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Fear and Loathing in Las Élysée: France 2022 – politicalbetting.com

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  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages

    Enjoying all the Brexit supporters explaining how it was all about higher wages all along when they could've just raised the minimum wage in increments without causing massive disruption / shortages + losing the advantages of being in a huge trade bloc.
    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1443886402215743500

    And still the gullible idiots cheer...
  • Scott_xP said:

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages

    Enjoying all the Brexit supporters explaining how it was all about higher wages all along when they could've just raised the minimum wage in increments without causing massive disruption / shortages + losing the advantages of being in a huge trade bloc.
    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1443886402215743500

    And still the gullible idiots cheer...
    Oh don't be a f***ing dingbat!

    So you want to stick people nailed down to the floor of minimum wage? Have you ever considered that minimum wage is supposed to be a minimum not a maximum?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    Empty shelves and no food on the table.

    This is the cost of Tory incompetence.
    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1444210547193417735/photo/1
  • kinabalu said:

    kle4 said:

    DavidL said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Andy_JS said:
    The interesting part of that linked story is that Boris also says cases are not getting to court quickly enough. The Ministry of Justice has just revealed the crown court backlog is at an all-time high, up to two years for some cases. (Admittedly, all-time means since 2014 when records began.)
    https://uk.news.yahoo.com/backlog-crown-court-criminal-cases-172331708.html
    Oh FFS! The Tory government has repeatedly cut the budget for the criminal justice system. Boris voted for this every single time. That is why there are such delays. The situation was dire long before Covid. In many cases trials are being set for 3 or 4 years after the crimes. Crocodile tears on his part
    tlg86 said:

    On Cressida Dick, something occurred to me this morning. I wonder if the reason she’s still got a job is because there isn’t a woman available to replace her. Let’s be honest, they can’t appoint a man to sort this out, can they?

    There are a number of senior policewomen around. Quite a few have been interviewed in recent days. And some seem to be ex-police women, which tells you something.

    Personally, I've had it with tokenism. Get the best person in - someone who really understands the need for change. Get sensible female advisors. What needs to happen to the police - as I've bored everyone here senseless with - is far wider than the Everard case.
    The delays in criminal justice are themselves a major source of inefficiency. So many trials are postponed and put off when witnesses have been inconvenienced. Cops are less bothered than most because they claim overtime. I regularly ask cops to attend at, say, 2.00pm but they are there by 10 to get well paid sitting in waiting rooms.

    A good example of the alternative was the sentence appeal court in Scotland. The Lord President really got a grip of that and massively accelerated the process. The result was that those who appealed were much less likely to get bail. And, therefore, much less likely to appeal. The Appeal court was also not presented with endless cases where the defence were able to argue, yes he has been a very naughty boy but he's kept his nose clean in the last 2 years/now got a young child/ even got a job.

    Speed up trials and there will be more pleas.
    Reading about the court and justice system depresses me, as while money doesn't solve all problems in the world, it does seem that adequately funding and resourcing the courts and lawyers pays for itself with improved efficiency, on top of being important for justice purposes. It just seems to be such a false economy for the government to have cut back so much.
    No votes in the criminal justice system other than making noises about "monsters" and "life should mean life", I think this is a big part of why it's been neglected. It's a populist age and this is reflected in political rhetoric and priorities.
    And that's why the British state is gradually shrinking towards an NHS, a pension system and a national flagship. There just aren't votes in spending on anything else.
  • paulyork64paulyork64 Posts: 2,507

    Small work question - what do you call a construction of two semi-detached houses? The German is Eigenheim, but "own home" is a false friend and I'm not sure there is an English term for it.

    Others have suggested duplex, but that seems to mean two flats rather than two houses (e.g. one above the other).
    i think a duplex usually refers to an apartment on more than one floor, rather than 2 separate dwellings.
  • sladeslade Posts: 2,082

    kle4 said:

    Small work question - what do you call a construction of two semi-detached houses? The German is Eigenheim, but "own home" is a false friend and I'm not sure there is an English term for it.

    Others have suggested duplex, but that seems to mean two flats rather than two houses (e.g. one above the other).
    Isn't that a maisonette?
    Wouldn’t a maisonette be a flat on more than one floor, but not all of the floors of the building? I am guessing at this point though.
    I live in a duplex - that is a flat which covers 2 stories ( I have an upstairs and a downstairs). A maisonette is usually a semi detached house divided into 2 levels each with a separate entrance.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,910
    edited October 2021
    kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    DavidL said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Andy_JS said:
    The interesting part of that linked story is that Boris also says cases are not getting to court quickly enough. The Ministry of Justice has just revealed the crown court backlog is at an all-time high, up to two years for some cases. (Admittedly, all-time means since 2014 when records began.)
    https://uk.news.yahoo.com/backlog-crown-court-criminal-cases-172331708.html
    Oh FFS! The Tory government has repeatedly cut the budget for the criminal justice system. Boris voted for this every single time. That is why there are such delays. The situation was dire long before Covid. In many cases trials are being set for 3 or 4 years after the crimes. Crocodile tears on his part
    tlg86 said:

    On Cressida Dick, something occurred to me this morning. I wonder if the reason she’s still got a job is because there isn’t a woman available to replace her. Let’s be honest, they can’t appoint a man to sort this out, can they?

    There are a number of senior policewomen around. Quite a few have been interviewed in recent days. And some seem to be ex-police women, which tells you something.

    Personally, I've had it with tokenism. Get the best person in - someone who really understands the need for change. Get sensible female advisors. What needs to happen to the police - as I've bored everyone here senseless with - is far wider than the Everard case.
    The delays in criminal justice are themselves a major source of inefficiency. So many trials are postponed and put off when witnesses have been inconvenienced. Cops are less bothered than most because they claim overtime. I regularly ask cops to attend at, say, 2.00pm but they are there by 10 to get well paid sitting in waiting rooms.

    A good example of the alternative was the sentence appeal court in Scotland. The Lord President really got a grip of that and massively accelerated the process. The result was that those who appealed were much less likely to get bail. And, therefore, much less likely to appeal. The Appeal court was also not presented with endless cases where the defence were able to argue, yes he has been a very naughty boy but he's kept his nose clean in the last 2 years/now got a young child/ even got a job.

    Speed up trials and there will be more pleas.
    Reading about the court and justice system depresses me, as while money doesn't solve all problems in the world, it does seem that adequately funding and resourcing the courts and lawyers pays for itself with improved efficiency, on top of being important for justice purposes. It just seems to be such a false economy for the government to have cut back so much.
    Unfortunately, that's the situation in most parts of government. As a nation, we get what we pay for and overall, we're not paying enough. Because governments don't get elected by charging enough.

    This isn't new, by the way. Some of my formative politics was in a patch where "vote Labour for lower (council house) rents" was a potent slogan. So every year, said houses got a bit shabbier...

    I don't know the way out of this.
    Not helped in justice by not wanting to pay for things like legal aid as it helps the 'wrong' people.

    I don't see a way out of this either. I think ultimately in this country at least when we are faced with the options of paying more for a better service (and yes there has been plenty of waste trimmed) or settling for a crappier service at less cost, we will go for the latter every time.
    One problem is that the needs and funding are all dealt with at random and bit by bit.

    For example does the DHSC, the medical profession, the NHS's finance chiefs and the treasury ever sit down and ask "How much would it cost to have what the medical profession would regard as a proper NHS?" And don't stop until they have agreed an answer.

    PS What's the answer?

  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    THE CRISIS THAT WASN'T A CRISIS IS OVER

    Queues even longer in this corner of south London for petrol this morning. https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1444240096081977345/photo/1

    In and around SE London the petrol stations are either empty or with lengthy queues blocking all traffic until there is no more fuel in them.
    https://twitter.com/fredsirieix1/status/1444228368648507395
  • Scott_xP said:

    THE CRISIS THAT WASN'T A CRISIS IS OVER

    Queues even longer in this corner of south London for petrol this morning. https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1444240096081977345/photo/1

    In and around SE London the petrol stations are either empty or with lengthy queues blocking all traffic until there is no more fuel in them.
    https://twitter.com/fredsirieix1/status/1444228368648507395

    I wonder why London seems to be the one place where the media-invented panic is still ongoing?

    Is it because London is full of FBPE Remoaners?
    Or because London is full of the media?

    Or both.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,690
    edited October 2021
    Scott_xP said:

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages

    Enjoying all the Brexit supporters explaining how it was all about higher wages all along when they could've just raised the minimum wage in increments without causing massive disruption / shortages + losing the advantages of being in a huge trade bloc.
    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1443886402215743500

    And still the gullible idiots cheer...
    Insult those who have a different view then and add to their support

    And how do you think raising the minimum wage would help get more HGV drivers or even agricultural workers

  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,256
    kle4 said:

    Small work question - what do you call a construction of two semi-detached houses? The German is Eigenheim, but "own home" is a false friend and I'm not sure there is an English term for it.

    I don't think there is a term, since you need at least two to make it be semi detached in the first place. Duplex? An americanism I think, not sure if it differs.
    I think there's an important distinction between two residences on one property (duplex) and where a single construction spans two properties (semi-detached)
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,747

    .

    IanB2 said:

    Jonathan said:

    Definitely more to this petrol shortage than panic. Service stations that had fuel are now empty again. A genuine supply chain problem.

    Not around here
    I wonder if any disruption is regional based upon customer behaviour, or brand-related based on a company being incompetent?

