politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The Conservatives’ paradoxical leadership contest
politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The Conservatives’ paradoxical leadership contest
If Leave had gone down to a narrow defeat, Boris Johnson would have had all the power with none of the responsibility. He would also have had a senior Cabinet role for a year or two, and a chance to prove himself at that level. There’d be no immediate crisis to manage, and any trouble from Europe – and there would surely have been some – would play to his advantage.
Comments
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John Baron MP. Basildon and Brexjt. Announces run for Leader.
BBC PolEd says0 -
Freudian slip?bunnco said:John Baron MP. Basildon and Benefit
BBC PolEd says0 -
Gutted that Priti ruled herself out of running.0
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Angela Eagle is now the clear favourite to be next Labour Leader, currently 2.74 (7/4) with Betfair.0
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FPT
Well, thank you kindly for asking...SeanT said:So what would you like the UK to do? Join the EEA? Or leave the single market as well? What? Serious question. I'm interested to know how REMAINERS are thinking.
At this point remaining in the EU would require a different deal with the EU, a second referendum, and a popular majority for that deal. Whilst all these things are feasible in theory, the logistics are against it: there is nobody in the EU and UK governments who is minded to construct such a deal, and nobody in the UK government who wishes to legislate for a second referendum, and so on. So it appears that Brexit is, however regrettable, inevitable unless something changes.
So we move from trying to save the ship to trying to choose the lifeboat. Passengers on a sinking ship should choose the nearest lifeboat, not the best. The EEA/EFTA deal has the inestimable advantage of already being in existence and seaworthy, and should therefore be the quickest to join. So we should join that. I am aware it has freedom of movement and is objectionable to many LEAVErs but this can be legitimately spun as a temporary measure to provide respite whilst a longer-lasting deal is assembled in the 2020's with due care.
My present concern is that there are currently no competent people in Government willing or able to do this, and the candidates for PM are unable or unwilling to do this.
Consequently at the moment the most likely outcome appears to be a lengthy renegotiation of everything with everybody, without the numbers or quality of personnel to do it competently.0 -
You've got no proof of the title. Not even going to try and back it up in the piece?0
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Fox has drifted out to 34.
Looks like only 4 have any serious chance.
Stewart Jackson just added to Boris column per Guido - now (including the candidate themselves):
Boris - 28
Crabb - 17
May - 9
Leadsom - nobody yet0 -
I'm off now, but Tissue that is a wonderfully clever and original little but of analysis you have done there, so well done comrade.0
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TP is being too clever by half unlike Johnson.0
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FPT:
That's very debateable. I think Labour's 2015 manifesto was more right-wing than any of Tony Blair's manifestos -- Blair never stood on a platform to pare back public spending and to be "tougher than the Tories on welfare", after all. Miliband occasionally throwing out some waffle about "responsible capitalism" doesn't mean much when the actual policies were all straight out of Progress pamphlets.Freggles said:Labour moved to the left when Brown was running for PM, and their level of support fell.
So the party moved further to the left under Miliband "Let's have a go at offering real centre-left policies". Their level of support fell even further.
So the party moved to the outer limits of Labour politics, to the extent that SWP types came into the party. "Miliband was an aberration, Corbyn offers authentic left-wing policies". The level of support, at the ballot box, has been even worse under Corbyn than under Miliband or Brown or Blair.
But sure, maybe it's all a coincidence and the public are lying when they say they won't vote for a left wing labour party, and their actions are lying when they haven't so far
In any case, in 2016, we just got a test of the electoral success of the Labour "moderates"' formula in the EU Referendum -- the "Remain" campaign was designed by some of the leading "moderates" like Chuka Umunna and Emma Reynolds. The main principles (supporting the economic status quo, being the party of big business, being culturally liberal, being "internationalist") are exactly the principles that the "moderates" want Labour to follow. It failed spectacularly in the referendum, so why on earth would it be a good idea to model official Labour strategy on it?0 -
Letting Boris lead ties the Tories to the promises he made during the referendum and which he will be constantly called to account for. A pragmatic Remainer gets them off the hook. They'd be mad not to go for May. I very much hope they go for Boris.0
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Lib Dems here I come. Angela is horridpeter_from_putney said:Angela Eagle is now the clear favourite to be next Labour Leader, currently 2.74 (7/4) with Betfair.
