Undefined discussion subject.

LewisDuckworth said:

JWisemann said:

The only genuine anti-semitic behaviour I have encountered in the UK has been from right-wingers.

Do you live on some remote Scottish island?

Clearly, you have no time to read any newspapers, even 'The Guardian':

CST said in 2014 there were 81 violent assaults, 81 incidents of damage and desecration of Jewish property, and 884 cases of abusive behaviour, more than double the number in 2013, several hundred of which involved social media platforms like Facebook and Twitter. CST’s logs include a letter sent to a Jewish organisation which read: “Gaza is the Auschwitz. The inmates are fighting back. The Jew wears the jackboot and armband now.”

The charity said the surge in antisemitism was fuelled by reactions to the conflict in Gaza in July and August that claimed the lives of 2,131 Palestinians and 71 Israelis, according to the UN. It appears to reflect an international trend. Last year in France and Austria the number of incidents doubled, according to reports by the Service de Protection de la Communauté Juive and the Vienna-based Forum Against Antisemitism.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/feb/05/antisemitic-attacks-uk-community-security-trust-britain-jewish-population

Your Moniker is most misleading. Mr Wisemann.

CarlottaVance said:

JWisemann said:

MaxPB said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

This poll is expecting an 82% turnout.

I will eat my hat if it is 82% or higher.

It'll be under 50%. That should make it a much tighter race.

It was 38% in 2012 when the candidates were Boris and Ken, charisma bypass operation patients Zac and Sadiq won't help turnout.

Low turnout should help Zac but I fully expect Khan to win next week.

Zac's campaign may also have galvanised anti-Tory sentiment and made generic anti-Tories more likely to vote. It'll be an interesting one. You're right, though: if 2012 was 38%, it's hard to see this year going any higher.

I think the last couple of days may end up depressing turnout from that particular group and fire up a few Tories and neutrals that were looking to sit this one out.

The vast majority of the population have a negative view of Israel and will view this with indifference or as a Westminster bubble smear campaign.

For all Israel's many failings I'd hazard the vast majority of the population have a much more negative view of Hitler, before or after "he went a bit mad"

Alistair said:

MarkHopkins said:

MaxPB said:

No a reduction in home ownership rates for North London suburbs. Lots of local Tories know that until the government step in and force private landlords out of the market in London the city is lost to us within the next 2-3 electoral cycles.

Forcing private landlords out will not reduce prices - there's too much demand.

The only way to deal with it is to reduce immigration, but many in London don't want that.

People would own (and not rent) if they could afford to buy, but the prices are just too high with the extra demand.

But it is no cheaper to rent. Buy to let mortgages means the renter's are having to pay off someone's mortage.

foxinsoxuk said:

SouthamObserver said:

runnymede said:

MarqueeMark said:

London is an urban Labour bastion. You wouldn't expect a Tory Mayor of Manchester or Liverpool or Newcastle. That Boris infiltrated himself in is a measure of how remarkable his personal appeal extended.

I'm also expecting some remarkable levels of vote harvesting for the Great Khan in parts of inner London, based on the expectation of the resulting, er, patronage that helping secure his tenure will bring certain "community leaders".

'vote harvesting'
'patronage'
'many voters not bothered about anti-semitism' (Dr. Fox)

This is our liberal, progressive capital, right?

To be fair the folk that sing about gassing Jews at Stamford Bridge, Upton Park and the New Den don't tend to be Moslems. As the story posted yesterday on here demonstrated, anti-Semitism is still fairly widespread in the UK. What makes Labour unique among the mainstream parties is the way so many of its activists are happy to parade their anti-Semitism and/or to indulge it in others. Seamus Milne does not hate Jews, but he does hate America and will stand shoulder to shoulder with whoever else does. And Seamus is not alone.

Residual anti-semitism in Britain is distasteful, but what is particularly worrying about the new anti-semitism of the left is that it justifies and legitimises violence and even murder. It also carries a lot of misogynistic and homophobic baggage with it.

Sean_F said:

MarqueeMark said:

david_herdson said:

RochdalePioneers said:

MarqueeMark said:

London is an urban Labour bastion. You wouldn't expect a Tory Mayor of Manchester or Liverpool or Newcastle. That Boris infiltrated himself in is a measure of how remarkable his personal appeal extended.