    No hint of any issues anymore here. No queues, no disruption.
    Ah, Mr Thompson - the man confidently asserting that the Government's temporary visa scheme wouldn't be extended - when today it already has!
    I don't recall confidently asserting it wouldn't be. I do recall saying it was all meaningless media fluff for the media's benefit - which it is - do you really think 5,000 visas is a gamechanger economically?
    You also asserted the fuel crisis was more-or-less over by last Saturday evening/Sunday morning. I believe you assured us that as everyone had a full tank the need for panic buying was over, and diveries would catch up quickly. I pointed out an issue with a finite supply of vehicles and drivers, which you dismissed.

    Remind me never to take betting tips from you!
    If I get another tip like Sunak at 200/1 (or 250/1 with odds boost) then if you wish to miss out on that, that's on you. 🤷‍♂️
    You know how I feel about "on you", Philip. It has a chippy, slightly playground vibe to it. There's rarely a need for it and especially not in a bantering post such as this. Much better would be the standard "up to you".

    "If you wish to miss out on that, that's up to you." Like that. Or, if you want some edge to it you could say, "that's entirely up to you".
  • TresTres Posts: 2,724

    Scott_xP said:

    THE CRISIS THAT WASN'T A CRISIS IS OVER

    Queues even longer in this corner of south London for petrol this morning. https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1444240096081977345/photo/1

    In and around SE London the petrol stations are either empty or with lengthy queues blocking all traffic until there is no more fuel in them.
    https://twitter.com/fredsirieix1/status/1444228368648507395

    I wonder why London seems to be the one place where the media-invented panic is still ongoing?

    Is it because London is full of FBPE Remoaners?
    Or because London is full of the media?

    Or both.
    How exactly do you think the media are preventing petrol stations being supplied? Your foolish Brexit is going to end up with petrol rationing before the end of the year.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,992
    edited October 2021

    Small work question - what do you call a construction of two semi-detached houses? The German is Eigenheim, but "own home" is a false friend and I'm not sure there is an English term for it.

    What context?

    Normally it would be "pair of semi-detached houses" (likes shoes, one on its own is incomplete, and the two are both separate and interdependent) or perhaps "two semi-detached houses", though the latter misses the relationship.

    My rate is - like Unherd - £1 per word :smile:

  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,700

    My modest proposal for solving the problem of queues at petrol stations: a £30 minimum spend so that only those who actually need to fill up will do so.

    The problem with that is you have a lot of drivers in the system who only fill up when they actually need to do so - but only put £10 or £20 in when they do.

    Not everyone fills their tank. Indeed its less fuel efficient if you do so this is quite deliberate for a lot of people.
    I assume you are saying it’s more fuel efficient to run with less petrol in the car due to the weight reduction? Not going to do the maths, but 20 litres of fuel weighs less than 20 kg vs a car that must be over 1000 kg even without passengers. Percentage wise it’s tiny, and nothing like the difference seen in say a jumbo jet. I doubt the difference in fuel economy could be measured in normal use.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    Farooq said:

    Your woes are due to moral failings.

    Brexit really is a religion.

    A cult
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    After backing the man it fired for lying when he was a young journalist to be prime minister, the Times finally gets round to admitting the true cost of Johnson's hard Brexit https://twitter.com/NickCohen4/status/1443848695066341409/photo/1
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    Farooq said:

    I think Scott's program of government is "we wouldn't have got rid of them in the first place".
    Which is a fair point.

    Now that we have irrefutable evidence of the impact of taking migrant and immigrant workers out of the economy, how about we take a crack at seeing what happens when we take all the MPs who voted for #BREXIT out of Parliament at the earliest possible opportunity?
    https://twitter.com/HardenStance/status/1444215094502739968
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,256

    Scott_xP said:

    On a day Ministers double down on ‘leak inquiries’ to blame-shift the supply crisis - this @ft article explains how all of us have been calling for sensible interventions for months and were supposedly ‘crying wolf’ - well said @FWDwholesale in particular
    https://www.ft.com/content/1e93fab0-916e-4697-be8a-af02bde94411 https://twitter.com/ColdChainShane/status/1444206645890977795/photo/1

    It is of course the demand for cheap labour from the EU to depress UK wages

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages
    That seems to be where the rhetoric is shifting. It depends on people not noticing the actual shortages
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    Where will the fanbois go now...

    Boris Johnson will argue (as per Times interview) that there is a big divide over using overseas workers to plug the current gaps.

    Talking privately to Tory MPs and others, they say this argument has limits. See below


    From my Tory conference preview http://news.sky.com/story/tory-party-conference-pm-will-try-to-turn-a-troublesome-backdrop-to-his-advantage-12423573 https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1444242042931007495/photo/1
  • Tres said:

    Scott_xP said:

    THE CRISIS THAT WASN'T A CRISIS IS OVER

    Queues even longer in this corner of south London for petrol this morning. https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1444240096081977345/photo/1

    In and around SE London the petrol stations are either empty or with lengthy queues blocking all traffic until there is no more fuel in them.
    https://twitter.com/fredsirieix1/status/1444228368648507395

    I wonder why London seems to be the one place where the media-invented panic is still ongoing?

    Is it because London is full of FBPE Remoaners?
    Or because London is full of the media?

    Or both.
    How exactly do you think the media are preventing petrol stations being supplied? Your foolish Brexit is going to end up with petrol rationing before the end of the year.
    Petrol stations are being supplied. As much as you like to whinge and invent issues.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    Even if the PM meant 'put to one side for a moment' rather than 'never mind', he will probably have to apologise for/clarify this language. Won't he? https://twitter.com/wesstreeting/status/1444212238370459649
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,700
    Scott_xP said:

    Empty shelves and no food on the table.

    This is the cost of Tory incompetence.
    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1444210547193417735/photo/1

    Once again the empty shelves? Just been shopping. Meat from the butcher, no issues. Green grocer in the arcade, no problems, although warned about a coming shortage of cob nuts... as the season is ending. Waitrose - I could see no shortages at all.
    I am not saying there are no shortages in places, but the media is distorting the reality.
  • The Queen opening Holyrood live on Sky meeting Nicola and fellow politicians with lots of Union Jack's being waved by the crowds around Holyrood is rather amusing
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,791

    Scott_xP said:

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages

    Enjoying all the Brexit supporters explaining how it was all about higher wages all along when they could've just raised the minimum wage in increments without causing massive disruption / shortages + losing the advantages of being in a huge trade bloc.
    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1443886402215743500

    And still the gullible idiots cheer...
    Insult those who have a different view then and add to their support

    And how do you think raising the minimum wage would help get more HGV drivers or even agricultural workers

    You should be pleased as your decision to vote remain has been completely vindicated by events such as this.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,747

    kinabalu said:

    kle4 said:

    DavidL said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Andy_JS said:
    The interesting part of that linked story is that Boris also says cases are not getting to court quickly enough. The Ministry of Justice has just revealed the crown court backlog is at an all-time high, up to two years for some cases. (Admittedly, all-time means since 2014 when records began.)
    https://uk.news.yahoo.com/backlog-crown-court-criminal-cases-172331708.html
    Oh FFS! The Tory government has repeatedly cut the budget for the criminal justice system. Boris voted for this every single time. That is why there are such delays. The situation was dire long before Covid. In many cases trials are being set for 3 or 4 years after the crimes. Crocodile tears on his part
    tlg86 said:

    On Cressida Dick, something occurred to me this morning. I wonder if the reason she’s still got a job is because there isn’t a woman available to replace her. Let’s be honest, they can’t appoint a man to sort this out, can they?

    There are a number of senior policewomen around. Quite a few have been interviewed in recent days. And some seem to be ex-police women, which tells you something.

    Personally, I've had it with tokenism. Get the best person in - someone who really understands the need for change. Get sensible female advisors. What needs to happen to the police - as I've bored everyone here senseless with - is far wider than the Everard case.
    The delays in criminal justice are themselves a major source of inefficiency. So many trials are postponed and put off when witnesses have been inconvenienced. Cops are less bothered than most because they claim overtime. I regularly ask cops to attend at, say, 2.00pm but they are there by 10 to get well paid sitting in waiting rooms.

    A good example of the alternative was the sentence appeal court in Scotland. The Lord President really got a grip of that and massively accelerated the process. The result was that those who appealed were much less likely to get bail. And, therefore, much less likely to appeal. The Appeal court was also not presented with endless cases where the defence were able to argue, yes he has been a very naughty boy but he's kept his nose clean in the last 2 years/now got a young child/ even got a job.

    Speed up trials and there will be more pleas.
    Reading about the court and justice system depresses me, as while money doesn't solve all problems in the world, it does seem that adequately funding and resourcing the courts and lawyers pays for itself with improved efficiency, on top of being important for justice purposes. It just seems to be such a false economy for the government to have cut back so much.
    No votes in the criminal justice system other than making noises about "monsters" and "life should mean life", I think this is a big part of why it's been neglected. It's a populist age and this is reflected in political rhetoric and priorities.
    And that's why the British state is gradually shrinking towards an NHS, a pension system and a national flagship. There just aren't votes in spending on anything else.
    Yes. Eg look at how "sorting out social care" became little more than a new iteration of "penny on tax to fund our NHS".
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,143
    We desperately need a mild winter this year.



    Harsh winter threatens to send energy prices even higher

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2021/10/02/harsh-winter-threatens-send-energy-prices-even-higher/
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,992
    edited October 2021
    MattW said:

    Small work question - what do you call a construction of two semi-detached houses? The German is Eigenheim, but "own home" is a false friend and I'm not sure there is an English term for it.

