politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » CNN reveals document on Russian tower deal signed by Trump con
Options
Comments
-
No they aren't. They, the RoI and the UK are supporting the backstop.MarqueeMark said:
I'm so sorry that reality has splattered your pristine garments.....matt said:
Welcome to leaver world, where covering oneself in shit is fine provided that third parties get hit by the odd splatter.MarqueeMark said:
....and the UK leaving with No Deal is going to push all of them into recession.CarlottaVance said:
Cheer up! The Belgian PM has just resigned, the French Police are about to strike and German economic confidence is at its lowest in over a decade. Everything’s going so well.....OldKingCole said:The two major Anglophone countries are deep in the brown stuff due to incompetent Governments. Yet both came to power as a result of an acknowleged democratic process.
Makes one furiously to think! Why have the processes in each country worked so badly?
Merry Christmas, Europe.
The EU will pick up your dry-cleaning bill. After all, they are the ones flingng the backstop shit.0 -
Here's an idea Trump and Ivanka could get behind...
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/dec/19/youtube-host-faces-charges-for-criticising-thai-princesss-miss-universe-dress0 -
Indedd we agreed it a year ago and are now trying to break our word.TOPPING said:
No they aren't. They, the RoI and the UK are supporting the backstop.MarqueeMark said:
I'm so sorry that reality has splattered your pristine garments.....matt said:
Welcome to leaver world, where covering oneself in shit is fine provided that third parties get hit by the odd splatter.MarqueeMark said:
....and the UK leaving with No Deal is going to push all of them into recession.CarlottaVance said:
Cheer up! The Belgian PM has just resigned, the French Police are about to strike and German economic confidence is at its lowest in over a decade. Everything’s going so well.....OldKingCole said:The two major Anglophone countries are deep in the brown stuff due to incompetent Governments. Yet both came to power as a result of an acknowleged democratic process.
Makes one furiously to think! Why have the processes in each country worked so badly?
Merry Christmas, Europe.
The EU will pick up your dry-cleaning bill. After all, they are the ones flingng the backstop shit.0 -
The Prime Minister has now set a date for the debate – week commencing 7 January, with the meaningful vote the next week. But time is short and the Government needs to get over the meaningful vote hurdle to unlock possible ways forward.
The process could look something like the following:
Step 1: Have the meaningful vote – but if there is nothing new on the table, treat as a resumed debate. The Prime Minister could even use another of our suggested tactics and make it a free vote. Assuming the motion is defeated, make clear the immediate next step will be…
Step 2: Allow MPs to have indicative votes on another way forward. This would be to see whether there is any majority for a way forward. At the moment, it looks like no option commands a majority.
If that is right, the Prime Minister’s next gambit could be to try a cross-the-floor tactic designed to unite all those MPs who say they “want to respect the referendum” minus those who cannot accept her backstop.
The risk to her is that this could trigger a confidence motion where the DUP would back the Opposition, so she would need to be confident that her way forward could command cross-party support.
Step 3: Put the Withdrawal Agreement back to MPs – but decouple it from the political declaration. Assuming the indicative votes indicate no majority for a referendum and no majority for a no deal exit, the Prime Minister can take it that there are the votes for an orderly Brexit.
Her deal is the only one on offer that can guarantee an orderly Brexit. She could say to MPs that they need to pass that part of her deal (and the Withdrawal Agreement Bill) to ensure a transition and an opening of negotiations on the future relationship.
She could then make a virtue of the vagueness of the political declaration – the 27 pages on non-legally binding text on the future framework. It encompasses a range of relationships and where the EU has repeatedly made clear that others are possible if UK red lines change.
https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/blog/how-prime-minister-could-break-stalemate-brexit
Jill Rutter, contemporary of May's and Civil Servant sidelined by Brown's bully boys in the Treasury....0 -
Not as ugly as a split infinitive though...Morris_Dancer said:Good morning, everyone.
I see Chrome has decided to unilaterally uglify its tabs again.
😖0 -
Interesting:
https://twitter.com/ZoeTillman/status/1075151045146357761
The company appears to be Rosneft.0 -
You forgot about May’s bully boys that tried to get a civil servant sacked for breaking the civil service impartiality code.CarlottaVance said:The Prime Minister has now set a date for the debate – week commencing 7 January, with the meaningful vote the next week. But time is short and the Government needs to get over the meaningful vote hurdle to unlock possible ways forward.
The process could look something like the following:
Step 1: Have the meaningful vote – but if there is nothing new on the table, treat as a resumed debate. The Prime Minister could even use another of our suggested tactics and make it a free vote. Assuming the motion is defeated, make clear the immediate next step will be…
Step 2: Allow MPs to have indicative votes on another way forward. This would be to see whether there is any majority for a way forward. At the moment, it looks like no option commands a majority.
If that is right, the Prime Minister’s next gambit could be to try a cross-the-floor tactic designed to unite all those MPs who say they “want to respect the referendum” minus those who cannot accept her backstop.
The risk to her is that this could trigger a confidence motion where the DUP would back the Opposition, so she would need to be confident that her way forward could command cross-party support.
Step 3: Put the Withdrawal Agreement back to MPs – but decouple it from the political declaration. Assuming the indicative votes indicate no majority for a referendum and no majority for a no deal exit, the Prime Minister can take it that there are the votes for an orderly Brexit.
Her deal is the only one on offer that can guarantee an orderly Brexit. She could say to MPs that they need to pass that part of her deal (and the Withdrawal Agreement Bill) to ensure a transition and an opening of negotiations on the future relationship.
She could then make a virtue of the vagueness of the political declaration – the 27 pages on non-legally binding text on the future framework. It encompasses a range of relationships and where the EU has repeatedly made clear that others are possible if UK red lines change.
https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/blog/how-prime-minister-could-break-stalemate-brexit
Jill Rutter, contemporary of May's and Civil Servant sidelined by Brown's bully boys in the Treasury....
This civil servant’s crime? Tweeting Ed Balls good luck on Strictly.0 -
There are so many investigations into Donald Trump that only the keenest devotees can keep track of them. At the end of the process the public will generally conclude that he was a liar (because he was). The more difficult question is whether they will care. He will retain enough support to be a huge headache for the Republican party.0
-
The wording of the text doesn’t match what was agreed in December last yearFoxy said:
Indedd we agreed it a year ago and are now trying to break our word.TOPPING said:
No they aren't. They, the RoI and the UK are supporting the backstop.MarqueeMark said:
I'm so sorry that reality has splattered your pristine garments.....matt said:
Welcome to leaver world, where covering oneself in shit is fine provided that third parties get hit by the odd splatter.MarqueeMark said:
....and the UK leaving with No Deal is going to push all of them into recession.CarlottaVance said:
Cheer up! The Belgian PM has just resigned, the French Police are about to strike and German economic confidence is at its lowest in over a decade. Everything’s going so well.....OldKingCole said:The two major Anglophone countries are deep in the brown stuff due to incompetent Governments. Yet both came to power as a result of an acknowleged democratic process.
Makes one furiously to think! Why have the processes in each country worked so badly?
Merry Christmas, Europe.
The EU will pick up your dry-cleaning bill. After all, they are the ones flingng the backstop shit.
Also, to be fair, May is not “trying to break her word”. It’s debatable whether Parliament actually needs to ratify the treaty, but if it does (either politically or legally) then all May has committed to is to present the treaty to Parliament for their approval
0 -
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
0 -
Mr. Charles, I shall endeavour to never again do that.0
-
Personally, I think the Backstop the best feature of the Deal. It is particularly good for NI as it maintains the majority of the benefits of EU membership at no cost.Charles said:
The wording of the text doesn’t match what was agreed in December last yearFoxy said:
Indedd we agreed it a year ago and are now trying to break our word.TOPPING said:
No they aren't. They, the RoI and the UK are supporting the backstop.MarqueeMark said:
I'm so sorry that reality has splattered your pristine garments.....matt said:
Welcome to leaver world, where covering oneself in shit is fine provided that third parties get hit by the odd splatter.MarqueeMark said:
....and the UK leaving with No Deal is going to push all of them into recession.CarlottaVance said:
Cheer up! The Belgian PM has just resigned, the French Police are about to strike and German economic confidence is at its lowest in over a decade. Everything’s going so well.....OldKingCole said:The two major Anglophone countries are deep in the brown stuff due to incompetent Governments. Yet both came to power as a result of an acknowleged democratic process.
