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Starmer’s challenge: LAB starts in an almost impossible position – politicalbetting.com

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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,624

    What are you all complaining about?

    You're getting to hear a top lawyer speak for 90mins for FREE and you're complaining.

    You lot don't know how lucky you are.

    Telling you consider hearing a lawyer speak a privilege for us :)
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    "Make Brexit work"
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    The greater proportion of tax burden should not fall on working people.

    Is that even remotely possible if taken literally?
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,337

    Bit disingenuous there. Claiming he was shocked when he found out 98% of rape cases don't end in a criminal conviction.

    What was he doing all that time he was DPP and head of the CPS?

    These have been the same numbers for years. Did he not know what was going on when he was the man responsible for prosecutions?

    The numbers do not appear to be identical.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/apr/23/rape-conviction-rate-high
    (2013)...In raw figures, there were 3,692 prosecutions for rape last year, resulting in 2,333 convictions...

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/may/23/fewer-than-one-in-60-cases-lead-to-charge-in-england-and-wales
    (2020) ...While there were 52,210 rapes recorded by police in England and Wales in 2020, only 843 resulted in a charge or a summons – a rate of 1.6%..
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,747
    Words I never want to hear again

    Sir kyrr Starmer saying ‘and let me give you an example’
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    MattWMattW Posts: 18,382

    HYUFD said:

    Starmer's speech generally good overall in terms of targeting swing voters, apart from that bit he just did where he attacked Boris for reintroducing Latin in state schools which was a bit philistine

    Perhaps. In the long term, both parties need to recognise that introducing or increasing modern work skills to the national curriculum will mean squeezing out old stuff whether that be Latin or oxbow lakes or the unification of Italy.
    How can Latin be squeezed out when it is not taught in the State sector?

    What he has missed on that one is that a large majority of European countries teach Latin. It is about culture and thinking; but he's chosen the cheap mudslinging option.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,624
    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.
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    glwglw Posts: 9,549
    edited September 2021

    3% of GDP on R&D.

    Actual policy alert.

    That's a US level for R&D spending. I can't see a Labour government offering similar business and financial terms to support it. Are Labour going to let such investors get filthy rich? Are they going to change the law so that businesses that fail and the people that run them can rapidly bounce back? And they going to offer the massive tax breaks you can get in the US at Federal and State level?

    Nice target, but I really would be surprised to see Labour adopt policies that would see the UK catch up with the US. Labour usually condemns such stuff.
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    kle4 said:

    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.

    His cadence is good.
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    kle4 said:

    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.

    It's...fine. It's not set your world on fire but it's not bad, I'd put him somewhere between Attlee and Blair
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,747
    kle4 said:

    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.


    Started well, now crap
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,821
    Leon said:

    Words I never want to hear again

    Sir kyrr Starmer saying ‘and let me give you an example’

    My Dad taught me to?

    Be a boring Twat
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    kle4 said:

    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.

    His cadence is good.
    He was excellent in the emotional story bits. Very well rehearsed I would say.
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    kle4 said:

    What are you all complaining about?

    You're getting to hear a top lawyer speak for 90mins for FREE and you're complaining.

    You lot don't know how lucky you are.

    Telling you consider hearing a lawyer speak a privilege for us :)
    Yup, nearly as good as ready a lawyer's words on a regular basis.
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    The greater proportion of tax burden should not fall on working people.

    Is that even remotely possible if taken literally?

    Yes absolutely 100% possible.

    Tax unearned income at the same rate as earned income.

    I won't hold my breath for Labour to actually mean that though, but if they did I'd lend them my vote.
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,821

    kle4 said:

    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.

    It's...fine. It's not set your world on fire but it's not bad, I'd put him somewhere between Attlee and Blair
    More between IDS and Sooty
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,624

    kle4 said:

    What are you all complaining about?

    You're getting to hear a top lawyer speak for 90mins for FREE and you're complaining.

    You lot don't know how lucky you are.

