politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Selling time. What passes for Theresa May’s strategy
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EEA is more viable now as immigration from the EU has fallen since the Brexit vote but yes I would now take EEA gladly over No Deal or Revoke but sadly the extremists on both the Leave and Remain sides seem more determined to play Russian roulette with Brexit than seek a compromiseRichard_Tyndall said:
A few days before the referendum a yougov poll had 42% of Leave voters saying they would prefer an EEA Brexit which retained FoM to 45% wanting a Brexit which did not.rpjs said:
If even just over 3.5% of Leave voters were willing to accept a Brexit that included retaining FOM, then there was NO majority against FOM at the 2016 referendum.isam said:
Thank you.Cyclefree said:
You raise a very good point. I think this is worthy of a thread header. How do you think these concerns should be addressed?isam said:
"...what would they do to address the concerns of the majority of 2016 referendum voters?"isam said:There seems to be an assumption that the people who voted Leave didn't know what they were voting for, and didn't really want to leave the EU... if we were to accept that argument, and the establishment managed somehow to wriggle out of actually leaving, what would they do to address the concerns of the majority of 2016 referendum voters?
It seems to me that a "business as usual" / "pretend it never happened" attitude prevails, the formation of Chuka/TIG being the most glaring example.
Anyone?
I think it is impossible to address those concerns whilst we are a member of the EU, because the concerns all stem from FOM, which appears to be non negotiable. But I’d be interested to hear how people who want to ignore the result would deal with them
I do not believe that over 96.35% of Leave voters were voting to end FOM. Do you?
EEA is what we should have been aiming for all along.0 -
This time the vote has two clearly defined outcomes - either we ratify the WA or revoke A50. It could be made binding in law.kjohnw said:
They didn’t listen last time why would they listen again until they get the answer they wantwilliamglenn said:
If, as Hammond said, the country is at an inflection point, wouldn't you rather give that decision than leave it to parliament?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
When you consider that the Hammonds and Gaukes, who have said they will resign both their jobs and the Conservative Party rather than vote for no deal, remained loyal tonight, they and we owe a huge debt of gratitude to those few Tories like Letwin who were brave enough to make a stand.0
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Indeed. And there will even bigger riots on the streets if we crash out in chaos causing multiple bankruptcies and job losses. Perhaps the nutjobs who trashed the Withdrawal Agreement which would implement an orderly Brexit, and gave perfect cover to Labour to go through the lobbies with them, should have considered those two points back in November.kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
Considering Extend beat No Deal by 1 vote, it doesn't seem guaranteed at all that revoke would win.Richard_Tyndall said:
Revoke was not one of the choices tonight. That vote would be very differentHYUFD said:
The Commons also voted for extension beyond May 22nd thus enabling participation in the EU elections.Richard_Nabavi said:Hmm, this result doesn't exactly give a clear direction from parliament which would encourage the EU to give us a bit of leeway. This is not enough to take a catastrophic accidental No Deal off the table.
Plus on tonight's numbers if no other alternative to No Deal hard to see how a majority of MPs do not vote to revoke Art 50 and cancel Brexit0 -
+1. I thought the same so they cancel each other out and it is still Maj of 1 for the Cooper amendment. I wish people would not make false representations about democracy being debased when they are incorrect.TheScreamingEagles said:
Netted off by the vote of the disgraced fraudster Chris Davies.Pulpstar said:What an absolubte fucking disgrace, passed with Fiona Onasunya's vote.
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There is some logic to back that thought process up though.Foxy said:
My favourite piece of polling on FOM is the poll that similtaneously supported FOM for Britons in the EU and opposed it for Europeans in Britain. Sadly not to hand.rpjs said:
Who knows? But we didn't have a referendum on FOM, did we?isam said:
Honestly those kind of comments are just riduculous, because there are Remainers who disagree with FOM but who voted to stay because they work in the city and worry about the risk to their (very high) income.rpjs said:
If even just over 3.5% of Leave voters were willing to accept a Brexit that included retaining FOM, then there was NO majority against FOM at the 2016 referendum.isam said:
Thank you.Cyclefree said:
You raise a very good point. I think this is worthy of a thread header. How do you think these concerns should be addressed?isam said:
"...what would they do to address the concerns of the majority of 2016 referendum voters?"isam said:There seems to be an assumption that the people who voted Leave didn't know what they were voting for, and didn't really want to leave the EU... if we were to accept that argument, and the establishment managed somehow to wriggle out of actually leaving, what would they do to address the concerns of the majority of 2016 referendum voters?
