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Which is all very well but opening with Burns and Roy, that's really foolhardy.TrèsDifficile said:
"Now, as the 150th anniversary of the infamous charge approaches, historians are revising their accounts of what every schoolchild knows was a famous military disaster.Foxy said:
It is odd that the PM chooses as his catchphrase a description of a famous blunder:Scott_P said:
Forward, the Light Brigade!”
Was there a man dismayed?
Not though the soldier knew
Someone had blundered.
Theirs not to make reply,
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die.
Into the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
Writing in the October edition of BBC History magazine, a leading academic and author says the Light Brigade helped to lay the foundations for the future success of the British Army by establishing an ideal of heroic and "unthinking obedience", with lasting benefits.
..
The charge occurred during the battle of Balaklava in the Crimean War, when 658 British cavalrymen, acting on a misinterpreted order, rode for more than a mile under heavy fire to attack Russian artillery positions, killed the gunners, then retreated, having lost 110 dead, 180 wounded or taken prisoner and 475 horses killed.
Yet the charge helped swing the campaign in favour of the British. A few days later, 10,000 British troops held fast against 40,000 Russians at the battle of Inkerman. In the longer term, the habit of obeying orders - which had not been universal in earlier periods - indicated a new ethos of professionalism in the Army."
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/charge-of-the-light-brigade-was-a-military-success-545886.html1 -
Earlier posts have indicated Parliament is already well hung with Boris and Gove in it.The_Taxman said:
It is why I cannot vote for him or his party. I will just vote LD and hope for an even more hung parliament! If they cannot do anything it has to be better than them doing the wrong thing!philiph said:
In that case you do not understand Corbyn, and probably not what his beliefs, objectives and political imperitives are.The_Taxman said:
What I cannot understand about Corbyn is his stubbornness in carrying on and letting the Tories off the hook, when a dynamic fresh Labour leader could wipe the floor with Johnson. Someone else may not have the ideological purity of Corbyn. But they would have the power to make changes that would improve the lives of the many not the few...Sandpit said:
It’s why Labour need to ditch Corbyn ASAP. Many people don’t like Boris Johnson, but consider him by far the lesser of two evils.The_Taxman said:
I do think Boris has a poor reception amoung some women voters i know. One of which called him a "scruffy bastard" on he day he became PM! It made me laugh that reaction! This person has until this year voted Tory in every election. I dont think they will vote Tory again whilst Boris is PM! The LD are going to pick up some serious votes from people like this who cannot stand Johnson and I cannot see Labour voters suddenly voting Tory to replace these losses from the Tory ranks...anothernick said:
Exactly. This will damage Boris with women voters particularly. My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was trying to make the best of a difficult situation, thinks Boris is a disgusting individual not fit to be PM because of his attitude to women. And I doubt she is alone in taking that view.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
However, if true that ruins my Freudian theory about the reason they behave like utter dicks.0 -
True but I think Kier Starmer would be better than Corbyn.IanB2 said:
They dont have a dynamic fresh leader in waiting and, as is evident from NPs posts, both the members and the leadership want to hang onto the purported purity.The_Taxman said:
What I cannot understand about Corbyn is his stubbornness in carrying on and letting the Tories off the hook, when a dynamic fresh Labour leader could wipe the floor with Johnson. Someone else may not have the ideological purity of Corbyn. But they would have the power to make changes that would improve the lives of the many not the few...Sandpit said:
It’s why Labour need to ditch Corbyn ASAP. Many people don’t like Boris Johnson, but consider him by far the lesser of two evils.The_Taxman said:
I do think Boris has a poor reception amoung some women voters i know. One of which called him a "scruffy bastard" on he day he became PM! It made me laugh that reaction! This person has until this year voted Tory in every election. I dont think they will vote Tory again whilst Boris is PM! The LD are going to pick up some serious votes from people like this who cannot stand Johnson and I cannot see Labour voters suddenly voting Tory to replace these losses from the Tory ranks...anothernick said:
Exactly. This will damage Boris with women voters particularly. My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was trying to make the best of a difficult situation, thinks Boris is a disgusting individual not fit to be PM because of his attitude to women. And I doubt she is alone in taking that view.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
I think Swinson is fresh and dynamic by the way. She is likeable IMO and her TV appearences connect to me as a viewer in a way her rival did not.0 -
Are you sure it was due to his penis size and not a reference to his intellectual capacity?DecrepitJohnL said:
Michael Gove was nicknamed Donkey, according to the new biography. He should have leaked that part instead of the cocaine story.Mysticrose said:
Isn't he, erm, extremely large?Cyclefree said:
Boris’s behaviour is par for the course. The mystery is why Carrie should want to shack up with him, knowing his history of serial unfaithfulness to every woman he has ever been with.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
But, yes, I concur.1 -
Why was Zsa Zsa Gabor regarded as the best housekeeper in the world?geoffw said:
When you marry your housekeeper it reduces GDP.SandraMc said:Re; Boris and Carrie marrying. As Sir James Goldsmith said: "When you marry the mistress, it creates a vacancy."
Because every time she divorced, she kept the house.1 -
lol - Boris is only ever one step away from a massive cock-up!ydoethur said:
Earlier posts have indicated Parliament is already well hung with Boris and Gove in it.The_Taxman said:
It is why I cannot vote for him or his party. I will just vote LD and hope for an even more hung parliament! If they cannot do anything it has to be better than them doing the wrong thing!philiph said:
In that case you do not understand Corbyn, and probably not what his beliefs, objectives and political imperitives are.The_Taxman said:
What I cannot understand about Corbyn is his stubbornness in carrying on and letting the Tories off the hook, when a dynamic fresh Labour leader could wipe the floor with Johnson. Someone else may not have the ideological purity of Corbyn. But they would have the power to make changes that would improve the lives of the many not the few...Sandpit said:
It’s why Labour need to ditch Corbyn ASAP. Many people don’t like Boris Johnson, but consider him by far the lesser of two evils.The_Taxman said:
I do think Boris has a poor reception amoung some women voters i know. One of which called him a "scruffy bastard" on he day he became PM! It made me laugh that reaction! This person has until this year voted Tory in every election. I dont think they will vote Tory again whilst Boris is PM! The LD are going to pick up some serious votes from people like this who cannot stand Johnson and I cannot see Labour voters suddenly voting Tory to replace these losses from the Tory ranks...anothernick said:
Exactly. This will damage Boris with women voters particularly. My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was trying to make the best of a difficult situation, thinks Boris is a disgusting individual not fit to be PM because of his attitude to women. And I doubt she is alone in taking that view.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
However, if true that ruins my Freudian theory about the reason they behave like utter dicks.0 -
+100Nigel_Foremain said:
I would agree with that sentiment. I will be voting LD rather than endorse Johnson and his band of nutters. However if Labour had a leader who was not as thick as pigshit and wanted to turn the UK into a banana republic, then I would even lend them my vote to punish the Conservative Party for becoming UKIP/BNP-liteSandpit said:
It’s why Labour need to ditch Corbyn ASAP. Many people don’t like Boris Johnson, but consider him by far the lesser of two evils.The_Taxman said:
I do think Boris has a poor reception amoung some women voters i know. One of which called him a "scruffy bastard" on he day he became PM! It made me laugh that reaction! This person has until this year voted Tory in every election. I dont think they will vote Tory again whilst Boris is PM! The LD are going to pick up some serious votes from people like this who cannot stand Johnson and I cannot see Labour voters suddenly voting Tory to replace these losses from the Tory ranks...anothernick said:
Exactly. This will damage Boris with women voters particularly. My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was trying to make the best of a difficult situation, thinks Boris is a disgusting individual not fit to be PM because of his attitude to women. And I doubt she is alone in taking that view.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
Voted Con since first eligible election (2001).
