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May 17th – the day we have been waiting so long for – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,127
edited May 2021 in General
May 17th – the day we have been waiting so long for – politicalbetting.com

My afternoon's work helping Daughter get pub/restaurant ready for reopening. Immensely proud of all her hard work at The Punchbowl Inn, The Green – https://t.co/fZibD06MlgWherever you are, please support local venues. Good luck to all opening tomorrow.#Millom #LakeDistrict pic.twitter.com/aSP4BRS4Og

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Comments

  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382
    Welcome
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,548
    Best of luck to Punchbowl management, staff AND their relatives on your new beginning! The place sure does look fine outside and no doubt in(n) would urge any & all PBers who authorities will allow entry into England to swing by & give it a try. THEN post your experiences.

    Still remember tooling along in my rental car in 2001 and, as the day was advancing and my energies were flagging, spotting a inn advertising rooms and stopped to check it out.

    First thing I noticed was a wonderful smell wafting from the kitchen. Price was right (= cheap) for a basic but very satisfactory room (there were bunny rabbits running around right outside my window). Had a truly first-rate feed, and hung out a the bar (not my scene) chatting with the innkeeper and a few regulars. Was one of my most pleasant experiences in the UK on that or any visit.

    See that Millom is right by the sea, on a very interesting coast. When I was in the Lake District, buzzed down the main drag (like everybody and his brother it seems) which frankly was ok but too crowded, I did not tarry. Would certainly like to check out the saltwater side of the Lake District some day.

    Cyclefree - more power to your & your daughter's arm!!
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,548
    Happy belated birthday, Mike.

    You are 1000% correct re the thrill of going to a restaurant for the first time post-COVID, especially & particularly when you are sure that you are as safe as you be doing it thanks to the jab(s).

    Not 1000% safe, or even one-tenth of it - but a damn sight better than without the vax!

    And interestingly enough, the SECOND and THIRD times are pretty thrilling. May take you a while to become truly blase again about such a simple, human pleasure.

    Maybe never.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,456
    Just back from dining inside with no mask requirement!! Still only at 50% capacity, which - given it is a very popular and noisy restaurant normally - I quite enjoyed.

    Just looking forward now to being able to travel for work and hold on-site, in-person workshops.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,548
    TimT said:

    Just back from dining inside with no mask requirement!! Still only at 50% capacity, which - given it is a very popular and noisy restaurant normally - I quite enjoyed.

    Just looking forward now to being able to travel for work and hold on-site, in-person workshops.

    Speaking of pent-up demand, please let me know IF you know any attractive, reasonably affluent widows? Definitely kindhearted, and preferably nearsighted!
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    Also encouraging.

    Why the C.D.C. Changed Its Advice on Masks
    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/14/health/cdc-masks-vaccines-variants.html?smid=tw-share
    ... One of the lingering concerns among scientists had been that even a vaccinated person might carry the virus — perhaps briefly, without symptoms — and spread it to others. But C.D.C. research, including the new study, has consistently found few infections among those who received the Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna vaccines.

    “This study, added to the many studies that preceded it, was pivotal to C.D.C. changing its recommendations for those who are fully vaccinated against Covid-19,” Dr. Walensky said in a statement on Friday.

    Other recent studies confirm that people who are infected after vaccination carry too little virus to infect others, said Florian Krammer, a virologist at the Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai.

    “It’s really hard to even sequence the virus sometimes because there’s very little virus, and it’s there for a short period of time,” he said...


    Note to study relates to the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines, as it’s from the US, but it’s quite likely the same is true of other effective vaccines such as AZN.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    The head of the CDC, facing blowback over the agency’s new liberalized mask guidelines, offered a stark reassurance on Sunday: Only unvaccinated people are at risk if they take off their masks.
    https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1394003415429259270
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    Many happy returns to Mike, and best wishes to @Cyclefree for her daughter’s grand reopening.

    (And am fairly optimistic regarding the Indian variant, FWIW.)
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,662
    edited May 2021
    Nigelb said:

    Many happy returns to Mike, and best wishes to @Cyclefree for her daughter’s grand reopening.

    (And am fairly optimistic regarding the Indian variant, FWIW.)

    Sorry to put a damp squib on a landmark day, but I will not be giving up my mask anytime soon. Too many anti vaccer loons out there! I have to think of my 92 yr old father in law too...
  • Cocky_cockneyCocky_cockney Posts: 760

    Nigelb said:

    Many happy returns to Mike, and best wishes to @Cyclefree for her daughter’s grand reopening.

    (And am fairly optimistic regarding the Indian variant, FWIW.)

    Sorry to put a damp squib on a landmark day, but I will not be giving up my mask anytime soon. Too many anti vaccer loons out there! I have to think of my 92 yr old father in law too...
    Up to you but there's no need for fully vaccinated people to be wearing them.

    We need to get out of this vortex of fear and paranoia. It's going to take a long time and, just as the war and evacuation scarred a generation, unfortunately some people never will.
  • Cocky_cockneyCocky_cockney Posts: 760
    edited May 2021
    Happy belated birthday, Mike.

    A great day today. Let's just hope that Boris doesn't allow a few panicking scientists to spook him into a flip-flop.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,314
    Good luck to all those in the licenced trade on their reopening today - and to all their customers, behave yourselves!
  • Cocky_cockneyCocky_cockney Posts: 760
    I can't really re-post that otherwise good CDC unmasking article on social media. I'm trying to tread sensitively with my younger friends and family who haven't yet been vaccinated.

    The decision to jab the most vulnerable first was clearly correct (so Labour including the King of the North were utterly wrong as usual) but I'm still conscious of the need to be sensitive. I've many younger friends who would love to be able to holiday abroad this summer etc. etc.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,662

    Nigelb said:

    Many happy returns to Mike, and best wishes to @Cyclefree for her daughter’s grand reopening.

    (And am fairly optimistic regarding the Indian variant, FWIW.)

    Sorry to put a damp squib on a landmark day, but I will not be giving up my mask anytime soon. Too many anti vaccer loons out there! I have to think of my 92 yr old father in law too...
    Up to you but there's no need for fully vaccinated people to be wearing them.

    We need to get out of this vortex of fear and paranoia. It's going to take a long time and, just as the war and evacuation scarred a generation, unfortunately some people never will.
    Fully vaccinated doesn't mean immune...
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,921

    Nigelb said:

    Many happy returns to Mike, and best wishes to @Cyclefree for her daughter’s grand reopening.

    (And am fairly optimistic regarding the Indian variant, FWIW.)

    Sorry to put a damp squib on a landmark day, but I will not be giving up my mask anytime soon. Too many anti vaccer loons out there! I have to think of my 92 yr old father in law too...
    Up to you but there's no need for fully vaccinated people to be wearing them.

    We need to get out of this vortex of fear and paranoia. It's going to take a long time and, just as the war and evacuation scarred a generation, unfortunately some people never will.
    Given the vaccines are a fair bit less effective on the really elderly, I think I'd do what @squareroot2 is doing for the next month or so. As I probably would if there was a serious influenza season.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,357

    Happy belated birthday, Mike.

    A great day today. Let's just hope that Boris doesn't allow a few panicking scientists to spook him into a flip-flop.

    Let's just hope selfish idiots being reckless don't give him cause.

    (FWIW I can see there perhaps being localised lockdowns with an accompanying vax-blitz, but not wide-spread national lockdowns. Fingers crossed.)
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575

    I can't really re-post that otherwise good CDC unmasking article on social media. I'm trying to tread sensitively with my younger friends and family who haven't yet been vaccinated.

    The decision to jab the most vulnerable first was clearly correct (so Labour including the King of the North were utterly wrong as usual) but I'm still conscious of the need to be sensitive. I've many younger friends who would love to be able to holiday abroad this summer etc. etc.

    The question of priorities is one for the inquiry (if nothing else then to keep it away from Boris's mistakes). By all means start with the most vulnerable but should priority have switched at some point to those most likely to spread the virus? Or those least able to work from home?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,921

    Happy belated birthday, Mike.