    What context?

    Normally it would be "pair of semi-detached houses" (likes shoes, one on its own is incomplete, and the two are both separate and interdependent) or perhaps "two semi-detached houses", though the latter misses the relationship.

    My rate is - like Unherd - £1 per word :smile:

    This is what I am defining:



    Maisonette is usually a flat on two or more floors with its own internal staircase and front door.
    Duplex in the UK is a flat on 2 floors, with an internal staircase.
    If a flat has 3 floors in the UK, it is a triplex.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,592
    Farooq said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages

    Enjoying all the Brexit supporters explaining how it was all about higher wages all along when they could've just raised the minimum wage in increments without causing massive disruption / shortages + losing the advantages of being in a huge trade bloc.
    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1443886402215743500

    And still the gullible idiots cheer...
    Insult those who have a different view then and add to their support

    And how do you think raising the minimum wage would help get more HGV drivers or even agricultural workers

    I think Scott's program of government is "we wouldn't have got rid of them in the first place".
    Which is a fair point.
    Raising the minimum wage with unlimited immigration didn't fixed anything beyond dragging more and more skill sets / jobs into the minimum wage net.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Northstar said:

    Jonathan said:

    We have one independent chain of garages with its own trucks and depot in Shoreham. They are keeping going, but do not have the capacity to pick up the slack left by gaps elsewhere.

    We were told this would be over in a few days. It isn’t. It’s not just panic.

    Yup, a similar story in my part of London. The independent garage that I was relying on until last week empty later on yesterday. Got up early today and found fuel elsewhere, but quite a reasonable way away.
    London and the South East are having issues and I have said that and so have the media

    I am not selfish or complacent, but it is fair to comment on our local issues and as I said on Thursday the Asda driver delivering our order said that there was only one car filling up when he left and in his words 'it is over' and to be fair he works for Asda

    Shortly after Sky were reporting from Chester again from a service station with no queues

    Furthermore yesteday there were posts again saying they were able to obtain fuel

    There is a need to recognise some will be having issues but it is also fair to say many are not
    Just filled up (in Oxfordshire) - 5 min queue, no limits on purchases. Does seem to be very variable experience in terms of disruption with London seemingly hardest hit from the anecdotes friends have shared
    London:

    - larger population in small area
    - Most drivers are occasional so would assume, on balance, more partially empty tanks
    - Scarcity of petrol stations given (a) lower demand in normal times; (b) cost of land; and (c) alternative uses
    - Greater exposure to Twitter (?)
    - Plenty of alternative transport options

    So not surprised they are disproportionately affected
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,256

    Scott_xP said:

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages

    Enjoying all the Brexit supporters explaining how it was all about higher wages all along when they could've just raised the minimum wage in increments without causing massive disruption / shortages + losing the advantages of being in a huge trade bloc.
    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1443886402215743500

    And still the gullible idiots cheer...
    Insult those who have a different view then and add to their support

    And how do you think raising the minimum wage would help get more HGV drivers or even agricultural workers

    The argument is that if you want to raise wages, it's better to intervene to raise those wages than create artificial shortages that have bad economic and societal consequences and don't even work overall in raising wages.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited October 2021
    Does anyone hear from @tim ?

    And why was that @Roy_G_Biv banned? He always seemed to pick on @Big_G_NorthWales G, was it for that?
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398

    Small work question - what do you call a construction of two semi-detached houses? The German is Eigenheim, but "own home" is a false friend and I'm not sure there is an English term for it.

    I work in a related field and have always struggled with this. As far as I know, there is no such word in the english language (it is definetly not duplex or maisonette). Sounds rather clumsy and long but I would describe it as 'a building comprising two semi detached houses'.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,690
    edited October 2021
    FF43 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On a day Ministers double down on ‘leak inquiries’ to blame-shift the supply crisis - this @ft article explains how all of us have been calling for sensible interventions for months and were supposedly ‘crying wolf’ - well said @FWDwholesale in particular
    https://www.ft.com/content/1e93fab0-916e-4697-be8a-af02bde94411 https://twitter.com/ColdChainShane/status/1444206645890977795/photo/1

    It is of course the demand for cheap labour from the EU to depress UK wages

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages
    That seems to be where the rhetoric is shifting. It depends on people not noticing the actual shortages
    I really do believe this will be the theme throughout the conservative conference and of course as has been well documented the shortages is a global reality affecting most countries

    This is interesting from Sky

    https://news.sky.com/story/why-is-europe-short-of-lorry-drivers-and-how-bad-is-the-crisis-12423174
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
  • TresTres Posts: 2,724

    Tres said:

    Scott_xP said:

    THE CRISIS THAT WASN'T A CRISIS IS OVER

    Queues even longer in this corner of south London for petrol this morning. https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1444240096081977345/photo/1

    In and around SE London the petrol stations are either empty or with lengthy queues blocking all traffic until there is no more fuel in them.
    https://twitter.com/fredsirieix1/status/1444228368648507395

    I wonder why London seems to be the one place where the media-invented panic is still ongoing?

    Is it because London is full of FBPE Remoaners?
    Or because London is full of the media?

    Or both.
    How exactly do you think the media are preventing petrol stations being supplied? Your foolish Brexit is going to end up with petrol rationing before the end of the year.
    Petrol stations are being supplied. As much as you like to whinge and invent issues.
    I just imagined the two petrol stations I drove past an hour ago with cones and signs saying no fuel did i?
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    edited October 2021
    Charles said:

    Northstar said:

    Jonathan said:

    We have one independent chain of garages with its own trucks and depot in Shoreham. They are keeping going, but do not have the capacity to pick up the slack left by gaps elsewhere.

    We were told this would be over in a few days. It isn’t. It’s not just panic.

    Yup, a similar story in my part of London. The independent garage that I was relying on until last week empty later on yesterday. Got up early today and found fuel elsewhere, but quite a reasonable way away.
    London and the South East are having issues and I have said that and so have the media

    I am not selfish or complacent, but it is fair to comment on our local issues and as I said on Thursday the Asda driver delivering our order said that there was only one car filling up when he left and in his words 'it is over' and to be fair he works for Asda

    Shortly after Sky were reporting from Chester again from a service station with no queues

    Furthermore yesteday there were posts again saying they were able to obtain fuel

    There is a need to recognise some will be having issues but it is also fair to say many are not
    Just filled up (in Oxfordshire) - 5 min queue, no limits on purchases. Does seem to be very variable experience in terms of disruption with London seemingly hardest hit from the anecdotes friends have shared
    London:

    - larger population in small area
    - Most drivers are occasional so would assume, on balance, more partially empty tanks
    - Scarcity of petrol stations given (a) lower demand in normal times; (b) cost of land; and (c) alternative uses
    - Greater exposure to Twitter (?)
    - Plenty of alternative transport options

    So not surprised they are disproportionately affected
    1m non resident journeys into the city each day, a lot of whom are commuting regularly so filling up repeatedly as and when they can.

    Harder and less economical to resupply as takes many more hours per filling station refuelled due to slow traffic.

    Those are the main reasons and nothing that can be done about them apart from waiting for things to get closer to normal.
  • FF43 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages

    Enjoying all the Brexit supporters explaining how it was all about higher wages all along when they could've just raised the minimum wage in increments without causing massive disruption / shortages + losing the advantages of being in a huge trade bloc.
    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1443886402215743500

    And still the gullible idiots cheer...
    Insult those who have a different view then and add to their support

    And how do you think raising the minimum wage would help get more HGV drivers or even agricultural workers

    The argument is that if you want to raise wages, it's better to intervene to raise those wages than create artificial shortages that have bad economic and societal consequences and don't even work overall in raising wages.
    So the solution to skilled workers doing unsociable jobs being paid ridiculously low wages is to have government interventionism raising the minimum wage?

    At what point should people not be expected to work for minimum wage in your eyes?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,992
    edited October 2021

    Scott_xP said:

    THE CRISIS THAT WASN'T A CRISIS IS OVER

    Queues even longer in this corner of south London for petrol this morning. https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1444240096081977345/photo/1

    In and around SE London the petrol stations are either empty or with lengthy queues blocking all traffic until there is no more fuel in them.
    https://twitter.com/fredsirieix1/status/1444228368648507395

    I wonder why London seems to be the one place where the media-invented panic is still ongoing?

    Is it because London is full of FBPE Remoaners?
    Or because London is full of the media?

    Or both.
    If you ever want to do a media stunt, always make it in the morning within 2 hours of London so the juornos can get there, get back, and write the story, in one day, then go out drinking.

    The first big noticed fracking protest - at Balcombe in W Sussex - had a direct 1:31 train to Victoria.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited October 2021
    Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    That is like a temperance spoon for Remainer hard ons over British shortages



  • kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kle4 said:

    DavidL said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Andy_JS said:
    The interesting part of that linked story is that Boris also says cases are not getting to court quickly enough. The Ministry of Justice has just revealed the crown court backlog is at an all-time high, up to two years for some cases. (Admittedly, all-time means since 2014 when records began.)
    https://uk.news.yahoo.com/backlog-crown-court-criminal-cases-172331708.html
    Oh FFS! The Tory government has repeatedly cut the budget for the criminal justice system. Boris voted for this every single time. That is why there are such delays. The situation was dire long before Covid. In many cases trials are being set for 3 or 4 years after the crimes. Crocodile tears on his part
    tlg86 said:

    On Cressida Dick, something occurred to me this morning. I wonder if the reason she’s still got a job is because there isn’t a woman available to replace her. Let’s be honest, they can’t appoint a man to sort this out, can they?