    Telling you consider hearing a lawyer speak a privilege for us :)
    Yup, nearly as good as ready a lawyer's words on a regular basis.
    I give thanks every day.
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Filled up at Sainsbury's, bust but nothing out of the ordinary queue wise. However did have one fellow filling up a petrol can on foot and another person who had apparently never used a petrol station before and stopped at the first available pump rather than pulling forward to the next free pump.
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    HYUFD said:

    Starmer's speech generally good overall in terms of targeting swing voters, apart from that bit he just did where he attacked Boris for reintroducing Latin in state schools which was a bit philistine

    Perhaps. In the long term, both parties need to recognise that introducing or increasing modern work skills to the national curriculum will mean squeezing out old stuff whether that be Latin or oxbow lakes or the unification of Italy.
    Studying pronouns could be good training for the modern workplace.
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    Nigelb said:

    Bit disingenuous there. Claiming he was shocked when he found out 98% of rape cases don't end in a criminal conviction.

    What was he doing all that time he was DPP and head of the CPS?

    These have been the same numbers for years. Did he not know what was going on when he was the man responsible for prosecutions?

    The numbers do not appear to be identical.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/apr/23/rape-conviction-rate-high
    (2013)...In raw figures, there were 3,692 prosecutions for rape last year, resulting in 2,333 convictions...

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/may/23/fewer-than-one-in-60-cases-lead-to-charge-in-england-and-wales
    (2020) ...While there were 52,210 rapes recorded by police in England and Wales in 2020, only 843 resulted in a charge or a summons – a rate of 1.6%..
    That is a clever little trick you did there given that those two stats are completely different.

    The 2013 number is the the number of prosecutions which led to a conviction.
    The 2020 number is the number of accusations that led to a charge

    They are measuring completely different things.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,747
    edited September 2021

    kle4 said:

    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.

    His cadence is good.
    He was excellent in the emotional story bits. Very well rehearsed I would say.
    Why didn’t he stay there? He’s now sounding like a kind of well-meaning middle-management Lib Dem version of ceaucescu, with a 3 hour speech to dutifully applauding party apparatchiks
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    Pidcock looking miserable.

    Sir K is working well.
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    The greater proportion of tax burden should not fall on working people.

    Is that even remotely possible if taken literally?

    Yes because burden relates to fairness as well as the amount of money.

    Someone on UC has a bigger tax burden than a multi millionaire, imo.

    Burden = cause (someone) worry, hardship, or distress.
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    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,380

    RobD said:

    That 150/170 stat is shocking. I hope someone's checked it. (Actually, for the sake of the country, I hope it is wrong.)

    For those not watching it, what was the stat?
    150th out of 170 countries in investment.
    Thanks, I also missed that bit.

    I'm sure there's a way of measuring investment that makes it right (they'll have been careful, I hope!). Might not be the most valid of measurements.

    You can get almost any figure if you ask exactly the right question.
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    WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,503
    edited September 2021

    kle4 said:

    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.

    It's...fine. It's not set your world on fire but it's not bad, I'd put him somewhere between Attlee and Blair
    More between IDS and Sooty
    Very funny image. To be fair, IDS's "quiet man" speech is one on the funniest things I've ever seen in politics, whereas I'd place the effectiveness of this speech so far more between Howard and early Cameron.
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,821
    Best 3 words of speech so far

    GREEN NEW DEAL

    gets standing ovation.

    Pity he didnt want it discussed at Conference
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    Leon said:

    kle4 said:

    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.

    His cadence is good.
    He was excellent in the emotional story bits. Very well rehearsed I would say.
    Why didn’t he stay there? He’s now sounding like a kind of well-meaning middle-management Lib Dem version of ceaucescu, with a 3 hour speech to dutifully applauding party apparatchiks
    I think he wants to make sure he says as much as he can that is in the infamous essay, otherwise he has wasted a summer. :smiley:
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    Leon said:

    kle4 said:

    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.


    Started well, now crap
    The problem is that those he needs to impress will have fallen asleep and he just seems to be rambling

    I have no idea how it will be reported with the shocking news on Sarah Everard and the media likely covering the heckling

    However, Starmer has proved he is the best leader for labour at this time
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    MattWMattW Posts: 18,382

    That 150/170 stat is shocking. I hope someone's checked it. (Actually, for the sake of the country, I hope it is wrong.)

    Where is it from? I don't believe that one, unless it is very carefully cherry-picked.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,337
    edited September 2021
    Nigelb said:

    Bit disingenuous there. Claiming he was shocked when he found out 98% of rape cases don't end in a criminal conviction.

    What was he doing all that time he was DPP and head of the CPS?