Don't write off Boris as Tory leader just yet. He has appeal cross party lines, apparently a buffoon but intelligent and self deprecating. A populist with a way with words and a way with the media. And from what I can see the Tory grass roots love him.

Compared to some of the other viable options touted such as May (psychotic) or Hammond (like Major minus the personality) he might actually have a chance of connectino with the electorate.

But before he gets to the general electorate, he has to appeal to (1) Tory MPs and (2) Tory members. Besides, after a decade or so of his antics, I wonder whether the appeal is waring off a little with the public, never mind the smaller electorates?

Whoever first put forward Boris for Mayor of London was a genius. It was a superb meshing of the man and the role.

However, Boris's presence seemed to do little or nothing in helping the Conservatives in marginal Westminster seats across London during his tenure.

There was a post from Ipsos MORI last night which showed how striking was the degree of correlation between the proportion of White people in any given ward in London and Boris Johnson's support. I imagine that correlation will apply to Zac Goldsmith, but running about 10% below the level of support that Boris got. The only wards that buck this trend are Kenton in Brent, and a number of wards in Harrow and Barnet.

Innocent_Abroad said:

rottenborough said:

Morning all,

Gruesome headlines for Labour. Meanwhile, Telegraph reporting that Miliband Snr is to take top US job if Clinton wins. Even the Prince Over the Water has thrown in the towel.

Two questions for :Tory Peebies.

First, what benefit does England enjoy from the Labour Party's being legal?

Second, what would have to happen for it to cease to enjoy that benefit?

malcolmg said:

what utter bollocks

Innocent_Abroad said:

rottenborough said:

Morning all,

Gruesome headlines for Labour. Meanwhile, Telegraph reporting that Miliband Snr is to take top US job if Clinton wins. Even the Prince Over the Water has thrown in the towel.

Two questions for :Tory Peebies.

First, what benefit does England enjoy from the Labour Party's being legal?

Second, what would have to happen for it to cease to enjoy that benefit?

Scott_P said:

@wildernessyrs: Alan Johnson: "It's certainly true there's no Labour problem that the arrival of Ken Livingstone can't make worse." https://t.co/3996DObxvr

CD13 said:

I can't see the Labour party getting much sympathy. Their usual response to anything they don't like is to accuse someone of a being 'ist' or being a 'phobe'.

Ken may have 'mis-spoke" in Clintonese, but it's the biter bit.

LondonBob said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

https://twitter.com/asabenn/status/725950187802255360

Again, what is your point?

An apt profile pick for you.

Moses_ said:

MarqueeMark said:

Moses_ said:

Well given Livingstone has finally been thrown out (albeit temporarily until the dust settles) I guess that leaves Lady Colonel Thornberry to throw out Trident on her own form Labours defence review

Ken will be back off the Naughty Step well before that document is laid in front of the public.

His mate Jeremy will see to it. No crime is so great as to get in the way of delivering unilateral nuclear disarmament...

This sums up Labours entire problem really.....

htt://tinyurl.com/zebpbht

TheScreamingEagles said:

https://twitter.com/asabenn/status/725950187802255360

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

MarqueeMark said:

david_herdson said:

RochdalePioneers said:

MarqueeMark said:

London is an urban Labour bastion. You wouldn't expect a Tory Mayor of Manchester or Liverpool or Newcastle. That Boris infiltrated himself in is a measure of how remarkable his personal appeal extended.

Don't write off Boris as Tory leader just yet. He has appeal cross party lines, apparently a buffoon but intelligent and self deprecating. A populist with a way with words and a way with the media. And from what I can see the Tory grass roots love him.

Compared to some of the other viable options touted such as May (psychotic) or Hammond (like Major minus the personality) he might actually have a chance of connectino with the electorate.

But before he gets to the general electorate, he has to appeal to (1) Tory MPs and (2) Tory members. Besides, after a decade or so of his antics, I wonder whether the appeal is waring off a little with the public, never mind the smaller electorates?

Whoever first put forward Boris for Mayor of London was a genius. It was a superb meshing of the man and the role.

However, Boris's presence seemed to do little or nothing in helping the Conservatives in marginal Westminster seats across London during his tenure.