    There are a number of senior policewomen around. Quite a few have been interviewed in recent days. And some seem to be ex-police women, which tells you something.

    Personally, I've had it with tokenism. Get the best person in - someone who really understands the need for change. Get sensible female advisors. What needs to happen to the police - as I've bored everyone here senseless with - is far wider than the Everard case.
    The delays in criminal justice are themselves a major source of inefficiency. So many trials are postponed and put off when witnesses have been inconvenienced. Cops are less bothered than most because they claim overtime. I regularly ask cops to attend at, say, 2.00pm but they are there by 10 to get well paid sitting in waiting rooms.

    A good example of the alternative was the sentence appeal court in Scotland. The Lord President really got a grip of that and massively accelerated the process. The result was that those who appealed were much less likely to get bail. And, therefore, much less likely to appeal. The Appeal court was also not presented with endless cases where the defence were able to argue, yes he has been a very naughty boy but he's kept his nose clean in the last 2 years/now got a young child/ even got a job.

    Speed up trials and there will be more pleas.
    Reading about the court and justice system depresses me, as while money doesn't solve all problems in the world, it does seem that adequately funding and resourcing the courts and lawyers pays for itself with improved efficiency, on top of being important for justice purposes. It just seems to be such a false economy for the government to have cut back so much.
    No votes in the criminal justice system other than making noises about "monsters" and "life should mean life", I think this is a big part of why it's been neglected. It's a populist age and this is reflected in political rhetoric and priorities.
    And that's why the British state is gradually shrinking towards an NHS, a pension system and a national flagship. There just aren't votes in spending on anything else.
    Yes. Eg look at how "sorting out social care" became little more than a new iteration of "penny on tax to fund our NHS".
    And people have turned out a lot less supportive of even that than they claimed to be when it was merely a hypothetical opinion poll question.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    Scott_xP said:

    Empty shelves and no food on the table.

    This is the cost of Tory incompetence.
    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1444210547193417735/photo/1

    Once again the empty shelves? Just been shopping. Meat from the butcher, no issues. Green grocer in the arcade, no problems, although warned about a coming shortage of cob nuts... as the season is ending. Waitrose - I could see no shortages at all.
    I am not saying there are no shortages in places, but the media is distorting the reality.
    Was in Markies food hall in Banbury this morning stocking up essentials for son who is being dropped off at college today. If there were shortages of anything it was not immediately evident.

    Have to say that Banbury is a seriously nice place. I have mentioned that we have got to a situation in Dundee that nearly 1/3rd of shops are now sitting empty making the High street and shopping centres look depressing and greatly restricting choice. In Banbury there doesn't seem to be an empty shop, the restaurant we went to last night was superb and the baking where we went for coffee this morning was first class. There was a slightly weird thing that by 8.00am there were at least 4 barbers all doing a roaring trade.

    The town has a very prosperous feel to it. It's impressive.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,992
    edited October 2021
    Scott_xP said:

    Where will the fanbois go now...

    Boris Johnson will argue (as per Times interview) that there is a big divide over using overseas workers to plug the current gaps.

    Talking privately to Tory MPs and others, they say this argument has limits. See below


    From my Tory conference preview http://news.sky.com/story/tory-party-conference-pm-will-try-to-turn-a-troublesome-backdrop-to-his-advantage-12423573 https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1444242042931007495/photo/1

    Personally I think it needs a serious speech.

    I think he will go for Building Back Better, possibly with some reference to the budget and future years. Or perhaps foreign policy - CBBPP (or whatever it is called today), US if anything has happened (joining USMCA would be a good move), or Mercosaur, where things have been quit.

    It will need something for the North.

    I have heard it mooted that Section 16 of the NIP will be invoked, but that looks too complex for a comference speech to me. Even though the circs now exist to justify it.

    I wonder if Macron's posturing over fish will get a mention? Macron has embarrassed himself, because he is demanding various things that are in violation of the UK-EU FTA. Big flare up not due until Oct 31 however.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,256

    FF43 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On a day Ministers double down on ‘leak inquiries’ to blame-shift the supply crisis - this @ft article explains how all of us have been calling for sensible interventions for months and were supposedly ‘crying wolf’ - well said @FWDwholesale in particular
    https://www.ft.com/content/1e93fab0-916e-4697-be8a-af02bde94411 https://twitter.com/ColdChainShane/status/1444206645890977795/photo/1

    It is of course the demand for cheap labour from the EU to depress UK wages

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages
    That seems to be where the rhetoric is shifting. It depends on people not noticing the actual shortages
    I really do believe this will be the theme throughout the conservative conference and of course as has been well documented the shortages is a global reality affecting most countries

    This is interesting from Sky

    https://news.sky.com/story/why-is-europe-short-of-lorry-drivers-and-how-bad-is-the-crisis-12423174
    I think that article is saying the opposite of what you may be implying. The number of HGV drivers is in sharp fall in the UK, while they are increasing, or not falling as much in other European countries. Presumably those countries where there is a fall can take up some of the increase elsewhere. The UK can't because it's not in the Single Market.

    People can either claim shortages are good because they drive up wages (evidence that do overall is scanty) or that there aren't any shortages. Claiming both at the same time is just dishonest.
  • The Queen opening Holyrood live on Sky meeting Nicola and fellow politicians with lots of Union Jack's being waved by the crowds around Holyrood is rather amusing

    Crowds up to one deep!


  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    A brutal but necessary thread, from a Canadian ICU doc, explaining what dying from COVID 19 is actually like

    https://twitter.com/drdagly/status/1443577158023073796?s=21

    Sweet Jesus. ‘And vaccination can prevent almost all of this’
  • FF43 said:

    FF43 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On a day Ministers double down on ‘leak inquiries’ to blame-shift the supply crisis - this @ft article explains how all of us have been calling for sensible interventions for months and were supposedly ‘crying wolf’ - well said @FWDwholesale in particular
    https://www.ft.com/content/1e93fab0-916e-4697-be8a-af02bde94411 https://twitter.com/ColdChainShane/status/1444206645890977795/photo/1

    It is of course the demand for cheap labour from the EU to depress UK wages

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages
    That seems to be where the rhetoric is shifting. It depends on people not noticing the actual shortages
    I really do believe this will be the theme throughout the conservative conference and of course as has been well documented the shortages is a global reality affecting most countries

    This is interesting from Sky

    https://news.sky.com/story/why-is-europe-short-of-lorry-drivers-and-how-bad-is-the-crisis-12423174
    I think that article is saying the opposite of what you may be implying. The number of HGV drivers is in sharp fall in the UK, while they are increasing, or not falling as much in other European countries. Presumably those countries where there is a fall can take up some of the increase elsewhere. The UK can't because it's not in the Single Market.

    People can either claim shortages are good because they drive up wages (evidence that do overall is scanty) or that there aren't any shortages. Claiming both at the same time is just dishonest.
    There are not many shortages and those that are will create wage increases.

    Ultimately shortages will be eliminated and wages higher simultaneously, as those items that are "short" simply cease to be traded. Which is because they're the least efficient, least demanded goods (and if they weren't, they'd outbid other goods for transport costs).
  • Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
  • FF43 said:

    FF43 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On a day Ministers double down on ‘leak inquiries’ to blame-shift the supply crisis - this @ft article explains how all of us have been calling for sensible interventions for months and were supposedly ‘crying wolf’ - well said @FWDwholesale in particular
    https://www.ft.com/content/1e93fab0-916e-4697-be8a-af02bde94411 https://twitter.com/ColdChainShane/status/1444206645890977795/photo/1

    It is of course the demand for cheap labour from the EU to depress UK wages

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages
    That seems to be where the rhetoric is shifting. It depends on people not noticing the actual shortages
    I really do believe this will be the theme throughout the conservative conference and of course as has been well documented the shortages is a global reality affecting most countries

    This is interesting from Sky

    https://news.sky.com/story/why-is-europe-short-of-lorry-drivers-and-how-bad-is-the-crisis-12423174
    I think that article is saying the opposite of what you may be implying. The number of HGV drivers is in sharp fall in the UK, while they are increasing, or not falling as much in other European countries. Presumably those countries where there is a fall can take up some of the increase elsewhere. The UK can't because it's not in the Single Market.

    People can either claim shortages are good because they drive up wages (evidence that do overall is scanty) or that there aren't any shortages. Claiming both at the same time is just dishonest.
    Actually the UK can draw from both the EU and beyond with the new visa quota scheme, though the initial 3 month limit was stupid and at least it has been extended

    HMG is not against drawing workers from abroad but it is a much more restricted and targeted immigration policy to meet our demands while preventing over supply and reduced incomes
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,538
    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Empty shelves and no food on the table.

    This is the cost of Tory incompetence.
    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1444210547193417735/photo/1

    Once again the empty shelves? Just been shopping. Meat from the butcher, no issues. Green grocer in the arcade, no problems, although warned about a coming shortage of cob nuts... as the season is ending. Waitrose - I could see no shortages at all.
    I am not saying there are no shortages in places, but the media is distorting the reality.
    Was in Markies food hall in Banbury this morning stocking up essentials for son who is being dropped off at college today. If there were shortages of anything it was not immediately evident.

    Have to say that Banbury is a seriously nice place. I have mentioned that we have got to a situation in Dundee that nearly 1/3rd of shops are now sitting empty making the High street and shopping centres look depressing and greatly restricting choice. In Banbury there doesn't seem to be an empty shop, the restaurant we went to last night was superb and the baking where we went for coffee this morning was first class. There was a slightly weird thing that by 8.00am there were at least 4 barbers all doing a roaring trade.

