Commission negotiating documents which are shared with EU Member States, the European Council, the European Parliament, the Council, national parliaments, and the United Kingdom will be released to the public
PMSL
And then there is this.... "A French lawyer ... Julien Fouchet ... [a] European law specialist from Bordeaux wants to challenge the validity of the EU negotiations on the basis the procedure was flawed ... It will call for the cancellation of the Brexit negotiating directives drafted by the EU, which are due to be adopted on 22 May, on the basis the referendum breached the rights of the UK citizens who were denied the vote. "
Meaningless, since the referendum was advisory only.
In fact, the Supreme Court saved Theresa's bacon. She was insisting going ahead without a parliamentary vote.
Yes, but the other side of the coin is that, regardless of our legal system, the Commission has to follow the EU's legal system. We need two sides to negotiate.
All the treaty required is that A50 was declared "in accordance with its own constitutional requirements". That has been done.
970 comments about this U turn/disaster for TM the PM, but no betting advice?
Look at the next PM markets. And TM exit dates
I have no idea about the Next PM market. There's a good article to be written after the GE about it but so much depends on the result and the reshuffle (assuming there is one), not to mention the timing of a vacancy. There is no Tory heir apparent at the moment.
And I think the Neil interview tonight could actually be more brutal than it might have been half an hour ago.
In more reflective terms I remember us pb Tories getting all terribly excited on Bigotgate Day but it didn't result in a wipeout for Brown; it hardly had any traction at all with the voting public. This might blow over too.
Andrew Neil, who will be now preparing for this interview, has a big problem.
It is in his power to utterly destroy May's reputation credibility and leave the way open for a minority government led by Corbyn.
Or pull his punches and destroy his own reputation and credibility.
What is he to do?
He'll go really hard on Mrs May, as he should.
He'll also be going really hard on Mr Corbyn, and a u-turn on social care is small beer compared to support for the IRA.
Democracy in action I guess, the people have blown a raspberry and the (current) powers that be have gone into an emergency handbrake turn. So "good" in that narrow sense.
You give the impression (even unwittingly, and out of good intentions) of threatening people's homes in this country, and you won't last to the next news cycle. It engendered a "flight or fight" response - all parties will note that.
By far the most shambolic few days I can ever remember in any general election. Ever, from anyone. Even fictional.
This what happens when govts think they have no serious opposition. Sloppy proposals come out. It was "brave", it does try to tackle something that we all need to resolve, and this will now shoot right up the agenda for whoever is in No 10 on June 9th. But you do not insert into your manifesto very complex policy and detail like this on the hoof 21 days before an election.
Whoever is responsible in Tory HQ is, I assume, searching the sits vac for a whelk stall to run.
Meanwhile Labour are running up the country's bar bill like a drunk that's left his wallet at home but still wants to buy everyone a round.
What an utter disaster. Not only has she capitulated to media pressure (which ruins the 'strong and stable' and 'tough but necessary' campaign themes); by not stating what the cap will be, she ensures that this farrago will run and run.
Maybe working on a collective farm won't be so bad. Like a gap year on a kibbutz, for the rest of your life.
"Après nous, le déluge"?
Cue Tories shouting "Without us, it'll be communism" as their "strong, stable" balloon plummets. All Labour needed was for the spotlight to be put on the government.
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
And I think the Neil interview tonight could actually be more brutal than it might have been half an hour ago.
In more reflective terms I remember us pb Tories getting all terribly excited on Bigotgate Day but it didn't result in a wipeout for Brown; it hardly had any traction at all with the voting public. This might blow over too.
Andrew Neil, who will be now preparing for this interview, has a big problem.
It is in his power to utterly destroy May's reputation credibility and leave the way open for a minority government led by Corbyn.
Or pull his punches and destroy his own reputation and credibility.
What is he to do?
He'll go really hard on Mrs May, as he should.
He'll also be going really hard on Mr Corbyn, and a u-turn on social care is small beer compared to support for the IRA.
And his anti Trident I will not push the button stance
If it has been utterly destroyed, the Tories are out. If anything a major party says can start to look paper-thin quickly, it's a promise from a sitting government that things are going to be OK when living conditions and expectations have fallen for years.
Not so, for the very obvious reason that Theresa May and the Tories are the only game in town. Labour aren't even pretending to be a credible alternative government.
I suspect Labour's ever-growing list of spending promises will not do it any good.
There's a tipping point where people switch from being greedy to being suspicious and then cynical and then angry.
The trick is to make the maximum number of promises that people will believe but not to go so far you start losing more votes from the extra promises than they bring in.
970 comments about this U turn/disaster for TM the PM, but no betting advice?
Deep down the frothers know its not going to change the result much.
I backed under 177.5 Labour seats on Betfair at EVS trying to swim against the tide, it was tipped up as shrewd to be on under 160 not a fortnight ago.
So what are the odds that May scrapes through this election with a small majority, then is immediately challenged for the leadership by the headbangers who think she is going to screw up Brexit as badly as this?
Very low, even allowing for the fact that in the Tory Party, you don't 'challenge' for the leadership. It's not 1990.
The problem that May has is that she's not really suited to electioneering. That skillset, however, is very different from the one needed to run a government or lead negotiations.
