Where’s the full video Ms Butler? twitter.com/guardiannews/status/1293608926399864832?s=20
Since Dawn Butler's "full video" could not possibly show the police looking up the wrong registration number, what's your point?
My point is she Tweeted that she’d “recorded everything” then only released 1 minute of an 8 minute recording. The Police should release their body cam footage so we get the whole picture.
The police case is they stopped the car after the registration lookup error. If they claimed the car was careering all over the road, or had a funky smell from the window, there might be value but they are not claiming that.
A full video might show the police as unfailingly polite and apologetic or that Butler and her mate were abusive or uncooperative but even if all that were true, it would not address the reason of why the car was stopped in the first place. That is the crucial question and the rest is just a smokescreen.
It was a BMW. It will be as simple as that; not that the police can admit to that.
With blacked-out windows, as the police have already said.
If the tinted/blacked out windows broke the law then the rozzers would have issued a prohibition notice? Did they? If not why not? Oh because they were legal.
I only ask as someone who drives a vehicle with tinted windows.
They were not stopped because of the tinted windows - as you know - but the tinted windows meant they couldn’t see the occupants to “racially profile” them, as Ms Butler claims in her edited video.
Oh come of it, British cops are infamous for saying BMWs are 'Black Man's Wheels', vehicles that often come with tinted windows as standard.
Check out the recent comments by Danny Rose.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
You have to remember, a lot of Scots suffer in the sun, so their idea of what is just right is different. I love the chilly morning haar [fog and mist off the North Sea].
When I lived in Berwick the haar would roll in over the golf course and sometimes stay for days or even weeks. It was not pleasant
Much rather that than this filthy stinking heat. You can't escape it and can't do anything in it but suffer and long for it to be over.
Scotland definitely gets the best end of the weather deal in Britain, even the really rainy bits out West.
I agree with you on almost everything Black Rook - but we differ on this. More hot weather please!
Oh good God no, roll on September please. Really, if you want to swelter all the time then move to Andalucia, or perhaps Togo. 30+ during the day and 20 in the middle of the night is too bloody much.
Ideally it would be nice if it were pleasantly warm during the day and cool at night (and Spring was marvellous,) but offered the choice between the current sweat fest and a dreich November day in Fife, I'd take the latter. Every time.
I find I need a good hot summer (especially in August) to enjoy the Autumn. I love Autumn (all that colour ,decay and milder weather with a nice chill - I am a bit of a goth) but do need a hot summer to fully appreciate it . So happy it has been really hot this week and happy when it gets cooler and into my favourite season (Cannot understand people who prefer other seasons to Autumn) Fav seasons in order
Autumn Winter Summer Spring (all too nice and fluffy and left wingish imho!)
I agree on Autumn, but I've had enough of trying to sleep in this swelter thanks.
Where’s the full video Ms Butler? twitter.com/guardiannews/status/1293608926399864832?s=20
Since Dawn Butler's "full video" could not possibly show the police looking up the wrong registration number, what's your point?
My point is she Tweeted that she’d “recorded everything” then only released 1 minute of an 8 minute recording. The Police should release their body cam footage so we get the whole picture.
The police case is they stopped the car after the registration lookup error. If they claimed the car was careering all over the road, or had a funky smell from the window, there might be value but they are not claiming that.
A full video might show the police as unfailingly polite and apologetic or that Butler and her mate were abusive or uncooperative but even if all that were true, it would not address the reason of why the car was stopped in the first place. That is the crucial question and the rest is just a smokescreen.
It was a BMW. It will be as simple as that; not that the police can admit to that.
With blacked-out windows, as the police have already said.
If the tinted/blacked out windows broke the law then the rozzers would have issued a prohibition notice? Did they? If not why not? Oh because they were legal.
I only ask as someone who drives a vehicle with tinted windows.
They were not stopped because of the tinted windows - as you know - but the tinted windows meant they couldn’t see the occupants to “racially profile” them, as Ms Butler claims in her edited video.
Oh come of it, British cops are infamous for saying BMWs are 'Black Man's Wheels', vehicles that often come with tinted windows as standard.
Check out the recent comments by Danny Rose.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Where’s the full video Ms Butler? twitter.com/guardiannews/status/1293608926399864832?s=20
Since Dawn Butler's "full video" could not possibly show the police looking up the wrong registration number, what's your point?
My point is she Tweeted that she’d “recorded everything” then only released 1 minute of an 8 minute recording. The Police should release their body cam footage so we get the whole picture.
The police case is they stopped the car after the registration lookup error. If they claimed the car was careering all over the road, or had a funky smell from the window, there might be value but they are not claiming that.
A full video might show the police as unfailingly polite and apologetic or that Butler and her mate were abusive or uncooperative but even if all that were true, it would not address the reason of why the car was stopped in the first place. That is the crucial question and the rest is just a smokescreen.
It was a BMW. It will be as simple as that; not that the police can admit to that.
With blacked-out windows, as the police have already said.
If the tinted/blacked out windows broke the law then the rozzers would have issued a prohibition notice? Did they? If not why not? Oh because they were legal.
