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Trump at a 25% chance looks value for the WH2024 GOP nomination – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,158
edited June 2021 in General
imageTrump at a 25% chance looks value for the WH2024 GOP nomination – politicalbetting.com

We’ve hardly referred to events in the US following the January 6th Insurrection and the inauguration of Joe Biden. From the perspective of this side of the pond things seem a lot more peaceful and without the regular stream of Tweets from the Oval Office life is getting back to some sort of normality.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,173
    edited June 2021
    First.
  • BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,492
    second?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,569
    Lay the favourite.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,362
    Well most of the Republican voting changes will survive court attacks as the Republicans control the Supreme Court

    And Trump will win the 2024 Republican nomination if he stands for his supporters make up a significant percentage of current Republican membership - in the same way many sane former Tory Members left leaving mainly Boris supporters behind.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    I'd have thought that 25% is about right, all things considered.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,362
    Sandpit said:

    Lay the favourite.

    I'm not sure I would at those odds. 2 to 3 to 1 I would be laying 4 to 1 seems a fairly accurate estimate of his odds.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,977
    From Ladbrokes: Hancock's odds of being replaced as Health Secretary by the end of 2021 have been slashed this morning from 4/6 into 2/5. It's 2/1 he stands down by the end of the month.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,158
    Not sure about this.

    Smarkets has some Biden exit markets with the caveat that Biden's death will void the markets; which makes backing him to stay on a real no brainer.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    edited June 2021
    Scott_xP said:

    From Ladbrokes: Hancock's odds of being replaced as Health Secretary by the end of 2021 have been slashed this morning from 4/6 into 2/5. It's 2/1 he stands down by the end of the month.

    An article of PB faith was that Hancock did not want Britain in lockdown 'a minute' longer than necessary.

    FFS where is that argument today?

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,158
    ping said:

    I genuinely feel sorry for his family.

    Trump's ?
  • GnudGnud Posts: 298
    edited June 2021
    FPT

    Foxy said:

    Frost is even thicker than I thought:

    “I don’t think those who campaigned five years ago for Brexit drove the analysis, drove the politics of it. I think they are surprised, quite often, to find relations are in the state they’re in,” said Frost.

    https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jun/24/brexit-campaigners-surprised-by-sour-relations-with-eu-says-lord-frost?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other&__twitter_impression=true

    It's almost as if they expected us to keep our word...

    Frost is the perfect embodiment of the incurious mediocrity of the British managerial class that has done so much to make us so uncompetitive as a country.

    When trying to explain the success of the Nordic countries to disbelieving American, Australian and English visitors (“how come you’re so rich when you pay such high taxes?”), I usually start with explaining the difference in productivity. And to do that I explain how Nordic managers are generally competent, curious, pleasant, cooperative and… most importantly… display every sign of actually liking their fellow human beings.

    The contrast with English managerial culture could not be starker, where it seems to be obligatory to shut down curious emploees; and a criterion for getting the job is that you are a greedy bastard who despises human beings lower down the hierarchy than yourself.
    This is so true. And it applies to Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland just as much as to England.

    And it's not only expressed within the organisation that's being managed, but also in any kind of relation with "members of the public". If in Sweden, say, someone who is not in the social elite has to see someone at the local authority about something, or at a bank branch, or at a police station, the experience will be how you describe it: you will see someone who is pleasant to you, could easily imagine themselves in your position, smiles in a genuine way, has no problem leaving you in their office while they go out to check something - and if they are a woman the office is likely to be very "homely" and as often as not it will have some teddy bears for some reason. In Britain the attitude will be one of passive aggression, as if you are trying to get one over on them, and you will be unlikely ever to get a genuine smile with the eyes as well as the mouth, or any feeling that you are talking to another human being who respects you as being in the same species and could easily imagine your positions being reversed. It's like a cultural neocolonialism.

    It is a commonplace observation but nonetheless true that an organisation wherein every manager sh*ts on those of lower rank than his own is likely to have junior public-facing staff who for obvious psychological reasons tend to treat "the public" in the same way.
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    Pulpstar said:

    ping said:

    I genuinely feel sorry for his family.

    Trump's ?
    Well, yes, but no, Hancock’s.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,032

    I'd have thought that 25% is about right, all things considered.

    Probably true, looking at the utterly uninspiring, charismatic and/or accident prone alternatives.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Sandpit said:

    Lay the favourite.

    Not so sure on this one. I am leaving the market well alone.

    After Nov20 I initially thought laying trump would be a brain dead obvious move but the GOP have decided to go all in on the Big Lie and the Biden admin have signalled they are going to the whole "Not prosecuting obvious crimes of the previous administration" thing.

    So suddenly Trump at 25% looks a bit tasty.

    But it's a nightmare market with too many unknowns for me.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    edited June 2021
    ping said:

    I genuinely feel sorry for Hancock’s family.

    Wiki says he has 3 kids, I assume are school age. That’s gonna be nasty for them.

    Wow how naive are you....

    I feel sorry for the many many people who were not allowed to embrace their dying relatives under lockkdown. Matt Hancock was the architect of that system

    It now turns out he completely flouted his own rules, and clearly got off on the power he was given.

    What were his priorities then? What are they now?
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,348
    I think that if Trump wants the nomination he will win the nomination.

    Especially now that he's off Twitter, running for and winning the nomination will be the one way that he can have the constant attention his narcissistic ego demands. Why would he not want that?