If it has been utterly destroyed, the Tories are out. If anything a major party says can start to look paper-thin quickly, it's a promise from a sitting government that things are going to be OK when living conditions and expectations have fallen for years.
Not so, for the very obvious reason that Theresa May and the Tories are the only game in town. Labour aren't even pretending to be a credible alternative government.
I suspect Labour's ever-growing list of spending promises will not do it any good.
There's a tipping point where people switch from being greedy to being suspicious and then cynical and then angry.
The trick is to make the maximum number of promises that people will believe but not to go so far you start losing more votes from the extra promises than they bring in.
The IFS manifesto review tomorrow wil be interesting especially on tax raising, including corporation tax
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Yvette CooperVerified account @YvetteCooperMP 2m2 minutes ago More So it's an optional cap at unspecified level to be included in a future consultation? Can't even do a competent u-turn. Still a #dementiatax
It still has more detail than Labour's position on care costs....
Thats true. As long as that continues for next 17 days job done.
Oh, I think Labour's position might just come under scrutiny next.... and their hypocrisy.
You told me this was a none issue at the Weekend so your view doesnt count
It won't be me asking the questions.
And not a non-issue - just brave, to do what is fair.
If Corbyn's Labour had a positive, easily-understood alternative, he might have been able to make some hay. But if you are worried about your inheritance, you are even more worried about how COrbyn's Labour are looking at umpteen ways to milk you.
I also find it a tad ironic that you are cheer-leading for a party full of people who had more sympathy with the aims of the attacker on that Tunisian beach, than you, holed up in that hotel.
Commission negotiating documents which are shared with EU Member States, the European Council, the European Parliament, the Council, national parliaments, and the United Kingdom will be released to the public
PMSL
And then there is this.... "A French lawyer ... Julien Fouchet ... [a] European law specialist from Bordeaux wants to challenge the validity of the EU negotiations on the basis the procedure was flawed ... It will call for the cancellation of the Brexit negotiating directives drafted by the EU, which are due to be adopted on 22 May, on the basis the referendum breached the rights of the UK citizens who were denied the vote. "
Meaningless, since the referendum was advisory only.
In fact, the Supreme Court saved Theresa's bacon. She was insisting going ahead without a parliamentary vote.
Yes, but the other side of the coin is that, regardless of our legal system, the Commission has to follow the EU's legal system. We need two sides to negotiate.
All the treaty required is that A50 was declared "in accordance with its own constitutional requirements". That has been done.
970 comments about this U turn/disaster for TM the PM, but no betting advice?
Look at the next PM markets. And TM exit dates
I have no idea about the Next PM market. There's a good article to be written after the GE about it but so much depends on the result and the reshuffle (assuming there is one), not to mention the timing of a vacancy. There is no Tory heir apparent at the moment.
Out of curiosity may I ask where you were canvassing the other day ?
I am starting to think that Theresa May is a Corbynista plant. Not in his wildest dreams could Big Jezza have imagined how pisspoor a campaigner she would be.
They knew what they were doing when they kept her away from a televised debate that's for sure.
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Politically it was bad but financially we have to pay more for personal social care at home, not just residential care, it was just a sledgehammer was used to crack a nut, hence the u turn
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
He who fights and runs away Lives to fight another day.
I think I am glad she has done it, but this is no one's finest hour.
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
It may also bring into play labour and lib dems proposals, their cap, and how they would pay for it
Yvette CooperVerified account @YvetteCooperMP 2m2 minutes ago More So it's an optional cap at unspecified level to be included in a future consultation? Can't even do a competent u-turn. Still a #dementiatax
It still has more detail than Labour's position on care costs....
Thats true. As long as that continues for next 17 days job done.
Oh, I think Labour's position might just come under scrutiny next.... and their hypocrisy.
You told me this was a none issue at the Weekend so your view doesnt count
It won't be me asking the questions.
And not a non-issue - just brave, to do what is fair.
If Corbyn's Labour had a positive, easily-understood alternative, he might have been able to make some hay. But if you are worried about your inheritance, you are even more worried about how COrbyn's Labour are looking at umpteen ways to milk you.
I also find it a tad ironic that you are cheer-leading for a party full of people who had more sympathy with the aims of the attacker on that Tunisian beach, than you, holed up in that hotel.
All shootings are wrong, whether they be Islamic terrorists killing British holidaymakers, or tragedies like the death of Osama Bin Laden
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
I agree. This is a bad day at the office for May, but will be forgotten by end of the week as we move onto other matters.
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
U-TURN can be good, as you say. "PARTIAL AND UNCLEAR U-TURN WHICH THEY SAY ISN'T A U-TURN", not so much.
2 u-turns in 2 months, I look forward to the next 2 years...
The big one will be over a second EU referendum. There's no other way to get off the massive hook the government is on.
The LDs complete failure this election on a second referendum platform means that is now dead, if May wins it is Brexit and no free movement, no single market membership and no €100 billion to the EU
He'll also be going really hard on Mr Corbyn, and a u-turn on social care is small beer compared to support for the IRA.
Really? The thing about 1983 and 1992 when the Tories also ran very negative campaigns against the leader of the opposition was that they focused on the opposition manifesto.