Makes one furiously to think! Why have the processes in each country worked so badly?
Merry Christmas, Europe.
The EU will pick up your dry-cleaning bill. After all, they are the ones flingng the backstop shit.
Also, to be fair, May is not “trying to break her word”. It’s debatable whether Parliament actually needs to ratify the treaty, but if it does (either politically or legally) then all May has committed to is to present the treaty to Parliament for their approval0 -
Kerguelen is aFrench dependancy, not sure he would get a visa. Could I suggest South Georgia?MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.0 -
You mean apart from the £39+ billion the UK are paying so they can have the benefit of membership at "no cost"?Foxy said:
Personally, I think the Backstop the best feature of the Deal. It is particularly good for NI as it maintains the majority of the benefits of EU membership at no cost.Charles said:
The wording of the text doesn’t match what was agreed in December last yearFoxy said:
Indedd we agreed it a year ago and are now trying to break our word.TOPPING said:
No they aren't. They, the RoI and the UK are supporting the backstop.MarqueeMark said:
I'm so sorry that reality has splattered your pristine garments.....matt said:
Welcome to leaver world, where covering oneself in shit is fine provided that third parties get hit by the odd splatter.MarqueeMark said:
....and the UK leaving with No Deal is going to push all of them into recession.CarlottaVance said:
Cheer up! The Belgian PM has just resigned, the French Police are about to strike and German economic confidence is at its lowest in over a decade. Everything’s going so well.....OldKingCole said:The two major Anglophone countries are deep in the brown stuff due to incompetent Governments. Yet both came to power as a result of an acknowleged democratic process.
Makes one furiously to think! Why have the processes in each country worked so badly?
Merry Christmas, Europe.
The EU will pick up your dry-cleaning bill. After all, they are the ones flingng the backstop shit.
Also, to be fair, May is not “trying to break her word”. It’s debatable whether Parliament actually needs to ratify the treaty, but if it does (either politically or legally) then all May has committed to is to present the treaty to Parliament for their approval0 -
The Republicans didn't do that well in Ohio at the midterms - Sherrod Brown was only a few hundred thousand votes behind where Trump got in 2016 which is almost unprecedented. (And Wisconsin was even worse: the winning Democrat's vote count would have been enough to beat Trump.)TheKitchenCabinet said:(1) The Republican Establishment knows that Trump bring voters to the party that others wouldn't. Now, he also repels (apparently) some suburban well off Republicans. But if you look at where Republican House losses came from, a high percentage came from states which Trump lost in 2016 anyway (NJ, NY, CA, IL). On the other hand, the establishment knows any new Republican candidate is unlikely to repeat Trump's wins in places like Michigan and Wisconsin. And they won the Senate seat in FL and did reasonably well in Ohio.
0 -
Agreed and the primary voters of the Republican Party will likely stick with Trump anywayTheKitchenCabinet said:
On topic, couple of reasons I think the Republicans will stick with him in 2020HYUFD said:
More likely Bloomberg runs as an independent, especially if the choice is say Trump v Sanders it Trump v WarrenYellow_Submarine said:On topic: We need public polling on what an Independent Trump Candidacy would do to the Electoral College in 2020. Who's vote does he take and where ? The Republicans will already have that data privately. Which leaves us with three questions. 1. Is Trump a bigger electoral disaster for the Republicans as an Independent than as a Republican ? 2. How credible is Trump's threat to stand as an Independent ? 3. What would Trump want to not stand voluntarily ?
There are of course other variables. If a close family member is indicted his behaviour might prompt the 25A, he could just die given his weight and stress levels and the ourse.
(1) The Republican Establishment knows that Trump bring voters to the party that others wouldn't. Now, he also repels (apparently) some suburban well off Republicans. But if you look at where Republican House losses came from, a high percentage came from states which Trump lost in 2016 anyway (NJ, NY, CA, IL). On the other hand, the establishment knows any new Republican candidate is unlikely to repeat Trump's wins in places like Michigan and Wisconsin. And they won the Senate seat in FL and did reasonably well in Ohio.
(2) Post-Kavanaugh, Trump built up a lot of credit with traditional Republicans. More to the point, Establishment Republicans fear that Democrats would target them as aggressively as Trump if 2020 was lost. There is a sense Trump is the only one who can hold them back.
(3) There is a good chance that at least one Supreme Court seat (Ginsberg) comes up, possibly in the next 2 years, almost certainly before 2024. That will be a humdinger of a battle. I would imagine Republicans will want someone with Trump's willingness to attack to be around for that.
(4) Stepping back and looking at the whole Mueller thing, there are enough sub-plots where the whole thing is getting slightly complicated. Was Flynn a victim of a sting or not? What happened to the Page-Strozk texts? etc etc. There is enough in here where he can drag it out. And Barr is not likely to make the same mistake Sessions did in recusement.0 -
I’m sure Nigel Farage, repeater of a well known anti Semitic trope, will be delighted at this.
https://twitter.com/lionelbarber/status/1075284734975098880?s=210 -
To splitly infinitive and beyond...Charles said:
Not as ugly as a split infinitive though...Morris_Dancer said:Good morning, everyone.
I see Chrome has decided to unilaterally uglify its tabs again.
😖
0 -
I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.0 -
-
That's a sensible plan, however I fear that after the deal is rejected in the MV that either the Gov't will pivot to a 2nd ref or pivot to no deal then be VONCed by 7 treasonous heroic MPs on its own side. So 2nd ref or GE it is. Personally I'd prefer a GE.CarlottaVance said:The Prime Minister has now set a date for the debate – week commencing 7 January, with the meaningful vote the next week. But time is short and the Government needs to get over the meaningful vote hurdle to unlock possible ways forward.
The process could look something like the following:
Step 1: Have the meaningful vote – but if there is nothing new on the table, treat as a resumed debate. The Prime Minister could even use another of our suggested tactics and make it a free vote. Assuming the motion is defeated, make clear the immediate next step will be…
Step 2: Allow MPs to have indicative votes on another way forward. This would be to see whether there is any majority for a way forward. At the moment, it looks like no option commands a majority.
If that is right, the Prime Minister’s next gambit could be to try a cross-the-floor tactic designed to unite all those MPs who say they “want to respect the referendum” minus those who cannot accept her backstop.
The risk to her is that this could trigger a confidence motion where the DUP would back the Opposition, so she would need to be confident that her way forward could command cross-party support.
Step 3: Put the Withdrawal Agreement back to MPs – but decouple it from the political declaration. Assuming the indicative votes indicate no majority for a referendum and no majority for a no deal exit, the Prime Minister can take it that there are the votes for an orderly Brexit.
Her deal is the only one on offer that can guarantee an orderly Brexit. She could say to MPs that they need to pass that part of her deal (and the Withdrawal Agreement Bill) to ensure a transition and an opening of negotiations on the future relationship.
She could then make a virtue of the vagueness of the political declaration – the 27 pages on non-legally binding text on the future framework. It encompasses a range of relationships and where the EU has repeatedly made clear that others are possible if UK red lines change.
https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/blog/how-prime-minister-could-break-stalemate-brexit
Jill Rutter, contemporary of May's and Civil Servant sidelined by Brown's bully boys in the Treasury....0 -
TheScreamingEagles said:
I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
Only Hunt left at this rate. I mean Raab has been shown to be far too inexperienced. Boris can't ever be written off, but somehow he has to get some more MPs onboard.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.0 -
Since 2010 any treaty has to be ratified by Parliament in a straight yes/no vote.Charles said:
The wording of the text doesn’t match what was agreed in December last yearFoxy said:
Indedd we agreed it a year ago and are now trying to break our word.TOPPING said:
No they aren't. They, the RoI and the UK are supporting the backstop.MarqueeMark said:
I'm so sorry that reality has splattered your pristine garments.....matt said:
Welcome to leaver world, where covering oneself in shit is fine provided that third parties get hit by the odd splatter.MarqueeMark said:
....and the UK leaving with No Deal is going to push all of them into recession.CarlottaVance said:
Cheer up! The Belgian PM has just resigned, the French Police are about to strike and German economic confidence is at its lowest in over a decade. Everything’s going so well.....OldKingCole said:The two major Anglophone countries are deep in the brown stuff due to incompetent Governments. Yet both came to power as a result of an acknowleged democratic process.
