politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Starmer tells Boris to “get a grip” as they prepare for the fi

More than 500,000 people have signed a petition demanding justice for rail worker Belly Mujinga who died after being spat at by a man claiming to have Covid-19.

But the investigation found nobody spat at her.

The force said it had not found any evidence of anyone spitting during the incident, and that a 57-year-old man they interviewed had a test result showing he had not had Covid-19.

Mysticrose said:

Philip_Thompson said:

Mysticrose said:

Philip_Thompson said:

Scott_xP said:

https://twitter.com/tnewtondunn/status/1268145517814525953

Oh dear, thank goodness once more that the imbecilic Theresa May is not involved with negotiations.

It should be obvious for anyone with two braincells to rub together that insisting before negotiations you will get a particular element from the party opposite gives the party opposite a blank cheque on what they can demand.

What a plonker. She's learnt nothing from her failure.

She produced the best, most workable, Brexit solution out there.

As the months and years roll on you will have time to repent along with most of the country and rue bitterly the day that Parliament voted down her deal.

I guarantee it.

The only people left who will be happy that her deal failed will be the anarchists like Cummings and Farage.

There'll be a cold day in hell before I back May's deal I can assure you that.

I opposed it entirely consistently on principles.

'Principles' that would have embraced the return of sectarian violence to the streets of Northern Ireland in order to deliver your version of a pure Brexit. Never mind the break up of the UK and murder on our streets, those are secondary for you.

Shameful. And that's euphemistic.

Garbage. I would never embrace violence but not would I abandon my principles to the threat of them either.

There are fates worse than murder on our streets by terrorism. If Islamic terrorists threatened Troubles level of violence if we didn't disenfranchise women would you give in to such threats?

tlg86 said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

More than 500,000 people have signed a petition demanding justice for rail worker Belly Mujinga who died after being spat at by a man claiming to have Covid-19.

But the investigation found nobody spat at her.

The force said it had not found any evidence of anyone spitting during the incident, and that a 57-year-old man they interviewed had a test result showing he had not had Covid-19.

The media's reporting of that case was appalling.

Twitter are now trying to twist this into a race thing, as a man was prosecuted for spitting at a white police officer, while having COVID.

Brom said:

Boris definitely looked better on BBC. Labour supporters must be hoping Starmer has another gear to go up.

Labour have been screaming along at 8,000 revs in first gear about Cummings. Let's see how long before they are in the pits for a new engine...

RochdalePioneers said:

NickPalmer said:

RochdalePioneers said:

SouthamObserver said:

The expulsions have already started. It's great to see.

Yeah, me!

You've been expelled?

Effectively. LGU wrote to me rejecting my provisional membership as I was a LibDem last year. Email imprint from Jennie Formby. So thats an effective 2 year ban. There isn't anything at all stopping people defecting from one party to another and Salma Yaqoob can testify, so its a "GS has absolute power to say no" that did it. One of my local enemies worked for Laura Pillock and got upset when I called her "Pidcock" on a facebook page - been suggested that she got me bounced by going directly to the departing Formby.

Perhaps the Labour Party judged that your loyalties were too fickle given that you joined and campaigned for an opposition party?

Or perhaps the LP would not wish to encourage membership of the sort of people who find it so very amusing to change Pidcock to Pillock? (I write as a gronw-up anti-Corbynite).

RochdalePioneers said:

Philip_Thompson said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Philip_Thompson said:

nichomar said:

Philip_Thompson said:

rottenborough said:

WhisperingOracle said:

Anabobazina said:

A generally crap and dull PMQs with Boris marginally better than normal.

Sir Keir got a bit snarky about a letter.

Boris looked a bloody scruffy mess again.

Last week was the week when Starmer could have caused him all sorts of trouble. The news cycle has moved on, events have moved on, the momentum has moved on ; an extremely lucky escape for Mr J.

It aint over...


https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/18491570.dominic-cummings-council-investigates-planning-permission-complaints-durham-lockdown-cottage/

That just looks like a petty vendetta.

No it’s called unexpected consequences of one actions. If it proves that the allegations are true then it’s their own fault. Why should the media give them a free pass?

And if the allegations aren't true it's a petty vendetta. That it's happening now certainly matches that.

So when someone complains to the planning department of your council that someone has built a property without permission they shouldn't investigate? They've stuck an ugly great extension on the back, it blocks out the sun in your garden, they shouldn't investigate the allegation that they didn't get planning permission?

You're saying one rule for Cummings one rule for everyone else...

No I'm saying that if there was an objection it should have been filed when I was done. If the sun was blocked out I'd file a complaint immediately not when the person who did it hit the news.

The complaint is that the building was erected without planning permission. If permission was asked for and refused then yes, object at the point it was filed. However, if planning permission was not sought its's hard to object at the proper time as that time never existed. Hence the need to investigate, the planning authority doing its legal duty.

When was the building erected?

