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To be fair, it's a bit like the difference between speed chess and tournament chess. They didn't get the same amount of time to fully consider their opinions, or hear all the submissions the SC had the benefit of.MarqueeMark said:Queen's Bench must be feeling a little sore - to be over-ruled 11-0. How shit must they be?
Note that the Scottish judgment was also slightly off beam in looking at motive, which the SC ruled irrelevant.
But yes, a bit shit.0 -
Happy to be corrected here but Labour, SNP, Lib Dems, Green, PC and various others had decided to enact the stop no deal legislation and get the extension before having an election. Those parties didn't all do it as a personal favour for Labour, they also believe no deal is a stupid idea.TheValiant said:
If I was Swinson (or Blackford) I would table one, and kindly ask the Speaker to consider hearing it, saying they have the support of the other party and that whilst not convention(!), if the third and fourth largest parties in Parliament support one, at such a crucial time, it should be debated. Bercow would probably call it.Pulpstar said:
Is Corbyn even going to table one though ?AlastairMeeks said:
Imagine you're a Conservative MP (not one of the completely nuts ones) and a vote of no confidence is tabled over the Prime Minister leading the Queen into an unlawful prorogation. Enjoy defending that one in Parliament or voting for him.Scott_P said:
Then roar with laughter as Labour troop through the 'No' lobby the next day.
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However there have been and always will be a political dimension to a prorogation. The fact identified by the Supreme Court was that Parliament should not be able to use this to impede parliamentary oversight. Whilst it seems common sense it was not legally clear before and it will impede future governments (mr Corbyn) from overstepping their remit.Nigelb said:
It is not the fact that he lost in court that ought to dish him.Philip_Thompson said:
Did May resign after she lost in the Supreme Court?Fenman said:
Every Prime minister up until now would have resigned in similar circumstances.KentRising said:
If he's not going to resign, and Corbyn and Co aren't going to call a VONC, why should he do anything other than just carry on?Bob__Sykes said:Boris needs to be on the first plane home, PDQ.
Surely he doesn't make his speech to business leaders in NY now?
Rather it is the inferences anyone with a spark of intelligence can draw from the judgment.
It's not even that the courts rules prorogation not legal, so much as the way in which they utterly demolished the ex post facto political justifications offered for the prorogation.
It is not the court case which should bring down the government, but rather the realisation of the government's own actions.
Of course we have a LOTO not worth the name, and it is doubtful that Swinson would be allowed to call a VONC even if she tried.0 -
Nigel Farage is no doubt already reaching for Arron Banks's newly-exonerated cheque book.MarqueeMark said:I assume Farage is delighted at the spectacle of the Forces of Remain circling the wagons?
His day as PM marches on apace....0 -
Interesting the exchange markets have not reacted to the result. Either it was priced in or they think it will have little outcome on Brexit0
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"You might think that, but we cannot possibly speculate..."Scott_P said:0 -
The BBC desperately trying to spin this and then get some loon on to defend Bozo .0
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Always thought cats were going to take over sooner or later.spudgfsh said:0 -
Shaping up for an "us" versus "them" election.AndyJS said:It wouldn't surprise me if this is all going to plan as far as Cummings is concerned. People vs the elites. (Not my view incidentally).
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That's certainly one way, yes. It's difficult for them to do that politically as a) it hands the levers of government to their opponents and b) it will ensure that we don't leave by 31 Oct and thus bust open the pitch that only Remainers are stopping Brexit from happening.GIN1138 said:
The clear way out is for the government to force the issue by resigning and throwing the gauntlet down to Parliament to come up with something better if they can.AndrewSpencer said:This decision throws the impossible situation in Parliament into strong relief. We have a Government that does not have the confidence of the HoC and yet the HoC will not act to put it out of its misery. The key question now is what is Parliament going to do with the time that the SC has given it? Surely the only reasonable response is to VONC the Government and either call an election or try to find another Government which commands the confidence of the HoC (good luck with that!). What is the purpose and where is the dignity of keeping the Government in a straitjacket for another five weeks and just shouting at it?