In 2017 the IRA isn't even mentioned in the Labour manifesto, which isn't surprising since it hasn't existed for many years. Moreover, practically everyone thinks that the eventual cooperation between Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness was a good thing, and much better than people getting killed. Ken Livingstone was actually right when he said there would come a day when IRA leaders would shake hands with the queen. Never mind that Corbyn talked crap about the IRA in the 1980s, or even that they were a murderous gangster organisation (which they were) - who cares?
I'd be really surprised if the "Corbyn IRA" line from the Tories was properly tested in focus groups against other issues.
So what are the odds that May scrapes through this election with a small majority, then is immediately challenged for the leadership by the headbangers who think she is going to screw up Brexit as badly as this?
Very low, even allowing for the fact that in the Tory Party, you don't 'challenge' for the leadership. It's not 1990.
The problem that May has is that she's not really suited to electioneering. That skillset, however, is very different from the one needed to run a government or lead negotiations.
She also really REALLY needs to widen her circle of advisors. She HAS to learn from this disaster. Get out of the bunker, put Timothy and Hill back in their box, get some smart people who will answer back or correct her.
This debacle all comes from her reliance on a tiny group of wonks that have been with her for yonks. Not healthy.
True. And worse, her advisors don't have the broad policy or political background that a LotO would take into No 10. The demands of the Home Office are much more limited, not only in policy (obviously) but also in political leadership. That applies to the private office as much as to the politician.
970 comments about this U turn/disaster for TM the PM, but no betting advice?
Look at the next PM markets. And TM exit dates
I have no idea about the Next PM market. There's a good article to be written after the GE about it but so much depends on the result and the reshuffle (assuming there is one), not to mention the timing of a vacancy. There is no Tory heir apparent at the moment.
Out of curiosity may I ask where you were canvassing the other day ?
Which other day? I've been out a lot this last month.
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
U-TURN can be good, as you say. "PARTIAL AND UNCLEAR U-TURN WHICH THEY SAY ISN'T A U-TURN", not so much.
This is a good u-turn, as long as the cap is something that people can feel is not ridiculous, such as £500K or whatever.
Yvette CooperVerified account @YvetteCooperMP 2m2 minutes ago More So it's an optional cap at unspecified level to be included in a future consultation? Can't even do a competent u-turn. Still a #dementiatax
It still has more detail than Labour's position on care costs....
Thats true. As long as that continues for next 17 days job done.
Oh, I think Labour's position might just come under scrutiny next.... and their hypocrisy.
You told me this was a none issue at the Weekend so your view doesnt count
It won't be me asking the questions.
And not a non-issue - just brave, to do what is fair.
If Corbyn's Labour had a positive, easily-understood alternative, he might have been able to make some hay. But if you are worried about your inheritance, you are even more worried about how COrbyn's Labour are looking at umpteen ways to milk you.
I also find it a tad ironic that you are cheer-leading for a party full of people who had more sympathy with the aims of the attacker on that Tunisian beach, than you, holed up in that hotel.
All shootings are wrong, whether they be Islamic terrorists killing British holidaymakers, or tragedies like the death of Osama Bin Laden
Thank you for calling the show, Jeremy from North London there.....
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
He who fights and runs away Lives to fight another day.
I think I am glad she has done it, but this is no one's finest hour.
Sure. It's a botch job, a stupid, avoidable mess, but the alternative is Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn.
I've come to my senses and realised that No, I couldn't ever vote for him. No matter how shit the Tories might be. And there IS a real risk, if the trend continues, that he could be leader of the largest party, and thus PM, in Coalition with Sturgeon. The worst of all worlds.
And I think the Neil interview tonight could actually be more brutal than it might have been half an hour ago.
In more reflective terms I remember us pb Tories getting all terribly excited on Bigotgate Day but it didn't result in a wipeout for Brown; it hardly had any traction at all with the voting public. This might blow over too.
Mrs Duffy was in fact a bigot so Gordo was only telling the truth.
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
U-TURN can be good, as you say. "PARTIAL AND UNCLEAR U-TURN WHICH THEY SAY ISN'T A U-TURN", not so much.
In fairness Nick the question will now be asked of labour. Are they in favour of lifetime security of tenure, increasing the capital to £100,000 and what cap they would apply and, as important, how would it be paid for
So what are the odds that May scrapes through this election with a small majority, then is immediately challenged for the leadership by the headbangers who think she is going to screw up Brexit as badly as this?
Very low, even allowing for the fact that in the Tory Party, you don't 'challenge' for the leadership. It's not 1990.
The problem that May has is that she's not really suited to electioneering. That skillset, however, is very different from the one needed to run a government or lead negotiations.
She also really REALLY needs to widen her circle of advisors. She HAS to learn from this disaster. Get out of the bunker, put Timothy and Hill back in their box, get some smart people who will answer back or correct her.
This debacle all comes from her reliance on a tiny group of wonks that have been with her for yonks. Not healthy.
True. And worse, her advisors don't have the broad policy or political background that a LotO would take into No 10. The demands of the Home Office are much more limited, not only in policy (obviously) but also in political leadership. That applies to the private office as much as to the politician.
