I do wonder how disadvantaged Labour are by the fact only oldies are fully vaccinated. How many people thought I might just give that trip to the polling station a miss and hadn't organized a postal vote.
It isn't just that. The under 30s are just not going to be voting full stop. Like I said earlier, almost all of my friends haven't bothered to vote and most of them are Labour or Lib Dem supporters.
To be honest the results are better than I expected so far.
Because?
Because what?
Not bothering to vote. General apathy, its locals nobody gives a shit, the direction of the Labour / Lib Dem parties?
I do wonder how disadvantaged Labour are by the fact only oldies are fully vaccinated. How many people thought I might just give that trip to the polling station a miss and hadn't organized a postal vote.
It isn't just that. The under 30s are just not going to be voting full stop. Like I said earlier, almost all of my friends haven't bothered to vote and most of them are Labour or Lib Dem supporters.
To be honest the results are better than I expected so far.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
Replacing the MP for Islington with a London Lawyer may not have been the smartest move.
I do wonder how disadvantaged Labour are by the fact only oldies are fully vaccinated. How many people thought I might just give that trip to the polling station a miss and hadn't organized a postal vote.
It isn't just that. The under 30s are just not going to be voting full stop. Like I said earlier, almost all of my friends haven't bothered to vote and most of them are Labour or Lib Dem supporters.
To be honest the results are better than I expected so far.
Because?
Because what?
Not bothering to vote. General apathy, its locals nobody gives a shit, the direction of the Labour / Lib Dem parties?
They don't care about the local council or the PCC
Starmer deserves to take a great deal of flak for Hartlepool - a by election that did not need to be held at all at this time. It also reflects badly on the Chief Whip and Regional Party Officers who surely provided advice. It does not augur well for his political psephological nous. Of course, the poor results in Sunderland were going to happen anyway.
He couldn't have moved it by that much, so I doubt it makes that much difference.
The MP did not have to resign at all! All Starmer could do in terms of leverage was to threaten removal of the Whip , but he could have still sat as an Independent - just like Corbyn. The MP would have done Labour a favour by simply ignoring Starmer. The loss of Hartlepool is a self inflicted wound.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
I do wonder how disadvantaged Labour are by the fact only oldies are fully vaccinated. How many people thought I might just give that trip to the polling station a miss and hadn't organized a postal vote.
It isn't just that. The under 30s are just not going to be voting full stop. Like I said earlier, almost all of my friends haven't bothered to vote and most of them are Labour or Lib Dem supporters.
To be honest the results are better than I expected so far.
Because?
Starmer and Davey hardly get the juices flowing.
Davey visited Sunderland during the campaign.
Interestingly the Lib Dems have failed to take any of their target wards in Newcastle thus far
Starmer deserves to take a great deal of flak for Hartlepool - a by election that did not need to be held at all at this time. It also reflects badly on the Chief Whip and Regional Party Officers who surely provided advice. It does not augur well for his political psephological nous. Of course, the poor results in Sunderland were going to happen anyway.
He couldn't have moved it by that much, so I doubt it makes that much difference.
The MP did not have to resign at all! All Starmer could do in terms of leverage was to threaten removal of the Whip , but he could have still sat as an Independent - just like Corbyn. The MP would have done Labour a favour by simply ignoring Starmer. The loss of Hartlepool is a self inflicted wound.
Perhaps the MP had a shred of honour and decided to resign given the charges he faced?
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
Replacing the MP for Islington with a London Lawyer may not have been the smartest move.
Susan Elizabeth Dungworth (LAB & CO-OP) - 868 David Ferguson (CON) - 869 Anita Cynthia Romer (LD) 105
CON GAIN (by 1 vote)
Blyth Valley Lab GE candidate loses also her council seat
And she only lost Blyth Valley by 700 votes. From MP aspirations to no place on the council in 18 months. Poor Susan Dungsworth, she must be feeling like, err, shit.
Starmer deserves to take a great deal of flak for Hartlepool - a by election that did not need to be held at all at this time. It also reflects badly on the Chief Whip and Regional Party Officers who surely provided advice. It does not augur well for his political psephological nous. Of course, the poor results in Sunderland were going to happen anyway.
An utterly disastrous candidate - a second referendumer. In Hartlepool.
The Tories could have barely hand-picked a candidate they would rather face.
And bear in mind, the Tory candidate was roundly condemned as a shit choice too. Just - not quite as shit.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
Replacing the MP for Islington with a London Lawyer may not have been the smartest move.
