politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » UKIP’s leader, Doc Nuttall, no longer odds-on favourite to tak
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I'm still not convinced it is easy as all that.John_M said:
Yep, this is their Gettysburg. Weak local candidate vs party leader. Strong Leave vote. Labour leader madder by the day. If they can't win Stoke, we can stick a fork in 'em and call it done.dixiedean said:Brexit capital or no, if UKIP can't win in Stoke with their leader standing, they won't win any Labour seats. Their much publicised Northern breakthrough will last as long as Jurgen Klopp's wonder side. Will have to go back to pestering Tories on the East coast.
In Copeland, the Cons are only 2k votes behind so can hope to win on differential turnout without needing switchers. It is also a clear 2 horse race
In Stoke, UKIP are 5k votes behind and competing with the Cons for second place. Even if some Lab sit on their hands, UKIP still also need to get switchers from either Con or Lab.0 -
Why is that silly from their point of view? It might be eminently sensible.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Jessop, by that, I'm referring to the apparent necessity of us leaving this Euratom thingummyjig only to rejoin it immediately as an associate.
If they let us back in, that is.0 -
Actually, Mr D, our departure from Euratom is specified in the A50 Bill.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Jessop, by that, I'm referring to the apparent necessity of us leaving this Euratom thingummyjig only to rejoin it immediately as an associate.
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So many of these occurrences of these incidents now, I think we need a thread on top 10...I think my favourite was the one where he is approached, comes towards the camera / reporter, reporter says Mr corbyn .... from sky news and he does an about turn and runs through some doors.dr_spyn said:PA video of Corbyn in Stoke.
https://twitter.com/PA/status/8253431811894231040 -
King Cole, ah, well that seems even sillier.
Mr. Jessop, having a mechanism to leave but making it tedious for those concerned is daft.
Mr. Vale2, I also think the Lib Dems will be resurgent. Aren't they focusing on Stoke?0 -
Only because Lisbon+ says we have to.OldKingCole said:
Actually, Mr D, our departure from Euratom is specified in the A50 Bill.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Jessop, by that, I'm referring to the apparent necessity of us leaving this Euratom thingummyjig only to rejoin it immediately as an associate.
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Another angry 'winner'. Presumably he hasn't found enough drinkable liberals' tears to soothe his savage breast.
"DA: Man kicked Muslim woman at JFK airport, said 'Trump is here now'"
http://tinyurl.com/j6a938x0 -
It seems that some of our resident Leavers are having difficulty with the concept that Brexit means Brexit.0
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Multiple countries are involved. Lawyers are involved. Worse, highly paid, international lawyers are involved. They want tedious, partly because they earn more, and partly because the agreements have to have a certain complexity.Morris_Dancer said:King Cole, ah, well that seems even sillier.
Mr. Jessop, having a mechanism to leave but making it tedious for those concerned is daft.
Mr. Vale2, I also think the Lib Dems will be resurgent. Aren't they focusing on Stoke?
As an aside, has any lawyer ever simplified a contract or agreement ?
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Mr. Jessop, quite agree.
[I must be quite tired too, I almost called you King Jessop].0 -
Quite the opposite. Do you know what " chaos " means ?JosiasJessop said:The chaos starts:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-387835120 -
Yes. Your point being?MonikerDiCanio said:
Quite the opposite. Do you know what " chaos " means ?JosiasJessop said:The chaos starts:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-387835120 -
Pleb Jessop, please. )Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Jessop, quite agree.
[I must be quite tired too, I almost called you King Jessop].0 -
Define "simplify":JosiasJessop said:
Multiple countries are involved. Lawyers are involved. Worse, highly paid, international lawyers are involved. They want tedious, partly because they earn more, and partly because the agreements have to have a certain complexity.Morris_Dancer said:King Cole, ah, well that seems even sillier.
Mr. Jessop, having a mechanism to leave but making it tedious for those concerned is daft.
Mr. Vale2, I also think the Lib Dems will be resurgent. Aren't they focusing on Stoke?
As an aside, has any lawyer ever simplified a contract or agreement ?
http://politicalbetting.blogspot.co.uk/2010/07/negotiations-and-love-songs-why.html0 -
My point would be obvious if you knew the real rather than vulgar meaning of chaos.JosiasJessop said:
Yes. Your point being?MonikerDiCanio said:
Quite the opposite. Do you know what " chaos " means ?JosiasJessop said:The chaos starts:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-387835120 -
I do know, thanks. I stand by my words. Now, your point is?MonikerDiCanio said:
My point would be obvious if you knew the real rather than vulgar meaning of chaos.JosiasJessop said:
Yes. Your point being?MonikerDiCanio said:
Quite the opposite. Do you know what " chaos " means ?JosiasJessop said:The chaos starts:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-387835120 -
Plebius Jessopius Minimus?
A nice feature of Roman names was that significant feats would get you a new name. So, Titus Manlius slew a massive Gaul in a duel and took his torque, and became Titus Manlius Torquatus. Marcus Valerius did something similar but was aided by a crow, and became Marcus Valerius Corvus.