Makes one furiously to think! Why have the processes in each country worked so badly?
Merry Christmas, Europe.
The EU will pick up your dry-cleaning bill. After all, they are the ones flingng the backstop shit.
Also, to be fair, May is not “trying to break her word”. It’s debatable whether Parliament actually needs to ratify the treaty, but if it does (either politically or legally) then all May has committed to is to present the treaty to Parliament for their approval0 -
Rather than parliament reject the deal and then look at alternatives, the May tactic is for them to reject the alternatives and then look at the deal. Makes perfect sense. It's the logical sequence. You don't strangle the bird in your hand and then go looking for one in the bush. You first check if there IS one in the bush and only if there is, and it's a better looking one, do you close your eyes and your fist and do the deed. The cries of 'it's a scandal!, it's blackmail!' etc are unfounded. The PM is doing her level best to get the deal through. The scandal would be if she wasn't.0
-
That was the case people thought might be a subpoena on the president himself since the courts were locked down and reporters excluded. Rosneft, eh? Is that reliable?Nigelb said:Interesting:
https://twitter.com/ZoeTillman/status/1075151045146357761
The company appears to be Rosneft.0 -
Hammond might still appeal as the old pope elected by young cardinals, as a one-term leader who'd give more junior candidates a chance to prove themselves. Otherwise Hunt should be favourite.rottenborough said:TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
Only Hunt left at this rate. I mean Raab has been shown to be far too inexperienced. Boris can't ever be written off, but somehow he has to get some more MPs onboard.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.0 -
What is the EU doing about the Hungarian government though? I don't see the point of the EU if one of its fundamental purposes is not to protect liberal democracy across Europe.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Yes. Because the WA is all the EU care about. That is the Deal, really. And it is compatible with all sorts of FTAs. Norway, Chequers, Labour BINO, even Canada if a high tech border proves possible, all of these can be pursued. We just need to decide if we are leaving the EU and if we are we need to ratify the WA. This truth will surely dawn at some point.CarlottaVance said:Put the Withdrawal Agreement back to MPs – but decouple it from the political declaration. Assuming the indicative votes indicate no majority for a referendum and no majority for a no deal exit, the Prime Minister can take it that there are the votes for an orderly Brexit.
Her deal is the only one on offer that can guarantee an orderly Brexit. She could say to MPs that they need to pass that part of her deal (and the Withdrawal Agreement Bill) to ensure a transition and an opening of negotiations on the future relationship.
She could then make a virtue of the vagueness of the political declaration – the 27 pages on non-legally binding text on the future framework. It encompasses a range of relationships and where the EU has repeatedly made clear that others are possible if UK red lines change.0 -
Hunt is so totally transparent. He'll make out that he is a Remainer, soft Brexiter or No Deal Brexiter depending on which day of the week it is. He only believes in one thing - furthering his own career.DecrepitJohnL said:
Hammond might still appeal as the old pope elected by young cardinals, as a one-term leader who'd give more junior candidates a chance to prove themselves. Otherwise Hunt should be favourite.rottenborough said:TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
Only Hunt left at this rate. I mean Raab has been shown to be far too inexperienced. Boris can't ever be written off, but somehow he has to get some more MPs onboard.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
Hopefully he has now got to the grips with the tricky issue of where his wife is from.0 -
Oh dear, will the Tories have written off the votes of all their strong leavers and workers earning under £30,000 in the next GE ?0
-
I'm not sure how popular "immigrants claiming benefits" is among those on average earnings.....Pulpstar said:Oh dear, will the Tories have written off the votes of all their strong leavers and workers earning under £30,000 in the next GE ?
0 -
What is the EU going to do about election results it doesn't like - overturn them?rottenborough said:
What is the EU doing about the Hungarian government though? I don't see the point of the EU if one of its fundamental purposes is not to protect liberal democracy across Europe.TheScreamingEagles said:
Orban's party scored 59 per cent in the most recent opinion poll - and in second place was the far right Jobbik party on 12 percent. So that is nearly three quarters of Hungarians who back Orban or think he is too moderate.
Whether you approve or not - isn't it ultimately a matter for the people of Hungary to decide their government and not the EU? And they seem overall rather content.
Which is of course the problem - how does the EU deal with voters when they don't vote 'the right way'?0 -
Eh ? There are plenty of people earning sub 30k that don't claim a penny.CarlottaVance said:
I'm not sure how popular "immigrants claiming benefits" is among those on average earnings.....Pulpstar said:Oh dear, will the Tories have written off the votes of all their strong leavers and workers earning under £30,000 in the next GE ?
0 -
I'm kinda thinking that the general rule for viable candidates for next Tory leader is that they're only viable till they open their mouths.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.0 -
South Georgia is magnificient and should be on everyone's bucket listFoxy said:
Kerguelen is aFrench dependancy, not sure he would get a visa. Could I suggest South Georgia?MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.0 -
Not true about Jeremy Hunt.Theuniondivvie said:
I'm kinda thinking that the general rule for viable candidates for next Tory leader are that they're only viable till they open their mouths.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
He always sounds and acts like a Prime Minister in waiting.
That’s not my book talking. Honest.0 -
He's also poked a hornets nest on public sector pay here.Pulpstar said:
Eh ? There are plenty of people earning sub 30k that don't claim a penny.CarlottaVance said:
I'm not sure how popular "immigrants claiming benefits" is among those on average earnings.....Pulpstar said:Oh dear, will the Tories have written off the votes of all their strong leavers and workers earning under £30,000 in the next GE ?
0 -
King Hell Javid has managed to make Lord Adonis sound like a reasonable person. He's really screwed it up this morning hasn't he.rottenborough said:0 -
I know. It was awful.Pulpstar said:
King Hell Javid has managed to make Lord Adonis sound like a reasonable person. He's really screwed it up this morning hasn't he.rottenborough said:
To think he plays up this working class kid/son of immigrants card like he’s a man of the people.0 -
That's very grudging. If only you could see the shitshow that the Brexiter PMs made of the negotiations in those parallel universes.MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.0 -
Indeed so. This is the bizarre paradox.Foxy said:
Personally, I think the Backstop the best feature of the Deal. It is particularly good for NI as it maintains the majority of the benefits of EU membership at no cost.Charles said:
The wording of the text doesn’t match what was agreed in December last yearFoxy said:
Indedd we agreed it a year ago and are now trying to break our word.TOPPING said:
No they aren't. They, the RoI and the UK are supporting the backstop.MarqueeMark said:
I'm so sorry that reality has splattered your pristine garments.....matt said:
Welcome to leaver world, where covering oneself in shit is fine provided that third parties get hit by the odd splatter.MarqueeMark said:
....and the UK leaving with No Deal is going to push all of them into recession.CarlottaVance said:
Cheer up! The Belgian PM has just resigned, the French Police are about to strike and German economic confidence is at its lowest in over a decade. Everything’s going so well.....OldKingCole said:The two major Anglophone countries are deep in the brown stuff due to incompetent Governments. Yet both came to power as a result of an acknowleged democratic process.
Makes one furiously to think! Why have the processes in each country worked so badly?
Merry Christmas, Europe.
The EU will pick up your dry-cleaning bill. After all, they are the ones flingng the backstop shit.
Also, to be fair, May is not “trying to break her word”. It’s debatable whether Parliament actually needs to ratify the treaty, but if it does (either politically or legally) then all May has committed to is to present the treaty to Parliament for their approval0 -
Is there anything there apart from birds and seals?Big_G_NorthWales said:
South Georgia is magnificient and should be on everyone's bucket listFoxy said:
Kerguelen is aFrench dependancy, not sure he would get a visa. Could I suggest South Georgia?MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.0 -
Well it's certainly a foreign government owned company, as per the court ruling.DecrepitJohnL said:
That was the case people thought might be a subpoena on the president himself since the courts were locked down and reporters excluded. Rosneft, eh? Is that reliable?Nigelb said:Interesting:
https://twitter.com/ZoeTillman/status/1075151045146357761
The company appears to be Rosneft.
