@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Instinctively, emotionally, I'm with Philip. I am slightly cross when I see someone wearing a mask outside where there is no requirement to do so (nor any conceivable benefit). My emotional reaction is that these people are why we have been pushed into these excessive, illiberal restrictions in the first place. And yet, rationally - and rational wins, in the end - I know I am not them, and they may have 101 things going on in their heads which have lead them to the decision they have, from horrible personal experiences of losing loved ones down to the level of not actually finding masks that physically uncomfortable. Indeed, some of these people are my friends (albeit friends whom in pre-pandemic times we laughed about for being hilariously over-cautious.)
As long as post Jun 21 there is no law requiring me to wear a mask, I will be happy. And I can reenter the world and get a new pair of glasses and a mobile phone and all the other things I have been putting off doing for the best part of a year until I can do it maskless.
On another note, I plan to go to a pub tomorrow. I look forward to seeing how much or little they care about who I am. If they insist on QR codes or the NHS app, I won't be going; quite aside from any libertarian arguments, I need a new phone.
Afternoon all. Escorted wife to out-patient appointment this morning; routine treatment of macular degeneration. However, every iOS professing well and they don't want to see her until;l July. And she can still drive; overall eyesight is excellent.
Everyone in out-patients was masked..... staff and patients, including the team outside directing people to the nearby vaccination clinic. However, went home and wandered along the Main Street of our little town and almost no-one was masked, except me and the staff in the pharmacy.
Someone earlier suggested that Hartlepool may already be done and dusted because of the high proportion of postals in these elections - will that pretty much apply to everywhere else I wonder?
I will be amazed if the SNP fail to hold Moray or fail to gain Edinburgh Central. The bookies (who I fully accept are not infallible) have the SNP at 1/4 to gain Edinburgh Central (Ladbrokes) and to hold Moray at 1.29 (smarkets). I am on at appreciably better odds ;-)
Well yes - but for me they fall into the category of the very scared. If they're vulnerable, presumably they've been jabbed. And more to the point, out in the street, masks benefit you just about not at all. If they won't demask now, when will they?
Well, it's up to them. We haven't heard from Johnson lately on the subject of letterboxes and bank-robbers, but nijab-wearers who choose them from personal preference must be chuckling over the turn of fate that has turned the entire country including him into similar attire. Karma, innit.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
There's a place not far outside the York ring road where I was astounded to get charged £3.20 for two pints a couple of years back. I'm in North Yorkshire, so definitely not a southern jessie.
Not sure I'd describe Knottingley as beautiful Some nice villages thereabouts though and houses as cheap as the beer. We seriously thought about buying a house in Beal...
Ha ha no it’s definitely not beautiful! Aye Beal’s nice.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
I dont think it is. I think the last week will probably mean the least in any recent by election. The postal votes will be now mostly returned. PVs are the dedicated and most likely to vote of the electorate, and i'm assuming that PVs in this election are higher than ever before.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
A lot of postals in these times of Covid - and they are mostly in.
I would remain very surprised if there was a Labour hold in Hartlepool even without early postal vote returns. I believe it will be rather a comfortable Conservative win too, on a low turnout. My point was, pressure on Johnson and the Conservatives does seem to be fast moving. Nonetheless, I am not sure whoever wins Hartlepool tells us very much about GE2024.
You'd better hope Labour hold Hartlepool, because if they don't, the abject humiliation of the Opposition losing seats in midterm to a Boris Johnson under full assault by the media will kill Wallpapergate stone dead.
Here speaks somebody who is plainly not getting his weekly copy of "newpunditry-newpolitics".
I can do you a deal. Subscribe FREE at this point. It will cost a fiver once every man and his dog are clambering to get onboard in a few weeks.
Can we have Brextenders (other PBers might suggest a neater portmanteau) – those who are unhappy winners, the sorts of tiresome culture warriors who keep referring back to Brexit having WON, by way of a social wedge?
Actually not many of them on PB these days – my old Brexit adversaries such as Philip and Mortimer seem rather gracious in victory.
But the Brextenders are OUT THERE. Goodwin is their poster boy.
That’s definitely a type, but ‘brextenders’ is not good. Sounds like ‘eastenders’ which is simply confusing
The genius of ‘remoaners’ (I wonder who first coined it?) is the way it exactly captures a type with one clever punning easy-to-say, easy-to-understand word. Because, boy, they really do MOAN. Mr Meeks moaned like a Yokohama hooker for two loooong years.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
Now, now, play nicely. The place is rammed with Scots and Geordies and their offspring cos of the pits so we’re super northern in these parts.
My very simple viewpoint
South of the Tees - Southern poncey North of the Tyne - there be monsters...
As a child in Scotland whose neighbours went to the outlandish extravagance of going all the way South to Whitley Bay - which as any fule no is practically on the Equator....or in the tropics, at least....
A true northerner thinks the north ends roughly twelve miles south of where he was born. Which for me is the Cheshire/Staffordshire border just south of Macclesfield.
As someone who normally rages about honours to government time-servers, Stevens has had one hell of year, deserves to retire from his day job and can likely add an enormous amount to the expertise of their Lordships. He’s only 54.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
It’s no issue if you’re willing to radically reduce the size of Scotland’s deficit.
I see no evidence you’re willing to accept any trade-offs of Independence; which basically puts you on a par with...Brexiters.
“Brexiters” - 283,000 Google hits
“Brexiteers” - 837,000 Google hits
The BrexitEERS won the lexical war, as well
I favoured Brexitards, but I was warned off I think by the PB Mods.
Brexshitters was my favourite example of Remoaner lexicological madness. Used in newspapers by ‘serious’ journalists
Brexiteers is the term that will survive. Because it sounds cooler, is easier to say, and has that poetic hint of ‘buccaneers’, ‘grenadiers’, ‘chandeliers’
You complain about Brexshitter, which I have never heard, yet use the term remoaner. Irony obviously not your thing?
But Remoaner is a useful word. It captures the kind of Remainer who has strayed into irrationality. Someone with Strasbourg Syndrome.
I’d put Nigel Formain, on here, in that category. Maybe Mr Meeks, tho he has a more severe case
‘Remainiac’ should be reserved for Remainers who have gone completely postal. Outright lunacy. A C Grayling springs to mind.
Does ‘Brexshitters’ usefully identify a type of Brexiteer? I don’t believe it does. It’s just an unfunny insult. Used by Remoaners
I disagree. Remoaner is an insult, as is Brexshitter, although to be honest I reckon you have just made this one up.
Brexiteer is not insulting.
I rather like Remainiac and doesn't feel like an insult to me, although can appreciate how some might take it as so.
A term can be insulting AND useful and insightful. Remoaner is one such term. Remainers who moan, endlessly. We’ve all encountered them, sometimes on here
As for ‘brexshitters’ -
‘How many Brexshitters went or are going skiing in Europe? How many own second homes there? What EU wines do they drink? We must be told.’
It's Brexshit (an amorphous pile of crap) Which has a ring, just as Remoaner has.
I don't use either.
I noticed a classic bit of Brexshit from "Leon" further up this post. Quite funny really. About as ridiculous as one of the plots in one of the so-called "novels" from SeanT.
I don't moan about Brexit, @Leon I actually find it all quite funny. I admit I didn't find it amusing at first (it was pretty damaging for my business as it has and is for many), but the more I think about it the more I realise that gradually even people with slow political analysis like "Leon" will slowly and eventually grasp that they were sold a pup.
That realisation will be proportional to how much they want to believe, just like Trump supporters with whom they share a lot of mentality. Let's face it, Brexit is now a boring subject that only people like Leon bang on about, even though they won their pyric victory. I find sniggering at Brexit believers far more satisfying than moaning about something I can't change.
Someone earlier suggested that Hartlepool may already be done and dusted because of the high proportion of postals in these elections - will that pretty much apply to everywhere else I wonder?
Yep I said at the start of the week most had been posted before the let the bodies pile high.
Well yes - but for me they fall into the category of the very scared. If they're vulnerable, presumably they've been jabbed. And more to the point, out in the street, masks benefit you just about not at all. If they won't demask now, when will they?
Well, it's up to them. We haven't heard from Johnson lately on the subject of letterboxes and bank-robbers, but nijab-wearers who choose them from personal preference must be chuckling over the turn of fate that has turned the entire country including him into similar attire. Karma, innit.
Nice post, but if Johnson said that nijab-wearers look like virus scared medical mask wearers you'd criticism him wouldn't you.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
Now, now, play nicely. The place is rammed with Scots and Geordies and their offspring cos of the pits so we’re super northern in these parts.
My very simple viewpoint
South of the Tees - Southern poncey North of the Tyne - there be monsters...
As a child in Scotland whose neighbours went to the outlandish extravagance of going all the way South to Whitley Bay - which as any fule no is practically on the Equator....or in the tropics, at least....
A true northerner thinks the north ends roughly twelve miles south of where he was born. Which for me is the Cheshire/Staffordshire border just south of Macclesfield.
Three Shires Head?
(P.S. I once met a guy from Southsea Island who only considered Portsmouth and more southerly latitudes as the 'True South')
Interesting to see how the EU member state Malta (described by the British press as totally incapable financially of being an independent state shortly before their independence), has the highest vaccination rate by at least one measure (see Carlota Vance table earlier).
I find this ironic, as I think the pull back from Yes to No seems mainly due to the vaccination achievement of the UK, and the false claim that an independent Scotland could not have achieved this on its own.
I ceased to worry about whether or not Scotland would become independent a while back, as the demographics are utterly crushing for unionism. The end of the Union can be delayed but not prevented.