Starmer deserves to take a great deal of flak for Hartlepool - a by election that did not need to be held at all at this time. It also reflects badly on the Chief Whip and Regional Party Officers who surely provided advice. It does not augur well for his political psephological nous. Of course, the poor results in Sunderland were going to happen anyway.
Another way of looking at it, if they knew they would probably loos anyway, then better to get it out of the way now, when it will be mixed in with other bad news, and possibly be overshadowed by results in Scotland.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Lisa Nandy. Should have done it last time... Was on her at 100-1. Fools.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Yes exactly. I think a white provincial working class woman like Rayner could work well. She’s not to everyone’s taste, but nor is Boris, and he’s doing OK
It is the obvious next move. After that, I run out of potential moves for Labour
Without Scotland, perhaps they are simply finished
Starmer deserves to take a great deal of flak for Hartlepool - a by election that did not need to be held at all at this time. It also reflects badly on the Chief Whip and Regional Party Officers who surely provided advice. It does not augur well for his political psephological nous. Of course, the poor results in Sunderland were going to happen anyway.
An utterly disastrous candidate - a second referendumer. In Hartlepool.
The Tories could have barely hand-picked a candidate they would rather face.
And bear in mind, the Tory candidate was roundly condemned as a shit choice too. Just - not quite as shit.
Yeah, it makes Labour look a bit out of touch parachuting an arch-remainer into one of the most leave voting seats in the country.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
Replacing the MP for Islington with a London Lawyer may not have been the smartest move.
Starmer deserves to take a great deal of flak for Hartlepool - a by election that did not need to be held at all at this time. It also reflects badly on the Chief Whip and Regional Party Officers who surely provided advice. It does not augur well for his political psephological nous. Of course, the poor results in Sunderland were going to happen anyway.
An utterly disastrous candidate - a second referendumer. In Hartlepool.
The Tories could have barely hand-picked a candidate they would rather face.
And bear in mind, the Tory candidate was roundly condemned as a shit choice too. Just - not quite as shit.
Yeah, it makes Labour look a bit out of touch parachuting an arch-remainer into one of the most leave voting seats in the country.
Starmer deserves to take a great deal of flak for Hartlepool - a by election that did not need to be held at all at this time. It also reflects badly on the Chief Whip and Regional Party Officers who surely provided advice. It does not augur well for his political psephological nous. Of course, the poor results in Sunderland were going to happen anyway.
An utterly disastrous candidate - a second referendumer. In Hartlepool.
The Tories could have barely hand-picked a candidate they would rather face.
And bear in mind, the Tory candidate was roundly condemned as a shit choice too. Just - not quite as shit.
The by election could easily have been deferred until October/ November - possibly into 2022. The vacination Bounce is likely to be long gone by that time.
Starmer deserves to take a great deal of flak for Hartlepool - a by election that did not need to be held at all at this time. It also reflects badly on the Chief Whip and Regional Party Officers who surely provided advice. It does not augur well for his political psephological nous. Of course, the poor results in Sunderland were going to happen anyway.
An utterly disastrous candidate - a second referendumer. In Hartlepool.
The Tories could have barely hand-picked a candidate they would rather face.
And bear in mind, the Tory candidate was roundly condemned as a shit choice too. Just - not quite as shit.
Yeah, it makes Labour look a bit out of touch parachuting an arch-remainer into one of the most leave voting seats in the country.
I don't think it would have made a difference
We'll never know of course. But it does look a bit odd. He even went as far as purging his twitter history just before he was officially selected.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
Replacing the MP for Islington with a London Lawyer may not have been the smartest move.
The fact he is a "sir" probably not a great help
Perhaps they could try an hereditary peer next?
Didn't one of the Benns seek to revive their title?
You can hold one and sit in the Commons now of course.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Lisa Nandy. Should have done it last time... Was on her at 100-1. Fools.
I preferred Nandy, felt she was more in tune with the WWC than SKS and had a better understanding of where Labour previously went wrong. Her recent flirting with a couple of ultra woke causes should be grounds for concern though.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Lisa Nandy. Should have done it last time... Was on her at 100-1. Fools.
Noooooo. Not Nandy. She’s woke middle class. She’s Starmer in a skirt. Obsessed with trans insanity
Your frequent reminder we 've had one ward outwith the NE so far. Before Kier jacks it in. And everybody and their dog up here was predicting this. I'm with Gallowgate. This ain't half as bad as I thought. Even going forward in Central Newcastle.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Lisa Nandy. Should have done it last time... Was on her at 100-1. Fools.