    The scenarios in which he does not run for the nomination are:

    1. Incapacity due to ill health.

    2. Ineligibility due to incarceration following criminal conviction.

    3. Someone close to him (Melania? Ivanka? Junior?), and trusted by him, argues him round to the view that he's achieved all he set out to achieve, has nothing to prove, and it's for the next generation to fight to preserve his legacy.

    My feeling is that (3) would be pretty hard to pull off, because it would run contrary to his sense of self. If attempted, and failed, it's the sort of thing that might lead to that person being banished from the inner circle.

    We also have to consider that running for election again would probably be seen as a good way to avoid jail time.

    I'm frequently wrong, and it's a long time until the nomination, but that looks like he should be the odds-on favourite.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    edited June 2021
    How must the many many dupes on here who peddled as nauseam the argument that our government and its advisors were acting in our best interests be feeling this morning?

  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,747

    ping said:

    I genuinely feel sorry for Hancock’s family.

    Wiki says he has 3 kids, I assume are school age. That’s gonna be nasty for them.

    Wow how naive are you....

    I feel sorry for the many many people who were not allowed to embrace their dying relatives under lockkdown. Matt Hancock was the architect of that system

    It now turns out he completely flouted his own rules, and clearly got off on the power he was given.

    What were his priorities then? What are they now?
    And the arrogance to do it in full view of cctv. It’s not a long lens camera through a net curtain. He is clearly a massive weirdo.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,032
    Fishing said:

    I'd have thought that 25% is about right, all things considered.

    Probably true, looking at the utterly uninspiring, charismatic and/or accident prone alternatives.
    (uncharismastic)
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,158
    Alistair said:

    Sandpit said:

    Lay the favourite.

    Not so sure on this one. I am leaving the market well alone.

    After Nov20 I initially thought laying trump would be a brain dead obvious move but the GOP have decided to go all in on the Big Lie and the Biden admin have signalled they are going to the whole "Not prosecuting obvious crimes of the previous administration" thing.

    So suddenly Trump at 25% looks a bit tasty.

    But it's a nightmare market with too many unknowns for me.
    Have the rules in Georgia (Or any other red state legistlature) been changed to a republican victory no matter the votes for the next presidential election yet ?
    Also if the GOP controls the House after the midterms ... Biden does hold the hot-seat though so there is that to consider.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,948

    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
    Shouldn't the unskilled upskill?
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    How must the many many dupes on here who peddled as nauseam the argument that our government and its advisors were acting in our best interests be feeling this morning?

    If you’re happy continuing to live in your fantasy world about the discussions and arguments on here over the last year then that’s up to you.

  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    Alistair said:

    Sandpit said:

    Lay the favourite.

    Not so sure on this one. I am leaving the market well alone.

    After Nov20 I initially thought laying trump would be a brain dead obvious move but the GOP have decided to go all in on the Big Lie and the Biden admin have signalled they are going to the whole "Not prosecuting obvious crimes of the previous administration" thing.

    So suddenly Trump at 25% looks a bit tasty.

    But it's a nightmare market with too many unknowns for me.
    Later in the year, America is going to be on fire. On fire.

    Whatever you think of the election result, that Maricopa audit is not being held to endorse it. Many other legislatures were at the audit, going to school on the Arizona model.

    Trump is going to hold a series of huge rallies later in the year when he will use the audit's results to try to take Biden's legitimacy away.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    alex_ said:

    How must the many many dupes on here who peddled as nauseam the argument that our government and its advisors were acting in our best interests be feeling this morning?

    If you’re happy continuing to live in your fantasy world about the discussions and arguments on here over the last year then that’s up to you.

    Hancock was the captain of the team you turned yourself into a pin cushion for.

    If you are happy with that, fine. Anything the powerful ever do will be OK by you.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,569
    edited June 2021
    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
    Shouldn't the unskilled upskill?
    Shouldn’t employers invest in training their workforce?
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,032
    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
    Shouldn't the unskilled upskill?
    Ideally, but things like minimum wages discourage them from doing so.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
    Shouldn't the unskilled upskill?
    Absolutely. The more skills the better.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,191
    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
    Shouldn't the unskilled upskill?
    Which brings us back to large numbers of people being sent into the university system, for dubious benefit.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    moonshine said:

    ping said:

    I genuinely feel sorry for Hancock’s family.

    Wiki says he has 3 kids, I assume are school age. That’s gonna be nasty for them.

    Wow how naive are you....

    I feel sorry for the many many people who were not allowed to embrace their dying relatives under lockkdown. Matt Hancock was the architect of that system

    It now turns out he completely flouted his own rules, and clearly got off on the power he was given.

    What were his priorities then? What are they now?
    And the arrogance to do it in full view of cctv. It’s not a long lens camera through a net curtain. He is clearly a massive weirdo.

    I fear many of the people we elect are, sadly. That is why they cannot be given too much power.
  • OldBasingOldBasing Posts: 173
    Trump will be indicted and on his way to prison in New York State - wouldn't bet on this for that reason.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    How must the many many dupes on here who peddled as nauseam the argument that our government and its advisors were acting in our best interests be feeling this morning?

    I see on the last thread you tried to make this about vaccines and you still pretend you're not an antivaxxer. 🤦‍♂️

    Hancock having sex doesn't change anything about vaccines saving lives.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,362
    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
    Shouldn't the unskilled upskill?
    Shouldn’t employers invest in training their workforce?
    +1 - the truely unskilled won't know what and how to upskill - if employers want skilled workers they need to help them do so.