If it blocked out the sun then that should have been obvious when it was erected. If it's been up for years but nobody realised then it clearly isn't blocking out anyone's sun etc

179 new deaths in England. Absolutely loads of back dating, all the way back to 24th March !!!!

Last 3 days, 18 / 47 / 20

Piers Moron will shortly be screaming about death rate rising.

Philip_Thompson said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Philip_Thompson said:

nichomar said:

Philip_Thompson said:

rottenborough said:

WhisperingOracle said:

Anabobazina said:

A generally crap and dull PMQs with Boris marginally better than normal.

Sir Keir got a bit snarky about a letter.

Boris looked a bloody scruffy mess again.

Last week was the week when Starmer could have caused him all sorts of trouble. The news cycle has moved on, events have moved on, the momentum has moved on ; an extremely lucky escape for Mr J.

It aint over...


https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/18491570.dominic-cummings-council-investigates-planning-permission-complaints-durham-lockdown-cottage/

That just looks like a petty vendetta.

No it’s called unexpected consequences of one actions. If it proves that the allegations are true then it’s their own fault. Why should the media give them a free pass?

And if the allegations aren't true it's a petty vendetta. That it's happening now certainly matches that.

So when someone complains to the planning department of your council that someone has built a property without permission they shouldn't investigate? They've stuck an ugly great extension on the back, it blocks out the sun in your garden, they shouldn't investigate the allegation that they didn't get planning permission?

You're saying one rule for Cummings one rule for everyone else...

No I'm saying that if there was an objection it should have been filed when I was done. If the sun was blocked out I'd file a complaint immediately not when the person who did it hit the news.

Some things get looked at closer, or even noticed for the first time when there's a spotlight shone on them.

FrancisUrquhart said:

179 new deaths in England. Absolutely loads of back dating, all the way back to 24th March !!!!

Last 3 days, 18 / 47 / 20

Piers Moron will shortly be screaming about death rate rising.

I must admit I thought the backdating was new deaths.

Of course they are not new deaths, they are newly attributable to COVID.

Anabobazina said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

179 new deaths in England. Absolutely loads of back dating, all the way back to 24th March !!!!

Last 3 days, 18 / 47 / 20

Piers Moron will shortly be screaming about death rate rising.

How are we backdating so far? That seems absurd!

It's testing of samples taken post-decease.

https://twitter.com/meganamram/status/1267965387443822592

TheWhiteRabbit said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

179 new deaths in England. Absolutely loads of back dating, all the way back to 24th March !!!!

Last 3 days, 18 / 47 / 20

Piers Moron will shortly be screaming about death rate rising.

I must admit I thought the backdating was new deaths.

Of course they are not new deaths, they are newly attributable to COVID.

Presumably lots of people die infected with the virus but not of the virus?

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

Can we take a moment to recognise that in the last thread, @HYUFD suggested that if Nissan closed and it negatively affected the North East, then that is their own fault for voting for Brexit and for the Conservatives?

Can we just recognise this special moment please.

I did. I invited him to come and knock doors up here with a blue rosette on so that he can explain the triumph of the will to the local newly impoverished and unemployed.

The vast majority of Tory voters want to end the transition period and leave the single market and end free movement and leave the customs union as the Tories manifesto promised. If that is not delivered many if not most of them will switch back to the Brexit Party.

If voters in the North East voted Leave in 2016 and Tory in 2019 they knew what they were voting for, the Tories should have no apologies in delivering it

“They knew what they were voting for”

It’s their own fault right? Is that the official Conservative Party line?

Oh this is gold.

No, it's not.

nichomar said:

Sandpit said:

Anabobazina said:

kyf_100 said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Can’t Johnson brush his hair, he looks embarrassing

I seem to remember a lot of Labour supporters taking offence with Tories criticising Corbyn's appearance back in the day.

Let's face it the Jezziah looked decidedly unkempt. But I agree that it was wrong to point it out then just as it's wrong to point it out now.

A man's abilities are not determined by how well he brushes his hair or where his suits come from.

Corbyn was massively smartened up by Labour's stylists – which suggests that the party did recognise that it was important.

There's definitely a minimum standard required, Corbyn's people did well to drag him through a tailor's shop when Cameron made that criticism of him.

Likewise, Boris needs to be dragged through a barber's shop. The deliberately scruffy look really doesn't come across well during a major crisis.

He is trying to hide his loss of hair, if you look closely he’s going bald

No, it's a deliberate, carefully cultivated look. It's supposed to be a bit boyish and raffish, I think. Appeals to his base.

I thought he looked a good deal better today than he has recently. He's put a bit of weight back on, he didn't look tired and he showed some energy.

The half-empty chamber doesn't help him though. You can see he's used to the braying support as he looks round towards his own benches, but without the numbers it is less effective. Starmer's more cerebral style works better in a thinly attended Chamber.