And it's widely reported that it is a company which acquired 19.5% of Glencore (though I'm not sure of the source for that) - which would make it Rosneft.0 -
Its how its being presented in the Mail. The Cabinet fight was over £30,000 (May) vs £21,700 (Hammond, Employers who can't be arsed to train Brits) - at £21,700 plenty of benefits come into play.Pulpstar said:
Eh ? There are plenty of people earning sub 30k that don't claim a penny.CarlottaVance said:
I'm not sure how popular "immigrants claiming benefits" is among those on average earnings.....Pulpstar said:Oh dear, will the Tories have written off the votes of all their strong leavers and workers earning under £30,000 in the next GE ?
0 -
The only reason I can see for a 30k cap is child benefit and tax credits. Once we're outside the EU can't we discriminate in favour of the natives against EU citizens for those benefits though ?0
-
In much of London now you need to earn not far off £100k to even think about buying a one bed flat - more than that for a house which could accommodate a family or pay £1500 to £2000 a month to rent one. In much of the country a family where the breadwinner earns £30k and who doesn't own a home would struggle to make ends meet and fund their housing costs. The average house price is £230k and even more where most of the jobs are - do banks do 8 times salary mortgages?rottenborough said:
Given our high cost of living surely a key criteria has to be will that person pay their way and they and their family not take out more in tax credits, housing benefit and public services like schools and the NHS than they pay in - if they are not doing a skilled or essential job. Let alone the pressures of an ever rising population on housing, services, transport infrastructure and more.
There is more to life and quality of life than headline GDP and growing that on the back of a low wage, high cost, job insecure, private renting insecure, just about making ends meet economy.
0 -
Oh, if you're a FAMILY and need a whole house or flat then yes £30k is far too little. But if you're single and live in say err Sheffield then you can rent a room for £300/month https://www.spareroom.co.uk/flatshare/south_yorkshire/sheffield/11646313, £30k is plenty to live off.brendan16 said:
In much of London now you need to earn not far off £100k to even think about buying a one bed flat - more than that for a house which could accommodate a family or pay £1500 to £2000 a month to rent one. In much of the country a family earning £30k who doesn't own a home would struggle to make ends meet and fund their housing costs - the average house price is £230k and more where the jobs are - do banks do 8 times salary mortgages?rottenborough said:
Given our high cost of living surely a key criteria has to be will that person pay their way and not take out more in tax credits, housing benefit and public services than they pay in - if they are not doing a skilled or essential job. Let alone the pressures of an ever rising population on housing, services, transport infrastructure and more.
There is more to life and quality of life than headline GDP and growing that on the back of a low wage, high cost, job insecure, private renting insecure, just about making ends meet economy.
A points system taking into account age and wider circumstance would be more appropriate.0 -
TheScreamingEagles said:
I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
PB Tory Next Leader Bingo
Boris The Johnson (REJECTED)
Penny Splash (REJECTED)
Rory the Tory from Balamory (WHO?)
Magic Saj (REJECTED)
Jeremy Hunt the Massive ... (PENDING)
Pulpstar's cat will come into the running soon.
0 -
Theuniondivvie said:
I'm kinda thinking that the general rule for viable candidates for next Tory leader is that they're only viable till they open their mouths.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
Chortle.0 -
Didn't hear it......but if they're quietly burying Cameron's idiotic 'tens of thousands' thats a good thing, isn't it?TheScreamingEagles said:
Unless they are going to start building the houses and schools for a city the size of Newcastle upon Tyne every year.....0 -
I know a couple of people who have spent a lot of time with him. They were not impressed at all.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Snow covered high mountains, glaciers, whales, king penguins, elephant and fur seals. Only accessable by boat and is approx 800 miles south east of the Falklands. Made famous by Ernest Shackleton.IanB2 said:
Is there anything there apart from birds and seals?Big_G_NorthWales said:
South Georgia is magnificient and should be on everyone's bucket listFoxy said:
Kerguelen is aFrench dependancy, not sure he would get a visa. Could I suggest South Georgia?MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
We called at it as part of our visit to Antartica and the Falklands, in what was one of our most enriching cruise holidays0 -
As long as the current resident remains in place then.....williamglenn said:0 -
@Brendan16 Surely a family (two adults) would need to be earning £60,000 on these rules ?0
-
That sounds like an incredible trip.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Snow covered high mountains, glaciers, whales, king penguins, elephant and fur seals. Only accessable by boat and is approx 800 miles south east of the Falklands. Made famous by Ernest Shackleton.IanB2 said:
Is there anything there apart from birds and seals?Big_G_NorthWales said:
South Georgia is magnificient and should be on everyone's bucket listFoxy said:
Kerguelen is aFrench dependancy, not sure he would get a visa. Could I suggest South Georgia?MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
We called at it as part of our visit to Antartica and the Falklands, in what was one of our most enriching cruise holidays0 -
He always comes across as utterly wooden and leaden footed to me. I can see the general appeal of him as an idea, but what works in theory often fails to work in practice.tottenhamWC said:
I know a couple of people who have spent a lot of time with him. They were not impressed at all.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
I am laying Pulpstar's cat, as it appears to be the current favourite.....Anazina said:TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
PB Tory Next Leader Bingo
Boris The Johnson (REJECTED)
Penny Splash (REJECTED)
Rory the Tory from Balamory (WHO?)
Magic Saj (REJECTED)
Jeremy Hunt the Massive ... (PENDING)
Pulpstar's cat will come into the running soon.0 -
One of the comments was "he has clearly spent too long in a glass office." Another got the strong impression he was literally going nowhere at Deutsche when he worked there.Anazina said:
He always comes across as utterly wooden and leaden footed to me. I can see the general appeal of him as an idea, but what works in theory often fails to work in practice.tottenhamWC said:
I know a couple of people who have spent a lot of time with him. They were not impressed at all.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
I haven't seen the Trust's report; were BBC News making up this bit - "It is striking that the Trust itself said there was 'no evidence of bias'. Indeed, it also said the news report was 'compiled in good faith'."?Anazina said:
She rarely, if ever, gets a good story. And when she does, she fucks it up.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/entertainment-arts-38666914
This is so egregious an example, I’m surprised it didn’t have greater consequences for her.
Also, in the interview referred to, LK did Corbyn a favour in my view. When asked whether he would "order security services onto the street to stop people being killed"
He replied "Of course you'd bring people onto the streets to prevent and ensure there is safety within our society."
He doesn't even make sense.0 -
Please let this be true for my betting position but I think McVey has played this well and could be a dark horse candidate at this stage. Resigned, so got potentially the ERG support, has kept herself out of the TV studios except for one, generally decent / no disaster interview where she signalled she would be willing to stand for the leadership (so signalled intent) and has been careful to not say much since. On the basis that everyone else seems to be blowing themselves up, that could work well.rottenborough said:TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
Only Hunt left at this rate. I mean Raab has been shown to be far too inexperienced. Boris can't ever be written off, but somehow he has to get some more MPs onboard.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
And, as an ex-TV presenter, she probably has an advantage in working the media.0 -
I don't know if this helps the debate but my household income is approx £100k and I own a large period four-bedroomed house in a nice (if relatively dull) London suburb. London does not begin and end at the boundary of Zone 2, which many provincial PBers seem to think it does judging by the calculations on here.Pulpstar said:
Oh, if you're a FAMILY and need a whole house or flat then yes £30k is far too little. But if you're single and live in say err Sheffield then you can rent a room for £300/month https://www.spareroom.co.uk/flatshare/south_yorkshire/sheffield/11646313, £30k is plenty to live off.brendan16 said:
In much of London now you need to earn not far off £100k to even think about buying a one bed flat - more than that for a house which could accommodate a family or pay £1500 to £2000 a month to rent one. In much of the country a family earning £30k who doesn't own a home would struggle to make ends meet and fund their housing costs - the average house price is £230k and more where the jobs are - do banks do 8 times salary mortgages?rottenborough said:
Given our high cost of living surely a key criteria has to be will that person pay their way and not take out more in tax credits, housing benefit and public services than they pay in - if they are not doing a skilled or essential job. Let alone the pressures of an ever rising population on housing, services, transport infrastructure and more.
