@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
I suspect you will be disappointed. Here in the US the CDC has now dropped the mask mandate outdoors for those fully vaccinated except in “crowded” conditions and NY state has endorses that. Yet walking around the very much not crowded streets of Tarrytown yesterday lunchtime, either no-one else got the memo, or nobody at all has been fully vaccinated yet (in fact 1/3 of the state has been) as mask-wearing was as prevalent as before.
As I’ve said before, even after the pandemic is over, I plan to carry a mask with me when travelling on public transport, especially in the winter, and will don it if I’m feeling sniffly or I observe such symptoms in others, as in common practice in East Asia. It’s been wonderful not having had a single cold this last eighteen months.
Outdoor masking was never a big thing around where I was and, since the start of easement, it's pretty much dead.
58% of French people support the retired generals who threatened a military coup and 49% think the army should intervene over the head of the government.
Don't tell Roger - he thinks Hartlepool is only in the UK!
I wonder how many people here, have spotted the pictures of Le Vieux Maréchal*, when visiting a home - sometimes with a black band on the corner... surprisingly common in some parts of France....
And no, they are generally not celebrating his Verdun command.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
As Europe sticks its nose to the glass, looking in wistfully at partying Brits.
That's what you get for trying to fight Covid on the cheap, Europe.
Harsh but true.
But let’s not gloat about it, just celebrate that the U.K. has done a great job of squashing the pandemic - in the cafes, pubs and bars! It’s every Briton’s patriotic duty to spend the summer in the pub every night!
I suspect Europe will have just as good a summer as us, because they will relax restrictions to a less ultra-cautious timetable than us, and will be largely fine.
Indeed, and by the time August rolls around (the only month that matters to our continental friends) they'll be mostly through their vax programmes. And jolly good too – the gloating thing is a bit off TBH.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
I agree with this analysis. Is there anyone who doesn't dislike masks? Most people I speak to consider them a necessary evil but are very keen to get rid of them. Interestingly, I was at the pub on Saturday and nobody was wearing masks bar the waiting staff, who presumably have to do so. I suspect this was the case in most places.
I detest the masks. I hate having to wear one while moving in mostly empty corridors at work. I hate wearing them in the supermarket. I cannot wait to ditch them forever. I suspect some will want to cling to them as some kind of universal nostrum. I'd love to have seen some proper science around their use - one town uses them and another doesn't and we compare how infections spread. I suspect their use does have some impact on viral spread - spread seems mostly through the air, not from surfaces so it makes sense. I do wonder if they are so important right now, with most MSOA areas seeing hardly any evidence of the virus, and well over 60% of adults having had at least one jab.
There's a poll finding you won't see anywhere near the top of these pages!
More recent BMG shows a 4-point Tory lead (up 2), while the latest Savanta shows it as 7 points (down 2). Both well below the stratospheric 11-13 leads from other pollsters of a week or two back, and taken before yesterday's firestorm. Tories clearly still ahead, but...
True Nick, but as ever with polls they are best treated as another data point. Next week will be interesting, as we all know that elections are far more reliable than opinion polls.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
It’s no issue if you’re willing to radically reduce the size of Scotland’s deficit.
I see no evidence you’re willing to accept any trade-offs of Independence; which basically puts you on a par with...Brexiters.
“Brexiters” - 283,000 Google hits
“Brexiteers” - 837,000 Google hits
The BrexitEERS won the lexical war, as well
I favoured Brexitards, but I was warned off I think by the PB Mods.
Brexshitters was my favourite example of Remoaner lexicological madness. Used in newspapers by ‘serious’ journalists
Brexiteers is the term that will survive. Because it sounds cooler, is easier to say, and has that poetic hint of ‘buccaneers’, ‘grenadiers’, ‘chandeliers’
You complain about Brexshitter, which I have never heard, yet use the term remoaner. Irony obviously not your thing?
But Remoaner is a useful word. It captures the kind of Remainer who has strayed into irrationality. Someone with Strasbourg Syndrome.
I’d put Nigel Formain, on here, in that category. Maybe Mr Meeks, tho he has a more severe case
‘Remainiac’ should be reserved for Remainers who have gone completely postal. Outright lunacy. A C Grayling springs to mind.
Does ‘Brexshitters’ usefully identify a type of Brexiteer? I don’t believe it does. It’s just an unfunny insult. Used by Remoaners
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
Some people are clearly very fond of their masks. They are very definitely in a minority but not a tiny one -you will see about one in twenty people on our local high street with them on their faces. Very broadly, they tend to fall into three categories: the very scared (mostly old people who MUST have been double jabbed by now - if they're not demasking now, when will they ever?); the self-righteous-looking virtue signaller (most of the time, surely, I'm projecting here - but some people just look smug and angry when wearing a mask); and the forgetful (how can people forget they still have the horrid things on their faces? Some just do. My mother in law for one). If they must carry on, fair enough, as long as the rest of us don't have to.
You're missing a large category there - the vulnerable. Quite a lot of people (millions) have conditions/treatments that make them especially vulnerable to COVID.
One of the triumphs off modern medicine is that many of these people have no outward sign of illness - they take their pills/injections and live their lives.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
I fear for your sanity when Sturgeon asks for a vote, Boris says no, and then... nothing happens. Will you march on Bute House?
Sturgeon is not interested in independence, she bumps her gums but is interested in herself. She will not last much longer, the chickens are coming home to roost.
This is a bit like those Lefties who contantly claim that only the keepers of the true Socialist flame have any right to govern from the left. Truth is that the SNP is all you´ve got and if they fail, then that is the end of Indy, not just for now, but forever. What Alba is doing is unleashing the inner Judean Peoples Front of the Nationalist movement. Right now Scotland is split 50-50 about Indy as it is. As the Nats start tearing chunks off each other as to who is the true keeper of the nationalist flame, support for Indy itself is falling. Sturgeon won´t be pushed out because she is insufficiently nationalist, she will go because the supporters of separatism start a civil war amongst themselves. So you and Wings and the various other enemies of Sturgeon are totally wrong headed if you think removing her will help your cause. In fact I judge that she is the only one who can now deliver a separate Scotland and the numbers are not breaking her or your way. Across Scotland we are hearing that on the ground the Nat vote is soft. The Tories are down too of course so there is a deal of uncertainty, but Salmond´s party is just reminding a lot of folk what they most dislike about the Nats in general and that is not helping the SNP either.
the false claim that an independent Scotland could not have achieved this on its own.
It couldn't have if it had followed the policy the SNP government advocated and bought from the EU scheme. The only reason Malta (and Hungary) are ahead of the rest of the EU is they bought outside the EU scheme.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
I admire, and am encouraged by, your optimism. But I find it hard to share. Why, if social distancing ends on the 21st June, are councils still recruting covid marshalls? Why are sage talking about mask wearing next winter? I hope whay you think will happen, will happen. But I have little faith in the state giving up power it has given itself.
Well we'll see. I think you'll find the compulsion goes. Maybe bits & pieces kicking around but by and large we'll go back to something close to pre-pandemic. As to why the talk? - there's always talk and people can find what they want in it. Like, there was lots of talk about vaxports, wasn't there? I said we could safely ignore most of it, and so it is coming to pass. Bottom line, Cookie, I don't see the government throwing away the societal dividend from beating the pandemic. It's in nobody's interest and I most particularly do NOT buy this stuff about "the scientists won't give up centre stage easily" or "the politicians like these restrictions and will find excuses to prolong them". I just think all that is way off beam.. It makes no sense. No, you'll be rocking on 22 June, trust me.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
Some people are clearly very fond of their masks. They are very definitely in a minority but not a tiny one -you will see about one in twenty people on our local high street with them on their faces. Very broadly, they tend to fall into three categories: the very scared (mostly old people who MUST have been double jabbed by now - if they're not demasking now, when will they ever?); the self-righteous-looking virtue signaller (most of the time, surely, I'm projecting here - but some people just look smug and angry when wearing a mask); and the forgetful (how can people forget they still have the horrid things on their faces? Some just do. My mother in law for one). If they must carry on, fair enough, as long as the rest of us don't have to.
You're missing a large category there - the vulnerable. Quite a lot of people (millions) have conditions/treatments that make them especially vulnerable to COVID.