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From the last thread
Don't get me wrong I think it's essential that we do implement a contribution based system and now is about the one time you could implement it. Trouble is I really can't see anyone brave enough to do it. Heck the one thing untouched in the sod you all brexit budget was benefits.Omnium said:
However it perhaps is that easy.eek said:
Good luck with that. We wouldn't be in this mess if that was easy....MaxPB said:
I think delaying Article 50 for too long will hang over the economy like a black cloud, ours and in the EU. We need a pre-negotiated settlement and then trigger article 50. Right now the EU is understandably upset at the leave vote, we need to let them calm down over the summer, let the new PM settle in and then let her(!) begin negotiating along with her new team, once an outline is reached then trigger article 50 and have a joint announcement over the timetable for our transition into EFTA and that we will remain a signitory to the EEA agreement and crucially for UK and EU businesses; in the single market, we will also pay into Horizon2020, the single European sky and a few other optional programmes like Erasmus.murali_s said:
I really don't know Sean - I'm just a simple middle manager in a corporate.
Possibly kick Article 50 into the long grass and keep it there for a number of years - but I know the risks with that are huge but the risks with other options could be bigger.
We are in a huge mess - all self-inflicted.
Staying in the EU was and still is the best option IMHO.
Economic stability prioritised, no mention of the emergency brake, we can solve immigration by making the benefits system contribution based and invest in education and training.
That really should have been items 1, 2 and 3 in that budget.0 -
David Blanchflower, one of a group of economists who has been advising the shadow chancellor John McDonnell on issues including future reform of the Bank of England, has said that he is pulling out of the role.
Trying to get to 5 million unemployed, one person at a time.0 -
John Baron standing "to ensure referendum promises are honoured".
No Surrender
No Compromise
Popcorn
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I've always liked Angela Eagle, but how on earth is she an answer to any of Labour's problems? I'm not even sure she's any better than Corbyn on the presentational/"looks like a prime minister" front.
I fear she may well be about to prove that "Corbyn is not doing well" is not at all the same thing as "there is someone available who would do better than Corbyn".0 -
Explosions and gunfire at Istanbul airport0
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I'm sure misery guts would go down well in the country. And how on earth did Labour manage to miss 4 votes off either side in the no confidence vote. They couldn't run a whelk stall to save their life right now. I said to friends at work today that 212 was a suspiciously low number given the number of Labour MP's on hearing the news.peter_from_putney said:Angela Eagle is now the clear favourite to be next Labour Leader, currently 2.74 (7/4) with Betfair.
Am going through Ataturk airport in Istanbul in 6 weeks time, hope everyone is alright there.0 -
My Mum is 91, a Con member, voted Leave and loves Boris.
She reads Boris's articles in the Telegraph avidly and always agrees with everything he says.
She has just told me she is supporting Theresa May for leader.0 -
FPT
The humour lies in the fact that all these issues (aside from not being life and death) were entirely plentiful before. But we don't have uncertainty now, we have brexit uncertainty. We don't have racism, we have brexit racism. We don't have 'I didn't get the job', we have 'Brexit took my job'. It's becoming the new 'immigration' for the metros.numbertwelve said:
Sorry, I don't find others' economic misfortune particularly funny.Luckyguy1983 said:I'm loving #BrexitProblems
-No-one has given me a job now I've graduated!
-My skyscraper might not be built!
-Someone I've talked to is worried!
-Someone else I've talked to is thinking of moving to France!
-No-one is certain whether they want to throw finance at my amazing newt-selling app start-up!