A couple of points rebutting nonsense comments on the election by some PBers:- Sturgeon is not going to lose her constituency seat to the privately educated millionaire Sarwar, and the SNP are not going to lose Moray, a seat that Ross was afraid to stand in at this election.
It will be interesting to see if Labour can hold any of their 3 constituency seats currently held on tiny or small majorities, Dumbarton, East Lothian and Edinburgh Southern. The last named seems their best bet to me due to tactical voting for Labour by Tory supporters.
Nearly forgot-Angus Robertson will gain Edinburgh Central from the Conservatives. Baroness Davidson has fled that scene having employed her usual tactic of dodging her constituents :-)
No point expecting any sensible comments from the diehard unionists on here. Though I suspect a Scotch expert will be along soon to correct you.
Can we have Brextenders (other PBers might suggest a neater portmanteau) – those who are unhappy winners, the sorts of tiresome culture warriors who keep referring back to Brexit having WON, by way of a social wedge?
Actually not many of them on PB these days – my old Brexit adversaries such as Philip and Mortimer seem rather gracious in victory.
But the Brextenders are OUT THERE. Goodwin is their poster boy.
That’s definitely a type, but ‘brextenders’ is not good. Sounds like ‘eastenders’ which is simply confusing
The genius of ‘remoaners’ (I wonder who first coined it?) is the way it exactly captures a type with one clever punning easy-to-say, easy-to-understand word. Because, boy, they really do MOAN. Mr Meeks moaned like a Yokohama hooker for two loooong years.
Yes, the portmanteau needs work. I'll have a rethink!
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Instinctively, emotionally, I'm with Philip. I am slightly cross when I see someone wearing a mask outside where there is no requirement to do so (nor any conceivable benefit). My emotional reaction is that these people are why we have been pushed into these excessive, illiberal restrictions in the first place. And yet, rationally - and rational wins, in the end - I know I am not them, and they may have 101 things going on in their heads which have lead them to the decision they have, from horrible personal experiences of losing loved ones down to the level of not actually finding masks that physically uncomfortable. Indeed, some of these people are my friends (albeit friends whom in pre-pandemic times we laughed about for being hilariously over-cautious.)
As long as post Jun 21 there is no law requiring me to wear a mask, I will be happy. And I can reenter the world and get a new pair of glasses and a mobile phone and all the other things I have been putting off doing for the best part of a year until I can do it maskless.
On another note, I plan to go to a pub tomorrow. I look forward to seeing how much or little they care about who I am. If they insist on QR codes or the NHS app, I won't be going; quite aside from any libertarian arguments, I need a new phone.
I've been talking about masks in crowded indoor spaces. This is what I postulate will carry on to a significant extent and is most certainly not "weird". Wearing a mask all of the time when out of the house is something else. That's imo a bit wei ... odd. But, you know, each to his own, live and let live, bla bla.
So that's the good news. You're not with Philip, you're in a much better place - with me.
If everyone gets their vaccines we should get to zero Covid I think. You just need proof of vaccination & a negative test as a condition of entry to the country.
Is that realistic? I agree that if everyone - or even if a sufficiently large number of people - get their vaccine then covid has nowhere to go and dies out in the UK. (Though of course we would still get thousands of positive tests a week on current numbers of testing). But how many people come in to the UK each day? Can we insist all of those have negative tests? Can we rely on the accuracy of those negative tests? And somewhere there has to be a frontier. Even NZ - which is much more able than us to seal itself off - kept getting cases reintroduced.
Some people will slip through the net and present symptons later, but the virus is being dropped into a vaccinated population; it can't proliferate because it can't find hosts. New Zealand has an issue because it has a ~ zero antibody population.
Yes, fair point. I think I am taking 'zero covid' too literally.
Well yes - but for me they fall into the category of the very scared. If they're vulnerable, presumably they've been jabbed. And more to the point, out in the street, masks benefit you just about not at all. If they won't demask now, when will they?
Well, it's up to them. We haven't heard from Johnson lately on the subject of letterboxes and bank-robbers, but nijab-wearers who choose them from personal preference must be chuckling over the turn of fate that has turned the entire country including him into similar attire. Karma, innit.
The face mask is not comparable - stop being a burka!
1. Alba fails to gain any seats 2. SNP fails to gain a majority. 3. Labour outperforms Conservative 4. SNP/Green fail to gain a majority
(1) and (2) now look likely. There is insufficient evidence for (3). I can only dream of (4).
BOLLOX as ever, you are almost a clone of HYFUD
I predicted the Sex Pest Party would be a damp squib when you were hyping it up on here.
You are a seer now as well as an obnoxious arse.
How is your therapy for psychological projection going? I guess it is proving as effective as Alex Salmond's diversity training.
Keep jogging loser
Wow, that took a while for your braincell to come up with that one! Slow even by your standards. I have been off here, done a bit of work, had lunch and come back to find that was the sum of a couple of hours of a nationalist's mental anguish over how to respond. Freud would have a field day. I guess a lot of your thought process must be consumed with how you can be more like Alex: a man's man and a real loser's loser.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Instinctively, emotionally, I'm with Philip. I am slightly cross when I see someone wearing a mask outside where there is no requirement to do so (nor any conceivable benefit). My emotional reaction is that these people are why we have been pushed into these excessive, illiberal restrictions in the first place. And yet, rationally - and rational wins, in the end - I know I am not them, and they may have 101 things going on in their heads which have lead them to the decision they have, from horrible personal experiences of losing loved ones down to the level of not actually finding masks that physically uncomfortable. Indeed, some of these people are my friends (albeit friends whom in pre-pandemic times we laughed about for being hilariously over-cautious.)
As long as post Jun 21 there is no law requiring me to wear a mask, I will be happy. And I can reenter the world and get a new pair of glasses and a mobile phone and all the other things I have been putting off doing for the best part of a year until I can do it maskless.
On another note, I plan to go to a pub tomorrow. I look forward to seeing how much or little they care about who I am. If they insist on QR codes or the NHS app, I won't be going; quite aside from any libertarian arguments, I need a new phone.
I've been talking about masks in crowded indoor spaces. This is what I postulate will carry on to a significant extent and is most certainly not "weird". Wearing a mask all of the time when out of the house is something else. That's imo a bit wei ... odd. But, you know, each to his own, live and let live, bla bla.
So that's the good news. You're not with Philip, you're in a much better place - with me.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Instinctively, emotionally, I'm with Philip. I am slightly cross when I see someone wearing a mask outside where there is no requirement to do so (nor any conceivable benefit). My emotional reaction is that these people are why we have been pushed into these excessive, illiberal restrictions in the first place. And yet, rationally - and rational wins, in the end - I know I am not them, and they may have 101 things going on in their heads which have lead them to the decision they have, from horrible personal experiences of losing loved ones down to the level of not actually finding masks that physically uncomfortable. Indeed, some of these people are my friends (albeit friends whom in pre-pandemic times we laughed about for being hilariously over-cautious.)
As long as post Jun 21 there is no law requiring me to wear a mask, I will be happy. And I can reenter the world and get a new pair of glasses and a mobile phone and all the other things I have been putting off doing for the best part of a year until I can do it maskless.
On another note, I plan to go to a pub tomorrow. I look forward to seeing how much or little they care about who I am. If they insist on QR codes or the NHS app, I won't be going; quite aside from any libertarian arguments, I need a new phone.
I've been talking about masks in crowded indoor spaces. This is what I postulate will carry on to a significant extent and is most certainly not "weird". Wearing a mask all of the time when out of the house is something else. That's imo a bit wei ... odd. But, you know, each to his own, live and let live, bla bla.
So that's the good news. You're not with Philip, you're in a much better place - with me.
You're trying to make an argument out of nothing. 🙄
There's no difference between saying "odd" or "weird". Same thing. They're synonyms.
I'm "live and let live" too, even with those I find weirdos. Like you and your intention to make everything an argument for some reason.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
Now, now, play nicely. The place is rammed with Scots and Geordies and their offspring cos of the pits so we’re super northern in these parts.
My very simple viewpoint
South of the Tees - Southern poncey North of the Tyne - there be monsters...
As a child in Scotland whose neighbours went to the outlandish extravagance of going all the way South to Whitley Bay - which as any fule no is practically on the Equator....or in the tropics, at least....
A true northerner thinks the north ends roughly twelve miles south of where he was born. Which for me is the Cheshire/Staffordshire border just south of Macclesfield.
Don't get me started on Barmcakes (Where I grew up) and teacakes in Yorkshire. When I pointed out teacakes has raisins in them - I was shouted down - Ther froot teecakes!
If everyone gets their vaccines we should get to zero Covid I think. You just need proof of vaccination & a negative test as a condition of entry to the country.
Is that realistic? I agree that if everyone - or even if a sufficiently large number of people - get their vaccine then covid has nowhere to go and dies out in the UK. (Though of course we would still get thousands of positive tests a week on current numbers of testing). But how many people come in to the UK each day? Can we insist all of those have negative tests? Can we rely on the accuracy of those negative tests? And somewhere there has to be a frontier. Even NZ - which is much more able than us to seal itself off - kept getting cases reintroduced.
Some people will slip through the net and present symptons later, but the virus is being dropped into a vaccinated population; it can't proliferate because it can't find hosts. New Zealand has an issue because it has a ~ zero antibody population.
To expand a bit further, each person with Covid entering the country ends up with
1/(1 - r(V)) being infected on average eventually, where r(V) is the reproductive rate of the virus amongst your broadly vaccinated population, and crucially r(V) is < 1 {The meaning of herd immunity}.