Voted LD in 2017, and at the Euros, and fully expect to do so at next election.
However, Vince Cable was useless. Do the Lib Dems actually have policies beyond Brexit?0 -
I blame the parents.Cyclefree said:
Boris’s behaviour is par for the course. The mystery is why Carrie should want to shack up with him, knowing his history of serial unfaithfulness to every woman he has ever been with.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
0 -
This is true, but with Boris it will always be somebody else's cock up.The_Taxman said:
lol - Boris is only ever one step away from a massive cock-up!ydoethur said:
Earlier posts have indicated Parliament is already well hung with Boris and Gove in it.The_Taxman said:
It is why I cannot vote for him or his party. I will just vote LD and hope for an even more hung parliament! If they cannot do anything it has to be better than them doing the wrong thing!philiph said:
In that case you do not understand Corbyn, and probably not what his beliefs, objectives and political imperitives are.The_Taxman said:
What I cannot understand about Corbyn is his stubbornness in carrying on and letting the Tories off the hook, when a dynamic fresh Labour leader could wipe the floor with Johnson. Someone else may not have the ideological purity of Corbyn. But they would have the power to make changes that would improve the lives of the many not the few...Sandpit said:
It’s why Labour need to ditch Corbyn ASAP. Many people don’t like Boris Johnson, but consider him by far the lesser of two evils.The_Taxman said:
I do think Boris has a poor reception amoung some women voters i know. One of which called him a "scruffy bastard" on he day he became PM! It made me laugh that reaction! This person has until this year voted Tory in every election. I dont think they will vote Tory again whilst Boris is PM! The LD are going to pick up some serious votes from people like this who cannot stand Johnson and I cannot see Labour voters suddenly voting Tory to replace these losses from the Tory ranks...anothernick said:
Exactly. This will damage Boris with women voters particularly. My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was trying to make the best of a difficult situation, thinks Boris is a disgusting individual not fit to be PM because of his attitude to women. And I doubt she is alone in taking that view.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
However, if true that ruins my Freudian theory about the reason they behave like utter dicks.0 -
They have a policy on almost everythingGardenwalker said:
+100Nigel_Foremain said:
I would agree with that sentiment. I will be voting LD rather than endorse Johnson and his band of nutters. However if Labour had a leader who was not as thick as pigshit and wanted to turn the UK into a banana republic, then I would even lend them my vote to punish the Conservative Party for becoming UKIP/BNP-liteSandpit said:
It’s why Labour need to ditch Corbyn ASAP. Many people don’t like Boris Johnson, but consider him by far the lesser of two evils.The_Taxman said:
I do think Boris has a poor reception amoung some women voters i know. One of which called him a "scruffy bastard" on he day he became PM! It made me laugh that reaction! This person has until this year voted Tory in every election. I dont think they will vote Tory again whilst Boris is PM! The LD are going to pick up some serious votes from people like this who cannot stand Johnson and I cannot see Labour voters suddenly voting Tory to replace these losses from the Tory ranks...anothernick said:
Exactly. This will damage Boris with women voters particularly. My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was trying to make the best of a difficult situation, thinks Boris is a disgusting individual not fit to be PM because of his attitude to women. And I doubt she is alone in taking that view.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
Voted Con since first eligible election (2001).
Voted LD in 2017, and at the Euros, and fully expect to do so at next election.
However, Vince Cable was useless. Do the Lib Dems actually have policies beyond Brexit?0 -
The homoerotics of Conservative supporters are a wonder to behold.0
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I’m sure they do.IanB2 said:
They have a policy on almost everythingGardenwalker said:
+100Nigel_Foremain said:
I would agree with that sentiment. I will be voting LD rather than endorse Johnson and his band of nutters. However if Labour had a leader who was not as thick as pigshit and wanted to turn the UK into a banana republic, then I would even lend them my vote to punish the Conservative Party for becoming UKIP/BNP-liteSandpit said:
It’s why Labour need to ditch Corbyn ASAP. Many people don’t like Boris Johnson, but consider him by far the lesser of two evils.The_Taxman said:
I do think Boris has a poor reception amoung some women voters i know. One of which called him a "scruffy bastard" on he day he became PM! It made me laugh that reaction! This person has until this year voted Tory in every election. I dont think they will vote Tory again whilst Boris is PM! The LD are going to pick up some serious votes from people like this who cannot stand Johnson and I cannot see Labour voters suddenly voting Tory to replace these losses from the Tory ranks...anothernick said:
Exactly. This will damage Boris with women voters particularly. My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was trying to make the best of a difficult situation, thinks Boris is a disgusting individual not fit to be PM because of his attitude to women. And I doubt she is alone in taking that view.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
Voted Con since first eligible election (2001).
Voted LD in 2017, and at the Euros, and fully expect to do so at next election.
However, Vince Cable was useless. Do the Lib Dems actually have policies beyond Brexit?
None of it has had any media cut through.
For starters, they need to junk tertiary fees.
It’s their Clause 4.0 -
Starmer makes Vince sound interestingThe_Taxman said:
True but I think Kier Starmer would be better than Corbyn.IanB2 said:
They dont have a dynamic fresh leader in waiting and, as is evident from NPs posts, both the members and the leadership want to hang onto the purported purity.The_Taxman said:
What I cannot understand about Corbyn is his stubbornness in carrying on and letting the Tories off the hook, when a dynamic fresh Labour leader could wipe the floor with Johnson. Someone else may not have the ideological purity of Corbyn. But they would have the power to make changes that would improve the lives of the many not the few...Sandpit said:
It’s why Labour need to ditch Corbyn ASAP. Many people don’t like Boris Johnson, but consider him by far the lesser of two evils.The_Taxman said:
I do think Boris has a poor reception amoung some women voters i know. One of which called him a "scruffy bastard" on he day he became PM! It made me laugh that reaction! This person has until this year voted Tory in every election. I dont think they will vote Tory again whilst Boris is PM! The LD are going to pick up some serious votes from people like this who cannot stand Johnson and I cannot see Labour voters suddenly voting Tory to replace these losses from the Tory ranks...anothernick said:
Exactly. This will damage Boris with women voters particularly. My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was trying to make the best of a difficult situation, thinks Boris is a disgusting individual not fit to be PM because of his attitude to women. And I doubt she is alone in taking that view.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
I think Swinson is fresh and dynamic by the way. She is likeable IMO and her TV appearences connect to me as a viewer in a way her rival did not.0 -
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This is satire,right?Mysticrose said:
Yep the sheer lunacy of the First World War. The most unparalleled piece of pointless carnage in human history.TrèsDifficile said:
"Now, as the 150th anniversary of the infamous charge approaches, historians are revising their accounts of what every schoolchild knows was a famous military disaster.Foxy said:
It is odd that the PM chooses as his catchphrase a description of a famous blunder:Scott_P said:
Forward, the Light Brigade!”
Was there a man dismayed?
Not though the soldier knew
Someone had blundered.
Theirs not to make reply,
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die.
Into the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
Writing in the October edition of BBC History magazine, a leading academic and author says the Light Brigade helped to lay the foundations for the future success of the British Army by establishing an ideal of heroic and "unthinking obedience", with lasting benefits.
Academics have to point score, even when they haven't a leg left to stand on. It's the only way they can justify their existence.0 -
Maths would suggest the retreat was mostly on foot.DavidL said:
Which is all very well but opening with Burns and Roy, that's really foolhardy.TrèsDifficile said:
"Now, as the 150th anniversary of the infamous charge approaches, historians are revising their accounts of what every schoolchild knows was a famous military disaster.Foxy said:
It is odd that the PM chooses as his catchphrase a description of a famous blunder:Scott_P said:
Forward, the Light Brigade!”
Was there a man dismayed?
Not though the soldier knew
Someone had blundered.
Theirs not to make reply,
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die.