    A great day today. Let's just hope that Boris doesn't allow a few panicking scientists to spook him into a flip-flop.

    Let's just hope selfish idiots being reckless don't give him cause.

    (FWIW I can see there perhaps being localised lockdowns with an accompanying vax-blitz, but not wide-spread national lockdowns. Fingers crossed.)
    Given how many Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech vaccines the UK will be receiving in the next month, I doubt local vax-blitz will be needed.

    I'd hope that the UK will approve Pfizer for children next month, and then we really can put this entirely behind us.

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    edited May 2021

    Nigelb said:

    Many happy returns to Mike, and best wishes to @Cyclefree for her daughter’s grand reopening.

    (And am fairly optimistic regarding the Indian variant, FWIW.)

    Sorry to put a damp squib on a landmark day, but I will not be giving up my mask anytime soon. Too many anti vaccer loons out there! I have to think of my 92 yr old father in law too...
    I’m not advocating throwing caution to the winds. Seems like a reasonable individual choice to me.
    I hope the opening up will not greatly impact the fall in infections, but it’s not silly for some people to decide they want to wait and see.
  • Cocky_cockneyCocky_cockney Posts: 760
    edited May 2021

    Nigelb said:

    Many happy returns to Mike, and best wishes to @Cyclefree for her daughter’s grand reopening.

    (And am fairly optimistic regarding the Indian variant, FWIW.)

    Sorry to put a damp squib on a landmark day, but I will not be giving up my mask anytime soon. Too many anti vaccer loons out there! I have to think of my 92 yr old father in law too...
    Up to you but there's no need for fully vaccinated people to be wearing them.

    We need to get out of this vortex of fear and paranoia. It's going to take a long time and, just as the war and evacuation scarred a generation, unfortunately some people never will.
    Fully vaccinated doesn't mean immune...
    All life has a certain amount of risk. The vaccines are superb and even if you were unlucky enough to contract it, the viral load will be so small and you're not going to die from it. Not would you pass it on to your father-in-law who also would not die from it.

    It's up to you but don't spread fear further. There's really absolutely no need. We have to get out of this vortex of fear.

    We (you) have a choice now. Stay in a closed mindset of fear and paranoia or pull yourself up and out of it and get back to living.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,357

    I can't really re-post that otherwise good CDC unmasking article on social media. I'm trying to tread sensitively with my younger friends and family who haven't yet been vaccinated.

    The decision to jab the most vulnerable first was clearly correct (so Labour including the King of the North were utterly wrong as usual) but I'm still conscious of the need to be sensitive. I've many younger friends who would love to be able to holiday abroad this summer etc. etc.

    The question of priorities is one for the inquiry (if nothing else then to keep it away from Boris's mistakes). By all means start with the most vulnerable but should priority have switched at some point to those most likely to spread the virus? Or those least able to work from home?
    There was only ever one priority: the NHS. The biggest mistake was readying a huge supply of empty beds in the NHS - by sending people back to care homes. Whereupon, they returned back to hospital - along with their fellow residents - to be treated for Covid they had brought from hospital.

    "Protect the NHS" also required "close the borders". This was the second biggest mistake. Quite who was lobbying the Government to keep them open I will be most curious to discover when the Report finally comes out. If I live that long...
  • Cocky_cockneyCocky_cockney Posts: 760
    Fear is the weapon by which all dystopian regimes control their masses, long after the reason for that fear has been dissipated.

    It's also how Pavlov's dogs were controlled.

    Live life again. You really can.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,921

    Nigelb said:

    Many happy returns to Mike, and best wishes to @Cyclefree for her daughter’s grand reopening.

    (And am fairly optimistic regarding the Indian variant, FWIW.)

    Sorry to put a damp squib on a landmark day, but I will not be giving up my mask anytime soon. Too many anti vaccer loons out there! I have to think of my 92 yr old father in law too...
    Up to you but there's no need for fully vaccinated people to be wearing them.

    We need to get out of this vortex of fear and paranoia. It's going to take a long time and, just as the war and evacuation scarred a generation, unfortunately some people never will.
    Fully vaccinated doesn't mean immune...
    All life has a certain amount of risk. The vaccines are superb and even if you were unlucky enough to contract it, the viral load will be so small and you're not going to die from it. Not would you pass it on to your father-in-law who also would not die from it.

    It's up to you but don't spread fear further. There's really absolutely no need. We have to get out of this vortex of fear.

    We (you) have a choice now. Stay in a closed mindset of fear and paranoia or pull yourself up and out of it and get back to living.
    Woah.

    That's quite a leap there.

    Different people have different circumstances. As a double vaccinated person, around my double vaccinated parents, I would be quite relaxed.

    But my parents are in good health and in their early to mid 70s.

    If they were in poor health in their 80s, I'd be a bit more careful, because it only takes a mild infection at that age to cause potentiality life ending problems.

    This isn't "giving in" to panic, it's recognizing that their risk reward is different to mine.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,921

    Fear is the weapon by which all dystopian regimes control their masses, long after the reason for that fear has been dissipated.

    It's also how Pavlov's dogs were controlled.

    Live life again. You really can.

    I'm struggling to see how the personal choice to be cautious around certain people is somehow dystopian government control.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480
    rcs1000 said:

    Fear is the weapon by which all dystopian regimes control their masses, long after the reason for that fear has been dissipated.

    It's also how Pavlov's dogs were controlled.

    Live life again. You really can.

    I'm struggling to see how the personal choice to be cautious around certain people is somehow dystopian government control.
    It isn't. Freedom includes the right to choose to be cautious.

    Pleased to see that the Punchbowl Inn serves pineapple pizza. I wonder if chocolate sprinkles on cappuccino are permitted...

  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,357
    And every best wish for a bumper summer at The Punchbowl. Bit of a schlep from south Devon for a lunch, but I will see if I can do a detour round Cumbria on my way to the Outer Hebs at the end of September.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753

    Nigelb said:

    Many happy returns to Mike, and best wishes to @Cyclefree for her daughter’s grand reopening.

    (And am fairly optimistic regarding the Indian variant, FWIW.)

    Sorry to put a damp squib on a landmark day, but I will not be giving up my mask anytime soon. Too many anti vaccer loons out there! I have to think of my 92 yr old father in law too...
    Good to hear. People should be informed of the situation and risks and make their own decisions.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    I can't really re-post that otherwise good CDC unmasking article on social media. I'm trying to tread sensitively with my younger friends and family who haven't yet been vaccinated.

    The decision to jab the most vulnerable first was clearly correct (so Labour including the King of the North were utterly wrong as usual) but I'm still conscious of the need to be sensitive. I've many younger friends who would love to be able to holiday abroad this summer etc. etc.

    The question of priorities is one for the inquiry (if nothing else then to keep it away from Boris's mistakes). By all means start with the most vulnerable but should priority have switched at some point to those most likely to spread the virus? Or those least able to work from home?
    There was only ever one priority: the NHS. The biggest mistake was readying a huge supply of empty beds in the NHS - by sending people back to care homes. Whereupon, they returned back to hospital - along with their fellow residents - to be treated for Covid they had brought from hospital.

    "Protect the NHS" also required "close the borders". This was the second biggest mistake. Quite who was lobbying the Government to keep them open I will be most curious to discover when the Report finally comes out. If I live that long...
    "Don't close the borders" was one of two astronomically wrong maxims from WHO (along with "respiratory diseases are not airborne" ) based on a badly flawed understanding of the research.

    I suspect we'll find there wasn't anyone in particular lobbying to keep them open. Boris would have been happy to uncritically accept the WHO advice as communicated to him via SAGE/Whitty/Valance as he has always wanted things to "carry on as normal" as much as possible.

  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,662

    Nigelb said:

    Many happy returns to Mike, and best wishes to @Cyclefree for her daughter’s grand reopening.

    (And am fairly optimistic regarding the Indian variant, FWIW.)

    Sorry to put a damp squib on a landmark day, but I will not be giving up my mask anytime soon. Too many anti vaccer loons out there! I have to think of my 92 yr old father in law too...
    Up to you but there's no need for fully vaccinated people to be wearing them.