It's time for the PB Tories to take over! DH can be PM, RobD can have 'spreadsheet Phil's' job and SeanT gets to do foreign affairs! TSE can be Lynton if he wants....
970 comments about this U turn/disaster for TM the PM, but no betting advice?
Look at the next PM markets. And TM exit dates
I have no idea about the Next PM market. There's a good article to be written after the GE about it but so much depends on the result and the reshuffle (assuming there is one), not to mention the timing of a vacancy. There is no Tory heir apparent at the moment.
Out of curiosity may I ask where you were canvassing the other day ?
Which other day? I've been out a lot this last month.
Any day but the more info the more it would be appreciated.
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Politically it was bad but financially we have to pay more for personal social care at home, not just residential care, it was just a sledgehammer was used to crack a nut, hence the u turn
What is really needed is a cross party consensus on this subject.
"A cross-party commission should be set up to review the future of the NHS and social care in England, a trio of former health ministers say. Ex-health secretaries Stephen Dorrell and Alan Milburn and Lib Dem MP Norman Lamb say without radical change, the future looks bleak. Mr Lamb will raise the issue in Parliament on Wednesday, warning that the systems could crash without action."
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
U-TURN can be good, as you say. "PARTIAL AND UNCLEAR U-TURN WHICH THEY SAY ISN'T A U-TURN", not so much.
This is a good u-turn, as long as the cap is something that people can feel is not ridiculous, such as £500K or whatever.
She says it will be consulted on so no doubt Dilnot and other experts will present their views
Ministers now saying they were only talking about Dilnot's cap when they rejected it
So the cap is greater than £78k then.
Of course. The question is how much bigger.
and is the same definition applying re hotel costs not counting towards the cap or not....
Indeed. One of the problems they have now, is that people have rapidly been bought up to speed on the issue that very few voters had thought about before.
In my own case, I am seeing my solicitor later in the week!
So what are the odds that May scrapes through this election with a small majority, then is immediately challenged for the leadership by the headbangers who think she is going to screw up Brexit as badly as this?
Very low, even allowing for the fact that in the Tory Party, you don't 'challenge' for the leadership. It's not 1990.
The problem that May has is that she's not really suited to electioneering. That skillset, however, is very different from the one needed to run a government or lead negotiations.
She also really REALLY needs to widen her circle of advisors. She HAS to learn from this disaster. Get out of the bunker, put Timothy and Hill back in their box, get some smart people who will answer back or correct her.
This debacle all comes from her reliance on a tiny group of wonks that have been with her for yonks. Not healthy.
True. And worse, her advisors don't have the broad policy or political background that a LotO would take into No 10. The demands of the Home Office are much more limited, not only in policy (obviously) but also in political leadership. That applies to the private office as much as to the politician.
It's time for the PB Tories to take over! DH can be PM, RobD can have 'spreadsheet Phil's' job and SeanT gets to do foreign affairs! TSE can be Lynton if he wants....
So what are the odds that May scrapes through this election with a small majority, then is immediately challenged for the leadership by the headbangers who think she is going to screw up Brexit as badly as this?
Very low, even allowing for the fact that in the Tory Party, you don't 'challenge' for the leadership. It's not 1990.
The problem that May has is that she's not really suited to electioneering. That skillset, however, is very different from the one needed to run a government or lead negotiations.
She also really REALLY needs to widen her circle of advisors. She HAS to learn from this disaster. Get out of the bunker, put Timothy and Hill back in their box, get some smart people who will answer back or correct her.
This debacle all comes from her reliance on a tiny group of wonks that have been with her for yonks. Not healthy.
True. And worse, her advisors don't have the broad policy or political background that a LotO would take into No 10. The demands of the Home Office are much more limited, not only in policy (obviously) but also in political leadership. That applies to the private office as much as to the politician.
A very sharp observation. Plus, I assume she wasn't part of the inner circle for either election 2015 or the EU Referendum?
So what are the odds that May scrapes through this election with a small majority, then is immediately challenged for the leadership by the headbangers who think she is going to screw up Brexit as badly as this?
Very low, even allowing for the fact that in the Tory Party, you don't 'challenge' for the leadership. It's not 1990.
The problem that May has is that she's not really suited to electioneering. That skillset, however, is very different from the one needed to run a government or lead negotiations.
She also really REALLY needs to widen her circle of advisors. She HAS to learn from this disaster. Get out of the bunker, put Timothy and Hill back in their box, get some smart people who will answer back or correct her.
This debacle all comes from her reliance on a tiny group of wonks that have been with her for yonks. Not healthy.
True. And worse, her advisors don't have the broad policy or political background that a LotO would take into No 10. The demands of the Home Office are much more limited, not only in policy (obviously) but also in political leadership. That applies to the private office as much as to the politician.
It's time for the PB Tories to take over! DH can be PM, RobD can have 'spreadsheet Phil's' job and SeanT gets to do foreign affairs! TSE can be Lynton if he wants....
Someone a few days called me 'A pound shop Lynton Crosby'
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
I agree. This is a bad day at the office for May, but will be forgotten by end of the week as we move onto other matters.
