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I’d like to see betting markets on how many MPs and MSPs defect to Alba by the end of May – politica

SystemSystem Posts: 8,489
edited March 28 in General
I’d like to see betting markets on how many MPs and MSPs defect to Alba by the end of May – politicalbetting.com

Mr MacAskill says he intends to continue as an MP and will work with SNP group at Westminster. But he’s quit @theSNP to stand for new party. https://t.co/CZ01khrdfo

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 36,455
    England really struggling.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 57,337
    Stokes gone...game over
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732
    DavidL said:

    England really struggling.

    Unlikely to get past 250 with 3 down already.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 10,231
    DavidL said:

    England really struggling.

    Well, wouldn't expect them to provide many MSPs/MPs for Alba would we?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 57,337
    DavidL said:

    England really struggling.

    Like the Lib Dems in the polls.....
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 36,455
    I think Joanna Cherry is a bit out of the game at the moment but she is another potential defector. I agree with the thread that Holyrood defectors are less likely.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 21,432
    The vicar of Bath has been on good form lately in his war with the SNP and its autocratic bent

    Scotland needed a Mandela, instead of Nelson we got Winnie
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 9,999

    The vicar of Bath has been on good form lately in his war with the SNP and its autocratic bent

    Scotland needed a Mandela, instead of Nelson we got Winnie

    Ewing?
  • Time_to_LeaveTime_to_Leave Posts: 2,160
    I wonder what the impact will be on donors? Salmond must be well connected, and both parties presumably fishing in the same pond.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732

    I wonder what the impact will be on donors? Salmond must be well connected, and both parties presumably fishing in the same pond.

    Pretty big pond surely nowadays?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 36,455

    I wonder what the impact will be on donors? Salmond must be well connected, and both parties presumably fishing in the same pond.

    Pretty big pond surely nowadays?
    Remember 3 members of their finance committee resigned last week when Nicola's husband refused to allow them to see the accounts. There is a lot of gossip about supposedly "ringfenced" money that's been spent.
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 5,605

    "My hunch is that we won’t see that many defections at Holyrood because of the forthcoming election where it will take an astonishing level of chutzpah to fight an election under one party’s banner then defect to another shortly after being (re)elected, I think that level of chutzpah required is beyond most politicians these days."

    Chutzpah is something no politician is ever short of.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 47,568
    Imagine the fuss in the UK if the Royal Berkshire had phoned up Eton and said "send your staff round, we've got spare doses":

    https://www.politico.eu/article/irish-hospitals-vaccination-program-ended-after-it-gave-leftover-shots-to-elite-school/
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 65,174
    NI 7,329 / 3,103
    Scotland 26,902 / 17,606
    Wales 22,228 /11,920

    Yet again that's a proportionately greater day for Wales than anywhere else.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 47,568


    "My hunch is that we won’t see that many defections at Holyrood because of the forthcoming election where it will take an astonishing level of chutzpah to fight an election under one party’s banner then defect to another shortly after being (re)elected, I think that level of chutzpah required is beyond most politicians these days."

    Chutzpah is something no politician is ever short of.

    Least of all among the Scottish Nationalists......
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 29,218
    Salmond and Sturgeon/Blackford tearing chunks out of each other brings to mind Dr. Johnson's comment about disputing precedence between a louse and a flea.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 57,337
    Pulpstar said:

    NI 7,329 / 3,103
    Scotland 26,902 / 17,606
    Wales 22,228 /11,920

    Yet again that's a proportionately greater day for Wales than anywhere else.

    No figure for England?
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 29,218
    O/T I see that Tory membership is back up to 200,000.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 3,177

    Imagine the fuss in the UK if the Royal Berkshire had phoned up Eton and said "send your staff round, we've got spare doses":

    https://www.politico.eu/article/irish-hospitals-vaccination-program-ended-after-it-gave-leftover-shots-to-elite-school/

    The fuss would be much diminished, because every teacher over-50, and those with pre-existing conditions, is able to get a vaccination. In Ireland they still haven't finished vaccinating care home residents, and they only recently started on over-70s (or 75s).

    After a strong start compared to the rest of the EU, Ireland has recently been falling well behind.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732

    Imagine the fuss in the UK if the Royal Berkshire had phoned up Eton and said "send your staff round, we've got spare doses":

    https://www.politico.eu/article/irish-hospitals-vaccination-program-ended-after-it-gave-leftover-shots-to-elite-school/

    The fuss would be much diminished, because every teacher over-50, and those with pre-existing conditions, is able to get a vaccination. In Ireland they still haven't finished vaccinating care home residents, and they only recently started on over-70s (or 75s).

    After a strong start compared to the rest of the EU, Ireland has recently been falling well behind.
    Indeed. 20 leftover doses at the end of the day going to others instead wouldn't be newsworthy over here. Indeed the distribution plan assumed for the potential of leftovers going elsewhere all along.

