court Summons issued for 3 weeks, and the queue 'full'.

If you call a company like Sky you'll get through to someone probably working from home - but at least you'll get through to someone and they take your issue seriously. At least if you threaten to cancel your contract they do.

Foxy said:

Leon said:

The Frankfurt fans are much more impressively energetic and fervent. What happened to Scottish fans?

Foxjr2 went to an Eintracht Frankfurt match while on school German exchange. He rather liked the fervour of their fans. They have been our German team since. They grind out wins.

IshmaelZ said:

wooliedyed said:

IshmaelZ said:

Leon said:

wooliedyed said:

Hold Thou Thy cross before my closing eyes
Shine through the gloom and point me to the skies
Heaven's morning breaks, and earth's vain shadows flee
In life, in death, o Lord, abide with me
Abide with me, abide with me

The protagonist is slipping away, calling to their saviour to stay with them and carry them home to Eternity.

How can that possibly not move anyone?? It's just beautiful.

Even “better”, the writer was a dogmatic and humourless Anglican prelate of Scots origin who had showed no facility for good poetry and profound thought ever in his life, until he was two weeks before his death from tuberculosis, when he suddenly produced these immortal lines, as the grave claimed him

By some accounts he finished it the day before he died

Superb. A sublime moment of human defiance in the face of our shared mortality. And Liverpool fans decided to boo that? They are free to do so, and I am free to despise them, their team, and their city, for all eternity, for their disgusting, boorish philistinism

I read it as an expression of religious doubt in the face of approaching death - I did anyway and that account confirms it. He is pleading for reassurance that God is not a fraud and that death is not just death.

Nah it's an affirmstion of faith in the face of death.

I fear no foe, with Thee at hand to bless
Ills have no weight, and tears no bitterness
Where is death's sting?
Where, grave, thy victory?
I triumph still, if Thou abide with me

But why the conditional? Surely for a God fearing right thinking parson non-abidance with me should be unthinkable?

IshmaelZ said:

wooliedyed said:

IshmaelZ said:

Leon said:

wooliedyed said:

Hold Thou Thy cross before my closing eyes
Shine through the gloom and point me to the skies
Heaven's morning breaks, and earth's vain shadows flee
In life, in death, o Lord, abide with me
Abide with me, abide with me

The protagonist is slipping away, calling to their saviour to stay with them and carry them home to Eternity.

How can that possibly not move anyone?? It's just beautiful.

Even “better”, the writer was a dogmatic and humourless Anglican prelate of Scots origin who had showed no facility for good poetry and profound thought ever in his life, until he was two weeks before his death from tuberculosis, when he suddenly produced these immortal lines, as the grave claimed him

By some accounts he finished it the day before he died

Superb. A sublime moment of human defiance in the face of our shared mortality. And Liverpool fans decided to boo that? They are free to do so, and I am free to despise them, their team, and their city, for all eternity, for their disgusting, boorish philistinism

I read it as an expression of religious doubt in the face of approaching death - I did anyway and that account confirms it. He is pleading for reassurance that God is not a fraud and that death is not just death.

Nah it's an affirmstion of faith in the face of death.

I fear no foe, with Thee at hand to bless
Ills have no weight, and tears no bitterness
Where is death's sting?
Where, grave, thy victory?
I triumph still, if Thou abide with me

But why the conditional? Surely for a God fearing right thinking parson non-abidance with me should be unthinkable?

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

The evil of the British Empire for one. A scar on us for time immemorial..

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

MBE - does it stand for "Masturbating over the British Empire"?

boulay said:

Leon said:

Farooq said:

Leon said:

The Frankfurt fans are much more impressively energetic and fervent. What happened to Scottish fans?

There was no Abide With Me before kick off to get the blood racing.

Seriously tho. The Germans have flares and songs, they jump and down in unison, they all wear white and wave white flags (even if they do sometimes look like Klansmen thereby)

The Scots fans just stand there. I thought they were famously passionate?