One of the triumphs off modern medicine is that many of these people have no outward sign of illness - they take their pills/injections and live their lives.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Instinctively, emotionally, I'm with Philip. I am slightly cross when I see someone wearing a mask outside where there is no requirement to do so (nor any conceivable benefit). My emotional reaction is that these people are why we have been pushed into these excessive, illiberal restrictions in the first place. And yet, rationally - and rational wins, in the end - I know I am not them, and they may have 101 things going on in their heads which have lead them to the decision they have, from horrible personal experiences of losing loved ones down to the level of not actually finding masks that physically uncomfortable. Indeed, some of these people are my friends (albeit friends whom in pre-pandemic times we laughed about for being hilariously over-cautious.)
As long as post Jun 21 there is no law requiring me to wear a mask, I will be happy. And I can reenter the world and get a new pair of glasses and a mobile phone and all the other things I have been putting off doing for the best part of a year until I can do it maskless.
On another note, I plan to go to a pub tomorrow. I look forward to seeing how much or little they care about who I am. If they insist on QR codes or the NHS app, I won't be going; quite aside from any libertarian arguments, I need a new phone.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
As Europe sticks its nose to the glass, looking in wistfully at partying Brits.
That's what you get for trying to fight Covid on the cheap, Europe.
Harsh but true.
But let’s not gloat about it, just celebrate that the U.K. has done a great job of squashing the pandemic - in the cafes, pubs and bars! It’s every Briton’s patriotic duty to spend the summer in the pub every night!
I suspect Europe will have just as good a summer as us, because they will relax restrictions to a less ultra-cautious timetable than us, and will be largely fine.
Indeed, and by the time August rolls around (the only month that matters to our continental friends) they'll be mostly through their vax programmes. And jolly good too – the gloating thing is a bit off TBH.
Yes, gloating is bad. It is also mis-advised. Almost every country that has publicly gloated about its covid response has then gone on to have a nasty date with Covid.
Ireland. Czechia. Sweden. Hungary. Germany. India. Russia.
Open letter by pro-European luminaries calling for EU-UK relations to enter a new competitive phase in which both sides pro-actively seek each other’s dissolution:
Carlotta Vance. It must be disappointing for you that your publicising of the vaccination statistics confirms that Scotland, as in independent EU member, could have achieved a successful vaccination rollout. Opponents of independence have claimed that was impossible. You have evidenced that it was entirely possible.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
It’s no issue if you’re willing to radically reduce the size of Scotland’s deficit.
I see no evidence you’re willing to accept any trade-offs of Independence; which basically puts you on a par with...Brexiters.
“Brexiters” - 283,000 Google hits
“Brexiteers” - 837,000 Google hits
The BrexitEERS won the lexical war, as well
I favoured Brexitards, but I was warned off I think by the PB Mods.
Brexshitters was my favourite example of Remoaner lexicological madness. Used in newspapers by ‘serious’ journalists
Brexiteers is the term that will survive. Because it sounds cooler, is easier to say, and has that poetic hint of ‘buccaneers’, ‘grenadiers’, ‘chandeliers’
You complain about Brexshitter, which I have never heard, yet use the term remoaner. Irony obviously not your thing?
I'd never heard Brexshitter either. Obviously didn't catch on - which is a pity because, like Remoaner, it hits the spot. Remainers did do a fair bit of moaning. And Leavers don't half talk utter utter shit.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
Some people are clearly very fond of their masks. They are very definitely in a minority but not a tiny one -you will see about one in twenty people on our local high street with them on their faces. Very broadly, they tend to fall into three categories: the very scared (mostly old people who MUST have been double jabbed by now - if they're not demasking now, when will they ever?); the self-righteous-looking virtue signaller (most of the time, surely, I'm projecting here - but some people just look smug and angry when wearing a mask); and the forgetful (how can people forget they still have the horrid things on their faces? Some just do. My mother in law for one). If they must carry on, fair enough, as long as the rest of us don't have to.
You're missing a large category there - the vulnerable. Quite a lot of people (millions) have conditions/treatments that make them especially vulnerable to COVID.
One of the triumphs off modern medicine is that many of these people have no outward sign of illness - they take their pills/injections and live their lives.
Well yes - but for me they fall into the category of the very scared. If they're vulnerable, presumably they've been jabbed. And more to the point, out in the street, masks benefit you just about not at all. If they won't demask now, when will they?
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Oh no. Now that's a much bigger issue in my book than having to give contact details.
Carlotta Vance. It must be disappointing for you that your publicising of the vaccination statistics confirms that Scotland, as in independent EU member, could have achieved a successful vaccination rollout. Opponents of independence have claimed that was impossible. You have evidenced that it was entirely possible.
"Could" doing a lot of heavy lifting there. Would PM Nicola have ignored the EU scheme and bought externally to it? A yes or no will suffice.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
It’s no issue if you’re willing to radically reduce the size of Scotland’s deficit.
I see no evidence you’re willing to accept any trade-offs of Independence; which basically puts you on a par with...Brexiters.
“Brexiters” - 283,000 Google hits
“Brexiteers” - 837,000 Google hits
The BrexitEERS won the lexical war, as well
I favoured Brexitards, but I was warned off I think by the PB Mods.
Brexshitters was my favourite example of Remoaner lexicological madness. Used in newspapers by ‘serious’ journalists
Brexiteers is the term that will survive. Because it sounds cooler, is easier to say, and has that poetic hint of ‘buccaneers’, ‘grenadiers’, ‘chandeliers’
You complain about Brexshitter, which I have never heard, yet use the term remoaner. Irony obviously not your thing?
I'd never heard Brexshitter either. Obviously didn't catch on - which is a pity because, like Remoaner, it hits the spot. Remainers did do a fair bit of moaning. And Leavers don't half talk utter utter shit.
I think Brexshitter tends to be on .. er .. Twatter.
Carlotta Vance. It must be disappointing for you that your publicising of the vaccination statistics confirms that Scotland, as in independent EU member, could have achieved a successful vaccination rollout. Opponents of independence have claimed that was impossible. You have evidenced that it was entirely possible.
No - your counterfactual involves the SNP government doing something it argued against.
The top 3 European countries ran their own vaccination purchase schemes - the UK on its own, completely, Malta and Hungary in addition to the EU scheme.
If you want a comparison, why not pick a country that did what the SNP government advocated - like Austria or Denmark - with less than half the UK's vaccination rate.
This latest Scottish poll, if held under NZ’s PR system would deliver:
SNP 50 Con 31 Lab 27 Grn 14 LDm 7
SNP/Grn 1 seat shy of a majority.
Possible govt combinations:
SNP/Lab SNP/Grn/LDm
I’m curious, but what is the relevance of putting the Scottish polls through the NZ system? It’s like me saying that under the Egyptian Ptolemaic regime Salmond and and Sturgeon should get married and be Co-rulers,
I thought the same - maybe he's from there?
Presumably it was to show how other voting systems are better (depending on pov).
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
It’s no issue if you’re willing to radically reduce the size of Scotland’s deficit.
I see no evidence you’re willing to accept any trade-offs of Independence; which basically puts you on a par with...Brexiters.
“Brexiters” - 283,000 Google hits
“Brexiteers” - 837,000 Google hits
The BrexitEERS won the lexical war, as well
I favoured Brexitards, but I was warned off I think by the PB Mods.
Brexshitters was my favourite example of Remoaner lexicological madness. Used in newspapers by ‘serious’ journalists
Brexiteers is the term that will survive. Because it sounds cooler, is easier to say, and has that poetic hint of ‘buccaneers’, ‘grenadiers’, ‘chandeliers’
You complain about Brexshitter, which I have never heard, yet use the term remoaner. Irony obviously not your thing?
If an insult is hard to say, it loses its sting. Brexshitter is hard to say. You need a little pause after the 'Brex'. That's why it doesn't work.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
I agree with this analysis. Is there anyone who doesn't dislike masks? Most people I speak to consider them a necessary evil but are very keen to get rid of them. Interestingly, I was at the pub on Saturday and nobody was wearing masks bar the waiting staff, who presumably have to do so. I suspect this was the case in most places.