DO YOU SEE WHAT YOU'VE DONE BREXITERS? DO YOU??
*Rest of Britain gets on with life*
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Bit of abuse for Boris at the protest now. Looks very well behaved though.0
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Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
Fine pie shares - Buy Buy Buy ..Freggles said:
Lib Dems here I come. Angela is horridpeter_from_putney said:Angela Eagle is now the clear favourite to be next Labour Leader, currently 2.74 (7/4) with Betfair.
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Slow hand clap...TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
I'm an open minded voter and drift around the Tory/Lib Dem axis, I voted in Anna Soubry last year as the Labour candidate was an arse.
I would not vote for Johnson's Tories unless he came up with some stunning policies, and he won't.0 -
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Yeah, the pound has been in the toilet for years!.....?Luckyguy1983 said:FPT
The humour lies in the fact that all these issues (aside from not being life and death) were entirely plentiful before. But we don't have uncertainty now, we have brexit uncertainty. We don't have racism, we have brexit racism. We don't have 'I didn't get the job', we have 'Brexit took my job'. It's becoming the new 'immigration' for the metros.numbertwelve said:
Sorry, I don't find others' economic misfortune particularly funny.Luckyguy1983 said:I'm loving #BrexitProblems
-No-one has given me a job now I've graduated!
-My skyscraper might not be built!
-Someone I've talked to is worried!
-Someone else I've talked to is thinking of moving to France!
-No-one is certain whether they want to throw finance at my amazing newt-selling app start-up!
DO YOU SEE WHAT YOU'VE DONE BREXITERS? DO YOU??
*Rest of Britain gets on with life*0 -
Yet more Blairites!TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
Another excellent contribution from Mr Price.
I chose the pic, I hope we'll see more of it post September 9th0 -
Yes, good thread.
As I saod last thread. Theresa becomes leader advocates and agrees EEA membership with the EU, calls a snap election vs Corbyn who just about holds on, watches Labour get destroyed in the north by UKIP. After winning she makes Boris chancellor to deliver the Leave prospectus and the millions per week to the NHS. In one stroke she has defeated her rival and decapitated Labour while delivering an economic settlement that will placate most Tory voters who plumped for Leave as we will be out of the EU and have control over our laws and non-EU trade.
Theresa May could be a modern day Michael Corleone at the end of the Godfather.0 -
How long do we give him before he changes his mind?TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
Surely Falconer has to go now?TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
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Me too. Stella Creasy would be my preferred candidate - probably not popular enough in the party, or with the unions, but it would certainly indicate a clean break with the nightmare of the last few years.Freggles said:
Lib Dems here I come. Angela is horridpeter_from_putney said:Angela Eagle is now the clear favourite to be next Labour Leader, currently 2.74 (7/4) with Betfair.
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Angela Eagle has the popular appeal of Colonel Rosa Klebb.Freggles said:
Lib Dems here I come. Angela is horridpeter_from_putney said:Angela Eagle is now the clear favourite to be next Labour Leader, currently 2.74 (7/4) with Betfair.
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@MichaelLCrick: SNP Parliamentary leader Angus Robertson may claim at PMQs tmrw he should be deemed Leader of Opposition as has 56 MPs behind him; Corbyn 400
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Do you think Angela Eagle would be more electorally successful than Corbyn?Jonathan said:
Yet more Blairites!TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
Popcorn at the readyScott_P said:@MichaelLCrick: SNP Parliamentary leader Angus Robertson may claim at PMQs tmrw he should be deemed Leader of Opposition as has 56 MPs behind him; Corbyn 40
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A sack of shit would be more electorally successful than Corbyn. He will lose every Labour seat bar Islington and still not resign.Danny565 said:
Do you think Angela Eagle would be more electorally successful than Corbyn?Jonathan said:
Yet more Blairites!TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
I am going...but I have to say there is a huge amount of logic there. It would have been Yvette, if she had swallowed a bit of pride and taken a job with Corbyn. But Angela took a job with Corbyn, has done alright, shown some pluckiness at PMQ's, taken Brexit on with the live TV debate and has now resigned (unlike Burnham). She has proven to be on the right side of the left political pendulum...so I would guess has proved herself.peter_from_putney said:Angela Eagle is now the clear favourite to be next Labour Leader, currently 2.74 (7/4) with Betfair.
