Why the LDs and LAB could be the main beneficiaries of compulsory voter ID – politicalbetting.com

Nigel_Foremain said:

Philip_Thompson said:

not_on_fire said:

Philip_Thompson said:

londonpubman said:

rkrkrk said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

28k....37....406

Yep... not great at all. My prediction at start of the month was that we would get to 300/day by end of June... but I clearly underestimated it.

Remember also that the hospitalizations figure is actually for last week, there's a significant delay in reporting.
England which is a bit more up to date reported 390 admissions day before yesterday... so we have potentially broken 500 admission/day for UK already.

I did project the other day on here that we would get to 100,000 cases a day. Not everyone universally agreed with me. I do hope that I am wrong...

I thought you said it would get to 100k cases a day by last week?

When do you think it will get to 100k by? And if it does without causing hospitalisations and deaths because the link has been broken then why should we care?

I imagine the approx 20,000 people who get long Covid will care. Or do they not matter?

Ah 'long Covid' the last gasp desperate claim of the Cult of Zero Covid.

No they don't matter, not enough to strip away people's civil liberties. People get sick, that's what the NHS is there to treat, we don't lose our civil liberties to prevent people being potentially ill in the future.

Especially since the claims of 'long Covid' post-vaccinations are extremely dubious at best. If vaccines have broken the link between Covid and hospitalisations and deaths, then what reason is there to think that people will still get 'long Covid'? 🤔

Compassionate as ever eh, Phil?

FrancisUrquhart said:

Russia reports 737 new coronavirus deaths, the biggest one-day increase on record, and 23,378 new cases

FrancisUrquhart said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

28k....37....406

Yep... not great at all. My prediction at start of the month was that we would get to 300/day by end of June... but I clearly underestimated it.

Remember also that the hospitalizations figure is actually for last week, there's a significant delay in reporting.
England which is a bit more up to date reported 390 admissions day before yesterday... so we have potentially broken 500 admission/day for UK already.

88% of people in hospital are unvaccinated or partially vaccinated. The people going into hospital are majority those who are refusing the vaccine, this was a known outcome of any unlockdown as we saw in Israel. What do you propose to avoid this outcome?

If a + b = 88%, can we say that either a or b is over 50%?

We've seen previous breakdowns of this figure were the actually unvaccinated make up a much larger proportion than the partially vaccinated, additionally we aren't halting the vaccine programme. Either way, you haven't answered the question, the vast majority of people in hospital now and for the foreseeable future are those who have said no to the vaccine. What do you propose we do?

Where is your evidence hospitals are full of refusers?

The answer was to vaccinate everyone, wait 2 weeks, and then lift restrictions.

But it's too late for that now. We are committed to an unnecessary wave. The only question is how big it will be.

A SAGE member said it this morning that 88% of people currently in hospital in England are unvaccinated or only partially vaccinated. Currently the latter group are just in a waiting period of getting their second dose and most of them could probably walk up and get one if they tried after 3/4 weeks.

How do you vaccinate everyone? Send in the army China style, hold them down and jab them, then do it again three weeks later?

I keep trying to tell you, the partially protected are a massive chunk of population. Vaccine refusers are a small, small proportion.

Semple defined full protection as 4 weeks from vaccine.

But whatever it is, it's not indefinite and every day we get closer to it. Vaccine refusers will be around 5m in total. The number of first doses is now demand limited, it has been for the last couple of weeks.

All of the scientists are fairly united that unlockdown in autumn would be a disaster as the exit wave would be horrific for the NHS combined with what is likely to be a pretty bad flu season as we don't know what to put in the jab this year.

So once again, I'm asking the question, what are you proposing we do?

Well I would guess try to slow transmission through mask wearing (most obviously in schools, public transport etc.), properly fund isolation, speed up vaccination by making it more convenient and maybe even paying people, put money into local public health teams... nothing particularly revolutionary to be honest!

But there's no denying this should have been done earlier. The govt have obviously let this get out of control again, and are going to get a whole bunch of people infected before they had full vaccine protection rather than afterwards.

Make vaccination more convenient....how much more convenient than now can it be? There are 1000s and 1000s of centres throughout the country, open 8am to 8pm, 7 days a week. There is online booking, phone booking, GP led, On top of there, there are walk up no question centres mobile vans, weekly mass jabathons. All free of charge.

What specific extra measures could they do?

Malmesbury said:

rcs1000 said:

I think it is time we all looked to Malta for Covid vaccination success. They have achieved the impossible.

According to their own government website, they are the only country where the number of people who are fully vaccinated (72.5%) exceeds the number who have received at least one dose (72.1%).

Edit to add: the data is easier to see on the EU page - https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#national-ref-tab

Bunch of slackers

Gibralter has

1st dose - 116%
2nd dose - 115%

rkrkrk said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

28k....37....406

Yep... not great at all. My prediction at start of the month was that we would get to 300/day by end of June... but I clearly underestimated it.

Remember also that the hospitalizations figure is actually for last week, there's a significant delay in reporting.
England which is a bit more up to date reported 390 admissions day before yesterday... so we have potentially broken 500 admission/day for UK already.

88% of people in hospital are unvaccinated or partially vaccinated. The people going into hospital are majority those who are refusing the vaccine, this was a known outcome of any unlockdown as we saw in Israel. What do you propose to avoid this outcome?

If a + b = 88%, can we say that either a or b is over 50%?

We've seen previous breakdowns of this figure were the actually unvaccinated make up a much larger proportion than the partially vaccinated, additionally we aren't halting the vaccine programme. Either way, you haven't answered the question, the vast majority of people in hospital now and for the foreseeable future are those who have said no to the vaccine. What do you propose we do?