All the same, Boris did ok today. Starmer made some good points but without doing any damage. The PM generally fielded the questions satisfactorily and even managed a little well-judged humour. Curiously the most awkward moments arose from his refusal to condemn Donald Trump. That's the kind of thing which can be used again and again by the opposition.

On the whole a rather dull PMQ, so therefore quite a decent one for the PM.

Northern_Al said:

RochdalePioneers said:

NickPalmer said:

RochdalePioneers said:

SouthamObserver said:

The expulsions have already started. It's great to see.

Yeah, me!

You've been expelled?

Effectively. LGU wrote to me rejecting my provisional membership as I was a LibDem last year. Email imprint from Jennie Formby. So thats an effective 2 year ban. There isn't anything at all stopping people defecting from one party to another and Salma Yaqoob can testify, so its a "GS has absolute power to say no" that did it. One of my local enemies worked for Laura Pillock and got upset when I called her "Pidcock" on a facebook page - been suggested that she got me bounced by going directly to the departing Formby.

Perhaps the Labour Party judged that your loyalties were too fickle given that you joined and campaigned for an opposition party?

Or perhaps the LP would not wish to encourage membership of the sort of people who find it so very amusing to change Pidcock to Pillock? (I write as a gronw-up anti-Corbynite).

I knew what I was doing, I will take the punishment. That the cultists were such screaming hypocrites does make me chuckle - I'm too fickle but Yaqoob is not? Similarly the other person locally who I know was the most vocally against me defecting from the LibDems to Labour himself defected from the LibDems to Labour...

As for Pillock, she truly was one. And as the (now departed cos not Corbynite) Senior Regional Director replied to the complaint against me she's hardly going to be upset by a barb like that which was made on a private Labour Facebook group.

I'll be back. Or maybe I won't. Maybe the Labour Party has no interest in regaining the support of its former loyal supporters. Maybe I should just "fuck off and join the Tories then" as "I'm coming back to destroy the last traces of socialism in the party" (both direct quotes from an old friend of mine prominent and active in the party locally). I know the Tories would welcome me, have that in writing from in a personal email from my new MP

Anabobazina said:

The backdating thing is causing too much confusion.

They should publish today's deaths which (assuming Francis is right, and I've no reason to doubt him) is 18 today in England.

Absolutely should have done this from the beginning and then updated the chart every day (in the way Prof Cricket does). I have absolutely no idea why they didn't, but also no excuse after 3 months that the morons that suppose to report on this get it wrong every damn day.

RobD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

Can we take a moment to recognise that in the last thread, @HYUFD suggested that if Nissan closed and it negatively affected the North East, then that is their own fault for voting for Brexit and for the Conservatives?

Can we just recognise this special moment please.

I did. I invited him to come and knock doors up here with a blue rosette on so that he can explain the triumph of the will to the local newly impoverished and unemployed.

The vast majority of Tory voters want to end the transition period and leave the single market and end free movement and leave the customs union as the Tories manifesto promised. If that is not delivered many if not most of them will switch back to the Brexit Party.

If voters in the North East voted Leave in 2016 and Tory in 2019 they knew what they were voting for, the Tories should have no apologies in delivering it

“They knew what they were voting for”

It’s their own fault right? Is that the official Conservative Party line?

Oh this is gold.

No, it's not.

What isn’t?

We were discussing the impact of Nissan closing in the North East. I made no mention at all of Brexit, merely the likely factual impact that would have, Brexit or no Brexit.

@HYUFD’s response was essentially: “it doesn’t matter if Nissan closes. If that is a result of WTO terms, then it’s their own fault. They should not have voted Leave or for the Conservatives”.

FrancisUrquhart said:

Anabobazina said:

The backdating thing is causing too much confusion.

They should publish today's deaths which (assuming Francis is right, and I've no reason to doubt him) is 18 today in England.

Absolutely should have done this from the beginning and then updated the chart every day (in the way Prof Cricket does). I have absolutely no idea why they didn't, but also no excuse after 3 months that the morons that suppose to report on this get it wrong every damn day.

Indeed, it's a stupid system made worse by even stupider analyses by the media.

eek said:

The Daily Mail report on PMQs is an interesting read https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8383653/Keir-Starmer-rattles-Boris-Johnson-coronavirus-response.html

It's really not very positive for Boris.

The Daily Mail is dripping-wet Liberal scum. Have you not got the memo from the PB Tories?

FrancisUrquhart said:

Anabobazina said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

179 new deaths in England. Absolutely loads of back dating, all the way back to 24th March !!!!

Last 3 days, 18 / 47 / 20

Piers Moron will shortly be screaming about death rate rising.

How are we backdating so far? That seems absurd!

I believe it is newly discovered that it was COVID. One thing we have to give credit for in the UK, we really don't just sweep cause of death under the carpet. They go above and beyond to try to find out why.

Which is why the useful stats are going to be excess deaths over a baseline, for all countries.