Into the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
Writing in the October edition of BBC History magazine, a leading academic and author says the Light Brigade helped to lay the foundations for the future success of the British Army by establishing an ideal of heroic and "unthinking obedience", with lasting benefits.
..
The charge occurred during the battle of Balaklava in the Crimean War, when 658 British cavalrymen, acting on a misinterpreted order, rode for more than a mile under heavy fire to attack Russian artillery positions, killed the gunners, then retreated, having lost 110 dead, 180 wounded or taken prisoner and 475 horses killed.
Yet the charge helped swing the campaign in favour of the British. A few days later, 10,000 British troops held fast against 40,000 Russians at the battle of Inkerman. In the longer term, the habit of obeying orders - which had not been universal in earlier periods - indicated a new ethos of professionalism in the Army."
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/charge-of-the-light-brigade-was-a-military-success-545886.html0 -
A less interesting leader might be just what we need at the moment. Major was intensely boring but he did provide solid dependable leadership - something sadly lacking in Westminster today.IanB2 said:
Starmer makes Vince sound interestingThe_Taxman said:
True but I think Kier Starmer would be better than Corbyn.IanB2 said:
They dont have a dynamic fresh leader in waiting and, as is evident from NPs posts, both the members and the leadership want to hang onto the purported purity.The_Taxman said:
What I cannot understand about Corbyn is his stubbornness in carrying on and letting the Tories off the hook, when a dynamic fresh Labour leader could wipe the floor with Johnson. Someone else may not have the ideological purity of Corbyn. But they would have the power to make changes that would improve the lives of the many not the few...Sandpit said:
It’s why Labour need to ditch Corbyn ASAP. Many people don’t like Boris Johnson, but consider him by far the lesser of two evils.The_Taxman said:
I do think Boris has a poor reception amoung some women voters i know. One of which called him a "scruffy bastard" on he day he became PM! It made me laugh that reaction! This person has until this year voted Tory in every election. I dont think they will vote Tory again whilst Boris is PM! The LD are going to pick up some serious votes from people like this who cannot stand Johnson and I cannot see Labour voters suddenly voting Tory to replace these losses from the Tory ranks...anothernick said:
Exactly. This will damage Boris with women voters particularly. My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was trying to make the best of a difficult situation, thinks Boris is a disgusting individual not fit to be PM because of his attitude to women. And I doubt she is alone in taking that view.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
I think Swinson is fresh and dynamic by the way. She is likeable IMO and her TV appearences connect to me as a viewer in a way her rival did not.0 -
It's gratifying to see so many considering the LDs as a vote and as thoughtful people confronted with a choice of Boris Johnson or Jeremy Corbyn I can't say I blame them.Gardenwalker said:+100
Voted Con since first eligible election (2001).
Voted LD in 2017, and at the Euros, and fully expect to do so at next election.
However, Vince Cable was useless. Do the Lib Dems actually have policies beyond Brexit?
There will of course be a full LD manifesto with a range of policies and programmes. It's hard not to deny the dominance of Brexit as a topic but there are plenty concerned at the latest incarnation of the traditional Conservative spending splurge which will increase borrowing, the deficit and ultimately the debt. Anyone would think Johnson and his Government are trying to buy votes with promises of wheelbarrows full of cash.
I also understand for the sake of his own political self-preservation Johnson is desperate a No Deal exit from the EU doesn't lead to a full on recession. The unpalatable truth is a significant minority seem willing to eat grass rather than remain in the EU - really, the EU isn't that bad?0 -
0
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And he isn't seen as from the left.anothernick said:
A less interesting leader might be just what we need at the moment. Major was intensely boring but he did provide solid dependable leadership - something sadly lacking in Westminster today.IanB2 said:
Starmer makes Vince sound interestingThe_Taxman said:
True but I think Kier Starmer would be better than Corbyn.IanB2 said:
They dont have a dynamic fresh leader in waiting and, as is evident from NPs posts, both the members and the leadership want to hang onto the purported purity.The_Taxman said:
What I cannot understand about Corbyn is his stubbornness in carrying on and letting the Tories off the hook, when a dynamic fresh Labour leader could wipe the floor with Johnson. Someone else may not have the ideological purity of Corbyn. But they would have the power to make changes that would improve the lives of the many not the few...Sandpit said:
It’s why Labour need to ditch Corbyn ASAP. Many people don’t like Boris Johnson, but consider him by far the lesser of two evils.The_Taxman said:
I do think Boris has a poor reception amoung some women voters i know. One of which called him a "scruffy bastard" on he day he became PM! It made me laugh that reaction! This person has until this year voted Tory in every election. I dont think they will vote Tory again whilst Boris is PM! The LD are going to pick up some serious votes from people like this who cannot stand Johnson and I cannot see Labour voters suddenly voting Tory to replace these losses from the Tory ranks...anothernick said:
Exactly. This will damage Boris with women voters particularly. My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was trying to make the best of a difficult situation, thinks Boris is a disgusting individual not fit to be PM because of his attitude to women. And I doubt she is alone in taking that view.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
I think Swinson is fresh and dynamic by the way. She is likeable IMO and her TV appearences connect to me as a viewer in a way her rival did not.
Anyhow May was supposed to be dependable and boring.0 -
You can never underestimate the intelligence of the great British public ...stodge said:
It's gratifying to see so many considering the LDs as a vote and as thoughtful people confronted with a choice of Boris Johnson or Jeremy Corbyn I can't say I blame them.Gardenwalker said:+100
Voted Con since first eligible election (2001).
Voted LD in 2017, and at the Euros, and fully expect to do so at next election.
However, Vince Cable was useless. Do the Lib Dems actually have policies beyond Brexit?
There will of course be a full LD manifesto with a range of policies and programmes. It's hard not to deny the dominance of Brexit as a topic but there are plenty concerned at the latest incarnation of the traditional Conservative spending splurge which will increase borrowing, the deficit and ultimately the debt. Anyone would think Johnson and his Government are trying to buy votes with promises of wheelbarrows full of cash.
I also understand for the sake of his own political self-preservation Johnson is desperate a No Deal exit from the EU doesn't lead to a full on recession. The unpalatable truth is a significant minority seem willing to eat grass rather than remain in the EU - really, the EU isn't that bad?0 -
Perhaps @TGOHF can confirm?IanB2 said:
Maths would suggest the retreat was mostly on foot.DavidL said:
Which is all very well but opening with Burns and Roy, that's really foolhardy.TrèsDifficile said:
"Now, as the 150th anniversary of the infamous charge approaches, historians are revising their accounts of what every schoolchild knows was a famous military disaster.Foxy said:
It is odd that the PM chooses as his catchphrase a description of a famous blunder:Scott_P said:
Forward, the Light Brigade!”
Was there a man dismayed?
Not though the soldier knew
Someone had blundered.
Theirs not to make reply,
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die.
Into the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
Writing in the October edition of BBC History magazine, a leading academic and author says the Light Brigade helped to lay the foundations for the future success of the British Army by establishing an ideal of heroic and "unthinking obedience", with lasting benefits.
..
The charge occurred during the battle of Balaklava in the Crimean War, when 658 British cavalrymen, acting on a misinterpreted order, rode for more than a mile under heavy fire to attack Russian artillery positions, killed the gunners, then retreated, having lost 110 dead, 180 wounded or taken prisoner and 475 horses killed.
Yet the charge helped swing the campaign in favour of the British. A few days later, 10,000 British troops held fast against 40,000 Russians at the battle of Inkerman. In the longer term, the habit of obeying orders - which had not been universal in earlier periods - indicated a new ethos of professionalism in the Army."