    These have been the same numbers for years. Did he not know what was going on when he was the man responsible for prosecutions?

    The numbers do not appear to be identical.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/apr/23/rape-conviction-rate-high
    (2013)...In raw figures, there were 3,692 prosecutions for rape last year, resulting in 2,333 convictions...

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/may/23/fewer-than-one-in-60-cases-lead-to-charge-in-england-and-wales
    (2020) ...While there were 52,210 rapes recorded by police in England and Wales in 2020, only 843 resulted in a charge or a summons – a rate of 1.6%..
    That year, obviously, was heavily impacted by the pandemic, but the number of prosecutions for the previous year (2019/20) was 1,867.

    Also, the number of rapes reported has grown massively since 2013, so Starmer was being nowhere near as disingenuous as suggested.
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    Leon said:

    An hour in and he tells us

    ‘We have to build a strong economy’

    Ffs

    It's a shame the present government is going in the opposite direction there.
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    The greater proportion of tax burden should not fall on working people.

    Is that even remotely possible if taken literally?

    Yes absolutely 100% possible.

    Tax unearned income at the same rate as earned income.

    I won't hold my breath for Labour to actually mean that though, but if they did I'd lend them my vote.
    I agree but I think the question is whether the amount of unearned income is greater than the amount of earned income which is what he seems to be claiming? I have no idea about that.
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,839

    Best 3 words of speech so far

    GREEN NEW DEAL

    gets standing ovation.

    Pity he didnt want it discussed at Conference

    Three words that mean…

    Exactly what everyone listening wants them to mean?
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    tlg86 said:

    Starmer will have us exercising every morning like in 1984.

    We've heard the from the loony left now it's UKIP's turn.

    It's a close run think but I'd give it to the hecklers -just.
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    WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,503
    edited September 2021

    Best 3 words of speech so far

    GREEN NEW DEAL

    gets standing ovation.

    Pity he didnt want it discussed at Conference

    All Ed Miliband's work, and both left and right of the party standing to applaud. As I've mentioned many times, the centre of the party, not Mandelsonianism, will ultimately be what is essential for Starmer.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,747
    Superb shot of desperate audience member yawning. Now someone asleep

    Hahahaha
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    StockyStocky Posts: 9,708

    Leon said:

    kle4 said:

    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.

    His cadence is good.
    He was excellent in the emotional story bits. Very well rehearsed I would say.
    Why didn’t he stay there? He’s now sounding like a kind of well-meaning middle-management Lib Dem version of ceaucescu, with a 3 hour speech to dutifully applauding party apparatchiks
    I think he wants to make sure he says as much as he can that is in the infamous essay, otherwise he has wasted a summer. :smiley:
    Is he reading this off something we can't see? Otherwise, remembering all of this and delivering it so well is seriously impressive.
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    Mr. Sandpit, aye. It'll warm the cockles of their hearts when the electricity fails because the wind isn't blowing enough. Or is blowing too much.
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    I said it before.

    Keir Starmer has not looked to Blair, or Corbyn, for inspiration.

    He has looked to David Cameron.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,624
    Have seen one of his heckle retorts about it usually being Tories who heckle him on a Wednesday - very good, ties in the idea that they are being the Tories' helpers.
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    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,043

    Leon said:

    This is seriously trite now

    Totally forgettable. The only really memorable bit (to date) is his excellent put-down of the hecklers - ‘changing nations, not changing slogans’

    That’s what people will take-away. Might be rather good for Labour

    He is becoming boring because his speech is too long
    Only the soundbites will make the news headlines, so if they are ok...
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    MattWMattW Posts: 18,382
    Boris & friends are going to have to sort out their Green PR.

    Starmer is positioning to claim credit for the significant things that have already been achieved.

    Such as the UK being approx. on track for the 1.5C level, an about the only significant economy to be so.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,337

    Nigelb said:

    Bit disingenuous there. Claiming he was shocked when he found out 98% of rape cases don't end in a criminal conviction.

    What was he doing all that time he was DPP and head of the CPS?

    These have been the same numbers for years. Did he not know what was going on when he was the man responsible for prosecutions?

    The numbers do not appear to be identical.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/apr/23/rape-conviction-rate-high
    (2013)...In raw figures, there were 3,692 prosecutions for rape last year, resulting in 2,333 convictions...