Where is your evidence hospitals are full of refusers?

The answer was to vaccinate everyone, wait 2 weeks, and then lift restrictions.

But it's too late for that now. We are committed to an unnecessary wave. The only question is how big it will be.

A SAGE member said it this morning that 88% of people currently in hospital in England are unvaccinated or only partially vaccinated. Currently the latter group are just in a waiting period of getting their second dose and most of them could probably walk up and get one if they tried after 3/4 weeks.

How do you vaccinate everyone? Send in the army China style, hold them down and jab them, then do it again three weeks later?

I keep trying to tell you, the partially protected are a massive chunk of population. Vaccine refusers are a small, small proportion.

Semple defined full protection as 4 weeks from vaccine.

But whatever it is, it's not indefinite and every day we get closer to it. Vaccine refusers will be around 5m in total. The number of first doses is now demand limited, it has been for the last couple of weeks.

All of the scientists are fairly united that unlockdown in autumn would be a disaster as the exit wave would be horrific for the NHS combined with what is likely to be a pretty bad flu season as we don't know what to put in the jab this year.

So once again, I'm asking the question, what are you proposing we do?

Well I would guess try to slow transmission through mask wearing (most obviously in schools, public transport etc.), properly fund isolation, speed up vaccination by making it more convenient and maybe even paying people, put money into local public health teams... nothing particularly revolutionary to be honest!

But there's no denying this should have been done earlier. The govt have obviously let this get out of control again, and are going to get a whole bunch of people infected before they had full vaccine protection rather than afterwards.

Make vaccination more convenient....how much more convenient than now can it be? There are 1000s and 1000s of centres throughout the country, open 8am to 8pm, 7 days a week. There is online booking, phone booking, GP led, On top of there, there are walk up no question centres mobile vans, weekly mass jabathons. All free of charge.

What specific extra measures could they do?

Well convenient is probably one they should have done earlier... it may be very good now I don't know, for a while it certainly wasn't so easy. Family member has been told not until end of August.

Malmesbury said:

rcs1000 said:

I think it is time we all looked to Malta for Covid vaccination success. They have achieved the impossible.

According to their own government website, they are the only country where the number of people who are fully vaccinated (72.5%) exceeds the number who have received at least one dose (72.1%).

Edit to add: the data is easier to see on the EU page - https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#national-ref-tab

Bunch of slackers

Gibralter has

1st dose - 116%
2nd dose - 115%

rkrkrk said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

28k....37....406

Yep... not great at all. My prediction at start of the month was that we would get to 300/day by end of June... but I clearly underestimated it.

Remember also that the hospitalizations figure is actually for last week, there's a significant delay in reporting.
England which is a bit more up to date reported 390 admissions day before yesterday... so we have potentially broken 500 admission/day for UK already.

88% of people in hospital are unvaccinated or partially vaccinated. The people going into hospital are majority those who are refusing the vaccine, this was a known outcome of any unlockdown as we saw in Israel. What do you propose to avoid this outcome?

If a + b = 88%, can we say that either a or b is over 50%?

We've seen previous breakdowns of this figure were the actually unvaccinated make up a much larger proportion than the partially vaccinated, additionally we aren't halting the vaccine programme. Either way, you haven't answered the question, the vast majority of people in hospital now and for the foreseeable future are those who have said no to the vaccine. What do you propose we do?

Where is your evidence hospitals are full of refusers?

The answer was to vaccinate everyone, wait 2 weeks, and then lift restrictions.

But it's too late for that now. We are committed to an unnecessary wave. The only question is how big it will be.

A SAGE member said it this morning that 88% of people currently in hospital in England are unvaccinated or only partially vaccinated. Currently the latter group are just in a waiting period of getting their second dose and most of them could probably walk up and get one if they tried after 3/4 weeks.

How do you vaccinate everyone? Send in the army China style, hold them down and jab them, then do it again three weeks later?

I keep trying to tell you, the partially protected are a massive chunk of population. Vaccine refusers are a small, small proportion.

Semple defined full protection as 4 weeks from vaccine.

But whatever it is, it's not indefinite and every day we get closer to it. Vaccine refusers will be around 5m in total. The number of first doses is now demand limited, it has been for the last couple of weeks.

All of the scientists are fairly united that unlockdown in autumn would be a disaster as the exit wave would be horrific for the NHS combined with what is likely to be a pretty bad flu season as we don't know what to put in the jab this year.

So once again, I'm asking the question, what are you proposing we do?

Well I would guess try to slow transmission through mask wearing (most obviously in schools, public transport etc.), properly fund isolation, speed up vaccination by making it more convenient and maybe even paying people, put money into local public health teams... nothing particularly revolutionary to be honest!

But there's no denying this should have been done earlier. The govt have obviously let this get out of control again, and are going to get a whole bunch of people infected before they had full vaccine protection rather than afterwards.

Make vaccination more convenient....how much more convenient than now can it be? There are 1000s and 1000s of centres throughout the country, open 8am to 8pm, 7 days a week. There is online booking, phone booking, GP led, On top of there, there are walk up no question centres mobile vans, weekly mass jabathons. All free of charge.

What specific extra measures could they do?

Well convenient is probably one they should have done earlier... it may be very good now I don't know, for a while it certainly wasn't so easy. Family member has been told not until end of August.