It seems to me that a "business as usual" / "pretend it never happened" attitude prevails, the formation of Chuka/TIG being the most glaring example.
Anyone?
I think it is impossible to address those concerns whilst we are a member of the EU, because the concerns all stem from FOM, which appears to be non negotiable. But I’d be interested to hear how people who want to ignore the result would deal with them
I do not believe that over 96.35% of Leave voters were voting to end FOM. Do you?
You think a referendum on FOM would be won by those who want to keep it?
British people who migrate to other EU countries tend to be affluent than the areas they migrate to.
With immigrants to the UK from other EU countries the opposite is the usual case.0 -
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
Will they rewrite the Horst Wessel song for Jack Renshaw too?isam said:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-447986490 -
I was at a dinner tonight with a group of our running club friends who represented a mix from fervent Remain to pro-Brexit. There was no sign from the Remainers that the time had changed but everyone of those who voted for Brexit said that they were disillusioned with how things had turned out. I wouldn't said they would riot but May has definitely lost their votes - and not gained any support from Remainers in return.kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
Hammond and Gauke I think would abstain on a Revoke v No Deal vote, tonight they voted with the Government and against CooperIanB2 said:When you consider that the Hammonds and Gaukes, who have said they will resign both their jobs and the Conservative Party rather than vote for no deal, remained loyal tonight, they and we owe a huge debt of gratitude to those few Tories like Letwin who were brave enough to make a stand.
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It does, because if it came to a real decision, the considerable payroll vote would split.Philip_Thompson said:
Considering Extend beat No Deal by 1 vote, it doesn't seem guaranteed at all that revoke would win.Richard_Tyndall said:
Revoke was not one of the choices tonight. That vote would be very differentHYUFD said:
The Commons also voted for extension beyond May 22nd thus enabling participation in the EU elections.Richard_Nabavi said:Hmm, this result doesn't exactly give a clear direction from parliament which would encourage the EU to give us a bit of leeway. This is not enough to take a catastrophic accidental No Deal off the table.
Plus on tonight's numbers if no other alternative to No Deal hard to see how a majority of MPs do not vote to revoke Art 50 and cancel Brexit0 -
I have called out ERG and no deal for longer than I can rememberIanB2 said:When you consider that the Hammonds and Gaukes, who have said they will resign both their jobs and the Conservative Party rather than vote for no deal, remained loyal tonight, they and we owe a huge debt of gratitude to those few Tories like Letwin who were brave enough to make a stand.
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My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
Its worse than that.Richard_Nabavi said:
Indeed. And there will even bigger riots on the street if we crash out in chaos causing mulitple bankruptcies and job losses. Perhaps the nutjobs who trashed the Withdrawal Agreement which would implement an orderly Brexit, and gave perfect cover to Labour to go through the lobbies with them, should have considered those two points back in November.kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.
Those same nutjobs want No Deal with Fox and Grayling in charge of trade and transport.0 -
Hammond was seriously impressive on Peston. By far the most talented Tory. Sadly, as a pro-business, eurorealistic moderate he has no chance of winning over the moondogs in the Tory membership.Foxy said:
He is the only adult in the room at Cabinet, which is why he is hated by the Brexiteers.No_Offence_Alan said:
No one complaining about unemployment.Luckyguy1983 said:I struggle to find any redeeming qualities in Phillip Hammond.
No one complaining about inflation.
No one complaining about high interest rates.
Chancellors in the past would have given their eye teeth for that.0 -
Tommy Robinson. A convicted criminal.Foxy said:
Will they rewrite the Horst Wessel song for Jack Renshaw too?isam said:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-447986490 -
O/T, if pb'ers are looking for a book to read, may I recommend All Among the Barley by Melissa Harrison? Absolutely wonderful and with an ending that will make you reflect once you have finished.0
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I think it would, but with a majority in single or low double figures.Philip_Thompson said:
Considering Extend beat No Deal by 1 vote, it doesn't seem guaranteed at all that revoke would win.Richard_Tyndall said:
Revoke was not one of the choices tonight. That vote would be very differentHYUFD said:
The Commons also voted for extension beyond May 22nd thus enabling participation in the EU elections.Richard_Nabavi said:Hmm, this result doesn't exactly give a clear direction from parliament which would encourage the EU to give us a bit of leeway. This is not enough to take a catastrophic accidental No Deal off the table.