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/may/23/fewer-than-one-in-60-cases-lead-to-charge-in-england-and-wales
    (2020) ...While there were 52,210 rapes recorded by police in England and Wales in 2020, only 843 resulted in a charge or a summons – a rate of 1.6%..
    That is a clever little trick you did there given that those two stats are completely different.

    The 2013 number is the the number of prosecutions which led to a conviction.
    The 2020 number is the number of accusations that led to a charge

    They are measuring completely different things.
    I was comparing the number of prosecutions brought. The difference is obvious.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,899
    What are these red cards about ?
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    New labour reborn...
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    Praising the Blair years, thank God
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    They're going wild.....someone wake up BJO
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,747
    Stocky said:

    Leon said:

    kle4 said:

    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.

    His cadence is good.
    He was excellent in the emotional story bits. Very well rehearsed I would say.
    Why didn’t he stay there? He’s now sounding like a kind of well-meaning middle-management Lib Dem version of ceaucescu, with a 3 hour speech to dutifully applauding party apparatchiks
    I think he wants to make sure he says as much as he can that is in the infamous essay, otherwise he has wasted a summer. :smiley:
    Is he reading this off something we can't see? Otherwise, remembering all of this and delivering it so well is seriously impressive.
    He turns from left to right to left again, like anyone reading a speech from two invisible plastic screens - as is normal these days
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    Standing ovation for Mark Drakeford after Starmer mentions him.
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    MattWMattW Posts: 18,382

    Best 3 words of speech so far

    GREEN NEW DEAL

    gets standing ovation.

    Pity he didnt want it discussed at Conference

    All Ed Miliband's work, and both left and right of the party standing to applaud. As I've mentioned many times, the centre of the party, not Mandelsonianism, will be key for Starmer.
    Do we have a link to what this means?

    There a lot of versions of it around.
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    Stocky said:

    Leon said:

    kle4 said:

    I cannot watch it, how is his delivery? I confess his voice is slightly annoying to me in some undefinable way, but its not a big deal.

    His cadence is good.
    He was excellent in the emotional story bits. Very well rehearsed I would say.
    Why didn’t he stay there? He’s now sounding like a kind of well-meaning middle-management Lib Dem version of ceaucescu, with a 3 hour speech to dutifully applauding party apparatchiks
    I think he wants to make sure he says as much as he can that is in the infamous essay, otherwise he has wasted a summer. :smiley:
    Is he reading this off something we can't see? Otherwise, remembering all of this and delivering it so well is seriously impressive.
    There's two visible teleprompters just ahead of him.
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    Now this, this is good.
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    It is sooooo nice to hear a Labour leader celebrating the achievements of Labour in government.
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    eekeek Posts: 24,932
    Sandpit said:

    Best 3 words of speech so far

    GREEN NEW DEAL

    gets standing ovation.

    Pity he didnt want it discussed at Conference

    Three words that mean…

    Exactly what everyone listening wants them to mean?
    Yep, never put context and content to a buzz phrase...
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    This is a new start for Labour. I really believe it.

    Maybe Keir Starmer won't win - but he has plotted a course for Labour back to power.
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    Starmer will rue the day he goes after the SNP!!
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,209
    edited September 2021
    Just flipped the radio on. Genuinely no idea if it is/was SKS or Ed Milliband talking. Talking about Labour achievements - when? And how wages have gone down under the Cons - not according to the ONS they haven't.

    What's going on???

    Edit: the audience were loving it tho
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    Starmer good on the union
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,624
    Leon said:

    Superb shot of desperate audience member yawning. Now someone asleep

    Hahahaha

    At least they have't done that stupid thing of putting a crowd behind the speaker so when one of them drops off you can see it prominently.
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,821

    Standing ovation for Mark Drakeford after Starmer mentions him.

    BigG gone off SKS now!!

    OK I cant watch anymore he is crap
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    TheValiantTheValiant Posts: 1,697


    If he was so decent why was he prepared to stand with the far left and stand against those who were opposing antisemitism in 2019? Why did he put his career before saying that antisemitism is wrong?

    Probably the same reason Corbyn and his rabble didn't leave in the 1990s. They were biding their time, just as the more moderate wing of Labour had to bide theirs.