There's too many different methodologies in use, so it's unfair to criticise one country for having high Covid death stats, when all they are doing is being meticulous and testing post-mortem samples. There's also the ups and downs of other types of death due to the temporary social measures in place (more suicides, fewer traffic and industrial accidents etc.).

Thankfully, most countries (China, Russia and perhaps India excepted), manage to record numbers of deaths accurately.

Gallowgate said:

RobD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

Can we take a moment to recognise that in the last thread, @HYUFD suggested that if Nissan closed and it negatively affected the North East, then that is their own fault for voting for Brexit and for the Conservatives?

Can we just recognise this special moment please.

I did. I invited him to come and knock doors up here with a blue rosette on so that he can explain the triumph of the will to the local newly impoverished and unemployed.

The vast majority of Tory voters want to end the transition period and leave the single market and end free movement and leave the customs union as the Tories manifesto promised. If that is not delivered many if not most of them will switch back to the Brexit Party.

If voters in the North East voted Leave in 2016 and Tory in 2019 they knew what they were voting for, the Tories should have no apologies in delivering it

“They knew what they were voting for”

It’s their own fault right? Is that the official Conservative Party line?

Oh this is gold.

No, it's not.

What isn’t?

We were discussing the impact of Nissan closing in the North East. I made no mention at all of Brexit, merely the likely factual impact that would have, Brexit or no Brexit.

@HYUFD’s response was essentially: “it doesn’t matter if Nissan closes. If that is a result of WTO terms, then it’s their own fault. They should not have voted Leave or for the Conservatives”.

If saving Nissan was their top priority even if they voted Leave in 2016 they should have voted Labour or LD in 2019 as they both ruled out WTO terms and were more willing to consider staying in the single market as Nissan execs said they wanted.

The Tories never ruled out WTO terms Brexit under Boris if the EU refused to do a Canada style FTA so if they still went ahead and voted Tory they have nobody to blame but themselves

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

RobD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

Can we take a moment to recognise that in the last thread, @HYUFD suggested that if Nissan closed and it negatively affected the North East, then that is their own fault for voting for Brexit and for the Conservatives?

Can we just recognise this special moment please.

I did. I invited him to come and knock doors up here with a blue rosette on so that he can explain the triumph of the will to the local newly impoverished and unemployed.

The vast majority of Tory voters want to end the transition period and leave the single market and end free movement and leave the customs union as the Tories manifesto promised. If that is not delivered many if not most of them will switch back to the Brexit Party.

If voters in the North East voted Leave in 2016 and Tory in 2019 they knew what they were voting for, the Tories should have no apologies in delivering it

“They knew what they were voting for”

It’s their own fault right? Is that the official Conservative Party line?

Oh this is gold.

No, it's not.

What isn’t?

We were discussing the impact of Nissan closing in the North East. I made no mention at all of Brexit, merely the likely factual impact that would have, Brexit or no Brexit.

@HYUFD’s response was essentially: “it doesn’t matter if Nissan closes. If that is a result of WTO terms, then it’s their own fault. They should not have voted Leave or for the Conservatives”.

If saving Nissan was their top priority even if they voted Leave in 2016 they should have voted Labour or LD in 2019 as they both ruled out WTO terms and were more willing to consider staying in the single market as Nissan execs said they wanted.

The Tories never ruled out WTO terms Brexit under Boris if the EU refused to do a Canada style FTA so if they still went ahead and voted Tory they have nobody to blame but themselves

And who did Sunderland vote for as you continually told us?

I hope that's made the flaw in your argument obvious enough even to you.

Gallowgate said:

RobD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

Can we take a moment to recognise that in the last thread, @HYUFD suggested that if Nissan closed and it negatively affected the North East, then that is their own fault for voting for Brexit and for the Conservatives?

Can we just recognise this special moment please.

I did. I invited him to come and knock doors up here with a blue rosette on so that he can explain the triumph of the will to the local newly impoverished and unemployed.

The vast majority of Tory voters want to end the transition period and leave the single market and end free movement and leave the customs union as the Tories manifesto promised. If that is not delivered many if not most of them will switch back to the Brexit Party.

If voters in the North East voted Leave in 2016 and Tory in 2019 they knew what they were voting for, the Tories should have no apologies in delivering it

“They knew what they were voting for”

It’s their own fault right? Is that the official Conservative Party line?

Oh this is gold.

No, it's not.

What isn’t?

We were discussing the impact of Nissan closing in the North East. I made no mention at all of Brexit, merely the likely factual impact that would have, Brexit or no Brexit.

@HYUFD’s response was essentially: “it doesn’t matter if Nissan closes. If that is a result of WTO terms, then it’s their own fault. They should not have voted Leave or for the Conservatives”.

You asked if it was official party line, it is not.

DavidL said:

Malmesbury said:

NHS England graphs -

I wonder if we will see our first day with no hospital deaths this month. We might, even if its a bit of a statistical fluke.