    We need to get out of this vortex of fear and paranoia. It's going to take a long time and, just as the war and evacuation scarred a generation, unfortunately some people never will.
    Fully vaccinated doesn't mean immune...
    All life has a certain amount of risk. The vaccines are superb and even if you were unlucky enough to contract it, the viral load will be so small and you're not going to die from it. Not would you pass it on to your father-in-law who also would not die from it.

    It's up to you but don't spread fear further. There's really absolutely no need. We have to get out of this vortex of fear.

    We (you) have a choice now. Stay in a closed mindset of fear and paranoia or pull yourself up and out of it and get back to living.
    Jeez I think I will need counselling after that.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    The interesting thing will be finding which members of government were lobbying to CLOSE the borders.
  • NemtynakhtNemtynakht Posts: 2,329

    I can't really re-post that otherwise good CDC unmasking article on social media. I'm trying to tread sensitively with my younger friends and family who haven't yet been vaccinated.

    The decision to jab the most vulnerable first was clearly correct (so Labour including the King of the North were utterly wrong as usual) but I'm still conscious of the need to be sensitive. I've many younger friends who would love to be able to holiday abroad this summer etc. etc.

    The question of priorities is one for the inquiry (if nothing else then to keep it away from Boris's mistakes). By all means start with the most vulnerable but should priority have switched at some point to those most likely to spread the virus? Or those least able to work from home?
    There was only ever one priority: the NHS. The biggest mistake was readying a huge supply of empty beds in the NHS - by sending people back to care homes. Whereupon, they returned back to hospital - along with their fellow residents - to be treated for Covid they had brought from hospital.

    "Protect the NHS" also required "close the borders". This was the second biggest mistake. Quite who was lobbying the Government to keep them open I will be most curious to discover when the Report finally comes out. If I live that long...
    I think the Government will probably be fine on both measures as it seems that scientific advice was the basis for both decisions. I'm not saying the Government was right, just that consistently SAGE bods seem to pop up saying closing the border would make no difference. Now I don't agree but I also think the Government should in general follow the scientific advice for want of anything better.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753
    edited May 2021
    rcs1000 said:

    Fear is the weapon by which all dystopian regimes control their masses, long after the reason for that fear has been dissipated.

    It's also how Pavlov's dogs were controlled.

    Live life again. You really can.

    I'm struggling to see how the personal choice to be cautious around certain people is somehow dystopian government control.
    Let's say that there was a real fear that the NHS would be overwhelmed. I mean really overwhelmed, not Guardian every year overwhelmed.

    How to get the nation to restrain itself and change its behaviour? By propagating a climate of fear and anxiety.

    Perhaps this was justified. Perhaps it wasn't. There is undoubtedly a virus which, like the flu, is dangerous for 92 yr olds.

    But it certainly achieved the aim of control. And continues to do so as people "freely" decide to maintain measures to assuage their anxiety. Was or is it dystopian? Each to their own.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    rcs1000 said:

    Fear is the weapon by which all dystopian regimes control their masses, long after the reason for that fear has been dissipated.

    It's also how Pavlov's dogs were controlled.

    Live life again. You really can.

    I'm struggling to see how the personal choice to be cautious around certain people is somehow dystopian government control.
    Everyone is free to make their own choices as long as it is the same choices Cocky makes.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753
    edited May 2021
    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753
    edited May 2021

    I can't really re-post that otherwise good CDC unmasking article on social media. I'm trying to tread sensitively with my younger friends and family who haven't yet been vaccinated.

    The decision to jab the most vulnerable first was clearly correct (so Labour including the King of the North were utterly wrong as usual) but I'm still conscious of the need to be sensitive. I've many younger friends who would love to be able to holiday abroad this summer etc. etc.

    The question of priorities is one for the inquiry (if nothing else then to keep it away from Boris's mistakes). By all means start with the most vulnerable but should priority have switched at some point to those most likely to spread the virus? Or those least able to work from home?
    There was only ever one priority: the NHS. The biggest mistake was readying a huge supply of empty beds in the NHS - by sending people back to care homes. Whereupon, they returned back to hospital - along with their fellow residents - to be treated for Covid they had brought from hospital.

    "Protect the NHS" also required "close the borders". This was the second biggest mistake. Quite who was lobbying the Government to keep them open I will be most curious to discover when the Report finally comes out. If I live that long...
    I think the Government will probably be fine on both measures as it seems that scientific advice was the basis for both decisions. I'm not saying the Government was right, just that consistently SAGE bods seem to pop up saying closing the border would make no difference. Now I don't agree but I also think the Government should in general follow the scientific advice for want of anything better.
    Interesting to hear that we have people on PB who, over the course of the pandemic, have disagreed with SAGE for being too cautious and for being not cautious enough.

    Running all those models at home while getting on with life and posting on PB must be exhausting.

    (Honourable exception for @MaxPB who does seem to have done all those things.)
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706
    Today is an important step towards normality but what is even more important is that we really crack on with vaccination. We still have a lot to do with a significant proportion of the population not vaccinated and a much larger proportion (including me) who have only received 1 dose.

    Hopefully the supply constraints of the last 2 months are now largely behind us. I want to see a series of 700k+ days in the next couple of weeks. As we vaccinate all known variants become less of an issue and less and less of a justification for any delay in removing the existing controls in June.

    As a country we need to get back to work and back to play as well. Hopefully we also see some very positive GDP numbers over the next few months as The Punchbowl and countless other establishments get going again.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,662
    I see Harry is milking it for all it is worth, this time blaming his father as a parent.
    He has no conception about what life really is like. He had easy street by comparison to most people . I had a tough time with my father but I haven't spent 50 yrs bleating about it as Harry seems destined to do.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753

    I see Harry is milking it for all it is worth, this time blaming his father as a parent.
    He has no conception about what life really is like. He had easy street by comparison to most people . I had a tough time with my father but I haven't spent 50 yrs bleating about it as Harry seems destined to do.

    Harry has what I believe is called his own lived experience. It is no more nor less valid than yours.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575
    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    You don't have to get yourself tested twice a week. Rather, you can test yourself twice a week using free home test kits.
    https://www.gov.uk/order-coronavirus-rapid-lateral-flow-tests
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    You don't have to get yourself tested twice a week. Rather, you can test yourself twice a week using free home test kits.
    https://www.gov.uk/order-coronavirus-rapid-lateral-flow-tests
    And are you planning to do so? Have you been doing so?
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    I’ve been given 7-packs of test kits twice now; we seem to be awash with them. But I don’t see the the point in using them unless I feel ill or are about to meet someone vulnerable
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753
    IanB2 said:

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    I’ve been given 7-packs of test kits twice now; we seem to be awash with them. But I don’t see the the point in using them unless I feel ill or are about to meet someone vulnerable
    BoJo seems to be saying that the whole nation should test twice a week. Regardless of how we feel.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,123
    Nigelb said:

    The head of the CDC, facing blowback over the agency’s new liberalized mask guidelines, offered a stark reassurance on Sunday: Only unvaccinated people are at risk if they take off their masks.
    https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1394003415429259270

    Shouldn’t that say “only unvaccinated people are at risk of spreading the virus if they take off their masks.”

    Of course, anyone you encounter is potentially unvaccinated so I guess that messaging might not be helpful.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,357
    edited May 2021
    Alistair said:

    I can't really re-post that otherwise good CDC unmasking article on social media. I'm trying to tread sensitively with my younger friends and family who haven't yet been vaccinated.

    The decision to jab the most vulnerable first was clearly correct (so Labour including the King of the North were utterly wrong as usual) but I'm still conscious of the need to be sensitive. I've many younger friends who would love to be able to holiday abroad this summer etc. etc.

    The question of priorities is one for the inquiry (if nothing else then to keep it away from Boris's mistakes). By all means start with the most vulnerable but should priority have switched at some point to those most likely to spread the virus? Or those least able to work from home?
    There was only ever one priority: the NHS. The biggest mistake was readying a huge supply of empty beds in the NHS - by sending people back to care homes. Whereupon, they returned back to hospital - along with their fellow residents - to be treated for Covid they had brought from hospital.