I only ask as someone who drives a vehicle with tinted windows.
They were not stopped because of the tinted windows - as you know - but the tinted windows meant they couldn’t see the occupants to “racially profile” them, as Ms Butler claims in her edited video.
Rear windows. Neither illegal, nor obscuring the occupants.
Where’s the full video Ms Butler? twitter.com/guardiannews/status/1293608926399864832?s=20
Since Dawn Butler's "full video" could not possibly show the police looking up the wrong registration number, what's your point?
My point is she Tweeted that she’d “recorded everything” then only released 1 minute of an 8 minute recording. The Police should release their body cam footage so we get the whole picture.
The police case is they stopped the car after the registration lookup error. If they claimed the car was careering all over the road, or had a funky smell from the window, there might be value but they are not claiming that.
A full video might show the police as unfailingly polite and apologetic or that Butler and her mate were abusive or uncooperative but even if all that were true, it would not address the reason of why the car was stopped in the first place. That is the crucial question and the rest is just a smokescreen.
It was a BMW. It will be as simple as that; not that the police can admit to that.
With blacked-out windows, as the police have already said.
If the tinted/blacked out windows broke the law then the rozzers would have issued a prohibition notice? Did they? If not why not? Oh because they were legal.
I only ask as someone who drives a vehicle with tinted windows.
They were not stopped because of the tinted windows - as you know - but the tinted windows meant they couldn’t see the occupants to “racially profile” them, as Ms Butler claims in her edited video.
Oh come of it, British cops are infamous for saying BMWs are 'Black Man's Wheels', vehicles that often come with tinted windows as standard.
Check out the recent comments by Danny Rose.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Where’s the full video Ms Butler? twitter.com/guardiannews/status/1293608926399864832?s=20
Since Dawn Butler's "full video" could not possibly show the police looking up the wrong registration number, what's your point?
My point is she Tweeted that she’d “recorded everything” then only released 1 minute of an 8 minute recording. The Police should release their body cam footage so we get the whole picture.
The police case is they stopped the car after the registration lookup error. If they claimed the car was careering all over the road, or had a funky smell from the window, there might be value but they are not claiming that.
A full video might show the police as unfailingly polite and apologetic or that Butler and her mate were abusive or uncooperative but even if all that were true, it would not address the reason of why the car was stopped in the first place. That is the crucial question and the rest is just a smokescreen.
It was a BMW. It will be as simple as that; not that the police can admit to that.
With blacked-out windows, as the police have already said.
If the tinted/blacked out windows broke the law then the rozzers would have issued a prohibition notice? Did they? If not why not? Oh because they were legal.
I only ask as someone who drives a vehicle with tinted windows.
They were not stopped because of the tinted windows - as you know - but the tinted windows meant they couldn’t see the occupants to “racially profile” them, as Ms Butler claims in her edited video.
Oh come of it, British cops are infamous for saying BMWs are 'Black Man's Wheels', vehicles that often come with tinted windows as standard.
Check out the recent comments by Danny Rose.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Is she still doing banks these days?
Got sensible and traded it in for a Skoda Kodiaq to accommodate children. A poor life choice in my opinion.
Where’s the full video Ms Butler? twitter.com/guardiannews/status/1293608926399864832?s=20
Since Dawn Butler's "full video" could not possibly show the police looking up the wrong registration number, what's your point?
My point is she Tweeted that she’d “recorded everything” then only released 1 minute of an 8 minute recording. The Police should release their body cam footage so we get the whole picture.
The police case is they stopped the car after the registration lookup error. If they claimed the car was careering all over the road, or had a funky smell from the window, there might be value but they are not claiming that.
A full video might show the police as unfailingly polite and apologetic or that Butler and her mate were abusive or uncooperative but even if all that were true, it would not address the reason of why the car was stopped in the first place. That is the crucial question and the rest is just a smokescreen.
It was a BMW. It will be as simple as that; not that the police can admit to that.
With blacked-out windows, as the police have already said.
If the tinted/blacked out windows broke the law then the rozzers would have issued a prohibition notice? Did they? If not why not? Oh because they were legal.
I only ask as someone who drives a vehicle with tinted windows.
They were not stopped because of the tinted windows - as you know - but the tinted windows meant they couldn’t see the occupants to “racially profile” them, as Ms Butler claims in her edited video.
Oh come of it, British cops are infamous for saying BMWs are 'Black Man's Wheels', vehicles that often come with tinted windows as standard.
Check out the recent comments by Danny Rose.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Is she still doing banks these days?
It used to be having a red car led to most stops as the police played car snooker and needed a red before they could pot a colour.
Where’s the full video Ms Butler? twitter.com/guardiannews/status/1293608926399864832?s=20
Since Dawn Butler's "full video" could not possibly show the police looking up the wrong registration number, what's your point?
My point is she Tweeted that she’d “recorded everything” then only released 1 minute of an 8 minute recording. The Police should release their body cam footage so we get the whole picture.