I think some will be blowing raspberries and taking the piss for a bit longer than that.
Yvette CooperVerified account @YvetteCooperMP 2m2 minutes ago More So it's an optional cap at unspecified level to be included in a future consultation? Can't even do a competent u-turn. Still a #dementiatax
It still has more detail than Labour's position on care costs....
Thats true. As long as that continues for next 17 days job done.
Oh, I think Labour's position might just come under scrutiny next.... and their hypocrisy.
No one doubts that the Tories are going to win so Labour are largely irrelevant right now, what is more important to our future for the next couple is whether we are going to get "strong and stable" or "weak and wobbly" and it's not looking good as we speak.
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
He who fights and runs away Lives to fight another day.
I think I am glad she has done it, but this is no one's finest hour.
Sure. It's a botch job, a stupid, avoidable mess, but the alternative is Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn.
I've come to my senses and realised that No, I couldn't ever vote for him. No matter how shit the Tories might be. And there IS a real risk, if the trend continues, that he could be leader of the largest party, and thus PM, in Coalition with Sturgeon. The worst of all worlds.
We have to hold our noses and give TMay the job.
Lab - most seats has dropped to 15.5 on BF.
No chance TMICIPM (Increased Majority) Nailed On.
From my point of view betting wise anything under 399.5 seats will pay for 6 months social care under current rules or 2.5 weeks under Tory proposals
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Politically it was bad but financially we have to pay more for personal social care at home, not just residential care, it was just a sledgehammer was used to crack a nut, hence the u turn
What is really needed is a cross party consensus on this subject.
"A cross-party commission should be set up to review the future of the NHS and social care in England, a trio of former health ministers say. Ex-health secretaries Stephen Dorrell and Alan Milburn and Lib Dem MP Norman Lamb say without radical change, the future looks bleak. Mr Lamb will raise the issue in Parliament on Wednesday, warning that the systems could crash without action."
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
U-TURN can be good, as you say. "PARTIAL AND UNCLEAR U-TURN WHICH THEY SAY ISN'T A U-TURN", not so much.
All people will hear is the words "TORY U-TURN". Which is all they want to hear, as they REALLY don't want to vote for Jeremy. They want an excuse to forgive their bumbling prime minister, and trust her again, as the alternative is too scary and bearded.
When was the last time a party with a leader who was perceived to be bumbling got re-elected?
And if people engage their intellects, which many won't, they'll realise that any more U-turns that would be welcome from the Tories will be much harder to extract if they win the election.
So what are the odds that May scrapes through this election with a small majority, then is immediately challenged for the leadership by the headbangers who think she is going to screw up Brexit as badly as this?
Very low, even allowing for the fact that in the Tory Party, you don't 'challenge' for the leadership. It's not 1990.
The problem that May has is that she's not really suited to electioneering. That skillset, however, is very different from the one needed to run a government or lead negotiations.
She also really REALLY needs to widen her circle of advisors. She HAS to learn from this disaster. Get out of the bunker, put Timothy and Hill back in their box, get some smart people who will answer back or correct her.
This debacle all comes from her reliance on a tiny group of wonks that have been with her for yonks. Not healthy.
True. And worse, her advisors don't have the broad policy or political background that a LotO would take into No 10. The demands of the Home Office are much more limited, not only in policy (obviously) but also in political leadership. That applies to the private office as much as to the politician.
A very sharp observation. Plus, I assume she wasn't part of the inner circle for either election 2015 or the EU Referendum?
Dominic Cummings should be at the heart of the Tory election machine. His Leave campaign was genius.
Ministers now saying they were only talking about Dilnot's cap when they rejected it
So the cap is greater than £78k then.
Of course. The question is how much bigger.
and is the same definition applying re hotel costs not counting towards the cap or not....
Indeed. One of the problems they have now, is that people have rapidly been bought up to speed on the issue that very few voters had thought about before.
In my own case, I am seeing my solicitor later in the week!
Yes. This is the killer fact. Few knew of this issue outside of Westminster and the wonks and fewer still were going to worry about it before June 8th. As soon as it became general knowledge that your house was up for grabs no amount of logic was going to sway folk. Flight or fight. The policy was not bonkers per se at all but as soon as you point out people's houses are in play (even if the detail says that's exactly what you are avoiding happening), it's pure raw emotional response.
So what are the odds that May scrapes through this election with a small majority, then is immediately challenged for the leadership by the headbangers who think she is going to screw up Brexit as badly as this?
Very low, even allowing for the fact that in the Tory Party, you don't 'challenge' for the leadership. It's not 1990.
The problem that May has is that she's not really suited to electioneering. That skillset, however, is very different from the one needed to run a government or lead negotiations.
She also really REALLY needs to widen her circle of advisors. She HAS to learn from this disaster. Get out of the bunker, put Timothy and Hill back in their box, get some smart people who will answer back or correct her.
This debacle all comes from her reliance on a tiny group of wonks that have been with her for yonks. Not healthy.
True. And worse, her advisors don't have the broad policy or political background that a LotO would take into No 10. The demands of the Home Office are much more limited, not only in policy (obviously) but also in political leadership. That applies to the private office as much as to the politician.