I would doubt that. but this may be of interest -

https://twitter.com/cricketwyvern/status/1267851443823947778

rottenborough said:

https://twitter.com/MrHarryCole/status/1268140177077219328

That was the most significant thing today at PMQs - extracted by Hunt, not SKS.

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

RobD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

Can we take a moment to recognise that in the last thread, @HYUFD suggested that if Nissan closed and it negatively affected the North East, then that is their own fault for voting for Brexit and for the Conservatives?

Can we just recognise this special moment please.

I did. I invited him to come and knock doors up here with a blue rosette on so that he can explain the triumph of the will to the local newly impoverished and unemployed.

The vast majority of Tory voters want to end the transition period and leave the single market and end free movement and leave the customs union as the Tories manifesto promised. If that is not delivered many if not most of them will switch back to the Brexit Party.

If voters in the North East voted Leave in 2016 and Tory in 2019 they knew what they were voting for, the Tories should have no apologies in delivering it

“They knew what they were voting for”

It’s their own fault right? Is that the official Conservative Party line?

Oh this is gold.

No, it's not.

What isn’t?

We were discussing the impact of Nissan closing in the North East. I made no mention at all of Brexit, merely the likely factual impact that would have, Brexit or no Brexit.

@HYUFD’s response was essentially: “it doesn’t matter if Nissan closes. If that is a result of WTO terms, then it’s their own fault. They should not have voted Leave or for the Conservatives”.

If saving Nissan was their top priority even if they voted Leave in 2016 they should have voted Labour or LD in 2019 as they both ruled out WTO terms and were more willing to consider staying in the single market as Nissan execs said they wanted.

The Tories never ruled out WTO terms Brexit under Boris if the EU refused to do a Canada style FTA so if they still went ahead and voted Tory they have nobody to blame but themselves

Do you think the vast majority understood this with all the crap that was being put out by both sides. You only had to hear the nonsense a lot of the public said when being interviewed in the street. My father voted leave because there were enough black people here already!!! I'm embarrassed typing that for (at least) 2 reasons.

Cyclefree said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

RobD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

Can we take a moment to recognise that in the last thread, @HYUFD suggested that if Nissan closed and it negatively affected the North East, then that is their own fault for voting for Brexit and for the Conservatives?

Can we just recognise this special moment please.

I did. I invited him to come and knock doors up here with a blue rosette on so that he can explain the triumph of the will to the local newly impoverished and unemployed.

The vast majority of Tory voters want to end the transition period and leave the single market and end free movement and leave the customs union as the Tories manifesto promised. If that is not delivered many if not most of them will switch back to the Brexit Party.

If voters in the North East voted Leave in 2016 and Tory in 2019 they knew what they were voting for, the Tories should have no apologies in delivering it

“They knew what they were voting for”

It’s their own fault right? Is that the official Conservative Party line?

Oh this is gold.

No, it's not.

What isn’t?

We were discussing the impact of Nissan closing in the North East. I made no mention at all of Brexit, merely the likely factual impact that would have, Brexit or no Brexit.

@HYUFD’s response was essentially: “it doesn’t matter if Nissan closes. If that is a result of WTO terms, then it’s their own fault. They should not have voted Leave or for the Conservatives”.

If saving Nissan was their top priority even if they voted Leave in 2016 they should have voted Labour or LD in 2019 as they both ruled out WTO terms and were more willing to consider staying in the single market as Nissan execs said they wanted.

The Tories never ruled out WTO terms Brexit under Boris if the EU refused to do a Canada style FTA so if they still went ahead and voted Tory they have nobody to blame but themselves

That’s going to be a marvellous election slogan at the next election.

“Unemployed? Well, you voted for us last time so it’s your fault. Vote for us again.”

Rather thankfully HYUFD does not write the slogans!

He's told me, Big G and many others not to vote for the party so what does he know?

https://twitter.com/tnewtondunn/status/1268145517814525953?s=20

LostPassword said:

Anabobazina said:

Does Sean hold the all-time PB record for the most user accounts?

He's only had three! (Unless he's started a new one?)

I think I'm up to five, but I might have forgotten a couple.

You seem to be quite honest about it however

Mysticrose said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Mysticrose said:

Boris is embarrassingly bad

And today Starmer was worse

No he wasn't!! He's just forensic and cool. There are only two take-aways from that PMQ's. 1. The letter (bad for Johnson) and 2. the appearance and manner of Johnson (bad for Johnson).

You're missing the biggest one - 24 hour test turn around be end of month - thats one heck of a rod for PHE (and the government)'s backs.

Anabobazina said:

Does Sean hold the all-time PB record for the most user accounts?

I am SeanT!

