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The last 12 hours on the £420m Betfair next President market – politicalbetting.com

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    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,186
    Here's where I think we might end up. As I say, I favour Trump to win, but I am more bullish about Biden than I was.


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    My one concern is that most places had school half term either last week or the week before, and that might have given a temporary reduction in R.
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Off-topic but interesting. Argos & Currys are not closing their stores. Instead you will be able to do click and collect. Described to me as a "grey area" they are exploiting. Punters will not be allowed to enter stores, supposedly they are going to stick up a marquee in the car park to hand over orders...

    That doesn't sound like a grey area. Click and collect is specifically allowed.
    Wasn't Argos always click and collect?

    "Shopping for people used to signing on" as Jo Caufield used to rather caustically put it.
    Argos is an amazing operation who web wise has been miles ahead of the competition. Their pioneering of click and collect was a revolution.

    There's a reason Sainsburys bought them up.
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    MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688

    /blockquote>

    Tim Spector is always encouraging.

    Except when he's too busy flogging his clients' data to Sam Cam for profit

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    Mal557Mal557 Posts: 662
    Yes Nate's summary pretty much tallies with what Ralston is seeing, it will be close though. But those 75K postal votes in Clark County will favour Biden , mail ballots are going about 2-1 for him
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    IanB2 said:

    If remaining Penn votes go 70:30 for Biden then he edges it by my quick and dirty calc.

    The cities appear to be about 75:25, but not all the outstanding votes are from the cities
    It's even higher in the cities. The Current breakdown of Early Vote is 78/20 to Biden and I'm seeing precincts with 85%+ going to Biden.

    The crux is how low the figure goes in the deep red parts of the State.
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    MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688

    MrEd said:

    Pulpstar said:

    MrEd said:

    Morning everyone.

    Quick question / point. Just looked at the NYT website re Wisconsin. From what I can see Biden has a 9K lead but the counties where there are still substantial amounts of votes left are all heavily Republican with the Democrat areas pretty much voted.

    Have I missed something?

    Method of vote (Mail in) favours Biden everywhere. Opposite in Nevada & Arizona (Counting in person)
    Thx everyone. Makes sense.

    On that basis, I think there is a good chance Trump wins AZ but will be close.

    Also expect the Trump campaign to question the validity of the Milwaukee mail in vote and claim fraud.

    NV i think will be Biden given Ralston’s remarks but he has been proved to have missed how close it will be.

    NC should be Trump. GA should be Biden. I’m not sure re MI and PA.


    Fox and the AP have called AZ for Biden.
    Yep Biden has Arizona and Nevada.

    Not by a lot, but he has them
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    "There are dark days right around the corner.....

    https://twitter.com/DavidHerdson/status/1323940803702640645?s=20
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    Barnesian said:

    I have had a look at the five remaining swing states and the probability of Biden taking them based on Betfair latest price.

    Georgia 42%
    Wisconsin 79%
    Michigan 61%
    Penn 37%
    Nevada 67%

    There are 32 B/T combinations of these 5 states.
    Of these 32 combinations, 16 give Biden 270+ ECs.
    I have computed the probabilities of each combination (ignoring correlation between states which I think is less important at this counting stage) and the probability that Biden finds a winning path is 66%. I have checked that all the combinations add up to 100%.

    It is based on assumption that Biden has 238 "in the bag" including NE2. I think that is right.
    Without NE2 it drops to 48%.

    I note that Biden is at currently 1.83 (55%) on Betfair.

    EDIT Now 1.73 (58%)

    It really scares me that this could end up 270-268. In theory Biden has then won but you only need 1 idiot in the EC to throw it to the house. This could so end up as Bush vs. Gore on steroids.

    I think Casino Royale was wise to take a small profit.
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    No more NV results until 9am tomorrow apparently.
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    alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    edited November 2020
    Does anyone know the actual situation in Michigan at the moment? Why does the Decision Desk HQ twitter feed vary from it's website?
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,749
    edited November 2020

    I'm irritated if I lose my bet with HYUFD, not because I'm disappointed at losing to HYUFD (credit to him if he wins) but because in my head I was going to buy myself Crusader Kings III with the winnings.

    Bah!

    What was the bet?
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    Mal557Mal557 Posts: 662

    MrEd said:

    Pulpstar said:

    MrEd said:

    Morning everyone.

    Quick question / point. Just looked at the NYT website re Wisconsin. From what I can see Biden has a 9K lead but the counties where there are still substantial amounts of votes left are all heavily Republican with the Democrat areas pretty much voted.

    Have I missed something?

    Method of vote (Mail in) favours Biden everywhere. Opposite in Nevada & Arizona (Counting in person)
    Thx everyone. Makes sense.

    On that basis, I think there is a good chance Trump wins AZ but will be close.

    Also expect the Trump campaign to question the validity of the Milwaukee mail in vote and claim fraud.

    NV i think will be Biden given Ralston’s remarks but he has been proved to have missed how close it will be.

    NC should be Trump. GA should be Biden. I’m not sure re MI and PA.


    Fox and the AP have called AZ for Biden.
    Yep Biden has Arizona and Nevada.