    The problem there is how few doses there have been given out.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 57,337
    'Lack of perspective': why Ursula von der Leyen's EU vaccine strategy is failing

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/mar/28/jean-claude-juncker-and-dominic-cummings-unite-on-ursula-von-der-leyen-eu-stupid-vaccine-war

    There is strategy behind the madness?
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 3,177

    Imagine the fuss in the UK if the Royal Berkshire had phoned up Eton and said "send your staff round, we've got spare doses":

    https://www.politico.eu/article/irish-hospitals-vaccination-program-ended-after-it-gave-leftover-shots-to-elite-school/

    The fuss would be much diminished, because every teacher over-50, and those with pre-existing conditions, is able to get a vaccination. In Ireland they still haven't finished vaccinating care home residents, and they only recently started on over-70s (or 75s).

    After a strong start compared to the rest of the EU, Ireland has recently been falling well behind.
    Indeed. 20 leftover doses at the end of the day going to others instead wouldn't be newsworthy over here. Indeed the distribution plan assumed for the potential of leftovers going elsewhere all along.

    The problem there is how few doses there have been given out.
    The UK is about three-fifths of the way through first doses. Everyone still waiting for a first dose knows that there isn't much longer to go.

    In Ireland they've taken three months to do about one-seventh of first doses. I know Max and RCS are confident that the tsunami of vaccine doses is approaching, but any young teacher in Ireland could be forgiven for doing the Maths and wondering what year they will have to wait for, rather than which week or month.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 36,455

    Pulpstar said:

    NI 7,329 / 3,103
    Scotland 26,902 / 17,606
    Wales 22,228 /11,920

    Yet again that's a proportionately greater day for Wales than anywhere else.

    No figure for England?
    4 down.

    Oh, sorry.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 4,599
    fpt

    I hope people don't mind me reposting this but it was my favourite episode of Question Time.

    The pb conversation today has brought this to mind not least since two of the panellists have been mentioned on this thread.

    Question Time on the Rushdie knighthood. Christopher Hitchens was a friend of Rushdie which might explain things a bit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hmv2sL2qkIM&t=782s
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 26,443
    Sean_F said:

    Salmond and Sturgeon/Blackford tearing chunks out of each other brings to mind Dr. Johnson's comment about disputing precedence between a louse and a flea.

    Nevertheless Unionists, especially English ones, seem mightily interested in it.
    At least we can be comforted that the SCon scabies are once more relegated to irrelevance in the pecking..biting?..order.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 57,337
    DavidL said:

    Pulpstar said:

    NI 7,329 / 3,103
    Scotland 26,902 / 17,606
    Wales 22,228 /11,920

    Yet again that's a proportionately greater day for Wales than anywhere else.

    No figure for England?
    4 down.

    Oh, sorry.
    Failing harder than the EU vaccination programme...
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 27,195

    Imagine the fuss in the UK if the Royal Berkshire had phoned up Eton and said "send your staff round, we've got spare doses":

    https://www.politico.eu/article/irish-hospitals-vaccination-program-ended-after-it-gave-leftover-shots-to-elite-school/

    The fuss would be much diminished, because every teacher over-50, and those with pre-existing conditions, is able to get a vaccination. In Ireland they still haven't finished vaccinating care home residents, and they only recently started on over-70s (or 75s).

    After a strong start compared to the rest of the EU, Ireland has recently been falling well behind.
    Indeed. 20 leftover doses at the end of the day going to others instead wouldn't be newsworthy over here. Indeed the distribution plan assumed for the potential of leftovers going elsewhere all along.

    The problem there is how few doses there have been given out.
    The UK is about three-fifths of the way through first doses. Everyone still waiting for a first dose knows that there isn't much longer to go.

    In Ireland they've taken three months to do about one-seventh of first doses. I know Max and RCS are confident that the tsunami of vaccine doses is approaching, but any young teacher in Ireland could be forgiven for doing the Maths and wondering what year they will have to wait for, rather than which week or month.
    I'm confident that the tsunami is approaching the UK and US, not so sure for the EU. The vaccine that they will have most of next quarter will be AZ and that's been unfairly discredited there. The panic buying of Pfizer will work out badly for the EU as they aren't due the majority of those deliveries until H2 or 2022 but they've commited to buy them.
  • Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 3,248
    I know we have some far more genuine experts around here, so I'd be grateful for a critique of the following (my understanding of the immune system, vaccines in general, what covid does, and the covid vaccines), intended to mollify some vaccine hesitancy on the theory that knowledge dispels fear.
    And yes, I know it's probably far too long

    -------------------

    I tend to think that both vaccine hesitancy and it’s more acute cousin of antivaxxing tend to stem from fear of the unknown. Which is, to be fair, starting from a rational base: “they want to inject something into my body; I don’t know what it is or how it works…” which can easily mutate into fear.

    Nothing insulting about that: fear is natural. When used properly, it can give caution and care (technically, my caution and care in pre-flighting my microlight stems from fear of what could happen if things went wrong).