The police case is they stopped the car after the registration lookup error. If they claimed the car was careering all over the road, or had a funky smell from the window, there might be value but they are not claiming that.
A full video might show the police as unfailingly polite and apologetic or that Butler and her mate were abusive or uncooperative but even if all that were true, it would not address the reason of why the car was stopped in the first place. That is the crucial question and the rest is just a smokescreen.
It was a BMW. It will be as simple as that; not that the police can admit to that.
With blacked-out windows, as the police have already said.
If the tinted/blacked out windows broke the law then the rozzers would have issued a prohibition notice? Did they? If not why not? Oh because they were legal.
I only ask as someone who drives a vehicle with tinted windows.
They were not stopped because of the tinted windows - as you know - but the tinted windows meant they couldn’t see the occupants to “racially profile” them, as Ms Butler claims in her edited video.
Rear windows. Neither illegal, nor obscuring the occupants.
Only a factor of four out. Why hasn't the dashboard been updated?
I'm not so sure about the 28 day cut off. Derek Draper, for example, has been in ICU since March 30 and may yet die - of Covid, presumably. I'm sure there are others who are not minor celebrities, but no idea how many. By contrast, not many ex-Covid sufferers have been subsequently run over by buses, despite what some on here claim.
Yes, I hope Mr Draper makes a full recovery, but if he succumbed then it should be recorded as covid, alongside deaths such as Dr Pathak:
"8. Does this methodology not mean that deaths will be undercounted from now on? No. We are conscious that due to the unstable nature of the disease, applying a time limitation could potentially miss COVID-19 deaths, hence all cases with COVID-19- reported on their death registration will be included regardless of their time to death from the initial infection date."
You have to remember, a lot of Scots suffer in the sun, so their idea of what is just right is different. I love the chilly morning haar [fog and mist off the North Sea].
When I lived in Berwick the haar would roll in over the golf course and sometimes stay for days or even weeks. It was not pleasant
Much rather that than this filthy stinking heat. You can't escape it and can't do anything in it but suffer and long for it to be over.
Scotland definitely gets the best end of the weather deal in Britain, even the really rainy bits out West.
I agree with you on almost everything Black Rook - but we differ on this. More hot weather please!
Oh good God no, roll on September please. Really, if you want to swelter all the time then move to Andalucia, or perhaps Togo. 30+ during the day and 20 in the middle of the night is too bloody much.
Ideally it would be nice if it were pleasantly warm during the day and cool at night (and Spring was marvellous,) but offered the choice between the current sweat fest and a dreich November day in Fife, I'd take the latter. Every time.
The Norman Book of Roger describes England as in perpetual winter.
Where’s the full video Ms Butler? twitter.com/guardiannews/status/1293608926399864832?s=20
Since Dawn Butler's "full video" could not possibly show the police looking up the wrong registration number, what's your point?
My point is she Tweeted that she’d “recorded everything” then only released 1 minute of an 8 minute recording. The Police should release their body cam footage so we get the whole picture.
The police case is they stopped the car after the registration lookup error. If they claimed the car was careering all over the road, or had a funky smell from the window, there might be value but they are not claiming that.
A full video might show the police as unfailingly polite and apologetic or that Butler and her mate were abusive or uncooperative but even if all that were true, it would not address the reason of why the car was stopped in the first place. That is the crucial question and the rest is just a smokescreen.
It was a BMW. It will be as simple as that; not that the police can admit to that.
With blacked-out windows, as the police have already said.
If the tinted/blacked out windows broke the law then the rozzers would have issued a prohibition notice? Did they? If not why not? Oh because they were legal.
I only ask as someone who drives a vehicle with tinted windows.
They were not stopped because of the tinted windows - as you know - but the tinted windows meant they couldn’t see the occupants to “racially profile” them, as Ms Butler claims in her edited video.
Oh come of it, British cops are infamous for saying BMWs are 'Black Man's Wheels', vehicles that often come with tinted windows as standard.
Check out the recent comments by Danny Rose.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Is she still doing banks these days?
It used to be having a red car led to most stops as the police played car snooker and needed a red before they could pot a colour.
Trying to work out if white cars were safe then or did they occasionally get shunted off the road as fouls?
Only a factor of four out. Why hasn't the dashboard been updated?
I'm not so sure about the 28 day cut off. Derek Draper, for example, has been in ICU since March 30 and may yet die - of Covid, presumably. I'm sure there are others who are not minor celebrities, but no idea how many. By contrast, not many ex-Covid sufferers have been subsequently run over by buses, despite what some on here claim.
Scotland and Wales have been applying the 28 day limit the whole time.
It’s shocking that Gavin Williamson hasn’t resigned in shame never to be seen again. Even if he was dealt a difficult hand his response has been appalling, for outcomes which were totally predictable. The ludicrous amendment involving mock exams is just the poo on the shoe.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
James O'Brien wannabes. "Everything is so tiresomely obvious, when will you guys finally get it?" They think everyone who voted or thinks differently to them has been conned by the politicians they disagree with
You have to remember, a lot of Scots suffer in the sun, so their idea of what is just right is different. I love the chilly morning haar [fog and mist off the North Sea].