    Not by a lot, but he has them
    So if as seems quite possible now he wins WI , he needs GA , MI or PA to win?
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    kjhkjh Posts: 10,668
    In a different universe where the Rust Belt counted early and the South was the next day and with the same result we would have all gone to bed and woken up thinking Biden had won a landslide and then it would have started to tighten. Weird thought.
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    "There are dark days right around the corner.....

    https://twitter.com/DavidHerdson/status/1323940803702640645?s=20

    Not to forget a likely GOP Senate who are going to have zero qualms about being disruptive.
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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,083

    No more NV results until 9am tomorrow apparently.

    Is that 9am tomorrow as in 9am Wednesday, or 9am tomorrow as in 9am Thursday?
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    kicorsekicorse Posts: 431
    Barnesian said:

    I have had a look at the five remaining swing states and the probability of Biden taking them based on Betfair latest price.

    Georgia 42%
    Wisconsin 79%
    Michigan 61%
    Penn 37%
    Nevada 67%

    There are 32 B/T combinations of these 5 states.
    Of these 32 combinations, 16 give Biden 270+ ECs.
    I have computed the probabilities of each combination (ignoring correlation between states which I think is less important at this counting stage) and the probability that Biden finds a winning path is 66%. I have checked that all the combinations add up to 100%.

    It is based on assumption that Biden has 238 "in the bag" including NE2. I think that is right.
    Without NE2 it drops to 48%.

    I note that Biden is at currently 1.83 (55%) on Betfair.

    EDIT Now 1.73 (58%)

    Nice calculation. For me too much of the 8% could be accounted for by correlations and un-in-the-bagness of the 238 (e.g. ABC still not projecting AZ) to bet off of it, but still very useful.
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    isamisam Posts: 40,971
    Have we seen the final Betfair crossover?
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,749

    No more NV results until 9am tomorrow apparently.

    So from 17:00 GMT today?

    What's wrong with these people - can't they stay up all night like the rest of us?!
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,094

    Barnesian said:

    I have had a look at the five remaining swing states and the probability of Biden taking them based on Betfair latest price.

    Georgia 42%
    Wisconsin 79%
    Michigan 61%
    Penn 37%
    Nevada 67%

    There are 32 B/T combinations of these 5 states.
    Of these 32 combinations, 16 give Biden 270+ ECs.
    I have computed the probabilities of each combination (ignoring correlation between states which I think is less important at this counting stage) and the probability that Biden finds a winning path is 66%. I have checked that all the combinations add up to 100%.

    It is based on assumption that Biden has 238 "in the bag" including NE2. I think that is right.
    Without NE2 it drops to 48%.

    I note that Biden is at currently 1.83 (55%) on Betfair.

    EDIT Now 1.73 (58%)

    It really scares me that this could end up 270-268. In theory Biden has then won but you only need 1 idiot in the EC to throw it to the house. This could so end up as Bush vs. Gore on steroids.

    I think Casino Royale was wise to take a small profit.
    I don't buy the faithless electors scenario because presumably you'd just get tit for tat if they did that?
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    Can we all agree that while the Electoral College is a pretty crappy way of choosing the most important elected official on the entire planet, it makes for insanely entertaining elections.
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,094

    No more NV results until 9am tomorrow apparently.

    Is that 9am tomorrow as in 9am Wednesday, or 9am tomorrow as in 9am Thursday?

    Thursday – it's absolutely ridiculous.
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    Barnesian said:

    I have had a look at the five remaining swing states and the probability of Biden taking them based on Betfair latest price.

    Georgia 42%
    Wisconsin 79%
    Michigan 61%
    Penn 37%
    Nevada 67%

    There are 32 B/T combinations of these 5 states.
    Of these 32 combinations, 16 give Biden 270+ ECs.
    I have computed the probabilities of each combination (ignoring correlation between states which I think is less important at this counting stage) and the probability that Biden finds a winning path is 66%. I have checked that all the combinations add up to 100%.

    It is based on assumption that Biden has 238 "in the bag" including NE2. I think that is right.
    Without NE2 it drops to 48%.

    I note that Biden is at currently 1.83 (55%) on Betfair.

    EDIT Now 1.73 (58%)

    It really scares me that this could end up 270-268. In theory Biden has then won but you only need 1 idiot in the EC to throw it to the house. This could so end up as Bush vs. Gore on steroids.

    I think Casino Royale was wise to take a small profit.
    Am I right in thinking Betfair pay out on the 270-268?

    Presumably a President could in theory openly bribe a couple of faithless electors with a few million and the only people who could remove him for it would be a Republican senate needing 67 votes......
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    isam said:

    Have we seen the final Betfair crossover?

    Maybe. Maybe not
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,094
    kjh said:

    In a different universe where the Rust Belt counted early and the South was the next day and with the same result we would have all gone to bed and woken up thinking Biden had won a landslide and then it would have started to tighten. Weird thought.

    Ha! Very true!
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,610
    I think sleepy Joe squeaks across the line from here. Nothing like the landslide so many were hoping for but a win is a win.
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    DruttDrutt Posts: 1,093
    Full disclosure: this is how my predictions have evolved since September. I don't think I was a million miles out.



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    not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,341
    Mal557 said:

    MrEd said:

    Pulpstar said:

    MrEd said:

    Morning everyone.