So if the vaccines and takeup push the r(V) to be 0.8, each person that slips through the net ends up with 5 infections (0.5;2). Which is why you still want it as a condition of entry but it's not the end of days if someone slips through. NZ's issue is that with no vaccinations or infections r(t) > 1
Interesting to see how the EU member state Malta (described by the British press as totally incapable financially of being an independent state shortly before their independence), has the highest vaccination rate by at least one measure (see Carlota Vance table earlier).
I find this ironic, as I think the pull back from Yes to No seems mainly due to the vaccination achievement of the UK, and the false claim that an independent Scotland could not have achieved this on its own.
I ceased to worry about whether or not Scotland would become independent a while back, as the demographics are utterly crushing for unionism. The end of the Union can be delayed but not prevented.
A couple of points rebutting nonsense comments on the election by some PBers:- Sturgeon is not going to lose her constituency seat to the privately educated millionaire Sarwar, and the SNP are not going to lose Moray, a seat that Ross was afraid to stand in at this election.
It will be interesting to see if Labour can hold any of their 3 constituency seats currently held on tiny or small majorities, Dumbarton, East Lothian and Edinburgh Southern. The last named seems their best bet to me due to tactical voting for Labour by Tory supporters.
Nearly forgot-Angus Robertson will gain Edinburgh Central from the Conservatives. Baroness Davidson has fled that scene having employed her usual tactic of dodging her constituents :-)
Just to pick up on this - to think opinion doesn’t change as you get older is a bit of a mis-calculation.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
It’s no issue if you’re willing to radically reduce the size of Scotland’s deficit.
I see no evidence you’re willing to accept any trade-offs of Independence; which basically puts you on a par with...Brexiters.
“Brexiters” - 283,000 Google hits
“Brexiteers” - 837,000 Google hits
The BrexitEERS won the lexical war, as well
I favoured Brexitards, but I was warned off I think by the PB Mods.
Brexshitters was my favourite example of Remoaner lexicological madness. Used in newspapers by ‘serious’ journalists
Brexiteers is the term that will survive. Because it sounds cooler, is easier to say, and has that poetic hint of ‘buccaneers’, ‘grenadiers’, ‘chandeliers’
You complain about Brexshitter, which I have never heard, yet use the term remoaner. Irony obviously not your thing?
But Remoaner is a useful word. It captures the kind of Remainer who has strayed into irrationality. Someone with Strasbourg Syndrome.
I’d put Nigel Formain, on here, in that category. Maybe Mr Meeks, tho he has a more severe case
‘Remainiac’ should be reserved for Remainers who have gone completely postal. Outright lunacy. A C Grayling springs to mind.
Does ‘Brexshitters’ usefully identify a type of Brexiteer? I don’t believe it does. It’s just an unfunny insult. Used by Remoaners
I disagree. Remoaner is an insult, as is Brexshitter, although to be honest I reckon you have just made this one up.
Brexiteer is not insulting.
I rather like Remainiac and doesn't feel like an insult to me, although can appreciate how some might take it as so.
A term can be insulting AND useful and insightful. Remoaner is one such term. Remainers who moan, endlessly. We’ve all encountered them, sometimes on here
As for ‘brexshitters’ -
‘How many Brexshitters went or are going skiing in Europe? How many own second homes there? What EU wines do they drink? We must be told.’
It's Brexshit (an amorphous pile of crap) Which has a ring, just as Remoaner has.
I don't use either.
I noticed a classic bit of Brexshit from "Leon" further up this post. Quite funny really. About as ridiculous as one of the plots in one of the so-called "novels" from SeanT.
I don't moan about Brexit, @Leon I actually find it all quite funny. I admit I didn't find it amusing at first (it was pretty damaging for my business as it has and is for many), but the more I think about it the more I realise that gradually even people with slow political analysis like "Leon" will slowly and eventually grasp that they were sold a pup.
That realisation will be proportional to how much they want to believe, just like Trump supporters with whom they share a lot of mentality. Let's face it, Brexit is now a boring subject that only people like Leon bang on about, even though they won their pyric victory. I find sniggering at Brexit believers far more satisfying than moaning about something I can't change.
You do realise that is one long classic Remoaner rant? Case closed, m’lud
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
I fear for your sanity when Sturgeon asks for a vote, Boris says no, and then... nothing happens. Will you march on Bute House?
Sturgeon is not interested in independence, she bumps her gums but is interested in herself. She will not last much longer, the chickens are coming home to roost.
This is a bit like those Lefties who contantly claim that only the keepers of the true Socialist flame have any right to govern from the left. Truth is that the SNP is all you´ve got and if they fail, then that is the end of Indy, not just for now, but forever. What Alba is doing is unleashing the inner Judean Peoples Front of the Nationalist movement. Right now Scotland is split 50-50 about Indy as it is. As the Nats start tearing chunks off each other as to who is the true keeper of the nationalist flame, support for Indy itself is falling. Sturgeon won´t be pushed out because she is insufficiently nationalist, she will go because the supporters of separatism start a civil war amongst themselves. So you and Wings and the various other enemies of Sturgeon are totally wrong headed if you think removing her will help your cause. In fact I judge that she is the only one who can now deliver a separate Scotland and the numbers are not breaking her or your way. Across Scotland we are hearing that on the ground the Nat vote is soft. The Tories are down too of course so there is a deal of uncertainty, but Salmond´s party is just reminding a lot of folk what they most dislike about the Nats in general and that is not helping the SNP either.
Sturgeon is not interested in Independence, Scotland is not interested in London Tory, labour and Lib Dem parties. ALBA have more members already than Lib Dems who are an irrelevance completely in Scotland , they will be lucky to be 5th party this time. The direction is all one way , it is only a matter of time till independence for sure and it will be a long long long time till SNP are not in power, likely after independence before that happens.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Instinctively, emotionally, I'm with Philip. I am slightly cross when I see someone wearing a mask outside where there is no requirement to do so (nor any conceivable benefit). My emotional reaction is that these people are why we have been pushed into these excessive, illiberal restrictions in the first place. And yet, rationally - and rational wins, in the end - I know I am not them, and they may have 101 things going on in their heads which have lead them to the decision they have, from horrible personal experiences of losing loved ones down to the level of not actually finding masks that physically uncomfortable. Indeed, some of these people are my friends (albeit friends whom in pre-pandemic times we laughed about for being hilariously over-cautious.)
As long as post Jun 21 there is no law requiring me to wear a mask, I will be happy. And I can reenter the world and get a new pair of glasses and a mobile phone and all the other things I have been putting off doing for the best part of a year until I can do it maskless.
On another note, I plan to go to a pub tomorrow. I look forward to seeing how much or little they care about who I am. If they insist on QR codes or the NHS app, I won't be going; quite aside from any libertarian arguments, I need a new phone.
I've been talking about masks in crowded indoor spaces. This is what I postulate will carry on to a significant extent and is most certainly not "weird". Wearing a mask all of the time when out of the house is something else. That's imo a bit wei ... odd. But, you know, each to his own, live and let live, bla bla.
So that's the good news. You're not with Philip, you're in a much better place - with me.
But as you've already established, you and Philip are largely agreeing with each other
So post Jun 21 - we're hoping there will be no legal requirement to wear masks. (You are more optimistic than me, but we'll see). - some businesses may continue to enforce mask requirements. Up to them if they do, but not likely to be good for business - though who knows? - public sector bodies are a bit of an unknown. My view is that they probably will continue to require mask wearing indoors. (Boo!) We'll wait and see. - people who wear masks outside all the time - perhaps a bit odd and frankly I'd rather they didn't, but we don't know people's circumstances or what is going on in their heads. - voluntary wearing of masks indoors - up to individuals, and there will very likely be a legacy effect. Can't get too exercised about that, in the short term.
Social distancing is an altogether different kettle of fish, and I suspect it will wither naturally, though we may be spacing oursleves out a bit more for some time to come. It's a much less binary issue - it's largely obvious whether someone is wearing a mask or not, much less so whether two people are social distancing.
Fck me, bumper crop of election literature the morn - Reform UK, Communist, Scottish Family Party, STUC Coalition, Green, Alba and G. Galloway comedy vehicle. No one got the one party state memo obviously.
I offer Galloway's effort for entertainment. Remember Unionists, this is your guy.
Fck me, bumper crop of election literature the morn - Reform UK, Communist, Scottish Family Party, STUC Coalition, Green, Alba and G. Galloway comedy vehicle. No one got the one party state memo obviously.
I offer Galloway's effort for entertainment. Remember Unionists, this is your guy.
LOL. Reading his list of "the team" it seems more like a conspiracy of the professions than a party.
Interesting that the Westminster bubble decorating and he said / she said not showing up in polling.
I had a terrifying thought for Labour when reading the last thread. What if Boris is like a gateway drug Tory - they get rid of him and the red wall carry on voting Tory even with Boris gone! Imagine the howls of pain on in the Guardian as PM Sunak crushes Starmer.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Some people will and they will be the weird exceptions, just like in the past when you'd see eg Japanese shoppers in the Trafford centre wearing a mask. It just looks weird, but it always happened and you'll continue to get it with some weirdos going forwards. And I stand by the term, people voluntarily doing it when its not required or mandated will be very much the exception not the norm.
But more important than whether a few weirdos do stuff that doesn't affect anyone else, is whether businesses demand it. I couldn't care less if individuals want to wear a mask when they're not required to, I couldn't care less about other people's fashion choices. But if businesses are still demanding it that's a different matter, that's where its continuing, and if its not required by law there'll be little incentive for businesses to mandate it.