Does make me wonder what names our politicians would have added. David Hubris Cameron? Edward Stone Miliband? Margaret Falklands Thatcher?0 -
It's not all that low for a by-election. The turnouts this parliament have been:DavidL said:
Oh yes, I was not suggesting anything lower than 30%. In the 30s is very low for a Parliamentary vote.david_herdson said:
I'd expect turnout to be better than 'very low', even accepting the Stoke Central baseline. I'd be surprised if it's not in the 30s. On that basis, Labour should hold. If it is sub-25, UKIP will stand a good chance. Mike's point is right though: UKIP are not very good at election campaigning and are short of important data which will matter.DavidL said:I find it quite bizarre that UKIP were ever favourites for this seat. I expect a pretty comfortable Labour hold on a very low turnout.
DavidL is quite right that it's bizarre that UKIP were ever favourites given these drags on their vote share and where they're starting from. Personally, I reckon they should be nearer 2/1.
40.3 - Oldham W
33.2 - Sheffield Brightside
43.0 - Ogmore
42.5 - Tooting
25.8 - Batley & Spen
46.8 - Witney
53.4 - Richmond Park
37.1 - Sleaford
So the middle half form the range 37-43. The lower 30s is lowish for a by-election (and that's where I think Stoke will come in) but it's nothing extraordinary.0 -
I find it odd that someone who a couple of days ago was crying over a tragic picture of a victim of Nazi aggression - including comments about her being beaten before death - now excuses violence by talking about "some redness in the woman's shins".SeanT said:
Note that in this story the culprit faces "four years in jail" for causing "some redness in the woman's shins". America is as mad as us. Hence, Trump.Theuniondivvie said:Another angry 'winner'. Presumably he hasn't found enough drinkable liberals' tears to soothe his savage breast.
"DA: Man kicked Muslim woman at JFK airport, said 'Trump is here now'"
http://tinyurl.com/j6a938x
Violence of any sort is to be abhorred, not excused.0 -
That's still theoretically the case in Britain. Viscount Montgomery of Alemein, for example.Morris_Dancer said:Plebius Jessopius Minimus?
A nice feature of Roman names was that significant feats would get you a new name. So, Titus Manlius slew a massive Gaul in a duel and took his torque, and became Titus Manlius Torquatus. Marcus Valerius did something similar but was aided by a crow, and became Marcus Valerius Corvus.
Does make me wonder what names our politicians would have added. David Hubris Cameron? Edward Stone Miliband? Margaret Falklands Thatcher?0 -
Surely chaos has no meaning?MonikerDiCanio said:
Quite the opposite. Do you know what " chaos " means ?JosiasJessop said:The chaos starts:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-387835120 -
US loves long sentences...4 years will be what is asked for, not given.JosiasJessop said:
I find it odd that someone who a couple of days ago was crying over a tragic picture of a victim of Nazi aggression - including comments about her being beaten before death - now excuses violence by talking about "some redness in the woman's shins".SeanT said:
Note that in this story the culprit faces "four years in jail" for causing "some redness in the woman's shins". America is as mad as us. Hence, Trump.Theuniondivvie said:Another angry 'winner'. Presumably he hasn't found enough drinkable liberals' tears to soothe his savage breast.
"DA: Man kicked Muslim woman at JFK airport, said 'Trump is here now'"
http://tinyurl.com/j6a938x
Violence of any sort is to be abhorred, not excused.0 -
The "special relationship" at work
@ShippersUnbound: "The United States is responsible for the United States' policy on refugees". May fails again to condemn Trump
@RobDotHutton: And this after twice ignoring the question when politely asked. We had to shout it out. twitter.com/ShippersUnboun…
@paulwaugh: Proud to say we in the Lobby heckled the PM until she answered the question about Trump's Muslim and refugee ban.0 -
That's a great article, thanks.AlastairMeeks said:
Define "simplify":JosiasJessop said:
Multiple countries are involved. Lawyers are involved. Worse, highly paid, international lawyers are involved. They want tedious, partly because they earn more, and partly because the agreements have to have a certain complexity.Morris_Dancer said:King Cole, ah, well that seems even sillier.
Mr. Jessop, having a mechanism to leave but making it tedious for those concerned is daft.
Mr. Vale2, I also think the Lib Dems will be resurgent. Aren't they focusing on Stoke?
As an aside, has any lawyer ever simplified a contract or agreement ?
http://politicalbetting.blogspot.co.uk/2010/07/negotiations-and-love-songs-why.html
BTW, did your prediction: "It will tinker round the edges, but I expect the tax legislation to be lengthier in 2014 than it is today" come true?0 -
Mr. Herdson, not really. Titles associated with places are different to an additional name which may or may not have a geographical aspect. There's Scipio Africanus, of course, but also Quintus Fabius Maximus.0
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Reductive pish is certainly Tessy's go-to strategy when she can't think of anything else.
https://twitter.com/Torcuil/status/8253799997127352340 -
It seems that some of our resident Remainers have not learned to avoid being smug and self satisfied in their scorn for the views of others.AlastairMeeks said:It seems that some of our resident Leavers are having difficulty with the concept that Brexit means Brexit.
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If 'significant feats' get me a new name, would I be Plebius Jessopius Littoreus Ambulans ?Morris_Dancer said:Plebius Jessopius Minimus?
A nice feature of Roman names was that significant feats would get you a new name. So, Titus Manlius slew a massive Gaul in a duel and took his torque, and became Titus Manlius Torquatus. Marcus Valerius did something similar but was aided by a crow, and became Marcus Valerius Corvus.
Does make me wonder what names our politicians would have added. David Hubris Cameron? Edward Stone Miliband? Margaret Falklands Thatcher?