Noooooo. Not Nandy. She’s woke middle class. She’s Starmer in a skirt. Obsessed with trans insanity
Seriously. She’s never going to win a GE
No she isn't.
She's unapologetically woke but she also appreciates that other people hold different views, and that's okay.
At least that's how she portrayed herself when I heard her speak in Newcastle. She really got it, and hence why I voted for her over Starmer.
Starmer deserves to take a great deal of flak for Hartlepool - a by election that did not need to be held at all at this time. It also reflects badly on the Chief Whip and Regional Party Officers who surely provided advice. It does not augur well for his political psephological nous. Of course, the poor results in Sunderland were going to happen anyway.
An utterly disastrous candidate - a second referendumer. In Hartlepool.
The Tories could have barely hand-picked a candidate they would rather face.
And bear in mind, the Tory candidate was roundly condemned as a shit choice too. Just - not quite as shit.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
I don't think that is Rayner. She is Manchester through and through. Perhaps Nandy? I still can't get over the fact that Leigh gas a Tory MP.
If the results continue like this then Boris is going to be walking on water.
That’s an understatement. Normally you get a swing right across the country, with the odd exceptions. Are we going to see massive swings in the midlands and the NE but the rest of the country Labour holds its own and the Libs eat into the tories.
The results so far are utterly devastating for labour.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Lisa Nandy. Should have done it last time... Was on her at 100-1. Fools.
Noooooo. Not Nandy. She’s woke middle class. She’s Starmer in a skirt. Obsessed with trans insanity
Seriously. She’s never going to win a GE
Caroline Flint was the only one who credibly moved from a generic centre-left Remain position to a 'get Brexit done' position, but unfortunately for them she lost her seat.
Your frequent reminder we 've had one ward outwith the NE so far. Before Kier jacks it in. And everybody and their dog up here was predicting this. I'm with Gallowgate. This ain't half as bad as I thought. Even going forward in Central Newcastle.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Yes exactly. I think a white provincial working class woman like Rayner could work well. She’s not to everyone’s taste, but nor is Boris, and he’s doing OK
It is the obvious next move. After that, I run out of potential moves for Labour
Without Scotland, perhaps they are simply finished
But Rayner is not provincial. She is from Manchester.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
Replacing the MP for Islington with a London Lawyer may not have been the smartest move.
The fact he is a "sir" probably not a great help
Perhaps they could try an hereditary peer next?
Didn't one of the Benns seek to revive their title?
You can hold one and sit in the Commons now of course.
I think it's less his receiving a gong from Her Maj that's the problem than stuff like the kneeling for BLM and all the other woke business that sticks in the craw of many traditional Labour voters.
The problem is not the leader of Labour, as I've said before, its that Labour is a fundamentally broken institution, with an appeal that is too narrow.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Yes exactly. I think a white provincial working class woman like Rayner could work well. She’s not to everyone’s taste, but nor is Boris, and he’s doing OK
It is the obvious next move. After that, I run out of potential moves for Labour
Without Scotland, perhaps they are simply finished
But Rayner is not provincial. She is from Manchester.
Everywhere not in London is provincial. Or something. It might be code for 'has an accent'.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Yes exactly. I think a white provincial working class woman like Rayner could work well. She’s not to everyone’s taste, but nor is Boris, and he’s doing OK
It is the obvious next move. After that, I run out of potential moves for Labour
Without Scotland, perhaps they are simply finished
But Rayner is not provincial. She is from Manchester.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Lisa Nandy. Should have done it last time... Was on her at 100-1. Fools.
Noooooo. Not Nandy. She’s woke middle class. She’s Starmer in a skirt. Obsessed with trans insanity
Seriously. She’s never going to win a GE
Caroline Flint was the only one who credibly moved from a generic centre-left Remain position to a 'get Brexit done' position, but unfortunately for them she lost her seat.
Yes, it was a shame in a way that of the 3 red Doncaster seats hers was the one to go. Although a surprising amount of her constituency was/is rural (ish) and has always had blue wards on the council.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Yes exactly. I think a white provincial working class woman like Rayner could work well. She’s not to everyone’s taste, but nor is Boris, and he’s doing OK
It is the obvious next move. After that, I run out of potential moves for Labour
Without Scotland, perhaps they are simply finished
But Rayner is not provincial. She is from Manchester.