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He'll be leader of Labour first.MarkHopkins said:0 -
Beyond ridicule!Jonathan said:
Yet more Blairites!TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
Not in a million years.MarkHopkins said:0 -
Reek will come crawling back if Corbyn wins the members vote.FrancisUrquhart said:
How long do we give him before he changes his mind?TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
FWIW for the first time since the vote, I have a sense that Brexit may not actually happen. A small chance, but not zero.0
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That's not an answer to my question. Do you think Eagle would be more electorally successful? What evidence is there of it?Jonathan said:
A sack of shit would be more electorally successful than Corbyn. He will lose every Labour seat bar Islington and still not resign.Danny565 said:
Do you think Angela Eagle would be more electorally successful than Corbyn?Jonathan said:
Yet more Blairites!TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
Didn't JackW make a point that Labour peers cannot resign since they were not appointed by Jezza?Tissue_Price said:
Surely Falconer has to go now?TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday
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David Miliband out to 16s....0
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Fun fact of the day: no Democratic US President has handed over to a fellow Democrat in an election since before the Civil War. (Franklin Pierce -> James Buchanan in 1856).
And even the Republicans have only done a single electoral handover to another Republican since the Great Depression (Ronald Reagan -> his vice-president George H W Bush in 1988).0 -
Why should what is objectionable to some leavers be the determining factor? If there is a clear majority in the country for effective freedom of movement then that is the way to go.viewcode said:FPT
Well, thank you kindly for asking...SeanT said:So what would you like the UK to do? Join the EEA? Or leave the single market as well? What? Serious question. I'm interested to know how REMAINERS are thinking.
At this point remaining in the EU would require a different deal with the EU, a second referendum, and a popular majority for that deal. Whilst all these things are feasible in theory, the logistics are against it: there is nobody in the EU and UK governments who is minded to construct such a deal, and nobody in the UK government who wishes to legislate for a second referendum, and so on. So it appears that Brexit is, however regrettable, inevitable unless something changes.
So we move from trying to save the ship to trying to choose the lifeboat. Passengers on a sinking ship should choose the nearest lifeboat, not the best. The EEA/EFTA deal has the inestimable advantage of already being in existence and seaworthy, and should therefore be the quickest to join. So we should join that. I am aware it has freedom of movement and is objectionable to many LEAVErs but this can be legitimately spun as a temporary measure to provide respite whilst a longer-lasting deal is assembled in the 2020's with due care.
My present concern is that there are currently no competent people in Government willing or able to do this, and the candidates for PM are unable or unwilling to do this.
Consequently at the moment the most likely outcome appears to be a lengthy renegotiation of everything with everybody, without the numbers or quality of personnel to do it competently.
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Boris has always been seen as a buffoon by many. What has changed now is that there is a sizable part of the population - and many within his own party - who absolutely despise him. It's not great to be in that position before you even declare your candidacy for PM.HaroldO said:I'm an open minded voter and drift around the Tory/Lib Dem axis, I voted in Anna Soubry last year as the Labour candidate was an arse.
I would not vote for Johnson's Tories unless he came up with some stunning policies, and he won't.0 -
EU Army. She literally talks about hard power.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm0 -
Mr Jobabob is the PB expert on this matter, and this matter alone.tyson said:
Didn't JackW make a point that Labour peers cannot resign since they were not appointed by Jezza?Tissue_Price said:
Surely Falconer has to go now?TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
Hopefully May. But I have no special insight on this one. PB Tories will be especially useful here.Pong said:Jack, if you don't mind me asking, how do you think the Con membership will vote if it's May v Boris?