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/charge-of-the-light-brigade-was-a-military-success-545886.html0 -
https://twitter.com/SamGyimah/status/1156808680559587328
Early September. Time to bring them down Sam.0 -
Maths would also suggest that must be an old article if the 150th anniversary of the Charge of the Light Brigade in 1854 is "approaching". Surely the revisionists have been revised by now. Wasn't one of our number embarking on an MA in military history? Have they reached the Crimea yet?DavidL said:
Perhaps @TGOHF can confirm?IanB2 said:
Maths would suggest the retreat was mostly on foot.DavidL said:
Which is all very well but opening with Burns and Roy, that's really foolhardy.TrèsDifficile said:
"Now, as the 150th anniversary of the infamous charge approaches, historians are revising their accounts of what every schoolchild knows was a famous military disaster.Foxy said:
It is odd that the PM chooses as his catchphrase a description of a famous blunder:Scott_P said:
Forward, the Light Brigade!”
Was there a man dismayed?
Not though the soldier knew
Someone had blundered.
Theirs not to make reply,
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die.
Into the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
Writing in the October edition of BBC History magazine, a leading academic and author says the Light Brigade helped to lay the foundations for the future success of the British Army by establishing an ideal of heroic and "unthinking obedience", with lasting benefits.
..
The charge occurred during the battle of Balaklava in the Crimean War, when 658 British cavalrymen, acting on a misinterpreted order, rode for more than a mile under heavy fire to attack Russian artillery positions, killed the gunners, then retreated, having lost 110 dead, 180 wounded or taken prisoner and 475 horses killed.
Yet the charge helped swing the campaign in favour of the British. A few days later, 10,000 British troops held fast against 40,000 Russians at the battle of Inkerman. In the longer term, the habit of obeying orders - which had not been universal in earlier periods - indicated a new ethos of professionalism in the Army."
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/charge-of-the-light-brigade-was-a-military-success-545886.html0 -
It's so often the cases parties choose leaders who are the antithesis of their predecessor as though not only are they choosing a new leader they are by so doing rejecting the old leader.IanB2 said:<
And he isn't seen as from the left.
Anyhow May was supposed to be dependable and boring.
For the LDs, Ashdown to Kennedy to Campbell to Clegg to Farron to Cable to Swinson represents a pendulum like swing from youth to experience and changes in leadership style.
For the Conservatives Thatcher to Major to Hague to IDS to Howard to Cameron to May to Johnson - not quite so stark, the Hague/IDS/Howard line more about continuity but in terms of personality and style the change is almost pendulum like.
For Labour Kinnock to Blair to Brown to Miliband to Corbyn is more of a journey but within that shifts of personality and style and manner.
If you want to pick the next leader of these parties look at the current leaders and seek out someone who isn't like them at all.0 -
The ghost of Ozzy's emergency budget has returned to haunt the Boris No Deal.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/aug/01/government-refuses-to-rule-out-emergency-no-deal-brexit-budget0 -
https://twitter.com/davidallengreen/status/1156845545018863617
The autumn GE will be known by historians as the Burning Lamb Election.0 -
-
PFStark_Dawning said:The ghost of Ozzy's emergency budget has returned to haunt the Boris No Deal.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/aug/01/government-refuses-to-rule-out-emergency-no-deal-brexit-budget0 -
Conservatives drifting in the betting on B&R.
Might just be today's mood on here
0 -
The "leading academic and author" whose opinion is expressed in the article originated a hoax claiming that Charles Dickens met Fyodor Dostoyevsky..DecrepitJohnL said:
Maths would also suggest that must be an old article if the 150th anniversary of the Charge of the Light Brigade in 1854 is "approaching". Surely the revisionists have been revised by now. Wasn't one of our number embarking on an MA in military history? Have they reached the Crimea yet?DavidL said:
Perhaps @TGOHF can confirm?IanB2 said:
Maths would suggest the retreat was mostly on foot.DavidL said:
Which is all very well but opening with Burns and Roy, that's really foolhardy.TrèsDifficile said:
"Now, as the 150th anniversary of the infamous charge approaches, historians are revising their accounts of what every schoolchild knows was a famous military disaster.Foxy said:
It is odd that the PM chooses as his catchphrase a description of a famous blunder:Scott_P said:
Forward, the Light Brigade!”
Was there a man dismayed?
Not though the soldier knew
Someone had blundered.
Theirs not to make reply,
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die.
Into the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
Writing in the October edition of BBC History magazine, a leading academic and author says the Light Brigade helped to lay the foundations for the future success of the British Army by establishing an ideal of heroic and "unthinking obedience", with lasting benefits.
..
The charge occurred during the battle of Balaklava in the Crimean War, when 658 British cavalrymen, acting on a misinterpreted order, rode for more than a mile under heavy fire to attack Russian artillery positions, killed the gunners, then retreated, having lost 110 dead, 180 wounded or taken prisoner and 475 horses killed.
Yet the charge helped swing the campaign in favour of the British. A few days later, 10,000 British troops held fast against 40,000 Russians at the battle of Inkerman. In the longer term, the habit of obeying orders - which had not been universal in earlier periods - indicated a new ethos of professionalism in the Army."
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/charge-of-the-light-brigade-was-a-military-success-545886.html
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2013/jul/10/man-behind-dickens-dostoevsky-hoax0 -
How many hospitals does £6bn buy?
How many nurses? How many school places? How many council houses? How many bridges? How many traffic easing schemes?0 -
Now there's a subsample...HYUFD said:
The Tories still lead by 4% over Labour with women under Borisanothernick said:
Exactly. This will damage Boris with women voters particularly. My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was trying to make the best of a difficult situation, thinks Boris is a disgusting individual not fit to be PM because of his attitude to women. And I doubt she is alone in taking that view.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
0 -
Probably the last time that Jimmy will lead the attack at the start of an Ashes series. Here's hoping he has a good one.0
-
Why then does Mr Johnson deliberately engineer the appearance of Ken Dodd?DecrepitJohnL said:
David Cameron's mum was right when she told Jeremy Corbyn to wear a suit, do up his tie and sing the national anthem. It worked for Corbyn, and even Boris seems to have visited his tailor recently. Look at Michael Foot's duffle coat for another demonstration that appearances matter.The_Taxman said:
I do think Boris has a poor reception amoung some women voters i know. One of which called him a "scruffy bastard" on he day he became PM! It made me laugh that reaction! This person has until this year voted Tory in every election. I dont think they will vote Tory again whilst Boris is PM!0 -
Lewes. Green & LibDem alliance, or split?
https://twitter.com/CllrJohnnyDenis/status/11565723906143273010 -
Betting markets like financial ones tend to overshoot then correct. Hence the £ this week (tho it's now sinking again). TSE spotted that the Tories have a greater than 3% chance as the BXP Ltd. balloon deflates, especially with the geography of the seat making it hard to call. Thus punters lumped on until the implied 20% chance seemed too high, and people who backed at long odds cashed inMysticrose said:Conservatives drifting in the betting on B&R.
Might just be today's mood on here0 -
Under PFI, less than 2Gardenwalker said:How many hospitals does £6bn buy?
How many nurses? How many school places? How many council houses? How many bridges? How many traffic easing schemes?
"The biggest PFI deal, considered widely to have been a mistake, was to build new hospitals on the sites of two old ones – the Royal London in Whitechapel, east London, and St Bartholomew’s two miles away.
The rebuild cost £1.1 billion but, under the terms of the PFI, the final cost will be more than £7 billion with the Barts Health NHS Trust making payments until 2049."