(my Latin's awful, so please feel free to rip the above to shreds).0 -
I thought I was merely being explanatory and educating the great unwashed of PB. Now my feelings are all bruised and everything.Mortimer said:
It seems that some of our resident Remainers have not learned to avoid being smug and self satisfied in their scorn for the views of others.AlastairMeeks said:It seems that some of our resident Leavers are having difficulty with the concept that Brexit means Brexit.
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Mr. Jessop, mine's awful too, so I only get the Ambulans bit.0
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@Ed_Miliband: PM's refusal to condemn Trump Muslim ban is shocking, wrong and cannot stand. It flies in the face of the values of people across Britain.0
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So if I've got this straight, it's because the Lisbon Treaty supersedes membership of Euratom. So all those hyper-ventilating scientists should calm down, we have not suddenly turned anti-science or anti-nuclear it's simply that we won't be able to be a member of Euratom due to EU membership, we will have to replace it with an associate membership like Switzerland.John_M said:
Only because Lisbon+ says we have to.OldKingCole said:
Actually, Mr D, our departure from Euratom is specified in the A50 Bill.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Jessop, by that, I'm referring to the apparent necessity of us leaving this Euratom thingummyjig only to rejoin it immediately as an associate.
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I accept that it's not quite the same in that a title doesn't form part of the name per se, but it is still an inherited attribute of the name so surely a close modern parallel? (And there is form from Rome for an overlap between the two, at the very highest level, with Caesar, Augustus and Imperator having all been personal taken names of Octavian - albeit that Imperator was itself a title taken as a name).Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Herdson, not really. Titles associated with places are different to an additional name which may or may not have a geographical aspect. There's Scipio Africanus, of course, but also Quintus Fabius Maximus.
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Mr. Herdson, more of an inherited option, I think, for the names of Romans.
There is some similarity.0 -
First there was Lisbon (2007). Then there was the EU Amendment Act (2008). This incorporated Euratom under the auspices of the EU (it was originally created under the Treaty of Rome).glw said:
So if I've got this straight, it's because the Lisbon Treaty supersedes membership of Euratom. So all those hyper-ventilating scientists should calm down, we have not suddenly turned anti-science or anti-nuclear it's simply that we won't be able to be a member of Euratom due to EU membership, we will have to replace it with an associate membership like Switzerland.John_M said:
Only because Lisbon+ says we have to.OldKingCole said:
Actually, Mr D, our departure from Euratom is specified in the A50 Bill.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Jessop, by that, I'm referring to the apparent necessity of us leaving this Euratom thingummyjig only to rejoin it immediately as an associate.
Therefore, when we invoke article 50, Euratom is one of the agencies that we automagically leave. As you say, May hasn't suddenly run amok and decided that nukes are evil.0 -
Seriously, if you're praying in favour of Ed Miliband (who? - ed.) wait until you find a better quote.Scott_P said:@Ed_Miliband: PM's refusal to condemn Trump Muslim ban is shocking, wrong and cannot stand. It flies in the face of the values of people across Britain.
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Trump is out of order and I doubt this policy will last long.Scott_P said:@Ed_Miliband: PM's refusal to condemn Trump Muslim ban is shocking, wrong and cannot stand. It flies in the face of the values of people across Britain.
Theresa May's response that America has it's policy and UK has ours is the only response most every leader would give.
But those on the left will continue with their fury but I am not sure it will take them far
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Talking of pish. Is Sturgeon personally housing any refugees yet as she promised she would ?Theuniondivvie said:Reductive pish is certainly Tessy's go-to strategy when she can't think of anything else.
https://twitter.com/Torcuil/status/825379999712735234
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/08/year-nicola-sturgeon-refugees/0 -
We are going to see a whole series of eruptions of ill-informed outrage as it sinks in what leaving the EU means, aren't we?John_M said:Therefore, when we invoke article 50, Euratom is one of the agencies that we automagically leave. As you say, May hasn't suddenly run amok and decided that nukes are evil.
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No sucking up here, no siree!Scott_P said:
Separately, Germany and France are also continuing to work on creating a joint tactical airlift pool of Lockheed Martin Corp C-130J military transport planes, a spokesman for the German defense ministry said on Saturday.0 -
Nigel Aeroplane FarageMorris_Dancer said:Plebius Jessopius Minimus?
A nice feature of Roman names was that significant feats would get you a new name. So, Titus Manlius slew a massive Gaul in a duel and took his torque, and became Titus Manlius Torquatus. Marcus Valerius did something similar but was aided by a crow, and became Marcus Valerius Corvus.
Does make me wonder what names our politicians would have added. David Hubris Cameron? Edward Stone Miliband? Margaret Falklands Thatcher?0 -
David, did you get any good data from your pensions presentation the other weekDavidL said:
Doesn't matter. This is donkey territory and he just about makes the grade for that.MonikerDiCanio said:
Have you seen Labour's candidate, Snell ? Unprepossessing and uninspiring even by their dismal standards.DavidL said:I find it quite bizarre that UKIP were ever favourites for this seat. I expect a pretty comfortable Labour hold on a very low turnout.
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Here's the French foreign minister's coruscating condemnation of Trump. I'm sure he'll be a-quaking in his boots:SeanT said:
Would this be the same France that has banned the burqa, and the same Germany that proposes to do the same? Unlike Britain and America?Scott_P said:
Just checking.
"This can only worry us, but there are many subjects that worry us, welcoming refugees who flee war and oppression is part of our duty."