    After all that is the entire point of the Apprenticeship Levy, here is money that you should be using to upskill your staff.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,496
    The latest YouGov polling, pretty much in line with all the others, contains little comfort for Labour, or the LDs. Obvs sub samples are dodgy, but outside London Labour and LD are doing conspicuously badly in 'Rest of South' which is exactly where the blue wall needs to be crumbling. Far too much is being read into C&A result, which in time will look like another in the long line of byelection frolics.

    Far too much is being read into 'educated people don't vote Tory'. The ABCDE split just shows that the Tories have a solid spectrum of support across the social split. The Remain vote is split 4 or five ways (Tories second favourite among them!), while the Leave vote isn't.

    Interesting times.

    https://docs.cdn.yougov.com/zhh0oqc2h2/TheTimes_VI_Track_210624_W_BPC.pdf
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    eek said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
    Shouldn't the unskilled upskill?
    Shouldn’t employers invest in training their workforce?
    +1 - the truely unskilled won't know what and how to upskill - if employers want skilled workers they need to help them do so.

    After all that is the entire point of the Apprenticeship Levy, here is money that you should be using to upskill your staff.
    Indeed and hence why if firms want more HGV drivers etc they have the opportunity to invest in training etc
  • eekeek Posts: 28,362
    OldBasing said:

    Trump will be indicted and on his way to prison in New York State - wouldn't bet on this for that reason.

    If you believe that you can lay him and get a 25% return in less than 3 years - granted those odds aren't that attractive when you write it down.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    Pulpstar said:

    Alistair said:

    Sandpit said:

    Lay the favourite.

    Not so sure on this one. I am leaving the market well alone.

    After Nov20 I initially thought laying trump would be a brain dead obvious move but the GOP have decided to go all in on the Big Lie and the Biden admin have signalled they are going to the whole "Not prosecuting obvious crimes of the previous administration" thing.

    So suddenly Trump at 25% looks a bit tasty.

    But it's a nightmare market with too many unknowns for me.
    Have the rules in Georgia (Or any other red state legistlature) been changed to a republican victory no matter the votes for the next presidential election yet ?
    Also if the GOP controls the House after the midterms ... Biden does hold the hot-seat though so there is that to consider.
    There are valid arguments that a number of the measures that Republican legislatures are making will actually harm their own support (eg. Those who rely upon Mail in voting rather than those who favoured it in a pandemic). On the other hand the really dangerous stuff is the powers they are taking to overrule local certification boards, and also the extent to which they are encouraging whackos to get on the certification boards in the first place.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    OldBasing said:

    Trump will be indicted and on his way to prison in New York State - wouldn't bet on this for that reason.

    I don't see any way Trump can go to prison.

    Simply put, even in New York State, how do you get 12 jurors without one of them being MAGA?
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,747

    How must the many many dupes on here who peddled as nauseam the argument that our government and its advisors were acting in our best interests be feeling this morning?

    I see on the last thread you tried to make this about vaccines and you still pretend you're not an antivaxxer. 🤦‍♂️

    Hancock having sex doesn't change anything about vaccines saving lives.
    Just a little p… oh nevermind.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,362
    edited June 2021
    duplicate
  • northern_monkeynorthern_monkey Posts: 1,639
    FPT @Malmesbury

    Interesting - I can only see the 2 cannon. Unless you mean those red patches on the leading edges, which look more like the yellow you see on the outer wings in some painting schemes. But with the colour wrong.

    God I love this site.

    Yep, two cannon, one per wing.

    The machine gun ports were covered in red canvas patches to stop crap getting down the barrels, which were punctured when the guns were fired (on cannon they used condoms I think). The width of those red patches in the illustration looks more like a Hurricane pattern, where there were four guns right next to one another in the centre of the wing, with a wide red canvas patch covering all four barrels.

    On Spits with 8 Brownings the guns were spread out along the wing, one nearest the fuselage, two together in the middle of the wing one out towards the tip, giving three, narrower, red patches. Cannon armed Spits also had two machine guns per wing, giving two small red patches.

    Or something like that. There's loads of marks and probably loads more variation. No doubt someone will know better than me!
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,158
    alex_ said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Alistair said:

    Sandpit said:

    Lay the favourite.

    Not so sure on this one. I am leaving the market well alone.

    After Nov20 I initially thought laying trump would be a brain dead obvious move but the GOP have decided to go all in on the Big Lie and the Biden admin have signalled they are going to the whole "Not prosecuting obvious crimes of the previous administration" thing.

    So suddenly Trump at 25% looks a bit tasty.

    But it's a nightmare market with too many unknowns for me.
    Have the rules in Georgia (Or any other red state legistlature) been changed to a republican victory no matter the votes for the next presidential election yet ?
    Also if the GOP controls the House after the midterms ... Biden does hold the hot-seat though so there is that to consider.
    There are valid arguments that a number of the measures that Republican legislatures are making will actually harm their own support (eg. Those who rely upon Mail in voting rather than those who favoured it in a pandemic). On the other hand the really dangerous stuff is the powers they are taking to overrule local certification boards, and also the extent to which they are encouraging whackos to get on the certification boards in the first place.
    Yes but if these powers are put in place it might not matter what the underlying support is !
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,096
    edited June 2021
    I see the micro logic that says Trump will be the GOP nominee but my macro intuition says he won't be. I trust it so I continue to lay him. As his odds come in, I just top up. On my way to quite a big short.