    The town has a very prosperous feel to it. It's impressive.
    Last time I was in Banbury, I saw a young man in a suit riding a unicycle on his way into work...
  • The Queen opening Holyrood live on Sky meeting Nicola and fellow politicians with lots of Union Jack's being waved by the crowds around Holyrood is rather amusing

    Crowds up to one deep!


    Great visual though
  • Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
    On the last issue all I can say we've had no problems getting goods in or out at my workplace.

    Now there were problems about availability of supplies and an increase in their prices 4-6 months ago but never any problems with the actual delivering.
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,591
    Could really do with road work traffic signals outside petrol stations at the moment - formally make 1 lane a car park queue and let the other lane alternate rather than just completely blocking 1 direction at the moment. Would also help demand management as people would no longer be forced to queue for petrol they don't want and so buy it anyway given they've taken the hit in the queue.
  • DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Empty shelves and no food on the table.

    This is the cost of Tory incompetence.
    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1444210547193417735/photo/1

    Once again the empty shelves? Just been shopping. Meat from the butcher, no issues. Green grocer in the arcade, no problems, although warned about a coming shortage of cob nuts... as the season is ending. Waitrose - I could see no shortages at all.
    I am not saying there are no shortages in places, but the media is distorting the reality.
    Was in Markies food hall in Banbury this morning stocking up essentials for son who is being dropped off at college today. If there were shortages of anything it was not immediately evident.

    Have to say that Banbury is a seriously nice place. I have mentioned that we have got to a situation in Dundee that nearly 1/3rd of shops are now sitting empty making the High street and shopping centres look depressing and greatly restricting choice. In Banbury there doesn't seem to be an empty shop, the restaurant we went to last night was superb and the baking where we went for coffee this morning was first class. There was a slightly weird thing that by 8.00am there were at least 4 barbers all doing a roaring trade.

    The town has a very prosperous feel to it. It's impressive.
    Last time I was in Banbury, I saw a young man in a suit riding a unicycle on his way into work...
    So there is even a cycle wheel rationing problem now?
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,929
    We may need temporary visas to deal with the fuel supply issues.

    However if the answer to skill shortages is always more migration we're a failed state.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,992

    Charles said:

    Northstar said:

    Jonathan said:

    We have one independent chain of garages with its own trucks and depot in Shoreham. They are keeping going, but do not have the capacity to pick up the slack left by gaps elsewhere.

    We were told this would be over in a few days. It isn’t. It’s not just panic.

    Yup, a similar story in my part of London. The independent garage that I was relying on until last week empty later on yesterday. Got up early today and found fuel elsewhere, but quite a reasonable way away.
    London and the South East are having issues and I have said that and so have the media

    I am not selfish or complacent, but it is fair to comment on our local issues and as I said on Thursday the Asda driver delivering our order said that there was only one car filling up when he left and in his words 'it is over' and to be fair he works for Asda

    Shortly after Sky were reporting from Chester again from a service station with no queues

    Furthermore yesteday there were posts again saying they were able to obtain fuel

    There is a need to recognise some will be having issues but it is also fair to say many are not
    Just filled up (in Oxfordshire) - 5 min queue, no limits on purchases. Does seem to be very variable experience in terms of disruption with London seemingly hardest hit from the anecdotes friends have shared
    London:

    - larger population in small area
    - Most drivers are occasional so would assume, on balance, more partially empty tanks
    - Scarcity of petrol stations given (a) lower demand in normal times; (b) cost of land; and (c) alternative uses
    - Greater exposure to Twitter (?)
    - Plenty of alternative transport options

    So not surprised they are disproportionately affected
    1m non resident journeys into the city each day, a lot of whom are commuting regularly so filling up repeatedly as and when they can.

    Harder and less economical to resupply as takes many more hours per filling station refuelled due to slow traffic.

    Those are the main reasons and nothing that can be done about them apart from waiting for things to get closer to normal.
    Serious aside question: are new residents of Central London (CC Zone) now driving less since Sadiq increased their congestion charge by 900% 'during COVID'?
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,261
    edited October 2021

    Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
    These are all true to differing extents, especially the worldwide semiconductor shortage, and the cargo ships stuck off the californian coast, but there are no major petrol or food shortages in the rest of western europe as yet, nor, from what I can gather, anywhere on the Northeastern or western coastal United States.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,791


    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages

    There is definitely something going on. I recently bought an engine and transmission for my '80 Firebird (this winter's project). I had them consigned to FedEx in Memphis for shipping then I got my estimate for the freight costs.... $8,000!
  • DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Empty shelves and no food on the table.

    This is the cost of Tory incompetence.
    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1444210547193417735/photo/1

    Once again the empty shelves? Just been shopping. Meat from the butcher, no issues. Green grocer in the arcade, no problems, although warned about a coming shortage of cob nuts... as the season is ending. Waitrose - I could see no shortages at all.
    I am not saying there are no shortages in places, but the media is distorting the reality.
    Was in Markies food hall in Banbury this morning stocking up essentials for son who is being dropped off at college today. If there were shortages of anything it was not immediately evident.

    Have to say that Banbury is a seriously nice place. I have mentioned that we have got to a situation in Dundee that nearly 1/3rd of shops are now sitting empty making the High street and shopping centres look depressing and greatly restricting choice. In Banbury there doesn't seem to be an empty shop, the restaurant we went to last night was superb and the baking where we went for coffee this morning was first class. There was a slightly weird thing that by 8.00am there were at least 4 barbers all doing a roaring trade.

    The town has a very prosperous feel to it. It's impressive.
    Last time I was in Banbury, I saw a young man in a suit riding a unicycle on his way into work...
    So there is even a cycle wheel rationing problem now?
    Worse than that, evidently a cock-horse shortage.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    “Cosplay Cabinet: The Fancy Dress Party At The Heart Of Government”

    My contacts and I had fun bringing this piece together.

    A Tory MP told HuffPost UK: “Maybe they’ve forgotten who they are – why they are there.”


    https://m.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/cosplay-cabinet-battle-brands-at-the-heart-of-government_uk_61557886e4b008640eb05f15 https://twitter.com/SophiaSleigh/status/1444202500278689799/photo/1
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    isam said:

    Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    That is like a temperance spoon for Remainer hard ons over British shortages



    Each country seems to have different issues with supplies and shortages. As you’d expect with a globalised trading economy with different countries specialising in different things. China is having to ration power. Germany has run out of parts and is shuttering car factories. In Britain its labour which is lacking, especially trucks

    To be fair to Remoaners Brexit is part of this, but only a small part. If we were still in the SM we would be able to call on EU HGV drivers, and maybe some would come. But how many? All the EU faces driver shortages. Covid has displaced tens of thousands, and encouraged thousands more into new, better jobs

    Covid is the big issue. It has broken global supply chains in multiple ways, and rapid recovery has added extra stress, and now we have a cascade effect, worldwide. Could be a tough winter. Brace
  • Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
    These are all true to differing extents, especially the worldwide semiconductor shortage,and the cargo ships stuck off the californian coast, but there are no petrol or food shortages in the rest of western europe as yet, nor, from what I can gather, anywhere on the coastal united states.
    There's no petrol or food shortage in this nation either.

    There's a petrol demand surplus, primarily it seems in media + FBPE Twitter dominated London.
  • Dura_Ace said:


    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages

    There is definitely something going on. I recently bought an engine and transmission for my '80 Firebird (this winter's project). I had them consigned to FedEx in Memphis for shipping then I got my estimate for the freight costs.... $8,000!
    Tbf it probably weighs about 3 tons.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    edited October 2021
    MattW said:

    Charles said:

    Northstar said:

    Jonathan said:

    We have one independent chain of garages with its own trucks and depot in Shoreham. They are keeping going, but do not have the capacity to pick up the slack left by gaps elsewhere.

    We were told this would be over in a few days. It isn’t. It’s not just panic.

    Yup, a similar story in my part of London. The independent garage that I was relying on until last week empty later on yesterday. Got up early today and found fuel elsewhere, but quite a reasonable way away.
    London and the South East are having issues and I have said that and so have the media

    I am not selfish or complacent, but it is fair to comment on our local issues and as I said on Thursday the Asda driver delivering our order said that there was only one car filling up when he left and in his words 'it is over' and to be fair he works for Asda

    Shortly after Sky were reporting from Chester again from a service station with no queues

    Furthermore yesteday there were posts again saying they were able to obtain fuel

    There is a need to recognise some will be having issues but it is also fair to say many are not
    Just filled up (in Oxfordshire) - 5 min queue, no limits on purchases. Does seem to be very variable experience in terms of disruption with London seemingly hardest hit from the anecdotes friends have shared
    London:

    - larger population in small area
    - Most drivers are occasional so would assume, on balance, more partially empty tanks
    - Scarcity of petrol stations given (a) lower demand in normal times; (b) cost of land; and (c) alternative uses
    - Greater exposure to Twitter (?)
    - Plenty of alternative transport options

    So not surprised they are disproportionately affected
    1m non resident journeys into the city each day, a lot of whom are commuting regularly so filling up repeatedly as and when they can.

    Harder and less economical to resupply as takes many more hours per filling station refuelled due to slow traffic.