It's time for the PB Tories to take over! DH can be PM, RobD can have 'spreadsheet Phil's' job and SeanT gets to do foreign affairs! TSE can be Lynton if he wants....
TSE wants to run the Evening Standard, and would do it very well.
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
He who fights and runs away Lives to fight another day.
I think I am glad she has done it, but this is no one's finest hour.
Sure. It's a botch job, a stupid, avoidable mess, but the alternative is Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn.
I've come to my senses and realised that No, I couldn't ever vote for him. No matter how shit the Tories might be. And there IS a real risk, if the trend continues, that he could be leader of the largest party, and thus PM, in Coalition with Sturgeon. The worst of all worlds.
We have to hold our noses and give TMay the job.
Lab - most seats has dropped to 15.5 on BF.
No chance TMICIPM (Increased Majority) Nailed On.
From my point of view betting wise anything under 399.5 seats will pay for 6 months social care under current rules or 2.5 weeks under Tory proposals
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
U-TURN can be good, as you say. "PARTIAL AND UNCLEAR U-TURN WHICH THEY SAY ISN'T A U-TURN", not so much.
All people will hear is the words "TORY U-TURN". Which is all they want to hear, as they REALLY don't want to vote for Jeremy. They want an excuse to forgive their bumbling prime minister, and trust her again, as the alternative is too scary and bearded.
When was the last time a party with a leader who was perceived to be bumbling got re-elected?
And if people engage their intellects, which many won't, they'll realise that any more U-turns that would be welcome from the Tories will be much harder to extract if they win the election.
Ministers now saying they were only talking about Dilnot's cap when they rejected it
So the cap is greater than £78k then.
Of course. The question is how much bigger.
and is the same definition applying re hotel costs not counting towards the cap or not....
Indeed. One of the problems they have now, is that people have rapidly been bought up to speed on the issue that very few voters had thought about before.
In my own case, I am seeing my solicitor later in the week!
I think a better use of your time is to consult the charities like Alzheimers UK or Parkinsons UK or Age Concern. They’ll probably answer your questions & give you the same advice that a solicitor will, but for free.
In the case of my mother, I have to say I found Parkinson’s Uk absolutely invaluable. We gave a donation to the charity from her estate after she passed away.
Overall, though, there has to be more money coming in to Social Care, other wise it will collapse. Identifying where that money will come from should be the main aim of everyone.
@DPJHodges: May's U-turn won't have much impact on the election. But in terms of how her party and cabinet engage with her post election, it's seismic.
So what are the odds that May scrapes through this election with a small majority, then is immediately challenged for the leadership by the headbangers who think she is going to screw up Brexit as badly as this?
Very low, even allowing for the fact that in the Tory Party, you don't 'challenge' for the leadership. It's not 1990.
The problem that May has is that she's not really suited to electioneering. That skillset, however, is very different from the one needed to run a government or lead negotiations.
She also really REALLY needs to widen her circle of advisors. She HAS to learn from this disaster. Get out of the bunker, put Timothy and Hill back in their box, get some smart people who will answer back or correct her.
This debacle all comes from her reliance on a tiny group of wonks that have been with her for yonks. Not healthy.
True. And worse, her advisors don't have the broad policy or political background that a LotO would take into No 10. The demands of the Home Office are much more limited, not only in policy (obviously) but also in political leadership. That applies to the private office as much as to the politician.
A very sharp observation. Plus, I assume she wasn't part of the inner circle for either election 2015 or the EU Referendum?
Dominic Cummings should be at the heart of the Tory election machine. His Leave campaign was genius.
Labour Leave should be at the heart of the Tory election machine - they were much better than this!
One group of people who will have paid close attention to the U-turn under pressure will be the Eurosceptic parliamentary group. Getting a Brexit deal through the Commons just got harder.
The public must surely start becoming deeply suspicious of Corbyn's brazen attampts at bribery today, writing off billions of pounds of debts and promising policies, on student loans/maintenance fees, costing an eye watering 11 billion quid. He is chucking around money that he does not have and will never have, because it will go straight onto the tab.
On top of all the other fantastic promises, why oh why oh why hasn't their manifesto been dismantled piece by piece? I believe it has not come under anything like the scrutiny it would have if people genuinely believed they could be the next government. This has to change, because even if there is a million to one chance of Corbyn becoming PM, the consequences must be explained in great detail.
By the way, I thought May actually did pretty well in that speech. She had to do something, I suppose, and I guess even a U turn, embarrassing as it is, will be worth the short term damage in the end.
This last few days has rocked the Tories to the core, there's no point denying that now, but Corbyn & co offer them all the ammunition they could ever wish for in an opposition party, and they have to - must do - and I believe will do - expalin to the public what the catastrophc consequences of a Corbyn government would do to this country.
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
He who fights and runs away Lives to fight another day.
I think I am glad she has done it, but this is no one's finest hour.
Sure. It's a botch job, a stupid, avoidable mess, but the alternative is Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn.
I've come to my senses and realised that No, I couldn't ever vote for him. No matter how shit the Tories might be. And there IS a real risk, if the trend continues, that he could be leader of the largest party, and thus PM, in Coalition with Sturgeon. The worst of all worlds.
We have to hold our noses and give TMay the job.