As someone who’s been wearing one compulsorily outside his own home, including the office, for more than a year now, it’s actually not too bad if you get a decent washable cloth one.
Given the choice of either having people wear masks indoors or take half the seats out, businesses are going to choose the former all day long. Hopefully June 21st will see the end of regulations though, and it will be up to individual businesses how they want to deal with it.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
I dont think it is. I think the last week will probably mean the least in any recent by election. The postal votes will be now mostly returned. PVs are the dedicated and most likely to vote of the electorate, and i'm assuming that PVs in this election are higher than ever before.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
A lot of postals in these times of Covid - and they are mostly in.
I would remain very surprised if there was a Labour hold in Hartlepool even without early postal vote returns. I believe it will be rather a comfortable Conservative win too, on a low turnout. My point was, pressure on Johnson and the Conservatives does seem to be fast moving. Nonetheless, I am not sure whoever wins Hartlepool tells us very much about GE2024.
It would tell us that Labour have a big problem in places where they won in 2019 due to Farage taking votes that may have otherwise voted Tory.
And that Labour are both very lucky not to have far fewer seats and have a serious problem if they wish to stand still let alone start to claw things back.
It does, assuming nothing changes and the Johnson saved the nation narrative remains.
I am back in the saddle as it were, and although I am picking up work which is a hangover for work we would otherwise have got last year, I don't see it compensating for work already lost. I am being pro-active (speculate to accumulate) and I am setting on a Rep to generate business that in previous years would have developed organically, through my business partners and myself being out and about.
It looks very scary to me. I know business confidence generally has never been higher, and yes one sees "career vacancies" signs all over the place, but the number of closed shops, pubs and businesses is worrying. What happens when the jobs retention scheme closes? If the V shaped recovery looks more like an "M" the politics will change too. As a natural pessimist, I don't see how we avoid a difficult few years.
Carlotta Vance. You are fully entitled to delude yourself on the demographics issue. The overwhelming support for Scottish independence among the younger age groups is primarily due to younger people having only had a vote during the existence of Holyrood. They therefore support their own parliament over WM-that will not be changing materially any time soon.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
Some people are clearly very fond of their masks. They are very definitely in a minority but not a tiny one -you will see about one in twenty people on our local high street with them on their faces. Very broadly, they tend to fall into three categories: the very scared (mostly old people who MUST have been double jabbed by now - if they're not demasking now, when will they ever?); the self-righteous-looking virtue signaller (most of the time, surely, I'm projecting here - but some people just look smug and angry when wearing a mask); and the forgetful (how can people forget they still have the horrid things on their faces? Some just do. My mother in law for one). If they must carry on, fair enough, as long as the rest of us don't have to.
You're missing a large category there - the vulnerable. Quite a lot of people (millions) have conditions/treatments that make them especially vulnerable to COVID.
One of the triumphs off modern medicine is that many of these people have no outward sign of illness - they take their pills/injections and live their lives.
They are part of Cookie's "very scared" category I presume.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
Some people are clearly very fond of their masks. They are very definitely in a minority but not a tiny one -you will see about one in twenty people on our local high street with them on their faces. Very broadly, they tend to fall into three categories: the very scared (mostly old people who MUST have been double jabbed by now - if they're not demasking now, when will they ever?); the self-righteous-looking virtue signaller (most of the time, surely, I'm projecting here - but some people just look smug and angry when wearing a mask); and the forgetful (how can people forget they still have the horrid things on their faces? Some just do. My mother in law for one). If they must carry on, fair enough, as long as the rest of us don't have to.
You're missing a large category there - the vulnerable. Quite a lot of people (millions) have conditions/treatments that make them especially vulnerable to COVID.
One of the triumphs off modern medicine is that many of these people have no outward sign of illness - they take their pills/injections and live their lives.
Well yes - but for me they fall into the category of the very scared. If they're vulnerable, presumably they've been jabbed. And more to the point, out in the street, masks benefit you just about not at all. If they won't demask now, when will they?
Have you considered that for many people, the marginal cost of wearing a mask is zero? "just about not at all" - is not exactly true, either. There are proven cases of someone chating to someone in the street for a few minutes, leading to transmission.
And one day, nobody will admit to having been one...
This is already the case for the under 50s and in London.
We shall overcome eventually, as our cause is the righteous one.
Although I doubt we will rejoin. More likely, we will return to the single market.
If we can keep our cake, and eat their's as well...
Though personally I think there is a crisis of governance coming in the EU, about whether evolves to be able to run a gang of 27, or whether the existing establishment goes further down the rabbithole.
Reform or Die. With options of Looser or Tighter on Reform.
There ought to be a crisis of governance. But I can’t easily see it happening.
Not unless Le Pen wins the Presidency (v v unlikely), or perhaps that Bavarian guy becomes Chancellor.
The EU sits in that bucket of “flawed, but not worth expending energy on outside an utter crisis”.
Paris prosecutors specializing in health-related investigations have opened an involuntary manslaughter probe into three deaths that occurred following Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccinations, AFP reported on Wednesday. They are taking over and combining three investigations from local prosecutors that began on a regional level following complaints from the families of the deceased.
This latest Scottish poll, if held under NZ’s PR system would deliver:
SNP 50 Con 31 Lab 27 Grn 14 LDm 7
SNP/Grn 1 seat shy of a majority.
Possible govt combinations:
SNP/Lab SNP/Grn/LDm
I’m curious, but what is the relevance of putting the Scottish polls through the NZ system? It’s like me saying that under the Egyptian Ptolemaic regime Salmond and and Sturgeon should get married and be Co-rulers,
I thought the same - maybe he's from there?
I am. As is my profile pic.
I do the NZ thing to implicitly point out how terrible the system used in Scotland and Wales are.
It’s Blairite Labour’s fault, but they’ve saddled the two nations with disastrous systems.
Open letter by pro-European luminaries calling for EU-UK relations to enter a new competitive phase in which both sides pro-actively seek each other’s dissolution:
If everyone gets their vaccines we should get to zero Covid I think. You just need proof of vaccination & a negative test as a condition of entry to the country.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Oh no. Now that's a much bigger issue in my book than having to give contact details.
I know. How very dare they. I can feel a very, very strongly worded email indeed coming on. It’s left me in a right fluffery buffery, I’m not afraid to admit.
Carlotta Vance. You are fully entitled to delude yourself on the demographics issue. The overwhelming support for Scottish independence among the younger age groups is primarily due to younger people having only had a vote during the existence of Holyrood. They therefore support their own parliament over WM-that will not be changing materially any time soon.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
Some people are clearly very fond of their masks. They are very definitely in a minority but not a tiny one -you will see about one in twenty people on our local high street with them on their faces. Very broadly, they tend to fall into three categories: the very scared (mostly old people who MUST have been double jabbed by now - if they're not demasking now, when will they ever?); the self-righteous-looking virtue signaller (most of the time, surely, I'm projecting here - but some people just look smug and angry when wearing a mask); and the forgetful (how can people forget they still have the horrid things on their faces? Some just do. My mother in law for one). If they must carry on, fair enough, as long as the rest of us don't have to.
You're missing a large category there - the vulnerable. Quite a lot of people (millions) have conditions/treatments that make them especially vulnerable to COVID.
One of the triumphs off modern medicine is that many of these people have no outward sign of illness - they take their pills/injections and live their lives.
Well yes - but for me they fall into the category of the very scared. If they're vulnerable, presumably they've been jabbed. And more to the point, out in the street, masks benefit you just about not at all. If they won't demask now, when will they?
Have you considered that for many people, the marginal cost of wearing a mask is zero? "just about not at all" - is not exactly true, either. There are proven cases of someone chating to someone in the street for a few minutes, leading to transmission.
Carlotta Vance. It must be disappointing for you that your publicising of the vaccination statistics confirms that Scotland, as in independent EU member, could have achieved a successful vaccination rollout. Opponents of independence have claimed that was impossible. You have evidenced that it was entirely possible.