    "Protect the NHS" also required "close the borders". This was the second biggest mistake. Quite who was lobbying the Government to keep them open I will be most curious to discover when the Report finally comes out. If I live that long...
    "Don't close the borders" was one of two astronomically wrong maxims from WHO (along with "respiratory diseases are not airborne" ) based on a badly flawed understanding of the research.

    I suspect we'll find there wasn't anyone in particular lobbying to keep them open. Boris would have been happy to uncritically accept the WHO advice as communicated to him via SAGE/Whitty/Valance as he has always wanted things to "carry on as normal" as much as possible.

    I suspect there was a reluctance to face the political fall-out of cancelling folks' holibobs.

    And the only reason that closing the borders wouldn't have made any difference was, er, because the advice to close the borders wasn't given soon enough. The sources of infection into the UK from 28th February to 29th March 2020 that gave us the first spike were from 1,300 separate sources - 33.6% from Spain, 28.5% from France and 14.4% from Italy.

    0.1% came from China.

    During mid-March 2020, 20,000 a day were travelling back from Spain.

    We would still have had Covid in this country. Would it have affected as many people, caused as many deaths? A bolder Government - with better advice from experts than "it's too late now..." - would have discovered.

  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,344
    edited May 2021
    Good morning from possibly Pb's oldest current OAP.

    Mrs C and I are not going here, there and everywhere today; apart from anything else we try to have an alcohol free day on a Monday, and a meal's not a meal without wine!
    So while we won't be going today to any of the quite large number of good to excellent local pub/restaurants, we will be pleased to hear about other's celebrations.
    Especially, of course, those of Ms Cyclefree & her daughter. Like Mr MM, it's a long way from Essex to the Lakes, although we do have family not far away, so you never know.

    On a serious note. I don't think UK, and indeed the world, is by any means out of trouble yet. Our family in Thailand is still locked down and there's little or no prospect of actually, as opposed to virtually, seeing our granddaughters there for a while. We were hoping for Christmas, but the apparent importation of cases from Myanmar may well have scuppered that. UK is an island and ought to have controllable borders, but that's unusual.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575
    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    You don't have to get yourself tested twice a week. Rather, you can test yourself twice a week using free home test kits.
    https://www.gov.uk/order-coronavirus-rapid-lateral-flow-tests
    And are you planning to do so? Have you been doing so?
    A friend (my support bubble) has been using these free home tests. It is possible the PB teachers will be getting regular tests at work.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575
    IanB2 said:

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    I’ve been given 7-packs of test kits twice now; we seem to be awash with them. But I don’t see the the point in using them unless I feel ill or are about to meet someone vulnerable
    Actually, the whole point is to use the tests when you do not feel ill.
    https://www.gov.uk/order-coronavirus-rapid-lateral-flow-tests
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706
    IanB2 said:

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    I’ve been given 7-packs of test kits twice now; we seem to be awash with them. But I don’t see the the point in using them unless I feel ill or are about to meet someone vulnerable
    I was live teaching devils (trainee advocates) last Monday and was asked to do a test beforehand. It wasn't as unpleasant as many had made it sound. That's the only time I have used one and I agree that I am not minded to do so again unless I had suspicious symptoms.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480
    TOPPING said:

    IanB2 said:

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    I’ve been given 7-packs of test kits twice now; we seem to be awash with them. But I don’t see the the point in using them unless I feel ill or are about to meet someone vulnerable
    BoJo seems to be saying that the whole nation should test twice a week. Regardless of how we feel.
    The government must have a billion LFT kits it is trying to shift.
  • Rob_downunderRob_downunder Posts: 129
    John Harris proves once again why he's the best columnist in the Guardian by a long way

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/may/16/england-future-left-leaning-south-conservative-north

    We're further behind the curve of the US and the UK in Australia on this re-alignment but it's coming through. At the last federal election the constituency I live in got rid of the right wing former Prime Minister (Abbott), and replaced him with a Independent who stood on climate change action. This in one of Sydney's wealthiest areas that has always voted Liberal (liberal being the party name rather than their position which is conservative).
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706
    Should the SNP be worried about their little helpers taking over?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,314

    I can't really re-post that otherwise good CDC unmasking article on social media. I'm trying to tread sensitively with my younger friends and family who haven't yet been vaccinated.

    The decision to jab the most vulnerable first was clearly correct (so Labour including the King of the North were utterly wrong as usual) but I'm still conscious of the need to be sensitive. I've many younger friends who would love to be able to holiday abroad this summer etc. etc.

    The question of priorities is one for the inquiry (if nothing else then to keep it away from Boris's mistakes). By all means start with the most vulnerable but should priority have switched at some point to those most likely to spread the virus? Or those least able to work from home?
    There was only ever one priority: the NHS. The biggest mistake was readying a huge supply of empty beds in the NHS - by sending people back to care homes. Whereupon, they returned back to hospital - along with their fellow residents - to be treated for Covid they had brought from hospital.

    "Protect the NHS" also required "close the borders". This was the second biggest mistake. Quite who was lobbying the Government to keep them open I will be most curious to discover when the Report finally comes out. If I live that long...
    I think the Government will probably be fine on both measures as it seems that scientific advice was the basis for both decisions. I'm not saying the Government was right, just that consistently SAGE bods seem to pop up saying closing the border would make no difference. Now I don't agree but I also think the Government should in general follow the scientific advice for want of anything better.
    Borders and care homes were definitely the two biggest mistakes with the benefit of hindsight, but as you say they were with the scientific advice at the time, and many other Western governments made similar mistakes.

    As I’ve said before, the enquiry needs to be focussed primarily on understanding mistakes and not making them again, rather than any scapegoating or blaming of individuals. This is how, for example, transport accident enquiries are conducted.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706

    Good morning from possibly Pb's oldest current OAP.

    Mrs C and I are not going here, there and everywhere today; apart from anything else we try to have an alcohol free day on a Monday, and a meal's not a meal without wine!
    So while we won't be going today to any of the quite large number of good to excellent local pub/restaurants, we will be pleased to hear about other's celebrations.
    Especially, of course, those of Ms Cyclefree & her daughter. Like Mr MM, it's a long way from Essex to the Lakes, although we do have family not far away, so you never know.

    On a serious note. I don't think UK, and indeed the world, is by any means out of trouble yet. Our family in Thailand is still locked down and there's little or no prospect of actually, as opposed to virtually, seeing our granddaughters there for a while. We were hoping for Christmas, but the apparent importation of cases from Myanmar may well have scIuppered that. UK is an island and ought to have controllable borders, but that's unusual.

    I thought @JackW was at least 200.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753

    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    You don't have to get yourself tested twice a week. Rather, you can test yourself twice a week using free home test kits.
    https://www.gov.uk/order-coronavirus-rapid-lateral-flow-tests
    And are you planning to do so? Have you been doing so?
    A friend (my support bubble) has been using these free home tests. It is possible the PB teachers will be getting regular tests at work.
    Interesting thanks so are you doing them?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,344
    DavidL said:

    Good morning from possibly Pb's oldest current OAP.

    Mrs C and I are not going here, there and everywhere today; apart from anything else we try to have an alcohol free day on a Monday, and a meal's not a meal without wine!
    So while we won't be going today to any of the quite large number of good to excellent local pub/restaurants, we will be pleased to hear about other's celebrations.
    Especially, of course, those of Ms Cyclefree & her daughter. Like Mr MM, it's a long way from Essex to the Lakes, although we do have family not far away, so you never know.

    On a serious note. I don't think UK, and indeed the world, is by any means out of trouble yet. Our family in Thailand is still locked down and there's little or no prospect of actually, as opposed to virtually, seeing our granddaughters there for a while. We were hoping for Christmas, but the apparent importation of cases from Myanmar may well have scIuppered that. UK is an island and ought to have controllable borders, but that's unusual.

    I thought @JackW was at least 200.
    So did I, but he hasn't posted for a while, unless I've missed it. If he hasn't, hope he's OK!