FrancisUrquhart said:

Make vaccination more convenient....how much more convenient than now can it be? There are 1000s and 1000s of centres throughout the country, open 8am to 8pm, 7 days a week. There is online booking, phone booking, GP led, On top of there, there are walk up no question centres mobile vans, weekly mass jabathons. All free of charge.

What specific extra measures could they do?

rcs1000 said:

Malmesbury said:

rcs1000 said:

I think it is time we all looked to Malta for Covid vaccination success. They have achieved the impossible.

According to their own government website, they are the only country where the number of people who are fully vaccinated (72.5%) exceeds the number who have received at least one dose (72.1%).

Edit to add: the data is easier to see on the EU page - https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#national-ref-tab

Bunch of slackers

Gibralter has

1st dose - 116%
2nd dose - 115%

I take it back. It appears that Malta is not the only country to have achieved the impossible. Indeed, it's clear that Gibraltar's impossible is even more impossible than Malta's.

It's also very clear that if you want Covid vaccination success, you need the letters "lta" consecutively in your place name.

Malmesbury said:

Wales has crawled to just below 90% - they will probably hit that in a week or so. But that is it for Wales, I think....

I think that we would be lucky to get that high for the UK as a whole...

ydoethur said:

Malmesbury said:

rcs1000 said:

I think it is time we all looked to Malta for Covid vaccination success. They have achieved the impossible.

According to their own government website, they are the only country where the number of people who are fully vaccinated (72.5%) exceeds the number who have received at least one dose (72.1%).

Edit to add: the data is easier to see on the EU page - https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#national-ref-tab

Bunch of slackers

Gibralter has

1st dose - 116%
2nd dose - 115%

Those figures have thrown a Grenada in the southern Spanish drive, though.

ydoethur said:

Malmesbury said:

rcs1000 said:

I think it is time we all looked to Malta for Covid vaccination success. They have achieved the impossible.

According to their own government website, they are the only country where the number of people who are fully vaccinated (72.5%) exceeds the number who have received at least one dose (72.1%).

Edit to add: the data is easier to see on the EU page - https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#national-ref-tab

Bunch of slackers

Gibralter has

1st dose - 116%
2nd dose - 115%

Those figures have thrown a Grenada in the southern Spanish drive, though.

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

MaxPB said:

rkrkrk said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

28k....37....406

Yep... not great at all. My prediction at start of the month was that we would get to 300/day by end of June... but I clearly underestimated it.

Remember also that the hospitalizations figure is actually for last week, there's a significant delay in reporting.
England which is a bit more up to date reported 390 admissions day before yesterday... so we have potentially broken 500 admission/day for UK already.

88% of people in hospital are unvaccinated or partially vaccinated. The people going into hospital are majority those who are refusing the vaccine, this was a known outcome of any unlockdown as we saw in Israel. What do you propose to avoid this outcome?

If a + b = 88%, can we say that either a or b is over 50%?

We've seen previous breakdowns of this figure were the actually unvaccinated make up a much larger proportion than the partially vaccinated, additionally we aren't halting the vaccine programme. Either way, you haven't answered the question, the vast majority of people in hospital now and for the foreseeable future are those who have said no to the vaccine. What do you propose we do?

Where is your evidence hospitals are full of refusers?

The answer was to vaccinate everyone, wait 2 weeks, and then lift restrictions.

But it's too late for that now. We are committed to an unnecessary wave. The only question is how big it will be.

A SAGE member said it this morning that 88% of people currently in hospital in England are unvaccinated or only partially vaccinated. Currently the latter group are just in a waiting period of getting their second dose and most of them could probably walk up and get one if they tried after 3/4 weeks.

How do you vaccinate everyone? Send in the army China style, hold them down and jab them, then do it again three weeks later?

I keep trying to tell you, the partially protected are a massive chunk of population. Vaccine refusers are a small, small proportion.

Semple defined full protection as 4 weeks from vaccine.

But whatever it is, it's not indefinite and every day we get closer to it. Vaccine refusers will be around 5m in total. The number of first doses is now demand limited, it has been for the last couple of weeks.

All of the scientists are fairly united that unlockdown in autumn would be a disaster as the exit wave would be horrific for the NHS combined with what is likely to be a pretty bad flu season as we don't know what to put in the jab this year.

So once again, I'm asking the question, what are you proposing we do?

Well I would guess try to slow transmission through mask wearing (most obviously in schools, public transport etc.), properly fund isolation, speed up vaccination by making it more convenient and maybe even paying people, put money into local public health teams... nothing particularly revolutionary to be honest!

But there's no denying this should have been done earlier. The govt have obviously let this get out of control again, and are going to get a whole bunch of people infected before they had full vaccine protection rather than afterwards.

Make vaccination more convenient....how much more convenient than now can it be? There are 1000s and 1000s of centres throughout the country, open 8am to 8pm, 7 days a week. There is online booking, phone booking, GP led, On top of there, there are walk up no question centres mobile vans, weekly mass jabathons. All free of charge.

What specific extra measures could they do?

Well convenient is probably one they should have done earlier... it may be very good now I don't know, for a while it certainly wasn't so easy. Family member has been told not until end of August.

For a first dose? They should call the number and get that pushed up immediately, all first doses are supposed to be done before July 19th.

solarflare said:

Slightly random but I just saw an HMV TV advert for Queen's Greatest Hits album.

Now I do believe everyone should own a copy, but feeling a little bemused as to why it needs to be pushed now.