60/40?
FWIW my initial impressions are that whilst they appreciate Boris's entertainment value and see beyond his buffonery to a more serious politician he still lacks the depth to be PM. May is a safe pair of hands for the challenging times ahead.
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I'd just like things to calm down from 110 mph. A John Major dull middle aged dad type would be welcome now.SeanT said:
Yes. A month ago I might have entertained Boris as leader. I like him, and have reasons to be personally grateful to him. But this crisis is too serious. And that column from yesterday which he then withdrew today was the last straw.MaxPB said:Yes, good thread.
As I saod last thread. Theresa becomes leader advocates and agrees EEA membership with the EU, calls a snap election vs Corbyn who just about holds on, watches Labour get destroyed in the north by UKIP. After winning she makes Boris chancellor to deliver the Leave prospectus and the millions per week to the NHS. In one stroke she has defeated her rival and decapitated Labour while delivering an economic settlement that will placate most Tory voters who plumped for Leave as we will be out of the EU and have control over our laws and non-EU trade.
Theresa May could be a modern day Michael Corleone at the end of the Godfather.
We need someone relentlessly dull but reasonably competent. And a comforting, matronly bosom for a distraught and weepy nation.
May it is. I wish we had Mrs T.0 -
If we had Mrs Thatcher we wouldn't be leaving. We would have ejected the Frogs!SeanT said:
Yes. A month ago I might have entertained Boris as leader. I like him, and have reasons to be personally grateful to him. But this crisis is too serious. And that column from yesterday which he then withdrew today was the last straw.MaxPB said:Yes, good thread.
As I saod last thread. Theresa becomes leader advocates and agrees EEA membership with the EU, calls a snap election vs Corbyn who just about holds on, watches Labour get destroyed in the north by UKIP. After winning she makes Boris chancellor to deliver the Leave prospectus and the millions per week to the NHS. In one stroke she has defeated her rival and decapitated Labour while delivering an economic settlement that will placate most Tory voters who plumped for Leave as we will be out of the EU and have control over our laws and non-EU trade.
Theresa May could be a modern day Michael Corleone at the end of the Godfather.
We need someone relentlessly dull but reasonably competent. And a comforting, matronly bosom for a distraught and weepy nation.
May it is. I wish we had Mrs T.0 -
Do we care about an EU army? even if we we're still in we wouldn't have to join and it wouldn't affect us.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm0 -
He resigned yesterday.Tissue_Price said:
Surely Falconer has to go now?TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
"The humour lies in the fact that all these issues (aside from not being life and death) were entirely plentiful before."Luckyguy1983 said:FPT
The humour lies in the fact that all these issues (aside from not being life and death) were entirely plentiful before. But we don't have uncertainty now, we have brexit uncertainty. We don't have racism, we have brexit racism. We don't have 'I didn't get the job', we have 'Brexit took my job'. It's becoming the new 'immigration' for the metros.numbertwelve said:
Sorry, I don't find others' economic misfortune particularly funny.Luckyguy1983 said:I'm loving #BrexitProblems
-No-one has given me a job now I've graduated!
-My skyscraper might not be built!
-Someone I've talked to is worried!
-Someone else I've talked to is thinking of moving to France!
-No-one is certain whether they want to throw finance at my amazing newt-selling app start-up!
DO YOU SEE WHAT YOU'VE DONE BREXITERS? DO YOU??
*Rest of Britain gets on with life*
My experience over the last few days is that it is much worse. Especially the fear and uncertainty.
Still, at least you can find it funny.0 -
Doubt it, not feeling much either way. Just smelling the whiff of fudge, whether that is your preferred non-brexit-brexit or something more. Not saying it's likely, just not impossible.SeanT said:
You've actually gone BACK to Kubler Ross Stage 1. Denial.Jonathan said:FWIW for the first time since the vote, I have a sense that Brexit may not actually happen. A small chance, but not zero.