    Off to the gym now; see you all later!
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,795
    Yet again Johnson has screwed this up. With our (belated) border controls and a rapid vaccination programme, we should be unlocking today without fear.

    And yet we have India. Who absolutely could have been excluded from entry keeping their virulent new variant away from us.

    Oh no, muses Liar. I am due to fly there to negotiate a new trade deal. So let's ignore the science for a few more weeks until the evidence is deafening and I am forced to act.

    Again.

    If this new pox starts ripping through the unvaccinated and he has to lock us down again it's entirely on him. What an utter utter wazzock
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,314

    And every best wish for a bumper summer at The Punchbowl. Bit of a schlep from south Devon for a lunch, but I will see if I can do a detour round Cumbria on my way to the Outer Hebs at the end of September.

    Very long schlep from Dubai, but will definitely have to come and visit on next UK trip - whenever that happens to be.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753
    Charles said:

    TOPPING said:

    I see Harry is milking it for all it is worth, this time blaming his father as a parent.
    He has no conception about what life really is like. He had easy street by comparison to most people . I had a tough time with my father but I haven't spent 50 yrs bleating about it as Harry seems destined to do.

    Harry has what I believe is called his own lived experience. It is no more nor less valid than yours.
    He’s now playing in the US celeb world.

    He needs airtime.

    But he’s nothing to say that people are interested in except slagging off his family.

    It’s very sad for all of them, him especially
    I agree. But his predicament is that he was born into a family that people are interested in. It's his reality.

    He is now in the world of US celebs.

    So out of the frying pan into the frying pan.

    As I always say just because it might be a first world problem doesn't mean it's not a problem.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575
    OT I see Elon Musk has been making waves in Bitcoin circles again. Apparently he has ambiguously hinted he may have sold Tesla's holding at the top, after saying he'd hold.
    https://www.reuters.com/technology/bitcoin-price-lower-after-musk-tweet-2021-05-16/
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706

    DavidL said:

    Good morning from possibly Pb's oldest current OAP.

    Mrs C and I are not going here, there and everywhere today; apart from anything else we try to have an alcohol free day on a Monday, and a meal's not a meal without wine!
    So while we won't be going today to any of the quite large number of good to excellent local pub/restaurants, we will be pleased to hear about other's celebrations.
    Especially, of course, those of Ms Cyclefree & her daughter. Like Mr MM, it's a long way from Essex to the Lakes, although we do have family not far away, so you never know.

    On a serious note. I don't think UK, and indeed the world, is by any means out of trouble yet. Our family in Thailand is still locked down and there's little or no prospect of actually, as opposed to virtually, seeing our granddaughters there for a while. We were hoping for Christmas, but the apparent importation of cases from Myanmar may well have scIuppered that. UK is an island and ought to have controllable borders, but that's unusual.

    I thought @JackW was at least 200.
    So did I, but he hasn't posted for a while, unless I've missed it. If he hasn't, hope he's OK!

    Off to the gym now; see you all later!
    He popped in briefly after the elections but it would be good to see more of him. Haven't been to a gym for over a year. Hmm....
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Yet again Johnson has screwed this up. With our (belated) border controls and a rapid vaccination programme, we should be unlocking today without fear.

    And yet we have India. Who absolutely could have been excluded from entry keeping their virulent new variant away from us.

    Oh no, muses Liar. I am due to fly there to negotiate a new trade deal. So let's ignore the science for a few more weeks until the evidence is deafening and I am forced to act.

    Again.

    If this new pox starts ripping through the unvaccinated and he has to lock us down again it's entirely on him. What an utter utter wazzock

    Just to clarify: if we don’t get a third wave and we don’t have to lockdown will you post on here praising his boldness in making the right judgement call?
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575
    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    You don't have to get yourself tested twice a week. Rather, you can test yourself twice a week using free home test kits.
    https://www.gov.uk/order-coronavirus-rapid-lateral-flow-tests
    And are you planning to do so? Have you been doing so?
    A friend (my support bubble) has been using these free home tests. It is possible the PB teachers will be getting regular tests at work.
    Interesting thanks so are you doing them?
    Tbh I'd forgotten all about them till your post this morning.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753
    Foxy said:

    TOPPING said:

    IanB2 said:

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    I’ve been given 7-packs of test kits twice now; we seem to be awash with them. But I don’t see the the point in using them unless I feel ill or are about to meet someone vulnerable
    BoJo seems to be saying that the whole nation should test twice a week. Regardless of how we feel.
    The government must have a billion LFT kits it is trying to shift.
    That would take us to May 27th!

    :smile:
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    TOPPING said:

    Charles said:

    TOPPING said:

    I see Harry is milking it for all it is worth, this time blaming his father as a parent.
    He has no conception about what life really is like. He had easy street by comparison to most people . I had a tough time with my father but I haven't spent 50 yrs bleating about it as Harry seems destined to do.

    Harry has what I believe is called his own lived experience. It is no more nor less valid than yours.
    He’s now playing in the US celeb world.

    He needs airtime.

    But he’s nothing to say that people are interested in except slagging off his family.

    It’s very sad for all of them, him especially
    I agree. But his predicament is that he was born into a family that people are interested in. It's his reality.

    He is now in the world of US celebs.

    So out of the frying pan into the frying pan.

    As I always say just because it might be a first world problem doesn't mean it's not a problem.
    Sure. But he should have knuckled down and done his duty.

    I get the appeal of California- no one knows (or cares) who I am. But I keep my head down while I’m over there precisely because I want to preserve that relative freedom.

    He’s just shat the bed
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,795
    Regarding holidays abroad, has anyone looked at the requirements to re-enter the UK from almost everywhere? A negative test before you can get on the plane plus a further two private tests during your mandatory 10 days of self-isolation.

    I know the holiday companies have been banging the drum to try and win some business, but how many people can afford a 2 week holiday and then 10 days holed up at home afterwards? The cheapest pox text package seems to be £99 a person, so that's a fair wodge if you are a family.

    Finally, has anyone noted what the 3rd country status we insisted on "winning" means when entering countries like France and Spain? When travel restarts I can see a lot of people barred entry by not having the required paperwork / proof of funds / insurance.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774

    John Harris proves once again why he's the best columnist in the Guardian by a long way

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/may/16/england-future-left-leaning-south-conservative-north

    We're further behind the curve of the US and the UK in Australia on this re-alignment but it's coming through. At the last federal election the constituency I live in got rid of the right wing former Prime Minister (Abbott), and replaced him with a Independent who stood on climate change action. This in one of Sydney's wealthiest areas that has always voted Liberal (liberal being the party name rather than their position which is conservative).

    He's right that people are moving from London, but I wonder whether in time this will prove to be more than a temporary acceleration of an existing trend, as Londoners in their 50s bring forward (or acquire the courage to go for) their plans to downshift to a quieter life, as I did some years back.

    I also see early signs that a medium term fallout from the pandemic could be boosts for green parties.

    The key question is whether and when a tipping point is reached that puts Tory dominance of the wider Home Counties seriously at risk.

    On the island, the Tories' surprise against-the-trend loss of the council surely has more to do with it widely being seen as incompetent, rather than the effect of small numbers of incomers.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,753

    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    You don't have to get yourself tested twice a week. Rather, you can test yourself twice a week using free home test kits.
    https://www.gov.uk/order-coronavirus-rapid-lateral-flow-tests
    And are you planning to do so? Have you been doing so?
    A friend (my support bubble) has been using these free home tests. It is possible the PB teachers will be getting regular tests at work.
    Interesting thanks so are you doing them?
    Tbh I'd forgotten all about them till your post this morning.
    Get testing! Keep us updated on the results.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,599
    Charles said:

    TOPPING said:

    I see Harry is milking it for all it is worth, this time blaming his father as a parent.
    He has no conception about what life really is like. He had easy street by comparison to most people . I had a tough time with my father but I haven't spent 50 yrs bleating about it as Harry seems destined to do.

    Harry has what I believe is called his own lived experience. It is no more nor less valid than yours.
    He’s now playing in the US celeb world.

    He needs airtime.

