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New Scottish poll from Ipsos MORI has support for Scottish independence at 58% – a record level – po
New Scottish poll from Ipsos MORI has support for Scottish independence at 58% – a record level – politicalbetting.com
The end of the UK? Highest EVER recorded support for independence in Scotland (58%) pic.twitter.com/7Cengc1pfD
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And first to say hello independence Scotland.
The most interesting thing about the Scottish polling is the massively high approval rating for Nicola Sturgeon, despite the utter shambles on almost everything from the exam-grade fiasco to the Covid-19 response via the Alex Salmond brouhaha. It's obviously a tribal rallying-around the figurehead.
This is becoming an argument over targeted lockdowns versus national lockdowns.
If the government was intending to go full lockdown at some point then surely they wouldn`t allow a narrative to develop that it is Starmer`s idea. They could have done this easily yesterday along the lines of "At last! The leader of the opposition has come off the fence and promised to support something".
I think they will stick with targeted lockdowns. Starmer has made this even more likely. We have to establish the limits to liberty that we will tolerate in this country, and Tier 3 local lockdowns may be it.
But it is clear now Labour are happy to play politics with this. Starmer is a bright man, imagine if he read a legal report that said well the suspect was somewhere between 10m and 1000m from the incident and any further evidence of their exact whereabouts will only be available after the end of any potential trial, I think when he was at the CPS he would have to decide not to go to trial with this case. But that is what he claims he believes about this SAGE propsoal.
Good luck to a future independent Scotland. I think it will be best for both Scotland and the rest of the UK that Scotland sets off on its own path and takes responsibility for itself going forwards.
I am a bigger believer in the simple fundamental principle that people are better off looking after themselves and taking responsibility for their own actions and that should apply to Scotland as much as the UK or individual taxpayers.
Excited as Shagger may be about Labour voting tactics, it matters sod all to the actual crisis in hand.
Brexit was supposed to be the beginning of the end for the EU. That's what the Brexit-backing right told us. Instead, it has put the UK's existence in significant danger. I hate the idea of it happening, but maybe it is the only way that deluded, triumphalist, right wing English nationalists will be forced to confront reality.
Though the Welsh are welcome to tag along with the English if they want to as far as I'm concerned. They did for hundreds of years before the Acts of Union.
But at the same time I am not surprised. Sturgeon's communication is miles, miles better than the UK government. A completely different class. The level of empathy and understanding she communicates is grade A.
Of course there are huge issues to address, around the currency and the fiscal deficit. But Scotland has loads going for it and in the long run I think can be another economically successful and confident well-run social democratic small country in the EU. Far better than being mired in this Eton Mess.
Not that it's ever going to happen. Boris will never grant another referendum, and if Starmer were ever in a position to, he would be cuddly enough to swing enough Scots towards the status quo.
It works for the Cricket team.
The "England and Wales" legal system will now slowly diverge, I guess.
https://twitter.com/ScotRail/status/1316343606085644308?s=20
The history books will record Scotland is lost, and BoZo is the cause.
It doesn't matter who is in post when it is formalised
https://unherd.com/2020/10/can-britain-learn-from-germanys-covid-success/?tl_inbound=1&tl_groups[0]=18743&tl_period_type=3
British people have been dying at six times the rate of German people, from a disease that both countries could see coming at the same time. I wanted to ask around a bit and find out why.
The short version is that there are several factors, of varying importance — but, probably, none of them is magic, or hidden, or mysterious. There’s no obvious need to posit “immunological dark matter” or illegible cultural factors. Germany was better prepared and reacted faster than Britain did, and in some ways got lucky, while making some mistakes of its own; it had a political system and, of course, politicians, which were better suited to the moment; and together, those factors added up to keeping several tens of thousand Germans alive.
The key factors, in particular, appear to have been that they took measures earlier, and that they were better at protecting the most at-risk people. Those decisions came at significant cost, economically and to people’s lives – but, I think most of us would agree now, they were worth it.
How long can Starmer continue to not bother to vote for?