There was a post from Ipsos MORI last night which showed how striking was the degree of correlation between the proportion of White people in any given ward in London and Boris Johnson's support. I imagine that correlation will apply to Zac Goldsmith, but running about 10% below the level of support that Boris got. The only wards that buck this trend are Kenton in Brent, and a number of wards in Harrow and Barnet.

Which would be Jews and affluent Hindus voting anti-Ken.

Aren't people disgusted at how religion has now become a feature of British elections ?

Not so long ago we thought Northern Ireland was backwards and bigoted because of this.

Increasingly, there seem to be two broad new political coalitions forming in this country. One that's based on rural areas, medium-sized towns, and small cities. It's middle and working class, older than average, mostly White, mostly private sector. The opposing coalition is based on Greater London, Scotland, and core cities, with lots of backing from students, public sector workers, and ethnic minorities. Religion is only a part of that.

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

MarqueeMark said:

david_herdson said:

RochdalePioneers said:

MarqueeMark said:

London is an urban Labour bastion. You wouldn't expect a Tory Mayor of Manchester or Liverpool or Newcastle. That Boris infiltrated himself in is a measure of how remarkable his personal appeal extended.

Don't write off Boris as Tory leader just yet. He has appeal cross party lines, apparently a buffoon but intelligent and self deprecating. A populist with a way with words and a way with the media. And from what I can see the Tory grass roots love him.

Compared to some of the other viable options touted such as May (psychotic) or Hammond (like Major minus the personality) he might actually have a chance of connectino with the electorate.

But before he gets to the general electorate, he has to appeal to (1) Tory MPs and (2) Tory members. Besides, after a decade or so of his antics, I wonder whether the appeal is waring off a little with the public, never mind the smaller electorates?

Whoever first put forward Boris for Mayor of London was a genius. It was a superb meshing of the man and the role.

However, Boris's presence seemed to do little or nothing in helping the Conservatives in marginal Westminster seats across London during his tenure.

There was a post from Ipsos MORI last night which showed how striking was the degree of correlation between the proportion of White people in any given ward in London and Boris Johnson's support. I imagine that correlation will apply to Zac Goldsmith, but running about 10% below the level of support that Boris got. The only wards that buck this trend are Kenton in Brent, and a number of wards in Harrow and Barnet.

Which would be Jews and affluent Hindus voting anti-Ken.

Aren't people disgusted at how religion has now become a feature of British elections ?

Not so long ago we thought Northern Ireland was backwards and bigoted because of this.

Increasingly, there seem to be two broad new political coalitions forming in this country. One that's based on rural areas, medium-sized towns, and small cities. It's middle and working class, older than average, mostly White, mostly private sector. The opposing coalition is based on Greater London, Scotland, and core cities, with lots of backing from students, public sector workers, and ethnic minorities. Religion is only a part of that.

hunchman said:

EU conducting military training exercises in preparation for the coming civil unrest:

https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/international-news/europes-current-economy/eu-conducts-military-exercises-based-on-civil-war-theories/

Would the remain campaign and the remain apologists on here like to confirm that this is true? Is this really the kind of European Union that the UK should wish to remain a member of?

As I said yesterday, when the going gets tough for governments such as now, throughout history they always turn AGAINST the people.

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

MarqueeMark said:

david_herdson said:

RochdalePioneers said:

MarqueeMark said:

London is an urban Labour bastion. You wouldn't expect a Tory Mayor of Manchester or Liverpool or Newcastle. That Boris infiltrated himself in is a measure of how remarkable his personal appeal extended.

Don't write off Boris as Tory leader just yet. He has appeal cross party lines, apparently a buffoon but intelligent and self deprecating. A populist with a way with words and a way with the media. And from what I can see the Tory grass roots love him.

Compared to some of the other viable options touted such as May (psychotic) or Hammond (like Major minus the personality) he might actually have a chance of connectino with the electorate.

But before he gets to the general electorate, he has to appeal to (1) Tory MPs and (2) Tory members. Besides, after a decade or so of his antics, I wonder whether the appeal is waring off a little with the public, never mind the smaller electorates?

Whoever first put forward Boris for Mayor of London was a genius. It was a superb meshing of the man and the role.

However, Boris's presence seemed to do little or nothing in helping the Conservatives in marginal Westminster seats across London during his tenure.