    Mind you, I'm going off the most obvious alternative - DeSantis - too after hearing him speak following this building collapse in Miami. What an irritating voice.
  • mickydroymickydroy Posts: 316
    What a shambles this government is. Will no one rid me of this troublesome government, of course I am not advocating four knights kill Johnson, but best he avoid Canterbury, to be on the safe side.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,191
    Interesting - I can only see the 2 cannon. Unless you mean those red patches on the leading edges, which look more like the yellow you see on the outer wings in some painting schemes. But with the colour wrong.

    God I love this site.

    Yep, two cannon, one per wing.

    The machine gun ports were covered in red canvas patches to stop crap getting down the barrels, which were punctured when the guns were fired (on cannon they used condoms I think). The width of those red patches in the illustration looks more like a Hurricane pattern, where there were four guns right next to one another in the centre of the wing, with a wide red canvas patch covering all four barrels.

    On Spits with 8 Brownings the guns were spread out along the wing, one nearest the fuselage, two together in the middle of the wing one out towards the tip, giving three, narrower, red patches. Cannon armed Spits also had two machine guns per wing, giving two small red patches.

    Or something like that. There's loads of marks and probably loads more variation. No doubt someone will know better than me!

    I think we are in agreement. I don't think those red patches are supposed to be gun covers - which were round. Incidentally, I thought that covers were also to help with preventing the guns cold soaking at altitude?

    The red patches in the image look more like someone mixed up the cannon cover colour with the yellow outer leading edge used in some colour schemes.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578

    Alistair said:

    Sandpit said:

    Lay the favourite.

    Not so sure on this one. I am leaving the market well alone.

    After Nov20 I initially thought laying trump would be a brain dead obvious move but the GOP have decided to go all in on the Big Lie and the Biden admin have signalled they are going to the whole "Not prosecuting obvious crimes of the previous administration" thing.

    So suddenly Trump at 25% looks a bit tasty.

    But it's a nightmare market with too many unknowns for me.
    Later in the year, America is going to be on fire. On fire.

    Whatever you think of the election result, that Maricopa audit is not being held to endorse it. Many other legislatures were at the audit, going to school on the Arizona model.

    Trump is going to hold a series of huge rallies later in the year when he will use the audit's results to try to take Biden's legitimacy away.
    I'd agree with that. It's not just Maricopa. The Georgia SoS has also announced a review of what went on in Fulton County given they can't find a large chunk of their records for the mail in ballots.

    I was of the opinion Trump wouldn't run in 2024 but I'm far less certain of that now. The increasing view that CV came from a lab will encourage Trump to say "I told you so" (even if it isn't proved) and, for the GOP and possibly some independents, then gets them to question other things dismissed as conspiracy theories such as whether the election was stolen. He therefore probably fancies his chances, especially given the dismal performance of Harris so far and the likelihood, with the recent shift by Democrats to be more pro-law and order, Democrat infighting starts off again. Add in that the other main GOP candidates are young enough to wait until 2028 but know being chosen as the VP pick strengthens their chances hugely and it is very much for Trump to say one way or the other.



  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,191
    eek said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
    Shouldn't the unskilled upskill?
    Shouldn’t employers invest in training their workforce?
    +1 - the truely unskilled won't know what and how to upskill - if employers want skilled workers they need to help them do so.

    After all that is the entire point of the Apprenticeship Levy, here is money that you should be using to upskill your staff.
    Except that employers without training schemes aggressively poach if you train staff. A relative in the building business has gone through this - since most in the industry do very little....

    He would very much agree that, very often, the employer ends up pushing training on the workforce. This is one of those things that university graduates find to be outside their experience - the workers are often a bit resistant to going on courses etc. Even if paid for completely by the company.....
  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362
    edited June 2021

    ping said:

    I genuinely feel sorry for Hancock’s family.

    Wiki says he has 3 kids, I assume are school age. That’s gonna be nasty for them.

    Wow how naive are you....

    I feel sorry for the many many people who were not allowed to embrace their dying relatives under lockkdown. Matt Hancock was the architect of that system

    It now turns out he completely flouted his own rules, and clearly got off on the power he was given.

    What were his priorities then? What are they now?
    You silly fool!

    He was merely comforting her for the bad news she had received, about her holiday in Portugal. The best way to comfort pushy lobbiest types is put your tongue down their throat and grab a chunk of their firm buttocks. Rather like testing my eye sight with a drive, I do it all the time myself.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,362
    edited June 2021

    eek said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
    Shouldn't the unskilled upskill?
    Shouldn’t employers invest in training their workforce?
    +1 - the truely unskilled won't know what and how to upskill - if employers want skilled workers they need to help them do so.

    After all that is the entire point of the Apprenticeship Levy, here is money that you should be using to upskill your staff.
    Except that employers without training schemes aggressively poach if you train staff. A relative in the building business has gone through this - since most in the industry do very little....

    He would very much agree that, very often, the employer ends up pushing training on the workforce. This is one of those things that university graduates find to be outside their experience - the workers are often a bit resistant to going on courses etc. Even if paid for completely by the company.....
    There is usually a quid pro quo for company training which will be have a requirement that it needs to be paid back if they leave within x years - so a lot of people will turn down training as it's not worth the risk (plus the training will usually be poor quality and far too specific).

    Now I don't know how you fix the issue unless you created something like evening classes but the Government has spent 30+ years destroying them.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,397

    eek said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
    Shouldn't the unskilled upskill?
    Shouldn’t employers invest in training their workforce?
    +1 - the truely unskilled won't know what and how to upskill - if employers want skilled workers they need to help them do so.

    After all that is the entire point of the Apprenticeship Levy, here is money that you should be using to upskill your staff.
    Except that employers without training schemes aggressively poach if you train staff. A relative in the building business has gone through this - since most in the industry do very little....