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/nhs/11748960/The-PFI-hospitals-costing-NHS-2bn-every-year.html0 -
Yes, unfortunately. Some of us might be forced to vote LibDem despite that.IanB2 said:[The LibdDems] have a policy on almost everything
1 -
When Warner is on a 150, I think England are going to be regretting that missed opportunity....0
-
Now Norman has moved on, they may well be right. The Greens don't have too many good prospects and I would hope the LDs are generous enough to give them a free run in many of them. The IOW is another example.rottenborough said:Lewes. Green & LibDem alliance, or split?
https://twitter.com/CllrJohnnyDenis/status/11565723906143273010 -
That's right up there with the theory that the singer from Neutral Milk Hotel traveled back in time, rescued Anne Frank and then married her.TrèsDifficile said:
The "leading academic and author" whose opinion is expressed in the article originated a hoax claiming that Charles Dickens met Fyodor Dostoyevsky..
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2013/jul/10/man-behind-dickens-dostoevsky-hoax0 -
PFI.TrèsDifficile said:
Under PFI, less than 2Gardenwalker said:How many hospitals does £6bn buy?
How many nurses? How many school places? How many council houses? How many bridges? How many traffic easing schemes?
"The biggest PFI deal, considered widely to have been a mistake, was to build new hospitals on the sites of two old ones – the Royal London in Whitechapel, east London, and St Bartholomew’s two miles away.
The rebuild cost £1.1 billion but, under the terms of the PFI, the final cost will be more than £7 billion with the Barts Health NHS Trust making payments until 2049."
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/nhs/11748960/The-PFI-hospitals-costing-NHS-2bn-every-year.html
The Ponzi scheme of public sector financing.0 -
I thought Broad sought reviews on pretty much everything. Disappointing.FrancisUrquhart said:When Warner is on a 150, I think England are going to be regretting that missed opportunity....
0 -
It's mostly all harmless managerial stuff of good sense but minimal appeal.Richard_Nabavi said:
Yes, unfortunately. Some of us might be forced to vote LibDem despite that.IanB2 said:[The LibdDems] have a policy on almost everything
0 -
Warner already cheating....0
-
Your seat couldn't really be won by Labour unless they were on track for ~ 500+ seats iirc. OTOH Mine won't be won by the Tories unless they're on for a big majority - I think in either case the argument to vote Tory to keep Labour out is lessened..Richard_Nabavi said:
Yes, unfortunately. Some of us might be forced to vote LibDem despite that.IanB2 said:[The LibdDems] have a policy on almost everything
I know you're still likely undecided, but assuming Boris' pitch is "no deal" would you be more likely to vote Tory if you were in a key Lab-Tory marginal in order to keep Corbyn out or not ?0 -
I'd have thought that the LibDems would have a much better chance there. Yes, there's a Greenish-type of vote in Lewes itself, and some university-employed voters, but there's also a rural and retiree hinterland where I'd have thought the Greens would be a step too far but the LibDems could do OK.IanB2 said:
Now Norman has moved on, they may well be right. The Greens don't have too many good prospects and I would hope the LDs are generous enough to give them a free run in many of them. The IOW is another example.rottenborough said:Lewes. Green & LibDem alliance, or split?
https://twitter.com/CllrJohnnyDenis/status/11565723906143273010 -
https://twitter.com/Maomentum_/status/1153628285215137792SouthamObserver said:
Controlling the Labour party is the far left's priority. Defeating the Tories is a secondary concern.The_Taxman said:
What I cannot understand about Corbyn is his stubbornness in carrying on and letting the Tories off the hook, when a dynamic fresh Labour leader could wipe the floor with Johnson. Someone else may not have the ideological purity of Corbyn. But they would have the power to make changes that would improve the lives of the many not the few...Sandpit said:
It’s why Labour need to ditch Corbyn ASAP. Many people don’t like Boris Johnson, but consider him by far the lesser of two evils.The_Taxman said:
I do think Boris has a poor reception amoung some women voters i know. One of which called him a "scruffy bastard" on he day he became PM! It made me laugh that reaction! This person has until this year voted Tory in every election. I dont think they will vote Tory again whilst Boris is PM! The LD are going to pick up some serious votes from people like this who cannot stand Johnson and I cannot see Labour voters suddenly voting Tory to replace these losses from the Tory ranks...anothernick said:
Exactly. This will damage Boris with women voters particularly. My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was trying to make the best of a difficult situation, thinks Boris is a disgusting individual not fit to be PM because of his attitude to women. And I doubt she is alone in taking that view.SouthamObserver said:I don't have a problem with an unmarried couple living in Downing Street. Who on earth would? However, a married man in his 50s with at least five kids walking out on his family to live with a woman over 20 years younger than him is going to raise a few eyebrows even in this most liberal of ages. I guess members of the establishment elite have been doing it since time immemorial, though. They get away with stuff others can't.
0 -
I hope they’ve stockpiled enough sandals for all the newly minted LDs in the event of No Deal.IanB2 said:
It's mostly all harmless managerial stuff of good sense but minimal appeal.Richard_Nabavi said:
Yes, unfortunately. Some of us might be forced to vote LibDem despite that.IanB2 said:[The LibdDems] have a policy on almost everything
0 -
Despite the lack of any wicket, England seem to be well on top this morning. We'll want a wicket or two before lunch though to show for it.0
-
And now they review.....one that doesn't look out...0
-
I think it's unlikely that I'd vote Tory in any election where the deliberate policy was to crash us out. I wouldn't want the (hopefully metaphorical) blood on my hands. It would, however, depend on the individual candidate's position, and on the attractions of otherwise of the alternatives.Pulpstar said:Your seat couldn't really be won by Labour unless they were on track for ~ 500+ seats iirc. OTOH Mine won't be won by the Tories unless they're on for a big majority - I think in either case the argument to vote Tory to keep Labour out is lessened..
I know you're still likely undecided, but assuming Boris' pitch is "no deal" would you be more likely to vote Tory if you were in a key Lab-Tory marginal in order to keep Corbyn out or not ?0 -
Nevertheless as an LD myself I can see that they need to be offered more than a clear run in Brighton.Richard_Nabavi said:
I'd have thought that the LibDems would have a much better chance there. Yes, there's a Greenish-type of vote in Lewes itself, and some university-employed voters, but there's also a rural and retiree hinterland where I'd have thought the Greens would be a step too far but the LibDems could do OK.IanB2 said:
Now Norman has moved on, they may well be right. The Greens don't have too many good prospects and I would hope the LDs are generous enough to give them a free run in many of them. The IOW is another example.rottenborough said:Lewes. Green & LibDem alliance, or split?
https://twitter.com/CllrJohnnyDenis/status/11565723906143273010 -
England about as good at reviews as Roger Federer.0
-
Warner gone.0
-
Crowd at Birmingham sound like they've been drinking all day. But is only 11am.
I am old enough to remember cricket being gentile.
0 -
It all seems so crazy and the chasm between leave and remain is deepening by the dayGardenwalker said:How many hospitals does £6bn buy?
How many nurses? How many school places? How many council houses? How many bridges? How many traffic easing schemes?
I read a report that Boris meeting his opponents in Sturgeon and Drakeford plus NI is only serving to entrench his opposition but that they were not going to be responsive to anything he said anyway.
Boris and his advisers see this as a fight against the establishment and we can see on this forum how much anger he is attracting but when considered that anger has always been there over leaving the EU
I have little doubt the Lib Dems will win B & R and a lot will be made of it by the political establishment but the political polling and trends over the next few weeks should reveal if all the anger and negative news on no deal planning and falling currency is actually having an effect or does the public want Boris just to get out on the 31st October and his support continues or even improves.