That's provincial compared to North London.
If only they had a woman who grew up above a corner shop in Grantham.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Yes exactly. I think a white provincial working class woman like Rayner could work well. She’s not to everyone’s taste, but nor is Boris, and he’s doing OK
It is the obvious next move. After that, I run out of potential moves for Labour
Without Scotland, perhaps they are simply finished
But Rayner is not provincial. She is from Manchester.
That's provincial compared to North London.
Manchester is chock-full of North London types these days
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Lisa Nandy. Should have done it last time... Was on her at 100-1. Fools.
Noooooo. Not Nandy. She’s woke middle class. She’s Starmer in a skirt. Obsessed with trans insanity
Seriously. She’s never going to win a GE
No she isn't.
She's unapologetically woke but she also appreciates that other people hold different views, and that's okay.
At least that's how she portrayed herself when I heard her speak in Newcastle. She really got it, and hence why I voted for her over Starmer.
She makes me sneeze, allergically. She’s ultra-woke. And (despite the protests of PB) woke is growing in salience, and backlash. Hostage to fortune
Also, what does she believe?! Apart from Woke?
To be fair, this is a question which would trouble many leftwing politicians across the West
The problem is not the leader of Labour, as I've said before, its that Labour is a fundamentally broken institution, with an appeal that is too narrow.
That's a problem that the leader of the Labour Party ought to be fixing.
Instead it seems his idea of leadership is saying "I'm not Corbyn and I'm not Boris, now vote for me bitches"
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Yes exactly. I think a white provincial working class woman like Rayner could work well. She’s not to everyone’s taste, but nor is Boris, and he’s doing OK
It is the obvious next move. After that, I run out of potential moves for Labour
Without Scotland, perhaps they are simply finished
But Rayner is not provincial. She is from Manchester.
She has a remarkable back story
‘Rayner was born in Stockport, where she attended the state secondary Avondale School. She left school aged 16 whilst pregnant and without any qualifications. She later trained in social care, eventually becoming a trade union representative within Unison, during which time she joined the Labour Party. Selected to contest Ashton-under-Lyne in 2014, Rayner was elected for the seat at the 2015 general election.’
Voters might not think Boris has sold his soul for gold wallpaper and scatter cushions but that does not mean no offences were committed. President Nixon won a landslide after Watergate.
The problem is not the leader of Labour, as I've said before, its that Labour is a fundamentally broken institution, with an appeal that is too narrow.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
Replacing the MP for Islington with a London Lawyer may not have been the smartest move.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Lisa Nandy. Should have done it last time... Was on her at 100-1. Fools.
Noooooo. Not Nandy. She’s woke middle class. She’s Starmer in a skirt. Obsessed with trans insanity
Seriously. She’s never going to win a GE
Caroline Flint was the only one who credibly moved from a generic centre-left Remain position to a 'get Brexit done' position, but unfortunately for them she lost her seat.
I appreciate she ‘saw the light’ but always felt it was a ‘keep Caroline Flint in a job’ position. But hey at least she heard her electorate before the death knell sounded.
Going back to the 2016 referendum the Tory party having a relatively even leave/remain split of MPs was a good thing and reflective of their voters. Alarm bells should have been ringing at Lab HQ that 95% of their MPs were firmly in the remain camp. The party had drifted way too far from the views of the red wall at that point and the writing was on the wall without them realising it.
The problem is not the leader of Labour, as I've said before, its that Labour is a fundamentally broken institution, with an appeal that is too narrow.
I'm not sure the appeal is too much of a problem but the demography is now v-unfavourable.
Is this the Cummings effect: pushing the conservatives to grasp the disenfranchised lower-middle incomes?
‘She is an ardent supporter of Palestinian rights, condemning the killings of Palestinians during the Great March of Return and has repeatedly cited Israeli violations of human rights against Palestinians on social media. She is also a member of the Labour Friends of Palestine & the Middle East.’
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
Replacing the MP for Islington with a London Lawyer may not have been the smartest move.
Yet it was so widely counselled on here.
Not universally. But yes a few people, like OGH, were very keen on Sir Keir.
I think its a real shame that @isam isn't here at the moment. He had very good insights early on into how poor Sir Keir's (gross) approval ratings were, while people were raving about his (net) ones.
This election should put paid to the idea that net matters more than gross when there's a major discrepancy.