JohnLilburne said:

Stocky said:

MaxPB said:

Foxy said:

MaxPB said:

Foxy said:

noneoftheabove said:

not_on_fire said:

Philip_Thompson said:

londonpubman said:

rkrkrk said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

28k....37....406

Yep... not great at all. My prediction at start of the month was that we would get to 300/day by end of June... but I clearly underestimated it.

Remember also that the hospitalizations figure is actually for last week, there's a significant delay in reporting.
England which is a bit more up to date reported 390 admissions day before yesterday... so we have potentially broken 500 admission/day for UK already.

I did project the other day on here that we would get to 100,000 cases a day. Not everyone universally agreed with me. I do hope that I am wrong...

I thought you said it would get to 100k cases a day by last week?

When do you think it will get to 100k by? And if it does without causing hospitalisations and deaths because the link has been broken then why should we care?

I imagine the approx 20,000 people who get long Covid will care. Or do they not matter?

Do they matter more than the x thousand people who get cancer? Or have a heart attack?

Yes but that suggests that it is a choice, while more likely to be both. The massive backlogs are because of the pandemic, not the lockdown.

What's the latest word on ending social distancing in hospitals? Going on the 19th like the rest of the country? Fingers crossed.

No change in hospitals planned, I have specifically asked management.

Seems like a really odd decision, maybe something Javid will address in the next few days. At least you've got rid of Hancock.

Inevitable in medical settings. Who in charge is going to take a risk?

My concern is more with the non-medical public sector. It's all very well saying that private business can make their own rules* on this but I'd like to see the government extending freedom day to non-medical public services. Bet they won't though.

*Johnson said yesterday that businesses can apply rules, e.g. mask continuance on their premises, if they choose. But he also said that individuals are entitled to choose not to wear masks. Stormy times ahead.

At DWP an email came round this morning that strongly indicated we won't be rushing back to normal on the 19th. We're currently operating at reduced capacity, every other desk, screens etc with a lot of work still being done from home by phone. We are seeing people in the office though, particularly 18-24 year olds who have been identified as a priority. In contrast, some other local services haven't opened their doors.

williamglenn said:

solarflare said:

Slightly random but I just saw an HMV TV advert for Queen's Greatest Hits album.

Now I do believe everyone should own a copy, but feeling a little bemused as to why it needs to be pushed now.

“One vision, one Britain”

rcs1000 said:

ydoethur said:

Malmesbury said:

rcs1000 said:

I think it is time we all looked to Malta for Covid vaccination success. They have achieved the impossible.

According to their own government website, they are the only country where the number of people who are fully vaccinated (72.5%) exceeds the number who have received at least one dose (72.1%).

Edit to add: the data is easier to see on the EU page - https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#national-ref-tab

Bunch of slackers

Gibralter has

1st dose - 116%
2nd dose - 115%

Those figures have thrown a Grenada in the southern Spanish drive, though.

Oh God. He's at it again.

rcs1000 said:

solarflare said:

Slightly random but I just saw an HMV TV advert for Queen's Greatest Hits album.

Now I do believe everyone should own a copy, but feeling a little bemused as to why it needs to be pushed now.

My daughter (13) has just discovered Queen. She's also got herself a turntable, and wants to get all their albums on vinyl.

Youth of today, huh?

ydoethur said:

rcs1000 said:

solarflare said:

Slightly random but I just saw an HMV TV advert for Queen's Greatest Hits album.

Now I do believe everyone should own a copy, but feeling a little bemused as to why it needs to be pushed now.

My daughter (13) has just discovered Queen. She's also got herself a turntable, and wants to get all their albums on vinyl.

Youth of today, huh?

They like a broken record.

Foxy said:

ydoethur said:

rcs1000 said:

solarflare said:

Slightly random but I just saw an HMV TV advert for Queen's Greatest Hits album.

Now I do believe everyone should own a copy, but feeling a little bemused as to why it needs to be pushed now.

My daughter (13) has just discovered Queen. She's also got herself a turntable, and wants to get all their albums on vinyl.

Youth of today, huh?

They like a broken record.

The table has turned for vinyl. Both my boys have collections, though they mostly pinch mine. There is an artisnal love of a physical piece of music.

Foxy said:

ydoethur said:

Malmesbury said:

rcs1000 said:

I think it is time we all looked to Malta for Covid vaccination success. They have achieved the impossible.

According to their own government website, they are the only country where the number of people who are fully vaccinated (72.5%) exceeds the number who have received at least one dose (72.1%).

Edit to add: the data is easier to see on the EU page - https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#national-ref-tab

Bunch of slackers

Gibralter has

1st dose - 116%
2nd dose - 115%

Those figures have thrown a Grenada in the southern Spanish drive, though.

I don't think the Spanish can a Ford to scoff at that.

ydoethur said:

Foxy said:

ydoethur said:

rcs1000 said:

solarflare said:

Slightly random but I just saw an HMV TV advert for Queen's Greatest Hits album.

Now I do believe everyone should own a copy, but feeling a little bemused as to why it needs to be pushed now.

My daughter (13) has just discovered Queen. She's also got herself a turntable, and wants to get all their albums on vinyl.

Youth of today, huh?

They like a broken record.

The table has turned for vinyl. Both my boys have collections, though they mostly pinch mine. There is an artisnal love of a physical piece of music.

So it turns out IPods and IPHones were not the vinyl word?

Foxy said:

ydoethur said:

Foxy said:

ydoethur said:

rcs1000 said:

solarflare said:

Slightly random but I just saw an HMV TV advert for Queen's Greatest Hits album.

Now I do believe everyone should own a copy, but feeling a little bemused as to why it needs to be pushed now.