The Germans put the boot in:
"The United States is a country where Christian traditions have an important meaning. Loving your neighbor is a major Christian value, and that includes helping people."
Lacerating.0 -
Did the PB Tories' 'Tessy will be a good influence on the Don' line last even 24 hrs?0
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Concern but no condemnation and no statement from Merkel or HollandeScott_P said:
Lets hear Merkel and Hollande stand up and condemn the policy and for Merkel to cancel the recent German order for military planes in protest0 -
John_M said:
I thought I was merely being explanatory and educating the great unwashed of PB. Now my feelings are all bruised and everything.Mortimer said:
It seems that some of our resident Remainers have not learned to avoid being smug and self satisfied in their scorn for the views of others.AlastairMeeks said:It seems that some of our resident Leavers are having difficulty with the concept that Brexit means Brexit.
Re Ed Miliband, of whom Scott and Paste seems to be the latest fanboi, does he follow every tweet with an awkward rephrasing to make sure people get the stilted sound bite??0 -
Ummm. No.Theuniondivvie said:Did the PB Tories' 'Tessy will be a good influence on the Don' line last even 24 hrs?
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I wonder how many people who are outraged at the UK leaving Euratom have any idea what it does.glw said:
We are going to see a whole series of eruptions of ill-informed outrage as it sinks in what leaving the EU means, aren't we?John_M said:Therefore, when we invoke article 50, Euratom is one of the agencies that we automagically leave. As you say, May hasn't suddenly run amok and decided that nukes are evil.
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She's very pretty. Maybe you could comfort her.You could tell her you feel her pain.SeanT said:I can't believe Sarah Perry's searing, bleak, heartfelt Guardian confessional of modern human suffering - Did Writing A Novel Make Me Ill? - has only received two comments in five hours. It's like people have become inured to the horror.
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/jan/28/did-writing-a-book-make-me-ill-graves-disease-sarah-perry?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other0 -
The BBC seem to have got the message OKMortimer said:Re Ed Miliband, does he follow every tweet with an awkward rephrasing to make sure people get the stilted sound bite??
https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/8253858252989440010 -
Newcastle drifted from 1.8 to 2.2 on team news.. 3-0 Oxford!0
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SquirrelsquirrelsquirrelsquirrelsquirrelMonikerDiCanio said:
Talking of pish. Is Sturgeon personally housing any refugees yet as she promised she would ?Theuniondivvie said:Reductive pish is certainly Tessy's go-to strategy when she can't think of anything else.
https://twitter.com/Torcuil/status/825379999712735234
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/08/year-nicola-sturgeon-refugees/0 -
I think the policy needs to be a bit more sensitively applied. It seems unnecessary to apply it to people who are Green cardholders already.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Trump is out of order and I doubt this policy will last long.Scott_P said:@Ed_Miliband: PM's refusal to condemn Trump Muslim ban is shocking, wrong and cannot stand. It flies in the face of the values of people across Britain.
Theresa May's response that America has it's policy and UK has ours is the only response most every leader would give.
But those on the left will continue with their fury but I am not sure it will take them far
A moratorium on new applications, and across a wider range of countries, while drafting new more stringent requirements would be entirely reasonable.
It does seem Trump has torn up the refugee convention. Rather unfair on legitimate refugees, but the existing convention does need extensive revision.0 -
He has citizens unable to re - enter his countrySeanT said:
Genuine question: why is Trump "out of order"? He was elected on a platform of banning Muslim migration altogether. If anything, this edict is milder than his mandated proposal.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Trump is out of order and I doubt this policy will last long.Scott_P said:@Ed_Miliband: PM's refusal to condemn Trump Muslim ban is shocking, wrong and cannot stand. It flies in the face of the values of people across Britain.
Theresa May's response that America has it's policy and UK has ours is the only response most every leader would give.
But those on the left will continue with their fury but I am not sure it will take them far0 -
It is neither. Your words just show that your blubbing the other day was as false as your fiction.SeanT said:
The man's a dick, probably a drunken dick (he flew in "from Aruba"). Give him a sobering fine, some public shame, or a few weeks in the clink. I doubt he will do it again.JosiasJessop said:
I find it odd that someone who a couple of days ago was crying over a tragic picture of a victim of Nazi aggression - including comments about her being beaten before death - now excuses violence by talking about "some redness in the woman's shins".SeanT said:
Note that in this story the culprit faces "four years in jail" for causing "some redness in the woman's shins". America is as mad as us. Hence, Trump.Theuniondivvie said:Another angry 'winner'. Presumably he hasn't found enough drinkable liberals' tears to soothe his savage breast.
"DA: Man kicked Muslim woman at JFK airport, said 'Trump is here now'"
http://tinyurl.com/j6a938x
Violence of any sort is to be abhorred, not excused.
The girl in the photo was fourteen years old. She was gassed or killed by phenol injection. Your attempt to find equivalence is as absurd as it is repulsive.
And the equivalence is simple: this idiot's actions was the sort of hatred that allowed Nazism to breed in Germany in the 1930s. And your attitude - a turning of the cheek amongst the moderately sane - aided and abetted it.