When I lived in Berwick the haar would roll in over the golf course and sometimes stay for days or even weeks. It was not pleasant
Much rather that than this filthy stinking heat. You can't escape it and can't do anything in it but suffer and long for it to be over.
Scotland definitely gets the best end of the weather deal in Britain, even the really rainy bits out West.
I agree with you on almost everything Black Rook - but we differ on this. More hot weather please!
Oh good God no, roll on September please. Really, if you want to swelter all the time then move to Andalucia, or perhaps Togo. 30+ during the day and 20 in the middle of the night is too bloody much.
Ideally it would be nice if it were pleasantly warm during the day and cool at night (and Spring was marvellous,) but offered the choice between the current sweat fest and a dreich November day in Fife, I'd take the latter. Every time.
The Norman Book of Roger describes England as in perpetual winter.
Can somebody explain how Johnson will be running on a hard Brexit ticket in 2024. Aren't we ending the transition period this December, is HYUFD implying we're going to delay ending it? Can't see that going down too well with Tory voters
He will be running on a ticket of staying out of the single market and customs union and controlling our own borders by retaining the new points system not returning to free movement and doing our own trade deals
Labour may very well be running on the same ticket. That wont be “hard Brexit” that will be “status quo”.
If Starmer ruled out returning to the single market and customs union he would lose Remainers back to the LDs
You’re delusional.
If Brexit is going fine, there will be no clamour for the Single Market, even amongst so called “Remainers”. If Brexit is not going fine, then a “status quo” position will have little electoral value to the Conservatives.
You’re looking at the next election through the eyes of 2019. That is in my opinion misguided.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
I can tell Leavers simply on sight much of the time. They tend to be overweight and rather primitive looking. I reckon I can get 70% just on that basis. Then if I have a quick chat - listen carefully for a certain lack of intellect and/or this very particular softhead sentimentality a la Tony Parsons - that 70% goes to 90%. So pretty good, but it still means that 1 in 10 slip through the net.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
I can tell Leavers simply on sight much of the time. They tend to be overweight and rather primitive looking. I reckon I can get 70% just on that basis. Then if I have a quick chat - listen carefully for a certain lack of intellect and/or this very particular softhead sentimentality a la Tony Parsons - that 70% goes to 90%. So pretty good, but it still means that 1 in 10 slip through the net.
LadyG didn't mention anything to do with immutable characteristics like looks. You did.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
One time was when she was parked up in the car park of her local pub waiting for her husband to arrive. To be fair to the police, it's not the greatest of pubs and I can very much understand that they might wonder what an M3 was doing there.
But then Hackney is dodgy as fuck, so I think the same applies to Butler I'm afraid.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
When I started going out with my ex from Ghana, years ago, I hadn't really encountered the police previously. Not sure I'd ever actually spoken to a policeman.
Within a month, I had conversed with a number of them. Apparently they had a deep and abiding concern for the welfare of drivers of large, black cars. With blacked out rear windows, as it happens...
Oh, and driven by black people.
The non-black people in the suburb in question drove similar vehicles. But the police showed an utterly bigoted lack of interest in their welfare.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
One time was when she was parked up in the car park of her local pub waiting for her husband to arrive. To be fair to the police, it's not the greatest of pubs and I can very much understand that they might wonder what an M3 was doing there.
But then Hackney is dodgy as fuck, so I think the same applies to Butler I'm afraid.
When I was 21, I had a job in F&B, used to regularly drive home in a boy-racer type car at 2 or 3 in the morning at the weekends. Used to get stopped every 3-4 weeks, this being in leafy Surrey and Hampshire. They were always fine once I'd blown into their bag and got the green light.
My personal view was if they stopped everyone driving late at night, the personal inconvenience was worth it, for picking off one idiot a night who thought it was okay to drive home from a nightclub before he or she killed anyone.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
I can tell Leavers simply on sight much of the time. They tend to be overweight and rather primitive looking. I reckon I can get 70% just on that basis. Then if I have a quick chat - listen carefully for a certain lack of intellect and/or this very particular softhead sentimentality a la Tony Parsons - that 70% goes to 90%. So pretty good, but it still means that 1 in 10 slip through the net.
LadyG didn't mention anything to do with immutable characteristics like looks. You did.
Where’s the full video Ms Butler? twitter.com/guardiannews/status/1293608926399864832?s=20
Since Dawn Butler's "full video" could not possibly show the police looking up the wrong registration number, what's your point?
My point is she Tweeted that she’d “recorded everything” then only released 1 minute of an 8 minute recording. The Police should release their body cam footage so we get the whole picture.
The police case is they stopped the car after the registration lookup error. If they claimed the car was careering all over the road, or had a funky smell from the window, there might be value but they are not claiming that.
A full video might show the police as unfailingly polite and apologetic or that Butler and her mate were abusive or uncooperative but even if all that were true, it would not address the reason of why the car was stopped in the first place. That is the crucial question and the rest is just a smokescreen.