    Quick question / point. Just looked at the NYT website re Wisconsin. From what I can see Biden has a 9K lead but the counties where there are still substantial amounts of votes left are all heavily Republican with the Democrat areas pretty much voted.

    Have I missed something?

    Method of vote (Mail in) favours Biden everywhere. Opposite in Nevada & Arizona (Counting in person)
    Thx everyone. Makes sense.

    On that basis, I think there is a good chance Trump wins AZ but will be close.

    Also expect the Trump campaign to question the validity of the Milwaukee mail in vote and claim fraud.

    NV i think will be Biden given Ralston’s remarks but he has been proved to have missed how close it will be.

    NC should be Trump. GA should be Biden. I’m not sure re MI and PA.


    Fox and the AP have called AZ for Biden.
    Yep Biden has Arizona and Nevada.

    Not by a lot, but he has them
    So if as seems quite possible now he wins WI , he needs GA , MI or PA to win?
    Correct - any one of those will do.
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    alex_ said:

    Does anyone know the actual situation in Michigan at the moment? Why does the Decision Desk HQ twitter feed vary from it's website?

    Died 8 years ago?
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    isam said:

    Have we seen the final Betfair crossover?

    Y-n-E-o-S
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    EndillionEndillion Posts: 4,976

    Mal557 said:

    MrEd said:

    Pulpstar said:

    MrEd said:

    Morning everyone.

    Quick question / point. Just looked at the NYT website re Wisconsin. From what I can see Biden has a 9K lead but the counties where there are still substantial amounts of votes left are all heavily Republican with the Democrat areas pretty much voted.

    Have I missed something?

    Method of vote (Mail in) favours Biden everywhere. Opposite in Nevada & Arizona (Counting in person)
    Thx everyone. Makes sense.

    On that basis, I think there is a good chance Trump wins AZ but will be close.

    Also expect the Trump campaign to question the validity of the Milwaukee mail in vote and claim fraud.

    NV i think will be Biden given Ralston’s remarks but he has been proved to have missed how close it will be.

    NC should be Trump. GA should be Biden. I’m not sure re MI and PA.


    Fox and the AP have called AZ for Biden.
    Yep Biden has Arizona and Nevada.

    Not by a lot, but he has them
    So if as seems quite possible now he wins WI , he needs GA , MI or PA to win?
    Correct - any one of those will do.
    I think he can also get through with North Carolina plus the 2nd Maine congressional district. If he loses the latter, then the dead heat is back on the table.
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    MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688
    edited November 2020
    Big losers:

    CNN - godawful inability to compute the differences in WHEN people voted. 'Impressive leads' in XYZ were nothing of the sort, as it turned out.

    NYT needle - I love the New York Times but I wish they had put needles in the Midwest which currently look likely to decide the result

    Spreadex - their spread has been suspended almost the whole night. Disgraceful. I got out and re-bought at 262 but I'm not impressed. Will never use them again

    Punters - as usual punters over here and on Betfair didn't follow the US on the ground details. There was a moment in the early hours when Biden went out to 5 and I told people to buy. I've made some mistakes but that wasn't one of them.

    For me personally it's too soon to tally up but it hasn't been my best night. I thought Biden would get 300 ECVs and he's going to be lower than that. But I think he will 'just' win. Not the landslide I predicted!!!!

    Trump - disgraceful speech in the early hours. Just the worst.

    Biden - he may become President but if so he's the luckiest man on the planet.
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,094
    Trump drifting out on Betfair now.

    Why?
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    BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 7,997

    Barnesian said:

    I have had a look at the five remaining swing states and the probability of Biden taking them based on Betfair latest price.

    Georgia 42%
    Wisconsin 79%
    Michigan 61%
    Penn 37%
    Nevada 67%

    There are 32 B/T combinations of these 5 states.
    Of these 32 combinations, 16 give Biden 270+ ECs.
    I have computed the probabilities of each combination (ignoring correlation between states which I think is less important at this counting stage) and the probability that Biden finds a winning path is 66%. I have checked that all the combinations add up to 100%.

    It is based on assumption that Biden has 238 "in the bag" including NE2. I think that is right.
    Without NE2 it drops to 48%.

    I note that Biden is at currently 1.83 (55%) on Betfair.

    EDIT Now 1.73 (58%)

    It really scares me that this could end up 270-268. In theory Biden has then won but you only need 1 idiot in the EC to throw it to the house. This could so end up as Bush vs. Gore on steroids.

    I think Casino Royale was wise to take a small profit.
    I calculate that is a 18% chance. 12% of that is Nevada+Wisconsin+Michigan
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    MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    Mal557 said:

    MrEd said:

    Pulpstar said:

    MrEd said:

    Morning everyone.

    Quick question / point. Just looked at the NYT website re Wisconsin. From what I can see Biden has a 9K lead but the counties where there are still substantial amounts of votes left are all heavily Republican with the Democrat areas pretty much voted.

    Have I missed something?

    Method of vote (Mail in) favours Biden everywhere. Opposite in Nevada & Arizona (Counting in person)
    Thx everyone. Makes sense.

    On that basis, I think there is a good chance Trump wins AZ but will be close.