A woman was trying to do her job, and she was harassed and assaulted. I bet the fact it happened in an airport won't exactly be a mitigating factor.0 -
There is a significant difference between Trump and the European far right. Trump is just opposed to Islamism, whereas the mainland European nationalists (FN/Jobbik/AfD etc.) are anti-muslim per se, and also antisemitic (unlike Trump, or UKIP).SeanT said:
I wonder about the media hysteria over what Trump has done. Banning people from certain Muslim countries?viewcode said:
If memory serves, that happened to Charlie Chaplin. Although surprisingly I have not a lot of sympathy here. If you intend to live in a country long-term and don't take out at least dual citizenship, you do lay yourself open to this sort of thing.not_on_fire said:So it seems that Trump's visa ban includes green cards for citizens from the "Axis of Islam". People who may have lawfully lived in the US for decades and who happened to be on holiday this week are being barred from re-entering.
Europe is hyper-ventilating, yet recall that Geert Wilders is likely to come first in the Dutch elections, and he wants to ban The Koran.
This anti-Islamic discourse is inevitable, and will grow, and it will become mainstream, unless there is some miraculous Enlightenment within Islam itself. Trump is the future.0 -
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Are you sureSeanT said:
No, he doesn't.Big_G_NorthWales said:
He has citizens unable to re - enter his countrySeanT said:
Genuine question: why is Trump "out of order"? He was elected on a platform of banning Muslim migration altogether. If anything, this edict is milder than his mandated proposal.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Trump is out of order and I doubt this policy will last long.Scott_P said:@Ed_Miliband: PM's refusal to condemn Trump Muslim ban is shocking, wrong and cannot stand. It flies in the face of the values of people across Britain.
Theresa May's response that America has it's policy and UK has ours is the only response most every leader would give.
But those on the left will continue with their fury but I am not sure it will take them far0 -
Not a huge surprise. The BBC talk media. Mrs May meanwhile speaks human.Scott_P said:
The BBC seem to have got the message OKMortimer said:Re Ed Miliband, does he follow every tweet with an awkward rephrasing to make sure people get the stilted sound bite??
https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/8253858252989440010 -
@JustinWolfers: If the only we had implemented Trump's immigration ban list a decade ago, we could have prevented exactly 0 acts of Islamic terror in the US0
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Does it sex kittens?david_herdson said:
I wonder how many people who are outraged at the UK leaving Euratom have any idea what it does.glw said:
We are going to see a whole series of eruptions of ill-informed outrage as it sinks in what leaving the EU means, aren't we?John_M said:Therefore, when we invoke article 50, Euratom is one of the agencies that we automagically leave. As you say, May hasn't suddenly run amok and decided that nukes are evil.
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So no she hasn't. Your leaderene and fraud.Theuniondivvie said:
SquirrelsquirrelsquirrelsquirrelsquirrelMonikerDiCanio said:
Talking of pish. Is Sturgeon personally housing any refugees yet as she promised she would ?Theuniondivvie said:Reductive pish is certainly Tessy's go-to strategy when she can't think of anything else.
https://twitter.com/Torcuil/status/825379999712735234
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/08/year-nicola-sturgeon-refugees/0 -
https://twitter.com/maitlis/status/825387283570446336Mortimer said:The BBC talk media. Mrs May meanwhile speaks human.
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Trump is the past. 1933 to be precise.SeanT said:
I wonder about the media hysteria over what Trump has done. Banning people from certain Muslim countries?viewcode said:
If memory serves, that happened to Charlie Chaplin. Although surprisingly I have not a lot of sympathy here. If you intend to live in a country long-term and don't take out at least dual citizenship, you do lay yourself open to this sort of thing.not_on_fire said:So it seems that Trump's visa ban includes green cards for citizens from the "Axis of Islam". People who may have lawfully lived in the US for decades and who happened to be on holiday this week are being barred from re-entering.
Europe is hyper-ventilating, yet recall that Geert Wilders is likely to come first in the Dutch elections, and he wants to ban The Koran.
This anti-Islamic discourse is inevitable, and will grow, and it will become mainstream, unless there is some miraculous Enlightenment within Islam itself. Trump is the future.0 -
Less than 1 in a 1,000, and the outrage is mostly due to people not understanding why we are leaving, and assuming something else. Of course a more interesting question is why cooperation on nuclear energy matters became entangled with EU membership. It's almost as though the EU has become what we long feared it would.david_herdson said:
I wonder how many people who are outraged at the UK leaving Euratom have any idea what it does.glw said:
We are going to see a whole series of eruptions of ill-informed outrage as it sinks in what leaving the EU means, aren't we?John_M said:Therefore, when we invoke article 50, Euratom is one of the agencies that we automagically leave. As you say, May hasn't suddenly run amok and decided that nukes are evil.
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I think Littoreus means coastal waters or shoreline ('littoral'), and Ambulans walker. Therefore coastal waters walker.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Jessop, mine's awful too, so I only get the Ambulans bit.
It's the best I could do, and It'll probably send a Latin teacher into fits of rage.0 -
If airlines transport people who are forbidden to enter the USA, do the airlines have to return them to the country of embarkation?John_M said:
I'm waiting for clarity as to whether this is HS enforcing the XO, or the airlines over-reacting on the precautionary principle.not_on_fire said:
Seriously? Having been deemed worthy of permanent residence it's outrageous to suddennly be stranded abroad because the rules have changed.viewcode said:
If memory serves, that happened to Charlie Chaplin. Although surprisingly I have not a lot of sympathy here. If you intend to live in a country long-term and don't take out at least dual citizenship, you do lay yourself open to this sort of thing.not_on_fire said:So it seems that Trump's visa ban includes green cards for citizens from the "Axis of Islam". People who may have lawfully lived in the US for decades and who happened to be on holiday this week are being barred from re-entering.