    He would very much agree that, very often, the employer ends up pushing training on the workforce. This is one of those things that university graduates find to be outside their experience - the workers are often a bit resistant to going on courses etc. Even if paid for completely by the company.....
    This is why we used to have an extensive government supported FE sector.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,845
    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
    Shouldn't the unskilled upskill?
    How would the unskilled upskill? And even if they could, and even if there were, how would it help if they'd be competing, without experience, with the same experienced people for the skilled jobs?

    Employers could train unskilled workers and then employ them directly but that is not quite the same thing.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677



    I'm frequently wrong, and it's a long time until the nomination, but that looks like he should be the odds-on favourite.

    I have yet to see any compelling why he won't be the nominee.

    The campaign and election are going to be an absolute shit show at the fuck factory. It's going to be brilliant.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,569

    eek said:

    Sandpit said:

    TOPPING said:

    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    British productivity can basically be reduced to poor incentives for capital investment, and a low-skilled workforce.

    Single market membership helped compensate for the latter, somewhat.

    By supplying the low-skilled workforce.
    Not really.
    I suspect rather that the net impact was to increased the average skill level.
    Nonsense. The UK is a highly educated country which spends billions on education.

    Importing people who have skills does increase the average, hence the skills list for immigration including things like Doctors.
    Importing people who don't but are willing to work for minimum wage does not.
    Or, even worse, importing people who are skilled to work in unskilled jobs, because it pays more than skilled jobs in their home countries.
    A long running joke this, see this short clip from 2008, but this is a very serious point. Skilled people coming to do unskilled jobs is bad news for their home nation, bad news for the unskilled here, good news for the migrant but they're not using their skills, and good news for the employer who can use them rather than pay more to get the job done.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZd8sDquNYw
    Shouldn't the unskilled upskill?
    Shouldn’t employers invest in training their workforce?
    +1 - the truely unskilled won't know what and how to upskill - if employers want skilled workers they need to help them do so.

    After all that is the entire point of the Apprenticeship Levy, here is money that you should be using to upskill your staff.
    Except that employers without training schemes aggressively poach if you train staff. A relative in the building business has gone through this - since most in the industry do very little....

    He would very much agree that, very often, the employer ends up pushing training on the workforce. This is one of those things that university graduates find to be outside their experience - the workers are often a bit resistant to going on courses etc. Even if paid for completely by the company.....
    If a company is genuinely training people to have transferable skills, then a training bond arrangement is fair enough.

    It’s been common practice at airlines for decades, when a training course for a pilot on a new type of plane costs £25,000, they’re expected to either stay with the company for two years, or pay back a proportion of the cost of the training.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited June 2021
    Boris will probably be seen as strong and decisive and get a poll boost if he sacks Hancock for this - but if he doesn’t it could be the end of him
  • northern_monkeynorthern_monkey Posts: 1,639

    Interesting - I can only see the 2 cannon. Unless you mean those red patches on the leading edges, which look more like the yellow you see on the outer wings in some painting schemes. But with the colour wrong.
    God I love this site.

    Yep, two cannon, one per wing.

    The machine gun ports were covered in red canvas patches to stop crap getting down the barrels, which were punctured when the guns were fired (on cannon they used condoms I think). The width of those red patches in the illustration looks more like a Hurricane pattern, where there were four guns right next to one another in the centre of the wing, with a wide red canvas patch covering all four barrels.

    On Spits with 8 Brownings the guns were spread out along the wing, one nearest the fuselage, two together in the middle of the wing one out towards the tip, giving three, narrower, red patches. Cannon armed Spits also had two machine guns per wing, giving two small red patches.

    Or something like that. There's loads of marks and probably loads more variation. No doubt someone will know better than me!

    I think we are in agreement. I don't think those red patches are supposed to be gun covers - which were round. Incidentally, I thought that covers were also to help with preventing the guns cold soaking at altitude?

    The red patches in the image look more like someone mixed up the cannon cover colour with the yellow outer leading edge used in some colour schemes.

    Yeah it might have been the altitude thing as well - whatever, the patches were there to protect the guns.

    But I do disagree about their shape, they were definitely square. I wonder if it came on a big roll and they'd just slice off a few inches per gun port.

    Yep some marks had a yellow leading edge (though not Battle of Britain-vintage ones, the yellow came later).


  • SandraMcSandraMc Posts: 694
    Re: the Hancock affair. Popbitch had an item yesterday that are rumours that all is not well with the Gove/Vine union. The timing seems a bit of a coincidence.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,960
    Do we think old handy cock will effect the Tories chances in the by election next Thursday?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,977
    Labour goes there and calls for Matt Hancock to be sacked

    Anneliese Dodds, Labour Party Chair, says his position is 'hopelessly untenable' and says 'Boris Johnson should sack him'
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,960
    SandraMc said:

    Re: the Hancock affair. Popbitch had an item yesterday that are rumours that all is not well with the Gove/Vine union. The timing seems a bit of a coincidence.

    Well Staines was giving the nudge nudge the other week about Gove going to Portugal on his own.
  • GnudGnud Posts: 298

    ping said:

    I genuinely feel sorry for Hancock’s family.

    Wiki says he has 3 kids, I assume are school age. That’s gonna be nasty for them.

    Wow how naive are you....

    I feel sorry for the many many people who were not allowed to embrace their dying relatives under lockkdown. Matt Hancock was the architect of that system

    It now turns out he completely flouted his own rules, and clearly got off on the power he was given.