It was a BMW. It will be as simple as that; not that the police can admit to that.
With blacked-out windows, as the police have already said.
If the tinted/blacked out windows broke the law then the rozzers would have issued a prohibition notice? Did they? If not why not? Oh because they were legal.
I only ask as someone who drives a vehicle with tinted windows.
They were not stopped because of the tinted windows - as you know - but the tinted windows meant they couldn’t see the occupants to “racially profile” them, as Ms Butler claims in her edited video.
Rear windows. Neither illegal, nor obscuring the occupants.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
When I started going out with my ex from Ghana, years ago, I hadn't really encountered the police previously. Not sure I'd ever actually spoken to a policeman.
Within a month, I had conversed with a number of them. Apparently they had a deep and abiding concern for the welfare of drivers of large, black cars. With blacked out rear windows, as it happens...
Oh, and driven by black people.
The non-black people in the suburb in question drove similar vehicles. But the police showed an utterly bigoted lack of interest in their welfare.
That's shocking.
As a former Tory MP once told me, he was raised to respect the police, then he started to have to deal with them.
Not so long ago a police officer ended up going to prison for trying to fit up a cabinet minister.
If they can fit up a cabinet minister then what chance the rest of us?
Can somebody explain how Johnson will be running on a hard Brexit ticket in 2024. Aren't we ending the transition period this December, is HYUFD implying we're going to delay ending it? Can't see that going down too well with Tory voters
He will be running on a ticket of staying out of the single market and customs union and controlling our own borders by retaining the new points system not returning to free movement and doing our own trade deals
Labour may very well be running on the same ticket. That wont be “hard Brexit” that will be “status quo”.
If Starmer ruled out returning to the single market and customs union he would lose Remainers back to the LDs
You’re delusional.
If Brexit is going fine, there will be no clamour for the Single Market, even amongst so called “Remainers”. If Brexit is not going fine, then a “status quo” position will have little electoral value to the Conservatives.
You’re looking at the next election through the eyes of 2019. That is in my opinion misguided.
Yeah I'm going to call bs on HYUFD's claims too.
If in 2024 Brexit has worked under Johnson's plans, it won't even be up for debate unless Starmer is a moron.
If we're still debating Brexit in 2024 something has gone badly wrong, or it will be a repeat of 2024 when other issues come into focus and the Tories suffer for it.
Great 2019 electoral strategy, it is likely to be dreadful in 2024. I am not surprised though, the Tory plan was get elected, Brexit, then they gave up.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
One time was when she was parked up in the car park of her local pub waiting for her husband to arrive. To be fair to the police, it's not the greatest of pubs and I can very much understand that they might wonder what an M3 was doing there.
But then Hackney is dodgy as fuck, so I think the same applies to Butler I'm afraid.
When I was 21, I had a job in F&B, used to regularly drive home in a boy-racer type car at 2 or 3 in the morning at the weekends. Used to get stopped every 3-4 weeks, this being in leafy Surrey and Hampshire. They were always fine once I'd blown into their bag and got the green light.
My personal view was if they stopped everyone driving late at night, the personal inconvenience was worth it, for picking off one idiot a night who thought it was okay to drive home from a nightclub before he or she killed anyone.
I've regularly been a designated driver on a night out as I don't care about drinking. In 15 years of driving I've not been stopped once. I guess that's a combination of resourcing and perhaps a view that drink driving isn't all that common these days (at least that type - plenty get done driving the morning after when they are still over the limit).
I think the ONS general deaths stats publication has been fantastic. I know the ONS were getting grief about GDP this morning, but the deaths stats release is top notch.
On the one hand I'm concerned that it took so long for someone to ask the question as to why the number of deaths weren't falling to the levels seen elsewhere. But on the other hand hopefully that means they were focussing on the job in hand rather than questioning the stats.
There is nothing wrong with ONS reporting of things like GDP, they are invariably comprehensive and as accurate as possible. The ONS can't stop the media cherry picking figures to grind an axe. Anyone interested in ONS news can always look at the reports and data themselves. It was ONS data that I looked at the morning to conclude that the UK has likely already seen half of the total GDP fall reversed.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
James O'Brien wannabes. "Everything is so tiresomely obvious, when will you guys finally get it?" They think everyone who voted or thinks differently to them has been conned by the politicians they disagree with
They think that Leavers are a motley collection of racists, fantasists and mugs. And they are totally wrong. Some are none of those things.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
When I started going out with my ex from Ghana, years ago, I hadn't really encountered the police previously. Not sure I'd ever actually spoken to a policeman.
Within a month, I had conversed with a number of them. Apparently they had a deep and abiding concern for the welfare of drivers of large, black cars. With blacked out rear windows, as it happens...
Oh, and driven by black people.
The non-black people in the suburb in question drove similar vehicles. But the police showed an utterly bigoted lack of interest in their welfare.
That's shocking.
As a former Tory MP once told me, he was raised to respect the police, then he started to have to deal with them.