My daughter (13) has just discovered Queen. She's also got herself a turntable, and wants to get all their albums on vinyl.

Youth of today, huh?

They like a broken record.

The table has turned for vinyl. Both my boys have collections, though they mostly pinch mine. There is an artisnal love of a physical piece of music.

So it turns out IPods and IPHones were not the vinyl word?

I think we have to let the Singles Chart the way for cultural trends.

FrancisUrquhart said:

Interesting Prof Pantsdown says he thinks cases could be as high as 150-200k cases a day, but government strategy is justified and he is reasonably confident.

williamglenn said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Interesting Prof Pantsdown says he thinks cases could be as high as 150-200k cases a day, but government strategy is justified and he is reasonably confident.

Do you have a link?

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Floater said:

Foxy said:

Floater said:

Leon said:

Floater said:

Delta update - Son, double jabbed and having suffered covid last year and his girlfriend (double jabbed) are both now on anti biotics

He describes this bout of covid as "far, far worse than the first one"

Lumme

Does he note any major differences in symptoms?

Sympathies to both of them; they are an interesting example

Last time he was rough for 48 hours tops - this time its longer than that - he seemed a bit better yesterday but not so good today.

Temperature is better - 37.1 earlier - sats at 94 last reading

He says he has only lost his sense of taste today

He is young but has some severe health issues which are a concern

The viral phase either gets better in a week, or switches to the more dangerous inflammatory phase, so if worsening then it does need to be taken very seriously. May well need in person assessment.

Thanks Foxy - I was really worried when his sats were below 90 - I'm happier that he is in touch regularly with NHS - although all on phone.


As an aside - track and trace have been active in checking that he has stayed at home - not that he is even thinking of going out right now

Pleased to hear the £37 billion we've spaffed on track and trace is not wholly wasted. GWS.

Nigelb said:

Culture war tactics I almost approve of...

Movement grows to replace statues of Columbus with ones dedicated to a more respected figure—TV detective Lieutenant Columbo
https://www.theartnewspaper.com/news/movement-grows-to-replace-statues-of-columbus-with-ones-dedicated-to-a-more-respected-figure-tv-detective-lieutenant-columbo
...“Through a better understanding of history, Christopher Columbus no longer represents the values we wish to instill on future generations, yet monuments of this controversial figure are still in place throughout the country,” the organiser Ryan Toohey says. “We should replace the Columbus statue in Detroit with that of someone we can all admire; someone who always pursued truth and justice—Columbo. With only slight modifications to the plaque and the addition of a frumpy coat to the original statue, we can transform a symbol of hate into a beacon of hope.”...

DecrepiterJohnL said:

RobD said:

JosiasJessop said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Floater said:

Foxy said:

Floater said:

Leon said:

Floater said:

Delta update - Son, double jabbed and having suffered covid last year and his girlfriend (double jabbed) are both now on anti biotics

He describes this bout of covid as "far, far worse than the first one"

Lumme

Does he note any major differences in symptoms?

Sympathies to both of them; they are an interesting example

Last time he was rough for 48 hours tops - this time its longer than that - he seemed a bit better yesterday but not so good today.

Temperature is better - 37.1 earlier - sats at 94 last reading

He says he has only lost his sense of taste today

He is young but has some severe health issues which are a concern

The viral phase either gets better in a week, or switches to the more dangerous inflammatory phase, so if worsening then it does need to be taken very seriously. May well need in person assessment.

Thanks Foxy - I was really worried when his sats were below 90 - I'm happier that he is in touch regularly with NHS - although all on phone.


As an aside - track and trace have been active in checking that he has stayed at home - not that he is even thinking of going out right now

Pleased to hear the £37 billion we've spaffed on track and trace is not wholly wasted. GWS.

https://fullfact.org/online/37bn-test-trace-spending/

Not quite as bad as when the FT thought the entire NHS diagnostic budget was going to be used on testing.

So £20 billion up to April and what we have to show for it is one PBer's ill son getting a phone call, whereas the equivalent programmes in the Far East seem to have suppressed Covid quite effectively. But no doubt that's an unfair comparison because they are mindless automatons and we are an international transport hub or something.

Nigelb said:

Culture war tactics I almost approve of...

Movement grows to replace statues of Columbus with ones dedicated to a more respected figure—TV detective Lieutenant Columbo
https://www.theartnewspaper.com/news/movement-grows-to-replace-statues-of-columbus-with-ones-dedicated-to-a-more-respected-figure-tv-detective-lieutenant-columbo
...“Through a better understanding of history, Christopher Columbus no longer represents the values we wish to instill on future generations, yet monuments of this controversial figure are still in place throughout the country,” the organiser Ryan Toohey says. “We should replace the Columbus statue in Detroit with that of someone we can all admire; someone who always pursued truth and justice—Columbo. With only slight modifications to the plaque and the addition of a frumpy coat to the original statue, we can transform a symbol of hate into a beacon of hope.”...

ydoethur said:

rcs1000 said:

ydoethur said:

Malmesbury said:

rcs1000 said:

I think it is time we all looked to Malta for Covid vaccination success. They have achieved the impossible.

According to their own government website, they are the only country where the number of people who are fully vaccinated (72.5%) exceeds the number who have received at least one dose (72.1%).

Edit to add: the data is easier to see on the EU page - https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#national-ref-tab

Bunch of slackers

Gibralter has

1st dose - 116%
2nd dose - 115%

Those figures have thrown a Grenada in the southern Spanish drive, though.

Oh God. He's at it again.

I am not God.

I can see why the awesomeness of my puns might confuse you though.