Possible, perhaps, but plausible? Given the SNP's response when it was announced the UK would be going it alone I think not.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
Some people are clearly very fond of their masks. They are very definitely in a minority but not a tiny one -you will see about one in twenty people on our local high street with them on their faces. Very broadly, they tend to fall into three categories: the very scared (mostly old people who MUST have been double jabbed by now - if they're not demasking now, when will they ever?); the self-righteous-looking virtue signaller (most of the time, surely, I'm projecting here - but some people just look smug and angry when wearing a mask); and the forgetful (how can people forget they still have the horrid things on their faces? Some just do. My mother in law for one). If they must carry on, fair enough, as long as the rest of us don't have to.
You're missing a large category there - the vulnerable. Quite a lot of people (millions) have conditions/treatments that make them especially vulnerable to COVID.
One of the triumphs off modern medicine is that many of these people have no outward sign of illness - they take their pills/injections and live their lives.
Well yes - but for me they fall into the category of the very scared. If they're vulnerable, presumably they've been jabbed. And more to the point, out in the street, masks benefit you just about not at all. If they won't demask now, when will they?
Have you considered that for many people, the marginal cost of wearing a mask is zero? "just about not at all" - is not exactly true, either. There are proven cases of someone chating to someone in the street for a few minutes, leading to transmission.
Well yes I have - see my comment earlier about rationally I know some have a reason to be scared, and others, weirdly, don't seem to mind the horrid things (i.e. the marginal cost is near zero). Rationally I do try not to judge, because everybody is different.
To be clear, I hate them. I have been putting up with slightly blurry vision for the last year and a phone with a battery which lasts less than 30 minutes, because my price of wearing a mask is very high, and I will wait until I can replace phone and glasses without having to do so. But I get that some people don't seem to mind them. Weirdos. *note tongue is in cheek!*
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Oh no. Now that's a much bigger issue in my book than having to give contact details.
It’s left me in a right fluffery buffery, I’m not afraid to admit.
I'd be afraid to admit that, out of uncertainty of how bad it was.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
It’s no issue if you’re willing to radically reduce the size of Scotland’s deficit.
I see no evidence you’re willing to accept any trade-offs of Independence; which basically puts you on a par with...Brexiters.
“Brexiters” - 283,000 Google hits
“Brexiteers” - 837,000 Google hits
The BrexitEERS won the lexical war, as well
I favoured Brexitards, but I was warned off I think by the PB Mods.
Brexshitters was my favourite example of Remoaner lexicological madness. Used in newspapers by ‘serious’ journalists
Brexiteers is the term that will survive. Because it sounds cooler, is easier to say, and has that poetic hint of ‘buccaneers’, ‘grenadiers’, ‘chandeliers’
You complain about Brexshitter, which I have never heard, yet use the term remoaner. Irony obviously not your thing?
But Remoaner is a useful word. It captures the kind of Remainer who has strayed into irrationality. Someone with Strasbourg Syndrome.
I’d put Nigel Formain, on here, in that category. Maybe Mr Meeks, tho he has a more severe case
‘Remainiac’ should be reserved for Remainers who have gone completely postal. Outright lunacy. A C Grayling springs to mind.
Does ‘Brexshitters’ usefully identify a type of Brexiteer? I don’t believe it does. It’s just an unfunny insult. Used by Remoaners
I disagree. Remoaner is an insult, as is Brexshitter, although to be honest I reckon you have just made this one up.
Brexiteer is not insulting.
I rather like Remainiac and doesn't feel like an insult to me, although can appreciate how some might take it as so.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
Open letter by pro-European luminaries calling for EU-UK relations to enter a new competitive phase in which both sides pro-actively seek each other’s dissolution:
Open letter by pro-European luminaries calling for EU-UK relations to enter a new competitive phase in which both sides pro-actively seek each other’s dissolution:
Carlotta Vance. You are fully entitled to delude yourself on the demographics issue. The overwhelming support for Scottish independence among the younger age groups is primarily due to younger people having only had a vote during the existence of Holyrood. They therefore support their own parliament over WM-that will not be changing materially any time soon.
Your post is an example of the classic demographics argument that Labour (particularly under Corbyn) have relied so heavily upon of late. It's a mistake to assume that young people will continue voting in a radical manner permanently.
The young do have little to lose by voting for radical change, but once people get families, stable jobs and homes they become more interested in preserving those over big risky change. It doesn't always pan out that way (see Brexit) but it's more of a factor than you think.
Open letter by pro-European luminaries calling for EU-UK relations to enter a new competitive phase in which both sides pro-actively seek each other’s dissolution:
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
Some people are clearly very fond of their masks. They are very definitely in a minority but not a tiny one -you will see about one in twenty people on our local high street with them on their faces. Very broadly, they tend to fall into three categories: the very scared (mostly old people who MUST have been double jabbed by now - if they're not demasking now, when will they ever?); the self-righteous-looking virtue signaller (most of the time, surely, I'm projecting here - but some people just look smug and angry when wearing a mask); and the forgetful (how can people forget they still have the horrid things on their faces? Some just do. My mother in law for one). If they must carry on, fair enough, as long as the rest of us don't have to.
You're missing a large category there - the vulnerable. Quite a lot of people (millions) have conditions/treatments that make them especially vulnerable to COVID.
One of the triumphs off modern medicine is that many of these people have no outward sign of illness - they take their pills/injections and live their lives.
Well yes - but for me they fall into the category of the very scared. If they're vulnerable, presumably they've been jabbed. And more to the point, out in the street, masks benefit you just about not at all. If they won't demask now, when will they?
Have you considered that for many people, the marginal cost of wearing a mask is zero? "just about not at all" - is not exactly true, either. There are proven cases of someone chating to someone in the street for a few minutes, leading to transmission.
How can you prove that?
IIRC in several cases (in several countries including China), the only contact in the time period for the infection was such a chat. The probability seems to be much lower than indoors/confined spaces, but it is not non-existent.
If everyone gets their vaccines we should get to zero Covid I think. You just need proof of vaccination & a negative test as a condition of entry to the country.
Your last sentence will really enthuse a section of Guardian commentariate....
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
Some people are clearly very fond of their masks. They are very definitely in a minority but not a tiny one -you will see about one in twenty people on our local high street with them on their faces. Very broadly, they tend to fall into three categories: the very scared (mostly old people who MUST have been double jabbed by now - if they're not demasking now, when will they ever?); the self-righteous-looking virtue signaller (most of the time, surely, I'm projecting here - but some people just look smug and angry when wearing a mask); and the forgetful (how can people forget they still have the horrid things on their faces? Some just do. My mother in law for one). If they must carry on, fair enough, as long as the rest of us don't have to.
You're missing a large category there - the vulnerable. Quite a lot of people (millions) have conditions/treatments that make them especially vulnerable to COVID.
One of the triumphs off modern medicine is that many of these people have no outward sign of illness - they take their pills/injections and live their lives.
Well yes - but for me they fall into the category of the very scared. If they're vulnerable, presumably they've been jabbed. And more to the point, out in the street, masks benefit you just about not at all. If they won't demask now, when will they?
Have you considered that for many people, the marginal cost of wearing a mask is zero? "just about not at all" - is not exactly true, either. There are proven cases of someone chating to someone in the street for a few minutes, leading to transmission.
How can you prove that?
IIRC in several cases (in several countries including China), the only contact in the time period for the infection was such a chat. The probability seems to be much lower than indoors/confined spaces, but it is not non-existent.
Could have been airborne from distance, through a window, touching post - who knows? Not non-existent but you can never know. Only zero Covids would argue for non-existent risks anyway. We have the vaccines and inevitable boosters - now we live with it.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
Carlotta Vance. You have to explain why you think those who are currently younger people, who overwhelmingly support being governed by their own Edinburgh based parliament, are going over time, in a majority, to wish Westminster to govern them. Enjoy your leap of unionist faith, which, again ironically, will fade to cult status :-)
If everyone gets their vaccines we should get to zero Covid I think. You just need proof of vaccination & a negative test as a condition of entry to the country.
Is that realistic? I agree that if everyone - or even if a sufficiently large number of people - get their vaccine then covid has nowhere to go and dies out in the UK. (Though of course we would still get thousands of positive tests a week on current numbers of testing). But how many people come in to the UK each day? Can we insist all of those have negative tests? Can we rely on the accuracy of those negative tests? And somewhere there has to be a frontier. Even NZ - which is much more able than us to seal itself off - kept getting cases reintroduced.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Some people will and they will be the weird exceptions, just like in the past when you'd see eg Japanese shoppers in the Trafford centre wearing a mask. It just looks weird, but it always happened and you'll continue to get it with some weirdos going forwards. And I stand by the term, people voluntarily doing it when its not required or mandated will be very much the exception not the norm.