    Those are the main reasons and nothing that can be done about them apart from waiting for things to get closer to normal.
    Serious aside question: are new residents of Central London (CC Zone) now driving less since Sadiq increased their congestion charge by 900% 'during COVID'?
    I live on the edge of the zone so it makes no sense to go in. I used to drive in sometimes on evenings or weekends, when it was free, a few times a month but now it will be more like once or twice a year. In order those journeys replaced with use tube instead, go to a venue outside the zone or stay home.

    I dont think Sadiq had any choice on the matter, it was a central government diktat as far as I remember.
  • DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Empty shelves and no food on the table.

    This is the cost of Tory incompetence.
    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1444210547193417735/photo/1

    Once again the empty shelves? Just been shopping. Meat from the butcher, no issues. Green grocer in the arcade, no problems, although warned about a coming shortage of cob nuts... as the season is ending. Waitrose - I could see no shortages at all.
    I am not saying there are no shortages in places, but the media is distorting the reality.
    Was in Markies food hall in Banbury this morning stocking up essentials for son who is being dropped off at college today. If there were shortages of anything it was not immediately evident.

    Have to say that Banbury is a seriously nice place. I have mentioned that we have got to a situation in Dundee that nearly 1/3rd of shops are now sitting empty making the High street and shopping centres look depressing and greatly restricting choice. In Banbury there doesn't seem to be an empty shop, the restaurant we went to last night was superb and the baking where we went for coffee this morning was first class. There was a slightly weird thing that by 8.00am there were at least 4 barbers all doing a roaring trade.

    The town has a very prosperous feel to it. It's impressive.
    The only thing I've noticed missing was long life pomegranate juice and then only for a couple of weeks.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,256

    FF43 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages

    Enjoying all the Brexit supporters explaining how it was all about higher wages all along when they could've just raised the minimum wage in increments without causing massive disruption / shortages + losing the advantages of being in a huge trade bloc.
    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1443886402215743500

    And still the gullible idiots cheer...
    Insult those who have a different view then and add to their support

    And how do you think raising the minimum wage would help get more HGV drivers or even agricultural workers

    The argument is that if you want to raise wages, it's better to intervene to raise those wages than create artificial shortages that have bad economic and societal consequences and don't even work overall in raising wages.
    So the solution to skilled workers doing unsociable jobs being paid ridiculously low wages is to have government interventionism raising the minimum wage?

    At what point should people not be expected to work for minimum wage in your eyes?
    I didn't mention minimum wage, although that is one of the methods you might use to raise wages. Countries in Europe, including the Netherlands, have used industry agreed and government backed initiatives to improve both wages and conditions for lorry drivers as well as their supply.

    The point is, this kind of intervention is no less ineffective than the damaging artificial shortages that you simultaneously endorse and deny they exist.

    Real increases in prosperity are demand led and not shortage driven
  • Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
    These are all true to differing extents, especially the worldwide semiconductor shortage, and the cargo ships stuck off the californian coast, but there are no major petrol or food shortages in the rest of western europe as yet, nor, from what I can gather, anywhere on the Northeastern or western coastal United States.
    There were pictures of food shortages in Brussels supermarkets this week
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,261
    edited October 2021

    Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
    These are all true to differing extents, especially the worldwide semiconductor shortage,and the cargo ships stuck off the californian coast, but there are no petrol or food shortages in the rest of western europe as yet, nor, from what I can gather, anywhere on the coastal united states.
    There's no petrol or food shortage in this nation either.

    There's a petrol demand surplus, primarily it seems in media + FBPE Twitter dominated London.
    It does seem that there are authentic movement, rather than supply shortages, in some areas.

    There are also authentic shortages of certain foodstuffs.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,538

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Empty shelves and no food on the table.

    This is the cost of Tory incompetence.
    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1444210547193417735/photo/1

    Once again the empty shelves? Just been shopping. Meat from the butcher, no issues. Green grocer in the arcade, no problems, although warned about a coming shortage of cob nuts... as the season is ending. Waitrose - I could see no shortages at all.
    I am not saying there are no shortages in places, but the media is distorting the reality.
    Was in Markies food hall in Banbury this morning stocking up essentials for son who is being dropped off at college today. If there were shortages of anything it was not immediately evident.

    Have to say that Banbury is a seriously nice place. I have mentioned that we have got to a situation in Dundee that nearly 1/3rd of shops are now sitting empty making the High street and shopping centres look depressing and greatly restricting choice. In Banbury there doesn't seem to be an empty shop, the restaurant we went to last night was superb and the baking where we went for coffee this morning was first class. There was a slightly weird thing that by 8.00am there were at least 4 barbers all doing a roaring trade.

    The town has a very prosperous feel to it. It's impressive.
    Last time I was in Banbury, I saw a young man in a suit riding a unicycle on his way into work...
    So there is even a cycle wheel rationing problem now?
    That was back in 2018, so I suppose it might have been an early indication of post-Brexit shortages... ;)

    Walking of which, the other day I heard of a sport that I'd never encountered: mountain unicycling.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountain_unicycling
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,346
    algarkirk said:

    Once again David Allen Green gets it exactly right on the Everard aftermath:

    https://davidallengreen.com/2021/10/the-i-will-make-something-up-who-are-they-going-to-believe-me-or-you-police-officer-only-gets-a-written-warning-and-why-this-matters-after-the-sarah-everard-murder/


    All of which reminds you of how bad the BBC etc are at interviewing police chiefs, rarely asking the right questions.

    I got this right 18 months ago when I pointed out the dangers.

    See here - https://barry-walsh.co.uk/lockdown-blues/

    This case also shows why having 2 police officers is not necessarily the answer.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,143

    We may need temporary visas to deal with the fuel supply issues.

    However if the answer to skill shortages is always more migration we're a failed state.

    No, we are ageing one.
  • DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Empty shelves and no food on the table.

    This is the cost of Tory incompetence.
    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1444210547193417735/photo/1

    Once again the empty shelves? Just been shopping. Meat from the butcher, no issues. Green grocer in the arcade, no problems, although warned about a coming shortage of cob nuts... as the season is ending. Waitrose - I could see no shortages at all.
    I am not saying there are no shortages in places, but the media is distorting the reality.
    Was in Markies food hall in Banbury this morning stocking up essentials for son who is being dropped off at college today. If there were shortages of anything it was not immediately evident.

    Have to say that Banbury is a seriously nice place. I have mentioned that we have got to a situation in Dundee that nearly 1/3rd of shops are now sitting empty making the High street and shopping centres look depressing and greatly restricting choice. In Banbury there doesn't seem to be an empty shop, the restaurant we went to last night was superb and the baking where we went for coffee this morning was first class. There was a slightly weird thing that by 8.00am there were at least 4 barbers all doing a roaring trade.

    The town has a very prosperous feel to it. It's impressive.
    Last time I was in Banbury, I saw a young man in a suit riding a unicycle on his way into work...
    So there is even a cycle wheel rationing problem now?
    Worse than that, evidently a cock-horse shortage.
    There are enough cocks in the government so we just need to find some horses.
  • FF43 said:

    FF43 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I would suggest you ready yourself for Boris in full @Philip_Thompson mode to take this argument head on this week and accusing labour and others of wanting much more immigration (100,000 HGV drivers alone) at the expense of decent wages

    Enjoying all the Brexit supporters explaining how it was all about higher wages all along when they could've just raised the minimum wage in increments without causing massive disruption / shortages + losing the advantages of being in a huge trade bloc.
    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1443886402215743500

    And still the gullible idiots cheer...
    Insult those who have a different view then and add to their support

    And how do you think raising the minimum wage would help get more HGV drivers or even agricultural workers

    The argument is that if you want to raise wages, it's better to intervene to raise those wages than create artificial shortages that have bad economic and societal consequences and don't even work overall in raising wages.
    So the solution to skilled workers doing unsociable jobs being paid ridiculously low wages is to have government interventionism raising the minimum wage?

    At what point should people not be expected to work for minimum wage in your eyes?
    I didn't mention minimum wage, although that is one of the methods you might use to raise wages. Countries in Europe, including the Netherlands, have used industry agreed and government backed initiatives to improve both wages and conditions for lorry drivers as well as their supply.

    The point is, this kind of intervention is no less ineffective than the damaging artificial shortages that you simultaneously endorse and deny they exist.

    Real increases in prosperity are demand led and not shortage driven
    You didn't mention minimum wage but you responded to a conversation whereby raising minimum wage was the proposed alternative to cutting off infinite labour supply: they could've just raised the minimum wage in increments

    Do you think skilled workers doing unsociable work should be getting paid on or close to minimum wage?
  • Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
    These are all true to differing extents, especially the worldwide semiconductor shortage, and the cargo ships stuck off the californian coast, but there are no major petrol or food shortages in the rest of western europe as yet, nor, from what I can gather, anywhere on the Northeastern or western coastal United States.
    There were pictures of food shortages in Brussels supermarkets this week
    Sources ? Confirmed trade bodies information as provided in the UK, please.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,724

    Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
    These are all true to differing extents, especially the worldwide semiconductor shortage,and the cargo ships stuck off the californian coast, but there are no petrol or food shortages in the rest of western europe as yet, nor, from what I can gather, anywhere on the coastal united states.
    There's no petrol or food shortage in this nation either.

    There's a petrol demand surplus, primarily it seems in media + FBPE Twitter dominated London.
    That's a good Mohammed al-Sahhaf, do you do any other impressions?
  • Tres said:

    Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
    These are all true to differing extents, especially the worldwide semiconductor shortage,and the cargo ships stuck off the californian coast, but there are no petrol or food shortages in the rest of western europe as yet, nor, from what I can gather, anywhere on the coastal united states.
    There's no petrol or food shortage in this nation either.