No we don't , you vote for a donkey wearing a blue rosette if you want and get a government of asses Many think the country deserves better
I'm not even sure this u turn solves the issue. People aren't concerned about a cap, they are pissed at the prospect of having to pay at all. Whatever the realities of the situation, they are trying to sell a cup of sick. Should have avoided.
Exactly. A lot of the problem wasn't the plan, it was highlighting (and therefore taking ownership of) the existing set up.
Hmm. Remember: most people only listen to the soundbites and the headlines. They don't do political detail.
What's the big story of today? - TORY U-TURN. That precise phrase is trending number one on Twitter. So everyone will now think "Oh that horrible Tory policy has been ditched", and their anger will abate. TORY U-TURN is the meme that the Tories want out there, and they want it constantly repeated, and Labour are doing that job for them.
It won't be nice for Tory egos, but TORY U-TURN will drain the poison of DEMENTIA TAX - another simple, slightly deceitful and very powerful meme.
HMS TMay has taken some incoming, she's not holed below the waterline, yet.
He who fights and runs away Lives to fight another day.
I think I am glad she has done it, but this is no one's finest hour.
Sure. It's a botch job, a stupid, avoidable mess, but the alternative is Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn.
I've come to my senses and realised that No, I couldn't ever vote for him. No matter how shit the Tories might be. And there IS a real risk, if the trend continues, that he could be leader of the largest party, and thus PM, in Coalition with Sturgeon. The worst of all worlds.
We have to hold our noses and give TMay the job.
No we don't , you vote for a donkey wearing a blue rosette if you want and get a government of asses Many think the country deserves better
The alternatives are Farron and Corbyn. Better isn't on offer.
Ministers now saying they were only talking about Dilnot's cap when they rejected it
So the cap is greater than £78k then.
Of course. The question is how much bigger.
and is the same definition applying re hotel costs not counting towards the cap or not....
Indeed. One of the problems they have now, is that people have rapidly been bought up to speed on the issue that very few voters had thought about before.
In my own case, I am seeing my solicitor later in the week!
Yes. This is the killer fact. Few knew of this issue outside of Westminster and the wonks and fewer still were going to worry about it before June 8th. As soon as it became general knowledge that your house was up for grabs no amount of logic was going to sway folk. Flight or fight. The policy was not bonkers per se at all but as soon as you point out people's houses are in play (even if the detail says that's exactly what you are avoiding happening), it's pure raw emotional response.
I certainly had no idea there was such a lottery in local councils and whether they snatched your home immediately, or deferred the snatch until you die.
So what are the odds that May scrapes through this election with a small majority, then is immediately challenged for the leadership by the headbangers who think she is going to screw up Brexit as badly as this?
Very low, even allowing for the fact that in the Tory Party, you don't 'challenge' for the leadership. It's not 1990.
The problem that May has is that she's not really suited to electioneering. That skillset, however, is very different from the one needed to run a government or lead negotiations.
She also really REALLY needs to widen her circle of advisors. She HAS to learn from this disaster. Get out of the bunker, put Timothy and Hill back in their box, get some smart people who will answer back or correct her.
This debacle all comes from her reliance on a tiny group of wonks that have been with her for yonks. Not healthy.
True. And worse, her advisors don't have the broad policy or political background that a LotO would take into No 10. The demands of the Home Office are much more limited, not only in policy (obviously) but also in political leadership. That applies to the private office as much as to the politician.
It's time for the PB Tories to take over! DH can be PM, RobD can have 'spreadsheet Phil's' job and SeanT gets to do foreign affairs! TSE can be Lynton if he wants....
So what are the odds that May scrapes through this election with a small majority, then is immediately challenged for the leadership by the headbangers who think she is going to screw up Brexit as badly as this?
Very low, even allowing for the fact that in the Tory Party, you don't 'challenge' for the leadership. It's not 1990.
The problem that May has is that she's not really suited to electioneering. That skillset, however, is very different from the one needed to run a government or lead negotiations.
She also really REALLY needs to widen her circle of advisors. She HAS to learn from this disaster. Get out of the bunker, put Timothy and Hill back in their box, get some smart people who will answer back or correct her.
This debacle all comes from her reliance on a tiny group of wonks that have been with her for yonks. Not healthy.
True. And worse, her advisors don't have the broad policy or political background that a LotO would take into No 10. The demands of the Home Office are much more limited, not only in policy (obviously) but also in political leadership. That applies to the private office as much as to the politician.
It's time for the PB Tories to take over! DH can be PM, RobD can have 'spreadsheet Phil's' job and SeanT gets to do foreign affairs! TSE can be Lynton if he wants....
So what are the odds that May scrapes through this election with a small majority, then is immediately challenged for the leadership by the headbangers who think she is going to screw up Brexit as badly as this?
Very low, even allowing for the fact that in the Tory Party, you don't 'challenge' for the leadership. It's not 1990.
The problem that May has is that she's not really suited to electioneering. That skillset, however, is very different from the one needed to run a government or lead negotiations.
She also really REALLY needs to widen her circle of advisors. She HAS to learn from this disaster. Get out of the bunker, put Timothy and Hill back in their box, get some smart people who will answer back or correct her.