    But he’s nothing to say that people are interested in except slagging off his family.

    It’s very sad for all of them, him especially
    Yeah, its terrible he has so little to say about the world. Its not like he has given anything back to society, wouldnt it be great if he could have set up a charity event, perhaps for those in the armed services who suffered life changing injuries. If only he had done something like that, he would surely be free from criticism from the 99.9999% in society who have done less to help it change for the better.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,890
    Canada is on a very steep trajectory for first doses, poised to overtake the USA shortly
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,357
    Foxy said:

    TOPPING said:

    IanB2 said:

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    I’ve been given 7-packs of test kits twice now; we seem to be awash with them. But I don’t see the the point in using them unless I feel ill or are about to meet someone vulnerable
    BoJo seems to be saying that the whole nation should test twice a week. Regardless of how we feel.
    The government must have a billion LFT kits it is trying to shift.
    Bought from one of Hancock's mates down the pub?
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677
    Sandpit said:

    And every best wish for a bumper summer at The Punchbowl. Bit of a schlep from south Devon for a lunch, but I will see if I can do a detour round Cumbria on my way to the Outer Hebs at the end of September.

    Very long schlep from Dubai, but will definitely have to come and visit on next UK trip - whenever that happens to be.
    The A6 from Shap to Kendal is a great touge run. If you get passed by an Indischrot 997 Turbo with a GT3 RSR wing; that's me.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774

    Regarding holidays abroad, has anyone looked at the requirements to re-enter the UK from almost everywhere? A negative test before you can get on the plane plus a further two private tests during your mandatory 10 days of self-isolation.

    I know the holiday companies have been banging the drum to try and win some business, but how many people can afford a 2 week holiday and then 10 days holed up at home afterwards? The cheapest pox text package seems to be £99 a person, so that's a fair wodge if you are a family.

    Finally, has anyone noted what the 3rd country status we insisted on "winning" means when entering countries like France and Spain? When travel restarts I can see a lot of people barred entry by not having the required paperwork / proof of funds / insurance.

    Yes, I had plans to make a European road trip, as I usually do in May. Given how interesting it was travelling last September I did have a good look into whether it would still be possible to go, but decided that all the various and varying testing and quarantine and curfew requirements in place across Europe, coupled with the UK's amber restrictions which I sense won't disappear quite as quickly as some people are suggesting, made the whole thing a complex logistical challenge rather than a holiday break. I'm not travelling in the summer when it will surely be mayhem, so I shall sit here and watch holidaymakers descend from all over the country, and wait for September...
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Charles said:

    TOPPING said:

    I see Harry is milking it for all it is worth, this time blaming his father as a parent.
    He has no conception about what life really is like. He had easy street by comparison to most people . I had a tough time with my father but I haven't spent 50 yrs bleating about it as Harry seems destined to do.

    Harry has what I believe is called his own lived experience. It is no more nor less valid than yours.
    He’s now playing in the US celeb world.

    He needs airtime.

    But he’s nothing to say that people are interested in except slagging off his family.

    It’s very sad for all of them, him especially
    Yeah, its terrible he has so little to say about the world. Its not like he has given anything back to society, wouldnt it be great if he could have set up a charity event, perhaps for those in the armed services who suffered life changing injuries. If only he had done something like that, he would surely be free from criticism from the 99.9999% in society who have done less to help it change for the better.
    Invictus is a great organisation (My family supports both it and Supporting Wounded Heroes).

    But he’s left them high and dry.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    TOPPING said:

    Foxy said:

    TOPPING said:

    IanB2 said:

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    I’ve been given 7-packs of test kits twice now; we seem to be awash with them. But I don’t see the the point in using them unless I feel ill or are about to meet someone vulnerable
    BoJo seems to be saying that the whole nation should test twice a week. Regardless of how we feel.
    The government must have a billion LFT kits it is trying to shift.
    That would take us to May 27th!

    :smile:
    According to a well known PB'er we'll all be snowed in on that date, anyway.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,314
    edited May 2021
    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    And every best wish for a bumper summer at The Punchbowl. Bit of a schlep from south Devon for a lunch, but I will see if I can do a detour round Cumbria on my way to the Outer Hebs at the end of September.

    Very long schlep from Dubai, but will definitely have to come and visit on next UK trip - whenever that happens to be.
    The A6 from Shap to Kendal is a great touge run. If you get passed by an Indischrot 997 Turbo with a GT3 RSR wing; that's me.
    I’ve not been on that road for about two decades! I’ll wave as you pass me, as I’ll likely be in some sh!tty rental.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    Martin Kettle in the Guardian:

    Conservative poll watchers now contemplate the vulnerability of a “blue wall”, mainly around London. In these areas, voters who are culturally alienated from Johnson’s party may be rallying behind the best-placed opposition party. Johnson’s new planning bill, announced this week, could be an explosive catalyst in this process. The forthcoming Chesham and Amersham byelection, in a traditionally solid Tory constituency astride the HS2 rail line, will be a good indicator, with the Lib Dems the principal challenger.

    None of this is to pretend that Johnson does not dominate British politics right now. He does, and he should be taken more seriously. Nor is it to deny that a damaged Starmer has huge amounts to prove. That’s true, too. But, as the pandemic eases and more familiar politics resume, it is not just Labour that needs to clarify where it stands. Cracks in the Conservatives’ apparently commanding position show the Tories face a challenge of their own, too.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,357

    Charles said:

    TOPPING said:

    I see Harry is milking it for all it is worth, this time blaming his father as a parent.
    He has no conception about what life really is like. He had easy street by comparison to most people . I had a tough time with my father but I haven't spent 50 yrs bleating about it as Harry seems destined to do.

    Harry has what I believe is called his own lived experience. It is no more nor less valid than yours.
    He’s now playing in the US celeb world.

    He needs airtime.

    But he’s nothing to say that people are interested in except slagging off his family.

    It’s very sad for all of them, him especially
    Yeah, its terrible he has so little to say about the world. Its not like he has given anything back to society, wouldnt it be great if he could have set up a charity event, perhaps for those in the armed services who suffered life changing injuries. If only he had done something like that, he would surely be free from criticism from the 99.9999% in society who have done less to help it change for the better.
    Except, America has no interest. They just want to hear him slam the Royal family.

    It's almost as if, deep down, they fear they may have made the wrong call in getting rid of our royalty and replacing it by Presidents like Bush and Trump.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    So separated from the event by a few days I'm struggling to understand why people got so excited about Allison's cut price Jimmy Glass tribute act?
  • Massively O/T I remember a discussion a day or two ago with people worried about house prices. This house is on the street I am walking down now. 10-15 minutes by bus from main line station. Trains take just over 2 hours to Euston. Especially if you are now partially working from home, why would you not want to live here? Btw I have nothing to do with the property but Liverpool is such a bargain to live in.
    https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78560754#/
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,690
    https://youtu.be/ZBtMbBPzqHY

    Overnight in America “60 Minutes”, the oldest and one of the most sober current affairs shows in the US, broadcast this segment on UAPs (UFOs). Maybe 10 million Americans would have watched it as it aired, and it will now be bouncing around cyberspace to millions of others.

    Everyone here tends to think they are on the bleeding edge of political and current affairs discussion. This topic is leaving you collectively behind. It’s almost certainly the most important one of the last 75 years (if it turns out to be China or US tech) but may also be the most important story in human history.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575

    Charles said:

    TOPPING said:

    I see Harry is milking it for all it is worth, this time blaming his father as a parent.
    He has no conception about what life really is like. He had easy street by comparison to most people . I had a tough time with my father but I haven't spent 50 yrs bleating about it as Harry seems destined to do.

    Harry has what I believe is called his own lived experience. It is no more nor less valid than yours.
    He’s now playing in the US celeb world.

    He needs airtime.

    But he’s nothing to say that people are interested in except slagging off his family.