If they can't then we'll have to have an election.
The judgment does put the ball back in the court of the HoC. Lady Hale said that prorogation was unlawful because it prevented parliament from holding the government to account. The judgment restores that opportunity to them. What are they going to do with it other than crow about the rule of law and how terrible Boris et al are?0 -
Agreed. It always was a bit tenuous anyway, coming from a country that still has hereditary Lords as part of its legislature, and many of the people that support Brexit are quite happy with that.Scott_P said:1 -
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:.
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
Well played @FootballJOE pic.twitter.com/REus77oKdV
— Leslie Byron Pitt (@Afrofilmviewer) September 24, 20190 -
You imply a man wearing knickers is a bad thing and use it pejoratively... How offensively unwoke! #dinosaurNigel_Foremain said:
I suspect we still will, so don't wet your knickers. Any uncertainty and delay is fully at the door of the headbanging end of the Brexit debate.isam said:
“It will be your decision whether to remain in the EU on the basis of the reforms we secure, or whether we leave.isam said:
‘MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain’s exit from the EU’williamglenn said:
And, yet....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7k9fE28koW4
Your decision.
Nobody else’s.
Not politicians’.
Not Parliament’s.
Not lobby groups’.
Not mine.
Just you.
You, the British people, will decide.
At that moment, you will hold this country’s destiny in your hands.
This is a huge decision for our country, perhaps the biggest we will make in our lifetimes.
And it will be the final decision.
So to those who suggest that a decision in the referendum to leave…
…would merely produce another stronger renegotiation and then a second referendum in which Britain would stay…
…I say think again.
The renegotiation is happening right now. And the referendum that follows will be a once in a generation choice.
An in or out referendum.
When the British people speak, their voice will be respected – not ignored.
If we vote to leave, then we will leave.”0 -
What is Parliament going to talk about when it comes back?
There is no business happening apart from Brexit.
There is nothing to talk about on Brexit until the EU summit.0 -
In some parallel universe Lady Hale was Jacob Rees-Mogg's nanny and Brexit never happened0
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Of course, and a good thing too.Nemtynakht said:
However there have been and always will be a political dimension to a prorogation. The fact identified by the Supreme Court was that (the executive) should not be able to use this to impede parliamentary oversight. Whilst it seems common sense it was not legally clear before and it will impede future governments (mr Corbyn) from overstepping their remit.Nigelb said:
It is not the fact that he lost in court that ought to dish him.Philip_Thompson said:
Did May resign after she lost in the Supreme Court?Fenman said:
Every Prime minister up until now would have resigned in similar circumstances.KentRising said:
If he's not going to resign, and Corbyn and Co aren't going to call a VONC, why should he do anything other than just carry on?Bob__Sykes said:Boris needs to be on the first plane home, PDQ.
Surely he doesn't make his speech to business leaders in NY now?
Rather it is the inferences anyone with a spark of intelligence can draw from the judgment.
It's not even that the courts rules prorogation not legal, so much as the way in which they utterly demolished the ex post facto political justifications offered for the prorogation.
It is not the court case which should bring down the government, but rather the realisation of the government's own actions.
Of course we have a LOTO not worth the name, and it is doubtful that Swinson would be allowed to call a VONC even if she tried.
But while the SC did not look into the government's motives and honesty, it's quite possible to draw some fairly obvious conclusions.
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Keeping clutching at those straws! The reason why we are still in is because the ERG is collectively as thick as pigshit, even by Brexit supporting standardsPhilip_Thompson said:
Yes they did. May's Brexit wasn't the only form of Brexit on the table at the time.eristdoof said:
The ERG did vote against May's Brexit. You cannot claim otherwise.Philip_Thompson said:
The ERG didn't vote to extend. The MPs responsible for us not leaving are solely those who voted to extend.eek said:
Yet all the Brexiters here and elsewhere will blame everyone except the ERG...logical_song said:
Yes, those ERG spartans have a lot to answer for.isam said:
The bigger picture is one of the establishment refusing to carry out the referendum resultMikeSmithson said:I have updated the title to make it clear that it's the Rule of Law 11 Cummings/Johnson 0
After they rejected May's Deal the law of the land was that we would still leave on a set date. They didn't change that.