    So would it help if people had a better idea of what it involves? You see people saying “well, we don’t know what’s in them!” about the vaccines, when, in actual fact, the full details are not only well known to the MHRA, they’re published in the paperwork you receive on vaccination. It’s just that we (understandably) don’t understand the specifics.

    We have to start with how the immune system works. Which is fantastically complicated, but from what I’ve seen it seems to simplify down to this:

    Mode 1 – instant and indiscriminate

    The Immune system has two modes of operation. The first, call it “mode 1” is what it does instantly on attack. It’s called “the innate immune system”; I’m calling it “Mode 1”, and it’s a general, all-purpose assault on whatever has invaded. Ideally, it will kill it off, but for more sophisticated attacks, it buys time for Mode 2.

    Mode 1 is sort of like spraying the affected area with weed-killer. Killing off everything there with an all-purpose chemical warfare-style approach. Bad news for your cells in the area, but given how viruses can replicate exponentially, better to sacrifice a few cells than, well, all of them in the long run. It’s the bit where you feel really crappy, because, well, part of your body is now a battleground, your immune system is literally hurting yourself as well as the virus (which is also hurting you), but it’s doing it to prevent worse damage happening.

    Mode 2 – slower, but targeted

    While it’s spraying interferon, or interleukin, or whatever the technical names are, the scout components of Mode 2 (the adaptive immune system) are busily at work. They scope out the area to see what’s new and unrecognised, and they seize protein chains from it. Scurrying back, these helper T-cells engage the floating antibody factories that we call “B-cells” to try out production of tailored “antibodies” that are like floating gummi-bears; targeting some of these proteins in the hope of gumming up whatever the virus uses to enter your cells.


    (1/5)
  • Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 3,248
    Meanwhile, other helper T-cells round up the grizzled veteran fighters we call killer T-cells and hand out these chunks of protein (called “epitopes” and tell them “if you see these, it’s virus.” Like a group of Judge Dredd types (no doubt grunting, “I AM the immunity”) the T-cells swing into action. Floating into the war zone, they each go door-to-door on your cells, order them to open up, and they cross-check the protein chains they see within them with their handy list of epitopes they now have. If they don’t find any, they mutter something like “mind how you go, sir” (NB This may not be strictly how it goes), and go next door. When they find one, they slam the door and press the irreisitible “self-destruct” button on the cell, which takes it down with all within it. Again, harsh on your cells, but at least now it’s perfectly targeted. You’ve got billions of these cells and it’s only a problem if you let the virus go exponential to the stage where it can get through billions of them.

    When things go wrong

    With Covid, and without any inherent immunity (with “naïve” immune systems), you’ll take time to get Mode 2 into action, and while that’s happening, your Mode 1 and the virus are carrying out pitched warfare through your own system. And in some cases, Mode 2 takes quite a while to get going, for whatever reason (it’s worse the older you get).

    In the unfortunate cases where Mode 1 itself is slow to swing into action, and then Mode 2 is slower still, the virus gets strong purchase and Mode 1 attacks get wider and wider-spread. And keep escalating while the laggard Mode 2 is trying to work out what to do. Turning whole swathes of your body into a blasted wasteland (usually starting in your lungs as that’s where the virus gets its first purchase, but if it managed to get further into your system, possibly other organs as well). And you get the severe cases, and even, sadly, deaths.

    When things go right

    When things go right, the B-cells are churning out antibodies that perfectly hook onto the spike the coronavirus uses to attack your cells. Rendering it inert and useless; your body is sterile ground for the virus without causing any damage to your system. This is “sterilising immunity”.

    If some viruses get through (maybe through high viral loads), your patrolling killer T-cells are already in the area, and just when the virus thinks it’s getting somewhere, the cells it’s hijacked to reproduce itself go dark and offline. It can’t reproduce. You may have been asymptomatic, you may have been mildly ill if it managed to get going a bit before being fought back, but the amount of Mode 1 indiscriminate chemical warfare needed was minimal.
    (2/5)
  • Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 3,248
    Unfortunately, this takes time, so the ideal way of doing things just written is very rarely going to happen, unless you are lucky enough to have had a very good adaptive immunity, or had the right helper T-cells happen to be in the right area, and have your B-cells hit upon a good recipe for antibodies quickly out of sheer luck. Or, of course, if you’ve had it already.

    Or if you change the goalposts on the virus, and get the Mode 2 response ready before it even gets a chance to infect you.

    Sometimes the antibody levels wane over time (because churning out loads of them forever when you’re not being attacked is unnecessary), but the recipes are still there in the B-cells, and your T-cells have the epitopes directly to hand. A fresh invasion can kick up a new Mode 2 response far faster than when you didn’t have all this ready, massivley reducing the chances of a worst-case serious illness.

    Vaccines

    This is our way of changing the game on the virus. We train the adaptive immune system before the virus hits, so that ideal response is not rare, or unlikely, but the common default.