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Yup that's pretty much the european army though looking at the statement they may not actually do much combatSeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm
" It focuses on military capabilities and anti-terrorism as much as on job opportunities, inclusive societies and human rights."
it's the Peace Corps mark20 -
Pretty damning attack on Margaret Hodge (following link from Piers Corbyn weatheraction.com homepage):
http://cecaust.com.au/releases/2016_06_27_Corbyn.html
And I have said on here before, remember that Mr Corbyn has been informed and knows all about the activity on 'that road' that would damn many of his enemies in the PLP right now. Now that would be the ultimate nuclear option!0 -
Oh, this seems like fun:
Paul Waugh
@paulwaugh
Interesting thought. Ministers of Crown Act 1937 gives Speaker power to choose official leader of Opposition if uncertainty over who it is.0 -
If it's May and Eagle, a majority of party leaders will be women.
Now that's an unexpected outcome of Brexit.0 -
It occurs to me that, once the UK leaves, the EU can drop English as a standard language.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm0 -
New to PB.com and its posters are we Harold?HaroldO said:I'm an open minded voter and drift around the Tory/Lib Dem axis, I voted in Anna Soubry last year as the Labour candidate was an arse.
I would not vote for Johnson's Tories unless he came up with some stunning policies, and he won't.0 -
Hasn't he been doing that job for the past few months himself?AramintaMoonbeamQC said:Oh, this seems like fun:
Paul Waugh
@paulwaugh
Interesting thought. Ministers of Crown Act 1937 gives Speaker power to choose official leader of Opposition if uncertainty over who it is.0 -
Has Lord Falconer emerged from Finchley Road yet ?0
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I don't think the Irish would be too happy about that!AnneJGP said:
It occurs to me that, once the UK leaves, the EU can drop English as a standard language.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm0 -
Well, they might very well do so Anne. What would they replace it with? English is the global lingua franca. If that's not the very definition of irony, what is?AnneJGP said:
It occurs to me that, once the UK leaves, the EU can drop English as a standard language.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm0 -
Yes because it undermines NATO. Whatever you say or think about the US, we need them and their Polaris missiles. We should not be part of a union which seeks to undermine our defence posture and most reliable military partner of recent times.JonathanD said:
Do we care about an EU army? even if we we're still in we wouldn't have to join and it wouldn't affect us.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm0 -
We need someone boring and effective, rather than exciting and ineffective.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'd just like things to calm down from 110 mph. A John Major dull middle aged dad type would be welcome now.SeanT said:
Yes. A month ago I might have entertained Boris as leader. I like him, and have reasons to be personally grateful to him. But this crisis is too serious. And that column from yesterday which he then withdrew today was the last straw.MaxPB said:Yes, good thread.
As I saod last thread. Theresa becomes leader advocates and agrees EEA membership with the EU, calls a snap election vs Corbyn who just about holds on, watches Labour get destroyed in the north by UKIP. After winning she makes Boris chancellor to deliver the Leave prospectus and the millions per week to the NHS. In one stroke she has defeated her rival and decapitated Labour while delivering an economic settlement that will placate most Tory voters who plumped for Leave as we will be out of the EU and have control over our laws and non-EU trade.
Theresa May could be a modern day Michael Corleone at the end of the Godfather.
We need someone relentlessly dull but reasonably competent. And a comforting, matronly bosom for a distraught and weepy nation.
May it is. I wish we had Mrs T.
Mind you, we'll probably end up with the worst combination of all: boring and ineffective.
A boss once told me that engineering is at its best when no-one considers that it's there. It just works. Perhaps the same should be true of politicians.0 -
Falconer will be the last to go...Tissue_Price said:
Surely Falconer has to go now?TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
Bercow should call Boris as LoO just for a laugh.
(obviously he wont show up).0 -
Maybe she's hoping for the exchequer.Hertsmere_Pubgoer said:Gutted that Priti ruled herself out of running.