But more important than whether a few weirdos do stuff that doesn't affect anyone else, is whether businesses demand it. I couldn't care less if individuals want to wear a mask when they're not required to, I couldn't care less about other people's fashion choices. But if businesses are still demanding it that's a different matter, that's where its continuing, and if its not required by law there'll be little incentive for businesses to mandate it.
"Weirdos" is a silly - and tbh a rather crass and offensive - term to apply to what will almost certainly be the non-trivial minority of people who will be sufficiently risk-averse (having lived through this harrowing public health crisis which has lasted so long and wreaked such havoc) to continue on a voluntary basis with certain virus mitigation practices (eg masks in crowded spaces) after the legal compulsion to do so has been dropped. These people shoud not be viewed or described as weirdos. I trust we will not see it from you again in this context.
But I sense you know you've been a bit "argue for argues sake" on this point and are seeking to focus on what businesses will do. Ok. That is an interesting and important question. Will many businesses (in order to make their clientele feel ultra safe and increase turnover) impose covid restrictions even though they don't have to? I think no. I'm sure there will be pockets of it, and maybe in certain situations it might make commercial sense, but by and large - no. Post 22 June will usher in a new normal that for most things will resemble the old normal.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
The name might be a bit of a giveaway there.
Thick as a brick I may be, but remarkably I had worked that bit out for myself. It was perhaps too grammatically clumsy for my piercing wit to hit the target. Sorry.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
I was paying seven sheets a pint in EC1 last week – even made this long-term London dweller's eyes water.
Carlotta Vance. You have to explain why you think those who are currently younger people, who overwhelmingly support being governed by their own Edinburgh based parliament, are going over time, in a majority, to wish Westminster to govern them. Enjoy your leap of unionist faith, which, again ironically, will fade to cult status :-)
You could ask the same question about why young Labour voters would ever change to voting for the evil Tories.
Carlotta Vance. You have to explain why you think those who are currently younger people, who overwhelmingly support being governed by their own Edinburgh based parliament, are going over time, in a majority, to wish Westminster to govern them. Enjoy your leap of unionist faith, which, again ironically, will fade to cult status :-)
Now you explain why what happened in Quebec can't/won't happen in Scotland
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
If everyone gets their vaccines we should get to zero Covid I think. You just need proof of vaccination & a negative test as a condition of entry to the country.
Is that realistic? I agree that if everyone - or even if a sufficiently large number of people - get their vaccine then covid has nowhere to go and dies out in the UK. (Though of course we would still get thousands of positive tests a week on current numbers of testing). But how many people come in to the UK each day? Can we insist all of those have negative tests? Can we rely on the accuracy of those negative tests? And somewhere there has to be a frontier. Even NZ - which is much more able than us to seal itself off - kept getting cases reintroduced.
Some people will slip through the net and present symptons later, but the virus is being dropped into a vaccinated population; it can't proliferate because it can't find hosts. New Zealand has an issue because it has a ~ zero antibody population.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
It’s no issue if you’re willing to radically reduce the size of Scotland’s deficit.
I see no evidence you’re willing to accept any trade-offs of Independence; which basically puts you on a par with...Brexiters.
“Brexiters” - 283,000 Google hits
“Brexiteers” - 837,000 Google hits
The BrexitEERS won the lexical war, as well
I favoured Brexitards, but I was warned off I think by the PB Mods.
Brexshitters was my favourite example of Remoaner lexicological madness. Used in newspapers by ‘serious’ journalists
Brexiteers is the term that will survive. Because it sounds cooler, is easier to say, and has that poetic hint of ‘buccaneers’, ‘grenadiers’, ‘chandeliers’
You complain about Brexshitter, which I have never heard, yet use the term remoaner. Irony obviously not your thing?
But Remoaner is a useful word. It captures the kind of Remainer who has strayed into irrationality. Someone with Strasbourg Syndrome.
I’d put Nigel Formain, on here, in that category. Maybe Mr Meeks, tho he has a more severe case
‘Remainiac’ should be reserved for Remainers who have gone completely postal. Outright lunacy. A C Grayling springs to mind.
Does ‘Brexshitters’ usefully identify a type of Brexiteer? I don’t believe it does. It’s just an unfunny insult. Used by Remoaners
I disagree. Remoaner is an insult, as is Brexshitter, although to be honest I reckon you have just made this one up.
Brexiteer is not insulting.
I rather like Remainiac and doesn't feel like an insult to me, although can appreciate how some might take it as so.
A term can be insulting AND useful and insightful. Remoaner is one such term. Remainers who moan, endlessly. We’ve all encountered them, sometimes on here
As for ‘brexshitters’ -
‘How many Brexshitters went or are going skiing in Europe? How many own second homes there? What EU wines do they drink? We must be told.’
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
I said "Nah" in response to "bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while."
Its not bound to continue, people will rapidly put it behind us. People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June (begrudgingly in my case) but after that it is over.
Some weirdos may continue to wear a mask, but next-to-zero businesses will demand one and next-to-zero businesses will voluntarily require social distancing if its not legally required.
Such practices will die a death. Rapidly. Deservedly.
Of course some people will continue with certain aspects (eg masks in crowded spaces). Why on earth dispute something that's undeniably true?
Nigelb, for example, has said he possibly will. Ditto Nick Palmer, I bet. Plus a few others on here. Also some people I know in flesh & blood have said they intend to. These folk are not "weirdos". Don't be so ridiculous. You're projecting your own attitude onto everyone else.
I seem to bring out the worst out in you, Philip. You come out with an enormous amount of crap when talking to me. Your usual quotient is about 40% but it's at least double that when yours truly is your conversational partner. Ah well. I'm used to it.
Some people will and they will be the weird exceptions, just like in the past when you'd see eg Japanese shoppers in the Trafford centre wearing a mask. It just looks weird, but it always happened and you'll continue to get it with some weirdos going forwards. And I stand by the term, people voluntarily doing it when its not required or mandated will be very much the exception not the norm.
But more important than whether a few weirdos do stuff that doesn't affect anyone else, is whether businesses demand it. I couldn't care less if individuals want to wear a mask when they're not required to, I couldn't care less about other people's fashion choices. But if businesses are still demanding it that's a different matter, that's where its continuing, and if its not required by law there'll be little incentive for businesses to mandate it.
"Weirdos" is a silly - and tbh a rather crass and offensive - term to apply to what will almost certainly be the non-trivial minority of people who will be sufficiently risk-averse (having lived through this harrowing public health crisis which has lasted so long and wreaked such havoc) to continue on a voluntary basis with certain virus mitigation practices (eg masks in crowded spaces) after the legal compulsion to do so has been dropped. These people shoud not be viewed or described as weirdos. I trust we will not see it from you again in this context.
But I sense you know you've been a bit "argue for argues sake" on this point and are seeking to focus on what businesses will do. Ok. That is an interesting and important question. Will many businesses (in order to make their clientele feel ultra safe and increase turnover) impose covid restrictions even though they don't have to? I think no. I'm sure there will be pockets of it, and maybe in certain situations it might make commercial sense, but by and large - no. Post 22 June will usher in a new normal that for most things will resemble the old normal.
What about in the public sector?
Re wierdos, agree that this is not helpful. But if people continue to drag their heels in helping get us out of this awfulness by continuing on a voluntary basis with certain virus mitigation practices then they are part of the problem. Logic and science please, not irrational maths-illiterate fear.
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
It’s no issue if you’re willing to radically reduce the size of Scotland’s deficit.
I see no evidence you’re willing to accept any trade-offs of Independence; which basically puts you on a par with...Brexiters.
“Brexiters” - 283,000 Google hits
“Brexiteers” - 837,000 Google hits
The BrexitEERS won the lexical war, as well
I favoured Brexitards, but I was warned off I think by the PB Mods.