You haven’t watched that documentary “Braveheart” have you? Massed ranks of crazy Scots have been drilled for generations to stand there quietly until the over-confident foreigner thinks he’s on top and then they go nuts. See the very accurate reconstruction of the Battle of Stirling bridge by the director/renowned historian Mel Gibson for an example.

stodge said:

MoonRabbit said:

dixiedean said:

Thanks.
Bloke chased bloke on bikes. Knocked him off, then produced knife and repeatedly tried to stab him on the ground. Fortunately, assailant was superbly weedy and completely off his head.
Bloke on ground was a hulking sober guy. So no harm done. They left with much shouting. And the intervention of inevitable screaming girl.
Not much fun.

My election campaign right now, reduce crime, and reduce government waste.

Meaning what exactly? How do you reduce crime? More Police - the easy answer but they have to be paid for and trained. A former Prime Minister took them off the beat and put them in cars and vans. Unfortunately, the coalition made the stupid decision to close police stations, aided and supported by the current Prime Minister when Mayor of London.

"Reduce Government Waste" - define this "waste" - yes, you can make some savings such as by ending two-tier local Government perhaps. I suppose you could properly enforce working at home and sell off all that surplus real estate in central London that would be worth millions (perhaps). Perhaps we should forget throwing £13 billion at renovating the Houses of Parliament and look at a proper fit-for-purpose legislative chamber.

Foxy said:

IshmaelZ said:

wooliedyed said:

IshmaelZ said:

Leon said:

wooliedyed said:

Hold Thou Thy cross before my closing eyes
Shine through the gloom and point me to the skies
Heaven's morning breaks, and earth's vain shadows flee
In life, in death, o Lord, abide with me
Abide with me, abide with me

The protagonist is slipping away, calling to their saviour to stay with them and carry them home to Eternity.

How can that possibly not move anyone?? It's just beautiful.

Even “better”, the writer was a dogmatic and humourless Anglican prelate of Scots origin who had showed no facility for good poetry and profound thought ever in his life, until he was two weeks before his death from tuberculosis, when he suddenly produced these immortal lines, as the grave claimed him

By some accounts he finished it the day before he died

Superb. A sublime moment of human defiance in the face of our shared mortality. And Liverpool fans decided to boo that? They are free to do so, and I am free to despise them, their team, and their city, for all eternity, for their disgusting, boorish philistinism

I read it as an expression of religious doubt in the face of approaching death - I did anyway and that account confirms it. He is pleading for reassurance that God is not a fraud and that death is not just death.

Nah it's an affirmstion of faith in the face of death.

I fear no foe, with Thee at hand to bless
Ills have no weight, and tears no bitterness
Where is death's sting?
Where, grave, thy victory?
I triumph still, if Thou abide with me

But why the conditional? Surely for a God fearing right thinking parson non-abidance with me should be unthinkable?

Doubt is not a bar. As Jesus asked on the cross:

"My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"

Matthew 27:46

Theuniondivvie said:

Rangers and their fans restored to Britishness. Not that they doubted it for a minute.

NickPalmer said:

Farooq said:

Casino_Royale said:

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

America's democracy is something they had to wrestle us for. The idea that we bestowed it upon them is a hellava a take.

True. Moreover, the Empire had a curious penchant for subdividing countries ethnically rather than promote integration. We tried it in Ireland, in Cyprus, in Palestine and in India, and in every case it led directly to generations of conflict.

Omnium said:

NickPalmer said:

MoonRabbit said:

(Seriously, I will NEVER NEVER NEVER vote Labour)

Yes, we've rather gathered that

Why do you NP? Why vote Labour?

ping said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-suffolk-61498367

I thought John Peel had been cancelled?

His Wikipedia is rather damning.

Farooq said:

Foxy said:

IshmaelZ said:

wooliedyed said:

IshmaelZ said:

Leon said:

wooliedyed said:

Hold Thou Thy cross before my closing eyes
Shine through the gloom and point me to the skies
Heaven's morning breaks, and earth's vain shadows flee
In life, in death, o Lord, abide with me
Abide with me, abide with me

The protagonist is slipping away, calling to their saviour to stay with them and carry them home to Eternity.

How can that possibly not move anyone?? It's just beautiful.