    There's a petrol demand surplus, primarily it seems in media + FBPE Twitter dominated London.
    That's a good Mohammed al-Sahhaf, do you do any other impressions?
    Its the truth.

    Just because the truth doesn't suit your agenda doesn't change it.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,346
    kle4 said:

    algarkirk said:

    Once again David Allen Green gets it exactly right on the Everard aftermath:

    https://davidallengreen.com/2021/10/the-i-will-make-something-up-who-are-they-going-to-believe-me-or-you-police-officer-only-gets-a-written-warning-and-why-this-matters-after-the-sarah-everard-murder/


    All of which reminds you of how bad the BBC etc are at interviewing police chiefs, rarely asking the right questions.


    That a police officer who shouts loudly that he will make something up when challenged will keep his job and his anonymity – and will presumably carry on policing citizens and providing evidence to courts – is an absolute counterpoint to the assertions that citizens when confronted with an arresting officer can do anything other than comply.


    That case was a bloody embarrassment. Threatening, openly and without fear, to abuse your power, should be an instant dimissal. Even if it was merely a threat and he's never actually done it, that itself is an abuse. And abuse of power is far less up for correction than a procedural cockup or lack of knowledge and sensitivity. It's not something he can have thought was acceptable, and so the choice to behave so and think he can continue to serve is inexplicable.

    Some jobs, some offences, have to be zero tolerance.
    And that is why police culture needs to be totally rebuilt from the bottom up. And why those in charge now - who have presided over and allowed this culture to develop - are not the ones to put this right.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,484
    edited October 2021
    Cyclefree said:

    Foxy said:

    tlg86 said:

    I can’t figure out why Sadiq and Priti and Keir have all given their support to Dick.

    To the extent that it makes you wonder what we’re not being told?

    It's a strange one isn't it. Patel you can understand because it would be admitting an error. The other two?
    Probably because Starmer and Khan are actually grownups. I think there is a case for Dick going, but it’s not helpful to pile on an individual in situations like this.
    I agree that there is some scapegoating going on.

    Dick would have a better defence if she made some public statements of intent how she was going to root out misogyny and the people who obstructed the Morgan investigation etc.
    The police's response has been, once again, to tell women what they need to do. Women are again being made responsible for stopping male police officers harming them.

    They are not telling police officers what to do. They are not telling men what to do. No - women have to once again add "waving at buses" and "knocking on strangers' doors" to the list of other stuff they need to do if they want to go outside their homes without being menaced.

    FFS!!

    Yes I'm angry. I'm not the only woman to feel this way. Angry and tired of this and utterly contemptuous of this pathetically risible response.
    Keir Starmer agreed with you yesterday, quite forcefully. He said the problem with the Met and Ministers is that they are telling women what they should do differently, when they should be telling the police what they should do differently. He's right.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,791

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Empty shelves and no food on the table.

    This is the cost of Tory incompetence.
    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1444210547193417735/photo/1

    Once again the empty shelves? Just been shopping. Meat from the butcher, no issues. Green grocer in the arcade, no problems, although warned about a coming shortage of cob nuts... as the season is ending. Waitrose - I could see no shortages at all.
    I am not saying there are no shortages in places, but the media is distorting the reality.
    Was in Markies food hall in Banbury this morning stocking up essentials for son who is being dropped off at college today. If there were shortages of anything it was not immediately evident.

    Have to say that Banbury is a seriously nice place. I have mentioned that we have got to a situation in Dundee that nearly 1/3rd of shops are now sitting empty making the High street and shopping centres look depressing and greatly restricting choice. In Banbury there doesn't seem to be an empty shop, the restaurant we went to last night was superb and the baking where we went for coffee this morning was first class. There was a slightly weird thing that by 8.00am there were at least 4 barbers all doing a roaring trade.

    The town has a very prosperous feel to it. It's impressive.
    Last time I was in Banbury, I saw a young man in a suit riding a unicycle on his way into work...
    So there is even a cycle wheel rationing problem now?
    Loads of Shimano components are hard to get through normal channels. Shimano's European operation is run from the Netherlands so the UK gets doubly fucked due to Brexit. Yahoo Auctions Japan is the only way to get some parts at vast expense. Campagnolo is hard to get too but SRAM is easier.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,992
    edited October 2021

    Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
    These are all true to differing extents, especially the worldwide semiconductor shortage, and the cargo ships stuck off the californian coast, but there are no major petrol or food shortages in the rest of western europe as yet, nor, from what I can gather, anywhere on the Northeastern or western coastal United States.
    There were pictures of food shortages in Brussels supermarkets this week
    Yes, but that one is because some workers went on strike at a distribution centre threatened with closure.
    https://www.retaildetail.eu/en/news/food/empty-shelves-carrefour-due-strikes-distribution-centres

    Though they have problems because of Walloon / Not Walloon politics. It seems that bringing goods into Wallonia from the rest of Belgium is verboten. Or something.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,724

    Tres said:

    Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
    These are all true to differing extents, especially the worldwide semiconductor shortage,and the cargo ships stuck off the californian coast, but there are no petrol or food shortages in the rest of western europe as yet, nor, from what I can gather, anywhere on the coastal united states.
    There's no petrol or food shortage in this nation either.

    There's a petrol demand surplus, primarily it seems in media + FBPE Twitter dominated London.
    That's a good Mohammed al-Sahhaf, do you do any other impressions?
    Its the truth.

    Just because the truth doesn't suit your agenda doesn't change it.
    A good Eric Morecambe, playing all the right notes but not necessarily in the right order.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,261
    edited October 2021
    MattW said:

    Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
    These are all true to differing extents, especially the worldwide semiconductor shortage, and the cargo ships stuck off the californian coast, but there are no major petrol or food shortages in the rest of western europe as yet, nor, from what I can gather, anywhere on the Northeastern or western coastal United States.
    There were pictures of food shortages in Brussels supermarkets this week
    Yes, but that one is because some workers went on strike at a distribution centre threatened with closure.
    https://www.retaildetail.eu/en/news/food/empty-shelves-carrefour-due-strikes-distribution-centres

    Though they have problems because of Walloon / Not Walloon politics. It seems that bringing goods into Wallonia from the rest of Belgium is verboten. Or something.
    Too late, it's already gone viral amongst the ultra-Brexiters on social media, with no information providing that crucial supporting context. I've heard that one mentioned already elsewhere today ; the need for complete normalisation of whatever is going on is very strong.
  • We may need temporary visas to deal with the fuel supply issues.

    However if the answer to skill shortages is always more migration we're a failed state.

    No, we are ageing one.
    The UK has been an ageing state for generations.

    What we're seeing is a concentration of wealth in the hands of the oldies.

    Much of which needs to be shifted back down the age ladder.

    And the best way of doing that is through pay rises for the lower paid in the younger generations with the oldies having to pay more for what they consume.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    The view from Ireland. Brexit is a relatively trivial part of a global problem


    ‘Supply-chain shock: ‘Do your Christmas shopping early’

    ‘Recent headlines about UK shortages of everything from petrol to milk to games consoles have been met with concern here and the occasional hint of schadenfreude. But the story of how Maher’s Christmas trees got snarled up in a global supply chain crunch as they travelled from the factory owned by his US supplier in China to Malahide is part of a much larger, and infinitely more complex picture that dwarfs the problems caused by Brexit, and is already leading to price hikes and goods shortages here.’

    https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/supply-chain-shock-do-your-christmas-shopping-early-1.4687902
  • Cyclefree said:

    Foxy said:

    tlg86 said:

    I can’t figure out why Sadiq and Priti and Keir have all given their support to Dick.

    To the extent that it makes you wonder what we’re not being told?

    It's a strange one isn't it. Patel you can understand because it would be admitting an error. The other two?
    Probably because Starmer and Khan are actually grownups. I think there is a case for Dick going, but it’s not helpful to pile on an individual in situations like this.
    I agree that there is some scapegoating going on.

    Dick would have a better defence if she made some public statements of intent how she was going to root out misogyny and the people who obstructed the Morgan investigation etc.
    The police's response has been, once again, to tell women what they need to do. Women are again being made responsible for stopping male police officers harming them.

    They are not telling police officers what to do. They are not telling men what to do. No - women have to once again add "waving at buses" and "knocking on strangers' doors" to the list of other stuff they need to do if they want to go outside their homes without being menaced.

    FFS!!

    Yes I'm angry. I'm not the only woman to feel this way. Angry and tired of this and utterly contemptuous of this pathetically risible response.
    Keir Starmer agreed with you yesterday, quite forcefully. He said the problem with the Met and Ministers is that they are telling women what they should do differently, when they should be telling the police what they should do differently. He's right.
    He also endorsed Cressida Dick
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,346

    Cyclefree said:

    Foxy said:

    tlg86 said:

    I can’t figure out why Sadiq and Priti and Keir have all given their support to Dick.

    To the extent that it makes you wonder what we’re not being told?

    It's a strange one isn't it. Patel you can understand because it would be admitting an error. The other two?
    Probably because Starmer and Khan are actually grownups. I think there is a case for Dick going, but it’s not helpful to pile on an individual in situations like this.
    I agree that there is some scapegoating going on.

    Dick would have a better defence if she made some public statements of intent how she was going to root out misogyny and the people who obstructed the Morgan investigation etc.
    The police's response has been, once again, to tell women what they need to do. Women are again being made responsible for stopping male police officers harming them.