There is no doubt at all that those who want to remain must be furious with Corbyn who in a large part has aided and abetted the no deal scenario by not backing remain from the beginning
As far as losing a majority I think Boris is well aware that September and October will be very rocky and he is ready to call a GE and challenge Corbyn to vote for it. Indeed I think that many mps may be threatening all kinds of things in the Autumn but are they willing to lose their careers as many would
And before anyone says I am a cheerleader for Boris, he scares the socks off me and as I have repeatedly said on a no deal outcome I resign from the party0 -
-
LOL....it wasn't out....serves the cheating convict right.1
-
Probably detained in Turkey for looking a bit terroristy. Can't be too careful with Brits turning up in hot spots.DecrepitJohnL said:
Maths would also suggest that must be an old article if the 150th anniversary of the Charge of the Light Brigade in 1854 is "approaching". Surely the revisionists have been revised by now. Wasn't one of our number embarking on an MA in military history? Have they reached the Crimea yet?DavidL said:
Perhaps @TGOHF can confirm?IanB2 said:
Maths would suggest the retreat was mostly on foot.DavidL said:
Which is all very well but opening with Burns and Roy, that's really foolhardy.TrèsDifficile said:
"Now, as the 150th anniversary of the infamous charge approaches, historians are revising their accounts of what every schoolchild knows was a famous military disaster.Foxy said:
It is odd that the PM chooses as his catchphrase a description of a famous blunder:Scott_P said:
Forward, the Light Brigade!”
Was there a man dismayed?
Not though the soldier knew
Someone had blundered.
Theirs not to make reply,
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die.
Into the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
Writing in the October edition of BBC History magazine, a leading academic and author says the Light Brigade helped to lay the foundations for the future success of the British Army by establishing an ideal of heroic and "unthinking obedience", with lasting benefits.
..
The charge occurred during the battle of Balaklava in the Crimean War, when 658 British cavalrymen, acting on a misinterpreted order, rode for more than a mile under heavy fire to attack Russian artillery positions, killed the gunners, then retreated, having lost 110 dead, 180 wounded or taken prisoner and 475 horses killed.
Yet the charge helped swing the campaign in favour of the British. A few days later, 10,000 British troops held fast against 40,000 Russians at the battle of Inkerman. In the longer term, the habit of obeying orders - which had not been universal in earlier periods - indicated a new ethos of professionalism in the Army."
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/charge-of-the-light-brigade-was-a-military-success-545886.html0 -
-
So is Aus by the looks of things.FrancisUrquhart said:England about as good at reviews as Roger Federer.
0 -
Veepstakes - if we think it is Biden v Warren, what do we think Veep picks are?
I think Biden wants a WoC, that could have been Kamala before the attack on bussing but I think not afterwards. Abrams was touted by Biden folks before he even entered the race (she denied being asked and seemed to be upset by the presumption, but she would be a good pick). Maybe Julian Castro, but I do think the ticket will have a woman on it.
Warren, I dunno, probs a white dude. I'm thinking Mayor Pete; he's trying to straddle the left v centre and is young and enthusiastic and able to talk god and local areas etc. I think he'd be willing to be Warren's Veep and it could create a "unity" ticket. It would also rake in the cash (Buttigeig hasn't polled or performed well, but he is raising a lot of money).
There is still a part of me that thinks Pence is going to be off the ticket; Trump has shored up the evangelical base, he doesn't need to reassure them anymore. He needs to appeal to white suburban women, and there is a person very close to his heart that would be great at capturing them. I would not be surprised to see Trump / Trump 2020 ticket.0 -
The PM is the political establishment. The political establishment wants a No Deal Brexit.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It all seems so crazy and the chasm between leave and remain is deepening by the dayGardenwalker said:How many hospitals does £6bn buy?
How many nurses? How many school places? How many council houses? How many bridges? How many traffic easing schemes?
I read a report that Boris meeting his opponents in Sturgeon and Drakeford plus NI is only serving to entrench his opposition but that they were not going to be responsive to anything he said anyway.
Boris and his advisers see this as a fight against the establishment and we can see on this forum how much anger he is attracting but when considered that anger has always been there over leaving the EU
I have little doubt the Lib Dems will win B & R and a lot will be made of it by the political establishment but the political polling and trends over the next few weeks should reveal if all the anger and negative news on no deal planning and falling currency is actually having an effect or does the public want Boris just to get out on the 31st October and his support continues or even improves.
There is no doubt at all that those who want to remain must be furious with Corbyn who in a large part has aided and abetted the no deal scenario by not backing remain from the beginning
As far as losing a majority I think Boris is well aware that September and October will be very rocky and he is ready to call a GE and challenge Corbyn to vote for it. Indeed I think that many mps may be threatening all kinds of things in the Autumn but are they willing to lose their careers as many would
And before anyone says I am a cheerleader for Boris, he scares the socks off me and as I have repeatedly said on a no deal outcome I resign from the party
0 -
I am old enough to know you walk when you know you hit it.rottenborough said:Crowd at Birmingham sound like they've been drinking all day. But is only 11am.
I am old enough to remember cricket being gentile.
Warner true to form0 -
Half of the establishment.SouthamObserver said:
The PM is the political establishment. The political establishment wants a No Deal Brexit.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It all seems so crazy and the chasm between leave and remain is deepening by the dayGardenwalker said:How many hospitals does £6bn buy?
How many nurses? How many school places? How many council houses? How many bridges? How many traffic easing schemes?
I read a report that Boris meeting his opponents in Sturgeon and Drakeford plus NI is only serving to entrench his opposition but that they were not going to be responsive to anything he said anyway.
Boris and his advisers see this as a fight against the establishment and we can see on this forum how much anger he is attracting but when considered that anger has always been there over leaving the EU
I have little doubt the Lib Dems will win B & R and a lot will be made of it by the political establishment but the political polling and trends over the next few weeks should reveal if all the anger and negative news on no deal planning and falling currency is actually having an effect or does the public want Boris just to get out on the 31st October and his support continues or even improves.
There is no doubt at all that those who want to remain must be furious with Corbyn who in a large part has aided and abetted the no deal scenario by not backing remain from the beginning
As far as losing a majority I think Boris is well aware that September and October will be very rocky and he is ready to call a GE and challenge Corbyn to vote for it. Indeed I think that many mps may be threatening all kinds of things in the Autumn but are they willing to lose their careers as many would
And before anyone says I am a cheerleader for Boris, he scares the socks off me and as I have repeatedly said on a no deal outcome I resign from the party
The libertarian side with considerable stocks of non-pound assets.0 -
-
-
75% of mps want remain as does the media and vested interests.SouthamObserver said:
The PM is the political establishment. The political establishment wants a No Deal Brexit.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It all seems so crazy and the chasm between leave and remain is deepening by the dayGardenwalker said:How many hospitals does £6bn buy?
How many nurses? How many school places? How many council houses? How many bridges? How many traffic easing schemes?
I read a report that Boris meeting his opponents in Sturgeon and Drakeford plus NI is only serving to entrench his opposition but that they were not going to be responsive to anything he said anyway.
Boris and his advisers see this as a fight against the establishment and we can see on this forum how much anger he is attracting but when considered that anger has always been there over leaving the EU
I have little doubt the Lib Dems will win B & R and a lot will be made of it by the political establishment but the political polling and trends over the next few weeks should reveal if all the anger and negative news on no deal planning and falling currency is actually having an effect or does the public want Boris just to get out on the 31st October and his support continues or even improves.
There is no doubt at all that those who want to remain must be furious with Corbyn who in a large part has aided and abetted the no deal scenario by not backing remain from the beginning
As far as losing a majority I think Boris is well aware that September and October will be very rocky and he is ready to call a GE and challenge Corbyn to vote for it. Indeed I think that many mps may be threatening all kinds of things in the Autumn but are they willing to lose their careers as many would
And before anyone says I am a cheerleader for Boris, he scares the socks off me and as I have repeatedly said on a no deal outcome I resign from the party
That is the establishment but do not misunderstand me, I want a fair deal as per TM deal.