    There are multiple ways to do this. Most of us have vague memories of being told how the first vaccines were produced, using lighter and less dangerous versions of the actual viruses (cowpox instead of smallpox, for example). You could isolate the virus and pass it under unfavourable conditions until it liked those conditions better than humans – weakening it artificially – and then introduce it. Or you could grow the virus, and chemically kill it before introducing it, so it’s floating about in your system (all inert) but looks dodgy enough for your system to do something against it – because you could always be worried about the former way of doing things as you are, you know, literally infecting people with the actual virus, even if it’s weakened. If they have a compromised immune system, or you’ve got it a bit wrong, it’s bad news.

    With the inactivated (killed) virus way of doing things, you needed an “adjuvant” – which is a chemical attached to effectively blare a trumpet that “YOU’RE BEING ATTACKED” and startle your immune system (both halves) into action.

    (As an aside, it’s this adjuvant that causes the fluey negative side-effects. Your innate immune system, startled, swings into action briefly before concluding it’s all okay. In some people, it does it with less fanfare (without spilling its pint) and not causing you to feel crappy; in others, it gets more startled and goes a little overboard for a day or two).

    (3/5)
  • Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 3,248
    Current vaccines

    These days, though, we can do it better and at even less risk. We have the adenovector vaccines (like Oxford/Astrazeneca, or the Johnson & Johnson, or the Sputnik) which take a chimpanzee adenovirus that doesn’t even infect humans, biologically castrate it anyway to turn any risk of replication from “deeply deeply implausible” to “just nope” and glue whatever bits of the virus you wish to vaccinate against to the outside. Basically, disguise it as the coronavirus (but the fake version simply cannot do any damage to you), with the spike protein on the outside, and pre-produced epitopes of the rest of it glued onto it.

    (NB – I think they don’t actually use glue…)

    This gets introduced (together with that adjuvant to alert your immune system), and away you go.

    Or you can just introduce the spike protein and the epitopes attached to smaller particles – protein-based vaccines, like Novavax. Plus that adjuvant.

    Or, using music analogues, now we’ve gone from wax cylinders (similar viruses) through vinyl (attenuated viruses) and tape (dead viruses) to CDs (adenovectors) and minidiscs (protein-based), to just sending in the information itself. The mp3 version – RNA vaccines – that just use the messaging system to tell the immune system what’s happening and what to look out for. While the safety profile of this was great, there were questions on whether it would actually be efficacious. Questions answered by November last year in the “hell, yeah!” results.

    Although some people see the “mRNA” bit, decide it looks a lot like “DNA”, remember that’s something to do with genetics, and decide you’re genetically modifying your cells. Which is completely untrue – the mRNA can’t live long, can’t change you – it’s just messenger nucleic acids. That’s literally what the “m” stands for. Literally the only thing they worry about is that the lipids they use can, in rare circumstances, cause an allergic reaction to people very susceptible to allergens (and they’re on the lookout for that).

    (4/5)
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 37,509

    Imagine the fuss in the UK if the Royal Berkshire had phoned up Eton and said "send your staff round, we've got spare doses":

    https://www.politico.eu/article/irish-hospitals-vaccination-program-ended-after-it-gave-leftover-shots-to-elite-school/

    The fuss would be much diminished, because every teacher over-50, and those with pre-existing conditions, is able to get a vaccination. In Ireland they still haven't finished vaccinating care home residents, and they only recently started on over-70s (or 75s).

    After a strong start compared to the rest of the EU, Ireland has recently been falling well behind.
    At least one centre near Stafford did ring up a local school - not mine - and say, ‘we’ve got leftover doses, bring your staff.’
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 57,337
    edited March 28
    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1376138247487647746?s=19

    I saw this and thought, really, come on, £2/hr....and of course its horseshit. I actually think the likes of Deliveroo approach is unfair in the sense of it is quite opaque how much you will make given it is a combination of different amounts per order, different multiplers and bonus "quests"...but campaigners don't do themselves any favours with repeating total bollocks.

    If somebody was really only getting £2/hr, they wouldn't be doing this, would they...like come on.

    What the BIJ idiots don't understand is a) log in / out of an app doesn't equal time working and b) most people deliver for multiple apps at the same time, so they are logged in, but actively rejecting jobs from one as they are busy on a different job.

    The push for a guaranteed minimum wage might actually cut pay if you can't multi-app, which I think might be the solution these companies go down.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 37,509

    DavidL said:

    Pulpstar said:

    NI 7,329 / 3,103
    Scotland 26,902 / 17,606
    Wales 22,228 /11,920

    Yet again that's a proportionately greater day for Wales than anywhere else.

    No figure for England?
    4 down.

    Oh, sorry.
    Failing harder than the EU vaccination programme...
    If England lose by less than a hundred runs, they’ll have done well.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732

    DavidL said:

    Pulpstar said:

    NI 7,329 / 3,103
    Scotland 26,902 / 17,606
    Wales 22,228 /11,920

    Yet again that's a proportionately greater day for Wales than anywhere else.