Not so long ago a police officer ended up going to prison for trying to fit up a cabinet minister.
If they can fit up a cabinet minister then what chance the rest of us?
Most police are fine (just like any profession) - Its the politics that create bad policing .
I think the ONS general deaths stats publication has been fantastic. I know the ONS were getting grief about GDP this morning, but the deaths stats release is top notch.
On the one hand I'm concerned that it took so long for someone to ask the question as to why the number of deaths weren't falling to the levels seen elsewhere. But on the other hand hopefully that means they were focussing on the job in hand rather than questioning the stats.
There is nothing wrong with ONS reporting of things like GDP, they are invariably comprehensive and as accurate as possible. The ONS can't stop the media cherry picking figures to grind an axe. Anyone interested in ONS news can always look at the reports and data themselves. It was ONS data that I looked at the morning to conclude that the UK has likely already seen half of the total GDP fall reversed.
I think the complaints are about construction stats, but I don't know much about that. But I agree 100% with you that you're best off looking at the reports rather than listening to the journalists. Islam on BBC tonight just showed the Q2 comparison stats, which is misleading as was pointed out on here.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
One time was when she was parked up in the car park of her local pub waiting for her husband to arrive. To be fair to the police, it's not the greatest of pubs and I can very much understand that they might wonder what an M3 was doing there.
But then Hackney is dodgy as fuck, so I think the same applies to Butler I'm afraid.
When I was 21, I had a job in F&B, used to regularly drive home in a boy-racer type car at 2 or 3 in the morning at the weekends. Used to get stopped every 3-4 weeks, this being in leafy Surrey and Hampshire. They were always fine once I'd blown into their bag and got the green light.
My personal view was if they stopped everyone driving late at night, the personal inconvenience was worth it, for picking off one idiot a night who thought it was okay to drive home from a nightclub before he or she killed anyone.
I've regularly been a designated driver on a night out as I don't care about drinking. In 15 years of driving I've not been stopped once. I guess that's a combination of resourcing and perhaps a view that drink driving isn't all that common these days (at least that type - plenty get done driving the morning after when they are still over the limit).
I used to regularly drive from the North to the South at odd hours of the night and never got stopped once. I drove a 8 year old Mazda2, so I don't know if that made me unappealing to stop.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
I can tell Leavers simply on sight much of the time. They tend to be overweight and rather primitive looking. I reckon I can get 70% just on that basis. Then if I have a quick chat - listen carefully for a certain lack of intellect and/or this very particular softhead sentimentality a la Tony Parsons - that 70% goes to 90%. So pretty good, but it still means that 1 in 10 slip through the net.
All this is true, but nonetheless that Lady G and isam do seem to be a bit up themselves, mildly overmuch...
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
One time was when she was parked up in the car park of her local pub waiting for her husband to arrive. To be fair to the police, it's not the greatest of pubs and I can very much understand that they might wonder what an M3 was doing there.
But then Hackney is dodgy as fuck, so I think the same applies to Butler I'm afraid.
When I was 21, I had a job in F&B, used to regularly drive home in a boy-racer type car at 2 or 3 in the morning at the weekends. Used to get stopped every 3-4 weeks, this being in leafy Surrey and Hampshire. They were always fine once I'd blown into their bag and got the green light.
My personal view was if they stopped everyone driving late at night, the personal inconvenience was worth it, for picking off one idiot a night who thought it was okay to drive home from a nightclub before he or she killed anyone.
I've regularly been a designated driver on a night out as I don't care about drinking. In 15 years of driving I've not been stopped once. I guess that's a combination of resourcing and perhaps a view that drink driving isn't all that common these days (at least that type - plenty get done driving the morning after when they are still over the limit).
I used to regularly drive from the North to the South at odd hours of the night and never got stopped once. I drove a 8 year old Mazda2, so I don't know if that made me unappealing to stop.
I overtook what turned out to be an unmarked police car on the M40 late at night and suddenly saw it put blue flashing lights on. I thought "uh oh", but it proceeded to tear off down the motorway. Generally I think they have better things to do than pull people over (even if they might not necessarily be sticking to the speed limit).
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
You must be bored trying to wind people up.
Was it that bloke Eadric or that bloke Byronic who claimed to have voted Remain? They were certainly both petulant, whiny & narcissistic.
No idea who they are, but their narcissism seems justified, given how much you still obsess about these departed PBers?
The last few days in London have felt distinctly odd. Like we have crossed some weather Rubicon.
I've been here for even hotter days (tho all these are close to the record), but this last week feels like a climatic step change. I don't know why. But it does.
Is it the length and relentlessness? English tradition is two hot days and a thunderstorm that breaks the heat. We've had six days, six nights and no particular letup. And all those *&##$%?! thunderstorms this afternoon went to the west of London, not the east.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
You must be bored trying to wind people up.
Was it that bloke Eadric or that bloke Byronic who claimed to have voted Remain? They were certainly both petulant, whiny & narcissistic.