    You can't just leave a party you don't agree with at the current time (well, you can, but you'll achieve very little unless you really are lucky). You wait and try and change it back to your vision of what Labour should be.

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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,899
    edited September 2021
    On a personal note, Starmer is still on the "might vote for" list, unlike the NIMBY borderline antivax Lib Dems right now. I've a mind to read the manifestoes thoroughly this time round.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,747
    Interesting attack on Sturgeon
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,624
    I think it has been bold to mention an opposition slogan, eg levelling up, so prominently. Can go wrong to air your opponents' messaging, but they must see a weakness there given its vagueness.
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    If Keir Starmer had quit under Corbyn he'd have never become the leader and would never have been able to fix Labour.
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    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,380
    Pulpstar said:

    What are these red cards about ?

    https://www.facebook.com/Labouragainstthewitchhunt/posts/1511873375830547 ?
    Not sure, otherwise.

    Given red is Labour's colour, it's a wee bit ambiguous.
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    edited September 2021
    Leon said:

    This is seriously trite now

    Totally forgettable. The only really memorable bit (to date) is his excellent put-down of the hecklers - ‘changing nations, not changing slogans’

    That’s what people will take-away. Might be rather good for Labour

    A slogan about a slogan. An advertisers dream
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    Alistair said:

    Filled up at Sainsbury's, bust but nothing out of the ordinary queue wise. However did have one fellow filling up a petrol can on foot and another person who had apparently never used a petrol station before and stopped at the first available pump rather than pulling forward to the next free pump.

    I hate it when they do that.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,747
    Better now on the union and on celebrating New Labour
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    maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    edited September 2021
    Normally this time on a Wednesday you get a sea of Labour MPs wearing their masks in parliament.

    Looks like the performative political posturing on facewear didn't suit today.
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    Pulpstar said:

    On a personal note, Starmer is still on the "might vote for" list, unlike the NIMBY borderline antivax Lib Dems right now. I've a mind to read the manifestoes thoroughly this time round.

    I can't vote for anyone, dislike Starmer for his plans to destroy private schools.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,747
    Close to the end?

    *a nation prays*
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,624
    edited September 2021
    Leon said:

    Interesting attack on Sturgeon

    Conference seemed a bit more hesistant to applaud on that line.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,937
    Leon said:

    Close to the end?

    *a nation prays*

    Starmer's speech is 7,286 words long. Not one of the words is "socialism".
    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1443178459627507714?s=20
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,821
    Jonathan said:

    It is sooooo nice to hear a Labour leader celebrating the achievements of Labour in government.

    Would be better having a leader like Andy Burnham who could put Labour back in Government.

    No chance with this bloke.
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    He does seem to enjoy trolling the far left at least, which is fun.
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    Standing ovation for Mark Drakeford after Starmer mentions him.

    BigG gone off SKS now!!

    OK I cant watch anymore he is crap
    Actually you are wrong

    This speech is too long but in many ways he is bringing labour out of its unelectability and laying down a challenge to Boris
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    That's the GB News vote lost.
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    Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 4,800
    He seems a deep, deep functionalist. He is going to do lots of small but important foundational stuff to make things run smoother, change emphasis and piece it all together in the belief the end result will amount to big stuff. I think he is genuinely working up not down - this is the level at which Starmer will govern, perhaps there isn't and doesn't need to be more. If done well and with thought, it could work, but how is that pitch to be made?
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,937

    Pulpstar said:

    On a personal note, Starmer is still on the "might vote for" list, unlike the NIMBY borderline antivax Lib Dems right now. I've a mind to read the manifestoes thoroughly this time round.

    I can't vote for anyone, dislike Starmer for his plans to destroy private schools.
    You will vote LD then I imagine like you usually do
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    I can get behind this. It is boringly presented and I don't agree with much of the answers but he has chosen the right topics and has the right intent.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,747
    WHAT ABOUT PALESTINE
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,899

    Pulpstar said:

    On a personal note, Starmer is still on the "might vote for" list, unlike the NIMBY borderline antivax Lib Dems right now. I've a mind to read the manifestoes thoroughly this time round.

    I can't vote for anyone, dislike Starmer for his plans to destroy private schools.
    My old school seems to have destroyed merged with the other independent school and rebranded must to everyone's annoyance itself so that's not an ideological hang up for me.
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    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,123
    glw said:

    3% of GDP on R&D.