    Also expect the Trump campaign to question the validity of the Milwaukee mail in vote and claim fraud.

    NV i think will be Biden given Ralston’s remarks but he has been proved to have missed how close it will be.

    NC should be Trump. GA should be Biden. I’m not sure re MI and PA.


    Fox and the AP have called AZ for Biden.
    Yep Biden has Arizona and Nevada.

    Not by a lot, but he has them
    So if as seems quite possible now he wins WI , he needs GA , MI or PA to win?
    I don’t think you can call AZ for Biden.

    His lead is 5pc with 82pc of the vote in. Bear in mind, he was at a 9pc lead with 73pc in.

    So, it is clear that the vote on the day vote has broken heavily for Trump. Maricopa was 6pc up for Biden vs 10pc previously.

    I still think there are enough votes for Trump to win AZ
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    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,882

    "There are dark days right around the corner.....

    https://twitter.com/DavidHerdson/status/1323940803702640645?s=20

    I wouldn't be completely surprised to see USA slide into... if not an outright civil war then certainly severe civil unrest and violence over the next couple of years.

    With so much division and so many guns all over the place it looks like a tinderbox doesn't it?
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    If I was in a position to take a profit I would do so now. Alas my piss poor trading means I am in a hole but it's only a couple of hundred now after reducing my exposure so I am going to let it ride.
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,896
    GIN1138 said:
    Not a moral victory but a big political one. He's delivered a conservative majority of 6-3 on the Supreme Court, and a Republican hold in the Senate. Come 2022, under President Biden, and the Republicans will extend their Senate lead and flip the House.
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    Alistair said:
    Well they are ahead of TV, social media and most pundits.....not perfect but nothing is.
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,094

    isam said:

    Have we seen the final Betfair crossover?

    Maybe. Maybe not
    We need some updates from GA. If Biden can squeak that, I think he has possibly won the election.
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    alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    alex_ said:

    Does anyone know the actual situation in Michigan at the moment? Why does the Decision Desk HQ twitter feed vary from it's website?

    Died 8 years ago?
    Lol sorry - something popped up on my facebook feed.
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    Big losers:

    CNN - godawful inability to compute the differences in WHEN people voted. 'Impressive leads' in XYZ were nothing of the sort, as it turned out.

    NYT needle - I love the New York Times but I wish they had put needles in the Midwest which currently look likely to decide the result

    Spreadex - their spread has been suspended almost the whole night. Disgraceful. I got out and re-bought but I'm not impressed. Will never use them again

    Punters - as usual punters over here and on Betfair didn't follow the US on the ground details.

    For me personally it's too soon to tally up but it hasn't been my best night. I thought Biden would get 300 ECVs and he's going to be lower than that. But I think he will 'just' win.

    Trump - disgraceful speech in the early hours. Just the worst.

    Biden - he may become President but if so he's the luckiest man on the planet.

    Don't forget PredictIt:

    https://twitter.com/YellowLabLife/status/1323808371770884097
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    MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688

    Big losers:

    CNN - godawful inability to compute the differences in WHEN people voted. 'Impressive leads' in XYZ were nothing of the sort, as it turned out.

    NYT needle - I love the New York Times but I wish they had put needles in the Midwest which currently look likely to decide the result

    Spreadex - their spread has been suspended almost the whole night. Disgraceful. I got out and re-bought but I'm not impressed. Will never use them again

    Punters - as usual punters over here and on Betfair didn't follow the US on the ground details.

    For me personally it's too soon to tally up but it hasn't been my best night. I thought Biden would get 300 ECVs and he's going to be lower than that. But I think he will 'just' win.

    Trump - disgraceful speech in the early hours. Just the worst.

    Biden - he may become President but if so he's the luckiest man on the planet.

    Don't forget PredictIt:

    https://twitter.com/YellowLabLife/status/1323808371770884097
    OMG!!!!
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,094
    MaxPB said:

    I think sleepy Joe squeaks across the line from here. Nothing like the landslide so many were hoping for but a win is a win.


    What's your path Max?
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited November 2020

    I'm irritated if I lose my bet with HYUFD, not because I'm disappointed at losing to HYUFD (credit to him if he wins) but because in my head I was going to buy myself Crusader Kings III with the winnings.

    Bah!

    What was the bet?
    He said that the margin of victory (Electoral College) would be tighter this time than last time, I disagreed expecting Biden to win a bigger ECV majority than Trump won.

    For me to win from here I think that Biden needs to sweep NV, AZ, MI, WI, PA and GA.
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    Mal557 said:

    MrEd said:

    Pulpstar said:

    MrEd said:

    Morning everyone.

    Quick question / point. Just looked at the NYT website re Wisconsin. From what I can see Biden has a 9K lead but the counties where there are still substantial amounts of votes left are all heavily Republican with the Democrat areas pretty much voted.

    Have I missed something?

    Method of vote (Mail in) favours Biden everywhere. Opposite in Nevada & Arizona (Counting in person)
    Thx everyone. Makes sense.

    On that basis, I think there is a good chance Trump wins AZ but will be close.

    Also expect the Trump campaign to question the validity of the Milwaukee mail in vote and claim fraud.

    NV i think will be Biden given Ralston’s remarks but he has been proved to have missed how close it will be.