"Weirdos" is a silly - and tbh a rather crass and offensive - term to apply to what will almost certainly be the non-trivial minority of people who will be sufficiently risk-averse (having lived through this harrowing public health crisis which has lasted so long and wreaked such havoc) to continue on a voluntary basis with certain virus mitigation practices (eg masks in crowded spaces) after the legal compulsion to do so has been dropped. These people shoud not be viewed or described as weirdos. I trust we will not see it from you again in this context.
But I sense you know you've been a bit "argue for argues sake" on this point and are seeking to focus on what businesses will do. Ok. That is an interesting and important question. Will many businesses (in order to make their clientele feel ultra safe and increase turnover) impose covid restrictions even though they don't have to? I think no. I'm sure there will be pockets of it, and maybe in certain situations it might make commercial sense, but by and large - no. Post 22 June will usher in a new normal that for most things will resemble the old normal.
What about in the public sector?
Re wierdos, agree that this is not helpful. But if people continue to drag their heels in helping get us out of this awfulness by continuing on a voluntary basis with certain virus mitigation practices then they are part of the problem. Logic and science please, not irrational maths-illiterate fear.
I suppose public sector might be slower dropping all the restrictions. Not sure. Hopefully not. Re continuing mitigation behaviours, I think most of it will be sensible stuff, (eg) continuing to pop a mask on in a crowded indoor space, say a packed tube or bus. Or not shoving your face right next to somebody else's over the broccoli counter at Tescos. This sort of thing. This, for me, is not pulling us back into the mire, it's just the expected heightened risk awareness that tbh if it didn't happen would be surprising. I might myself choose to go back to exactly how I was (not 100% sure yet) but I don't view others not doing so as a problem or as a negative trait in them. Indeed it might lead to less colds and flu etc.
Fck me, bumper crop of election literature the morn - Reform UK, Communist, Scottish Family Party, STUC Coalition, Green, Alba and G. Galloway comedy vehicle. No one got the one party state memo obviously.
I offer Galloway's effort for entertainment. Remember Unionists, this is your guy.
What polls have shown that those clowns are going to win seats?
I've not seen any polls with these muppets getting 6% or more.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
It’s no issue if you’re willing to radically reduce the size of Scotland’s deficit.
I see no evidence you’re willing to accept any trade-offs of Independence; which basically puts you on a par with...Brexiters.
“Brexiters” - 283,000 Google hits
“Brexiteers” - 837,000 Google hits
The BrexitEERS won the lexical war, as well
I favoured Brexitards, but I was warned off I think by the PB Mods.
Brexshitters was my favourite example of Remoaner lexicological madness. Used in newspapers by ‘serious’ journalists
Brexiteers is the term that will survive. Because it sounds cooler, is easier to say, and has that poetic hint of ‘buccaneers’, ‘grenadiers’, ‘chandeliers’
You complain about Brexshitter, which I have never heard, yet use the term remoaner. Irony obviously not your thing?
But Remoaner is a useful word. It captures the kind of Remainer who has strayed into irrationality. Someone with Strasbourg Syndrome.
I’d put Nigel Formain, on here, in that category. Maybe Mr Meeks, tho he has a more severe case
‘Remainiac’ should be reserved for Remainers who have gone completely postal. Outright lunacy. A C Grayling springs to mind.
Does ‘Brexshitters’ usefully identify a type of Brexiteer? I don’t believe it does. It’s just an unfunny insult. Used by Remoaners
I disagree. Remoaner is an insult, as is Brexshitter, although to be honest I reckon you have just made this one up.
Brexiteer is not insulting.
I rather like Remainiac and doesn't feel like an insult to me, although can appreciate how some might take it as so.
A term can be insulting AND useful and insightful. Remoaner is one such term. Remainers who moan, endlessly. We’ve all encountered them, sometimes on here
As for ‘brexshitters’ -
‘How many Brexshitters went or are going skiing in Europe? How many own second homes there? What EU wines do they drink? We must be told.’
It's Brexshit (an amorphous pile of crap) Which has a ring, just as Remoaner has.
I don't use either.
I noticed a classic bit of Brexshit from "Leon" further up this post. Quite funny really. About as ridiculous as one of the plots in one of the so-called "novels" from SeanT.
I don't moan about Brexit, @Leon I actually find it all quite funny. I admit I didn't find it amusing at first (it was pretty damaging for my business as it has and is for many), but the more I think about it the more I realise that gradually even people with slow political analysis like "Leon" will slowly and eventually grasp that they were sold a pup.
That realisation will be proportional to how much they want to believe, just like Trump supporters with whom they share a lot of mentality. Let's face it, Brexit is now a boring subject that only people like Leon bang on about, even though they won their pyric victory. I find sniggering at Brexit believers far more satisfying than moaning about something I can't change.
You do realise that is one long classic Remoaner rant? Case closed, m’lud
I expect you would see it that way through your warped Brexshitter perspective. Did you like the bit about SeanT's novels? He used to be of these parts, and used to rant on about the EU all the time too. Too much time sitting at a keyboard with no real life experience other than writing travel guides and novels that make Jeffrey Archer's poorest work look like high art. I am guessing you do something of similar pointlessness?
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
Now, now, play nicely. The place is rammed with Scots and Geordies and their offspring cos of the pits so we’re super northern in these parts.
My very simple viewpoint
South of the Tees - Southern poncey North of the Tyne - there be monsters...
As a child in Scotland whose neighbours went to the outlandish extravagance of going all the way South to Whitley Bay - which as any fule no is practically on the Equator....or in the tropics, at least....
A true northerner thinks the north ends roughly twelve miles south of where he was born. Which for me is the Cheshire/Staffordshire border just south of Macclesfield.
Three Shires Head?
(P.S. I once met a guy from Southsea Island who only considered Portsmouth and more southerly latitudes as the 'True South')
Yes indeed! Have you ever been there? I have. Only memory is that it was very wet. I don't suppose it always is.
There was a wonderful line from 'People Like Us', in the episode set in a lawyer's office in Cheshire - 'often called the Surrey of the North - except for by people from Sussex - for whom the Surry of the North is Surrey.'
My submission is that what is happening is a generational change primarily based-unsurprisingly-on identity politics. Those who are inclined to favour their "Britishness" are older people. Those who are inclined to favour their "Scottishness" (and identity as Europeans) are younger people.
If PBers wish to believe that is the sort of attitude that will change in the way that younger Labour voters often trend towards becoming Conservative voters as they age, go right ahead.
"Added to which with costs running at a £1m by the time it goes to trial , she will end up losing her flat and savings when all she has to do is apologise say she got it wrong and pay costs. Sad."
Carlotta Vance. It must be disappointing for you that your publicising of the vaccination statistics confirms that Scotland, as in independent EU member, could have achieved a successful vaccination rollout. Opponents of independence have claimed that was impossible. You have evidenced that it was entirely possible.
"Could" doing a lot of heavy lifting there. Would PM Nicola have ignored the EU scheme and bought externally to it? A yes or no will suffice.
What a pathetic question. No-one can answer that as it is purely hypothetical and stupid and only an absolute numpty fool would ask such crap.
"Added to which with costs running at a £1m by the time it goes to trial , she will end up losing her flat and savings when all she has to do is apologise say she got it wrong and pay costs. Sad."
So with costs already at the level where she goes bankrupt if she loses she may as well go all in.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Instinctively, emotionally, I'm with Philip. I am slightly cross when I see someone wearing a mask outside where there is no requirement to do so (nor any conceivable benefit). My emotional reaction is that these people are why we have been pushed into these excessive, illiberal restrictions in the first place. And yet, rationally - and rational wins, in the end - I know I am not them, and they may have 101 things going on in their heads which have lead them to the decision they have, from horrible personal experiences of losing loved ones down to the level of not actually finding masks that physically uncomfortable. Indeed, some of these people are my friends (albeit friends whom in pre-pandemic times we laughed about for being hilariously over-cautious.)
As long as post Jun 21 there is no law requiring me to wear a mask, I will be happy. And I can reenter the world and get a new pair of glasses and a mobile phone and all the other things I have been putting off doing for the best part of a year until I can do it maskless.
On another note, I plan to go to a pub tomorrow. I look forward to seeing how much or little they care about who I am. If they insist on QR codes or the NHS app, I won't be going; quite aside from any libertarian arguments, I need a new phone.
I've been talking about masks in crowded indoor spaces. This is what I postulate will carry on to a significant extent and is most certainly not "weird". Wearing a mask all of the time when out of the house is something else. That's imo a bit wei ... odd. But, you know, each to his own, live and let live, bla bla.
So that's the good news. You're not with Philip, you're in a much better place - with me.
You're trying to make an argument out of nothing. 🙄
There's no difference between saying "odd" or "weird". Same thing. They're synonyms.
I'm "live and let live" too, even with those I find weirdos. Like you and your intention to make everything an argument for some reason.
lol. Blatant trolling.
Warning. Keep it up and I'll start asking about your pole again.
1. Alba fails to gain any seats 2. SNP fails to gain a majority. 3. Labour outperforms Conservative 4. SNP/Green fail to gain a majority
(1) and (2) now look likely. There is insufficient evidence for (3). I can only dream of (4).
BOLLOX as ever, you are almost a clone of HYFUD
I predicted the Sex Pest Party would be a damp squib when you were hyping it up on here.
You are a seer now as well as an obnoxious arse.
How is your therapy for psychological projection going? I guess it is proving as effective as Alex Salmond's diversity training.
Keep jogging loser
Wow, that took a while for your braincell to come up with that one! Slow even by your standards. I have been off here, done a bit of work, had lunch and come back to find that was the sum of a couple of hours of a nationalist's mental anguish over how to respond. Freud would have a field day. I guess a lot of your thought process must be consumed with how you can be more like Alex: a man's man and a real loser's loser.