ONLY MPs who voted to extend are the reason we are still in.1 -
I can do no better than to paraphrase the mighty @TheScreamingEagles from 2016... any Tory MP using that flimsy excuse to deny Brexit should be deselectedBeibheirli_C said:
That would be the advisory referendum....?isam said:
The bigger picture is one of the establishment refusing to carry out the referendum resultMikeSmithson said:I have updated the title to make it clear that it's the Rule of Law 11 Cummings/Johnson 0
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The honesty and credibility of the govt? The role of unelected bureaucrats (not those in the EU this time).MarqueeMark said:What is Parliament going to talk about when it comes back?
There is no business happening apart from Brexit.
There is nothing to talk about on Brexit until the EU summit.0 -
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Time to get yet more popcorn for the Arron Banks v Carole Cadwalladr suit.DecrepitJohnL said:
Nigel Farage is no doubt already reaching for Arron Banks's newly-exonerated cheque book.MarqueeMark said:I assume Farage is delighted at the spectacle of the Forces of Remain circling the wagons?
His day as PM marches on apace....0 -
Well, there were what, 12 bills in progress that are now un-dropped, including one on Domestic Violence.MarqueeMark said:What is Parliament going to talk about when it comes back?
There is no business happening apart from Brexit.
There is nothing to talk about on Brexit until the EU summit.
Also there might be some people want to question the PM about his conduct, just a guess.0 -
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
Talking about thick as pigshit Richard Tice says that Brexit wont happen on October 31 and that Cummings will resign. Though he's not normally someone to listen to he'll be correct on this0
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Confidence in the Government?MarqueeMark said:What is Parliament going to talk about when it comes back?
There is no business happening apart from Brexit.
There is nothing to talk about on Brexit until the EU summit.
Low level letterboxes (abolition) bill?0 -
I'm sure the Government had a business statement ready for this outcome. Perhaps they could start with the Domestic Abuse bill that was lost in the illegal suspension? Would be a popular choice and something most could unite round. A face-saver for the PM as well.MarqueeMark said:What is Parliament going to talk about when it comes back?
There is no business happening apart from Brexit.
There is nothing to talk about on Brexit until the EU summit.
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I thought we all wear them? Don't we?!isam said:
You imply a man wearing knickers is a bad thing and use it pejoratively... How offensively unwoke! #dinosaurNigel_Foremain said:
I suspect we still will, so don't wet your knickers. Any uncertainty and delay is fully at the door of the headbanging end of the Brexit debate.isam said:
“It will be your decision whether to remain in the EU on the basis of the reforms we secure, or whether we leave.isam said:
‘MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain’s exit from the EU’williamglenn said:
And, yet....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7k9fE28koW4
Your decision.
Nobody else’s.
Not politicians’.
Not Parliament’s.
Not lobby groups’.
Not mine.
Just you.
You, the British people, will decide.
At that moment, you will hold this country’s destiny in your hands.
This is a huge decision for our country, perhaps the biggest we will make in our lifetimes.
And it will be the final decision.
So to those who suggest that a decision in the referendum to leave…
…would merely produce another stronger renegotiation and then a second referendum in which Britain would stay…
…I say think again.
The renegotiation is happening right now. And the referendum that follows will be a once in a generation choice.
An in or out referendum.
When the British people speak, their voice will be respected – not ignored.
If we vote to leave, then we will leave.”0 -
Well the judges have decided we are no longer a constitutional monarchy.
It is a judicial dictatorship.0 -
the fermenting malt of a great nation ?TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
But for Cons voters and waverers, Jezza remains the gift that keeps giving, rounding up the maybes back into the Tory fold.Scott_P said:0 -
What utter bollocks.nunuone said:Well the judges have decided we are no longer a constitutional monarchy.