    No figure for England?
    4 down.

    Oh, sorry.
    Failing harder than the EU vaccination programme...
    Now, now be fair.

    The batsmen are already a third of the way to the target. Will take months for the EU programme to get to a third done.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 17,057

    fpt

    I hope people don't mind me reposting this but it was my favourite episode of Question Time.

    The pb conversation today has brought this to mind not least since two of the panellists have been mentioned on this thread.

    Question Time on the Rushdie knighthood. Christopher Hitchens was a friend of Rushdie which might explain things a bit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hmv2sL2qkIM&t=782s

    Blimey, what an utter disgrace Williams was. Haven't watched QT in years, though it was once a decent programme.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732

    fpt

    I hope people don't mind me reposting this but it was my favourite episode of Question Time.

    The pb conversation today has brought this to mind not least since two of the panellists have been mentioned on this thread.

    Question Time on the Rushdie knighthood. Christopher Hitchens was a friend of Rushdie which might explain things a bit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hmv2sL2qkIM&t=782s

    Don't particularly fancy watching an hour long repeat. Which snippet of it are you referring to?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 47,568
    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 57,337
    edited March 28

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    The French claim a different target every other week.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 64,175

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    I can believe in April they might go quicker than us, if they are having lots of supplies coming and we know we have less.

    But that prediction is implausible to say the least.
  • Time_to_LeaveTime_to_Leave Posts: 2,160
    edited March 28
    kle4 said:

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    I can believe in April they might go quicker than us, if they are having lots of supplies coming and we know we have less.

    But that prediction is implausible to say the least.
    In fairness, with each passing day they are encouraging their citizens to reject the vaccine and reducing the numbers of people willing to get done. They might have everyone who wants one done by Tuesday.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 65,174
    DavidL said:

    Pulpstar said:

    NI 7,329 / 3,103
    Scotland 26,902 / 17,606
    Wales 22,228 /11,920

    Yet again that's a proportionately greater day for Wales than anywhere else.

    No figure for England?
    4 down.

    Oh, sorry.
    England 367,393 201,335

    https://twitter.com/HugoGye/status/1376172470978420736 By Hugo's count
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 10,231

    Sean_F said:

    Salmond and Sturgeon/Blackford tearing chunks out of each other brings to mind Dr. Johnson's comment about disputing precedence between a louse and a flea.

    Nevertheless Unionists, especially English ones, seem mightily interested in it.
    At least we can be comforted that the SCon scabies are once more relegated to irrelevance in the pecking..biting?..order.
    One wonders who the ringworm are/is.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 21,432

    Imagine the fuss in the UK if the Royal Berkshire had phoned up Eton and said "send your staff round, we've got spare doses":

    https://www.politico.eu/article/irish-hospitals-vaccination-program-ended-after-it-gave-leftover-shots-to-elite-school/

    The fuss would be much diminished, because every teacher over-50, and those with pre-existing conditions, is able to get a vaccination. In Ireland they still haven't finished vaccinating care home residents, and they only recently started on over-70s (or 75s).

    After a strong start compared to the rest of the EU, Ireland has recently been falling well behind.
    Indeed. 20 leftover doses at the end of the day going to others instead wouldn't be newsworthy over here. Indeed the distribution plan assumed for the potential of leftovers going elsewhere all along.

    The problem there is how few doses there have been given out.
    The UK is about three-fifths of the way through first doses. Everyone still waiting for a first dose knows that there isn't much longer to go.

    In Ireland they've taken three months to do about one-seventh of first doses. I know Max and RCS are confident that the tsunami of vaccine doses is approaching, but any young teacher in Ireland could be forgiven for doing the Maths and wondering what year they will have to wait for, rather than which week or month.
    Brits to blame, obviously
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    To be rather morbid, maybe he means France will have caught up on Covid deaths.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,204

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 40,100
    I think it is safe to say he will be going upwards in the July reshuffle.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732

    I think it is safe to say he will be going upwards in the July reshuffle.
    Definitely more deserving to be in the Cabinet than Williamson.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 4,599

    fpt

    I hope people don't mind me reposting this but it was my favourite episode of Question Time.

    The pb conversation today has brought this to mind not least since two of the panellists have been mentioned on this thread.

    Question Time on the Rushdie knighthood. Christopher Hitchens was a friend of Rushdie which might explain things a bit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hmv2sL2qkIM&t=782s

    Don't particularly fancy watching an hour long repeat. Which snippet of it are you referring to?
    It's the opening bit. Williams/Hitchens C
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 37,509
    England now screwed.