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Step forward Philip Hammond...boring, tick, just sorts of works and nobody even know is doing the job, tick.JosiasJessop said:
We need someone boring and effective, rather than exciting and ineffective.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'd just like things to calm down from 110 mph. A John Major dull middle aged dad type would be welcome now.SeanT said:
Yes. A month ago I might have entertained Boris as leader. I like him, and have reasons to be personally grateful to him. But this crisis is too serious. And that column from yesterday which he then withdrew today was the last straw.MaxPB said:Yes, good thread.
As I saod last thread. Theresa becomes leader advocates and agrees EEA membership with the EU, calls a snap election vs Corbyn who just about holds on, watches Labour get destroyed in the north by UKIP. After winning she makes Boris chancellor to deliver the Leave prospectus and the millions per week to the NHS. In one stroke she has defeated her rival and decapitated Labour while delivering an economic settlement that will placate most Tory voters who plumped for Leave as we will be out of the EU and have control over our laws and non-EU trade.
Theresa May could be a modern day Michael Corleone at the end of the Godfather.
We need someone relentlessly dull but reasonably competent. And a comforting, matronly bosom for a distraught and weepy nation.
May it is. I wish we had Mrs T.
Mind you, we'll probably end up with the worst combination of all: boring and ineffective.
A boss once told me that engineering is at its best when no-one considers that it's there. It just works. Perhaps the same should be true of politicians.0 -
The EU: "Damn, here's another completely avoidable crisis. What on earth shall we do?"SeanT said:
Even if it wasn't going to affect us, it was one of those "EU pipedreams" which REMAINIANS chortlingly dismissed as utterly impossible, like Turkish accession, etcJonathanD said:
Do we care about an EU army? even if we we're still in we wouldn't have to join and it wouldn't affect us.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm
They did this, knowing they were lying, because they know that most of these pipedreams are entirely possible, but if we were told that, we'd vote LEAVE. So they lied. As we see here.
Chorus: "This calls for MoreEuropeman!"0 -
0
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Yes, it's quite something. A whole country's economy going down the pan all because of the festering resentment occasioned by some incident at Eton over 30 years ago that offended his amour-propre.SeanT said:
And he is going to own any economic downside to Brexit. I think this ruins his chances, in one go, unless we are remarkably lucky and avoid all chaos. That seems improbable.ThomasNashe said:
Boris has always been seen as a buffoon by many. What has changed now is that there is a sizable part of the population - and many within his own party - who absolutely despise him. It's not great to be in that position before you even declare your candidacy for PM.HaroldO said:I'm an open minded voter and drift around the Tory/Lib Dem axis, I voted in Anna Soubry last year as the Labour candidate was an arse.
I would not vote for Johnson's Tories unless he came up with some stunning policies, and he won't.0 -
"Juncker Refuses To Speak English In Address To EU Parliament" from zero hedge though0
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LOL. Now that is genuinely funny.Scott_P said:@andyburnhammp: Your "good source" is wrong, Michael. https://t.co/lnSuzxPOnS
Bummer0 -
it wouldJonathanD said:
Do we care about an EU army? even if we we're still in we wouldn't have to join and it wouldn't affect us.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm
it will still end up with us and the yanks doing the actual fighting while the dutch and danes conduct risk assessments and employee surveys0 -
Can't we at least consider the Belgian solution? We could do the nation-state equivalent of 'run silent, run deep' for a few years.FrancisUrquhart said:
Step forward Philip Hammond...boring, tick, just sorts of works and nobody even know is doing the job, tick.JosiasJessop said:
We need someone boring and effective, rather than exciting and ineffective.AramintaMoonbeamQC said:
I'd just like things to calm down from 110 mph. A John Major dull middle aged dad type would be welcome now.SeanT said:
Yes. A month ago I might have entertained Boris as leader. I like him, and have reasons to be personally grateful to him. But this crisis is too serious. And that column from yesterday which he then withdrew today was the last straw.MaxPB said:Yes, good thread.