There is more to life and quality of life than headline GDP and growing that on the back of a low wage, high cost, job insecure, private renting insecure, just about making ends meet economy.
A points system taking into account age and wider circumstance would be more appropriate.
(Pulpstar is not one of them, and has often corrected such mistakes by finding houses/flats down here that are affordable).0 -
I didn't accuse her of bias. I accused her of being a crap journalist.TrèsDifficile said:
I haven't seen the Trust's report; were BBC News making up this bit - "It is striking that the Trust itself said there was 'no evidence of bias'. Indeed, it also said the news report was 'compiled in good faith'."?Anazina said:
She rarely, if ever, gets a good story. And when she does, she fucks it up.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/entertainment-arts-38666914
This is so egregious an example, I’m surprised it didn’t have greater consequences for her.
Also, in the interview referred to, LK did Corbyn a favour in my view. When asked whether he would "order security services onto the street to stop people being killed"
He replied "Of course you'd bring people onto the streets to prevent and ensure there is safety within our society."
He doesn't even make sense.
Believe me, attributing an answer to a different question would result in major censure if not a sacking for most journalists. It really is a very fundamental fail.0 -
Here is one of his earlier campaigns:MarqueeMark said:
I am laying Pulpstar's cat, as it appears to be the current favourite.....Anazina said:TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
PB Tory Next Leader Bingo
Boris The Johnson (REJECTED)
Penny Splash (REJECTED)
Rory the Tory from Balamory (WHO?)
Magic Saj (REJECTED)
Jeremy Hunt the Massive ... (PENDING)
Pulpstar's cat will come into the running soon.
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/10753326466522972160 -
Point is - do we necessarily want to import unskilled people who can only afford to 'rent a room' in Sheffield. Cos that means one less room for a rough sleeper or one less flat for a family already here? And that is before we factor in our crazy tax credits system and housing benefit - which again are driven by high housing costs in the private rented sector.Pulpstar said:
Oh, if you're a FAMILY and need a whole house or flat then yes £30k is far too little. But if you're single and live in say err Sheffield then you can rent a room for £300/month https://www.spareroom.co.uk/flatshare/south_yorkshire/sheffield/11646313, £30k is plenty to live off.brendan16 said:
In much of London now you need to earn not far off £100k to even think about buying a one bed flat - more than that for a house which could accommodate a family or pay £1500 to £2000 a month to rent one. In much of the country a family earning £30k who doesn't own a home would struggle to make ends meet and fund their housing costs - the average house price is £230k and more where the jobs are - do banks do 8 times salary mortgages?rottenborough said:
Given our high cost of living surely a key criteria has to be will that person pay their way and not take out more in tax credits, housing benefit and public services than they pay in - if they are not doing a skilled or essential job. Let alone the pressures of an ever rising population on housing, services, transport infrastructure and more.
There is more to life and quality of life than headline GDP and growing that on the back of a low wage, high cost, job insecure, private renting insecure, just about making ends meet economy.
A points system taking into account age and wider circumstance would be more appropriate.
When Osborne failed in his attempt to reform tax credits a while back there was a woman on Question time complaining that if her tax credits were cut she wouldn't be able to afford her rent. No one of course thought - isn't it the high rent that is the problem not the tax credits. Cos if her rent was lower - she wouldn't have needed the taxpayer top up perhaps?
Again it depends if you want a happy society or a rising GDP on the back of cheap labour, insecure and expensive housing, taxpayer subsidies to fund the cheap labour and costly housing and the social problems which result.
Do we want just about making ends meet in Sheffield migrants - or those who will be significant net contributors or are highly skilled to fill jobs we really need as a society (e.g nurses not baristas).0 -
MarqueeMark said:
I am laying Pulpstar's cat, as it appears to be the current favourite.....Anazina said:TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
PB Tory Next Leader Bingo
Boris The Johnson (REJECTED)
Penny Splash (REJECTED)
Rory the Tory from Balamory (WHO?)
Magic Saj (REJECTED)
Jeremy Hunt the Massive ... (PENDING)
Pulpstar's cat will come into the running soon.
I'm concerned that your wager will turn out to be a value loser Mark!0 -
A couple of flawsTheKitchenCabinet said:
Please let this be true for my betting position but I think McVey has played this well and could be a dark horse candidate at this stage. Resigned, so got potentially the ERG support, has kept herself out of the TV studios except for one, generally decent / no disaster interview where she signalled she would be willing to stand for the leadership (so signalled intent) and has been careful to not say much since. On the basis that everyone else seems to be blowing themselves up, that could work well.rottenborough said:TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
Only Hunt left at this rate. I mean Raab has been shown to be far too inexperienced. Boris can't ever be written off, but somehow he has to get some more MPs onboard.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
And, as an ex-TV presenter, she probably has an advantage in working the media.
1. She is making an utter hash of her role at DWP – and sitting on the UC time bomb
2. She is an odious woman who is dating one of the most repellent MPs in the Commons
Esther The Jester (REJECTED)0 -
Stop bringing facts into a debate about immigration.Pulpstar said:
Nurses err... start on less than 30k.brendan16 said:
Do we want just about making ends meet in Sheffield migrants - or those who will be significant net contributors or are highly skilled to fill jobs we really need as a society (e.g nurses not baristas).0 -
It was our retirement present to each other in 2009 and was a voyage into a world of unbelievable beauty and experiences. We landed on Antartica under strict environment and safety procedures and got up close with the king penguins and seals. One of the bays we arrived at had 22 glaciers, flat calm sea with icebergs and whales gently carving through the crystal clear water. We also had several days of hurricane seas.SandyRentool said:
That sounds like an incredible trip.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Snow covered high mountains, glaciers, whales, king penguins, elephant and fur seals. Only accessable by boat and is approx 800 miles south east of the Falklands. Made famous by Ernest Shackleton.IanB2 said:
Is there anything there apart from birds and seals?Big_G_NorthWales said:
South Georgia is magnificient and should be on everyone's bucket listFoxy said:
Kerguelen is aFrench dependancy, not sure he would get a visa. Could I suggest South Georgia?MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
We called at it as part of our visit to Antartica and the Falklands, in what was one of our most enriching cruise holidays
It was a privilege to experience this most beautiful and spectacular part of our planet0 -
Are you referring to the TV interview in which she said we'd have the two year transition period to plan for a No Deal Brexit?TheKitchenCabinet said:
Please let this be true for my betting position but I think McVey has played this well and could be a dark horse candidate at this stage. Resigned, so got potentially the ERG support, has kept herself out of the TV studios except for one, generally decent / no disaster interview where she signalled she would be willing to stand for the leadership (so signalled intent) and has been careful to not say much since. On the basis that everyone else seems to be blowing themselves up, that could work well.rottenborough said:TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
Only Hunt left at this rate. I mean Raab has been shown to be far too inexperienced. Boris can't ever be written off, but somehow he has to get some more MPs onboard.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
And, as an ex-TV presenter, she probably has an advantage in working the media.
0 -
We'll never know in this universe, because the Remainers insisted on keeping the process restricted amongst a handful of themselves, whilst cutting the Brexit Ministers out the loop.IanB2 said:
That's very grudging. If only you could see the shitshow that the Brexiter PMs made of the negotiations in those parallel universes.MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
This handful own May's Shit Deal that resulted.0 -
Edit: I see she quit as Pensions Secretary. I hadn't noticed. Still, her record there will haunt her.Anazina said:
A couple of flawsTheKitchenCabinet said:
Please let this be true for my betting position but I think McVey has played this well and could be a dark horse candidate at this stage. Resigned, so got potentially the ERG support, has kept herself out of the TV studios except for one, generally decent / no disaster interview where she signalled she would be willing to stand for the leadership (so signalled intent) and has been careful to not say much since. On the basis that everyone else seems to be blowing themselves up, that could work well.rottenborough said:TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
Only Hunt left at this rate. I mean Raab has been shown to be far too inexperienced. Boris can't ever be written off, but somehow he has to get some more MPs onboard.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
And, as an ex-TV presenter, she probably has an advantage in working the media.