There was a post from Ipsos MORI last night which showed how striking was the degree of correlation between the proportion of White people in any given ward in London and Boris Johnson's support. I imagine that correlation will apply to Zac Goldsmith, but running about 10% below the level of support that Boris got. The only wards that buck this trend are Kenton in Brent, and a number of wards in Harrow and Barnet.

Which would be Jews and affluent Hindus voting anti-Ken.

Aren't people disgusted at how religion has now become a feature of British elections ?

Not so long ago we thought Northern Ireland was backwards and bigoted because of this.

Increasingly, there seem to be two broad new political coalitions forming in this country. One that's based on rural areas, medium-sized towns, and small cities. It's middle and working class, older than average, mostly White, mostly private sector. The opposing coalition is based on Greater London, Scotland, and core cities, with lots of backing from students, public sector workers, and ethnic minorities. Religion is only a part of that.

And it's a split on values more than it is on economics.

Personally, I'm quite uncomfortable with it.

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

MarqueeMark said:

david_herdson said:

RochdalePioneers said:

MarqueeMark said:

London is an urban Labour bastion. You wouldn't expect a Tory Mayor of Manchester or Liverpool or Newcastle. That Boris infiltrated himself in is a measure of how remarkable his personal appeal extended.

Don't write off Boris as Tory leader just yet. He has appeal cross party lines, apparently a buffoon but intelligent and self deprecating. A populist with a way with words and a way with the media. And from what I can see the Tory grass roots love him.

Compared to some of the other viable options touted such as May (psychotic) or Hammond (like Major minus the personality) he might actually have a chance of connectino with the electorate.

But before he gets to the general electorate, he has to appeal to (1) Tory MPs and (2) Tory members. Besides, after a decade or so of his antics, I wonder whether the appeal is waring off a little with the public, never mind the smaller electorates?

Whoever first put forward Boris for Mayor of London was a genius. It was a superb meshing of the man and the role.

However, Boris's presence seemed to do little or nothing in helping the Conservatives in marginal Westminster seats across London during his tenure.

There was a post from Ipsos MORI last night which showed how striking was the degree of correlation between the proportion of White people in any given ward in London and Boris Johnson's support. I imagine that correlation will apply to Zac Goldsmith, but running about 10% below the level of support that Boris got. The only wards that buck this trend are Kenton in Brent, and a number of wards in Harrow and Barnet.

Which would be Jews and affluent Hindus voting anti-Ken.

Aren't people disgusted at how religion has now become a feature of British elections ?

Not so long ago we thought Northern Ireland was backwards and bigoted because of this.

Increasingly, there seem to be two broad new political coalitions forming in this country. One that's based on rural areas, medium-sized towns, and small cities. It's middle and working class, older than average, mostly White, mostly private sector. The opposing coalition is based on Greater London, Scotland, and core cities, with lots of backing from students, public sector workers, and ethnic minorities. Religion is only a part of that.

blackburn63 said:

Patrick said:

I'd like to canvas the PB commentariat's views on our speech laws. I think we don't have free speech. You can be arrested and imprisoned for saying the wrong thing. This is usually because it is an 'incitement to hatred'. Or to actual violence. I don't see how this squares with the general commitment of a tolerant society to not get overwhelmed the truly deeply intolerant.

If you say 'I think Muslims are terrible intolerant and violent people and we should kill them' then, yes, that should be illegal as it is an incitement to violence.

But if you say 'I hate Islam because it has no accommodation for individual rights or desires and overtly seeks to oppress or kill some people like women, gays, Jews and apostates' then I suspect in today's UK you might be committing a crime.

How will this country ever really deal with Islamic fundamentalism if talking about it openly risks you getting your collar felt? If Dave is serious about the problem, as he appeared to be after Paris and Brussels, then let us judge him by his actions not his words. Bring back free speech.

Yep, all those numpties with their "je suis Charlie" placards, perfectly illustrates your point. They'll put down their posters and say "you can't say that" if you say anything remotely critical of Islam. Criticism of christianity is right on, of course.

LondonBob said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

LondonBob said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

https://twitter.com/asabenn/status/725950187802255360

Again, what is your point?

An apt profile pick for you.