Plus on tonight's numbers if no other alternative to No Deal hard to see how a majority of MPs do not vote to revoke Art 50 and cancel Brexit0 -
I don’t see what he’s got to do with it to be honestFoxy said:
Will they rewrite the Horst Wessel song for Jack Renshaw too?isam said:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-447986490 -
Total rubbish. Labour will mop up in the council elections and probably win the North of Tyne city region mayoralty.kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
I disagree there is a real appetite out there in the real world to walk away from the negotiationsRichard_Nabavi said:
Indeed. And there will even bigger riots on the streets if we crash out in chaos causing multiple bankruptcies and job losses. Perhaps the nutjobs who trashed the Withdrawal Agreement which would implement an orderly Brexit, and gave perfect cover to Labour to go through the lobbies with them, should have considered those two points back in November.kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.
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Hammond is an interventionist. Would be more at home in New Labour._Anazina_ said:
Hammond was seriously impressive on Peston. By far the most talented Tory. Sadly, as a pro-business, eurorealistic moderate he has no chance of winning over the moondogs in the Tory membership.Foxy said:
He is the only adult in the room at Cabinet, which is why he is hated by the Brexiteers.No_Offence_Alan said:
No one complaining about unemployment.Luckyguy1983 said:I struggle to find any redeeming qualities in Phillip Hammond.
No one complaining about inflation.
No one complaining about high interest rates.
Chancellors in the past would have given their eye teeth for that.0 -
Perhaps what we need is a series of indicative riots to determine the way forward.Richard_Nabavi said:
Indeed. And there will even bigger riots on the street if we crash out in chaos causing mulitple bankruptcies and job losses. Perhaps the nutjobs who trashed the Withdrawal Agreement which would implement an orderly Brexit, and gave perfect cover to Labour to go through the lobbies with them, should have considered those two points back in November.kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.
First up - Ken Clarke will be organising a drunken brawl in Belgravia, in favour of a permanent Customs Union.
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True. Its efficacy depends heavily on the oft repeated assertion (most frequently from Brexiters) that the EU is actually afraid of no deal.Richard_Nabavi said:
The problem is the transmission mechanism between parliament deciding that and it actually happening, which isn't clear. Cooper's bill provides a mechanism, which is the important missing bit of the jigsaw, but it looks a bit flaky (and still has to pass the Lords).IanB2 said:
If it came to a real choice between extension and no deal, no deal would be defeated comprehensively.Richard_Nabavi said:Hmm, this result doesn't exactly give a clear direction from parliament which would encourage the EU to give us a bit of leeway. This is not enough to take a catastrophic accidental No Deal off the table.
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The sort of person who hero worships Farage and Yaxley-Lennon.isam said:
I don’t see what he’s got to do with it to be honestFoxy said:
Will they rewrite the Horst Wessel song for Jack Renshaw too?isam said:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-44798649
Be careful of the company you keep isam.0 -
Where do you live?Gallowgate said:
Total rubbish. Labour will mop up in the council elections and probably win the North of Tyne city region mayoralty.kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
Mind you if Article 50 is revoked and many Brexit supporting Tory members resign their membership in protest. The unlikely candidate might be in with a chance. Personally, I think he is too unpopular in the country he has dire polling IIRC._Anazina_ said:
Hammond was seriously impressive on Peston. By far the most talented Tory. Sadly, as a pro-business, eurorealistic moderate he has no chance of winning over the moondogs in the Tory membership.Foxy said:
He is the only adult in the room at Cabinet, which is why he is hated by the Brexiteers.No_Offence_Alan said:
No one complaining about unemployment.Luckyguy1983 said:I struggle to find any redeeming qualities in Phillip Hammond.
No one complaining about inflation.
No one complaining about high interest rates.