1. She is making an utter hash of her role at DWP – and sitting on the UC time bomb
2. She is an odious woman who is dating one of the most repellent MPs in the Commons
Esther The Jester (REJECTED)0 -
You won't go wrong laying the Tory favourite....Anazina said:MarqueeMark said:
I am laying Pulpstar's cat, as it appears to be the current favourite.....Anazina said:TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
PB Tory Next Leader Bingo
Boris The Johnson (REJECTED)
Penny Splash (REJECTED)
Rory the Tory from Balamory (WHO?)
Magic Saj (REJECTED)
Jeremy Hunt the Massive ... (PENDING)
Pulpstar's cat will come into the running soon.
I'm concerned that your wager will turn out to be a value loser Mark!
0 -
Of course - it is all someone else's fault. Of course.MarqueeMark said:
We'll never know in this universe, because the Remainers insisted on keeping the process restricted amongst a handful of themselves, whilst cutting the Brexit Ministers out the loop.IanB2 said:
That's very grudging. If only you could see the shitshow that the Brexiter PMs made of the negotiations in those parallel universes.MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
This handful own May's Shit Deal that resulted.
The FTA that Davis and Patterson negotiated with Oklahoma shows exactly what could have been achieved if the Brexiteers had not fallen out among themselves, put personal ambition above the country and actually contested the Conservative party leadership election in 2016.
0 -
Not been following this story this morning, but does the cap include overtime? Workers such as nurses often add a lot to their salaries with overtime.Pulpstar said:
Nurses err... start on less than 30k.brendan16 said:
Do we want just about making ends meet in Sheffield migrants - or those who will be significant net contributors or are highly skilled to fill jobs we really need as a society (e.g nurses not baristas).0 -
Lucky you. I glimpsed land in Antarctica at first light, then a 48 hour storm meant anyone not up at penguin's fart never saw it. The ship's captain, a Dutch chap in his 70's, said those 48 hours were the worst conditions of his entire career..... Icebergs with a Force 11 behind them can't half shift! We eventually made it out, to head on to South Georgia and beyond.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It was our retirement present to each other in 2009 and was a voyage into a world of unbelievable beauty and experiences. We landed on Antartica under strict environment and safety procedures and got up close with the king penguins and seals. One of the bays we arrived at had 22 glaciers, flat calm sea with icebergs and whales gently carving through the crystal clear water. We also had several days of hurricane seas.SandyRentool said:
That sounds like an incredible trip.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Snow covered high mountains, glaciers, whales, king penguins, elephant and fur seals. Only accessable by boat and is approx 800 miles south east of the Falklands. Made famous by Ernest Shackleton.IanB2 said:
Is there anything there apart from birds and seals?Big_G_NorthWales said:
South Georgia is magnificient and should be on everyone's bucket listFoxy said:
Kerguelen is aFrench dependancy, not sure he would get a visa. Could I suggest South Georgia?MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
We called at it as part of our visit to Antartica and the Falklands, in what was one of our most enriching cruise holidays
It was a privilege to experience this most beautiful and spectacular part of our planet0 -
Fantastic.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It was our retirement present to each other in 2009 and was a voyage into a world of unbelievable beauty and experiences. We landed on Antartica under strict environment and safety procedures and got up close with the king penguins and seals. One of the bays we arrived at had 22 glaciers, flat calm sea with icebergs and whales gently carving through the crystal clear water. We also had several days of hurricane seas.SandyRentool said:
That sounds like an incredible trip.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Snow covered high mountains, glaciers, whales, king penguins, elephant and fur seals. Only accessable by boat and is approx 800 miles south east of the Falklands. Made famous by Ernest Shackleton.IanB2 said:
Is there anything there apart from birds and seals?Big_G_NorthWales said:
South Georgia is magnificient and should be on everyone's bucket listFoxy said:
Kerguelen is aFrench dependancy, not sure he would get a visa. Could I suggest South Georgia?MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
We called at it as part of our visit to Antartica and the Falklands, in what was one of our most enriching cruise holidays
It was a privilege to experience this most beautiful and spectacular part of our planet
But in 2009, didn't you regret missing some of the "Gordon Brown is crap" discussions here on PB?0 -
Only Hunt left at this rate. I mean Raab has been shown to be far too inexperienced. Boris can't ever be written off, but somehow he has to get some more MPs onboard.
Please let this be true for my betting position but I think McVey has played this well and could be a dark horse candidate at this stage. Resigned, so got potentially the ERG support, has kept herself out of the TV studios except for one, generally decent / no disaster interview where she signalled she would be willing to stand for the leadership (so signalled intent) and has been careful to not say much since. On the basis that everyone else seems to be blowing themselves up, that could work well.
And, as an ex-TV presenter, she probably has an advantage in working the media.
Are you referring to the TV interview in which she said we'd have the two year transition period to plan for a No Deal Brexit?
Don't think it will. she came out relatively unscathed - look at what happened with Rudd and Windrush vs McVey and UC. There is enough that she can lay at the door of Osborne and IDS for any future problems.Anazina said:
Edit: I see she quit as Pensions Secretary. I hadn't noticed. Still, her record there will haunt her.Anazina said:
A couple of flawsTheKitchenCabinet said:
Please let this be true for my betting position but I think McVey has played this well and could be a dark horse candidate at this stage. Resigned, so got potentially the ERG support, has kept herself out of the TV studios except for one, generally decent / no disaster interview where she signalled she would be willing to stand for the leadership (so signalled intent) and has been careful to not say much since. On the basis that everyone else seems to be blowing themselves up, that could work well.rottenborough said:TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
Only Hunt left at this rate. I mean Raab has been shown to be far too inexperienced. Boris can't ever be written off, but somehow he has to get some more MPs onboard.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
And, as an ex-TV presenter, she probably has an advantage in working the media.
1. She is making an utter hash of her role at DWP – and sitting on the UC time bomb
2. She is an odious woman who is dating one of the most repellent MPs in the Commons
Esther The Jester (REJECTED)0 -
Theresa May is the Boss From Hell.SouthamObserver said:
Of course - it is all someone else's fault. Of course.MarqueeMark said:
We'll never know in this universe, because the Remainers insisted on keeping the process restricted amongst a handful of themselves, whilst cutting the Brexit Ministers out the loop.IanB2 said:
That's very grudging. If only you could see the shitshow that the Brexiter PMs made of the negotiations in those parallel universes.MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
This handful own May's Shit Deal that resulted.
The FTA that Davis and Patterson negotiated with Oklahoma shows exactly what could have been achieved if the Brexiteers had not fallen out among themselves, put personal ambition above the country and actually contested the Conservative party leadership election in 2016.0 -
If that is one post-her resignation where she signaled she would stand for leader, then yes. But, maybe it is just me, she seems to have copped a lot less flak for that than some of Raab's utterances.SouthamObserver said:
Are you referring to the TV interview in which she said we'd have the two year transition period to plan for a No Deal Brexit?TheKitchenCabinet said:
Please let this be true for my betting position but I think McVey has played this well and could be a dark horse candidate at this stage. Resigned, so got potentially the ERG support, has kept herself out of the TV studios except for one, generally decent / no disaster interview where she signalled she would be willing to stand for the leadership (so signalled intent) and has been careful to not say much since. On the basis that everyone else seems to be blowing themselves up, that could work well.rottenborough said:TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
Only Hunt left at this rate. I mean Raab has been shown to be far too inexperienced. Boris can't ever be written off, but somehow he has to get some more MPs onboard.TheScreamingEagles said:I think Sajid Javid is a definite lay now in the race to succeed Mrs May.
What a disastrous interview.