Even “better”, the writer was a dogmatic and humourless Anglican prelate of Scots origin who had showed no facility for good poetry and profound thought ever in his life, until he was two weeks before his death from tuberculosis, when he suddenly produced these immortal lines, as the grave claimed him

By some accounts he finished it the day before he died

Superb. A sublime moment of human defiance in the face of our shared mortality. And Liverpool fans decided to boo that? They are free to do so, and I am free to despise them, their team, and their city, for all eternity, for their disgusting, boorish philistinism

I read it as an expression of religious doubt in the face of approaching death - I did anyway and that account confirms it. He is pleading for reassurance that God is not a fraud and that death is not just death.

Nah it's an affirmstion of faith in the face of death.

I fear no foe, with Thee at hand to bless
Ills have no weight, and tears no bitterness
Where is death's sting?
Where, grave, thy victory?
I triumph still, if Thou abide with me

But why the conditional? Surely for a God fearing right thinking parson non-abidance with me should be unthinkable?

Doubt is not a bar. As Jesus asked on the cross:

"My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"

Matthew 27:46

And, why had he?

Farooq said:

kle4 said:

Farooq said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

The evil of the British Empire for one. A scar on us for time immemorial..

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

America's democracy is something they had to wrestle us for. The idea that we bestowed it upon them is a hellava a take.

Not completely out there if part of the point was they felt they were not getting the representation and rights that they felt owed, that is they wanted to live up to the democratic tradition they saw (or perceived) in Britain. Bestowed (which I don't think was the word used anyway) doesn't necessarily mean intentionally or willingly bestowed. Indeed, nations might be inspired by what another nation said, even if what that nation did, did not live up to that.

Obviously it was more complex than that and there were other influences, particularly having cut the cord from us.

Yes, in which case we ought also to acknowledge the contribution to American history that was made by other countries too. The Enlightenment idea of liberty radiating from France can count as a major influence, but even later, post independence influences like the German/central European emigres in the wake of the 1848 revolutions had a major influence.

The way ideas diffuse through the world is a little different from the specific actions of history, and whilst both are interesting subjects, they can be treated as separate. For example, we tend to think more of the actions of Communist countries over and above its ideological foundations. That it, we think of Moscow more than Trier or London.
When it comes to actions, blame and praise can be much more precisely placed. We tried to strangle American democracy in its crib, so to award ourselves praise for it "because Magna Carta!!!!one!" is just mad.

Jim_Miller said:

Foxy mentioning Hitler and Stalin as great villains reminded me of one who seldom gets the debits he deserves: Mao

His policies resulted in the deaths of tens of millions of people in China during his 27-year reign, more than any other 20th-century leader; estimates of the number of people who died under his regime range from 40 million to as many as 80 million,[278][279] done through starvation, persecution, prison labour in laogai, and mass executions.

mwadams said:

MoonRabbit said:

Casino_Royale said:

Farooq said:

Casino_Royale said:

Taz said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

The evil of the British Empire for one. A scar on us for time immemorial..

You know the structure of today's free world is largely down to the British Empire, right?

Where do you think multiracial South African democracy, entrepreneurial Singapore, Hong Kong (try asking them whose rule they prefer), India (the world's largest democracy), America (the world's most powerful democracy) Canada, Australia and New Zealand come from? And how Japan, Taiwan and South Korea chose to imitate them rather than another autocracy.

Sure the Middle East is a bit of fuck up - although arguably Israel is better than the alternative - and Africa isn't exactly a bed of roses, although bigoted Rhodesia was almost certainly economically better off than the basket case that is modern Zimbabwe - but you can't argue that's representative. It's complex.

This penchant for equating us to the Nazis and selectively extracting the worst aspects from our history (usually out of context) to damn us for all time is certainly fashionable at the moment but it's also wrong - and just a phase.

America's democracy is something they had to wrestle us for. The idea that we bestowed it upon them is a hellava a take.

They literally based their constitution on our Bill of Rights and Magna Carta. Their argument was that as sons of liberty (Englishmen) royal governance had strayed from the true path.

Try reading some history and thinking for yourself rather than imbibing fashionable contemporary propaganda.

People will respect you more.

Was Magna Carta based or inspired on anything that preceded it, such as further afield in Europe, or from Ancient times? If an original creation, who penned it, do we know the names of authors?

So, the Magna Carta thing is a bit of a myth.