In any case, many countries don't allow dual citizenship, e.g. Germany, India, China.
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@ValaAfshar: US tech companies founded by 1st/2nd generation immigrants
Apple
Google
Facebook
Amazon
Oracle
IBM
Uber
Yahoo
EMC
eBay
AT&T
Tesla
Reddit0 -
@Aiannucci: Question: Is Trump's Muslim ban a hate crime and, if so, shouldn't he be refused entry to U.K.? Answer: ........0
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That'll be a "no" then?Theuniondivvie said:
SquirrelsquirrelsquirrelsquirrelsquirrelMonikerDiCanio said:
Talking of pish. Is Sturgeon personally housing any refugees yet as she promised she would ?Theuniondivvie said:Reductive pish is certainly Tessy's go-to strategy when she can't think of anything else.
https://twitter.com/Torcuil/status/825379999712735234
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/08/year-nicola-sturgeon-refugees/
And what business is it of the UK PM on US domestic immigration policy?0 -
Hilariously, Trump appears to be heading for an immigration policy that mirrors that of... the Gulf states. Complete with religious litmus tests....Bromptonaut said:
Trump is the past. 1933 to be precise.SeanT said:
I wonder about the media hysteria over what Trump has done. Banning people from certain Muslim countries?viewcode said:
If memory serves, that happened to Charlie Chaplin. Although surprisingly I have not a lot of sympathy here. If you intend to live in a country long-term and don't take out at least dual citizenship, you do lay yourself open to this sort of thing.not_on_fire said:So it seems that Trump's visa ban includes green cards for citizens from the "Axis of Islam". People who may have lawfully lived in the US for decades and who happened to be on holiday this week are being barred from re-entering.
Europe is hyper-ventilating, yet recall that Geert Wilders is likely to come first in the Dutch elections, and he wants to ban The Koran.
This anti-Islamic discourse is inevitable, and will grow, and it will become mainstream, unless there is some miraculous Enlightenment within Islam itself. Trump is the future.0 -
I wonder how a ban on immigration from those countries would go down hereScott_P said:@Aiannucci: Question: Is Trump's Muslim ban a hate crime and, if so, shouldn't he be refused entry to U.K.? Answer: ........
0 -
I believe so. Still trying to get some clarity on the green card wossname. Conflicting reports atm.perdix said:
If airlines transport people who are forbidden to enter the USA, do the airlines have to return them to the country of embarkation?John_M said:
I'm waiting for clarity as to whether this is HS enforcing the XO, or the airlines over-reacting on the precautionary principle.not_on_fire said:
Seriously? Having been deemed worthy of permanent residence it's outrageous to suddennly be stranded abroad because the rules have changed.viewcode said:
If memory serves, that happened to Charlie Chaplin. Although surprisingly I have not a lot of sympathy here. If you intend to live in a country long-term and don't take out at least dual citizenship, you do lay yourself open to this sort of thing.not_on_fire said:So it seems that Trump's visa ban includes green cards for citizens from the "Axis of Islam". People who may have lawfully lived in the US for decades and who happened to be on holiday this week are being barred from re-entering.
In any case, many countries don't allow dual citizenship, e.g. Germany, India, China.0 -
@normwilner: Trump said he'd run America like a business. Specifically, an Alabama lunch counter in 1936.0
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It was there from the start. Euratom was created at the same time as the EEC and shared institutions from 1967 i.e. before the UK joined.glw said:
Less than 1 in a 1,000, and the outrage is mostly due to people not understanding why we are leaving, and assuming something else. Of course a more interesting question is why cooperation on nuclear energy matters became entangled with EU membership. It's almost as though the EU has become what we long feared it would.david_herdson said:
I wonder how many people who are outraged at the UK leaving Euratom have any idea what it does.glw said:
We are going to see a whole series of eruptions of ill-informed outrage as it sinks in what leaving the EU means, aren't we?John_M said:Therefore, when we invoke article 50, Euratom is one of the agencies that we automagically leave. As you say, May hasn't suddenly run amok and decided that nukes are evil.
0 -
I'm not outraged, but I'm unsurprised such an issue has arisen, and think there will be many more. The divorce is going to be messy, even if it might eventually be in the best interests of both parties.david_herdson said:
I wonder how many people who are outraged at the UK leaving Euratom have any idea what it does.glw said:
We are going to see a whole series of eruptions of ill-informed outrage as it sinks in what leaving the EU means, aren't we?John_M said:Therefore, when we invoke article 50, Euratom is one of the agencies that we automagically leave. As you say, May hasn't suddenly run amok and decided that nukes are evil.
And yes, I did know roughly what Euratom does. Then again, it's the sort of area I'm interested in.0 -
Is that a littoral translation?JosiasJessop said:
I think Littoreus means coastal waters or shoreline ('littoral'), and Ambulans walker. Therefore coastal waters walker.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Jessop, mine's awful too, so I only get the Ambulans bit.