Chancellors in the past would have given their eye teeth for that.0 -
A lot of people just want it to end so normal life can continue. They'd be equally happy with revocation.kjohnw said:
I disagree there is a real appetite out there in the real world to walk away from the negotiationsRichard_Nabavi said:
Indeed. And there will even bigger riots on the streets if we crash out in chaos causing multiple bankruptcies and job losses. Perhaps the nutjobs who trashed the Withdrawal Agreement which would implement an orderly Brexit, and gave perfect cover to Labour to go through the lobbies with them, should have considered those two points back in November.kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.
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Newcastle upon Tyne.kjohnw said:
Where do you live?Gallowgate said:
Total rubbish. Labour will mop up in the council elections and probably win the North of Tyne city region mayoralty.kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
Yes of course there is. But it would evaporate within a day of contact with the reality of walking away from the negotiations.kjohnw said:
I disagree there is a real appetite out there in the real world to walk away from the negotiations0 -
Lp
If last year's pattern holds, of the Conservatives doing well in leave areas, and poorly in Remain areas, that will limit Conservative losses, due to the nature of the seats being contested.Gallowgate said:
Total rubbish. Labour will mop up in the council elections and probably win the North of Tyne city region mayoralty.kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
They certainly don't want No Deal, and would try hard to avoid it, but not at any price.IanB2 said:
True. Its efficacy depends heavily on the oft repeated assertion (most frequently from Brexiters) that the EU is actually afraid of no deal.Richard_Nabavi said:
The problem is the transmission mechanism between parliament deciding that and it actually happening, which isn't clear. Cooper's bill provides a mechanism, which is the important missing bit of the jigsaw, but it looks a bit flaky (and still has to pass the Lords).IanB2 said:
If it came to a real choice between extension and no deal, no deal would be defeated comprehensively.Richard_Nabavi said:Hmm, this result doesn't exactly give a clear direction from parliament which would encourage the EU to give us a bit of leeway. This is not enough to take a catastrophic accidental No Deal off the table.
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Can it prevent the bill from becoming law thoughBig_G_NorthWales said:
I heard a report that it is highly likely the lords brexiteers will fillbusterGallowgate said:So will the Lords filibuster this?
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Like the person who just secured Cooper's bill passing......rottenborough said:
Tommy Robinson. A convicted criminal.Foxy said:
Will they rewrite the Horst Wessel song for Jack Renshaw too?isam said:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-447986490 -
Well this evening's vote commits the PM to do something she was going to anyway, but the deciding vote being an MP that really should be in prison (& Certainly wouldn't be at liberty to work in any other workplace) is utterly contemptible.0
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Why? Who else are leavers going to vote for?kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
She's probably over the 10% recall threshold already too - terrible bit of drafting, that. OTOH, Remain is a vote short because of Newport W which will probably change tomorrow (though 75 does look big for the Tories, and 10 ludicrously short for UKIP).Pulpstar said:Well this evening's vote commits the PM to do something she was going to anyway, but the deciding vote being an MP that really should be in prison (& Certainly wouldn't be at liberty to work in any other workplace) is utterly contemptible.
0 -
I can’t speak for the north east but here in north west there is anger at the betrayal of brexit and labour are seen trying to block brexitGallowgate said:
Newcastle upon Tyne.kjohnw said:
Where do you live?Gallowgate said:
Total rubbish. Labour will mop up in the council elections and probably win the North of Tyne city region mayoralty.kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
Interestingly, tonight's vote exactly mirrors polling on extending or revoking v leaving without a deal.IanB2 said:
A lot of people just want it to end so normal life can continue. They'd be equally happy with revocation.kjohnw said:
I disagree there is a real appetite out there in the real world to walk away from the negotiationsRichard_Nabavi said:
Indeed. And there will even bigger riots on the streets if we crash out in chaos causing multiple bankruptcies and job losses. Perhaps the nutjobs who trashed the Withdrawal Agreement which would implement an orderly Brexit, and gave perfect cover to Labour to go through the lobbies with them, should have considered those two points back in November.kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
Chance of an "indicative vote" in Theresa May raised at 1922 tonight according to Newnight?0
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Hopefully the brexit partybrokenwheel said:
Why? Who else are leavers going to vote for?kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
I’d disagree with that.IanB2 said:
A lot of people just want it to end so normal life can continue. They'd be equally happy with revocation.kjohnw said:
I disagree there is a real appetite out there in the real world to walk away from the negotiationsRichard_Nabavi said:
Indeed. And there will even bigger riots on the streets if we crash out in chaos causing multiple bankruptcies and job losses. Perhaps the nutjobs who trashed the Withdrawal Agreement which would implement an orderly Brexit, and gave perfect cover to Labour to go through the lobbies with them, should have considered those two points back in November.kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.