One brain cell more than a cretin like you then, keep jogging loser.
Well yes - but for me they fall into the category of the very scared. If they're vulnerable, presumably they've been jabbed. And more to the point, out in the street, masks benefit you just about not at all. If they won't demask now, when will they?
Well, it's up to them. We haven't heard from Johnson lately on the subject of letterboxes and bank-robbers, but nijab-wearers who choose them from personal preference must be chuckling over the turn of fate that has turned the entire country including him into similar attire. Karma, innit.
The face mask is not comparable - stop being a burka!
Really ridiculous to compare them.
A facemask is a small piece of cloth, covering a small part of the face, to prevent others from getting sick and save lives.
A burqa covers the almost the entire face and body, is a misogynistic obscenity, designed to oppress women, dehumanise women and keep women segregated from the rest of society.
Anyone who thinks that medicine and misogyny are comparable needs their heads examining.
"Added to which with costs running at a £1m by the time it goes to trial , she will end up losing her flat and savings when all she has to do is apologise say she got it wrong and pay costs. Sad."
So with costs already at the level where she goes bankrupt if she loses she may as well go all in.
I have to say I am very uncomfortable with journalists being personally sued for libel rather than their publications.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
Now, now, play nicely. The place is rammed with Scots and Geordies and their offspring cos of the pits so we’re super northern in these parts.
My very simple viewpoint
South of the Tees - Southern poncey North of the Tyne - there be monsters...
As a child in Scotland whose neighbours went to the outlandish extravagance of going all the way South to Whitley Bay - which as any fule no is practically on the Equator....or in the tropics, at least....
A true northerner thinks the north ends roughly twelve miles south of where he was born. Which for me is the Cheshire/Staffordshire border just south of Macclesfield.
Three Shires Head?
(P.S. I once met a guy from Southsea Island who only considered Portsmouth and more southerly latitudes as the 'True South')
Yes indeed! Have you ever been there? I have. Only memory is that it was very wet. I don't suppose it always is.
There was a wonderful line from 'People Like Us', in the episode set in a lawyer's office in Cheshire - 'often called the Surrey of the North - except for by people from Sussex - for whom the Surry of the North is Surrey.'
A long, long time ago. Beautiful part of the world. We were hosteling over to Gradbach Mill aged 14, sun was blazing down, is how I remember it.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Instinctively, emotionally, I'm with Philip. I am slightly cross when I see someone wearing a mask outside where there is no requirement to do so (nor any conceivable benefit). My emotional reaction is that these people are why we have been pushed into these excessive, illiberal restrictions in the first place. And yet, rationally - and rational wins, in the end - I know I am not them, and they may have 101 things going on in their heads which have lead them to the decision they have, from horrible personal experiences of losing loved ones down to the level of not actually finding masks that physically uncomfortable. Indeed, some of these people are my friends (albeit friends whom in pre-pandemic times we laughed about for being hilariously over-cautious.)
As long as post Jun 21 there is no law requiring me to wear a mask, I will be happy. And I can reenter the world and get a new pair of glasses and a mobile phone and all the other things I have been putting off doing for the best part of a year until I can do it maskless.
On another note, I plan to go to a pub tomorrow. I look forward to seeing how much or little they care about who I am. If they insist on QR codes or the NHS app, I won't be going; quite aside from any libertarian arguments, I need a new phone.
I've been talking about masks in crowded indoor spaces. This is what I postulate will carry on to a significant extent and is most certainly not "weird". Wearing a mask all of the time when out of the house is something else. That's imo a bit wei ... odd. But, you know, each to his own, live and let live, bla bla.
So that's the good news. You're not with Philip, you're in a much better place - with me.
You're trying to make an argument out of nothing. 🙄
There's no difference between saying "odd" or "weird". Same thing. They're synonyms.
I'm "live and let live" too, even with those I find weirdos. Like you and your intention to make everything an argument for some reason.
lol. Blatant trolling.
Warning. Keep it up and I'll start asking about your pole again.
Can I request instead that we revive the scales? In the last episode, I think we left our antihero pushing 17st 7lbs??
200 European "intellectuals" have written to the EU institutions urging them to offer financial inducements to encourage Scotland to leave the UK and join the EU. I wonder how many of them would support a similar offer to Catalonia.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Some people will and they will be the weird exceptions, just like in the past when you'd see eg Japanese shoppers in the Trafford centre wearing a mask. It just looks weird, but it always happened and you'll continue to get it with some weirdos going forwards. And I stand by the term, people voluntarily doing it when its not required or mandated will be very much the exception not the norm.
But more important than whether a few weirdos do stuff that doesn't affect anyone else, is whether businesses demand it. I couldn't care less if individuals want to wear a mask when they're not required to, I couldn't care less about other people's fashion choices. But if businesses are still demanding it that's a different matter, that's where its continuing, and if its not required by law there'll be little incentive for businesses to mandate it.
"Weirdos" is a silly - and tbh a rather crass and offensive - term to apply to what will almost certainly be the non-trivial minority of people who will be sufficiently risk-averse (having lived through this harrowing public health crisis which has lasted so long and wreaked such havoc) to continue on a voluntary basis with certain virus mitigation practices (eg masks in crowded spaces) after the legal compulsion to do so has been dropped. These people shoud not be viewed or described as weirdos. I trust we will not see it from you again in this context.
But I sense you know you've been a bit "argue for argues sake" on this point and are seeking to focus on what businesses will do. Ok. That is an interesting and important question. Will many businesses (in order to make their clientele feel ultra safe and increase turnover) impose covid restrictions even though they don't have to? I think no. I'm sure there will be pockets of it, and maybe in certain situations it might make commercial sense, but by and large - no. Post 22 June will usher in a new normal that for most things will resemble the old normal.
What about in the public sector?
Re wierdos, agree that this is not helpful. But if people continue to drag their heels in helping get us out of this awfulness by continuing on a voluntary basis with certain virus mitigation practices then they are part of the problem. Logic and science please, not irrational maths-illiterate fear.
I suppose public sector might be slower dropping all the restrictions. Not sure. Hopefully not. Re continuing mitigation behaviours, I think most of it will be sensible stuff, (eg) continuing to pop a mask on in a crowded indoor space, say a packed tube or bus. Or not shoving your face right next to somebody else's over the broccoli counter at Tescos. This sort of thing. This, for me, is not pulling us back into the mire, it's just the expected heightened risk awareness that tbh if it didn't happen would be surprising. I might myself choose to go back to exactly how I was (not 100% sure yet) but I don't view others not doing so as a problem or as a negative trait in them. Indeed it might lead to less colds and flu etc.
Hugging/kissing when we meet friends/family outside of household - I haven't hugged or kissed anyone outside my household for months. That'll take a while I think, with a slightly awkward do we/don't we phase before it all gets back to normal.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
I fear for your sanity when Sturgeon asks for a vote, Boris says no, and then... nothing happens. Will you march on Bute House?
Sturgeon is not interested in independence, she bumps her gums but is interested in herself. She will not last much longer, the chickens are coming home to roost.
This is a bit like those Lefties who contantly claim that only the keepers of the true Socialist flame have any right to govern from the left. Truth is that the SNP is all you´ve got and if they fail, then that is the end of Indy, not just for now, but forever. What Alba is doing is unleashing the inner Judean Peoples Front of the Nationalist movement. Right now Scotland is split 50-50 about Indy as it is. As the Nats start tearing chunks off each other as to who is the true keeper of the nationalist flame, support for Indy itself is falling. Sturgeon won´t be pushed out because she is insufficiently nationalist, she will go because the supporters of separatism start a civil war amongst themselves. So you and Wings and the various other enemies of Sturgeon are totally wrong headed if you think removing her will help your cause. In fact I judge that she is the only one who can now deliver a separate Scotland and the numbers are not breaking her or your way. Across Scotland we are hearing that on the ground the Nat vote is soft. The Tories are down too of course so there is a deal of uncertainty, but Salmond´s party is just reminding a lot of folk what they most dislike about the Nats in general and that is not helping the SNP either.
Sturgeon is not interested in Independence, Scotland is not interested in London Tory, labour and Lib Dem parties. ALBA have more members already than Lib Dems who are an irrelevance completely in Scotland , they will be lucky to be 5th party this time. The direction is all one way , it is only a matter of time till independence for sure and it will be a long long long time till SNP are not in power, likely after independence before that happens.
Malc, Are you listening to the scores on the doors? I guess we will see next weekend, but I reckon you are in for a very nasty surprise if you really beleive any of that.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
I dont think it is. I think the last week will probably mean the least in any recent by election. The postal votes will be now mostly returned. PVs are the dedicated and most likely to vote of the electorate, and i'm assuming that PVs in this election are higher than ever before.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
A lot of postals in these times of Covid - and they are mostly in.
I would remain very surprised if there was a Labour hold in Hartlepool even without early postal vote returns. I believe it will be rather a comfortable Conservative win too, on a low turnout. My point was, pressure on Johnson and the Conservatives does seem to be fast moving. Nonetheless, I am not sure whoever wins Hartlepool tells us very much about GE2024.
You'd better hope Labour hold Hartlepool, because if they don't, the abject humiliation of the Opposition losing seats in midterm to a Boris Johnson under full assault by the media will kill Wallpapergate stone dead.
Here speaks somebody who is plainly not getting his weekly copy of "newpunditry-newpolitics".
I can do you a deal. Subscribe FREE at this point. It will cost a fiver once every man and his dog are clambering to get onboard in a few weeks.