Andy_JS said:

Nigelb said:

Culture war tactics I almost approve of...

Movement grows to replace statues of Columbus with ones dedicated to a more respected figure—TV detective Lieutenant Columbo
https://www.theartnewspaper.com/news/movement-grows-to-replace-statues-of-columbus-with-ones-dedicated-to-a-more-respected-figure-tv-detective-lieutenant-columbo
...“Through a better understanding of history, Christopher Columbus no longer represents the values we wish to instill on future generations, yet monuments of this controversial figure are still in place throughout the country,” the organiser Ryan Toohey says. “We should replace the Columbus statue in Detroit with that of someone we can all admire; someone who always pursued truth and justice—Columbo. With only slight modifications to the plaque and the addition of a frumpy coat to the original statue, we can transform a symbol of hate into a beacon of hope.”...

Columbo is one of the best TV series ever in my opinion.

FrancisUrquhart said:

JosiasJessop said:

On long covid:

When I had viral meningitis six or so years ago, I was fairly poorly. Once I was released from hospital, it took me a long time to recover. In fact, I had two relapses, one of which sent me back to hospital, three months after the illness. Many medical professionals say that once recovered from viral meningitis you are fine, but I have talked to many people who had relapses with symptoms very similar to the original illness. God knows what the cause is, though.

During my illness, I heard "You've recovered from the meningitis; it can't be that" from a couple of medical professionals. Despite the symptoms being similar, having had no blood tests, and not having suffered from them before, or thankfully since. It's a terrible view for so-called professionals to have. It is perversely funny to see the medical profession immediately accepting long covid, when many meningitis sufferers face denial.

My view is that viruses can take a long time to recover from, even when the original symptoms have disappeared. My short-term memory was poor after the illness; I am unsure if it is back to where it was, but it is certainly much better than it was

I think there's good news in this. I know two people who have suffered from long covid; both early on in the epidemic. Both feel they are back to normal; but it can be a long process.

A couple of years ago i was hospitalised with pneumonia. Took me 6 months to get back to full fitness and had a couple of set backs.

I think at the moment lots unknown about the catch all term of long covid, which is basically been used to bucket for anybody who is still suffering after initial recovery. I think there is a wide range among this.

ydoethur said:

rcs1000 said:

ydoethur said:

Foxy said:

ydoethur said:

rcs1000 said:

solarflare said:

Slightly random but I just saw an HMV TV advert for Queen's Greatest Hits album.

Now I do believe everyone should own a copy, but feeling a little bemused as to why it needs to be pushed now.

My daughter (13) has just discovered Queen. She's also got herself a turntable, and wants to get all their albums on vinyl.

Youth of today, huh?

They like a broken record.

The table has turned for vinyl. Both my boys have collections, though they mostly pinch mine. There is an artisnal love of a physical piece of music.

So it turns out IPods and IPHones were not the vinyl word?

I'm going to ask Vanilla if they can add a "Groan" button.

Why? Do my record puns needle you?

Nigelb said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

JosiasJessop said:

On long covid:

When I had viral meningitis six or so years ago, I was fairly poorly. Once I was released from hospital, it took me a long time to recover. In fact, I had two relapses, one of which sent me back to hospital, three months after the illness. Many medical professionals say that once recovered from viral meningitis you are fine, but I have talked to many people who had relapses with symptoms very similar to the original illness. God knows what the cause is, though.

During my illness, I heard "You've recovered from the meningitis; it can't be that" from a couple of medical professionals. Despite the symptoms being similar, having had no blood tests, and not having suffered from them before, or thankfully since. It's a terrible view for so-called professionals to have. It is perversely funny to see the medical profession immediately accepting long covid, when many meningitis sufferers face denial.

My view is that viruses can take a long time to recover from, even when the original symptoms have disappeared. My short-term memory was poor after the illness; I am unsure if it is back to where it was, but it is certainly much better than it was

I think there's good news in this. I know two people who have suffered from long covid; both early on in the epidemic. Both feel they are back to normal; but it can be a long process.

A couple of years ago i was hospitalised with pneumonia. Took me 6 months to get back to full fitness and had a couple of set backs.

I think at the moment lots unknown about the catch all term of long covid, which is basically been used to bucket for anybody who is still suffering after initial recovery. I think there is a wide range among this.

Post viral syndromes have been around for a long time - but I think it’s true that a lot of doctors are very unwilling to recognise stuff they can’t properly diagnose or explain. Covid has thrown up so many cases that even the most sceptical can’t ignore the reality.

And on a more positive note will lead to a great deal of research into the underlying mechansims.

Andy_JS said:

Nigelb said:

Culture war tactics I almost approve of...

Movement grows to replace statues of Columbus with ones dedicated to a more respected figure—TV detective Lieutenant Columbo
https://www.theartnewspaper.com/news/movement-grows-to-replace-statues-of-columbus-with-ones-dedicated-to-a-more-respected-figure-tv-detective-lieutenant-columbo
...“Through a better understanding of history, Christopher Columbus no longer represents the values we wish to instill on future generations, yet monuments of this controversial figure are still in place throughout the country,” the organiser Ryan Toohey says. “We should replace the Columbus statue in Detroit with that of someone we can all admire; someone who always pursued truth and justice—Columbo. With only slight modifications to the plaque and the addition of a frumpy coat to the original statue, we can transform a symbol of hate into a beacon of hope.”...

Columbo is one of the best TV series ever in my opinion.

No_Offence_Alan said:

solarflare said:

Slightly random but I just saw an HMV TV advert for Queen's Greatest Hits album.