The thing that became known as Magna Carta was basically a peace treaty drawn up by the Archbish of C. after what amounted to a series of Civil wars between the Angevin kings, and the local powers. It defined and circumscribed the powers of the various parties (including the church) to try to move away from the "might is right" approach of the last 100 years or so.

It later developed a semi-mythological status as a "rights based" system, which is what 'inspired' those other things; but it wasn't a 'model' for them.

As to antecedents - at least Henry I had tried to define a similar declaration of/circumscription of rights as means of establishing his power.

Foxy said:

IshmaelZ said:

wooliedyed said:

IshmaelZ said:

Leon said:

wooliedyed said:

Hold Thou Thy cross before my closing eyes
Shine through the gloom and point me to the skies
Heaven's morning breaks, and earth's vain shadows flee
In life, in death, o Lord, abide with me
Abide with me, abide with me

The protagonist is slipping away, calling to their saviour to stay with them and carry them home to Eternity.

How can that possibly not move anyone?? It's just beautiful.

Even “better”, the writer was a dogmatic and humourless Anglican prelate of Scots origin who had showed no facility for good poetry and profound thought ever in his life, until he was two weeks before his death from tuberculosis, when he suddenly produced these immortal lines, as the grave claimed him

By some accounts he finished it the day before he died

Superb. A sublime moment of human defiance in the face of our shared mortality. And Liverpool fans decided to boo that? They are free to do so, and I am free to despise them, their team, and their city, for all eternity, for their disgusting, boorish philistinism

I read it as an expression of religious doubt in the face of approaching death - I did anyway and that account confirms it. He is pleading for reassurance that God is not a fraud and that death is not just death.

Nah it's an affirmstion of faith in the face of death.

I fear no foe, with Thee at hand to bless
Ills have no weight, and tears no bitterness
Where is death's sting?
Where, grave, thy victory?
I triumph still, if Thou abide with me

But why the conditional? Surely for a God fearing right thinking parson non-abidance with me should be unthinkable?

Doubt is not a bar. As Jesus asked on the cross:

"My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"

Matthew 27:46

boulay said:

Leon said:

Farooq said:

Leon said:

The Frankfurt fans are much more impressively energetic and fervent. What happened to Scottish fans?

There was no Abide With Me before kick off to get the blood racing.

Seriously tho. The Germans have flares and songs, they jump and down in unison, they all wear white and wave white flags (even if they do sometimes look like Klansmen thereby)

The Scots fans just stand there. I thought they were famously passionate?

You haven’t watched that documentary “Braveheart” have you? Massed ranks of crazy Scots have been drilled for generations to stand there quietly until the over-confident foreigner thinks he’s on top and then they go nuts. See the very accurate reconstruction of the Battle of Stirling bridge by the director/renowned historian Mel Gibson for an example.

boulay said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Farooq said:

Leon said:

The Frankfurt fans are much more impressively energetic and fervent. What happened to Scottish fans?

There was no Abide With Me before kick off to get the blood racing.

Seriously tho. The Germans have flares and songs, they jump and down in unison, they all wear white and wave white flags (even if they do sometimes look like Klansmen thereby)

The Scots fans just stand there. I thought they were famously passionate?

You haven’t watched that documentary “Braveheart” have you? Massed ranks of crazy Scots have been drilled for generations to stand there quietly until the over-confident foreigner thinks he’s on top and then they go nuts. See the very accurate reconstruction of the Battle of Stirling bridge by the director/renowned historian Mel Gibson for an example.

Gibson is to history what Hitler was to Zionism Boris Johnson is to marital fidelity.

Exhibit “A”, The Patriot…..

wooliedyed said:

IshmaelZ said:

Foxy said:

IshmaelZ said:

wooliedyed said:

IshmaelZ said:

Leon said:

wooliedyed said:

Hold Thou Thy cross before my closing eyes
Shine through the gloom and point me to the skies
Heaven's morning breaks, and earth's vain shadows flee
In life, in death, o Lord, abide with me
Abide with me, abide with me

The protagonist is slipping away, calling to their saviour to stay with them and carry them home to Eternity.

How can that possibly not move anyone?? It's just beautiful.