RobD said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Sandpit said:

Chelyabinsk said:

CarlottaVance said:

Dissection of a photo-op:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/02/us/politics/trump-walk-lafayette-square.html

Buried in the article: "a small fire had been set in its basement during demonstrations over the weekend." In fact, not only had a fire been set that required a police escort to enable the firemen to put it out, but the flag outside the church had been torn down and burned, glass smashed in the windows, and anti-Trump graffiti sprayed on the building; the rector and wardens were sufficiently concerned to remove valuable items from the church on the morning of Trump's visit. Not mentioned anywhere in the article: the police cleared the space less than half an hour before Washington DC's curfew was due to go into effect.

Significant sections of the US media are covertly supporting the riots, often with omissions in reporting and talking about protestors rather than rioters.

Clearly a total breakdown in law and order is desirable for them, so long as it's seen as bad for the president.

Watching CNN vs Fox, it is a different world.

CNN started segments by overwhelmingly peaceful, but right wing white supremacists / nationalists pretending to be other groups involved in the violence, oh and probably some left wing groups.

Fox was ANTIFA, ANTIFA, ANTIFA.

White Supremacists driving the violence is up there with Birtherism.

Neither of them are news organizations any more. In fact I think you'd be hard-pressed to find anything as neutral as the BBC over there.

One reason why we should keep Cummings and the Tories generally away from the Beeb.

FrancisUrquhart said:

More than 500,000 people have signed a petition demanding justice for rail worker Belly Mujinga who died after being spat at by a man claiming to have Covid-19.

But the investigation found nobody spat at her.

The force said it had not found any evidence of anyone spitting during the incident, and that a 57-year-old man they interviewed had a test result showing he had not had Covid-19.

Yet the BBC reporter reporting on a BLM demo cited her and her "death caused by spitting" as "fact".

RochdalePioneers said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

Can we take a moment to recognise that in the last thread, @HYUFD suggested that if Nissan closed and it negatively affected the North East, then that is their own fault for voting for Brexit and for the Conservatives?

Can we just recognise this special moment please.

I did. I invited him to come and knock doors up here with a blue rosette on so that he can explain the triumph of the will to the local newly impoverished and unemployed.

The vast majority of Tory voters want to end the transition period and leave the single market and end free movement and leave the customs union as the Tories manifesto promised. If that is not delivered many if not most of them will switch back to the Brexit Party.

If voters in the North East voted Leave in 2016 and Tory in 2019 they knew what they were voting for, the Tories should have no apologies in delivering it

"You voted to make yourself unemployed. Can I count on your support again"?

yeah, that'll work

Still better than coming 3rd behind the Brexit Party if the transition period is extended indefinitely

HYUFD said:

Philip_Thompson said:

Gallowgate said:

RobD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

Can we take a moment to recognise that in the last thread, @HYUFD suggested that if Nissan closed and it negatively affected the North East, then that is their own fault for voting for Brexit and for the Conservatives?

Can we just recognise this special moment please.

I did. I invited him to come and knock doors up here with a blue rosette on so that he can explain the triumph of the will to the local newly impoverished and unemployed.

The vast majority of Tory voters want to end the transition period and leave the single market and end free movement and leave the customs union as the Tories manifesto promised. If that is not delivered many if not most of them will switch back to the Brexit Party.

If voters in the North East voted Leave in 2016 and Tory in 2019 they knew what they were voting for, the Tories should have no apologies in delivering it

“They knew what they were voting for”

It’s their own fault right? Is that the official Conservative Party line?

Oh this is gold.

No, it's not.

What isn’t?

We were discussing the impact of Nissan closing in the North East. I made no mention at all of Brexit, merely the likely factual impact that would have, Brexit or no Brexit.

@HYUFD’s response was essentially: “it doesn’t matter if Nissan closes. If that is a result of WTO terms, then it’s their own fault. They should not have voted Leave or for the Conservatives”.

HYUFD represents HYUFD not the Tories.

He is a blue Corbynite.

When over 60% of Tory voters with Yougov want to end the transition period and leave the single market and customs union I am sorry but that is the majority Tory view

That is the majority Tory voter view.

It isn't the sole Tory voter view and "you shouldn't have voted Tory" is not Tory policy.

If the Tories had only got 60% of the votes they got last time there wouldn't even be a Tory government FFS! 😡

To channel my inner Liz Truss: You. Are. A. Disgrace.

Sandpit said:

Chelyabinsk said:

CarlottaVance said:

Dissection of a photo-op:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/02/us/politics/trump-walk-lafayette-square.html

Buried in the article: "a small fire had been set in its basement during demonstrations over the weekend." In fact, not only had a fire been set that required a police escort to enable the firemen to put it out, but the flag outside the church had been torn down and burned, glass smashed in the windows, and anti-Trump graffiti sprayed on the building; the rector and wardens were sufficiently concerned to remove valuable items from the church on the morning of Trump's visit. Not mentioned anywhere in the article: the police cleared the space less than half an hour before Washington DC's curfew was due to go into effect.