As I saod last thread. Theresa becomes leader advocates and agrees EEA membership with the EU, calls a snap election vs Corbyn who just about holds on, watches Labour get destroyed in the north by UKIP. After winning she makes Boris chancellor to deliver the Leave prospectus and the millions per week to the NHS. In one stroke she has defeated her rival and decapitated Labour while delivering an economic settlement that will placate most Tory voters who plumped for Leave as we will be out of the EU and have control over our laws and non-EU trade.
Theresa May could be a modern day Michael Corleone at the end of the Godfather.
We need someone relentlessly dull but reasonably competent. And a comforting, matronly bosom for a distraught and weepy nation.
May it is. I wish we had Mrs T.
Mind you, we'll probably end up with the worst combination of all: boring and ineffective.
A boss once told me that engineering is at its best when no-one considers that it's there. It just works. Perhaps the same should be true of politicians.0 -
I'm not sure the Irish will be too happy about that.AnneJGP said:
It occurs to me that, once the UK leaves, the EU can drop English as a standard language.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm0 -
What about Malta and Ireland?John_M said:
Well, they might very well do so Anne. What would they replace it with? English is the global lingua franca. If that's not the very definition of irony, what is?AnneJGP said:
It occurs to me that, once the UK leaves, the EU can drop English as a standard language.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm0 -
Brilliant stuff! I quite agree lol!Scott_P said:@MichaelLCrick: SNP Parliamentary leader Angus Robertson may claim at PMQs tmrw he should be deemed Leader of Opposition as has 56 MPs behind him; Corbyn 40
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Nor would the Poles, do you think so many of them can speak Dutch, Spanish or FrenchFeersumEnjineeya said:
I don't think the Irish would be too happy about that!AnneJGP said:
It occurs to me that, once the UK leaves, the EU can drop English as a standard language.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm
. English is the de facto standard language of Europe now. 0 -
They'll just vote American as the standard language. The residual EU can't work without English.John_M said:
Well, they might very well do so Anne. What would they replace it with? English is the global lingua franca. If that's not the very definition of irony, what is?AnneJGP said:
It occurs to me that, once the UK leaves, the EU can drop English as a standard language.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm
The one thing that Brexit is sure to achieve is that English will be our world's language.
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She would not be my choice, but I think she would definitely be more effective than Corbyn. She can, for a start, hope to have the best Labour has on the front bench with her. That may not be a lot, but it is better than what Labour has now. Chuka, Cooper, Kendall, Jarvis, Leslie, Nandy and so on would bring a heft that clearly does not exist currently, and would be able to hold the Tories to account much more effectively.Danny565 said:
That's not an answer to my question. Do you think Eagle would be more electorally successful? What evidence is there of it?Jonathan said:
A sack of shit would be more electorally successful than Corbyn. He will lose every Labour seat bar Islington and still not resign.Danny565 said:
Do you think Angela Eagle would be more electorally successful than Corbyn?Jonathan said:
Yet more Blairites!TheScreamingEagles said:Michael Crick
Good source says Andy Burnham about to quit Shadow Cabinet, and three people appointed to it yesterday0 -
Maybe we should tell 'em they can't use English any more.AnneJGP said:
It occurs to me that, once the UK leaves, the EU can drop English as a standard language.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm
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I was going to say the Scandi's, because nobody else speaks their language...but then I remembered they all speak about 12 different languages so it wouldn't matter a jot.Pulpstar said:
Nor would the Poles, do you think so many of them can speak Dutch, Spanish or FrenchFeersumEnjineeya said:
I don't think the Irish would be too happy about that!AnneJGP said:
It occurs to me that, once the UK leaves, the EU can drop English as a standard language.SeanT said:Those EU Army proposals, which we were told were rubbish
http://eeas.europa.eu/statements-eeas/2016/160628_02_en.htm. English is the de facto standard language of Europe now.0