I totally reject no deal0 -
-
While politics nerds like us know that the Greens are essentially Corbynite in policy terms (to the point that I don't get why they split the vote in Labour marginals), I know quite a few Tories who are willing to vote Green but not LibDem. In non-urban seats they see the LibDems as the arch-rivals, but the Greens as harmless anti-Brexit tree-huggers. It'd be interesting to see some polling on this for supporters of the main parties - "Would you consider voting for LibDems? For Greens?" I suspect the Greens may be surprisingly transfer-friendly.Richard_Nabavi said:
I'd have thought that the LibDems would have a much better chance there. Yes, there's a Greenish-type of vote in Lewes itself, and some university-employed voters, but there's also a rural and retiree hinterland where I'd have thought the Greens would be a step too far but the LibDems could do OK.IanB2 said:
Now Norman has moved on, they may well be right. The Greens don't have too many good prospects and I would hope the LDs are generous enough to give them a free run in many of them. The IOW is another example.rottenborough said:Lewes. Green & LibDem alliance, or split?
https://twitter.com/CllrJohnnyDenis/status/11565723906143273010 -
If he is so popular it does not matter then.Scott_P said:0 -
Could either Mr or Mrs Obama be a viable Biden VP candidate, Barrack is held in high regard still and isn't constitutionally barred from being VP aiui. Michelle might also potentially be an option.148grss said:Veepstakes - if we think it is Biden v Warren, what do we think Veep picks are?
I think Biden wants a WoC, that could have been Kamala before the attack on bussing but I think not afterwards. Abrams was touted by Biden folks before he even entered the race (she denied being asked and seemed to be upset by the presumption, but she would be a good pick). Maybe Julian Castro, but I do think the ticket will have a woman on it.
Warren, I dunno, probs a white dude. I'm thinking Mayor Pete; he's trying to straddle the left v centre and is young and enthusiastic and able to talk god and local areas etc. I think he'd be willing to be Warren's Veep and it could create a "unity" ticket. It would also rake in the cash (Buttigeig hasn't polled or performed well, but he is raising a lot of money).
There is still a part of me that thinks Pence is going to be off the ticket; Trump has shored up the evangelical base, he doesn't need to reassure them anymore. He needs to appeal to white suburban women, and there is a person very close to his heart that would be great at capturing them. I would not be surprised to see Trump / Trump 2020 ticket.
A ticket with Obama and Biden on has won before !
As for Warren, she'd want a moderate I assume. Mayor Pete may well make sense.0 -
17 for 20
-
Lewes is interesting and will be a real test of any "progressive alliance". As we all know, it was an LD seat held by Norman Baker from 1997 to 2015 and he only lost it by a thousand votes or so to Maria Caulfield - an interesting counterfactual would have been, had Baker survived, whether he would have stood for the LD leadership against Tim Farron.rottenborough said:Lewes. Green & LibDem alliance, or split?
The local elections for Lewes Council this May were much better for the Greens who won 6 seats and Labour who won 3 and poor for the LDs who lost 4. I don't know the local circumstances or personalities - the Greens stood aside in 2017 but the LDs lost ground to Caulfield but she's far from secure.
The Greens have a point on current polling. - perhaps they could offer to stand aside in Eastbourne.0 -
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I’d argue that the media are pro-Brexit.Big_G_NorthWales said:
75% of mps want remain as does the media and vested interests.SouthamObserver said:
The PM is the political establishment. The political establishment wants a No Deal Brexit.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It all seems so crazy and the chasm between leave and remain is deepening by the dayGardenwalker said:How many hospitals does £6bn buy?
How many nurses? How many school places? How many council houses? How many bridges? How many traffic easing schemes?
I read a report that Boris meeting his opponents in Sturgeon and Drakeford plus NI is only serving to entrench his opposition but that they were not going to be responsive to anything he said anyway.
Boris and his advisers see this as a fight against the establishment and we can see on this forum how much anger he is attracting but when considered that anger has always been there over leaving the EU
I have little doubt the Lib Dems will win B & R and a lot will be made of it by the political establishment but the political polling and trends over the next few weeks should reveal if all the anger and negative news on no deal planning and falling currency is actually having an effect or does the public want Boris just to get out on the 31st October and his support continues or even improves.
There is no doubt at all that those who want to remain must be furious with Corbyn who in a large part has aided and abetted the no deal scenario by not backing remain from the beginning
As far as losing a majority I think Boris is well aware that September and October will be very rocky and he is ready to call a GE and challenge Corbyn to vote for it. Indeed I think that many mps may be threatening all kinds of things in the Autumn but are they willing to lose their careers as many would
And before anyone says I am a cheerleader for Boris, he scares the socks off me and as I have repeatedly said on a no deal outcome I resign from the party
That is the establishment but do not misunderstand me, I want a fair deal as per TM deal.
I totally reject no deal
Only the Guardian and the FT are anti-Brexit.
The BBC (in terms of broadcast output) is neither pro or remain, but because it provides balanced “space” to utter conmen and charlatans, tends to be pro-Brexit in its effect.0 -
Come on Australia, 60 to beat...0
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Neither Obama seem particularly interested in high office again. If Michelle wanted that life she could be winning the primary now, practically unopposed.Pulpstar said:
Could either Mr or Mrs Obama be a viable Biden VP candidate, Barrack is held in high regard still and isn't constitutionally barred from being VP aiui. Michelle might also potentially be an option.148grss said:Veepstakes - if we think it is Biden v Warren, what do we think Veep picks are?
I think Biden wants a WoC, that could have been Kamala before the attack on bussing but I think not afterwards. Abrams was touted by Biden folks before he even entered the race (she denied being asked and seemed to be upset by the presumption, but she would be a good pick). Maybe Julian Castro, but I do think the ticket will have a woman on it.
Warren, I dunno, probs a white dude. I'm thinking Mayor Pete; he's trying to straddle the left v centre and is young and enthusiastic and able to talk god and local areas etc. I think he'd be willing to be Warren's Veep and it could create a "unity" ticket. It would also rake in the cash (Buttigeig hasn't polled or performed well, but he is raising a lot of money).
There is still a part of me that thinks Pence is going to be off the ticket; Trump has shored up the evangelical base, he doesn't need to reassure them anymore. He needs to appeal to white suburban women, and there is a person very close to his heart that would be great at capturing them. I would not be surprised to see Trump / Trump 2020 ticket.
A ticket with Obama and Biden on has won before !
As for Warren, she'd want a moderate I assume. Mayor Pete may well make sense.0 -
Antisemitism alert!rottenborough said:Crowd at Birmingham sound like they've been drinking all day. But is only 11am.
I am old enough to remember cricket being gentile.0 -
Yeah but we're not just talking about spread betting where people can cash out. The Tories are drifting on fixed odds.IanB2 said:
Betting markets like financial ones tend to overshoot then correct. Hence the £ this week (tho it's now sinking again). TSE spotted that the Tories have a greater than 3% chance as the BXP Ltd. balloon deflates, especially with the geography of the seat making it hard to call. Thus punters lumped on until the implied 20% chance seemed too high, and people who backed at long odds cashed inMysticrose said:Conservatives drifting in the betting on B&R.
Might just be today's mood on here
I don't doubt that TSE was right that the implied 3% chance was 'value' but that doesn't mean it will win anything. Personally I think if you took that bet on fixed odds you were chucking money down the drain. We shall see.0 -
Gentile ?rottenborough said:Crowd at Birmingham sound like they've been drinking all day. But is only 11am.
I am old enough to remember cricket being gentile.
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I don't agree but then we come from different viewpointsGardenwalker said:
I’d argue that the media are pro-Brexit.Big_G_NorthWales said:
75% of mps want remain as does the media and vested interests.SouthamObserver said:
The PM is the political establishment. The political establishment wants a No Deal Brexit.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It all seems so crazy and the chasm between leave and remain is deepening by the dayGardenwalker said:How many hospitals does £6bn buy?
How many nurses? How many school places? How many council houses? How many bridges? How many traffic easing schemes?