It’s probably best that rUK spends most of its time working out what comes next.
I’d like to see very firm and robust pushing of our interests, particularly in the areas of defence and security policy which should be a red line.
An independent Scotland should expect no favours.
I believe in the United Kingdom. I think we are more together than we would be apart and that Scotland in particular would lose even more than England.
I am proud of our history together. We of course have made many mistakes but we have also done a lot of good and in my view the balance is comfortably in credit. My late father served in the British army for more than 20 years. I was born in Cheltenham and spent some of my youth outside Winchester. I have felt more British than Scots my entire life.
I am proud to be a citizen of a country that actually matters in the world, that has a seat on the Security Council, that has a well funded and internationally respected aid program, that stands up for human rights and civilised values. I like the fact that we actually matter.
If Scotland opts for independence I will feel diminished. I would be a citizen of an irrelevant backwater whose views on the issues of the day are of no moment, who would be parochial and dull. No one who has ever watched the Scottish Parliament should be in any doubt about how dull it would be.
When I go down to England I feel every bit as home as I do in Scotland. It is a part of my country. I belong there as much as here. I am still at home.
The economic consequences of Independence would of course be calamitous but at the end of the day who you are matters more than how much you have got. There would be a heavy price to pay as the delusions of the Nationalists were laid bare but we would survive. No one should really doubt the price but people like me are not in this for the money.
The great weakness of Better Together was that it made so little of this pride in our country and yet when I was canvassing that is what I heard repeatedly. There was great frustration in the way the campaign was fought, a frustration I shared. A Labour led campaign with a Tory government in Westminster meant that there was a great reluctance to speak up for the positive aspects of the Union. It is not a mistake that can be repeated.
I do not think that there is anything inevitable about independence. I, for one, will do what I can to persuade my fellow citizens that we are British and proud of it. I think we will prevail, again.
My feel is that it’s the other way around - the mature and relatively steady approach Sturgeon has demonstrated throughout the virus crisis is fuelling the rise in support for indy. Particularly when Scots look at the chaotic capricious government the Tories have inflicted upon the UK.
Yes, the virus crisis has hit everyone and no country has been free of mistakes. But those that have approached things with a degree of objectivity, consistency, maturity and honesty, like Sturgeon and Merkel, are emerging with more credibility than those that have been all at sea, like Bozo and Trump.
Which is actually a consolation, if you think about it.
HYUFD may want to send Marshall Wade up north to squash the rebellious Scots but other than that everyone else here seems to respect the right of the Scots to make their own choice - even if those of us who would warmly embrace it are still a minority. We're a growing minority in England though - there's only so long Scots can say they don't want to be united with the English before the feeling will become mutual.
Key phrase.
However from my travels I get the sense most English people don’t really give a fuck. They actually do shrug. They don’t want Scotland to go but it’s a third order issue. Perhaps in the end it will be this English apathy which kills the Union.
You'll always have the Isle of Wight.
https://twitter.com/naebD/status/1316349550144020482?s=20
Whatever the truth, he won’t grant a referendum with polls like this. He will hand the possibly poisoned chalice to his successor.
It will come crashing down into reality very quickly.
Now, following the last few years I think, if I was Scottish I'd at best be on the fence about staying in. Actually, I'd be furious about being taken out the EU against the will of the people. Freedom!
Such understatement.
https://twitter.com/Kevin_Maguire/status/1316341004828659714
If and when Scotland goes independent I think we'll able to kick the Brexiteers into the sea.
A special circle of hell is reserved for 'Unionists' who backed Brexit.
I so relate to this, so fucking relate to it.
https://twitter.com/feedthedrummer/status/1316334735375900678
You are absolutely obsessed with “The Tories” and Brexit.
The best analysis on this issue comes from @Black_Rook
We can only hope that the country that emerges from it has a more mature and realistic appraisal of its future place in the world than the fantastical nonsense and false nostalgia that has misinformed so much of it prior.
Incidentally, one driver of Tory votes (especially LD Con waverers in the SW) is the threat of the SNP holding balance of power.