    NC should be Trump. GA should be Biden. I’m not sure re MI and PA.


    Fox and the AP have called AZ for Biden.
    Yep Biden has Arizona and Nevada.

    Not by a lot, but he has them
    So if as seems quite possible now he wins WI , he needs GA , MI or PA to win?
    Yes, though for reasons of everyone’s sanity I would quite like him to pick up two of them, just so there is a cushion. Otherwise we’re going to spend the next month or so with opinion piece upon opinion piece on faithless electors.

    I also can’t see the states with narrow margins escaping Trump litigation, so having a buffer would be... helpful.
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    kicorsekicorse Posts: 431
    Drutt said:

    Full disclosure: this is how my predictions have evolved since September. I don't think I was a million miles out.



    What? You didn't project NE2 to Biden?Ignoramus!

    Seriously, that's impressive. You have every right to gloat.
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    OMG!!!!

    I suppose they just threw the page up in a hurry when everything fell over but I love the idea that they *scheduled* maintenance during the first 2 hours of the count...
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,094

    I suspect it's this thinking that's driving down Biden's price.
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    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,186
    And I see that Trump is back out to where he was on Betfair about 7 days ago.
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    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,176

    isam said:

    Have we seen the final Betfair crossover?

    Maybe. Maybe not
    The sphinx speaks. Or is it the sphincter?

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    Ok, thinking about going back in with a monkey.
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    isamisam Posts: 40,971

    Trump drifting out on Betfair now.

    Why?

    10k on Trump yesterday wouldn’t have moved his price from 3, 10k now would prob make him EVS from 6/4
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,749
    kicorse said:

    Drutt said:

    Full disclosure: this is how my predictions have evolved since September. I don't think I was a million miles out.



    What? You didn't project NE2 to Biden?Ignoramus!

    Seriously, that's impressive. You have every right to gloat.
    Agreed. If you've any thoughts on next week lottery numbers, please feel free to PM me. :smile:
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    LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221
    Biden by the whiskiest of whiskers? Lordy
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,610
    Got to be said, our election night and process is so much better than the US.
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    alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    Fox News showing very narrow Trump lead now in Michigan.
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,749

    I'm irritated if I lose my bet with HYUFD, not because I'm disappointed at losing to HYUFD (credit to him if he wins) but because in my head I was going to buy myself Crusader Kings III with the winnings.

    Bah!

    What was the bet?
    He said that the margin of victory (Electoral College) would be tighter this time than last time, I disagreed expecting Biden to win a bigger ECV majority than Trump won.

    For me to win from here I think that Biden needs to sweep NV, AZ, MI, WI, PA and GA.

    Ah thanks. Don't pay up just yet, that sweep is not quite probable but certainly possible.
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    BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 7,997
    kicorse said:

    Drutt said:

    Full disclosure: this is how my predictions have evolved since September. I don't think I was a million miles out.



    What? You didn't project NE2 to Biden?Ignoramus!

    Seriously, that's impressive. You have every right to gloat.
    Do we know the final result for NE2 (presidential)? I can't find it.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,966
    I'd have thought ol' Ben Shapiro would be happy to "own the libs"...............

    https://twitter.com/benshapiro/status/1323890527767416834
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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,354
    edited November 2020

    I'm irritated if I lose my bet with HYUFD, not because I'm disappointed at losing to HYUFD (credit to him if he wins) but because in my head I was going to buy myself Crusader Kings III with the winnings.

    Bah!

    What was the bet?
    He said that the margin of victory (Electoral College) would be tighter this time than the 304 to 227 last time, I disagreed expecting Biden to win a bigger ECV majority than Trump won.

    For me to win from here I think that Biden needs to sweep NV, AZ, MI, WI, PA and GA.
    Since Trump wins a 269-269 tie, Biden needs to win Arizona (called already by some), Nevada (very likely), Wisoonsin (probably), and any one of Michigan (4.4% behind, 16% to count, Pennsylvania (12.6% behind, but 36% to count, mostly urban) or both of NC and GA (1.7% behind, 6% left to count). Looks possible but odds against, maybe a 25% chance... I've not seen the NE2 result - if Biden won that (?), then he doesn't need Georgia.

    Thanks so much to Barnesian for hosting last night - made it a MUCH more enjoyable night with so many iold friends.
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    Of course there is still the chance that Biden gets PA too. If everything falls right he could end up on 300+ EVs. Though I think he’ll just fall short in PA.
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    LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221
    Imagine if the Republicans had a younger, nimbler, less embarrassing, more articulate populist. They would be romping home.

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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,291
    edited November 2020
    Well this is about the worst possible result.
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    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,882
    Sean_F said:

    GIN1138 said:
    Not a moral victory but a big political one. He's delivered a conservative majority of 6-3 on the Supreme Court, and a Republican hold in the Senate. Come 2022, under President Biden, and the Republicans will extend their Senate lead and flip the House.
    Rep majorities in the Senate and the House by 2022 could be helpful for getting that trade deal done even if Sleepy Joe wants to send us to the back of the queue! :D
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    MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688


    I suspect it's this thinking that's driving down Biden's price.
    Well it looks like he has won Arizona and Nevada. Tight but wins.