Be that as it may, the British media is an environment in which the speed of reporting is breakneck and the evolution of thought is glacial, so one can be confident that they'll analyse it in terms of the 'old politics'. I'll happily give you credit if you're right about the result, but I still don't expect us to win the seat under these conditions.
NEW. SNP Foreign Aff @AlynSmith tells me on an independent #Scotland joining the EURO
“We would want to participate an economic & monetary union for the macroeconomic stability. The adoption of the € should be put to the people in a REFERENDUM”.
Fck me, bumper crop of election literature the morn - Reform UK, Communist, Scottish Family Party, STUC Coalition, Green, Alba and G. Galloway comedy vehicle. No one got the one party state memo obviously.
I offer Galloway's effort for entertainment. Remember Unionists, this is your guy.
You tube keeps advertising me the Scottish Family Party's "Don't vote for the woke SNP song"
I'm sure it would go down a storm with many on here.
NEW. SNP Foreign Aff @AlynSmith tells me on an independent #Scotland joining the EURO
“We would want to participate an economic & monetary union for the macroeconomic stability. The adoption of the € should be put to the people in a REFERENDUM”.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
I fear for your sanity when Sturgeon asks for a vote, Boris says no, and then... nothing happens. Will you march on Bute House?
Sturgeon is not interested in independence, she bumps her gums but is interested in herself. She will not last much longer, the chickens are coming home to roost.
This is a bit like those Lefties who contantly claim that only the keepers of the true Socialist flame have any right to govern from the left. Truth is that the SNP is all you´ve got and if they fail, then that is the end of Indy, not just for now, but forever. What Alba is doing is unleashing the inner Judean Peoples Front of the Nationalist movement. Right now Scotland is split 50-50 about Indy as it is. As the Nats start tearing chunks off each other as to who is the true keeper of the nationalist flame, support for Indy itself is falling. Sturgeon won´t be pushed out because she is insufficiently nationalist, she will go because the supporters of separatism start a civil war amongst themselves. So you and Wings and the various other enemies of Sturgeon are totally wrong headed if you think removing her will help your cause. In fact I judge that she is the only one who can now deliver a separate Scotland and the numbers are not breaking her or your way. Across Scotland we are hearing that on the ground the Nat vote is soft. The Tories are down too of course so there is a deal of uncertainty, but Salmond´s party is just reminding a lot of folk what they most dislike about the Nats in general and that is not helping the SNP either.
Sturgeon is not interested in Independence, Scotland is not interested in London Tory, labour and Lib Dem parties. ALBA have more members already than Lib Dems who are an irrelevance completely in Scotland , they will be lucky to be 5th party this time. The direction is all one way , it is only a matter of time till independence for sure and it will be a long long long time till SNP are not in power, likely after independence before that happens.
Malc, Are you listening to the scores on the doors? I guess we will see next weekend, but I reckon you are in for a very nasty surprise if you really beleive any of that.
Malc believes in unicorns (that rUK will continue to give Scotland money if they vote to leave) - so yep he believes that..
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Instinctively, emotionally, I'm with Philip. I am slightly cross when I see someone wearing a mask outside where there is no requirement to do so (nor any conceivable benefit). My emotional reaction is that these people are why we have been pushed into these excessive, illiberal restrictions in the first place. And yet, rationally - and rational wins, in the end - I know I am not them, and they may have 101 things going on in their heads which have lead them to the decision they have, from horrible personal experiences of losing loved ones down to the level of not actually finding masks that physically uncomfortable. Indeed, some of these people are my friends (albeit friends whom in pre-pandemic times we laughed about for being hilariously over-cautious.)
As long as post Jun 21 there is no law requiring me to wear a mask, I will be happy. And I can reenter the world and get a new pair of glasses and a mobile phone and all the other things I have been putting off doing for the best part of a year until I can do it maskless.
On another note, I plan to go to a pub tomorrow. I look forward to seeing how much or little they care about who I am. If they insist on QR codes or the NHS app, I won't be going; quite aside from any libertarian arguments, I need a new phone.
I've been talking about masks in crowded indoor spaces. This is what I postulate will carry on to a significant extent and is most certainly not "weird". Wearing a mask all of the time when out of the house is something else. That's imo a bit wei ... odd. But, you know, each to his own, live and let live, bla bla.
So that's the good news. You're not with Philip, you're in a much better place - with me.
You're trying to make an argument out of nothing. 🙄
There's no difference between saying "odd" or "weird". Same thing. They're synonyms.
I'm "live and let live" too, even with those I find weirdos. Like you and your intention to make everything an argument for some reason.
lol. Blatant trolling.
Warning. Keep it up and I'll start asking about your pole again.
Can I request instead that we revive the scales? In the last episode, I think we left our antihero pushing 17st 7lbs??
Yes. A considerable weight for a shortish man. Takes a bit of believing even if muscle does weigh more than fat and the man in question is "mainly muscle".
NEW. SNP Foreign Aff @AlynSmith tells me on an independent #Scotland joining the EURO
“We would want to participate an economic & monetary union for the macroeconomic stability. The adoption of the € should be put to the people in a REFERENDUM”.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
I dont think it is. I think the last week will probably mean the least in any recent by election. The postal votes will be now mostly returned. PVs are the dedicated and most likely to vote of the electorate, and i'm assuming that PVs in this election are higher than ever before.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
A lot of postals in these times of Covid - and they are mostly in.
I would remain very surprised if there was a Labour hold in Hartlepool even without early postal vote returns. I believe it will be rather a comfortable Conservative win too, on a low turnout. My point was, pressure on Johnson and the Conservatives does seem to be fast moving. Nonetheless, I am not sure whoever wins Hartlepool tells us very much about GE2024.
You'd better hope Labour hold Hartlepool, because if they don't, the abject humiliation of the Opposition losing seats in midterm to a Boris Johnson under full assault by the media will kill Wallpapergate stone dead.
Here speaks somebody who is plainly not getting his weekly copy of "newpunditry-newpolitics".
I can do you a deal. Subscribe FREE at this point. It will cost a fiver once every man and his dog are clambering to get onboard in a few weeks.
Bluest is right here. The Tories will win Hartlepool and the pressure on Starmer becomes the big political story for this summer now.
The main reason it’s going Tory is voters there think if their constituency is Tory the government will want to keep it so by pouring money in, and a Tory MP is the best lobbiest to secure that investment. It’s completely sound thinking, and there’s absolutely nothing Labour can do about it, except sit it out for goodness knows how many years, till the voters feel let down and time for a change.
The pressure is not just on Starmer, his successor is likely to be destroyed by the Tories owning the levelling up idea whilst Labour own the stagnation and rape by globalisation of the 90’s and 00’s, the New Labour years predominantly.
NEW. SNP Foreign Aff @AlynSmith tells me on an independent #Scotland joining the EURO
“We would want to participate an economic & monetary union for the macroeconomic stability. The adoption of the € should be put to the people in a REFERENDUM”.
Can we have Brextenders (other PBers might suggest a neater portmanteau) – those who are unhappy winners, the sorts of tiresome culture warriors who keep referring back to Brexit having WON, by way of a social wedge?
Actually not many of them on PB these days – my old Brexit adversaries such as Philip and Mortimer seem rather gracious in victory.
But the Brextenders are OUT THERE. Goodwin is their poster boy.
That’s definitely a type, but ‘brextenders’ is not good. Sounds like ‘eastenders’ which is simply confusing
The genius of ‘remoaners’ (I wonder who first coined it?) is the way it exactly captures a type with one clever punning easy-to-say, easy-to-understand word. Because, boy, they really do MOAN. Mr Meeks moaned like a Yokohama hooker for two loooong years.
Yes, the portmanteau needs work. I'll have a rethink!
Since raising the topic seems to validate their very reason for living, how about "Brexitentialists"?
I've seen Prime Ministers dodge. I've seen them dissemble. I've seen them tell outright lies. But Cash for Curtains is the first time I've ever seen a sitting Prime Minister just refuse to answer a perfectly straight forward question about an issue of legitimate public interest. https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1387778450585423882
My submission is that what is happening is a generational change primarily based-unsurprisingly-on identity politics. Those who are inclined to favour their "Britishness" are older people. Those who are inclined to favour their "Scottishness" (and identity as Europeans) are younger people.
If PBers wish to believe that is the sort of attitude that will change in the way that younger Labour voters often trend towards becoming Conservative voters as they age, go right ahead.
I expect you to be very wrong.
Lifelong Conservatives saying folk become more right wing as they get older is definitely one of the most convincing theories going on PB.
I have not dismissed RT as FM. I don't like him, and I think he looks like Roger Melly, the man on the telly, from Viz comic, but the former Labour blue collar voters love him.
I've seen Prime Ministers dodge. I've seen them dissemble. I've seen them tell outright lies. But Cash for Curtains is the first time I've ever seen a sitting Prime Minister just refuse to answer a perfectly straight forward question about an issue of legitimate public interest. https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1387778450585423882
Another one who has seen the polls and realises he is Roger Irrelevant
Carlotta Vance. It must be disappointing for you that your publicising of the vaccination statistics confirms that Scotland, as in independent EU member, could have achieved a successful vaccination rollout. Opponents of independence have claimed that was impossible. You have evidenced that it was entirely possible.
"Could" doing a lot of heavy lifting there. Would PM Nicola have ignored the EU scheme and bought externally to it? A yes or no will suffice.
What a pathetic question. No-one can answer that as it is purely hypothetical and stupid and only an absolute numpty fool would ask such crap.
Come on Malc. PM Nicola would have taken pleasure in snubbing the UK government and publicly choosing the EU scheme. Be realistic.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
I dont think it is. I think the last week will probably mean the least in any recent by election. The postal votes will be now mostly returned. PVs are the dedicated and most likely to vote of the electorate, and i'm assuming that PVs in this election are higher than ever before.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
A lot of postals in these times of Covid - and they are mostly in.