‘She is an ardent supporter of Palestinian rights, condemning the killings of Palestinians during the Great March of Return and has repeatedly cited Israeli violations of human rights against Palestinians on social media. She is also a member of the Labour Friends of Palestine & the Middle East.’
JUST STFU ABOUT PALESTINE
Well a lot of right wingers on Twitter are obsessed with Israel, so I guess it's the same phenomenon.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Yes exactly. I think a white provincial working class woman like Rayner could work well. She’s not to everyone’s taste, but nor is Boris, and he’s doing OK
It is the obvious next move. After that, I run out of potential moves for Labour
Without Scotland, perhaps they are simply finished
But Rayner is not provincial. She is from Manchester.
She has a remarkable back story
‘Rayner was born in Stockport, where she attended the state secondary Avondale School. She left school aged 16 whilst pregnant and without any qualifications. She later trained in social care, eventually becoming a trade union representative within Unison, during which time she joined the Labour Party. Selected to contest Ashton-under-Lyne in 2014, Rayner was elected for the seat at the 2015 general election.’
Good for her
Good for her indeed but if Angela Rayner is elected leader, I'd give it a week before the Oxbridge-educated media hacks start sniffing that she is not up to par. Ask John Major.
‘She is an ardent supporter of Palestinian rights, condemning the killings of Palestinians during the Great March of Return and has repeatedly cited Israeli violations of human rights against Palestinians on social media. She is also a member of the Labour Friends of Palestine & the Middle East.’
JUST STFU ABOUT PALESTINE
I pointed out the other day that a friend linked me to a load of social media for Oxford Labour Party candidates....were they talking about the level of council tax, the bins, the congestion, supporting businesses and people as we come out of the pandemic, how to ensure the universities continue to thrive, that tourists are encouraged back....nope banging on about Free Palestine and how they were going to twin Oxford with part of it as a show of solidarity.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Yes exactly. I think a white provincial working class woman like Rayner could work well. She’s not to everyone’s taste, but nor is Boris, and he’s doing OK
It is the obvious next move. After that, I run out of potential moves for Labour
Without Scotland, perhaps they are simply finished
But Rayner is not provincial. She is from Manchester.
She has a remarkable back story
‘Rayner was born in Stockport, where she attended the state secondary Avondale School. She left school aged 16 whilst pregnant and without any qualifications. She later trained in social care, eventually becoming a trade union representative within Unison, during which time she joined the Labour Party. Selected to contest Ashton-under-Lyne in 2014, Rayner was elected for the seat at the 2015 general election.’
Good for her
Good for her indeed but if Angela Rayner is elected leader, I'd give it a week before the Oxbridge-educated media hacks start sniffing that she is not up to par. Ask John Major.
Well @HYUFD has already previously stated that she's too stupid to be PM, or something to that effect.
Rayner has a great backstory but she’s already operating at a level way above her talent. Not the only MP in that category mind. She would IMO be the worst major party leader in my lifetime.
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Yes exactly. I think a white provincial working class woman like Rayner could work well. She’s not to everyone’s taste, but nor is Boris, and he’s doing OK
It is the obvious next move. After that, I run out of potential moves for Labour
Without Scotland, perhaps they are simply finished
But Rayner is not provincial. She is from Manchester.
That's provincial compared to North London.
She is OK, but I don't listen to her and hear small town Britain. She sounds just like the city dwelling middle class activist types I know across the UK, who don't know anyone who votes Tory or voted for Brexit. The anger she shows and that of the people trying to cancel Brexit sound the same to me There is a disconnect between the evidence (votes) and their experience (twitter and friendship bubble) which means they cannot hear. This is fundamental to Labours current problems.
‘She is an ardent supporter of Palestinian rights, condemning the killings of Palestinians during the Great March of Return and has repeatedly cited Israeli violations of human rights against Palestinians on social media. She is also a member of the Labour Friends of Palestine & the Middle East.’
JUST STFU ABOUT PALESTINE
Well a lot of right wingers on Twitter are obsessed with Israel, so I guess it's the same phenomenon.
I know vanishingly few British right wingers ‘obsessed with Israel’ in a pro-Israeli way. Most find it boring and sad and decry Israeli heavy-handedness, even as they yearn to talk about anything else. It does not divert them for long
The left, however, seems to get a massive high from obsessing about Palestine. I guess because it combines anti-Americanism with post-colonialism and the anti-imperial struggle with - for some - a secret but heady hit of anti-semitism?