And, as an ex-TV presenter, she probably has an advantage in working the media.0 -
We experienced similar sea conditions at times and are fortunate that we are excellent sailors and considered it part of the voyageMarqueeMark said:
Lucky you. I glimpsed land in Antarctica at first light, then a 48 hour storm meant anyone not up at penguin's fart never saw it. The ship's captain, a Dutch chap in his 70's, said those 48 hours were the worst conditions of his entire career..... Icebergs with a Force 11 behind them can't half shift! We eventually made it out, to head on to South Georgia and beyond.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It was our retirement present to each other in 2009 and was a voyage into a world of unbelievable beauty and experiences. We landed on Antartica under strict environment and safety procedures and got up close with the king penguins and seals. One of the bays we arrived at had 22 glaciers, flat calm sea with icebergs and whales gently carving through the crystal clear water. We also had several days of hurricane seas.SandyRentool said:
That sounds like an incredible trip.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Snow covered high mountains, glaciers, whales, king penguins, elephant and fur seals. Only accessable by boat and is approx 800 miles south east of the Falklands. Made famous by Ernest Shackleton.IanB2 said:
Is there anything there apart from birds and seals?Big_G_NorthWales said:
South Georgia is magnificient and should be on everyone's bucket listFoxy said:
Kerguelen is aFrench dependancy, not sure he would get a visa. Could I suggest South Georgia?MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
We called at it as part of our visit to Antartica and the Falklands, in what was one of our most enriching cruise holidays
It was a privilege to experience this most beautiful and spectacular part of our planet0 -
On immigration, one of the key issues is the process. When I got a visa to work in Spain it involved leaving Spain and going back to the UK to get all the paperwork done via the Spanish consulate. That would be a disastrous system for many industries if it happened in the UK.
Again, we should revisit the brilliant piece from RCS's friend who ran the tech start-up to understand just how important it is to get good people very quickly. If the government fails to reflect that in its policy it will have a very negative effect very, very quickly.
http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2016/06/13/guest-slot-the-impact-of-leaving-the-eu-on-londons-technology-start-up-scene/
Note that we have already lost our private equity lead to the Netherlands:
https://www.ft.com/content/72ef5dbe-ff88-11e8-aebf-99e208d3e5210 -
Sadly I was not on PB at the timeSandyRentool said:
Fantastic.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It was our retirement present to each other in 2009 and was a voyage into a world of unbelievable beauty and experiences. We landed on Antartica under strict environment and safety procedures and got up close with the king penguins and seals. One of the bays we arrived at had 22 glaciers, flat calm sea with icebergs and whales gently carving through the crystal clear water. We also had several days of hurricane seas.SandyRentool said:
That sounds like an incredible trip.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Snow covered high mountains, glaciers, whales, king penguins, elephant and fur seals. Only accessable by boat and is approx 800 miles south east of the Falklands. Made famous by Ernest Shackleton.IanB2 said:
Is there anything there apart from birds and seals?Big_G_NorthWales said:
South Georgia is magnificient and should be on everyone's bucket listFoxy said:
Kerguelen is aFrench dependancy, not sure he would get a visa. Could I suggest South Georgia?MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
We called at it as part of our visit to Antartica and the Falklands, in what was one of our most enriching cruise holidays
It was a privilege to experience this most beautiful and spectacular part of our planet
But in 2009, didn't you regret missing some of the "Gordon Brown is crap" discussions here on PB?0 -
And nurses are skilled people and we are short of nurses - and we really do need nurses so in reality the government will need to move on the £30k cap for some professions. Maybe the issue is of course we don't pay nurses enough compared to many other western nations!TheScreamingEagles said:
Stop bringing facts into a debate about immigration.Pulpstar said:
Nurses err... start on less than 30k.brendan16 said:
Do we want just about making ends meet in Sheffield migrants - or those who will be significant net contributors or are highly skilled to fill jobs we really need as a society (e.g nurses not baristas).
The Canadians, Aussies, Kiwis and others have been doing this all for years so its hardly rocket science. They maintain a list of skilled and shortage occupations - if you meet the criteria then you get the skilled visa. Salary is important but it clearly shouldn't be the only criteria.0 -
CPI inflation down to 2.3%; RPI 3.2%. Avg earnings + 3.3%, House prices + 2.7%
A reasonably healthy set of numbers all round.0 -
Isn't the proposal actually that you need to be one or the other.brendan16 said:
And nurses are skilled people and we are short of nurses - and we really do need nurses so in reality the government will need to move on the £30k cap for some professions. Maybe the issue is of course we don't pay nurses enough compared to many other western nations!TheScreamingEagles said:
Stop bringing facts into a debate about immigration.Pulpstar said:
Nurses err... start on less than 30k.brendan16 said:
Do we want just about making ends meet in Sheffield migrants - or those who will be significant net contributors or are highly skilled to fill jobs we really need as a society (e.g nurses not baristas).
The Canadians, Aussies, Kiwis and others have been doing this all for years so its hardly rocket science. They maintain a list of skilled and shortage occupations - if you meet the criteria then you get the skilled visa. Salary is important but it clearly shouldn't be the only criteria.
Ie if you're on a specific skills list (which I believe is intended to include NHS so therefore nurses are covered) then you are in regardless of salary.
If you're not on the specific skills list then the salary is an alternative.
I think it is meant as either/or not both. You don't need to both be on a specific list of professions and above the salary threshold.0 -
So do we.brendan16 said:
And nurses are skilled people and we are short of nurses - and we really do need nurses so in reality the government will need to move on the £30k cap for some professions. Maybe the issue is of course we don't pay nurses enough compared to many other western nations!TheScreamingEagles said:
Stop bringing facts into a debate about immigration.Pulpstar said:
Nurses err... start on less than 30k.brendan16 said:
Do we want just about making ends meet in Sheffield migrants - or those who will be significant net contributors or are highly skilled to fill jobs we really need as a society (e.g nurses not baristas).
The Canadians, Aussies, Kiwis and others have been doing this all for years so its hardly rocket science. They maintain a list of skilled and shortage occupations - if you meet the criteria then you get the skilled visa. Salary is important but it clearly shouldn't be the only criteria.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/immigration-rules/immigration-rules-appendix-k-shortage-occupation-list
Which, surprise surprise, includes nurses.0 -
Yes, that pay level is starting Band 6, so Senior Staff Nurse level. Our new recruits are almost always more junior than that so band 4 or 5.Pulpstar said:
Nurses err... start on less than 30k.brendan16 said:
Do we want just about making ends meet in Sheffield migrants - or those who will be significant net contributors or are highly skilled to fill jobs we really need as a society (e.g nurses not baristas).
Of course, what the government means by unskilled is actually just low pay. As long as investment bankers can come and go, they are happy.0 -
The Brexiteers could have given Tory members the opportunity to vote for another boss. They chose not to.MarqueeMark said:
Theresa May is the Boss From Hell.SouthamObserver said:
Of course - it is all someone else's fault. Of course.MarqueeMark said:
We'll never know in this universe, because the Remainers insisted on keeping the process restricted amongst a handful of themselves, whilst cutting the Brexit Ministers out the loop.IanB2 said:
That's very grudging. If only you could see the shitshow that the Brexiter PMs made of the negotiations in those parallel universes.MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
This handful own May's Shit Deal that resulted.
The FTA that Davis and Patterson negotiated with Oklahoma shows exactly what could have been achieved if the Brexiteers had not fallen out among themselves, put personal ambition above the country and actually contested the Conservative party leadership election in 2016.
0 -
Anazina said:
I don't know if this helps the debate but my household income is approx £100k and I own a large period four-bedroomed house in a nice (if relatively dull) London suburb. London does not begin and end at the boundary of Zone 2, which many provincial PBers seem to think it does judging by the calculations on here.Pulpstar said:
Oh, if you're a FAMILY and need a whole house or flat then yes £30k is far too little. But if you're single and live in say err Sheffield then you can rent a room for £300/month https://www.spareroom.co.uk/flatshare/south_yorkshire/sheffield/11646313, £30k is plenty to live off.brendan16 said:
In much of London now you need to earn not far off £100k to even think about buying a one bed flat - more than that for a house which could accommodate a family or pay £1500 to £2000 a month to rent one. In much of the country a family earning £30k who doesn't own a home would struggle to make ends meet and fund their housing costs - the average house price is £230k and more where the jobs are - do banks do 8 times salary mortgages?rottenborough said:
Given our high cost of living surely a key criteria has to be will that person pay their way and not take out more in tax credits, housing benefit and public services than they pay in - if they are not doing a skilled or essential job. Let alone the pressures of an ever rising population on housing, services, transport infrastructure and more.