    Wisconsin looks fairly good for him right now.


    I think the Democratic focus on the Midwest might prove a masterstroke, and don't forget Pa. is where they piled in most effort which will reflcct in mail-ins, but I still think Joe Biden is only going to win this (if he does) by some bloody narrow margins in key midwest states.

    If so he's bloody lucky.

    The good thing for his kudos will be winning the popular vote.

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    Ok, thinking about going back in with a monkey.

    That's brave. I think we are in the zone where there is too much chance of skulduggery - whether it be lawsuits stopping the counting of mail ballets, recounts or faithless elections.

    I can see Biden squeaking it out if things are free and fair but not sure if it will be.
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    Now about those pollsters.....
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    alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    Of course there is still the chance that Biden gets PA too. If everything falls right he could end up on 300+ EVs. Though I think he’ll just fall short in PA.

    The Networks are saying c75% counted in PA. But it could actually be significantly lower.
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    Stock market seems completely unconcerned, doesnt move much whoever is leading or however tight it gets.
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    StockyStocky Posts: 9,736

    I'm irritated if I lose my bet with HYUFD, not because I'm disappointed at losing to HYUFD (credit to him if he wins) but because in my head I was going to buy myself Crusader Kings III with the winnings.

    Bah!

    What was the bet?
    He said that the margin of victory (Electoral College) would be tighter this time than the 304 to 227 last time, I disagreed expecting Biden to win a bigger ECV majority than Trump won.

    For me to win from here I think that Biden needs to sweep NV, AZ, MI, WI, PA and GA.
    Since Trump wins a 269-269 tie, Biden needs to win Arizona (called already by some), Nevada (very likely), Wisoonsin (probably), and any one of Michigan (4.4% behind, 16% to count, Pennsylvania (12.6% behind, but 36% to count, mostly urban) or both of NC and GA (1.7% behind, 6% left to count). Looks possible but odds against, maybe a 25% chance... I've not seen the NE2 result - if Biden won that (?), then he doesn't need Georgia.

    Thanks so much to Barnesian for hosting last night - made it a MUCH more enjoyable night with so many iold friends.
    "Wisconsin (probably)"

    I think Trump will take Wisconsin. The Dem strongholds are already in.
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,094
    Nate Cohn
    @Nate_Cohn
    Replying to
    @Nate_Cohn
    And we have a very clear picture in Georgia, thanks to the needle's analysis of the vote by precinct x method--stipulating that there aren't any errors in the GA county data. There's a lot of heavily Dem vote in the Atlanta area left. It's enough to make Biden a narrow favorite
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    Ok, thinking about going back in with a monkey.

    That's brave. I think we are in the zone where there is too much chance of skulduggery - whether it be lawsuits stopping the counting of mail ballets, recounts or faithless elections.

    I can see Biden squeaking it out if things are free and fair but not sure if it will be.
    It's a trading monkey.

    I don't intend to lock up any cash in these markets for months, even once a winner is known. I'll green out.
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,749

    Alistair said:
    Well they are ahead of TV, social media and most pundits.....not perfect but nothing is.

    If they were, how would PBers make any money from them?
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    BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 7,997

    I'm irritated if I lose my bet with HYUFD, not because I'm disappointed at losing to HYUFD (credit to him if he wins) but because in my head I was going to buy myself Crusader Kings III with the winnings.

    Bah!

    What was the bet?
    He said that the margin of victory (Electoral College) would be tighter this time than the 304 to 227 last time, I disagreed expecting Biden to win a bigger ECV majority than Trump won.

    For me to win from here I think that Biden needs to sweep NV, AZ, MI, WI, PA and GA.
    Since Trump wins a 269-269 tie, Biden needs to win Arizona (called already by some), Nevada (very likely), Wisoonsin (probably), and any one of Michigan (4.4% behind, 16% to count, Pennsylvania (12.6% behind, but 36% to count, mostly urban) or both of NC and GA (1.7% behind, 6% left to count). Looks possible but odds against, maybe a 25% chance... I've not seen the NE2 result - if Biden won that (?), then he doesn't need Georgia.

    Thanks so much to Barnesian for hosting last night - made it a MUCH more enjoyable night with so many iold friends.
    Thanks. It helped to have company. I only drank one bottle of wine. The champagne is still in the fridge.
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    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,186

    I'm irritated if I lose my bet with HYUFD, not because I'm disappointed at losing to HYUFD (credit to him if he wins) but because in my head I was going to buy myself Crusader Kings III with the winnings.

    Bah!

    What was the bet?
    He said that the margin of victory (Electoral College) would be tighter this time than the 304 to 227 last time, I disagreed expecting Biden to win a bigger ECV majority than Trump won.

    For me to win from here I think that Biden needs to sweep NV, AZ, MI, WI, PA and GA.
    Since Trump wins a 269-269 tie, Biden needs to win Arizona (called already by some), Nevada (very likely), Wisoonsin (probably), and any one of Michigan (4.4% behind, 16% to count, Pennsylvania (12.6% behind, but 36% to count, mostly urban) or both of NC and GA (1.7% behind, 6% left to count). Looks possible but odds against, maybe a 25% chance... I've not seen the NE2 result - if Biden won that (?), then he doesn't need Georgia.