    Does Dinesh Karthik post on PB?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 37,509

    I think it is safe to say he will be going upwards in the July reshuffle.
    Definitely more deserving to be in the Cabinet than Williamson.
    So are Larry, Palmerston and my niece’s gerbils.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 53,051

    I think it is safe to say he will be going upwards in the July reshuffle.
    And some were saying his appointment meant the rollout was doomed.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732
    In the words of Leonard Hofstadter England are "attached to another object by an inclined plane wrapped helically around an axis".
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 1,781

    I think it is safe to say he will be going upwards in the July reshuffle.
    Indeed, appointed to a job more or less guaranteed to take loads of plaudits at a point in time when the heavy lifting was largely done, now getting to front the good news PR - you don't get given that job if the boss doesn't like you already.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 37,509
    That’s nothing to do with race. It’s to cover up the fact they and their students can’t read music.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 57,337
    edited March 28
    Gardening, architecture, music....all racialist....
  • RobDRobD Posts: 53,051
    Teaching music symbols makes one complicit in white supremacy?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 57,337
    edited March 28
    RobD said:

    Teaching music symbols makes one complicit in white supremacy?
    Its also cultural appropriation to learn a foreign language....
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732
    6 down.

    Fat lady is warming up her vocal chords.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 65,174
    RobD said:

    I think it is safe to say he will be going upwards in the July reshuffle.
    And some were saying his appointment meant the rollout was doomed.
    It became very obvious very quickly why Zahawi was a good choice for the role.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 37,509
    What’s frustrating is that England are scoring at the required rate, but are playing daft shots as though they require 15 an over.
  • felixfelix Posts: 12,607

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
    It's almost sad to think how he used to be lauded on here for his freshness and statesmanlike stature - now we have the mean spirited small minded nationalist unable to disguise his jealous hatred of a neighbour. Utterly contemptible.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 37,509
    felix said:

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
    It's almost sad to think how he used to be lauded on here for his freshness and statesmanlike stature - now we have the mean spirited small minded nationalist unable to disguise his jealous hatred of a neighbour. Utterly contemptible.
    And he’s still better than Marine Le Pen.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732
    ydoethur said:

    felix said:

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
    It's almost sad to think how he used to be lauded on here for his freshness and statesmanlike stature - now we have the mean spirited small minded nationalist unable to disguise his jealous hatred of a neighbour. Utterly contemptible.
    And he’s still better than Marine Le Pen.
    Why?

    The creatures outside looked from Macron to Le Pen, and from Le Pen to Macron, and from Macron to Le Pen again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 57,337

    6 down.

    Fat lady is warming up her vocal chords.

    Good job England bat deep ;-)
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732

    6 down.

    Fat lady is warming up her vocal chords.

    Good job England bat deep ;-)
    Well indeed. A century partnership now would only leave us needing another 70 from the last three wickets (!)
  • BalrogBalrog Posts: 116
    RobD said:

    Teaching music symbols makes one complicit in white supremacy?
    I once saw an advert in new scientist for someone to teach electronics in a non-racist, non-sexist way. It was probably in the 80s and I think for a college in Harringay.

    I always wondered how they would cope with the colour coding scheme used to label component values. It goes something like black(0), brown(1), red (2), orange, yellow, green, blue, ... white (I can't remember the bits in the middle)
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 40,100
    maaarsh said:

    I think it is safe to say he will be going upwards in the July reshuffle.
    Indeed, appointed to a job more or less guaranteed to take loads of plaudits at a point in time when the heavy lifting was largely done, now getting to front the good news PR - you don't get given that job if the boss doesn't like you already.
    "the heavy lifting was largely done"

    eh?

    When he started the job, how many had been actually vaccinated?

    There may have been a well worked out theory plan, but the Germans had a very well worked out plan (see today's Observer) and they are failing.

  • alex_alex_ Posts: 5,023

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    Given that last week they raided an AstraZeneca site that had 29 million doses, none of which were intended for the UK, it's a bit of a mystery how they manage to express such certainty about where the UK is getting its vaccines from.

    Dare i suggest that the UK government might be deliberately feeding/"leaking" them faulty information to confuse them? (and possibly keep them from targeting Pfizer...). After all if we are on the sly utilising double agents to secretly tell them that we are getting all our AZ from Europe, when we really aren't getting any, then it prevents them looking elsewhere for export bans. It would certainly explain a lot of their increasingly bizarre statements and public behaviour.

    Whilst the UK keeps rocketing on setting new records for first doses, giving very little indication whatsoever that we need to hold them back for second doses.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 47,568

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
    And they've got other problems:


  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 57,337
    edited March 28

    maaarsh said:

    I think it is safe to say he will be going upwards in the July reshuffle.
    Indeed, appointed to a job more or less guaranteed to take loads of plaudits at a point in time when the heavy lifting was largely done, now getting to front the good news PR - you don't get given that job if the boss doesn't like you already.
    "the heavy lifting was largely done"

    eh?

    When he started the job, how many had been actually vaccinated?

    There may have been a well worked out theory plan, but the Germans had a very well worked out plan (see today's Observer) and they are failing.