It's the best I could do, and It'll probably send a Latin teacher into fits of rage.0 -
Yes, and at the airline's expense. Applies universally, so airlines always check that travellers have appropriate visas for their destination.perdix said:
If airlines transport people who are forbidden to enter the USA, do the airlines have to return them to the country of embarkation?John_M said:
I'm waiting for clarity as to whether this is HS enforcing the XO, or the airlines over-reacting on the precautionary principle.not_on_fire said:
Seriously? Having been deemed worthy of permanent residence it's outrageous to suddennly be stranded abroad because the rules have changed.viewcode said:
If memory serves, that happened to Charlie Chaplin. Although surprisingly I have not a lot of sympathy here. If you intend to live in a country long-term and don't take out at least dual citizenship, you do lay yourself open to this sort of thing.not_on_fire said:So it seems that Trump's visa ban includes green cards for citizens from the "Axis of Islam". People who may have lawfully lived in the US for decades and who happened to be on holiday this week are being barred from re-entering.
In any case, many countries don't allow dual citizenship, e.g. Germany, India, China.0 -
Yes. And face a substantial fine for bringing them in the first place.perdix said:
If airlines transport people who are forbidden to enter the USA, do the airlines have to return them to the country of embarkation?John_M said:
I'm waiting for clarity as to whether this is HS enforcing the XO, or the airlines over-reacting on the precautionary principle.not_on_fire said:
Seriously? Having been deemed worthy of permanent residence it's outrageous to suddennly be stranded abroad because the rules have changed.viewcode said:
If memory serves, that happened to Charlie Chaplin. Although surprisingly I have not a lot of sympathy here. If you intend to live in a country long-term and don't take out at least dual citizenship, you do lay yourself open to this sort of thing.not_on_fire said:So it seems that Trump's visa ban includes green cards for citizens from the "Axis of Islam". People who may have lawfully lived in the US for decades and who happened to be on holiday this week are being barred from re-entering.
In any case, many countries don't allow dual citizenship, e.g. Germany, India, China.
Hence the abundance of caution.0 -
Apple is quite poignant: Steve Jobs' natural father was a Syrian Muslim.Scott_P said:@ValaAfshar: US tech companies founded by 1st/2nd generation immigrants
Apple
Google
Facebook
Amazon
Oracle
IBM
Uber
Yahoo
EMC
eBay
AT&T
Tesla
Reddit0 -
1933?! Since when is Trump an antisemite?Bromptonaut said:
Trump is the past. 1933 to be precise.SeanT said:
I wonder about the media hysteria over what Trump has done. Banning people from certain Muslim countries?viewcode said:
If memory serves, that happened to Charlie Chaplin. Although surprisingly I have not a lot of sympathy here. If you intend to live in a country long-term and don't take out at least dual citizenship, you do lay yourself open to this sort of thing.not_on_fire said:So it seems that Trump's visa ban includes green cards for citizens from the "Axis of Islam". People who may have lawfully lived in the US for decades and who happened to be on holiday this week are being barred from re-entering.
Europe is hyper-ventilating, yet recall that Geert Wilders is likely to come first in the Dutch elections, and he wants to ban The Koran.
This anti-Islamic discourse is inevitable, and will grow, and it will become mainstream, unless there is some miraculous Enlightenment within Islam itself. Trump is the future.0 -
time will tell, not youBromptonaut said:
Trump is the past. 1933 to be precise.SeanT said:
I wonder about the media hysteria over what Trump has done. Banning people from certain Muslim countries?viewcode said:
If memory serves, that happened to Charlie Chaplin. Although surprisingly I have not a lot of sympathy here. If you intend to live in a country long-term and don't take out at least dual citizenship, you do lay yourself open to this sort of thing.not_on_fire said:So it seems that Trump's visa ban includes green cards for citizens from the "Axis of Islam". People who may have lawfully lived in the US for decades and who happened to be on holiday this week are being barred from re-entering.
Europe is hyper-ventilating, yet recall that Geert Wilders is likely to come first in the Dutch elections, and he wants to ban The Koran.
This anti-Islamic discourse is inevitable, and will grow, and it will become mainstream, unless there is some miraculous Enlightenment within Islam itself. Trump is the future.0 -
No. When i comes to Latin, I'm all at sea.Essexit said:
Is that a littoral translation?JosiasJessop said:
I think Littoreus means coastal waters or shoreline ('littoral'), and Ambulans walker. Therefore coastal waters walker.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Jessop, mine's awful too, so I only get the Ambulans bit.
It's the best I could do, and It'll probably send a Latin teacher into fits of rage.0 -
Who he never met.JosiasJessop said:
Apple is quite poignant: Steve Jobs' natural father was a Syrian Muslim.Scott_P said:@ValaAfshar: US tech companies founded by 1st/2nd generation immigrants
Apple
Google
Facebook
Amazon
Oracle
IBM
Uber
Yahoo
EMC
eBay
AT&T
Tesla
Reddit0 -
Proof positive that you are, literally, a dick ?SeanT said:
She complains about her eyes sticking out. It wasn't her eyes that I noticed.nunu said:
She's very pretty. Maybe you could comfort her.You could tell her you feel her pain.SeanT said:I can't believe Sarah Perry's searing, bleak, heartfelt Guardian confessional of modern human suffering - Did Writing A Novel Make Me Ill? - has only received two comments in five hours. It's like people have become inured to the horror.
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/jan/28/did-writing-a-book-make-me-ill-graves-disease-sarah-perry?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
:-)
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The MSM need to be careful here.
Clip of Theresa May says the 'United States is responsible for its policy on refugees, the UK is responsible for its refugees' sounded a good response. No other leader has condemned the US so far.