    Thanks so much to Barnesian for hosting last night - made it a MUCH more enjoyable night with so many iold friends.
    If there's a tie I thought under the 12th Amendment the House decides, thus a Democrat wins, while the Senate picks the Veep, thus a Republican. I mean, theoretically, we could have Biden as president and Trump as Veep?
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,283
    edited November 2020
    Nate Cohen reckons we can pencil NV as Dem.
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,094
    isam said:

    Trump drifting out on Betfair now.

    Why?

    10k on Trump yesterday wouldn’t have moved his price from 3, 10k now would prob make him EVS from 6/4
    Yup, there's not much out there.
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    alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    DougSeal said:

    I'm irritated if I lose my bet with HYUFD, not because I'm disappointed at losing to HYUFD (credit to him if he wins) but because in my head I was going to buy myself Crusader Kings III with the winnings.

    Bah!

    What was the bet?
    He said that the margin of victory (Electoral College) would be tighter this time than the 304 to 227 last time, I disagreed expecting Biden to win a bigger ECV majority than Trump won.

    For me to win from here I think that Biden needs to sweep NV, AZ, MI, WI, PA and GA.
    Since Trump wins a 269-269 tie, Biden needs to win Arizona (called already by some), Nevada (very likely), Wisoonsin (probably), and any one of Michigan (4.4% behind, 16% to count, Pennsylvania (12.6% behind, but 36% to count, mostly urban) or both of NC and GA (1.7% behind, 6% left to count). Looks possible but odds against, maybe a 25% chance... I've not seen the NE2 result - if Biden won that (?), then he doesn't need Georgia.

    Thanks so much to Barnesian for hosting last night - made it a MUCH more enjoyable night with so many iold friends.
    If there's a tie I thought under the 12th Amendment the House decides, thus a Democrat wins, while the Senate picks the Veep, thus a Republican. I mean, theoretically, we could have Biden as president and Trump as Veep?
    The House decides based on an "all states are equal" basis.
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    LadyG said:

    Imagine if the Republicans had a younger, nimbler, less embarrassing, more articulate populist. They would be romping home.

    Are you volunteering?
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    gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362
    If Biden takes Georgia Dems can still take Senate?
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    DruttDrutt Posts: 1,093
    Biden drifting in WI and MI but still odds-on (1.4 and 1.6)
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    DougSeal said:

    I'm irritated if I lose my bet with HYUFD, not because I'm disappointed at losing to HYUFD (credit to him if he wins) but because in my head I was going to buy myself Crusader Kings III with the winnings.

    Bah!

    What was the bet?
    He said that the margin of victory (Electoral College) would be tighter this time than the 304 to 227 last time, I disagreed expecting Biden to win a bigger ECV majority than Trump won.

    For me to win from here I think that Biden needs to sweep NV, AZ, MI, WI, PA and GA.
    Since Trump wins a 269-269 tie, Biden needs to win Arizona (called already by some), Nevada (very likely), Wisoonsin (probably), and any one of Michigan (4.4% behind, 16% to count, Pennsylvania (12.6% behind, but 36% to count, mostly urban) or both of NC and GA (1.7% behind, 6% left to count). Looks possible but odds against, maybe a 25% chance... I've not seen the NE2 result - if Biden won that (?), then he doesn't need Georgia.

    Thanks so much to Barnesian for hosting last night - made it a MUCH more enjoyable night with so many iold friends.
    If there's a tie I thought under the 12th Amendment the House decides, thus a Democrat wins, while the Senate picks the Veep, thus a Republican. I mean, theoretically, we could have Biden as president and Trump as Veep?
    The House votes in a funny way IIRC. It’s not one member one vote. It votes on state delegation lines (so majority of reps in state = 1 vote for that party’s candidate). Owing to the fact the Dem majority is based on large population states, I believe this means that the GOP would win a presidential election in the House even as the minority party.
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    Just 60k lead in Michigan now with Detroit yet to report I think?

    Surely Biden has this then?
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,495
    edited November 2020
    LadyG said:

    Imagine if the Republicans had a younger, nimbler, less embarrassing, more articulate populist. They would be romping home.

    One thing I notice in the UK: LinkedIN and Facebook are *pure* virtue signalling. First woman this. First gay that. First minority disabled female there. Lots of likes and applause. White privilege, of course of course - natch. "I *repent*" (flagellates back).

    In private, almost everyone I speaks to thinks it's OTT, and some really hate it.

    They keep their mouths shut, but they have a private vote.

    EDIT: if that's what it's like in the UK, reserved, fair play, polite etc - then what's it like in the USA where the culture divisions are far far worse, and they're much more polarised about who they talk to and engage with?
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    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,186
    alex_ said:

    DougSeal said:

    I'm irritated if I lose my bet with HYUFD, not because I'm disappointed at losing to HYUFD (credit to him if he wins) but because in my head I was going to buy myself Crusader Kings III with the winnings.

    Bah!

    What was the bet?
    He said that the margin of victory (Electoral College) would be tighter this time than the 304 to 227 last time, I disagreed expecting Biden to win a bigger ECV majority than Trump won.