It is a judicial dictatorship.0 -
Popular?!? Pull the other one.isam said:
It’s the truth.MikeSmithson said:
Dream onisam said:
The bigger picture is one of the establishment refusing to carry out the referendum resultMikeSmithson said:I have updated the title to make it clear that it's the Rule of Law 11 Cummings/Johnson 0
Did we vote to leave in 2016?
Have we left?
And now we have a popular politician trying to force through the referendum result denied by faceless lawyers. I know this is a place where faceless lawyers and counter intuitive arguments are worshipped, but it’s not that way in the country as a whole.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leadership_approval_opinion_polling_for_the_next_United_Kingdom_general_election0 -
So time for a general election?TheJezziah said:0 -
Lol.nunuone said:Well the judges have decided we are no longer a constitutional monarchy.
It is a judicial dictatorship.0 -
Leave voters are not a homologous group, and have different opinions. Some leave voters may now want to remain (and vice versa); others will be perfectly happy with May's deal, or *any* deal. And then there are the ERG/UKIP/BXPers who are striving for no deal.isam said:
The front page of the pro EU Standard spells it out “‘MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain’s exit from the EU’”... if that’s how George Osborne sees it, how do you think Leave voters will?SouthamObserver said:
The bigger picture is actually that no-one is above the law. If we are to remain a democracy, that principle is fundamental. The smaller picture is that delivering a Brexit that did not cause immense harm to the country was always going to be immensely difficult - and that is still the case. Those who claimed otherwise - and are now running the country - would do everyonr a favour is they admitted that and started looking beyond the base for solutions. EFTA/EEA will take us out. That's what shouold happen now.isam said:
The bigger picture is one of the establishment refusing to carry out the referendum resultMikeSmithson said:I have updated the title to make it clear that it's the Rule of Law 11 Cummings/Johnson 0
Given the power of the latter grouping, any Brexit aside from a hard-out no-deal would be seen as being 'thwarting' Brexit - words I believe Farage has himself used.
You may want to save some of your fire for Mr Farage, who has done more than anyone else to get us into this mess. He is now the gatekeeper of Brexit, which will only be seen to have happened when he says it has happened.0 -
I didn't vote for any of these scum. I know what it makes you.TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
Stop trying to overturn the will of the people. The people elected MPs in 2017 to serve a term of 5 years.FrancisUrquhart said:
So time for a general election?TheJezziah said:0 -
Get a grip man. It is unbecoming.Richard_Tyndall said:
I didn't vote for any of these scum. I know what it makes you.TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
Boris needs to sack Gove and say it was all his fault. Gove would go quietly.0
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I suspect he's not going to get his wish...
https://twitter.com/guyverhofstadt/status/1176441621962985474?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1176441621962985474&ref_url=https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2019/sep/24/brexit-supreme-court-latest-news-labour-conference-starmer-says-it-is-obvious-labour-will-back-remain-despite-conference-vote-live-news0 -
Any reaction from moderate but so far loyal Tory MPs yet?0
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“It will be your decision whether to remain in the EU on the basis of the reforms we secure, or whether we leave.
Your decision.
Nobody else’s.
Not politicians’.
Not Parliament’s.
Not lobby groups’.
Not mine.
Just you.
You, the British people, will decide.
At that moment, you will hold this country’s destiny in your hands.
This is a huge decision for our country, perhaps the biggest we will make in our lifetimes.
And it will be the final decision.
So to those who suggest that a decision in the referendum to leave…
…would merely produce another stronger renegotiation and then a second referendum in which Britain would stay…
…I say think again.
The renegotiation is happening right now. And the referendum that follows will be a once in a generation choice.
An in or out referendum.
When the British people speak, their voice will be respected – not ignored.
If we vote to leave, then we will leave.”