    Furthermore, with supply so lumpy, the whole operation is a moving target. Remember the initial plans were made with presumption AZN would have made 30 million doses by the end of the year.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 37,509
    If England were two down with this score at this stage, they would win easily.

    With so many wickets having been thrown away, India will walk it.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 17,057
    @FrankBooth - thanks for posting that QT episode, really worth watching in full. Very sad that we lost Christopher Hitchens at such a young age. And I say that as someone who probably disagreed with him more than agreed with him during that episode.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 36,890

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
    And they've got other problems
    If you look at the detail of France's numbers, it's unbelievable that Macron is still dithering about a lockdown while boasting about their position vis-à-vis the UK.
  • Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 7,850

    I'm surprised nobody has yet objected to Snooker as being racist: A white ball being used to knock about all the coloured balls, with bonus points for getting black down as often as you can.

    Chess is an obvious target. White always moves first, black second.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 37,509
    alex_ said:

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    Given that last week they raided an AstraZeneca site that had 29 million doses, none of which were intended for the UK, it's a bit of a mystery how they manage to express such certainty about where the UK is getting its vaccines from.

    Dare i suggest that the UK government might be deliberately feeding/"leaking" them faulty information to confuse them? (and possibly keep them from targeting Pfizer...). After all if we are on the sly utilising double agents to secretly tell them that we are getting all our AZ from Europe, when we really aren't getting any, then it prevents them looking elsewhere for export bans. It would certainly explain a lot of their increasingly bizarre statements and public behaviour.

    Whilst the UK keeps rocketing on setting new records for first doses, giving very little indication whatsoever that we need to hold them back for second doses.
    You have a very optimistic view of the ability of our intelligence services.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
    And they've got other problems
    If you look at the detail of France's numbers, it's unbelievable that Macron is still dithering about a lockdown while boasting about their position vis-à-vis the UK.
    Can anyone please explain why France's death toll is so relatively low, considering they've had more cases than the UK?

    Is it that their healthcare system has done better than the NHS?

    Or have the demographics of the cases been different?
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 5,023
    The other funny thing about the EU/France going on about whether the UK will manage to provide second doses "within 12 weeks" is that, er - wasn't 12 weeks an entirely UK produced figure? I'm not sure that 12 weeks is a figure that comes from vaccine makers (certainly not Pfizer, and probably not AZ).

    European politicians seem to be under the impression that every individual not getting their second dose within 12 weeks will, at a minimum, be totally unprotected at that point, and are making it sound almost as if they will simply drop dead!

    Whereas in reality it's a sliding level of declining protection (although it appears far more in the case of Pfizer, rather than AZ). And once the second dose is in, the booster is there. European politicians seem to think that if you miss the second dose you need to have two more.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 14,627

    The vicar of Bath has been on good form lately in his war with the SNP and its autocratic bent

    Scotland needed a Mandela, instead of Nelson we got Winnie

    Ewing?
    The pooh?
  • eekeek Posts: 11,738

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
    And they've got other problems
    If you look at the detail of France's numbers, it's unbelievable that Macron is still dithering about a lockdown while boasting about their position vis-à-vis the UK.
    Can anyone please explain why France's death toll is so relatively low, considering they've had more cases than the UK?

    Is it that their healthcare system has done better than the NHS?

    Or have the demographics of the cases been different?
    Lies, damned lies and statistics.

    Basically the only figure that you can trust for cross country comparisons will be excess deaths.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 37,509

    I'm surprised nobody has yet objected to Snooker as being racist: A white ball being used to knock about all the coloured balls, with bonus points for getting black down as often as you can.

    Chess is an obvious target. White always moves first, black second.
    Very sexist as well. Only female piece is the Queen (assuming that’s not the only gay character, of course) and she has to do all the work and yet is much less important than the King.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732
    eek said:

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
    And they've got other problems
    If you look at the detail of France's numbers, it's unbelievable that Macron is still dithering about a lockdown while boasting about their position vis-à-vis the UK.
    Can anyone please explain why France's death toll is so relatively low, considering they've had more cases than the UK?

    Is it that their healthcare system has done better than the NHS?

    Or have the demographics of the cases been different?
    Lies, damned lies and statistics.

    Basically the only figure that you can trust for cross country comparisons will be excess deaths.
    That was my first guess but France's excess death toll matches their official one too, so that doesn't answer it: https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/coronavirus-excess-deaths-tracker

    Its very puzzling, France genuinely seems to have a much lower CFR than the UK and I've no idea why.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 37,509
    eek said:

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
    And they've got other problems
    If you look at the detail of France's numbers, it's unbelievable that Macron is still dithering about a lockdown while boasting about their position vis-à-vis the UK.
    Can anyone please explain why France's death toll is so relatively low, considering they've had more cases than the UK?

    Is it that their healthcare system has done better than the NHS?

    Or have the demographics of the cases been different?
    Lies, damned lies and statistics.