It doesn’t do them any favours. It always seems cranky
‘She is an ardent supporter of Palestinian rights, condemning the killings of Palestinians during the Great March of Return and has repeatedly cited Israeli violations of human rights against Palestinians on social media. She is also a member of the Labour Friends of Palestine & the Middle East.’
JUST STFU ABOUT PALESTINE
Well a lot of right wingers on Twitter are obsessed with Israel, so I guess it's the same phenomenon.
I know vanishingly few British right wingers ‘obsessed with Israel’ in a pro-Israeli way. Most find it boring and sad and decry Israeli heavy-handedness, even as they yearn to talk about anything else. It does not divert them for long
The left, however, seems to get a massive high from obsessing about Palestine. I guess because it combines anti-Americanism with post-colonialism and the anti-imperial struggle with - for some - a secret but heady hit of anti-semitism?
It doesn’t do them any favours. It always seems cranky
That's because you spend your time looking for woke left wingers to get angry about
Has any opposition leader had a poor first election and gone on to win a general election? I believe Thatcher, Blair and Cameron all did rather well (and I can’t be arsed to trawl further back than that).
I would imagine it’s an ominous sign, if you’re associated with being a loser early on it becomes hard to shake that label.
They might have to go the full Angela Rayner. Provincial working class giantess.
If that doesn’t work, disband
They need someone who gets the modern provincial working class. Starmer seems to have a caricature in his head from the 1970s.
Lisa Nandy. Should have done it last time... Was on her at 100-1. Fools.
Noooooo. Not Nandy. She’s woke middle class. She’s Starmer in a skirt. Obsessed with trans insanity
Seriously. She’s never going to win a GE
Caroline Flint was the only one who credibly moved from a generic centre-left Remain position to a 'get Brexit done' position, but unfortunately for them she lost her seat.
I appreciate she ‘saw the light’ but always felt it was a ‘keep Caroline Flint in a job’ position. But hey at least she heard her electorate before the death knell sounded.
Going back to the 2016 referendum the Tory party having a relatively even leave/remain split of MPs was a good thing and reflective of their voters. Alarm bells should have been ringing at Lab HQ that 95% of their MPs were firmly in the remain camp. The party had drifted way too far from the views of the red wall at that point and the writing was on the wall without them realising it.
It was partially that I think, but listening was surely a good thing. She wasn't a terrible MP.
Ed Miliband doesn't bother living in the constituency - I honestly thought he'd go in 2019. There's certainly not a lot of enthusiasm for him in the working men's clubs.
The problem is not the leader of Labour, as I've said before, its that Labour is a fundamentally broken institution, with an appeal that is too narrow.
I'm not sure the appeal is too much of a problem but the demography is now v-unfavourable.
Is this the Cummings effect: pushing the conservatives to grasp the disenfranchised lower-middle incomes?
Part Cummings; part Boris. Broken record mode ON. Boris won in 2019 by running on Labour's 2017 platform.
So why vote Labour in 2021? More nurses? More infrastructure spending? More investment up north? You can get all those from Boris.
‘She is an ardent supporter of Palestinian rights, condemning the killings of Palestinians during the Great March of Return and has repeatedly cited Israeli violations of human rights against Palestinians on social media. She is also a member of the Labour Friends of Palestine & the Middle East.’
JUST STFU ABOUT PALESTINE
Well a lot of right wingers on Twitter are obsessed with Israel, so I guess it's the same phenomenon.
I know vanishingly few British right wingers ‘obsessed with Israel’ in a pro-Israeli way. Most find it boring and sad and decry Israeli heavy-handedness, even as they yearn to talk about anything else. It does not divert them for long
The left, however, seems to get a massive high from obsessing about Palestine. I guess because it combines anti-Americanism with post-colonialism and the anti-imperial struggle with - for some - a secret but heady hit of anti-semitism?
It doesn’t do them any favours. It always seems cranky
Many moons ago, I remember a right wing nutter on here (Shaun?) writing eloquently about what he described as Israeli "apartheid", in a definitely non-approving manner.
Comments
8 Lab
1 Con
1 Green
10 to declared
Threatening to announce...
https://twitter.com/lmharpin/status/1390458333929394176?s=21
The Tories could have barely hand-picked a candidate they would rather face.
And bear in mind, the Tory candidate was roundly condemned as a shit choice too. Just - not quite as shit.
Was on her at 100-1. Fools.