Brexshitters was my favourite example of Remoaner lexicological madness. Used in newspapers by ‘serious’ journalists
Brexiteers is the term that will survive. Because it sounds cooler, is easier to say, and has that poetic hint of ‘buccaneers’, ‘grenadiers’, ‘chandeliers’
You complain about Brexshitter, which I have never heard, yet use the term remoaner. Irony obviously not your thing?
But Remoaner is a useful word. It captures the kind of Remainer who has strayed into irrationality. Someone with Strasbourg Syndrome.
I’d put Nigel Formain, on here, in that category. Maybe Mr Meeks, tho he has a more severe case
‘Remainiac’ should be reserved for Remainers who have gone completely postal. Outright lunacy. A C Grayling springs to mind.
Does ‘Brexshitters’ usefully identify a type of Brexiteer? I don’t believe it does. It’s just an unfunny insult. Used by Remoaners
I disagree. Remoaner is an insult, as is Brexshitter, although to be honest I reckon you have just made this one up.
Brexiteer is not insulting.
I rather like Remainiac and doesn't feel like an insult to me, although can appreciate how some might take it as so.
A term can be insulting AND useful and insightful. Remoaner is one such term. Remainers who moan, endlessly. We’ve all encountered them, sometimes on here
As for ‘brexshitters’ -
‘How many Brexshitters went or are going skiing in Europe? How many own second homes there? What EU wines do they drink? We must be told.’
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
Carlotta Vance. You have to explain why you think those who are currently younger people, who overwhelmingly support being governed by their own Edinburgh based parliament, are going over time, in a majority, to wish Westminster to govern them. Enjoy your leap of unionist faith, which, again ironically, will fade to cult status :-)
How do you explain the Tories - who face a similar demographic challenge being re-elected?
The 60 year olds who voted for Mrs Thatcher in 1979 are now 102......
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
I see Nat West have said they will relocate if Scotland gains "Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom"
Tbf, I think they might do it either way and renominate their HQ to their Bishopsgate base and dump the last vestiges of of the RBS buyout and subsequent failure.
Doing that would mean dropping the printing of RBS bank notes - which would be a very political (and business) sensitive decision.
Mind you if personal banking runs at a loss and you wanted to start closing it down it would be an ideal way of doing so.
Wouldn't you just spin RBS into an entity which stays in Scotland while the rest of the company stays with NatWest Group in London. Effectively reversing the RBS takeover of NatWest so that NatWest becomes the owner of RBS which keeps the banknote printing licence in Edinburgh.
They wouldn't be able to print Sterling banknotes anyway, and I don't think that the EU would want banknotes bearing that name.
The whole economic side of independence is in my view almost impossible to navigate. At least for the time being. (Of course there may be wise Scottish heads that have a viable plan, but it seems unlikely to me)
Their wisest heads talk about using the £ - unfortunately without the wisdom to understand that really dose not make them independent at all.
Not many wise heads on here, full of numpties. Short term it would be no issue and any fool knows it will be own currency after that, as per every other country in the world. There would have to be a phased changeover of some sort and for sure Scotland will not be childish and will still accept English notes.
It’s no issue if you’re willing to radically reduce the size of Scotland’s deficit.
I see no evidence you’re willing to accept any trade-offs of Independence; which basically puts you on a par with...Brexiters.
“Brexiters” - 283,000 Google hits
“Brexiteers” - 837,000 Google hits
The BrexitEERS won the lexical war, as well
I favoured Brexitards, but I was warned off I think by the PB Mods.
Brexshitters was my favourite example of Remoaner lexicological madness. Used in newspapers by ‘serious’ journalists
Brexiteers is the term that will survive. Because it sounds cooler, is easier to say, and has that poetic hint of ‘buccaneers’, ‘grenadiers’, ‘chandeliers’
You complain about Brexshitter, which I have never heard, yet use the term remoaner. Irony obviously not your thing?
But Remoaner is a useful word. It captures the kind of Remainer who has strayed into irrationality. Someone with Strasbourg Syndrome.
I’d put Nigel Formain, on here, in that category. Maybe Mr Meeks, tho he has a more severe case
‘Remainiac’ should be reserved for Remainers who have gone completely postal. Outright lunacy. A C Grayling springs to mind.
Does ‘Brexshitters’ usefully identify a type of Brexiteer? I don’t believe it does. It’s just an unfunny insult. Used by Remoaners
I disagree. Remoaner is an insult, as is Brexshitter, although to be honest I reckon you have just made this one up.
Brexiteer is not insulting.
I rather like Remainiac and doesn't feel like an insult to me, although can appreciate how some might take it as so.
A term can be insulting AND useful and insightful. Remoaner is one such term. Remainers who moan, endlessly. We’ve all encountered them, sometimes on here
As for ‘brexshitters’ -
‘How many Brexshitters went or are going skiing in Europe? How many own second homes there? What EU wines do they drink? We must be told.’
Interesting to see how the EU member state Malta (described by the British press as totally incapable financially of being an independent state shortly before their independence), has the highest vaccination rate by at least one measure (see Carlota Vance table earlier).
I find this ironic, as I think the pull back from Yes to No seems mainly due to the vaccination achievement of the UK, and the false claim that an independent Scotland could not have achieved this on its own.
I ceased to worry about whether or not Scotland would become independent a while back, as the demographics are utterly crushing for unionism. The end of the Union can be delayed but not prevented.
A couple of points rebutting nonsense comments on the election by some PBers:- Sturgeon is not going to lose her constituency seat to the privately educated millionaire Sarwar, and the SNP are not going to lose Moray, a seat that Ross was afraid to stand in at this election.
It will be interesting to see if Labour can hold any of their 3 constituency seats currently held on tiny or small majorities, Dumbarton, East Lothian and Edinburgh Southern. The last named seems their best bet to me due to tactical voting for Labour by Tory supporters.
Nearly forgot-Angus Robertson will gain Edinburgh Central from the Conservatives. Baroness Davidson has fled that scene having employed her usual tactic of dodging her constituents :-)
Nothing is certain at all and no the demographics are no worse for Unionism than they are for the Tories, otherwise on your logic given under 30s comfortably voted for Corbyn there would always ultimately be Labour governments. People also always get more conservative as they age.
Sarwar will get a significant swing from Sturgeon and the SNP will likely lose Moray, Ross won it in 2019 at the general election and it is the most Leave seat in Scotland and today's Comres has a clear swing to the SCons from the SNP. As party leader Ross just stood on the list to ensure his election.
Today's poll also showed a swing from the SNP to Labour since 2016 so Labour will likely hold all their Holyrood constituency seats and gain some on the list.
Angus Robertson may well also fail to gain Edinburgh Central, Scottish Conservative voters from 2016 are more likely to vote for Sarwar's SLab if they are anti Brexit than the SNP
Can we have Brextenders (other PBers might suggest a neater portmanteau) – those who are unhappy winners, the sorts of tiresome culture warriors who keep referring back to Brexit having WON, by way of a social wedge?
Actually not many of them on PB these days – my old Brexit adversaries such as Philip and Mortimer seem rather gracious in victory.
But the Brextenders are OUT THERE. Goodwin is their poster boy.
Carlotta Vance: I make no claim to understand the voters of England, who after all elected loony tune Boris Johnson to PM. To be fair though, that was only on 43% of the vote and as you know, using FPTP in Scotland would give the SNP around 107 of the 129 seats even on this Savant poll ;-)
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
As Europe sticks its nose to the glass, looking in wistfully at partying Brits.
That's what you get for trying to fight Covid on the cheap, Europe.
Harsh but true.
But let’s not gloat about it, just celebrate that the U.K. has done a great job of squashing the pandemic - in the cafes, pubs and bars! It’s every Briton’s patriotic duty to spend the summer in the pub every night!
I suspect Europe will have just as good a summer as us, because they will relax restrictions to a less ultra-cautious timetable than us, and will be largely fine.
I suspect they’ll relax restrictions far too much, especially in the summer tourist resorts, and get totally screwed by it before the vaccine rollout finishes late.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
I dont think it is. I think the last week will probably mean the least in any recent by election. The postal votes will be now mostly returned. PVs are the dedicated and most likely to vote of the electorate, and i'm assuming that PVs in this election are higher than ever before.