Suspect turnout will vary a lot in local elections. Strong remain and particularly leave areas might be up but Kippers probably won’t be contesting many seats. Stay at home party might have a landslide.0 -
There’s some County Durham seats that have been trending Tory for some time but there’s no chance the urban seats in cities on Tyneside, Wearside, or the other major Northern cities are going to suddenly vote Tory. No chance.0
-
Why is it a disgrace?Pulpstar said:What an absolubte fucking disgrace, passed with Fiona Onasunya's vote.
0 -
What about the Brexit PartyGallowgate said:There’s some County Durham seats that have been trending Tory for some time but there’s no chance the urban seats in cities on Tyneside, Wearside, or the other major Northern cities are going to suddenly vote Tory. No chance.
0 -
No, but they may be able to delay it.kjohnw said:
Can it prevent the bill from becoming law thoughBig_G_NorthWales said:
I heard a report that it is highly likely the lords brexiteers will fillbusterGallowgate said:So will the Lords filibuster this?
0 -
She should be in jail at the moment, she's serving a sentence.bigjohnowls said:
Why is it a disgrace?Pulpstar said:What an absolubte fucking disgrace, passed with Fiona Onasunya's vote.
0 -
By how long ?Sean_F said:
No, but they may be able to delay it.kjohnw said:
Can it prevent the bill from becoming law thoughBig_G_NorthWales said:
I heard a report that it is highly likely the lords brexiteers will fillbusterGallowgate said:So will the Lords filibuster this?
0 -
Charles Moore thinks there's a been conspiracy between Labour and the Tories since the referendum to frustrate Brexit: "What really matters to them is that Brexit should be drained of all power."
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/04/theresa-may-and-jeremy-corbyn-both-want-to-frustrate-brexit/0 -
They aren’t standing in the local elections.kjohnw said:
Hopefully the brexit partybrokenwheel said:
Why? Who else are leavers going to vote for?kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
Er because she's a criminal?bigjohnowls said:
Why is it a disgrace?Pulpstar said:What an absolubte fucking disgrace, passed with Fiona Onasunya's vote.
0 -
The EU should just set the extension period to 1000 years.
The deadline existed to get the deal made, the deal is made. The British can leave whenever they want, with or without it. The EU don't particularly want them to leave, but they also don't want to stop them. The deadlines don't force anyone to decide anything, because everyone knows they can be extended.
So why have a deadline?0 -
Classic example of erroneously diagnosing conspiracy rather than incompetence.williamglenn said:Charles Moore thinks there's a been conspiracy between Labour and the Tories since the referendum to frustrate Brexit: "What really matters to them is that Brexit should be drained of all power."
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/04/theresa-may-and-jeremy-corbyn-both-want-to-frustrate-brexit/0 -
Maybe some of the small town seats but no chance that great swathes of Greater Manchester and Merseyside are going any colour but red.kjohnw said:
I can’t speak for the north east but here in north west there is anger at the betrayal of brexit and labour are seen trying to block brexitGallowgate said:
Newcastle upon Tyne.kjohnw said:
Where do you live?Gallowgate said:
Total rubbish. Labour will mop up in the council elections and probably win the North of Tyne city region mayoralty.kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
I was talking about a general election and MPsTGOHF said:
They aren’t standing in the local elections.kjohnw said:
Hopefully the brexit partybrokenwheel said:
Why? Who else are leavers going to vote for?kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
You mean Farage’s “I want to keep my MEP expenses” Party? That couldn’t be bothered to contest Newport West? Sorry to disappoint but Farage ain’t saving you.kjohnw said:
Hopefully the brexit partybrokenwheel said:
Why? Who else are leavers going to vote for?kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
It's becoming increasingly hard to see the Tories doing well at the locals, due to the shambles itself rather than any Leave/Remain aspect. The few anecdotal reports I've seen or heard from Tory canvassers suggest heavy weather. It'll be interesting to see the next VI polls - and these are national; in local elections people tend more left anyway and there isn't the fear-of-Corbyn factor to shore up the Tory vote.Sean_F said:Lp
If last year's pattern holds, of the Conservatives doing well in leave areas, and poorly in Remain areas, that will limit Conservative losses, due to the nature of the seats being contested.Gallowgate said:
Total rubbish. Labour will mop up in the council elections and probably win the North of Tyne city region mayoralty.kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
Even votes for the Brexit Party on a scale greater than UKIP in their ascendancy is not going to erode 60%+ majorities.kjohnw said:
What about the Brexit PartyGallowgate said:There’s some County Durham seats that have been trending Tory for some time but there’s no chance the urban seats in cities on Tyneside, Wearside, or the other major Northern cities are going to suddenly vote Tory. No chance.