Cameron Nov 2015
“MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain’s exit from the EU’”
Osborne Sep 20190 -
So is destroying democracy. Not that you give a shit about that.Gallowgate said:
Get a grip man. It is unbecoming.Richard_Tyndall said:
I didn't vote for any of these scum. I know what it makes you.TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
Think of his carbon footprint for god sake.Scott_P said:0 -
I repeat: get a grip.Richard_Tyndall said:
So is destroying democracy. Not that you give a shit about that.Gallowgate said:
Get a grip man. It is unbecoming.Richard_Tyndall said:
I didn't vote for any of these scum. I know what it makes you.TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
Can those who disagree with this ruling please argue why they would be in favour of PM Corbyn proroguing parliament for as long as he pleased to allow for something massive to happen, such as not funding the military, as John Major suggested?0
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Your last sentence is at least correct Richard. Those that "rule" us are in the Executive. They have lied to us all, so scum probably is correct. As for the referendum result, the real result (a very narrow win for Leave) has been ignored by those that would have us leave without a deal. An appropriate observance would have been a very soft Brexit to represent the marginal nature of the result. It would be up to those who advocate something more extreme to get such an outcome at a later date. No one has come out of this debacle well.Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
As soon we get an extension IMO.FrancisUrquhart said:
So time for a general election?TheJezziah said:
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nico67 said:
Hysterical nonsense . The SC stopped the dictatorship.nunuone said:Well the judges have decided we are no longer a constitutional monarchy.
It is a judicial dictatorship.
You're both wrong. An exec with a prorogued Parliament can't change anything, so it can't be a dictatorship. Indeed, on today's proceedings it looks like the PM is everyone's bitch.nico67 said:
Hysterical nonsense . The SC stopped the dictatorship.nunuone said:Well the judges have decided we are no longer a constitutional monarchy.
It is a judicial dictatorship.0 -
You didn't vote??Richard_Tyndall said:
I didn't vote for any of these scum. I know what it makes you.TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.
Funniest thing I've heard. You have therefore excluded yourself from any political comment about anything. which given the quality of your contributions would be no great loss.
Or wait - are you wearing your favourite "whoever you vote for the government always gets in" t-shirt?0 -
Remarkable that no witness statement was given by PM as to reasons. Para 61 is damning on that, and only conceivable reason was to avoid perjury rap.0
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Can someone explain to me what Parliament will do in the next six weeks?
They frit to death of the electorate so they won't dare to vote for an election. They're frit to death of bringing a VONC so what will they do with those six weeks?0 -
Nope I voted just not for any of this lot. Or are you so arrogant as to think that if your candidate loses you shouldn't have a voice? That woukd be about right for you.TOPPING said:
You didn't vote??Richard_Tyndall said:
I didn't vote for any of these scum. I know what it makes you.TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.
Funniest thing I've heard. You have therefore excluded yourself from any political comment about anything. which given the quality of your contributions would be no great loss.
Or wait - are you wearing your favourite "whoever you vote for the government always gets in" t-shirt?0 -
The correlation between Richard insulting people and realising he is out of his depth is quite high.Gallowgate said:
Get a grip man. It is unbecoming.Richard_Tyndall said:
I didn't vote for any of these scum. I know what it makes you.TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
Well this.CD13 said:Can someone explain to me what Parliament will do in the next six weeks?
They frit to death of the electorate so they won't dare to vote for an election. They're frit to death of bringing a VONC so what will they do with those six weeks?
All very well the Commons can now sit again as soon as possible.
Great.
So what are they going to do now? Sit there and......do what? Say what? Enact what? Decide what?0 -
So what now? Just hand the country over to the Stupid Communist? No thanks!0
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I certainly wear them, but I would not have thought that there was enough room in them for men's err... unmentionables. Well... most men....Nigel_Foremain said:
I thought we all wear them? Don't we?!isam said:You imply a man wearing knickers is a bad thing and use it pejoratively... How offensively unwoke! #dinosaur
Stay away from thongs though....0 -
It was the most astonishing omission.SirNorfolkPassmore said:Remarkable that no witness statement was given by PM as to reasons. Para 61 is damning on that, and only conceivable reason was to avoid perjury rap.
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Richard_Tyndall said:
I didn't vote for any of these scum. I know what it makes you.TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.
I’ve voted in every GE since 1959. I’ve only voted for a winner once.Richard_Tyndall said:
I didn't vote for any of these scum. I know what it makes you.TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.