No idea who they are, but their narcissism seems justified, given how much you still obsess out these departed PBers
Have they departed? That’s a relief given what Eadric and SeanT got up to on his last thread.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
James O'Brien wannabes. "Everything is so tiresomely obvious, when will you guys finally get it?" They think everyone who voted or thinks differently to them has been conned by the politicians they disagree with
They think that Leavers are a motley collection of racists, fantasists and mugs. And they are totally wrong. Some are none of those things.
i voted remain myself as i thought on balance the EU gave more freedom to the individual than it took but the reason why Remain lost was the sneering of the liberal establishment of anyone who declared they would vote leave - the close vote would have been won without that sneering . A failure of the so called political elite due to them being out of touch so much they actually thought anyone wanting to leave the EU was somehow inferior.
And yet, as has been pointed out earlier, the daily death update published on the main gov.uk Covid dashboard *this afternoon* was 77. When the death count arranged by date for England is now revealed to have been under 20 for pretty much an entire month, and we know that similar stats for the remainder of the country have ranged anywhere between zero and about 4 or 5.
They know they're publishing a total load of bollocks but they still keep on doing it.
I think the ONS general deaths stats publication has been fantastic. I know the ONS were getting grief about GDP this morning, but the deaths stats release is top notch.
On the one hand I'm concerned that it took so long for someone to ask the question as to why the number of deaths weren't falling to the levels seen elsewhere. But on the other hand hopefully that means they were focussing on the job in hand rather than questioning the stats.
There is nothing wrong with ONS reporting of things like GDP, they are invariably comprehensive and as accurate as possible. The ONS can't stop the media cherry picking figures to grind an axe. Anyone interested in ONS news can always look at the reports and data themselves. It was ONS data that I looked at the morning to conclude that the UK has likely already seen half of the total GDP fall reversed.
I think the complaints are about construction stats, but I don't know much about that. But I agree 100% with you that you're best off looking at the reports rather than listening to the journalists. Islam on BBC tonight just showed the Q2 comparison stats, which is misleading as was pointed out on here.
Construction does seem to be hard to measure for some reason or other. Generally though the ONS is a model of how to collect and analyse statistics to inform debate and policy, and they are very transparent about what they do. I find their website extremely useful for answering all sorts of questions I have about the state of the nation.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
One time was when she was parked up in the car park of her local pub waiting for her husband to arrive. To be fair to the police, it's not the greatest of pubs and I can very much understand that they might wonder what an M3 was doing there.
But then Hackney is dodgy as fuck, so I think the same applies to Butler I'm afraid.
When I was 21, I had a job in F&B, used to regularly drive home in a boy-racer type car at 2 or 3 in the morning at the weekends. Used to get stopped every 3-4 weeks, this being in leafy Surrey and Hampshire. They were always fine once I'd blown into their bag and got the green light.
My personal view was if they stopped everyone driving late at night, the personal inconvenience was worth it, for picking off one idiot a night who thought it was okay to drive home from a nightclub before he or she killed anyone.
I've regularly been a designated driver on a night out as I don't care about drinking. In 15 years of driving I've not been stopped once. I guess that's a combination of resourcing and perhaps a view that drink driving isn't all that common these days (at least that type - plenty get done driving the morning after when they are still over the limit).
Ironically I don't ever remember being stopped when I was 'Des' leaving the nightclub with three or four drunk idiots doing their best to distract me, it was always when I was on my own coming back from work. Sometimes I'd be stinking of beer as I'd been changing the barrels at work, which always made for a fun conversation with Plod.
This was '99-'01, I think attitudes have changed somewhat since then. Of half a dozen acquaintances who liked to drive home regularly from nightclubs, over the course of a few years every single one of them got caught and served a ban.
I had a Beemer convertible in London for 5 years. Often drove it late at night all over town. Never stopped. By the police, I mean. Obviously I did sometimes stop of my own volition - traffic lights etc.
My son is mixed race and has a bunch of black mates who he sometimes hangs out with in and out of (non Beemer) cars. Been stopped a fair few times.
Can somebody explain how Johnson will be running on a hard Brexit ticket in 2024. Aren't we ending the transition period this December, is HYUFD implying we're going to delay ending it? Can't see that going down too well with Tory voters
He will be running on a ticket of staying out of the single market and customs union and controlling our own borders by retaining the new points system not returning to free movement and doing our own trade deals
Labour may very well be running on the same ticket. That wont be “hard Brexit” that will be “status quo”.
If Starmer ruled out returning to the single market and customs union he would lose Remainers back to the LDs
You’re delusional.
If Brexit is going fine, there will be no clamour for the Single Market, even amongst so called “Remainers”. If Brexit is not going fine, then a “status quo” position will have little electoral value to the Conservatives.
You’re looking at the next election through the eyes of 2019. That is in my opinion misguided.
Yeah I'm going to call bs on HYUFD's claims too.
If in 2024 Brexit has worked under Johnson's plans, it won't even be up for debate unless Starmer is a moron.
If we're still debating Brexit in 2024 something has gone badly wrong, or it will be a repeat of 2024 when other issues come into focus and the Tories suffer for it.