I would remain very surprised if there was a Labour hold in Hartlepool even without early postal vote returns. I believe it will be rather a comfortable Conservative win too, on a low turnout. My point was, pressure on Johnson and the Conservatives does seem to be fast moving. Nonetheless, I am not sure whoever wins Hartlepool tells us very much about GE2024.
You'd better hope Labour hold Hartlepool, because if they don't, the abject humiliation of the Opposition losing seats in midterm to a Boris Johnson under full assault by the media will kill Wallpapergate stone dead.
Here speaks somebody who is plainly not getting his weekly copy of "newpunditry-newpolitics".
I can do you a deal. Subscribe FREE at this point. It will cost a fiver once every man and his dog are clambering to get onboard in a few weeks.
Bluest is right here. The Tories will win Hartlepool and the pressure on Starmer becomes the big political story for this summer now.
The main reason it’s going Tory is voters there think if their constituency is Tory the government will want to keep it so by pouring money in, and a Tory MP is the best lobbiest to secure that investment. It’s completely sound thinking, and there’s absolutely nothing Labour can do about it, except sit it out for goodness knows how many years, till the voters feel let down and time for a change.
The pressure is not just on Starmer, his successor is likely to be destroyed by the Tories owning the levelling up idea whilst Labour own the stagnation and rape by globalisation of the 90’s and 00’s, the New Labour years predominantly.
The irony is that Boris is going on almost as big a spending splurge as Biden announced for the US last night, this is basically a social democratic government with a blue rosette for the foreseeable future after Covid
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Instinctively, emotionally, I'm with Philip. I am slightly cross when I see someone wearing a mask outside where there is no requirement to do so (nor any conceivable benefit). My emotional reaction is that these people are why we have been pushed into these excessive, illiberal restrictions in the first place. And yet, rationally - and rational wins, in the end - I know I am not them, and they may have 101 things going on in their heads which have lead them to the decision they have, from horrible personal experiences of losing loved ones down to the level of not actually finding masks that physically uncomfortable. Indeed, some of these people are my friends (albeit friends whom in pre-pandemic times we laughed about for being hilariously over-cautious.)
As long as post Jun 21 there is no law requiring me to wear a mask, I will be happy. And I can reenter the world and get a new pair of glasses and a mobile phone and all the other things I have been putting off doing for the best part of a year until I can do it maskless.
On another note, I plan to go to a pub tomorrow. I look forward to seeing how much or little they care about who I am. If they insist on QR codes or the NHS app, I won't be going; quite aside from any libertarian arguments, I need a new phone.
I've been talking about masks in crowded indoor spaces. This is what I postulate will carry on to a significant extent and is most certainly not "weird". Wearing a mask all of the time when out of the house is something else. That's imo a bit wei ... odd. But, you know, each to his own, live and let live, bla bla.
So that's the good news. You're not with Philip, you're in a much better place - with me.
You're trying to make an argument out of nothing. 🙄
There's no difference between saying "odd" or "weird". Same thing. They're synonyms.
I'm "live and let live" too, even with those I find weirdos. Like you and your intention to make everything an argument for some reason.
I don't think they're synonyms. Weird is stranger than odd, which is just a bit unusual.
NEW. SNP Foreign Aff @AlynSmith tells me on an independent #Scotland joining the EURO
“We would want to participate an economic & monetary union for the macroeconomic stability. The adoption of the € should be put to the people in a REFERENDUM”.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
I dont think it is. I think the last week will probably mean the least in any recent by election. The postal votes will be now mostly returned. PVs are the dedicated and most likely to vote of the electorate, and i'm assuming that PVs in this election are higher than ever before.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
A lot of postals in these times of Covid - and they are mostly in.
I would remain very surprised if there was a Labour hold in Hartlepool even without early postal vote returns. I believe it will be rather a comfortable Conservative win too, on a low turnout. My point was, pressure on Johnson and the Conservatives does seem to be fast moving. Nonetheless, I am not sure whoever wins Hartlepool tells us very much about GE2024.
You'd better hope Labour hold Hartlepool, because if they don't, the abject humiliation of the Opposition losing seats in midterm to a Boris Johnson under full assault by the media will kill Wallpapergate stone dead.
Here speaks somebody who is plainly not getting his weekly copy of "newpunditry-newpolitics".
I can do you a deal. Subscribe FREE at this point. It will cost a fiver once every man and his dog are clambering to get onboard in a few weeks.
Bluest is right here. The Tories will win Hartlepool and the pressure on Starmer becomes the big political story for this summer now.
The main reason it’s going Tory is voters there think if their constituency is Tory the government will want to keep it so by pouring money in, and a Tory MP is the best lobbiest to secure that investment. It’s completely sound thinking, and there’s absolutely nothing Labour can do about it, except sit it out for goodness knows how many years, till the voters feel let down and time for a change.
The pressure is not just on Starmer, his successor is likely to be destroyed by the Tories owning the levelling up idea whilst Labour own the stagnation and rape by globalisation of the 90’s and 00’s, the New Labour years predominantly.
He's saying he expects Labour to win it. I'm the one calling it for the Cons.
Hope I'm wrong of course (betting and blog kudos aside) but 'new punditry' has this as a Tory seat under our 'new politics'. They'd have likely won it at the GE were it not for the big BXP vote. That was not long ago and since then? - Brexit delivered and the vaccines beating the pandemic, no room for Labour to speak, and (your point) pork barrel promised. Starmer will be on the end of some attacks but imo will ride it out. And if Labour win he'll get a boost. For me it's too early to judge him or Labour's longer term GE prospects. Let's see how it looks in a years time.
Your 'helicopter' view in last para of where it's all going? Bleak but possible.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
I dont think it is. I think the last week will probably mean the least in any recent by election. The postal votes will be now mostly returned. PVs are the dedicated and most likely to vote of the electorate, and i'm assuming that PVs in this election are higher than ever before.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
A lot of postals in these times of Covid - and they are mostly in.
I would remain very surprised if there was a Labour hold in Hartlepool even without early postal vote returns. I believe it will be rather a comfortable Conservative win too, on a low turnout. My point was, pressure on Johnson and the Conservatives does seem to be fast moving. Nonetheless, I am not sure whoever wins Hartlepool tells us very much about GE2024.
You'd better hope Labour hold Hartlepool, because if they don't, the abject humiliation of the Opposition losing seats in midterm to a Boris Johnson under full assault by the media will kill Wallpapergate stone dead.
Here speaks somebody who is plainly not getting his weekly copy of "newpunditry-newpolitics".
I can do you a deal. Subscribe FREE at this point. It will cost a fiver once every man and his dog are clambering to get onboard in a few weeks.
Bluest is right here. The Tories will win Hartlepool and the pressure on Starmer becomes the big political story for this summer now.
The main reason it’s going Tory is voters there think if their constituency is Tory the government will want to keep it so by pouring money in, and a Tory MP is the best lobbiest to secure that investment. It’s completely sound thinking, and there’s absolutely nothing Labour can do about it, except sit it out for goodness knows how many years, till the voters feel let down and time for a change.
The pressure is not just on Starmer, his successor is likely to be destroyed by the Tories owning the levelling up idea whilst Labour own the stagnation and rape by globalisation of the 90’s and 00’s, the New Labour years predominantly.
The irony is that Boris is going on almost as big a spending splurge as Biden announced for the US last night, this is basically a social democratic government with a blue rosette for the foreseeable future after Covid
If you were advising Labour, what should they do, if anything can be done to help them in next 5 - 10 years?
This is impressive. When the new UK ambassador @MennaRawlings takes up her post in Paris soon, Britain will have female ambassadors in Beijing, Berlin, Moscow, Paris, Rome, Washington DC and Tokyo (among many others)
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
It’s no issue if you’re willing to radically reduce the size of Scotland’s deficit.
I see no evidence you’re willing to accept any trade-offs of Independence; which basically puts you on a par with...Brexiters.
“Brexiters” - 283,000 Google hits
“Brexiteers” - 837,000 Google hits
The BrexitEERS won the lexical war, as well
I favoured Brexitards, but I was warned off I think by the PB Mods.
Brexshitters was my favourite example of Remoaner lexicological madness. Used in newspapers by ‘serious’ journalists
Brexiteers is the term that will survive. Because it sounds cooler, is easier to say, and has that poetic hint of ‘buccaneers’, ‘grenadiers’, ‘chandeliers’
What about Brxtrs?
Ooh those sound nice. Is it a new brand of chocolate biscuits?
"Added to which with costs running at a £1m by the time it goes to trial , she will end up losing her flat and savings when all she has to do is apologise say she got it wrong and pay costs. Sad."
So with costs already at the level where she goes bankrupt if she loses she may as well go all in.
I have to say I am very uncomfortable with journalists being personally sued for libel rather than their publications.
I am in general but Cadwalladr seems to have a personal vendetta
NEW. SNP Foreign Aff @AlynSmith tells me on an independent #Scotland joining the EURO
“We would want to participate an economic & monetary union for the macroeconomic stability. The adoption of the € should be put to the people in a REFERENDUM”.
I have not dismissed RT as FM. I don't like him, and I think he looks like Roger Melly, the man on the telly, from Viz comic, but the former Labour blue collar voters love him.
I just do not see RT as FM but this poll has come as a surprise
Also conservatives and abolish the Senedd 32% on list
My submission is that what is happening is a generational change primarily based-unsurprisingly-on identity politics. Those who are inclined to favour their "Britishness" are older people. Those who are inclined to favour their "Scottishness" (and identity as Europeans) are younger people.