Now I do believe everyone should own a copy, but feeling a little bemused as to why it needs to be pushed now.

50th anniversary.

rcs1000 said:

Malmesbury said:

rcs1000 said:

I think it is time we all looked to Malta for Covid vaccination success. They have achieved the impossible.

According to their own government website, they are the only country where the number of people who are fully vaccinated (72.5%) exceeds the number who have received at least one dose (72.1%).

Edit to add: the data is easier to see on the EU page - https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#national-ref-tab

Bunch of slackers

Gibralter has

1st dose - 116%
2nd dose - 115%

I take it back. It appears that Malta is not the only country to have achieved the impossible. Indeed, it's clear that Gibraltar's impossible is even more impossible than Malta's.

It's also very clear that if you want Covid vaccination success, you need the letters "lta" consecutively in your place name.

Floater said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Floater said:

Foxy said:

Floater said:

Leon said:

Floater said:

Delta update - Son, double jabbed and having suffered covid last year and his girlfriend (double jabbed) are both now on anti biotics

He describes this bout of covid as "far, far worse than the first one"

Lumme

Does he note any major differences in symptoms?

Sympathies to both of them; they are an interesting example

Last time he was rough for 48 hours tops - this time its longer than that - he seemed a bit better yesterday but not so good today.

Temperature is better - 37.1 earlier - sats at 94 last reading

He says he has only lost his sense of taste today

He is young but has some severe health issues which are a concern

The viral phase either gets better in a week, or switches to the more dangerous inflammatory phase, so if worsening then it does need to be taken very seriously. May well need in person assessment.

Thanks Foxy - I was really worried when his sats were below 90 - I'm happier that he is in touch regularly with NHS - although all on phone.


As an aside - track and trace have been active in checking that he has stayed at home - not that he is even thinking of going out right now

Pleased to hear the £37 billion we've spaffed on track and trace is not wholly wasted. GWS.

You will be even more pleased to know they have rung him more than once

rcs1000 said:

Andy_JS said:

Nigelb said:

Culture war tactics I almost approve of...

Movement grows to replace statues of Columbus with ones dedicated to a more respected figure—TV detective Lieutenant Columbo
https://www.theartnewspaper.com/news/movement-grows-to-replace-statues-of-columbus-with-ones-dedicated-to-a-more-respected-figure-tv-detective-lieutenant-columbo
...“Through a better understanding of history, Christopher Columbus no longer represents the values we wish to instill on future generations, yet monuments of this controversial figure are still in place throughout the country,” the organiser Ryan Toohey says. “We should replace the Columbus statue in Detroit with that of someone we can all admire; someone who always pursued truth and justice—Columbo. With only slight modifications to the plaque and the addition of a frumpy coat to the original statue, we can transform a symbol of hate into a beacon of hope.”...

Columbo is one of the best TV series ever in my opinion.

+1,000

They are almost all available on-line, and the first half dozen seasons are fantastic.

Fact for the day: the very first ever Columbo episode, Murder by the Book (1971) was directed by Steven Spielberg, when he was just 24 years old.

ydoethur said:

Floater said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Floater said:

Foxy said:

Floater said:

Leon said:

Floater said:

Delta update - Son, double jabbed and having suffered covid last year and his girlfriend (double jabbed) are both now on anti biotics

He describes this bout of covid as "far, far worse than the first one"

Lumme

Does he note any major differences in symptoms?

Sympathies to both of them; they are an interesting example

Last time he was rough for 48 hours tops - this time its longer than that - he seemed a bit better yesterday but not so good today.

Temperature is better - 37.1 earlier - sats at 94 last reading

He says he has only lost his sense of taste today

He is young but has some severe health issues which are a concern

The viral phase either gets better in a week, or switches to the more dangerous inflammatory phase, so if worsening then it does need to be taken very seriously. May well need in person assessment.

Thanks Foxy - I was really worried when his sats were below 90 - I'm happier that he is in touch regularly with NHS - although all on phone.


As an aside - track and trace have been active in checking that he has stayed at home - not that he is even thinking of going out right now

Pleased to hear the £37 billion we've spaffed on track and trace is not wholly wasted. GWS.

You will be even more pleased to know they have rung him more than once

Even for TalkTalk £37 billion for one phone call seemed a bit on the high side.

Casino_Royale said:

rcs1000 said:

Andy_JS said:

Nigelb said:

Culture war tactics I almost approve of...

Movement grows to replace statues of Columbus with ones dedicated to a more respected figure—TV detective Lieutenant Columbo
https://www.theartnewspaper.com/news/movement-grows-to-replace-statues-of-columbus-with-ones-dedicated-to-a-more-respected-figure-tv-detective-lieutenant-columbo
...“Through a better understanding of history, Christopher Columbus no longer represents the values we wish to instill on future generations, yet monuments of this controversial figure are still in place throughout the country,” the organiser Ryan Toohey says. “We should replace the Columbus statue in Detroit with that of someone we can all admire; someone who always pursued truth and justice—Columbo. With only slight modifications to the plaque and the addition of a frumpy coat to the original statue, we can transform a symbol of hate into a beacon of hope.”...

Columbo is one of the best TV series ever in my opinion.

+1,000

They are almost all available on-line, and the first half dozen seasons are fantastic.

Fact for the day: the very first ever Columbo episode, Murder by the Book (1971) was directed by Steven Spielberg, when he was just 24 years old.

Hey, my wife loves ya.

stodge said:

Evening all

Before this site devolves into a group of football fans down the boozer, a thought or two on the passing of the Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill in the Commons last evening.