    Basically the only figure that you can trust for cross country comparisons will be excess deaths.
    Although even on that measure, they’re doing better than we are.

    https://www.cebm.net/covid-19/excess-mortality-across-countries-in-2020/

    I would wonder if it’s the climate meaning they spend more time outdoors, but that hasn’t helped Italy or Spain.
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 1,084

    eek said:

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
    And they've got other problems
    If you look at the detail of France's numbers, it's unbelievable that Macron is still dithering about a lockdown while boasting about their position vis-à-vis the UK.
    Can anyone please explain why France's death toll is so relatively low, considering they've had more cases than the UK?

    Is it that their healthcare system has done better than the NHS?

    Or have the demographics of the cases been different?
    Lies, damned lies and statistics.

    Basically the only figure that you can trust for cross country comparisons will be excess deaths.
    That was my first guess but France's excess death toll matches their official one too, so that doesn't answer it: https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/coronavirus-excess-deaths-tracker

    Its very puzzling, France genuinely seems to have a much lower CFR than the UK and I've no idea why.
    What’s the general health of their population? I’m taking a guess that they have a lower number of obese individuals..
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 5,023

    eek said:

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
    And they've got other problems
    If you look at the detail of France's numbers, it's unbelievable that Macron is still dithering about a lockdown while boasting about their position vis-à-vis the UK.
    Can anyone please explain why France's death toll is so relatively low, considering they've had more cases than the UK?

    Is it that their healthcare system has done better than the NHS?

    Or have the demographics of the cases been different?
    Lies, damned lies and statistics.

    Basically the only figure that you can trust for cross country comparisons will be excess deaths.
    That was my first guess but France's excess death toll matches their official one too, so that doesn't answer it: https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/coronavirus-excess-deaths-tracker

    Its very puzzling, France genuinely seems to have a much lower CFR than the UK and I've no idea why.
    Maybe they normally have huge numbers of people dying from flu, so their excess deaths don't look so bad by its disappearance this year...
  • JonathanDJonathanD Posts: 2,385
    Floater said:
    Defacto they must have otherwise there would be no nonsense about 'April being 2nd dose month'. They would have shipped them to the UK and kept vaccinating the +40s.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 27,641
    edited March 28
    I think a note of caution is needed here.

    Our case rates/deaths/hospitalisations are all super low which is great. Our vaccine programme is heading to the moon.

    Meanwhile we point our fingers and laugh at the EU countries with their spiralling case rates and new lockdowns.

    However. We have been locked down for three months. Nothing open. Nothing allowed. Virtually. I don't think this has been the case in most of Europe.

    Vaccine efficacy is somewhere over 90%. That means that when we come out of lockdown, plenty of people will get this disease.

    The two things that are giving me some degree of comfort are Israel and schools having been back without an explosion of cases.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 52,732
    alex_ said:

    eek said:

    Really?

    France’s vaccination rollout will have caught up with the UK’s “in a few weeks”, the country’s president Emmanuel Macron has said amid tensions over vaccine supplies.

    At present, 11.45% of French people have received at least one vaccine, compared with 43.79% of Britons.

    However, Macron told Le Journal du Dimanche newspaper that France had significantly stepped up the pace of its vaccine drive and said the UK’s rollout would slow down soon.

    “In a few weeks we will have completely caught up with the British, who will meanwhile be increasingly dependent on us to vaccinate their population,” he said, referring to AstraZeneca supplies produced in the EU.


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/28/coronavirus-live-news-germany-risks-losing-control-of-covid-brazil-deaths-top-3000-for-second-day?page=with:block-606084398f08774d1beac794#block-606084398f08774d1beac794

    That's just embarrassing. As of today, we're about to hit 50 doses per 100; France is closing in on 15...
    And they've got other problems
    If you look at the detail of France's numbers, it's unbelievable that Macron is still dithering about a lockdown while boasting about their position vis-à-vis the UK.
    Can anyone please explain why France's death toll is so relatively low, considering they've had more cases than the UK?

    Is it that their healthcare system has done better than the NHS?

    Or have the demographics of the cases been different?
    Lies, damned lies and statistics.

    Basically the only figure that you can trust for cross country comparisons will be excess deaths.
    That was my first guess but France's excess death toll matches their official one too, so that doesn't answer it: https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/coronavirus-excess-deaths-tracker

    Its very puzzling, France genuinely seems to have a much lower CFR than the UK and I've no idea why.
    Maybe they normally have huge numbers of people dying from flu, so their excess deaths don't look so bad by its disappearance this year...
    Though they have more over 65s as a share of population.

    Obesity could explain it, they're the least obese OECD nation with the UK one of the most.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 53,051
    JonathanD said:

    Floater said:
    Defacto they must have otherwise there would be no nonsense about 'April being 2nd dose month'. They would have shipped them to the UK and kept vaccinating the +40s.
    Wasn't that due to a change in the schedule from the orders from India?
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