If PBers wish to believe that is the sort of attitude that will change in the way that younger Labour voters often trend towards becoming Conservative voters as they age, go right ahead.
I expect you to be very wrong.
Interesting - I may well be very wrong and good to hear your view of it. However I’d still be minded to err on the side of caution when making the assumption that going forward, that will remain consistent through the age ranges.
Comments
Escorted wife to out-patient appointment this morning; routine treatment of macular degeneration. However, every iOS professing well and they don't want to see her until;l July. And she can still drive; overall eyesight is excellent.
Everyone in out-patients was masked..... staff and patients, including the team outside directing people to the nearby vaccination clinic.
However, went home and wandered along the Main Street of our little town and almost no-one was masked, except me and the staff in the pharmacy.
I will be amazed if the SNP fail to hold Moray or fail to gain Edinburgh Central. The bookies (who I fully accept are not infallible) have the SNP at 1/4 to gain Edinburgh Central (Ladbrokes) and to hold Moray at 1.29 (smarkets). I am on at appreciably better odds ;-)
I can do you a deal. Subscribe FREE at this point. It will cost a fiver once every man and his dog are clambering to get onboard in a few weeks.
That’s definitely a type, but ‘brextenders’ is not good. Sounds like ‘eastenders’ which is simply confusing
The genius of ‘remoaners’ (I wonder who first coined it?) is the way it exactly captures a type with one clever punning easy-to-say, easy-to-understand word. Because, boy, they really do MOAN. Mr Meeks moaned like a Yokohama hooker for two loooong years.
Which for me is the Cheshire/Staffordshire border just south of Macclesfield.
I don't moan about Brexit, @Leon I actually find it all quite funny. I admit I didn't find it amusing at first (it was pretty damaging for my business as it has and is for many), but the more I think about it the more I realise that gradually even people with slow political analysis like "Leon" will slowly and eventually grasp that they were sold a pup.
That realisation will be proportional to how much they want to believe, just like Trump supporters with whom they share a lot of mentality. Let's face it, Brexit is now a boring subject that only people like Leon bang on about, even though they won their pyric victory. I find sniggering at Brexit believers far more satisfying than moaning about something I can't change.
(P.S. I once met a guy from Southsea Island who only considered Portsmouth and more southerly latitudes as the 'True South')
Yes, the portmanteau needs work. I'll have a rethink!
So that's the good news. You're not with Philip, you're in a much better place - with me.
I think I am taking 'zero covid' too literally.
There's no difference between saying "odd" or "weird". Same thing. They're synonyms.
I'm "live and let live" too, even with those I find weirdos. Like you and your intention to make everything an argument for some reason.
1/(1 - r(V)) being infected on average eventually, where r(V) is the reproductive rate of the virus amongst your broadly vaccinated population, and crucially r(V) is < 1 {The meaning of herd immunity}.
So if the vaccines and takeup push the r(V) to be 0.8, each person that slips through the net ends up with 5 infections (0.5;2). Which is why you still want it as a condition of entry but it's not the end of days if someone slips through.
NZ's issue is that with no vaccinations or infections r(t) > 1
People aren’t generally stupid..
The direction is all one way , it is only a matter of time till independence for sure and it will be a long long long time till SNP are not in power, likely after independence before that happens.
Starmer. Get the f*ck off wallpaper. Now. Before its too late.
Scott. Stop it mate. You are making it worse.
So post Jun 21
- we're hoping there will be no legal requirement to wear masks. (You are more optimistic than me, but we'll see).
- some businesses may continue to enforce mask requirements. Up to them if they do, but not likely to be good for business - though who knows?
- public sector bodies are a bit of an unknown. My view is that they probably will continue to require mask wearing indoors. (Boo!) We'll wait and see.
- people who wear masks outside all the time - perhaps a bit odd and frankly I'd rather they didn't, but we don't know people's circumstances or what is going on in their heads.
- voluntary wearing of masks indoors - up to individuals, and there will very likely be a legacy effect. Can't get too exercised about that, in the short term.
Social distancing is an altogether different kettle of fish, and I suspect it will wither naturally, though we may be spacing oursleves out a bit more for some time to come. It's a much less binary issue - it's largely obvious whether someone is wearing a mask or not, much less so whether two people are social distancing.
I offer Galloway's effort for entertainment. Remember Unionists, this is your guy.
I had a terrifying thought for Labour when reading the last thread. What if Boris is like a gateway drug Tory - they get rid of him and the red wall carry on voting Tory even with Boris gone! Imagine the howls of pain on in the Guardian as PM Sunak crushes Starmer.
I've not seen any polls with these muppets getting 6% or more.
There was a wonderful line from 'People Like Us', in the episode set in a lawyer's office in Cheshire - 'often called the Surrey of the North - except for by people from Sussex - for whom the Surry of the North is Surrey.'
My submission is that what is happening is a generational change primarily based-unsurprisingly-on identity politics. Those who are inclined to favour their "Britishness" are older people. Those who are inclined to favour their "Scottishness" (and identity as Europeans) are younger people.
If PBers wish to believe that is the sort of attitude that will change in the way that younger Labour voters often trend towards becoming Conservative voters as they age, go right ahead.
I expect you to be very wrong.
https://twitter.com/Arron_banks/status/1387732587251179523
"Added to which with costs running at a £1m by the time it goes to trial , she will end up losing her flat and savings when all she has to do is apologise say she got it wrong and pay costs. Sad."
Net delighted with SNP Majority:
16-24: +13
25-49: +14
50-64: -11
65+: -30
Net delighted SNP coalition with Greens:
16-24: +25
25-49: +8
50-64: -22
65+: -37
Net delighted SNP coalition with Alba:
16-24: -56
25-49: -42
50-64: -60
65+: -80
https://docs.cdn.yougov.com/unfra6xw2j/YouGov - Scotland coalition.pdf
The answer looks like not much.
Warning. Keep it up and I'll start asking about your pole again.
A facemask is a small piece of cloth, covering a small part of the face, to prevent others from getting sick and save lives.
A burqa covers the almost the entire face and body, is a misogynistic obscenity, designed to oppress women, dehumanise women and keep women segregated from the rest of society.
Anyone who thinks that medicine and misogyny are comparable needs their heads examining.
https://twitter.com/paul_lever/status/1387768480179658758?s=20
I have been saying for months, Johnson vaccinated Wales while Drakeford closed the pubs.
NEW. SNP Foreign Aff @AlynSmith tells me on an independent #Scotland joining the EURO
“We would want to participate an economic & monetary union for the macroeconomic stability. The adoption of the € should be put to the people in a REFERENDUM”.
https://twitter.com/antoguerrera/status/1387761243541413889?s=20
Two words...convergence criteria......
I'm sure it would go down a storm with many on here.
https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1387768444859437069?s=20
#BREAKING Russia Sputnik V vaccine developer says to sue Brazil regulator for defamation
https://twitter.com/AFP/status/1387775302047252483?s=20
Colour me skeptical.
The main reason it’s going Tory is voters there think if their constituency is Tory the government will want to keep it so by pouring money in, and a Tory MP is the best lobbiest to secure that investment. It’s completely sound thinking, and there’s absolutely nothing Labour can do about it, except sit it out for goodness knows how many years, till the voters feel let down and time for a change.
The pressure is not just on Starmer, his successor is likely to be destroyed by the Tories owning the levelling up idea whilst Labour own the stagnation and rape by globalisation of the 90’s and 00’s, the New Labour years predominantly.
(Christopher Furlong/Getty Images) https://twitter.com/NatashaC/status/1387778043268243458/photo/1
@BritainElects
·
39m
Welsh parl' voting intention(s):
Constituency:
LAB: 36% (+1)
CON: 27% (+6)
PC: 19% (-2)
LDEM: 5% (-2)
ABOL: 4% (+4)
REFUK: 4% (+4)
List:
LAB: 31% (-1)
CON: 24% (+5)
PC: 21% (-)
ABOL: 8% (+8)
LDEM: 5% (-2)
GRN: 3% (-)
REFUK: 3% (+3)
via @SavantaComRes
, 23-28 Apr
Chgs. w/ 2016
This is serious in itself because she has the power to suspend MPs.
https://twitter.com/jessicaelgot/status/1387778274877755398
https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1387778450585423882
https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1387768444859437069?s=19
The SNP has a lack of any proper thinkers. It’s just lightweights.
https://twitter.com/hzeffman/status/1387778729544458247?s=20
Hope I'm wrong of course (betting and blog kudos aside) but 'new punditry' has this as a Tory seat under our 'new politics'. They'd have likely won it at the GE were it not for the big BXP vote. That was not long ago and since then? - Brexit delivered and the vaccines beating the pandemic, no room for Labour to speak, and (your point) pork barrel promised. Starmer will be on the end of some attacks but imo will ride it out. And if Labour win he'll get a boost. For me it's too early to judge him or Labour's longer term GE prospects. Let's see how it looks in a years time.
Your 'helicopter' view in last para of where it's all going? Bleak but possible.
https://twitter.com/PedderSophie/status/1387779434271358976?s=20
Starmer has every right to be on this. Don't forget Major's Government died from a thousand (wallpaper?) cuts.
https://twitter.com/MrHarryCole/status/1387781134046703623
I’m not sure if that’s a good pitch to voters, who are looking to the end of an historic plague, and who just want a pint and a quieter life
And the tories have to be careful too. Abol +4 from nowhere. Reform +4 from nowhere.
Also conservatives and abolish the Senedd 32% on list
and 23rd to 28th April