Even “better”, the writer was a dogmatic and humourless Anglican prelate of Scots origin who had showed no facility for good poetry and profound thought ever in his life, until he was two weeks before his death from tuberculosis, when he suddenly produced these immortal lines, as the grave claimed him

By some accounts he finished it the day before he died

Superb. A sublime moment of human defiance in the face of our shared mortality. And Liverpool fans decided to boo that? They are free to do so, and I am free to despise them, their team, and their city, for all eternity, for their disgusting, boorish philistinism

I read it as an expression of religious doubt in the face of approaching death - I did anyway and that account confirms it. He is pleading for reassurance that God is not a fraud and that death is not just death.

Nah it's an affirmstion of faith in the face of death.

I fear no foe, with Thee at hand to bless
Ills have no weight, and tears no bitterness
Where is death's sting?
Where, grave, thy victory?
I triumph still, if Thou abide with me

But why the conditional? Surely for a God fearing right thinking parson non-abidance with me should be unthinkable?

Doubt is not a bar. As Jesus asked on the cross:

"My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"

Matthew 27:46

Which always sounds to me like "Ever get the feeling you've been cheated"?

Nah, it's the expression of the moment that, within Christian belief, Jesus took on the sins of man. God then forsook him so that nobody would be forsaken if they came to him through faith in Christ. That was, in the Christian tradition, the whole point of Jesus life on Earth and death.

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

boulay said:

Leon said:

Come on Rangers. Fuck these Scouse c*nts and traitors who BOO BEAUTY. Let Real Madrid hammer them

But loyal, sober Unionists and royalists? Go, lads

I am somewhat surprised how personally you have taken Liverpool fans booing at Wembley on Saturday. I truly thought you would love the madness, the anti-establishment chaos and rebellion. The “fuck you I won’t do what you tell me” behaviour.

It’s all part of life’s rich pageant and amazed you are bent out of shape by it.

I’m a monarchist conservative and it really doesn’t bother me at all - it’s just jolly japes at a football match.

If they annoyed you by being controversialist then it’s getting very Meta!!

What next - demanding seats rather than pit at a Metallica concert? Cocoa rather than Cognac before bed? Tsk Tsk.

No, it makes me puke. Because I know where it comes from

By all means Boo the National Anthem. Boo Prince William. Hurl your turds at Princess Kate, Whatever, you sad tattoeed fat fucks

But booing ABIDE WITH ME??

That is pure vandalism, it is the degradation of the human soul and the hatred of loveliness, in the most ugly way. It is something very Liverpudlian - a diseased city - but it spreads like a fungus. Fuck them all.

Remember Heysel

If Liverpool fans are tarred by Heysel then what are you and I tarred with by virtue of being English?

Is this even serious?

We conquered the world. And it was mainly good. We didn’t push over a wall and kill some Italian teens during a football match. Get a grip

Ok. Fair enough - if we are going simplistic (it wasn’t just Italian teens and it wasn’t just a simple case of some Liverpool fans pushing over a wall out of nothing).

Amritsar - we just controlled a riot as quickly as possible - naughty Indian teens….

Thing is you are probably the poster I agree most with on here for my sins but I’m staggered how miffed you have been by booing a pretty rubbish hymn - if it had been “I vow to thee my country” then I would be in my tank towards Anfield Road but really, perspective?

I hear you.

Maybe I always had this secret Simon Heffer-esque contempt for ugly, contemptible, obese, do-nothing Liverpool? But I hid it. OK, they booed our 96-year Queen during the year of her Platinum Jubilee, and a year or two after our widowhood. Maybe I could have contained myself, if they had done only that. But booing a beautiful religious hymn with the most profound lyrics ever written about humanity yielding with grace to mortality, WTAF??

They are monkeys. They are an element in working class British culture - fat, wanky, ugly, dumb, inadequate, Philistine, pathetic and gruesomely proud of it - which I utterly despise. Let them sink into the Irish Sea. Millwall have more nobility

I get you but you are in danger of going full-Roger…..

What would Bill Shankly or Ian Paisley have thought of them booing the Queen, or booing the National Anthem, and then booing ABIDE WITH ME?

I do not think they would have expressed admiration. And their bewildered contempt would be justified. We have regressed as a nation and a culture and Liverpool fans are the pimply, wobbly, nihilistic cutting edge. Well done, lads