    What were his priorities then? What are they now?
    He is an utter scumbag who has a had a hand in the unnecessary suffering of a very large number of people, but that is not his children's fault.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Sky asking if Hancock kissing his aide was "necessary" under the law. 😂
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 4,239
    algarkirk said:

    The latest YouGov polling, pretty much in line with all the others, contains little comfort for Labour, or the LDs. Obvs sub samples are dodgy, but outside London Labour and LD are doing conspicuously badly in 'Rest of South' which is exactly where the blue wall needs to be crumbling. Far too much is being read into C&A result, which in time will look like another in the long line of byelection frolics.

    Far too much is being read into 'educated people don't vote Tory'. The ABCDE split just shows that the Tories have a solid spectrum of support across the social split. The Remain vote is split 4 or five ways (Tories second favourite among them!), while the Leave vote isn't.

    Interesting times.

    https://docs.cdn.yougov.com/zhh0oqc2h2/TheTimes_VI_Track_210624_W_BPC.pdf

    "Rest of South" is a big area. Calling all Tory-held seats in the south the "Blue Wall" is a journalistic soundbite but not a very illuminating one.

    The Lib Dems' appeal in this area is to a particular set of seats that have higher numbers of graduates and professionals with strong links to London. Southend, Slough and Swindon are not going LD any time soon. Much of the south-west is not returning to the LDs, either, though I think they still have a chance in a couple of places like St Ives.

    Labour is harder to assess because... well, what actually is Labour these days?
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Scott_xP said:

    Labour goes there and calls for Matt Hancock to be sacked

    Anneliese Dodds, Labour Party Chair, says his position is 'hopelessly untenable' and says 'Boris Johnson should sack him'

    She’s right, he has to go. Boris thinks he’s useless anyway so who cares?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,541
    So, who had access to the CCTV of Hancock?

    I'd love to know how that got released. Would tell us so much about the power plays within the government.....
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,191

    Interesting - I can only see the 2 cannon. Unless you mean those red patches on the leading edges, which look more like the yellow you see on the outer wings in some painting schemes. But with the colour wrong.
    God I love this site.

    Yep, two cannon, one per wing.

    The machine gun ports were covered in red canvas patches to stop crap getting down the barrels, which were punctured when the guns were fired (on cannon they used condoms I think). The width of those red patches in the illustration looks more like a Hurricane pattern, where there were four guns right next to one another in the centre of the wing, with a wide red canvas patch covering all four barrels.

    On Spits with 8 Brownings the guns were spread out along the wing, one nearest the fuselage, two together in the middle of the wing one out towards the tip, giving three, narrower, red patches. Cannon armed Spits also had two machine guns per wing, giving two small red patches.

    Or something like that. There's loads of marks and probably loads more variation. No doubt someone will know better than me!
    I think we are in agreement. I don't think those red patches are supposed to be gun covers - which were round. Incidentally, I thought that covers were also to help with preventing the guns cold soaking at altitude?

    The red patches in the image look more like someone mixed up the cannon cover colour with the yellow outer leading edge used in some colour schemes.

    Yeah it might have been the altitude thing as well - whatever, the patches were there to protect the guns.

    But I do disagree about their shape, they were definitely square. I wonder if it came on a big roll and they'd just slice off a few inches per gun port.

    Yep some marks had a yellow leading edge (though not Battle of Britain-vintage ones, the yellow came later).




    I'm pretty sure I've seen pictures of round patches.....
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,158
    Tbh it might be useful to give lockdown loving Hancock the boot as restrictions are lifted on the 19th July.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,977
  • eekeek Posts: 28,362
    Ian Dunt has a great overview over the 4 issues that Matt Hancock has problems over

    https://www.politics.co.uk/week-in-review/2021/06/25/week-in-review-hancocks-half-hour/

    Covers hypocrisy, timing, cronyism and focus both previously and especially going forward now he has personal problems to fix...
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,960
    edited June 2021
    God we are a country of lily-livered aren't we...its 10 sodding days, watch sodding Netflix, piss about on the internet. It hardly like you are in solitary Steve McQueen stylee.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9724613/Couple-forced-eat-cold-wet-difficult-digest-food-stuck-stuffy-room.html
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,096
    isam said:

    Boris will probably be seen as strong and decisive and get a poll boost if he sacks Hancock for this - but if he doesn’t it could be the end of him

    Johnson sacking somebody for philandering would lay him wide open to the charge of being a rank hypocrite.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    Boris will probably be seen as strong and decisive and get a poll boost if he sacks Hancock for this - but if he doesn’t it could be the end of him

    Johnson sacking somebody for philandering would lay him wide open to the charge of being a rank hypocrite.
    There is absolutely no reason somebody should be sacked for philadering.

    The bigger charge is that Hancock broke the law he introduced. That makes it more complicated if the action was illegal.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,362
    isam said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Labour goes there and calls for Matt Hancock to be sacked

    Anneliese Dodds, Labour Party Chair, says his position is 'hopelessly untenable' and says 'Boris Johnson should sack him'

    She’s right, he has to go. Boris thinks he’s useless anyway so who cares?
    In times of crisis it's better most of the time to keep the current person in place as they know exactly what's going on.

    This is one of those times when it's probably not worth it, Hancock must be distracted by what is going on.

    Boris's problem is who can he replace him with...
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,960
    edited June 2021
    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    Boris will probably be seen as strong and decisive and get a poll boost if he sacks Hancock for this - but if he doesn’t it could be the end of him

    Johnson sacking somebody for philandering would lay him wide open to the charge of being a rank hypocrite.
    I don't think the shagging around is really the problem. I think in general the public don't actually care that much about people having affairs anymore (Justin124 aside).