There's some good and valid points in it but it's one of those pieces of legislation which is ruined by one "controversial" area - the change to the law on protest.

The woolly and wide-ranging definition of "intimidation or harassment" or "serious unease, alarm or distress to bystanders" gives the Police, in theory, huge powers. It's no surprise this Government and this Home Secretary think there are votes to be won by looking and sounding "tough" on protest.

Whether it's a response to the "culture wars" (whatever they are) or to individuals protesting near to Parliament, it seems an absurd misuse of State power to close down what is, so I thought, the right within a democratic society to protest.

Now, I'm in no way condoning criminal damage or thuggery and of course the Police must intervene if violence takes over but what constitutes "serious unease, alarm or distress"? Presumably I could argue the beggar on the Tube is causing me "unease" so they can be removed.

Theoretically, this power could have bene used to curtail the Anti-Iraq War march or the Countryside Alliance protest or indeed almost any other gathering or in theory an individual ranting at Speaker's Corner.

Apart from the shameless pandering to the frightened, what else does this Government think it will achieve? I suppose one will argue the streets will be more peaceful but when we have a non-Conservative Government and Conservatives wish to protest against a piece of Government legislation, they'll presumably be happy to be arrested and prosecuted under this law?

Cookie said:

Floater said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Floater said:

Foxy said:

Floater said:

Leon said:

Floater said:

Delta update - Son, double jabbed and having suffered covid last year and his girlfriend (double jabbed) are both now on anti biotics

He describes this bout of covid as "far, far worse than the first one"

Lumme

Does he note any major differences in symptoms?

Sympathies to both of them; they are an interesting example

Last time he was rough for 48 hours tops - this time its longer than that - he seemed a bit better yesterday but not so good today.

Temperature is better - 37.1 earlier - sats at 94 last reading

He says he has only lost his sense of taste today

He is young but has some severe health issues which are a concern

The viral phase either gets better in a week, or switches to the more dangerous inflammatory phase, so if worsening then it does need to be taken very seriously. May well need in person assessment.

Thanks Foxy - I was really worried when his sats were below 90 - I'm happier that he is in touch regularly with NHS - although all on phone.


As an aside - track and trace have been active in checking that he has stayed at home - not that he is even thinking of going out right now

Pleased to hear the £37 billion we've spaffed on track and trace is not wholly wasted. GWS.

You will be even more pleased to know they have rung him more than once

A friend of mine caught covid a few weeks back. Felt absolutely awful. The only time he wasn't suffering was when he was asleep. Which made it especially annoying when T&T rang him every single day at 8am.

DecrepiterJohnL said:

RobD said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

RobD said:

JosiasJessop said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Floater said:

Foxy said:

Floater said:

Leon said:

Floater said:

Delta update - Son, double jabbed and having suffered covid last year and his girlfriend (double jabbed) are both now on anti biotics

He describes this bout of covid as "far, far worse than the first one"

Lumme

Does he note any major differences in symptoms?

Sympathies to both of them; they are an interesting example

Last time he was rough for 48 hours tops - this time its longer than that - he seemed a bit better yesterday but not so good today.

Temperature is better - 37.1 earlier - sats at 94 last reading

He says he has only lost his sense of taste today

He is young but has some severe health issues which are a concern

The viral phase either gets better in a week, or switches to the more dangerous inflammatory phase, so if worsening then it does need to be taken very seriously. May well need in person assessment.

Thanks Foxy - I was really worried when his sats were below 90 - I'm happier that he is in touch regularly with NHS - although all on phone.


As an aside - track and trace have been active in checking that he has stayed at home - not that he is even thinking of going out right now

Pleased to hear the £37 billion we've spaffed on track and trace is not wholly wasted. GWS.

https://fullfact.org/online/37bn-test-trace-spending/

Not quite as bad as when the FT thought the entire NHS diagnostic budget was going to be used on testing.

So £20 billion up to April and what we have to show for it is one PBer's ill son getting a phone call, whereas the equivalent programmes in the Far East seem to have suppressed Covid quite effectively. But no doubt that's an unfair comparison because they are mindless automatons and we are an international transport hub or something.

Don't they have mass surveillance there? Good luck trying to enforce that in the UK.

London comes third in the cctv camera league table.
https://www.comparitech.com/vpn-privacy/the-worlds-most-surveilled-cities/

There really ought to be an inquiry into what has gone wrong with track and trace. It is ruinously expensive and there is little to show for it compared with the Far East. As I understand it, one important design issue we may have got wrong is whether to trace forwards or backwards: in other words, are you trying to work out where Patient X caught Covid, or who he might have given it to? Beyond that there are some implementation issues like dodgy apps, call centres and test labs but those are secondary imo. Or rather, they answer separate parts of the question: why is T&T so expensive, and why doesn't it work?

rcs1000 said:

Malmesbury said:

rcs1000 said:

I think it is time we all looked to Malta for Covid vaccination success. They have achieved the impossible.

According to their own government website, they are the only country where the number of people who are fully vaccinated (72.5%) exceeds the number who have received at least one dose (72.1%).

Edit to add: the data is easier to see on the EU page - https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#national-ref-tab

Bunch of slackers

Gibralter has

1st dose - 116%
2nd dose - 115%

I take it back. It appears that Malta is not the only country to have achieved the impossible. Indeed, it's clear that Gibraltar's impossible is even more impossible than Malta's.

It's also very clear that if you want Covid vaccination success, you need the letters "lta" consecutively in your place name.