Significant sections of the US media are covertly supporting the riots, often with omissions in reporting and talking about protestors rather than rioters.

Clearly a total breakdown in law and order is desirable for them, so long as it's seen as bad for the president.

It's almost like they want to stoke a race war.

https://twitter.com/CBSNews/status/1267874870609805312

CarlottaVance said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

More than 500,000 people have signed a petition demanding justice for rail worker Belly Mujinga who died after being spat at by a man claiming to have Covid-19.

But the investigation found nobody spat at her.

The force said it had not found any evidence of anyone spitting during the incident, and that a 57-year-old man they interviewed had a test result showing he had not had Covid-19.

Yet the BBC reporter reporting on a BLM demo cited her and her "death caused by spitting" as "fact".

This is incredibly dangerous at this heightened times. It is beyond irresponsible. Look what happened with Duggan case, a violent and armed career criminal.

NerysHughes said:

Anabobazina said:

TheWhiteRabbit said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

179 new deaths in England. Absolutely loads of back dating, all the way back to 24th March !!!!

Last 3 days, 18 / 47 / 20

Piers Moron will shortly be screaming about death rate rising.

I must admit I thought the backdating was new deaths.

Of course they are not new deaths, they are newly attributable to COVID.

Presumably lots of people die infected with the virus but not of the virus?

Absolutely, other countries do not record those as Covid deaths but in the UK we do. If you are squashed by a bus and you test positive for Covid then it is recorded as a Covid death

There are 2 issues with this:

a) It shouldn't be and is nonsense if it is, although it may be because your vision was blurred (aka Cummings)

and

b) Why were you doing a Cummings in the first place by being out?

This 'you' wasn't Cummings was it?

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

Can we take a moment to recognise that in the last thread, @HYUFD suggested that if Nissan closed and it negatively affected the North East, then that is their own fault for voting for Brexit and for the Conservatives?

Can we just recognise this special moment please.

I did. I invited him to come and knock doors up here with a blue rosette on so that he can explain the triumph of the will to the local newly impoverished and unemployed.

The vast majority of Tory voters want to end the transition period and leave the single market and end free movement and leave the customs union as the Tories manifesto promised. If that is not delivered many if not most of them will switch back to the Brexit Party.

If voters in the North East voted Leave in 2016 and Tory in 2019 they knew what they were voting for, the Tories should have no apologies in delivering it

“They knew what they were voting for”

It’s their own fault right? Is that the official Conservative Party line?

Oh this is gold.

"they voted for Brexit"

Yes, why did they vote for Brexit

"because they want Brexit. So we have to give them Brexit"

Yes but what were they hoping for out of Brexit

"brexit"

To be fair, on an individual basis most people could give the reasons they supported Brexit. The problem has always been that collectively no single flavour Brexit had more than 25-30% public support. That makes it unlikely the Brexit coalition can survive the reality of Brexit, as whatever choices are made, even if implemented perfectly, a significant proportion will feel misled.

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

Can we take a moment to recognise that in the last thread, @HYUFD suggested that if Nissan closed and it negatively affected the North East, then that is their own fault for voting for Brexit and for the Conservatives?

Can we just recognise this special moment please.

I did. I invited him to come and knock doors up here with a blue rosette on so that he can explain the triumph of the will to the local newly impoverished and unemployed.

The vast majority of Tory voters want to end the transition period and leave the single market and end free movement and leave the customs union as the Tories manifesto promised. If that is not delivered many if not most of them will switch back to the Brexit Party.

If voters in the North East voted Leave in 2016 and Tory in 2019 they knew what they were voting for, the Tories should have no apologies in delivering it

"You voted to make yourself unemployed. Can I count on your support again"?

yeah, that'll work

Still better than coming 3rd behind the Brexit Party if the transition period is extended indefinitely

We’re not talking about Brexit, or the transition period. We’re simply talking about Nissan’s importance to the North East’s economy.

If it was to close, measures will have to be taken to address that. Simply stating “well it’s your own fault” is not going to cut the mustard.

brokenwheel said:

Sandpit said:

Chelyabinsk said:

CarlottaVance said:

Dissection of a photo-op:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/02/us/politics/trump-walk-lafayette-square.html

Buried in the article: "a small fire had been set in its basement during demonstrations over the weekend." In fact, not only had a fire been set that required a police escort to enable the firemen to put it out, but the flag outside the church had been torn down and burned, glass smashed in the windows, and anti-Trump graffiti sprayed on the building; the rector and wardens were sufficiently concerned to remove valuable items from the church on the morning of Trump's visit. Not mentioned anywhere in the article: the police cleared the space less than half an hour before Washington DC's curfew was due to go into effect.

Significant sections of the US media are covertly supporting the riots, often with omissions in reporting and talking about protestors rather than rioters.

Clearly a total breakdown in law and order is desirable for them, so long as it's seen as bad for the president.