    I think it is more who is shagging around with in office hours (in the office) in the middle of a pandemic.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677

    Do we think old handy cock will effect the Tories chances in the by election next Thursday?

    Not a chance. His antics are right on the median of expected tory behaviour.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,158
    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    Boris will probably be seen as strong and decisive and get a poll boost if he sacks Hancock for this - but if he doesn’t it could be the end of him

    Johnson sacking somebody for philandering would lay him wide open to the charge of being a rank hypocrite.
    Carrie's been in Boris' bubble throughout the pandemic though, and there's either a d-notice out on his other extra-marital affairs or he's kept it in his pants for now ;)
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,977
    kinabalu said:

    Johnson sacking somebody for philandering would lay him wide open to the charge of being a rank hypocrite.

    Can't sack him for shagging.

    Could sack him for Covid rules, but Cummings...

    Could sack him for ministerial code, but Priti...

    Could sack him for being totally fucking useless maybe...
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    Just been sent a text with 2 pics of Hancock

    The lines of text are "saving lives" for the less flattering pic

    For the pic with a big smile on his face - "shagging wives"
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,240
    Scott_xP said:
    Hmm "secretly" having an affair? What does she want him to do, announce it at a 5pm presser and get JVT to give us the stats?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,960
    edited June 2021
    German health minister: 'Delta variant will have the upper hand over the summer'
    The more infectious Delta coronavirus variant will become dominant in Germany over the summer, health minister Jens Spahn said this morning.

    “The Delta variant will have the upper hand over the summer, it’s more a matter of weeks than months,” Spahn told a news conference, adding the variant currently makes up more than 15% of coronavirus cases reported in Germany.

    ---

    But its ok, everybody to the beaches and nightclubs of Southern Europe to intermingle.....
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,158
    Wonder if Mrs Hancock knew about this. Normally about 1-5 "Yes" in these situations isn't it ?
    Feel bad for her tbh
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,960
    The head of Israel’s pandemic response taskforce, Nachman Ash, told public radio the requirement came after four days of more than 100 new cases a day, with 227 cases confirmed on Thursday.

    “We are seeing a doubling every few days,” Ash said on Friday. “Another thing that’s worrying is the infections are spreading. If we had two cities where most of the infections were, we have more cities where the numbers are rising and communities where the cases are going up.”

    Ash said the rise in cases was likely due to the highly contagious Delta variant.

    ---

    They have lost their vaccine advantage when they hit the ceiling due to refuseniks.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,348

    God we are a country of lily-livered aren't we...its 10 sodding days, watch sodding Netflix, piss about on the internet. It hardly like you are in solitary Steve McQueen stylee.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9724613/Couple-forced-eat-cold-wet-difficult-digest-food-stuck-stuffy-room.html

    The food situation in the quarantine hotels does seem to be awful. I heard from my colleague who went through it that they would hear people in other rooms shouting out at midnight that they still hadn't received any food for the evening.

    There's no excuse for not being able to run the places properly, but some mate of the government has the contract and their determined to wring as much money from it as possible.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,569

    God we are a country of lily-livered aren't we...its 10 sodding days, watch sodding Netflix, piss about on the internet. It hardly like you are in solitary Steve McQueen stylee.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9724613/Couple-forced-eat-cold-wet-difficult-digest-food-stuck-stuffy-room.html

    LOL that’s brilliant, almost at the level of the tennis players in Australia. Maybe the UK should have used barracks for quarantine, as they did for the rescue flights from Wuhan back in Feb last year.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,809
    edited June 2021

    Interesting - I can only see the 2 cannon. Unless you mean those red patches on the leading edges, which look more like the yellow you see on the outer wings in some painting schemes. But with the colour wrong.
    God I love this site.

    Yep, two cannon, one per wing.

    The machine gun ports were covered in red canvas patches to stop crap getting down the barrels, which were punctured when the guns were fired (on cannon they used condoms I think). The width of those red patches in the illustration looks more like a Hurricane pattern, where there were four guns right next to one another in the centre of the wing, with a wide red canvas patch covering all four barrels.

    On Spits with 8 Brownings the guns were spread out along the wing, one nearest the fuselage, two together in the middle of the wing one out towards the tip, giving three, narrower, red patches. Cannon armed Spits also had two machine guns per wing, giving two small red patches.

    Or something like that. There's loads of marks and probably loads more variation. No doubt someone will know better than me!
    I think we are in agreement. I don't think those red patches are supposed to be gun covers - which were round. Incidentally, I thought that covers were also to help with preventing the guns cold soaking at altitude?

    The red patches in the image look more like someone mixed up the cannon cover colour with the yellow outer leading edge used in some colour schemes.
    Yeah it might have been the altitude thing as well - whatever, the patches were there to protect the guns.

    But I do disagree about their shape, they were definitely square. I wonder if it came on a big roll and they'd just slice off a few inches per gun port.

    Yep some marks had a yellow leading edge (though not Battle of Britain-vintage ones, the yellow came later).




    I'm pretty sure I've seen pictures of round patches.....

    To protect guns from dirt and moisture (which tended to freeze), definitely.