    They are not telling police officers what to do. They are not telling men what to do. No - women have to once again add "waving at buses" and "knocking on strangers' doors" to the list of other stuff they need to do if they want to go outside their homes without being menaced.

    FFS!!

    Yes I'm angry. I'm not the only woman to feel this way. Angry and tired of this and utterly contemptuous of this pathetically risible response.
    Keir Starmer agreed with you yesterday, quite forcefully. He said the problem with the Met and Ministers is that they are telling women what they should do differently, when they should be telling the police what they should do differently. He's right.
    Only spoilt by him supporting the woman in charge of the police who gave out that instruction. So what is the point of his criticism if he won't follow through?

    Words are easy.

    Actions are hard. And no-one wants to take any action.

    So their warm words are meaningless and contemptible blather.

    I can do nothing sadly. But at least I've made some practical suggestions.

    What the fuck do all these MPs, Spads, advisors and civil servants actually DO?
  • We may need temporary visas to deal with the fuel supply issues.

    However if the answer to skill shortages is always more migration we're a failed state.

    No, we are ageing one.
    The UK has been an ageing state for generations.

    What we're seeing is a concentration of wealth in the hands of the oldies.

    Much of which needs to be shifted back down the age ladder.

    And the best way of doing that is through pay rises for the lower paid in the younger generations with the oldies having to pay more for what they consume.
    Absolutely 💯% agreed.

    The time for pay deflation and cost/asset inflation needs to be over.

    It's time for pay inflation. If someone wants a good or service then pay for it.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,791

    Dura_Ace said:


    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages

    There is definitely something going on. I recently bought an engine and transmission for my '80 Firebird (this winter's project). I had them consigned to FedEx in Memphis for shipping then I got my estimate for the freight costs.... $8,000!
    Tbf it probably weighs about 3 tons.
    Small block 383 EFI stroker and 6 speed T56 so maybe 350kg.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,724

    We may need temporary visas to deal with the fuel supply issues.

    However if the answer to skill shortages is always more migration we're a failed state.

    No, we are ageing one.
    The UK has been an ageing state for generations.

    What we're seeing is a concentration of wealth in the hands of the oldies.

    Much of which needs to be shifted back down the age ladder.

    And the best way of doing that is through pay rises for the lower paid in the younger generations with the oldies having to pay more for what they consume.
    Absolutely 💯% agreed.

    The time for pay deflation and cost/asset inflation needs to be over.

    It's time for pay inflation. If someone wants a good or service then pay for it.
    My old mentor used to talk about getting two pay rises a year as routine, made the 70s sound brilliant.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,572

    kinabalu said:



    Yes. Eg look at how "sorting out social care" became little more than a new iteration of "penny on tax to fund our NHS".

    And people have turned out a lot less supportive of even that than they claimed to be when it was merely a hypothetical opinion poll question.
    Evidence of this?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,992

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Empty shelves and no food on the table.

    This is the cost of Tory incompetence.
    https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1444210547193417735/photo/1

    Once again the empty shelves? Just been shopping. Meat from the butcher, no issues. Green grocer in the arcade, no problems, although warned about a coming shortage of cob nuts... as the season is ending. Waitrose - I could see no shortages at all.
    I am not saying there are no shortages in places, but the media is distorting the reality.
    Was in Markies food hall in Banbury this morning stocking up essentials for son who is being dropped off at college today. If there were shortages of anything it was not immediately evident.

    Have to say that Banbury is a seriously nice place. I have mentioned that we have got to a situation in Dundee that nearly 1/3rd of shops are now sitting empty making the High street and shopping centres look depressing and greatly restricting choice. In Banbury there doesn't seem to be an empty shop, the restaurant we went to last night was superb and the baking where we went for coffee this morning was first class. There was a slightly weird thing that by 8.00am there were at least 4 barbers all doing a roaring trade.

    The town has a very prosperous feel to it. It's impressive.
    Last time I was in Banbury, I saw a young man in a suit riding a unicycle on his way into work...
    So there is even a cycle wheel rationing problem now?
    Worse than that, evidently a cock-horse shortage.
    Argh.

    More horse-dancing.


  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,261
    edited October 2021
    Tres said:

    We may need temporary visas to deal with the fuel supply issues.

    However if the answer to skill shortages is always more migration we're a failed state.

    No, we are ageing one.
    The UK has been an ageing state for generations.

    What we're seeing is a concentration of wealth in the hands of the oldies.

    Much of which needs to be shifted back down the age ladder.

    And the best way of doing that is through pay rises for the lower paid in the younger generations with the oldies having to pay more for what they consume.
    Absolutely 💯% agreed.

    The time for pay deflation and cost/asset inflation needs to be over.

    It's time for pay inflation. If someone wants a good or service then pay for it.
    My old mentor used to talk about getting two pay rises a year as routine, made the 70s sound brilliant.
    Philip and others are rehearsing for their new role at the West End, for a limited run over the Winter for charity, and for pantomime season only. Red Robbo is back - and this time he's a Thatcherite ;.)
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,910
    Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Is the Guardian suggesting that there are problems anywhere in the world which are not entirely the responsibility of Brexit, Boris, the Tories, the USA and the west? Steady on. Someone needs to get to Polly Toynbee quickly.

  • kinabalu said:



    Yes. Eg look at how "sorting out social care" became little more than a new iteration of "penny on tax to fund our NHS".

    And people have turned out a lot less supportive of even that than they claimed to be when it was merely a hypothetical opinion poll question.
    Evidence of this?
    As I remember that the polls taken in the aftermath of the NI increase announcement were rather less supportive of it than the "would you be willing to pay more tax to increase funding for the NHS" type opinion poll questions.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,143
    For those who like non-SAGE models, James Ward is working on a new one to model the endemic phase we are entering:

    https://twitter.com/JamesWard73/status/1444234690597113859
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,992
    edited October 2021

    MattW said:

    Leon said:

    This isn’t just petrol stations in Penge


    “‘A perfect storm’: supply chain crisis could blow world economy off course
    From Liverpool to LA, shortages of energy, labour and transport are threatening recovery from Covid”

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/02/supply-chain-world-economy-energy-labour-transport-covid?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Also in the Guardian:

    There’s a quiet panic happening in the US economy. Medical labs are running out of supplies like pipettes and petri dishes, summer camps and restaurants are having trouble getting food, and automobile, paint and electronics firms are curtailing production because they can’t get semiconductors. One man told me he couldn’t get a Whopper meal at a Burger King in Florida, as there was a sign saying “Sorry, no french fries with any order. We have no potatoes.”

    Imagine that, no french fries in America.

    The problem seems to be getting worse, as the shortages pile on top of each other like a snake eating its tail. For instance, the inability to fix trucks means that truck drivers can’t haul boxes of goods, which might actually contain the parts needed to fix the trucks, and so forth.

    ...

    Then there’s trucking. Talk to most businesspeople who make or move things and they will complain about the driver shortage. This too is a story of deregulation. In the 1970s, the end of public rate-setting forced trucking firms to compete against each other to offer lower shipping prices. The way they did this was by lowering pay to their drivers. Trucking on a firm-level became unpredictable and financially fragile, so for drivers schedules became unsustainable, even if the pay during boom times could be high. Today, even though pay is going up, the scheduling is crushing drivers. The result is a shortage of truckers.


    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/01/america-supply-chain-shortages
    These are all true to differing extents, especially the worldwide semiconductor shortage, and the cargo ships stuck off the californian coast, but there are no major petrol or food shortages in the rest of western europe as yet, nor, from what I can gather, anywhere on the Northeastern or western coastal United States.
    There were pictures of food shortages in Brussels supermarkets this week
    Yes, but that one is because some workers went on strike at a distribution centre threatened with closure.
    https://www.retaildetail.eu/en/news/food/empty-shelves-carrefour-due-strikes-distribution-centres

    Though they have problems because of Walloon / Not Walloon politics. It seems that bringing goods into Wallonia from the rest of Belgium is verboten. Or something.
    Too late, it's already gone viral amongst the ultra-Brexiters on social media, with no information providing that crucial supporting context. I've heard that one mentioned already elsewhere today ; the need for complete normalisation of whatever is going on is very strong.
    I was going to tickle some twitter remaniacs with that, until I checked it.

    Dildo did an accurate-but-slightly-misdirecting piece on it :smile:

    https://order-order.com/2021/10/01/new-brussels-shop-shelves-empty-despiteeu/
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    kinabalu said:



    Yes. Eg look at how "sorting out social care" became little more than a new iteration of "penny on tax to fund our NHS".

    And people have turned out a lot less supportive of even that than they claimed to be when it was merely a hypothetical opinion poll question.
    Evidence of this?
    The YouGov polls explicitly asking the 1% on Nat Ins question, that showed Lab and LD voters well in favour of it... until the Tories did it
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,791
    MattW said:



    Yes, but that one is because some workers went on strike at a distribution centre threatened with closure.
    https://www.retaildetail.eu/en/news/food/empty-shelves-carrefour-due-strikes-distribution-centres

    Though they have problems because of Walloon / Not Walloon politics. It seems that bringing goods into Wallonia from the rest of Belgium is verboten. Or something.

    It's not about movement of goods. Wallonie was the industrial heart of Belgium but has been in rapid decline relative to Flanders through industrialisation so any movement of jobs from Wallonie to Flanders will be bitterly resisted.

    Eric Zemmour is an absolutely staunch rattachiste so it could be irrelevant if he becomes President of France.
This discussion has been closed.