0 -
But she isn't presumably 60 days from 29th January is up, and hasn't been recalled either yet.Pulpstar said:
She should be in jail at the moment, she's serving a sentence.bigjohnowls said:
Why is it a disgrace?Pulpstar said:What an absolubte fucking disgrace, passed with Fiona Onasunya's vote.
0 -
Farage just wants a platform to justify being interviewed, and in case he needs it to book another stint on the MEP gravy train. I don't think he has much intention of putting in the graft needed to build another genuine national political party. Nor give anyone else the control to do so.brokenwheel said:
You mean Farage’s “I want to keep my MEP expenses” Party? That couldn’t be bothered to contest Newport West? Sorry to disappoint but Farage ain’t saving you.kjohnw said:
Hopefully the brexit partybrokenwheel said:
Why? Who else are leavers going to vote for?kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.
0 -
When does the Onasanya petition close?0
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In betting news, the UKIP price in Newport West is crazily short.0
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That sounds reasonable.edmundintokyo said:The EU should just set the extension period to 1000 years.
The deadline existed to get the deal made, the deal is made. The British can leave whenever they want, with or without it. The EU don't particularly want them to leave, but they also don't want to stop them. The deadlines don't force anyone to decide anything, because everyone knows they can be extended.
So why have a deadline?0 -
Arent her 60 days up?GIN1138 said:
Er because she's a criminal?bigjohnowls said:
Why is it a disgrace?Pulpstar said:What an absolubte fucking disgrace, passed with Fiona Onasunya's vote.
0 -
First of May.Danny565 said:When does the Onasanya petition close?
0 -
Thornberry and McDonnell have both been in hospital today, and missed votes, certainly earlier in the evening. There are always "what ifs" with close votes.0
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When she was convicted she should have resigned her seat.bigjohnowls said:
Arent her 60 days up?GIN1138 said:
Er because she's a criminal?bigjohnowls said:
Why is it a disgrace?Pulpstar said:What an absolubte fucking disgrace, passed with Fiona Onasunya's vote.
0 -
I don't think someone should be able to vote whilst they are serving a sentence ! Just because someone isn't in prison (Which is a cost/overcrowding issue) does not mean they should have complete liberty.bigjohnowls said:
Aren't her 60 days up?GIN1138 said:
Er because she's a criminal?bigjohnowls said:
Why is it a disgrace?Pulpstar said:What an absolubte fucking disgrace, passed with Fiona Onasunya's vote.
0 -
I'll just have to pretend Paul Flynn voted against for the Cooper amendment this evening, he was a good MP.0
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The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government0
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I always thought when people were on tag they had to abide by curfews and needed to be home in the evening?Pulpstar said:
I don't think someone should be able to vote whilst they are serving a sentence ! Just because someone isn't in prison (Which is a cost/overcrowding issue) does not mean they should have complete liberty.bigjohnowls said:
Aren't her 60 days up?GIN1138 said:
Er because she's a criminal?bigjohnowls said:
Why is it a disgrace?Pulpstar said:What an absolubte fucking disgrace, passed with Fiona Onasunya's vote.