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I imagine many of them will be furious. But nothing the court has decided today makes any difference to when we leave the EU. If Johnson had not illegally prorogued Parliament the high likelihood is that Parliament would not have passed the extension law that it did. This is entirely of the PM's making.isam said:
The front page of the pro EU Standard spells it out “‘MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain’s exit from the EU’”... if that’s how George Osborne sees it, how do you think Leave voters will?SouthamObserver said:
The bigger picture is actually that no-one is above the law. If we are to remain a democracy, that principle is fundamental. The smaller picture is that delivering a Brexit that did not cause immense harm to the country was always going to be immensely difficult - and that is still the case. Those who claimed otherwise - and are now running the country - would do everyonr a favour is they admitted that and started looking beyond the base for solutions. EFTA/EEA will take us out. That's what shouold happen now.isam said:
The bigger picture is one of the establishment refusing to carry out the referendum resultMikeSmithson said:I have updated the title to make it clear that it's the Rule of Law 11 Cummings/Johnson 0
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I'm looking forward to the next phase where you turn on the British people for being too pathetic to rise up against this Remainer conspiracy.Richard_Tyndall said:
Nope I voted just not for any of this lot.TOPPING said:
You didn't vote??Richard_Tyndall said:
I didn't vote for any of these scum. I know what it makes you.TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.
Funniest thing I've heard. You have therefore excluded yourself from any political comment about anything. which given the quality of your contributions would be no great loss.
Or wait - are you wearing your favourite "whoever you vote for the government always gets in" t-shirt?0 -
He is not God. He was not an absolute ruler. He is one man.isam said:“It will be your decision whether to remain in the EU on the basis of the reforms we secure, or whether we leave.
Your decision.
Nobody else’s.
Not politicians’.
Not Parliament’s.
Not lobby groups’.
Not mine.
Just you.
You, the British people, will decide.
At that moment, you will hold this country’s destiny in your hands.
This is a huge decision for our country, perhaps the biggest we will make in our lifetimes.
And it will be the final decision.
So to those who suggest that a decision in the referendum to leave…
…would merely produce another stronger renegotiation and then a second referendum in which Britain would stay…
…I say think again.
The renegotiation is happening right now. And the referendum that follows will be a once in a generation choice.
An in or out referendum.
When the British people speak, their voice will be respected – not ignored.
If we vote to leave, then we will leave.”
He never had the power to guarantee any of that, parliament is sovereign and would decide.
I agree we should leave (because we voted for it, not because its a good idea), but part of the problem we are in is we think our politicians have more power than they do.
Cameron could not guarantee Remain would win, or that we would leave if Leave won.
May could not guarantee we would leave on April Fools Day.
Boris cannot guarantee we will leave on Halloween (aka Macron Day)
Why not realise they are merely expressing their intentions not a guarantee of what will happen instead of getting repeatedly frustrated when they inevitably fail to deliver.
Because parliament is sovereign, not them, not a referendum, not the executive, not the Tory party.0 -
Finished the full judgement. I'm quite horny. It's beautiful. John Harris of the Guardian was so astute when he pointed out the Brexiters were Cavaliers not Roundheads.0
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I'd rather not. Labour get mullered in any election before Brexit is 'sorted' (one way or the other), IMO.TheJezziah said:
As soon we get an extension IMO.FrancisUrquhart said:
So time for a general election?TheJezziah said:0 -
Meanwhile, I'm enjoying how "the worst political decision in history" requires only the resignation of an obscure aide. Nigel Farage must really hate Dominic Cummings.0
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Says the man who seens unable to.understand the basic system of voting.TOPPING said:
The correlation between Richard insulting people and realising he is out of his depth is quite high.Gallowgate said:
Get a grip man. It is unbecoming.Richard_Tyndall said:
I didn't vote for any of these scum. I know what it makes you.TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
"It is impossible for us to conclude on the evidence... that there was any reason - let alone a good reason - to advise Her Majesty to prorogue Parliament for five weeks."SirNorfolkPassmore said:Remarkable that no witness statement was given by PM as to reasons. Para 61 is damning on that, and only conceivable reason was to avoid perjury rap.