Sorry Moscow Bobski, if you don't understand you never will.

I have no interest in Pakistan's position.

Scott_P said:

@LOS_Fisher: EXCL: Top 10 Labour donor pulls support from central party, saying Corbyn has "unleashed whirlwind of antisemitism" https://t.co/ra3qQE4ZMh

What crisis?

“To fight Livingstone using his own Nazi references, this would be an argument of which Joseph Goebbels would be proud.”

JackW said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

LondonBob said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

LondonBob said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

https://twitter.com/asabenn/status/725950187802255360

Again, what is your point?

An apt profile pick for you.

Sorry Moscow Bobski, if you don't understand you never will.

I have no interest in Pakistan's position.

Who is speaking about Pakistan?

Obviously not the Kremlin.

rcs1000 said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

MarqueeMark said:

david_herdson said:

RochdalePioneers said:

MarqueeMark said:

London is an urban Labour bastion. You wouldn't expect a Tory Mayor of Manchester or Liverpool or Newcastle. That Boris infiltrated himself in is a measure of how remarkable his personal appeal extended.

Don't write off Boris as Tory leader just yet. He has appeal cross party lines, apparently a buffoon but intelligent and self deprecating. A populist with a way with words and a way with the media. And from what I can see the Tory grass roots love him.

Compared to some of the other viable options touted such as May (psychotic) or Hammond (like Major minus the personality) he might actually have a chance of connectino with the electorate.

But before he gets to the general electorate, he has to appeal to (1) Tory MPs and (2) Tory members. Besides, after a decade or so of his antics, I wonder whether the appeal is waring off a little with the public, never mind the smaller electorates?

Whoever first put forward Boris for Mayor of London was a genius. It was a superb meshing of the man and the role.

However, Boris's presence seemed to do little or nothing in helping the Conservatives in marginal Westminster seats across London during his tenure.

There

Which would be Jews and affluent Hindus voting anti-Ken.

Aren't people disgusted at how religion has now become a feature of British elections ?

Not so long ago we thought Northern Ireland was backwards and bigoted because of this.

Increasingly, there seem to be two broad new political coalitions forming in this country. One that's based on rural areas, medium-sized towns, and small cities. It's middle and working class, older than average, mostly White, mostly private sector. The opposing coalition is based on Greater London, Scotland, and core cities, with lots of backing from students, public sector workers, and ethnic minorities. Religion is only a part of that.

And it's a split on values more than it is on economics.

Personally, I'm quite uncomfortable with it.

Maybe it's time to split the UK.

TheScreamingEagles said:

One for the political anoraks, because I don't know the answer.

When was the last time both the Tories and Labour had leadership elections in the same year ?

Has it ever happened before ?

Sandpit said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

One for the political anoraks, because I don't know the answer.

When was the last time both the Tories and Labour had leadership elections in the same year ?

Has it ever happened before ?

1963. Labour elected Wilson, the Tories Douglas-Home.

Sandpit said:

Patrick said:

I'd like to canvas the PB commentariat's views on our speech laws. I think we don't have free speech. You can be arrested and imprisoned for saying the wrong thing. This is usually because it is an 'incitement to hatred'. Or to actual violence. I don't see how this squares with the general commitment of a tolerant society to not get overwhelmed the truly deeply intolerant.

If you say 'I think Muslims are terrible intolerant and violent people and we should kill them' then, yes, that should be illegal as it is an incitement to violence.

But if you say 'I hate Islam because it has no accommodation for individual rights or desires and overtly seeks to oppress or kill some people like women, gays, Jews and apostates' then I suspect in today's UK you might be committing a crime.

How will this country ever really deal with Islamic fundamentalism if talking about it openly risks you getting your collar felt? If Dave is serious about the problem, as he appeared to be after Paris and Brussels, then let us judge him by his actions not his words. Bring back free speech.

I would like to think that your comments on Islam are not illegal. That is different though from saying they are not free from consequences - which may include upsetting or illegal activity on the part of others such as your being harassed, followed, threats made against you etc etc.

This is the reason the media chose not to publish the Danish cartoons, they didn't want the fate that later befel Charlie Hebdo. The real issue is therefore how we deal with people who take exaggerated offence at the slightest perceived criticism, and that is more difficult than it sounds.