0 -
1st law to be passed when this shitshow is sorted - MPs currently serving a sentence should not be able to vote in parliament.0
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You need a change of law then.Pulpstar said:
I don't think someone should be able to vote whilst they are serving a sentence ! Just because someone isn't in prison (Which is a cost/overcrowding issue) does not mean they should have complete liberty.bigjohnowls said:
Aren't her 60 days up?GIN1138 said:
Er because she's a criminal?bigjohnowls said:
Why is it a disgrace?Pulpstar said:What an absolubte fucking disgrace, passed with Fiona Onasunya's vote.
Aren't we talking about not jailing anyone with less than a 12 month sentence
0 -
Someone’s rattled.Pulpstar said:1st law to be passed when this shitshow is sorted - MPs currently serving a sentence should not be able to vote in parliament.
0 -
Maybe she's on the run.GIN1138 said:
I always thought when people were on tag they had to abide by curfews and needed to be home in the evening?Pulpstar said:
I don't think someone should be able to vote whilst they are serving a sentence ! Just because someone isn't in prison (Which is a cost/overcrowding issue) does not mean they should have complete liberty.bigjohnowls said:
Aren't her 60 days up?GIN1138 said:
Er because she's a criminal?bigjohnowls said:
Why is it a disgrace?Pulpstar said:What an absolubte fucking disgrace, passed with Fiona Onasunya's vote.
0 -
Possibility of an "indicative vote" in Theresa May was raised at 1922 committee tonight,kjohnw said:The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government
Will be interesting to see whether that gets anywhere tomorrow.0 -
Guardian thinks the Lords debate will be Friday or Monday, not tomorrow,0
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QEDTGOHF said:
Hammond is an interventionist. Would be more at home in New Labour._Anazina_ said:
Hammond was seriously impressive on Peston. By far the most talented Tory. Sadly, as a pro-business, eurorealistic moderate he has no chance of winning over the moondogs in the Tory membership.Foxy said:
He is the only adult in the room at Cabinet, which is why he is hated by the Brexiteers.No_Offence_Alan said:
No one complaining about unemployment.Luckyguy1983 said:I struggle to find any redeeming qualities in Phillip Hammond.
No one complaining about inflation.
No one complaining about high interest rates.
Chancellors in the past would have given their eye teeth for that.0 -
MPs serving a sentence shouldn't be able to vote ? Is that really such a controversial opinion ?Gallowgate said:
Someone’s rattled.Pulpstar said:1st law to be passed when this shitshow is sorted - MPs currently serving a sentence should not be able to vote in parliament.
0 -
And what does that do to help ?kjohnw said:The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government
0 -
Ushers in a better leader who will implement a decent brexitanother_richard said:
And what does that do to help ?kjohnw said:The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government
0 -
0
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Makes a General Election possible for the Tories politically.another_richard said:
And what does that do to help ?kjohnw said:The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government
0 -
Who you backing?kjohnw said:
Ushers in a better leader who will implement a decent brexitanother_richard said:
And what does that do to help ?kjohnw said:The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government
0 -
Hmm. Well the rules are what they are currently, and criminals can vote. I’d rather the misanthropic bigots from the DUP and the hard Tory right didn’t have the vote either, but they do!Pulpstar said:1st law to be passed when this shitshow is sorted - MPs currently serving a sentence should not be able to vote in parliament.
0 -
Not really, but as they currently are allowed to vote one can hardly complain when they do!Pulpstar said:
MPs serving a sentence shouldn't be able to vote ? Is that really such a controversial opinion ?Gallowgate said:
Someone’s rattled.Pulpstar said:1st law to be passed when this shitshow is sorted - MPs currently serving a sentence should not be able to vote in parliament.
0 -
The idea is that by doing so, they cause a vacuum of power which results in No Deal by Default.another_richard said:
And what does that do to help ?kjohnw said:The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government
The problem with the idea is twomany-fold:
1. Mrs May is still in a position to request an extension until a new Prime Minister is appointed by the Queen. She would, I'm sure, ask for a 12 or 18 month extension in that circumstance.
2. There is the very real possibility of a "government of National Unity" coming out of the Commons before a General Election. Such a government would implement a far softer Brexit than Mrs May's deal.
3. Even if a General Election were to flow from the VoNC, who lead the Conservative Party?
4. And even assume someone could be put in place who was suitably Brexity, how do you ensure that the Conservative MPs that are returned are in favour of your kind of deal?