There is more to life and quality of life than headline GDP and growing that on the back of a low wage, high cost, job insecure, private renting insecure, just about making ends meet economy.
A points system taking into account age and wider circumstance would be more appropriate.
(Pulpstar is not one of them, and has often corrected such mistakes by finding houses/flats down here that are affordable).
Quoting earnings and the value of the house you own is meaningless as it depends when you bought it. Four bed period houses in outer London (bar the less desirable parts) are hard to find at below £500k - even in cheaper areas. And that implies a salary required of well over £100k to buy it without a large deposit. Which I am assuming will not be the position of most new migrants.
Some people may earn only £20k but own a £1m house because they bought it 30 years ago when it maybe only cost £30k. Someone now would need to earn £250k to buy it on a mortgage. What is relevant is what salary you would need to buy it at now as a new arrival to the UK (i.e. no UK housing equity or high savings in UK terms). Cos if you had the latter why would you need to come to the UK for a better life?0 -
If that person was Andrea Leadsom.SouthamObserver said:
The Brexiteers could have given Tory members the opportunity to vote for another boss. They chose not to.MarqueeMark said:
Theresa May is the Boss From Hell.SouthamObserver said:
Of course - it is all someone else's fault. Of course.MarqueeMark said:
We'll never know in this universe, because the Remainers insisted on keeping the process restricted amongst a handful of themselves, whilst cutting the Brexit Ministers out the loop.IanB2 said:
That's very grudging. If only you could see the shitshow that the Brexiter PMs made of the negotiations in those parallel universes.MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I am not an ERG-er. I would take a deal - even May's Shit Deal - over the royal buggering of democracy that not delivering any Brexit condemns us to. No Deal should have been part of our negotiating strategy from day one. That it wasn't - and at one minute to midnight, May starts digging a bomb shelter - is risible. But we are where we are.
But I would have a price for agreeing to MSD:
a) May leaves office as soon as a new PM is in place. That replacement process starts April 2019
b) Olly Robbins spends the rest of his days counting penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
This handful own May's Shit Deal that resulted.
The FTA that Davis and Patterson negotiated with Oklahoma shows exactly what could have been achieved if the Brexiteers had not fallen out among themselves, put personal ambition above the country and actually contested the Conservative party leadership election in 2016.0 -
When I crossed the Drake Passage on the Lyubov Orlova (subsequently broke her tow on the way to the breakers and subject of lurid headlines about cannibal rats) the captain came on the tannoy and said; 'There are two types of objects in your cabin. Those on the floor, and those which will shortly be on the floor. I suggest you intervene in the process'. It was pretty rocky and we were confined to our cabins for a day with ham sandwiches handed out - but great fun!Big_G_NorthWales said:
We experienced similar sea conditions at times and are fortunate that we are excellent sailors and considered it part of the voyageMarqueeMark said:
Lucky you. I glimpsed land in Antarctica at first light, then a 48 hour storm meant anyone not up at penguin's fart never saw it. The ship's captain, a Dutch chap in his 70's, said those 48 hours were the worst conditions of his entire career..... Icebergs with a Force 11 behind them can't half shift! We eventually made it out, to head on to South Georgia and beyond.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It was our retirement present to each other in 2009 and was a voyage into a world of unbelievable beauty and experiences. We landed on Antartica under strict environment and safety procedures and got up close with the king penguins and seals. One of the bays we arrived at had 22 glaciers, flat calm sea with icebergs and whales gently carving through the crystal clear water. We also had several days of hurricane seas.SandyRentool said:
That sounds like an incredible trip.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Snow covered high mountains, glaciers, whales, king penguins, elephant and fur seals. Only accessable by boat and is approx 800 miles south east of the Falklands. Made famous by Ernest Shackleton.IanB2 said:
Is there anything there apart from birds and seals?Big_G_NorthWales said:
South Georgia is magnificient and should be on everyone's bucket listFoxy said:
Kerguelen is aFrench dependancy, not sure he would get a visa. Could I suggest South Georgia?MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal. She has to go before we get started on the Trade Agreement. After all, that will last not a few years but decades.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
I penguins on the Kerguelen Islands. And never to be awarded a gong.
We called at it as part of our visit to Antartica and the Falklands, in what was one of our most enriching cruise holidays
It was a privilege to experience this most beautiful and spectacular part of our planet0 -
More a sad reflection on no 10 than SJ.williamglenn said:
The important thing is to have a control dial rather than arguing about what the setting on the dial might be at any one time.0 -
There were only 6 of us in the dining room for breakfast with most confined to their cabins with anti sea sickness medication. The voyage from Antartica to South Georgia following Ernest Shackleton's sea route was mostly in a hurricane seaCarlottaVance said:
When I crossed the Drake Passage on the Lyubov Orlova (subsequently broke her tow on the way to the breakers and subject of lurid headlines about cannibal rats) the captain came on the tannoy and said; 'There are two types of objects in your cabin. Those on the floor, and those which will shortly be on the floor. I suggest you intervene in the process'. It was pretty rocky and we were confined to our cabins for a day with ham sandwiches handed out - but great fun!Big_G_NorthWales said:
We experienced similar sea conditions at times and are fortunate that we are excellent sailors and considered it part of the voyageMarqueeMark said:
Lucky you. I glimpsed land in Antarctica at first light, then a 48 hour storm meant anyone not up at penguin's fart never saw it. The ship's captain, a Dutch chap in his 70's, said those 48 hours were the worst conditions of his entire career..... Icebergs with a Force 11 behind them can't half shift! We eventually made it out, to head on to South Georgia and beyond.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It was our retirement present to each other in 2009 and was a voyage into a world of unbelievable beauty and experiences. We landed on Antartica under strict environment and safety procedures and got up close with the king penguins and seals. One of the bays we arrived at had 22 glaciers, flat calm sea with icebergs and whales gently carving through the crystal clear water. We also had several days of hurricane seas.SandyRentool said:
That sounds like an incredible trip.Big_G_NorthWales said:IanB2 said:
Is there anything there apart from birds and seals?Big_G_NorthWales said:
South Georgia is magnificient and should be on everyone's bucket listFoxy said:
Kerguelen is aFrench dependancy, not sure he would get a visa. Could I suggest South Georgia?MarqueeMark said:
I have always said it was a shit deal.IanB2 said:
So as a deal hater yourself, you are reconsidering?
It was a privilege to experience this most beautiful and spectacular part of our planet0 -
Of course - but we have a separate policy for people from 30 or so other nations which doesn't differentiate between a brain surgeon and an unemployed man with five kids in terms of access to living in the UK permanently.TrèsDifficile said:
So do we.brendan16 said:
And nurses are skilled people and we are short of nurses - and we really do need nurses so in reality the government will need to move on the £30k cap for some professions. Maybe the issue is of course we don't pay nurses enough compared to many other western nations!TheScreamingEagles said:
Stop bringing facts into a debate about immigration.Pulpstar said:
Nurses err... start on less than 30k.brendan16 said:
Do we want just about making ends meet in Sheffield migrants - or those who will be significant net contributors or are highly skilled to fill jobs we really need as a society (e.g nurses not baristas).
The Canadians, Aussies, Kiwis and others have been doing this all for years so its hardly rocket science. They maintain a list of skilled and shortage occupations - if you meet the criteria then you get the skilled visa. Salary is important but it clearly shouldn't be the only criteria.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/immigration-rules/immigration-rules-appendix-k-shortage-occupation-list
Which, surprise surprise, includes nurses.
If you could apply our skilled migrant policy consistently and equally irrespective of the passport the person holds but on the skills they have you would have a better functioning system.0
This discussion has been closed.