On the ground rumour from a tory mp in Hartlepool over the weekend and earlier this week. They think they've got it. Numbers reminiscent of Copeland byelection.
Probably accurate, but a week is a long time in politics, particularly this week.
A lot of postals in these times of Covid - and they are mostly in.
I would remain very surprised if there was a Labour hold in Hartlepool even without early postal vote returns. I believe it will be rather a comfortable Conservative win too, on a low turnout. My point was, pressure on Johnson and the Conservatives does seem to be fast moving. Nonetheless, I am not sure whoever wins Hartlepool tells us very much about GE2024.
It would tell us that Labour have a big problem in places where they won in 2019 due to Farage taking votes that may have otherwise voted Tory.
And that Labour are both very lucky not to have far fewer seats and have a serious problem if they wish to stand still let alone start to claw things back.
Yes - but remember Hartlepool is a special case with that 26% BXP vote at GE19.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
Now, now, play nicely. The place is rammed with Scots and Geordies and their offspring cos of the pits so we’re super northern in these parts.
My very simple viewpoint
South of the Tees - Southern poncey North of the Tyne - there be monsters...
As a child in Scotland whose neighbours went to the outlandish extravagance of going all the way South to Whitley Bay - which as any fule no is practically on the Equator....or in the tropics, at least....
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
There's a place not far outside the York ring road where I was astounded to get charged £3.20 for two pints a couple of years back. I'm in North Yorkshire, so definitely not a southern jessie.
Not sure I'd describe Knottingley as beautiful Some nice villages thereabouts though and houses as cheap as the beer. We seriously thought about buying a house in Beal...
Carlotta Vance: I make no claim to understand the voters of England, who after all elected loony tune Boris Johnson to PM. To be fair though, that was only on 43% of the vote and as you know, using FPTP in Scotland would give the SNP around 107 of the 129 seats even on this Savant poll ;-)
But you remain convinced that:
Scottish voters won't change their views over time, while English (Welsh & Irish) evidently do?
Can we have Brextenders (other PBers might suggest a neater portmanteau) – those who are unhappy winners, the sorts of tiresome culture warriors who keep referring back to Brexit having WON, by way of a social wedge?
Actually not many of them on PB these days – my old Brexit adversaries such as Philip and Mortimer seem rather gracious in victory.
But the Brextenders are OUT THERE. Goodwin is their poster boy.
@MarqueeMark is probably the archetypal Brextender.
Can we have Brextenders (other PBers might suggest a neater portmanteau) – those who are unhappy winners, the sorts of tiresome culture warriors who keep referring back to Brexit having WON, by way of a social wedge?
Actually not many of them on PB these days – my old Brexit adversaries such as Philip and Mortimer seem rather gracious in victory.
But the Brextenders are OUT THERE. Goodwin is their poster boy.
@MarqueeMark is probably the archetypal Brextender.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
We are very much baked into the masks, screens, no entry unlesses.
But that too will pass in time.
Of course a subset of society will throw their masks on the bonfire but they will find it difficult to operate as per the status quo ante. For a while.
Me, I just want to pop into a cafe, sit down at a free table and order a decaf americano without having to fill any forms in or register.
I just did a very plez tour of Cornwall and Dorset
In several places I just sat down, asked for a cold beer, and turned my face to the sun. Bliss
Interesting - no registration, etc? Haven't seen that elsewhere.
Yes, everywhere was like that - Cornwall, Devon, Dorset. They want the business and they have basically zero Covid, so you just sit down and ask for a beer. Or a seafood lunch. No problem
Lyme Regis in particular was rammed. It was a lovely sunny day - but a workday. It felt like a particularly jubilant Bank Holiday
Likewise, a friend of mine was out in Soho last night, he reports scenes of wild hedonism
We could be heading into an epic summer
I've had beers and coffees in a few places since April 12th and have not once had to give any personal details other than those on my debit card when I pay.
Interesting I have a sample experience size of one. A cafe attached to a garden centre.
Me: Hi can I have a coffee please, that table looks free. Waitress: Please go to the front desk to register and fill out the forms. Me: Oh, ok.
Very happy if this is an isolated procedure.
Brilliant example of misunderstanding infection control. Make everyone go to one central (potentially contaminated) point to use a potentially contaminated pen to fill out a form on a potentially contaminated clipboard. Rather than let everyone sit down without passing through a central point, and having the waitperson collect the data.
I've been to a couple of pubs (once) that have had a central registration point with one pen. Needless to say that I'm not going back to either of them, but that may largely be because they tried to charge £6/pint in Oxfordshire.
My preferred watering hole has put John Smith’s up by 15p to £2 a pint. Bloody daylight robbery.
Blimey! £2 a pint? Do you live in the North or the 1990s?
There's a place not far outside the York ring road where I was astounded to get charged £3.20 for two pints a couple of years back. I'm in North Yorkshire, so definitely not a southern jessie.
Not sure I'd describe Knottingley as beautiful Some nice villages thereabouts though and houses as cheap as the beer. We seriously thought about buying a house in Beal...
North Yorkshire is where the Southern Jessies have their weekend cottages.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
@tompeckConfess I hadn’t read this in full til now. What a mess. Just imagine the atmosphere in that flat right now, actually having to live among the gold wallpaper that is bringing you down. Boris Johnson has become his own Greek myth.
If so, it would be the most boring Greek myth ever, focussing mainly on scatter cushions
My eyes glazed over as I read it. So dull. I know Remoaners like you and Tom Peck are desperate for some belated revenge on Boris, but I’d be amazed if this is it. Sturgeon survived an alleged conspiracy to jail and ruin a rival on fake rape charges, Boris will survive a confected brouhaha about decor
His reckoning will come, however. When the economy slides
The economies slide has already occurred. We're about to enter the bounceback not the slide.
Slides tend to come about once every 8-12 years. Next slide quite plausibly could be around the time of the 2033 election.
The general assumption that people are making is that the economic slide will soon be reversed, so government spending cuts and tax rises can be kept manageable.
Also, there is an assumption that social distancing measures, such as working from home and wearing masks, will continue for the forseeable future. These assumptions, which are widely held, cannot both be correct.
I think that it is too early to say that the economic contraction is over.
Social distancing ends 21 June.
If social distancing is still in place 22 June I would support letters being sent to Graham Brady.
Compulsory distancing driven by government ends on 21st June. After that it will be discretionary, and is bound to continue to an extent and in certain ways for quite a while.
Nah, people have in their heads 21 June, they have had it for months. Its set now and any government that attempts to drag that out now would be committing Seppuku.
People will keep calm and carry on until 21 June but then it is OVER. Some people will want to drag it out, but for the overwhelming majority of people the second its no longer required that will be it. No ifs, no buts, no messing around.
Its worth remembering very few people were wearing masks until they were made compulsory. The second its no longer compulsory the overwhelming majority of people will stop doing it - and almost no business will demand it because they'd be stupid to do so.
Odd to kick off with "Nah" and then agree with the post you're replying to. Is it because it's me?
Yes, compulsory distancing is indeed over on 21 June and the government will indeed not be attempting to drag it out. As to how many people will still, despite the lack of compulsion, wish to continue with stuff like masks in crowded spaces and keeping 2m away from others whilst out and about, this remains to be seen. I'm happy with how I put it - such practices will continue to an extent.
There, you've made me say everything twice. Well done.
Some people are clearly very fond of their masks. They are very definitely in a minority but not a tiny one -you will see about one in twenty people on our local high street with them on their faces. Very broadly, they tend to fall into three categories: the very scared (mostly old people who MUST have been double jabbed by now - if they're not demasking now, when will they ever?); the self-righteous-looking virtue signaller (most of the time, surely, I'm projecting here - but some people just look smug and angry when wearing a mask); and the forgetful (how can people forget they still have the horrid things on their faces? Some just do. My mother in law for one). If they must carry on, fair enough, as long as the rest of us don't have to.
I think you may indeed be projecting a touch with that "smug" there! But, yes, that's about it. And I do recommend that we don't call all these people "weirdos". And of course it will drop off in time.
Comments
And no, they are generally not celebrating his Verdun command.