I read a report that Boris meeting his opponents in Sturgeon and Drakeford plus NI is only serving to entrench his opposition but that they were not going to be responsive to anything he said anyway.
Boris and his advisers see this as a fight against the establishment and we can see on this forum how much anger he is attracting but when considered that anger has always been there over leaving the EU
I have little doubt the Lib Dems will win B & R and a lot will be made of it by the political establishment but the political polling and trends over the next few weeks should reveal if all the anger and negative news on no deal planning and falling currency is actually having an effect or does the public want Boris just to get out on the 31st October and his support continues or even improves.
There is no doubt at all that those who want to remain must be furious with Corbyn who in a large part has aided and abetted the no deal scenario by not backing remain from the beginning
As far as losing a majority I think Boris is well aware that September and October will be very rocky and he is ready to call a GE and challenge Corbyn to vote for it. Indeed I think that many mps may be threatening all kinds of things in the Autumn but are they willing to lose their careers as many would
And before anyone says I am a cheerleader for Boris, he scares the socks off me and as I have repeatedly said on a no deal outcome I resign from the party
That is the establishment but do not misunderstand me, I want a fair deal as per TM deal.
I totally reject no deal
Only the Guardian and the FT are anti-Brexit.
The BBC (in terms of broadcast output) is neither pro or remain, but because it provides balanced “space” to utter conmen and charlatans, tends to be pro-Brexit in its effect.
Though I think you agree with me that Corbyn and his associates are an utter disaster for brexit and labour. To be fair if labour were led by anyone reasonably sensible it would change the political climate in an instant0 -
Does the media include Sun, Mail, and Express? Because they are hiding their Remainery very skilfully.Big_G_NorthWales said:
75% of mps want remain as does the media and vested interests.SouthamObserver said:
The PM is the political establishment. The political establishment wants a No Deal Brexit.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It all seems so crazy and the chasm between leave and remain is deepening by the dayGardenwalker said:How many hospitals does £6bn buy?
How many nurses? How many school places? How many council houses? How many bridges? How many traffic easing schemes?
I read a report that Boris meeting his opponents in Sturgeon and Drakeford plus NI is only serving to entrench his opposition but that they were not going to be responsive to anything he said anyway.
Boris and his advisers see this as a fight against the establishment and we can see on this forum how much anger he is attracting but when considered that anger has always been there over leaving the EU
I have little doubt the Lib Dems will win B & R and a lot will be made of it by the political establishment but the political polling and trends over the next few weeks should reveal if all the anger and negative news on no deal planning and falling currency is actually having an effect or does the public want Boris just to get out on the 31st October and his support continues or even improves.
There is no doubt at all that those who want to remain must be furious with Corbyn who in a large part has aided and abetted the no deal scenario by not backing remain from the beginning
As far as losing a majority I think Boris is well aware that September and October will be very rocky and he is ready to call a GE and challenge Corbyn to vote for it. Indeed I think that many mps may be threatening all kinds of things in the Autumn but are they willing to lose their careers as many would
And before anyone says I am a cheerleader for Boris, he scares the socks off me and as I have repeatedly said on a no deal outcome I resign from the party
That is the establishment but do not misunderstand me, I want a fair deal as per TM deal.
I totally reject no deal0 -
The Greens need to be reasonable.
They should limit their price to less than 10 free runs (someone once identified 6 winnable seats - Lewes was not one of them), and the promise of PR.0 -
Wasn't Bancroft the one saying the Aussies have no fear of Birmingham ?
Well, Paine was.
https://www.cricket.com.au/news/edgbaston-holds-on-fear-for-ashes-rivals-england-australia-first-test-joe-root-tim-paine/2019-08-01
...Paine does not rate Edgbaston anywhere near the top of his list of the most threatening venues around the world.
"I could name you 15," Paine told reporters on Wednesday when asked if there is a more ground intimidating in world cricket.
"England haven't lost here in how long? I don’t even know, I haven't looked at it, it doesn't concern us at all.
"I know a lot of the times when teams come to Australia and they have to go to the Gabba or the WACA it plays on their mind.
"I've seen it work in reverse. It doesn't affect us....0 -
That's bad news. Steve Smith at the crease looking to make 240. Probably get it as well.Big_G_NorthWales said:17 for 2
0 -
Any word from B&R on turnout? I guess it is hard to assess. Little movement today in the betting.0
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To give him his Jew, I think it was just a typo.OnlyLivingBoy said:
Antisemitism alert!rottenborough said:Crowd at Birmingham sound like they've been drinking all day. But is only 11am.
I am old enough to remember cricket being gentile.0 -
This is a new one. A separate SCon party would allow the Conservatives to bring in the DUP on the same terms as a unionist alliance.
https://twitter.com/conhome/status/1156580476590706692?s=210 -
You're wrong about this, and here's whyMysticrose said:
Yeah but we're not just talking about spread betting where people can cash out. The Tories are drifting on fixed odds.IanB2 said:
Betting markets like financial ones tend to overshoot then correct. Hence the £ this week (tho it's now sinking again). TSE spotted that the Tories have a greater than 3% chance as the BXP Ltd. balloon deflates, especially with the geography of the seat making it hard to call. Thus punters lumped on until the implied 20% chance seemed too high, and people who backed at long odds cashed inMysticrose said:Conservatives drifting in the betting on B&R.
Might just be today's mood on here
I don't doubt that TSE was right that the implied 3% chance was 'value' but that doesn't mean it will win anything. Personally I think if you took that bet on fixed odds you were chucking money down the drain. We shall see.
You can "cash out" by laying the Tories at a lower price than your back. Indeed spread betting you're often locked in as Sporting Index often "suspend" the markets.
Betfair has the annoying premium charge but 25-1 would never have been offered at a regular bookies on the Tories so backing on Betfair does allow you to quite literally "cash in".0 -
I'd forgotten Smith. We're doomed.ydoethur said:
That's bad news. Steve Smith at the crease looking to make 240. Probably get it as well.Big_G_NorthWales said:17 for 2
0 -
And some people think my puns are bad:
'The noise is ramping up around Edgbaston, it's a Bears pit out there.'0 -
These days it is the broadcast media who have a predominant role though the mail is successful on linedixiedean said:
Does the media include Sun, Mail, and Express? Because they are hiding their Remainery very skilfully.Big_G_NorthWales said:
75% of mps want remain as does the media and vested interests.SouthamObserver said:
The PM is the political establishment. The political establishment wants a No Deal Brexit.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It all seems so crazy and the chasm between leave and remain is deepening by the dayGardenwalker said:How many hospitals does £6bn buy?
How many nurses? How many school places? How many council houses? How many bridges? How many traffic easing schemes?
I read a report that Boris meeting his opponents in Sturgeon and Drakeford plus NI is only serving to entrench his opposition but that they were not going to be responsive to anything he said anyway.
Boris and his advisers see this as a fight against the establishment and we can see on this forum how much anger he is attracting but when considered that anger has always been there over leaving the EU
I have little doubt the Lib Dems will win B & R and a lot will be made of it by the political establishment but the political polling and trends over the next few weeks should reveal if all the anger and negative news on no deal planning and falling currency is actually having an effect or does the public want Boris just to get out on the 31st October and his support continues or even improves.
There is no doubt at all that those who want to remain must be furious with Corbyn who in a large part has aided and abetted the no deal scenario by not backing remain from the beginning
As far as losing a majority I think Boris is well aware that September and October will be very rocky and he is ready to call a GE and challenge Corbyn to vote for it. Indeed I think that many mps may be threatening all kinds of things in the Autumn but are they willing to lose their careers as many would
And before anyone says I am a cheerleader for Boris, he scares the socks off me and as I have repeatedly said on a no deal outcome I resign from the party
That is the establishment but do not misunderstand me, I want a fair deal as per TM deal.
I totally reject no deal0
This discussion has been closed.