    For me to win from here I think that Biden needs to sweep NV, AZ, MI, WI, PA and GA.
    Since Trump wins a 269-269 tie, Biden needs to win Arizona (called already by some), Nevada (very likely), Wisoonsin (probably), and any one of Michigan (4.4% behind, 16% to count, Pennsylvania (12.6% behind, but 36% to count, mostly urban) or both of NC and GA (1.7% behind, 6% left to count). Looks possible but odds against, maybe a 25% chance... I've not seen the NE2 result - if Biden won that (?), then he doesn't need Georgia.

    Thanks so much to Barnesian for hosting last night - made it a MUCH more enjoyable night with so many iold friends.
    If there's a tie I thought under the 12th Amendment the House decides, thus a Democrat wins, while the Senate picks the Veep, thus a Republican. I mean, theoretically, we could have Biden as president and Trump as Veep?
    The House decides based on an "all states are equal" basis.
    Gotcha! Thanks.
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    FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,052
    I hope Biden wins but after fur years of Trump for him to be so close to re-election is depressing. The democrats have to start listening to Trump voters. I'm not saying they are all reasonable, decent etc but for some reason many Americans have chosen to back him. Did the dems do enough to distance themselves from BLM/Antifa?

    I don't understand why they are sooooo hated but they ought to be trying to understand why.
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    Now's the time to pile into Betfair..

    I just went back in at 1.63 with a stack.
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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,083
    alex_ said:

    DougSeal said:

    I'm irritated if I lose my bet with HYUFD, not because I'm disappointed at losing to HYUFD (credit to him if he wins) but because in my head I was going to buy myself Crusader Kings III with the winnings.

    Bah!

    What was the bet?
    He said that the margin of victory (Electoral College) would be tighter this time than the 304 to 227 last time, I disagreed expecting Biden to win a bigger ECV majority than Trump won.

    For me to win from here I think that Biden needs to sweep NV, AZ, MI, WI, PA and GA.
    Since Trump wins a 269-269 tie, Biden needs to win Arizona (called already by some), Nevada (very likely), Wisoonsin (probably), and any one of Michigan (4.4% behind, 16% to count, Pennsylvania (12.6% behind, but 36% to count, mostly urban) or both of NC and GA (1.7% behind, 6% left to count). Looks possible but odds against, maybe a 25% chance... I've not seen the NE2 result - if Biden won that (?), then he doesn't need Georgia.

    Thanks so much to Barnesian for hosting last night - made it a MUCH more enjoyable night with so many iold friends.
    If there's a tie I thought under the 12th Amendment the House decides, thus a Democrat wins, while the Senate picks the Veep, thus a Republican. I mean, theoretically, we could have Biden as president and Trump as Veep?
    The House decides based on an "all states are equal" basis.
    Yep. Which means a GOP majority.

    🤷‍♂️
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    BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 7,997
    Stocky said:

    I'm irritated if I lose my bet with HYUFD, not because I'm disappointed at losing to HYUFD (credit to him if he wins) but because in my head I was going to buy myself Crusader Kings III with the winnings.

    Bah!

    What was the bet?
    He said that the margin of victory (Electoral College) would be tighter this time than the 304 to 227 last time, I disagreed expecting Biden to win a bigger ECV majority than Trump won.

    For me to win from here I think that Biden needs to sweep NV, AZ, MI, WI, PA and GA.
    Since Trump wins a 269-269 tie, Biden needs to win Arizona (called already by some), Nevada (very likely), Wisoonsin (probably), and any one of Michigan (4.4% behind, 16% to count, Pennsylvania (12.6% behind, but 36% to count, mostly urban) or both of NC and GA (1.7% behind, 6% left to count). Looks possible but odds against, maybe a 25% chance... I've not seen the NE2 result - if Biden won that (?), then he doesn't need Georgia.

    Thanks so much to Barnesian for hosting last night - made it a MUCH more enjoyable night with so many iold friends.
    "Wisconsin (probably)"

    I think Trump will take Wisconsin. The Dem strongholds are already in.
    You can get 4.3 on Betfair on Trump winning Wisconsin.
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    EPGEPG Posts: 6,013

    Nate Cohn
    @Nate_Cohn
    Replying to
    @Nate_Cohn
    And we have a very clear picture in Georgia, thanks to the needle's analysis of the vote by precinct x method--stipulating that there aren't any errors in the GA county data. There's a lot of heavily Dem vote in the Atlanta area left. It's enough to make Biden a narrow favorite

    Very clear narrow favourite by a method that was saying 90% Trump or so a few hours ago.
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    LadyG said:

    Imagine if the Republicans had a younger, nimbler, less embarrassing, more articulate populist. They would be romping home.

    Perhaps it's Trump's decrepit, plodding, cringeworthy inarticulateness that attracts.
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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,083
    edited November 2020

    I hope Biden wins but after fur years of Trump for him to be so close to re-election is depressing. The democrats have to start listening to Trump voters. I'm not saying they are all reasonable, decent etc but for some reason many Americans have chosen to back him. Did the dems do enough to distance themselves from BLM/Antifa?

    I don't understand why they are sooooo hated but they ought to be trying to understand why.

    I mean there is that, but remember the Democrats have managed to win over a majority...
This discussion has been closed.