    It’s very sad for all of them, him especially
    Yeah, its terrible he has so little to say about the world. Its not like he has given anything back to society, wouldnt it be great if he could have set up a charity event, perhaps for those in the armed services who suffered life changing injuries. If only he had done something like that, he would surely be free from criticism from the 99.9999% in society who have done less to help it change for the better.
    That is what is odd, isn't it? Harry was doing a bang-up job, at least as much as the other Royals, and certainly more innovative with the Invicta Games and so on. But then he threw it all up in the air with this "woe is me" guff.

    Sorry if that is unfair: I've not been following and do not really care if the Royal Family ends with Her Majesty or continues for another millennium.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575

    Foxy said:

    TOPPING said:

    IanB2 said:

    TOPPING said:

    And just out of interest I notice the news items say that BoJo says people must continue to be cautious and (continue to?) "be tested twice a week".

    Does anyone on here have plans to have themselves tested twice a week? Has anyone done so to date?

    I’ve been given 7-packs of test kits twice now; we seem to be awash with them. But I don’t see the the point in using them unless I feel ill or are about to meet someone vulnerable
    BoJo seems to be saying that the whole nation should test twice a week. Regardless of how we feel.
    The government must have a billion LFT kits it is trying to shift.
    Bought from one of Hancock's mates down the pub?
    That would certainly explain why HMG needs to get the tests out of the warehouse before the inquiry. :wink:
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,795
    Charles said:

    Yet again Johnson has screwed this up. With our (belated) border controls and a rapid vaccination programme, we should be unlocking today without fear.

    And yet we have India. Who absolutely could have been excluded from entry keeping their virulent new variant away from us.

    Oh no, muses Liar. I am due to fly there to negotiate a new trade deal. So let's ignore the science for a few more weeks until the evidence is deafening and I am forced to act.

    Again.

    If this new pox starts ripping through the unvaccinated and he has to lock us down again it's entirely on him. What an utter utter wazzock

    Just to clarify: if we don’t get a third wave and we don’t have to lockdown will you post on here praising his boldness in making the right judgement call?
    No. We have the very real risk of this new Indian pox tearing up the unvaccinated. Had he acted properly that risk would not have been there.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575
    moonshine said:

    https://youtu.be/ZBtMbBPzqHY

    Overnight in America “60 Minutes”, the oldest and one of the most sober current affairs shows in the US, broadcast this segment on UAPs (UFOs). Maybe 10 million Americans would have watched it as it aired, and it will now be bouncing around cyberspace to millions of others.

    Everyone here tends to think they are on the bleeding edge of political and current affairs discussion. This topic is leaving you collectively behind. It’s almost certainly the most important one of the last 75 years (if it turns out to be China or US tech) but may also be the most important story in human history.

    Or it might be that China is launching lots of satellites and people are watching bits of rocket fall back to Earth.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,798
    DavidL said:

    Should the SNP be worried about their little helpers taking over?
    I thought in Yoonworld we were all indistinguishable, a ghastly melange of woke anti-Yookayness?

    Since Unionism is now all about gaming the system, who is whose little helpers, or is it more a daisy chain kinda thing?
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,599

    Massively O/T I remember a discussion a day or two ago with people worried about house prices. This house is on the street I am walking down now. 10-15 minutes by bus from main line station. Trains take just over 2 hours to Euston. Especially if you are now partially working from home, why would you not want to live here? Btw I have nothing to do with the property but Liverpool is such a bargain to live in.
    https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78560754#/

    Just over 2hrs is just part of the journey. To our offices in London it becomes 3hrs 17, according to google, so a 7hr round trip. Might work for some two or three days a week, but not many.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,795
    IanB2 said:

    Regarding holidays abroad, has anyone looked at the requirements to re-enter the UK from almost everywhere? A negative test before you can get on the plane plus a further two private tests during your mandatory 10 days of self-isolation.

    I know the holiday companies have been banging the drum to try and win some business, but how many people can afford a 2 week holiday and then 10 days holed up at home afterwards? The cheapest pox text package seems to be £99 a person, so that's a fair wodge if you are a family.

    Finally, has anyone noted what the 3rd country status we insisted on "winning" means when entering countries like France and Spain? When travel restarts I can see a lot of people barred entry by not having the required paperwork / proof of funds / insurance.

    Yes, I had plans to make a European road trip, as I usually do in May. Given how interesting it was travelling last September I did have a good look into whether it would still be possible to go, but decided that all the various and varying testing and quarantine and curfew requirements in place across Europe, coupled with the UK's amber restrictions which I sense won't disappear quite as quickly as some people are suggesting, made the whole thing a complex logistical challenge rather than a holiday break. I'm not travelling in the summer when it will surely be mayhem, so I shall sit here and watch holidaymakers descend from all over the country, and wait for September...
    I need to go to see the client in Romania. It will have to wait until later in the summer when perhaps we will have lifted our requirements to self-isolate.

    From what I can see of 3rd country immigration rules in France and Spain (and likely others) you can't just drive off and pick somewhere to stay as you go. Unless you can show them that you have a stack of cash to sustain you and a return ticket to exit their country.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,599

    Charles said:

    TOPPING said:

    I see Harry is milking it for all it is worth, this time blaming his father as a parent.
    He has no conception about what life really is like. He had easy street by comparison to most people . I had a tough time with my father but I haven't spent 50 yrs bleating about it as Harry seems destined to do.

    Harry has what I believe is called his own lived experience. It is no more nor less valid than yours.
    He’s now playing in the US celeb world.

    He needs airtime.

    But he’s nothing to say that people are interested in except slagging off his family.

    It’s very sad for all of them, him especially
    Yeah, its terrible he has so little to say about the world. Its not like he has given anything back to society, wouldnt it be great if he could have set up a charity event, perhaps for those in the armed services who suffered life changing injuries. If only he had done something like that, he would surely be free from criticism from the 99.9999% in society who have done less to help it change for the better.
    That is what is odd, isn't it? Harry was doing a bang-up job, at least as much as the other Royals, and certainly more innovative with the Invicta Games and so on. But then he threw it all up in the air with this "woe is me" guff.

    Sorry if that is unfair: I've not been following and do not really care if the Royal Family ends with Her Majesty or continues for another millennium.
    The guy lost his mum at a young age whilst being in the public eye his whole life. Cutting him some slack whether you approve or disapprove of his actions seems the only reasonable way for the rest of us to behave.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575
    IanB2 said:

    Martin Kettle in the Guardian:

    Conservative poll watchers now contemplate the vulnerability of a “blue wall”, mainly around London. In these areas, voters who are culturally alienated from Johnson’s party may be rallying behind the best-placed opposition party. Johnson’s new planning bill, announced this week, could be an explosive catalyst in this process. The forthcoming Chesham and Amersham byelection, in a traditionally solid Tory constituency astride the HS2 rail line, will be a good indicator, with the Lib Dems the principal challenger.

    None of this is to pretend that Johnson does not dominate British politics right now. He does, and he should be taken more seriously. Nor is it to deny that a damaged Starmer has huge amounts to prove. That’s true, too. But, as the pandemic eases and more familiar politics resume, it is not just Labour that needs to clarify where it stands. Cracks in the Conservatives’ apparently commanding position show the Tories face a challenge of their own, too.

    Starmer seems to be playing PMQs like a barrister, accumulating individual pieces of evidence ready for a barnstorming summing-up to the jury. The question is whether he ever will make use of Boris's equivocations and even lies, or if, like his fellow ex-prosecutor and now Vice President Kamala Harris in America, it will just trail off into nothing.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,795

    Massively O/T I remember a discussion a day or two ago with people worried about house prices. This house is on the street I am walking down now. 10-15 minutes by bus from main line station. Trains take just over 2 hours to Euston. Especially if you are now partially working from home, why would you not want to live here? Btw I have nothing to do with the property but Liverpool is such a bargain to live in.
    https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78560754#/

    Just over 2hrs is just part of the journey. To our offices in London it becomes 3hrs 17, according to google, so a 7hr round trip. Might work for some two or three days a week, but not many.
    I think it could work if you can do a couple of days a week in that London with an overnight stay. Long trip in, work work work, hotel, early start in the office work work work then train home. Rest of the week spent in Liverpool.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480

    Charles said:

    TOPPING said:

    I see Harry is milking it for all it is worth, this time blaming his father as a parent.
    He has no conception about what life really is like. He had easy street by comparison to most people . I had a tough time with my father but I haven't spent 50 yrs bleating about it as Harry seems destined to do.