*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philippe_Pétain
I'd love to have seen some proper science around their use - one town uses them and another doesn't and we compare how infections spread. I suspect their use does have some impact on viral spread - spread seems mostly through the air, not from surfaces so it makes sense. I do wonder if they are so important right now, with most MSOA areas seeing hardly any evidence of the virus, and well over 60% of adults having had at least one jab.
I’d put Nigel Formain, on here, in that category. Maybe Mr Meeks, tho he has a more severe case
‘Remainiac’ should be reserved for Remainers who have gone completely postal. Outright lunacy. A C Grayling springs to mind.
Does ‘Brexshitters’ usefully identify a type of Brexiteer? I don’t believe it does. It’s just an unfunny insult. Used by Remoaners
One of the triumphs off modern medicine is that many of these people have no outward sign of illness - they take their pills/injections and live their lives.
But curiously, the Tories are in power.....
https://www.bmj.com/company/newsroom/pregnant-women-with-covid-19-are-less-likely-to-have-symptoms-and-may-more-likely-need-intensive-care/
And yet, rationally - and rational wins, in the end - I know I am not them, and they may have 101 things going on in their heads which have lead them to the decision they have, from horrible personal experiences of losing loved ones down to the level of not actually finding masks that physically uncomfortable. Indeed, some of these people are my friends (albeit friends whom in pre-pandemic times we laughed about for being hilariously over-cautious.)
As long as post Jun 21 there is no law requiring me to wear a mask, I will be happy. And I can reenter the world and get a new pair of glasses and a mobile phone and all the other things I have been putting off doing for the best part of a year until I can do it maskless.
On another note, I plan to go to a pub tomorrow. I look forward to seeing how much or little they care about who I am. If they insist on QR codes or the NHS app, I won't be going; quite aside from any libertarian arguments, I need a new phone.
Ireland. Czechia. Sweden. Hungary. Germany. India. Russia.
🏴 103,352 1st doses / 394,152 2nd doses
🏴 6,832 / 41,682
🏴 16,023 / 17,218
NI 7,933 / 9,833
https://twitter.com/HugoGye/status/1387755330281611267
https://twitter.com/b_judah/status/1387749270154092544?s=20
Popular with commenters under Comedy Dave.
The top 3 European countries ran their own vaccination purchase schemes - the UK on its own, completely, Malta and Hungary in addition to the EU scheme.
If you want a comparison, why not pick a country that did what the SNP government advocated - like Austria or Denmark - with less than half the UK's vaccination rate.
Given the choice of either having people wear masks indoors or take half the seats out, businesses are going to choose the former all day long. Hopefully June 21st will see the end of regulations though, and it will be up to individual businesses how they want to deal with it.
I am back in the saddle as it were, and although I am picking up work which is a hangover for work we would otherwise have got last year, I don't see it compensating for work already lost. I am being pro-active (speculate to accumulate) and I am setting on a Rep to generate business that in previous years would have developed organically, through my business partners and myself being out and about.
It looks very scary to me. I know business confidence generally has never been higher, and yes one sees "career vacancies" signs all over the place, but the number of closed shops, pubs and businesses is worrying. What happens when the jobs retention scheme closes? If the V shaped recovery looks more like an "M" the politics will change too. As a natural pessimist, I don't see how we avoid a difficult few years.
Her new nickname = Carrie.
And that's cheap the stuff we want for the stairs is £140 per metre and we need 20 metres of it
I will be hitting ebay and elsewhere to hunt for offcuts
But I can’t easily see it happening.
Not unless Le Pen wins the Presidency (v v unlikely), or perhaps that Bavarian guy becomes Chancellor.
The EU sits in that bucket of “flawed, but not worth expending energy on outside an utter crisis”.
Paris prosecutors specializing in health-related investigations have opened an involuntary manslaughter probe into three deaths that occurred following Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccinations, AFP reported on Wednesday. They are taking over and combining three investigations from local prosecutors that began on a regional level following complaints from the families of the deceased.
https://www.politico.eu/article/manslaughter-probe-into-deaths-following-astrazeneca-vaccines-launched-by-french-prosecutors/
Just as well France hasn't got a problem with vaccine scepticism...
As is my profile pic.
I do the NZ thing to implicitly point out how terrible the system used in Scotland and Wales are.
It’s Blairite Labour’s fault, but they’ve saddled the two nations with disastrous systems.
Got it.
I guess Labour will be in power forever then?
I used to think the people laying it were carpeters, but I dont think they go by that.
Latest: https://trib.al/GvBZrcJ https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1387758466358468610/video/1
To be clear, I hate them. I have been putting up with slightly blurry vision for the last year and a phone with a battery which lasts less than 30 minutes, because my price of wearing a mask is very high, and I will wait until I can replace phone and glasses without having to do so. But I get that some people don't seem to mind them. Weirdos. *note tongue is in cheek!*
Brexiteer is not insulting.
I rather like Remainiac and doesn't feel like an insult to me, although can appreciate how some might take it as so.
The young do have little to lose by voting for radical change, but once people get families, stable jobs and homes they become more interested in preserving those over big risky change. It doesn't always pan out that way (see Brexit) but it's more of a factor than you think.
Enjoy your leap of unionist faith, which, again ironically, will fade to cult status :-)
I agree that if everyone - or even if a sufficiently large number of people - get their vaccine then covid has nowhere to go and dies out in the UK. (Though of course we would still get thousands of positive tests a week on current numbers of testing).
But how many people come in to the UK each day? Can we insist all of those have negative tests? Can we rely on the accuracy of those negative tests? And somewhere there has to be a frontier. Even NZ - which is much more able than us to seal itself off - kept getting cases reintroduced.
But I sense you know you've been a bit "argue for argues sake" on this point and are seeking to focus on what businesses will do. Ok. That is an interesting and important question. Will many businesses (in order to make their clientele feel ultra safe and increase turnover) impose covid restrictions even though they don't have to? I think no. I'm sure there will be pockets of it, and maybe in certain situations it might make commercial sense, but by and large - no. Post 22 June will usher in a new normal that for most things will resemble the old normal.
They like the sexual connotation.
New Zealand has an issue because it has a ~ zero antibody population.
As for ‘brexshitters’ -
‘How many Brexshitters went or are going skiing in Europe? How many own second homes there? What EU wines do they drink? We must be told.’
https://twitter.com/y_alibhai/status/947441565953388544?s=21
Cringefest
Re wierdos, agree that this is not helpful. But if people continue to drag their heels in helping get us out of this awfulness by continuing on a voluntary basis with certain virus mitigation practices then they are part of the problem. Logic and science please, not irrational maths-illiterate fear.
I had to steer Mrs Anabob away from such products. I found an almost identical version at CarpetRight for half the price...
The 60 year olds who voted for Mrs Thatcher in 1979 are now 102......
South of the Tees - Southern poncey
North of the Tyne - there be monsters...
SCOOP: @jonsnowC4 is leaving @Channel4News. Announcement from the broadcaster shortly.
https://twitter.com/amolrajan/status/1387760225437065228?s=20
I don't use either.
Sarwar will get a significant swing from Sturgeon and the SNP will likely lose Moray, Ross won it in 2019 at the general election and it is the most Leave seat in Scotland and today's Comres has a clear swing to the SCons from the SNP. As party leader Ross just stood on the list to ensure his election.
Today's poll also showed a swing from the SNP to Labour since 2016 so Labour will likely hold all their Holyrood constituency seats and gain some on the list.
Angus Robertson may well also fail to gain Edinburgh Central, Scottish Conservative voters from 2016 are more likely to vote for Sarwar's SLab if they are anti Brexit than the SNP
Actually not many of them on PB these days – my old Brexit adversaries such as Philip and Mortimer seem rather gracious in victory.
But the Brextenders are OUT THERE. Goodwin is their poster boy.
I make no claim to understand the voters of England, who after all elected loony tune Boris Johnson to PM. To be fair though, that was only on 43% of the vote and as you know, using FPTP in Scotland would give the SNP around 107 of the 129 seats even on this Savant poll ;-)
Most (72%) would be happy joining up with Scottish Greens, however
https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1387763924188254208?s=20
Not sure I'd describe Knottingley as beautiful
Scottish voters won't change their views over time, while English (Welsh & Irish) evidently do?