This debacle all comes from her reliance on a tiny group of wonks that have been with her for yonks. Not healthy.
True. And worse, her advisors don't have the broad policy or political background that a LotO would take into No 10. The demands of the Home Office are much more limited, not only in policy (obviously) but also in political leadership. That applies to the private office as much as to the politician.
It's time for the PB Tories to take over! DH can be PM, RobD can have 'spreadsheet Phil's' job and SeanT gets to do foreign affairs! TSE can be Lynton if he wants....
Comments
How do so many fuckwits get so far in politics? Is it because the sane amongst us can't be arsed?
He'll also be going really hard on Mr Corbyn, and a u-turn on social care is small beer compared to support for the IRA.
Democracy in action I guess, the people have blown a raspberry and the (current) powers that be have gone into an emergency handbrake turn. So "good" in that narrow sense.
You give the impression (even unwittingly, and out of good intentions) of threatening people's homes in this country, and you won't last to the next news cycle. It engendered a "flight or fight" response - all parties will note that.
By far the most shambolic few days I can ever remember in any general election. Ever, from anyone. Even fictional.
This what happens when govts think they have no serious opposition. Sloppy proposals come out. It was "brave", it does try to tackle something that we all need to resolve, and this will now shoot right up the agenda for whoever is in No 10 on June 9th. But you do not insert into your manifesto very complex policy and detail like this on the hoof 21 days before an election.
Whoever is responsible in Tory HQ is, I assume, searching the sits vac for a whelk stall to run.
Meanwhile Labour are running up the country's bar bill like a drunk that's left his wallet at home but still wants to buy everyone a round.
Cue Tories shouting "Without us, it'll be communism" as their "strong, stable" balloon plummets. All Labour needed was for the spotlight to be put on the government.
There's a tipping point where people switch from being greedy to being suspicious and then cynical and then angry.
The trick is to make the maximum number of promises that people will believe but not to go so far you start losing more votes from the extra promises than they bring in.
Mind you its 11/10 now!
And not a non-issue - just brave, to do what is fair.
If Corbyn's Labour had a positive, easily-understood alternative, he might have been able to make some hay. But if you are worried about your inheritance, you are even more worried about how COrbyn's Labour are looking at umpteen ways to milk you.
I also find it a tad ironic that you are cheer-leading for a party full of people who had more sympathy with the aims of the attacker on that Tunisian beach, than you, holed up in that hotel.
Compare with politicians who prefer to surround themselves with like-minds, arse-lickers and the self-serving.
So the cap is greater than £78k then.
They knew what they were doing when they kept her away from a televised debate that's for sure.
Lives to fight another day.
I think I am glad she has done it, but this is no one's finest hour.
Why is Crosby thought of as infallible on here?
In 2017 the IRA isn't even mentioned in the Labour manifesto, which isn't surprising since it hasn't existed for many years. Moreover, practically everyone thinks that the eventual cooperation between Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness was a good thing, and much better than people getting killed. Ken Livingstone was actually right when he said there would come a day when IRA leaders would shake hands with the queen. Never mind that Corbyn talked crap about the IRA in the 1980s, or even that they were a murderous gangster organisation (which they were) - who cares?
I'd be really surprised if the "Corbyn IRA" line from the Tories was properly tested in focus groups against other issues.
Usually out my midday I thought?
It might be of interest betting wise
"A cross-party commission should be set up to review the future of the NHS and social care in England, a trio of former health ministers say.
Ex-health secretaries Stephen Dorrell and Alan Milburn and Lib Dem MP Norman Lamb say without radical change, the future looks bleak.
Mr Lamb will raise the issue in Parliament on Wednesday, warning that the systems could crash without action."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-35233346
In my own case, I am seeing my solicitor later in the week!
Fingers on buzzers....
cunning I call it...
and hopefully finally something will be done on social care funding post election.
From my point of view betting wise anything under 399.5 seats will pay for 6 months social care under current rules or 2.5 weeks under Tory proposals
And if people engage their intellects, which many won't, they'll realise that any more U-turns that would be welcome from the Tories will be much harder to extract if they win the election.
In the case of my mother, I have to say I found Parkinson’s Uk absolutely invaluable. We gave a donation to the charity from her estate after she passed away.
Overall, though, there has to be more money coming in to Social Care, other wise it will collapse. Identifying where that money will come from should be the main aim of everyone.
NEW THREAD
On top of all the other fantastic promises, why oh why oh why hasn't their manifesto been dismantled piece by piece? I believe it has not come under anything like the scrutiny it would have if people genuinely believed they could be the next government. This has to change, because even if there is a million to one chance of Corbyn becoming PM, the consequences must be explained in great detail.
By the way, I thought May actually did pretty well in that speech. She had to do something, I suppose, and I guess even a U turn, embarrassing as it is, will be worth the short term damage in the end.
This last few days has rocked the Tories to the core, there's no point denying that now, but Corbyn & co offer them all the ammunition they could ever wish for in an opposition party, and they have to - must do - and I believe will do - expalin to the public what the catastrophc consequences of a Corbyn government would do to this country.
https://twitter.com/LabourEoin/status/866213350799179777