    Harry has what I believe is called his own lived experience. It is no more nor less valid than yours.
    He’s now playing in the US celeb world.

    He needs airtime.

    But he’s nothing to say that people are interested in except slagging off his family.

    It’s very sad for all of them, him especially
    Yeah, its terrible he has so little to say about the world. Its not like he has given anything back to society, wouldnt it be great if he could have set up a charity event, perhaps for those in the armed services who suffered life changing injuries. If only he had done something like that, he would surely be free from criticism from the 99.9999% in society who have done less to help it change for the better.
    Or raising funds for covid vaccinations in poor countries?

    https://twitter.com/billboard/status/1391494439441469440?s=19
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,314

    Charles said:

    TOPPING said:

    I see Harry is milking it for all it is worth, this time blaming his father as a parent.
    He has no conception about what life really is like. He had easy street by comparison to most people . I had a tough time with my father but I haven't spent 50 yrs bleating about it as Harry seems destined to do.

    Harry has what I believe is called his own lived experience. It is no more nor less valid than yours.
    He’s now playing in the US celeb world.

    He needs airtime.

    But he’s nothing to say that people are interested in except slagging off his family.

    It’s very sad for all of them, him especially
    Yeah, its terrible he has so little to say about the world. Its not like he has given anything back to society, wouldnt it be great if he could have set up a charity event, perhaps for those in the armed services who suffered life changing injuries. If only he had done something like that, he would surely be free from criticism from the 99.9999% in society who have done less to help it change for the better.
    That is what is odd, isn't it? Harry was doing a bang-up job, at least as much as the other Royals, and certainly more innovative with the Invicta Games and so on. But then he threw it all up in the air with this "woe is me" guff.

    Sorry if that is unfair: I've not been following and do not really care if the Royal Family ends with Her Majesty or continues for another millennium.
    The guy lost his mum at a young age whilst being in the public eye his whole life. Cutting him some slack whether you approve or disapprove of his actions seems the only reasonable way for the rest of us to behave.
    No-one is forcing him to do his therapy sessions on TV.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575
    edited May 2021
    Alistair said:

    So separated from the event by a few days I'm struggling to understand why people got so excited about Allison's cut price Jimmy Glass tribute act?

    Ask @TheScreamingEagles, if he ever recovers from his meltdown on the last thread. Judging from the number of exclamation marks in his verb-free post, I think he was complaining his goalkeeper was at the wrong end.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,599
    Sandpit said:

    Charles said:

    TOPPING said:

    I see Harry is milking it for all it is worth, this time blaming his father as a parent.
    He has no conception about what life really is like. He had easy street by comparison to most people . I had a tough time with my father but I haven't spent 50 yrs bleating about it as Harry seems destined to do.

    Harry has what I believe is called his own lived experience. It is no more nor less valid than yours.
    He’s now playing in the US celeb world.

    He needs airtime.

    But he’s nothing to say that people are interested in except slagging off his family.

    It’s very sad for all of them, him especially
    Yeah, its terrible he has so little to say about the world. Its not like he has given anything back to society, wouldnt it be great if he could have set up a charity event, perhaps for those in the armed services who suffered life changing injuries. If only he had done something like that, he would surely be free from criticism from the 99.9999% in society who have done less to help it change for the better.
    That is what is odd, isn't it? Harry was doing a bang-up job, at least as much as the other Royals, and certainly more innovative with the Invicta Games and so on. But then he threw it all up in the air with this "woe is me" guff.

    Sorry if that is unfair: I've not been following and do not really care if the Royal Family ends with Her Majesty or continues for another millennium.
    The guy lost his mum at a young age whilst being in the public eye his whole life. Cutting him some slack whether you approve or disapprove of his actions seems the only reasonable way for the rest of us to behave.
    No-one is forcing him to do his therapy sessions on TV.
    No one is forcing posters to watch him or complain about him either. I know which I think less of.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,314
    edited May 2021

    Massively O/T I remember a discussion a day or two ago with people worried about house prices. This house is on the street I am walking down now. 10-15 minutes by bus from main line station. Trains take just over 2 hours to Euston. Especially if you are now partially working from home, why would you not want to live here? Btw I have nothing to do with the property but Liverpool is such a bargain to live in.
    https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78560754#/

    Just over 2hrs is just part of the journey. To our offices in London it becomes 3hrs 17, according to google, so a 7hr round trip. Might work for some two or three days a week, but not many.
    I think it could work if you can do a couple of days a week in that London with an overnight stay. Long trip in, work work work, hotel, early start in the office work work work then train home. Rest of the week spent in Liverpool.
    Yes, there’s a huge difference between two days a week and three in the London office, in terms of where you’d choose to live.

    Two days a week gives you the option to live in most of England, with one night in an hotel in Town, whereas three days a week limits you to about 90’ on the train. (Roughly a circle around Salisbury, Bristol, Birmingham, Peterborough)
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677
    Sandpit said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    And every best wish for a bumper summer at The Punchbowl. Bit of a schlep from south Devon for a lunch, but I will see if I can do a detour round Cumbria on my way to the Outer Hebs at the end of September.

    Very long schlep from Dubai, but will definitely have to come and visit on next UK trip - whenever that happens to be.
    The A6 from Shap to Kendal is a great touge run. If you get passed by an Indischrot 997 Turbo with a GT3 RSR wing; that's me.
    I’ve not been on that road for about two decades! I’ll wave as you pass me, as I’ll likely be in some sh!tty rental.
    Hire car = fastest production cars ever built. Just send it. I once went round the Nordschleife in 9m 40s in a rented F90 320d. Europcar charged my credit card 3,500 € for new pads, discs and tyres. The whole fucking dashboard came loose through the Karusell which was a bit distracting.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Charles said:

    Yet again Johnson has screwed this up. With our (belated) border controls and a rapid vaccination programme, we should be unlocking today without fear.

    And yet we have India. Who absolutely could have been excluded from entry keeping their virulent new variant away from us.

    Oh no, muses Liar. I am due to fly there to negotiate a new trade deal. So let's ignore the science for a few more weeks until the evidence is deafening and I am forced to act.

    Again.

    If this new pox starts ripping through the unvaccinated and he has to lock us down again it's entirely on him. What an utter utter wazzock

    Just to clarify: if we don’t get a third wave and we don’t have to lockdown will you post on here praising his boldness in making the right judgement call?
    No. We have the very real risk of this new Indian pox tearing up the unvaccinated. Had he acted properly that risk would not have been there.
    But your alternative has significant economic costs.

    He’s chosen a certain path that has economic benefit but more risk.

    Surely if he is right he should be praised and if he is wrong criticised?

    Otherwise I might have to doubt your evenhandedness
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,314
    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    And every best wish for a bumper summer at The Punchbowl. Bit of a schlep from south Devon for a lunch, but I will see if I can do a detour round Cumbria on my way to the Outer Hebs at the end of September.

    Very long schlep from Dubai, but will definitely have to come and visit on next UK trip - whenever that happens to be.
    The A6 from Shap to Kendal is a great touge run. If you get passed by an Indischrot 997 Turbo with a GT3 RSR wing; that's me.
    I’ve not been on that road for about two decades! I’ll wave as you pass me, as I’ll likely be in some sh!tty rental.
    Hire car = fastest production cars ever built. Just send it. I once went round the Nordschleife in 9m 40s in a rented F90 320d. Europcar charged my credit card 3,500 € for new pads, discs and tyres. The whole fucking dashboard came loose through the Karusell which was a bit distracting.
    Oh I can be quick in someone else’s car, but there’s not much on the road that would keep up with a 997 Turbo, even if I was Lewis Hamilton. Which of course you know, because that’s why you bought one! Genuine LOL and the’Ring story, I’ve heard that most rental places in Germany now have something in the contract about not driving on ‘one way toll roads’. ;)
This discussion has been closed.