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They'll face a reckoning, sooner or later.Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
He forgot "Tried to call an election, twice, but failed"Scott_P said:0 -
Cameron was just the leader of one faction within the Conservative Party. He did not speak for the country as a whole, did he?isam said:“It will be your decision whether to remain in the EU on the basis of the reforms we secure, or whether we leave.
Your decision.
Nobody else’s.
Not politicians’.
Not Parliament’s.
Not lobby groups’.
Not mine.
Just you.
You, the British people, will decide.
At that moment, you will hold this country’s destiny in your hands.
This is a huge decision for our country, perhaps the biggest we will make in our lifetimes.
And it will be the final decision.
So to those who suggest that a decision in the referendum to leave…
…would merely produce another stronger renegotiation and then a second referendum in which Britain would stay…
…I say think again.
The renegotiation is happening right now. And the referendum that follows will be a once in a generation choice.
An in or out referendum.
When the British people speak, their voice will be respected – not ignored.
If we vote to leave, then we will leave.”
Cameron Nov 2015
“MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain’s exit from the EU’”
Osborne Sep 20190 -
I get the arguments about a soft Brexit for a narrow leave victory, they do make sense but what would those arguing that say had the result gone the other way. Is there any form of 'soft Remain'? Thus far and no further? Is that really possible in an EU that will continue to legislate in favour of ever closer union (albeit that Cameron negotiated an opt-out from that)?Nigel_Foremain said:
Your last sentence is at least correct Richard. Those that "rule" us are in the Executive. They have lied to us all, so scum probably is correct. As for the referendum result, the real result (a very narrow win for Leave) has been ignored by those that would have us leave without a deal. An appropriate observance would have been a very soft Brexit to represent the marginal nature of the result. It would be up to those who advocate something more extreme to get such an outcome at a later date. No one has come out of this debacle well.Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
They'll do what they've been doing for months. Deciding what they don't want.ozymandias said:
Well this.CD13 said:Can someone explain to me what Parliament will do in the next six weeks?
They frit to death of the electorate so they won't dare to vote for an election. They're frit to death of bringing a VONC so what will they do with those six weeks?
All very well the Commons can now sit again as soon as possible.
Great.
So what are they going to do now? Sit there and......do what? Say what? Enact what? Decide what?1 -
Sturgeon, Swinson say Boris Johnson should resign. Hardly a surprise, perhaps his days are numbered if Tory MPs start tweeting or repeating that message. It remains to be seen if there is anyone capable of forming a government in his place. Corbyn can't command the support of his own party, let alone the support of Lib Dems or SNP.
Remains to be seen if MPs are prepared to break the logjam by calling a Vote of No Confidence or not.
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I think we already knew that was the case from the referendum campaign.AlastairMeeks said:Meanwhile, I'm enjoying how "the worst political decision in history" requires only the resignation of an obscure aide. Nigel Farage must really hate Dominic Cummings.
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No, but he was hardly the only politician saying that was he?PClipp said:
Cameron was just the leader of one faction within the Conservative Party. He did not speak for the country as a whole, did he?isam said:“It will be your decision whether to remain in the EU on the basis of the reforms we secure, or whether we leave.
Your decision.
Nobody else’s.
Not politicians’.
Not Parliament’s.
Not lobby groups’.
Not mine.
Just you.
You, the British people, will decide.
At that moment, you will hold this country’s destiny in your hands.
This is a huge decision for our country, perhaps the biggest we will make in our lifetimes.
And it will be the final decision.
So to those who suggest that a decision in the referendum to leave…
…would merely produce another stronger renegotiation and then a second referendum in which Britain would stay…
…I say think again.
The renegotiation is happening right now. And the referendum that follows will be a once in a generation choice.
An in or out referendum.
When the British people speak, their voice will be respected – not ignored.
If we vote to leave, then we will leave.”