It's almost like they want to stoke a race war.

https://twitter.com/CBSNews/status/1267874870609805312

"A grainy surveillance video of the shooting, played during the briefing, shows that Gardner backed up and pointed a gun after two people tackled him in the street. He initially fired two shots into the air that did not hit anyone.

After Scurlock jumped on his back, Gardner can be heard saying "get off me" many times before fatally shooting Scurlock once in the clavicle, Kleine said. Scurlock was taken to a local hospital where he died from his injuries. "

Sounds tragic but like that one might actually have been self defence. Makes a difference that he was the one saying get off me many times rather than the other way around.

Mexicanpete said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

HYUFD said:

RochdalePioneers said:

Gallowgate said:

Can we take a moment to recognise that in the last thread, @HYUFD suggested that if Nissan closed and it negatively affected the North East, then that is their own fault for voting for Brexit and for the Conservatives?

Can we just recognise this special moment please.

I did. I invited him to come and knock doors up here with a blue rosette on so that he can explain the triumph of the will to the local newly impoverished and unemployed.

The vast majority of Tory voters want to end the transition period and leave the single market and end free movement and leave the customs union as the Tories manifesto promised. If that is not delivered many if not most of them will switch back to the Brexit Party.

If voters in the North East voted Leave in 2016 and Tory in 2019 they knew what they were voting for, the Tories should have no apologies in delivering it

"You voted to make yourself unemployed. Can I count on your support again"?

yeah, that'll work

Still better than coming 3rd behind the Brexit Party if the transition period is extended indefinitely

Are you suggesting a Nigel Farage Premiership with Starmer still LOTO?

I am suggesting never mind possibly losing the next general election, if the Tories extend indefinitely they face a Canada 1993 style wipe out at the next general election and being overtaken by the Brexit Party as the Reform Party overtook the Canadian Tories then

Malmesbury said:

DavidL said:

Malmesbury said:

NHS England graphs -

I wonder if we will see our first day with no hospital deaths this month. We might, even if its a bit of a statistical fluke.

I would doubt that. but this may be of interest -

https://twitter.com/cricketwyvern/status/1267851443823947778

There has been a lot of talk about potential second waves etc but I have yet to see any evidence of this particular virus having anything like that anywhere in the world. It does seem to burn out somewhat for reasons as yet unclear. It may be that by August the world will look very different.

Sandpit said:

CarlottaVance said:

Mysticrose said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Mysticrose said:

Boris is embarrassingly bad

And today Starmer was worse

No he wasn't!! He's just forensic and cool. There are only two take-aways from that PMQ's. 1. The letter (bad for Johnson) and 2. the appearance and manner of Johnson (bad for Johnson).

You're missing the biggest one - 24 hour test turn around be end of month - thats one heck of a rod for PHE (and the government)'s backs.

Good. Look at what a shambles PHE were making of the testing, until Hancock made a public pledge of 100k tests in April and refused to back down.

24 hour testing from July is perhaps a little late!

* Edit - Back of the envelope calculation would be if it goes well then over 90% of cases will have been and gone by the time our testing process works!

CarlottaVance said:

Mysticrose said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Mysticrose said:

Boris is embarrassingly bad

And today Starmer was worse

No he wasn't!! He's just forensic and cool. There are only two take-aways from that PMQ's. 1. The letter (bad for Johnson) and 2. the appearance and manner of Johnson (bad for Johnson).

You're missing the biggest one - 24 hour test turn around be end of month - thats one heck of a rod for PHE (and the government)'s backs.

The 20 minute swab test trial will be finished around (by?) then. If it is anything like clinical trials I have come across, they actually know the result by now.

I presume they are testing using the lab version and 20 min, and comparing the results.

So they will know if the 20min one is working out.

It would make sense to switch to the 20min test.

Anabobazina said:

Does Sean hold the all-time PB record for the most user accounts?

Surely that is @TheLastBoyScout

https://twitter.com/ReutersUK/status/1268171270916579335?s=20

Vehicle mounted pavement and hit pedestrians

kjh said:

RobD said:

kjh said:

NerysHughes said:

Anabobazina said:

TheWhiteRabbit said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

179 new deaths in England. Absolutely loads of back dating, all the way back to 24th March !!!!

Last 3 days, 18 / 47 / 20

Piers Moron will shortly be screaming about death rate rising.

I must admit I thought the backdating was new deaths.

Of course they are not new deaths, they are newly attributable to COVID.

Presumably lots of people die infected with the virus but not of the virus?

Absolutely, other countries do not record those as Covid deaths but in the UK we do. If you are squashed by a bus and you test positive for Covid then it is recorded as a Covid death

There are 2 issues with this:

a) It shouldn't be and is nonsense if it is, although it may be because your vision was blurred (aka Cummings)

and

b) Why were you doing a Cummings in the first place by being out?

This 'you' wasn't Cummings was it?

There isn't, and never was, a total ban on going outside.

When infected?

Correct.