The Fench and German ministers say it can only 'worry us'
This is going to be a big story but there is no saying that the polarised views will change much0 -
No!! Never!!! Well I'll go to the foot of my stairs.glw said:
Less than 1 in a 1,000, and the outrage is mostly due to people not understanding why we are leaving, and assuming something else. Of course a more interesting question is why cooperation on nuclear energy matters became entangled with EU membership. It's almost as though the EU has become what we long feared it would.david_herdson said:
I wonder how many people who are outraged at the UK leaving Euratom have any idea what it does.glw said:
We are going to see a whole series of eruptions of ill-informed outrage as it sinks in what leaving the EU means, aren't we?John_M said:Therefore, when we invoke article 50, Euratom is one of the agencies that we automagically leave. As you say, May hasn't suddenly run amok and decided that nukes are evil.
0 -
Lol, Tessy getting a lesson in morality from Erdogan.
Presumably she'll get in a zinger about Turkey being responsible for Turkey's policy on refugees.
https://twitter.com/Jack_Blanchard_/status/8253880569413836800 -
http://www.waupun.k12.wi.us/Policy/other/dickhut/religions/04 Semitic Religions.htmldaodao said:
1933?! Since when is Trump an antisemite?Bromptonaut said:
Trump is the past. 1933 to be precise.SeanT said:
I wonder about the media hysteria over what Trump has done. Banning people from certain Muslim countries?viewcode said:
If memory serves, that happened to Charlie Chaplin. Although surprisingly I have not a lot of sympathy here. If you intend to live in a country long-term and don't take out at least dual citizenship, you do lay yourself open to this sort of thing.not_on_fire said:So it seems that Trump's visa ban includes green cards for citizens from the "Axis of Islam". People who may have lawfully lived in the US for decades and who happened to be on holiday this week are being barred from re-entering.
Europe is hyper-ventilating, yet recall that Geert Wilders is likely to come first in the Dutch elections, and he wants to ban The Koran.
This anti-Islamic discourse is inevitable, and will grow, and it will become mainstream, unless there is some miraculous Enlightenment within Islam itself. Trump is the future.0 -
Ed Miliband has been very visible in the last few days. Curious.0
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Those companies and their like would be useful in Making America Great Again.JosiasJessop said:
Apple is quite poignant: Steve Jobs' natural father was a Syrian Muslim.Scott_P said:@ValaAfshar: US tech companies founded by 1st/2nd generation immigrants
Apple
Google
Facebook
Amazon
Oracle
IBM
Uber
Yahoo
EMC
eBay
AT&T
Tesla
Reddit0 -
Actually, they probably did, although they didn't realise it at the time. His father worked in a cafe which Jobs used to go. (From my memory of the official biography)FrancisUrquhart said:
Who he never met.JosiasJessop said:
Apple is quite poignant: Steve Jobs' natural father was a Syrian Muslim.Scott_P said:@ValaAfshar: US tech companies founded by 1st/2nd generation immigrants
Apple
Google
Facebook
Amazon
Oracle
IBM
Uber
Yahoo
EMC
eBay
AT&T
Tesla
Reddit
Leaving that aside it seems a slightly odd point for you to be making.0 -
Faisal Islam just said amazingly, that there will be many in the UK who support the US policy0
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Yeh. That thought occurred to me too. Moves afoot?AlastairMeeks said:Ed Miliband has been very visible in the last few days. Curious.
0 -
It's an AndAnotherThing about Brexit. I've yet to hear of one incontrovertible and concrete benefit to Brexit. I'm not talking about sovereignty and taking control, which are arguable and in any case there are two sides to those coins.david_herdson said:
I wonder how many people who are outraged at the UK leaving Euratom have any idea what it does.glw said:
We are going to see a whole series of eruptions of ill-informed outrage as it sinks in what leaving the EU means, aren't we?John_M said:Therefore, when we invoke article 50, Euratom is one of the agencies that we automagically leave. As you say, May hasn't suddenly run amok and decided that nukes are evil.
0 -
Surely not???!!AlastairMeeks said:Ed Miliband has been very visible in the last few days. Curious.
To be honest, he has.. and he seems just as bad as before0 -
It's the 'absence makes the heart grow fonder' gambit. Compared to Corbyn, he's Clement Attlee.AlastairMeeks said:Ed Miliband has been very visible in the last few days. Curious.
My suggested campaign song for his return:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVzvRsl4rEM0 -
True, but it was originally a separate organisation with its own treaty. This is a good illustration of one of the big EU problems, that EU membership comes as a package, it's not flexible, and to solve one issue in particular (immigration control) we are having to leave the EU, single market, customs union, Euratom and much more. A bit of real flexibility and in all likelihood we would have voted to remain.david_herdson said:
It was there from the start. Euratom was created at the same time as the EEC and shared institutions from 1967 i.e. before the UK joined.glw said:
Less than 1 in a 1,000, and the outrage is mostly due to people not understanding why we are leaving, and assuming something else. Of course a more interesting question is why cooperation on nuclear energy matters became entangled with EU membership. It's almost as though the EU has become what we long feared it would.david_herdson said:
I wonder how many people who are outraged at the UK leaving Euratom have any idea what it does.glw said:
We are going to see a whole series of eruptions of ill-informed outrage as it sinks in what leaving the EU means, aren't we?John_M said:Therefore, when we invoke article 50, Euratom is one of the agencies that we automagically leave. As you say, May hasn't suddenly run amok and decided that nukes are evil.
0