    Actual policy alert.

    That's a US level for R&D spending. I can't see a Labour government offering similar business and financial terms to support it. Are Labour going to let such investors get filthy rich? Are they going to change the law so that businesses that fail and the people that run them can rapidly bounce back? And they going to offer the massive tax breaks you can get in the US at Federal and State level?

    Nice target, but I really would be surprised to see Labour adopt policies that would see the UK catch up with the US. Labour usually condemns such stuff.
    The only way you could achieve anything like that is more than 100% tax relief on R&D, a policy I have suggested before. But it would be expensive.
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,187
    Did Starmer miss the AUKUS announcement?
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    Good on taking the knee and England and so on but iirc Dominic Cummings said much the same thing about the stupidity of Boris getting on the wrong side of motherhood and apple pie over this.
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    Starmer

    If they are so bad, what does it say about us

    Excellent line
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    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,123
    Christ, is he still going??
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    LeonLeon Posts: 46,747
    He’s managed to get half of the Labour Conference to stand up and clap the British Army. That’s impressive. Sincerely

    This is a boring speech that had to be made
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    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Pulpstar said:

    On a personal note, Starmer is still on the "might vote for" list, unlike the NIMBY borderline antivax Lib Dems right now. I've a mind to read the manifestoes thoroughly this time round.

    I can't vote for anyone, dislike Starmer for his plans to destroy private schools.
    I was just reading this in today's grauniad and thinking how chilling it was

    When Bentall was 13, his parents used all their savings to send the brothers to Uppingham, then a forbidding boys’ boarding school in Rutland, which they hoped would give them a good start in life. Instead, Bentall was bullied for his Yorkshire accent and poor athletic performance. “I was basically mocked every day of my life between the ages of 13 and 18,” he says.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/sep/29/richard-bentall-the-doctor-who-lost-his-brother-then-revolutionised-psychology
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    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,940

    I can get behind this. It is boringly presented and I don't agree with much of the answers but he has chosen the right topics and has the right intent.

    He's chosen the right topics by covering everything.
    Expect a passage on water resource allocation in Guatemala incoming.
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,187
    "If they're so bad, what does that say about us?"

    The best part of his speech.
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    HYUFD said:

    Pulpstar said:

    On a personal note, Starmer is still on the "might vote for" list, unlike the NIMBY borderline antivax Lib Dems right now. I've a mind to read the manifestoes thoroughly this time round.

    I can't vote for anyone, dislike Starmer for his plans to destroy private schools.
    You will vote LD then I imagine like you usually do
    Nope, I've said I cannot vote for the Lib Dems as some of them have drunk the antivax/5G koolaid.

    As for usually, out of the seven general elections I've been eligible to vote in I've voted Conservative in five of them. So I usually vote Conservative.

    The only two times I haven't was when I had to vote tactically and stop Corbynites winning the seat.
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    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,380
    Young Wes has a bit of a fixed smile on him.

    Also amused (as always at these things, all parties) by the people giving a standing ovation while looking thoroughly bored, glancing around or down. If you're really enthused, you tend to look at the person enthusing you.
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    DavidL said:

    Christ, is he still going??

    Yes
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    If he was so decent why was he prepared to stand with the far left and stand against those who were opposing antisemitism in 2019? Why did he put his career before saying that antisemitism is wrong?

    Probably the same reason Corbyn and his rabble didn't leave in the 1990s. They were biding their time, just as the more moderate wing of Labour had to bide theirs.

    You can't just leave a party you don't agree with at the current time (well, you can, but you'll achieve very little unless you really are lucky). You wait and try and change it back to your vision of what Labour should be.

    Corbyn didn't bide his time in Blair's Cabinet.

    Starmer could have stabbed Corbyn in the front and stood up against antisemitism and bided his time on the backbenches.

    But no, he put his own personal career first.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,624
    Managed to see some of it now. He's doing well as far as I can see. Not that dull, some decent lines, yes a lot of trite stuff, dealt well with hecklers.

    It's a dull line, but he does seem credible, and believable when he talks about patriotism, the union, the military etc.
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    A bit jingoistic for a Labour leader.

    He's sounding too much like a Tory for my taste. Let's hope not being Johnson is enough..
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