    The erks just cut off a strip and stuck it down with red oxide dope, the same stuff as they used to prime linen fabric on flying surfaces (much of the Hurricane, and the control surfaces even on the Spit, earlier marks thereof). Easier and quicker to stick (sorry) with rectangles - cutting a circle means the linen starts fraying much more quickly, too.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    Boris will probably be seen as strong and decisive and get a poll boost if he sacks Hancock for this - but if he doesn’t it could be the end of him

    Johnson sacking somebody for philandering would lay him wide open to the charge of being a rank hypocrite.
    Not at all, because the problem here is not morality but the touchy feeliness with skneknd outside his immediate household during the ‘ don’t hug granny’ era
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,158
    Someone on twitter has put forward the argument that myocarditis risk for teenagers (From Pfizer) is greater than catching Covid even assuming 100% infection.
    I assume that's a nonsense.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    Scott_xP said:
    That would be the labour party that signed off on giving Johnson and Hancock more power than any people in their roles since Churchill?

    That labour party?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,541
    Pulpstar said:

    Tbh it might be useful to give lockdown loving Hancock the boot as restrictions are lifted on the 19th July.

    19th would be a good day for a big reshuffle. "Everything has changed, folks...."
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,307
    I wonder which other Minister's alleged extra-curricular activities might now also come out .......?
  • AslanAslan Posts: 1,673

    The head of Israel’s pandemic response taskforce, Nachman Ash, told public radio the requirement came after four days of more than 100 new cases a day, with 227 cases confirmed on Thursday.

    “We are seeing a doubling every few days,” Ash said on Friday. “Another thing that’s worrying is the infections are spreading. If we had two cities where most of the infections were, we have more cities where the numbers are rising and communities where the cases are going up.”

    Ash said the rise in cases was likely due to the highly contagious Delta variant.

    ---

    They have lost their vaccine advantage when they hit the ceiling due to refuseniks.

    Natural selection in action.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,960
    edited June 2021

    God we are a country of lily-livered aren't we...its 10 sodding days, watch sodding Netflix, piss about on the internet. It hardly like you are in solitary Steve McQueen stylee.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9724613/Couple-forced-eat-cold-wet-difficult-digest-food-stuck-stuffy-room.html

    The food situation in the quarantine hotels does seem to be awful. I heard from my colleague who went through it that they would hear people in other rooms shouting out at midnight that they still hadn't received any food for the evening.

    There's no excuse for not being able to run the places properly, but some mate of the government has the contract and their determined to wring as much money from it as possible.
    Intermittent fasting, great for losing some holiday love handles....

    I personally have done 16/8 for 5+ years now, never felt better.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,977
    Hancock...

    “I accept that I breached the social distancing guidance in these circumstances. I have let people down and am very sorry. I remain focused on working to get the country out of this pandemic, and would be grateful for privacy for my family on this personal matter.”
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,950
    edited June 2021
    Fervently hope there isn't footage to verify the 'eat out' component




  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,687
    "The timing of the embrace was in clear breach of the Government's social distancing rules on embracing someone from outside his social bubble.

    The guidance in place since March 2020 had ordered people to stay two metres apart from anyone outside their household or bubble. The rules were only relaxed on May 17."

    Telegraph.


    Sack him. Today.

    How can he possibly be sent out to tell people to continue with restrictions or take on new ones now?
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    The Govt need to grasp the nettle on relaxing travel rules for vaccinated people. Apart from anything else, that is a measure than will massively incentivise further vaccine take up for younger age groups where there is no obvious health reason to take the jab. It would also resolve a lot of the ridiculous uncertainty being engendered by their current travel rules, and provide something of a stable base for returning to something approaching normality.

    It makes no sense to have rules about travel to various EU destinations which seem to be largely based on case numbers when we are increasingly trying to move away from case numbers as the key measure for easing restrictions in the U.K.

  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,207
    isam said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Labour goes there and calls for Matt Hancock to be sacked

    Anneliese Dodds, Labour Party Chair, says his position is 'hopelessly untenable' and says 'Boris Johnson should sack him'

    She’s right, he has to go. Boris thinks he’s useless anyway so who cares?
    But Boris doesn't like being told what to do. Dodds telling Johnson to sack Hancock makes it even more likely he will stay.

    Bluestblue doesn't seem to be around today, but BB's thesis- damn the press, ignore the scandals, getting rid of people because of headlines is weakness, it's all yesterday's chip paper- has a logic to it.

    It's not one I share, because I think in physics terms. Making things that dent is a good thing, because the alternative is sudden, catastrophic breaking. You roll with the little punches to prevent the knockout blow.

    But Boris has made his bed here. He's kept on too many tawdry, compromised ministers to start doing the right thing now. And once he's forced to sack one minister, another bit of his charisma- sticking by his team, ignoring the press- goes.

    And a little bit more of his scalp is exposed.
  • AslanAslan Posts: 1,673

    Scott_xP said:
    Hmm "secretly" having an affair? What does she want him to do, announce it at a 5pm presser and get JVT to give us the stats?
    In most professional workplaces if you start a relationship with someone you have supervisory oversight over, you report it.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,569
    eek said:

    isam said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Labour goes there and calls for Matt Hancock to be sacked

    Anneliese Dodds, Labour Party Chair, says his position is 'hopelessly untenable' and says 'Boris Johnson should sack him'

    She’s right, he has to go. Boris thinks he’s useless anyway so who cares?
    In times of crisis it's better most of the time to keep the current person in place as they know exactly what's going on.

    This is one of those times when it's probably not worth it, Hancock must be distracted by what is going on.

    Boris's problem is who can he replace him with...
    Who was it that Blair appointed to that job, whose immediate response in the room with the PM was “oh f@#*, not Health”?
This discussion has been closed.