5. And even if you can get that sorted, what happens if the election results in a Hung Parliament?0 -
Anyone but the two clowns running the tories and labour 😁bigjohnowls said:
Who you backing?kjohnw said:
Ushers in a better leader who will implement a decent brexitanother_richard said:
And what does that do to help ?kjohnw said:The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government
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So what is this 'decent brexit' and how would it be implemented ?kjohnw said:
Ushers in a better leader who will implement a decent brexitanother_richard said:
And what does that do to help ?kjohnw said:The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government
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Your right we are well and truly screwed . Maybe emigration is the way forwardsrcs1000 said:
The idea is that by doing so, they cause a vacuum of power which results in No Deal by Default.another_richard said:
And what does that do to help ?kjohnw said:The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government
The problem with the idea is twomany-fold:
1. Mrs May is still in a position to request an extension until a new Prime Minister is appointed by the Queen. She would, I'm sure, ask for a 12 or 18 month extension in that circumstance.
2. There is the very real possibility of a "government of National Unity" coming out of the Commons before a General Election. Such a government would implement a far softer Brexit than Mrs May's deal.
3. Even if a General Election were to flow from the VoNC, who lead the Conservative Party?
4. And even assume someone could be put in place who was suitably Brexity, how do you ensure that the Conservative MPs that are returned are in favour of your kind of deal?
5. And even if you can get that sorted, what happens if the election results in a Hung Parliament?
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What a shame if Zac Goldsmith were to lose his seat. (Hopefully it could be mirrored by a win for the Blues in Don Valley.)Sean_F said:Lp
If last year's pattern holds, of the Conservatives doing well in leave areas, and poorly in Remain areas, that will limit Conservative losses, due to the nature of the seats being contested.Gallowgate said:
Total rubbish. Labour will mop up in the council elections and probably win the North of Tyne city region mayoralty.kjohnw said:
My son works in network rail , solid labour voters . All the lads there are all saying they will never vote labour again for the way the party has betrayed brexit. I think northern labour MPs are doomednico67 said:
Take a chill pill ! I’m a Remainer and just want an orderly exit and a deal . Blame the ERG nutjobs , you’d have had Brexit by now if it wasn’t for them .kjohnw said:
The people voted to leave . Remain lost . They have not enacted the people’s wishes . In a democracy the majority wins . Leave won . To subvert that vote is democratic betrayal . There will be riots on the streets if brexit is betrayedFoxy said:
On the contrary, our politicians are doing a marvelous job at representing the British public in all its contradictory and irreconcilable beliefs. Westminster has taken back control. Isn't that what the people wanted?kjohnw said:
The anger in this country is rising , Parliament and MPs are seen as the blockers of brexit and out of touch with ordinary people . They want us to think again because they think we gave the wrong answer last time . They are destroying our democracyPhilip_Thompson said:
No 23/6/17 was the night it happened. When May's incompetence ensured the saboteurs won and the Remainers had a majority in Parliament.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Tonight is the night ERG have been reduced to a rump of bitter losersIanB2 said:ERG pro-filibuster amendment falls 105 v 509
Don't expect this Parliament to have the last word though.0 -
Nobody you can name.kjohnw said:
Anyone but the two clowns running the tories and labour 😁bigjohnowls said:
Who you backing?kjohnw said:
Ushers in a better leader who will implement a decent brexitanother_richard said:
And what does that do to help ?kjohnw said:The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government
Is it a secret?0 -
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There was nothing particularly wrong with Mrs May's proposal. It would likely have been followed by a close, but sub-EEA, relationship between the UK and the EU.another_richard said:
So what is this 'decent brexit' and how would it be implemented ?kjohnw said:
Ushers in a better leader who will implement a decent brexitanother_richard said:
And what does that do to help ?kjohnw said:The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government
Over time, the relationship would have gradually loosened, but the divorce would have been a relatively friendly one.0 -
But it doesn't sort out the problems within the Conservative party unless the new leader commits to deselecting all MPs who would oppose the official policy.Pulpstar said:
Makes a General Election possible for the Tories politically.another_richard said:
And what does that do to help ?kjohnw said:The best option now is for the tories to vonc TM either through rule change in the 22 or failing that collapse the government
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This discussion has been closed.