It is the obvious next move. After that, I run out of potential moves for Labour
Without Scotland, perhaps they are simply finished
Dene and South Gosforth:
Nick Arnold (LAB) - 1177
Anna Foster (GRN) - 509
Gerry Langley (CON) - 475
Karen Robinson (LD) - 1777
LD HOLD
You can hold one and sit in the Commons now of course.
Seriously. She’s never going to win a GE
She's unapologetically woke but she also appreciates that other people hold different views, and that's okay.
At least that's how she portrayed herself when I heard her speak in Newcastle. She really got it, and hence why I voted for her over Starmer.
The results so far are utterly devastating for labour.
Con: 45.9% (+25.7)
Lab: 44.9% (-4.6)
Grn: 4.7% (+4.7)
Ind: 4.5% (+4.5)
No UKIP (-28.0) as prev.
Con GAIN from Lab
Bloody Green Corbynistas
There seems to be a lot of happy Tory faces in Harlow.
Could they be able to gain control for the first time since 2012
https://twitter.com/wallaceme/status/1390460482855784450
https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/elections/2021/05/2021-english-local-election-results-ward-ward
Also, what does she believe?! Apart from Woke?
To be fair, this is a question which would trouble many leftwing politicians across the West
Is that surprising? Isn't Thurrock Brexit-Central?
Instead it seems his idea of leadership is saying "I'm not Corbyn and I'm not Boris, now vote for me bitches"
‘Rayner was born in Stockport, where she attended the state secondary Avondale School. She left school aged 16 whilst pregnant and without any qualifications. She later trained in social care, eventually becoming a trade union representative within Unison, during which time she joined the Labour Party. Selected to contest Ashton-under-Lyne in 2014, Rayner was elected for the seat at the 2015 general election.’
Good for her
Going back to the 2016 referendum the Tory party having a relatively even leave/remain split of MPs was a good thing and reflective of their voters. Alarm bells should have been ringing at Lab HQ that 95% of their MPs were firmly in the remain camp. The party had drifted way too far from the views of the red wall at that point and the writing was on the wall without them realising it.
Is this the Cummings effect: pushing the conservatives to grasp the disenfranchised lower-middle incomes?
‘She is an ardent supporter of Palestinian rights, condemning the killings of Palestinians during the Great March of Return and has repeatedly cited Israeli violations of human rights against Palestinians on social media. She is also a member of the Labour Friends of Palestine & the Middle East.’
JUST STFU ABOUT PALESTINE
I think its a real shame that @isam isn't here at the moment. He had very good insights early on into how poor Sir Keir's (gross) approval ratings were, while people were raving about his (net) ones.
This election should put paid to the idea that net matters more than gross when there's a major discrepancy.
https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1390467526593757184
Cramlington South East (Northumberland) council result:
Con: 61.8% (+27.9)
Lab: 38.2% (-4.8)
No LDem (-16.5) and UKIP (-5.2) as prev.
Con GAIN from Lab
The Tories have taken the previously Labour stronghold seat in the Kingswood ward in Nuneaton.
They polled 793 votes, compared to 530 for Labour, 80 for the Green Party and 32 for the Trade Unionist and Socialist Coalition.
Con: 55.3% (+33.3)
Lab: 36.9% (-12.3)
Grn: 5.6% (+0.9)
Oth: 2.2% (+0.6)
No UKIP (-22.5) as prev.
Con GAIN from Lab
More UKIP going direct to Con and then some.
A tory gain outside the North east
23% swing Lab to Con!
It's simple — the white working class now vote Con, wherever they are in the country.
The left, however, seems to get a massive high from obsessing about Palestine. I guess because it combines anti-Americanism with post-colonialism and the anti-imperial struggle with - for some - a secret but heady hit of anti-semitism?
It doesn’t do them any favours. It always seems cranky
Hearing Conservatives are well on course to GAIN Nuneaton and Bedworth council from No Overall Control.
Ed Miliband doesn't bother living in the constituency - I honestly thought he'd go in 2019. There's certainly not a lot of enthusiasm for him in the working men's clubs.
So why vote Labour in 2021? More nurses? More infrastructure spending? More investment up north? You can get all those from Boris.
So put those two groups together and Con are big winners.
Its currently after the first declaration Con 17, Lab 16, Grn 1. It will only take one more to gain it.
Labour HOLD & Conservative GAIN Washington South (Sunderland) from Greens.
Tories fifth gain in Sunderland of the night.