Cameron Nov 2015
“MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain’s exit from the EU’”
Osborne Sep 20190 -
As so often, George Osborne is on the button:
The verdict could not be more disastrous for the PM. He has been humiliated. His government, exactly two months old today, has suffered a catastrophic defeat. His Downing Street team look like dunces — with a fatal combination of hubris, deceit and incompetence.
Above all, Mr Johnson has been exposed as powerless. And all for nothing. There was nothing to be gained by trying to prorogue Parliament — and everything to lose.
For here’s a truth that’s hard to hear amid all the noise today. Fundamentally, the judgment by the Supreme Court doesn’t matter in the battle over Brexit.
https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/comment/evening-standard-comment-a-victory-for-democracy-and-the-pm-humiliated-uber-s-delayed-new-ride-the-a4244886.html
I think the main immediate effect of this judgement is simply going to be an even bigger boost to the polarisation of opinion which we've seen since November.
Those ERG nutters (and the PM and half the current Cabinet) who trashed May's deal, and thus gave Labour a cast-iron excuse for playing partisan games with it, have a hell of a lot to answer for.1 -
Yes it is quite tricky as it stands. Perhaps if there was a thread on it, plus other systems of voting it would be quite helpful.Richard_Tyndall said:
Says the man who seens unable to.understand the basic system of voting.TOPPING said:
The correlation between Richard insulting people and realising he is out of his depth is quite high.Gallowgate said:
Get a grip man. It is unbecoming.Richard_Tyndall said:
I didn't vote for any of these scum. I know what it makes you.TOPPING said:
The "scum" that you voted for. Just as with Trump (I am not his greatest fan), who is the democratically elected president of the United States, so are our MPs democratically elected by you. And me. And everyone else. So if they are scum what does that make us?Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
Ooh what sort of reckoning? A Labour government? Nige as PM? What were you thinking?Sean_F said:
They'll face a reckoning, sooner or later.Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
Soft remain might look like an opt out from the Euro and ever closer union? Perhaps an emergency brake on immigration whilst we changed our welfare arrangements if we wanted to?AndrewSpencer said:
I get the arguments about a soft Brexit for a narrow leave victory, they do make sense but what would those arguing that say had the result gone the other way. Is there any form of 'soft Remain'? Thus far and no further? Is that really possible in an EU that will continue to legislate in favour of ever closer union (albeit that Cameron negotiated an opt-out from that)?Nigel_Foremain said:
Your last sentence is at least correct Richard. Those that "rule" us are in the Executive. They have lied to us all, so scum probably is correct. As for the referendum result, the real result (a very narrow win for Leave) has been ignored by those that would have us leave without a deal. An appropriate observance would have been a very soft Brexit to represent the marginal nature of the result. It would be up to those who advocate something more extreme to get such an outcome at a later date. No one has come out of this debacle well.Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
Can Boris appeal to the ECJ?0
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A lot of them will be out on their ear, at the next election.TOPPING said:
Ooh what sort of reckoning? A Labour government? Nige as PM? What were you thinking?Sean_F said:
They'll face a reckoning, sooner or later.Richard_Tyndall said:
Interesting phrasing from The Standard.williamglenn said:
"MPs could be back in days to thwart Britain's exit from EU"
No pretence now of trying to get a deal. Just ignore the referendum result and cancel Brexit. So we see the true nature of the scum who rule us.0 -
I'm not sure - frankly for I'm guessing the majority of Tory supporters and hitherto voters, everything that is happening at Brighton this week will clarify the threat that they perceive Corbyn represents and hence are likely to be driven back (holding their nose) to the Cons. But yes, Swinson is definitely an outlet valve.Tabman said:0 -
It's five weeks, not 5 years! 5 weeks in which Parliament would normally be in recess for conference season, and has already passed the legislation it wanted to!148grss said:Can those who disagree with this ruling please argue why they would be in favour of PM Corbyn proroguing parliament for as long as he pleased to allow for something massive to happen, such as not funding the military, as John Major suggested?
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Liar, liar, pants on fire!
When will the piece of sh*t resign?
And hi from NYC!0
This discussion has been closed.