Great 2019 electoral strategy, it is likely to be dreadful in 2024. I am not surprised though, the Tory plan was get elected, Brexit, then they gave up.
I expect 2024 will be "Got Brexit Done."
EDIT: In fact Rishi's first budget had him repeat phrasing along the lines of "getting things done," "gets things done," etc.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
I can tell Leavers simply on sight much of the time. They tend to be overweight and rather primitive looking. I reckon I can get 70% just on that basis. Then if I have a quick chat - listen carefully for a certain lack of intellect and/or this very particular softhead sentimentality a la Tony Parsons - that 70% goes to 90%. So pretty good, but it still means that 1 in 10 slip through the net.
LadyG didn't mention anything to do with immutable characteristics like looks. You did.
Yes, another characteristic of Remainers is their easy, unselfaware recourse to pejorative visual stereotyping mixed with quasi-racist sneering (at white people)
"Oh look at those fat white people God they must be Leave-voters"
We can thus conclude that Kinabalu parks his Prius at Remoaner Central
It’s shocking that Gavin Williamson hasn’t resigned in shame never to be seen again. Even if he was dealt a difficult hand his response has been appalling, for outcomes which were totally predictable. The ludicrous amendment involving mock exams is just the poo on the shoe.
The shock was that he attained cabinet rank. Everything after that is pitiful rather than shocking.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
When I started going out with my ex from Ghana, years ago, I hadn't really encountered the police previously. Not sure I'd ever actually spoken to a policeman.
Within a month, I had conversed with a number of them. Apparently they had a deep and abiding concern for the welfare of drivers of large, black cars. With blacked out rear windows, as it happens...
Oh, and driven by black people.
The non-black people in the suburb in question drove similar vehicles. But the police showed an utterly bigoted lack of interest in their welfare.
That's shocking.
As a former Tory MP once told me, he was raised to respect the police, then he started to have to deal with them.
Not so long ago a police officer ended up going to prison for trying to fit up a cabinet minister.
If they can fit up a cabinet minister then what chance the rest of us?
Most police are fine (just like any profession) - Its the politics that create bad policing .
When I was growing up in Oxford, a couple of contemporaries had run ins with the police.
One was knocked down by a car, walking home from working in a pub. A policeman found him - a long haired young man, bloodied up, semi conscious in the gutter, smelling of booze.
So, obviously, he had to give him a bit of tune up.
Which was all caught, hilariously, on early CCTV - the hit-and-run, the passage-a-tabac.
Hilariously, since the policeman's lawyers tried to claim that filming people with CCTV was against his (the policeman's) rights. Yes, in the days before CCTV was a police thing....
The funny thing was, at the same time this was going on, another policeman was being drummed out of the police for a mistake with expenses. That amounted to pence. Yes, not even one pound. But apparently, Policemen Must Be Like Caesars WIfe.
My friend of the long hair pointed that out, in the paper, in the column next to the reporting on his case.
There is another funny story I can tell, of why no-one in modern politics believes the police. It's another Oxford story....
And yet, as has been pointed out earlier, the daily death update published on the main gov.uk Covid dashboard *this afternoon* was 77. When the death count arranged by date for England is now revealed to have been under 20 for pretty much an entire month, and we know that similar stats for the remainder of the country have ranged anywhere between zero and about 4 or 5.
They know they're publishing a total load of bollocks but they still keep on doing it.
On the thread topic - I wonder how much the figures are reflective of the belief that Scotland has had zero deaths for weeks whilst England had been registering dozens, nearly hundreds...
Can somebody explain how Johnson will be running on a hard Brexit ticket in 2024. Aren't we ending the transition period this December, is HYUFD implying we're going to delay ending it? Can't see that going down too well with Tory voters
He will be running on a ticket of staying out of the single market and customs union and controlling our own borders by retaining the new points system not returning to free movement and doing our own trade deals
Labour may very well be running on the same ticket. That wont be “hard Brexit” that will be “status quo”.
If Starmer ruled out returning to the single market and customs union he would lose Remainers back to the LDs
You’re delusional.
If Brexit is going fine, there will be no clamour for the Single Market, even amongst so called “Remainers”. If Brexit is not going fine, then a “status quo” position will have little electoral value to the Conservatives.
You’re looking at the next election through the eyes of 2019. That is in my opinion misguided.
Yeah I'm going to call bs on HYUFD's claims too.
If in 2024 Brexit has worked under Johnson's plans, it won't even be up for debate unless Starmer is a moron.
If we're still debating Brexit in 2024 something has gone badly wrong, or it will be a repeat of 2024 when other issues come into focus and the Tories suffer for it.
Great 2019 electoral strategy, it is likely to be dreadful in 2024. I am not surprised though, the Tory plan was get elected, Brexit, then they gave up.
I expect 2024 will be "Got Brexit Done."
EDIT: In fact Rishi's first budget had him repeat phrasing along the lines of "getting things done," "gets things done," etc.
Do you think the Tories will get re-elected on that alone? Surely not.
I think we underestimate how quickly things can change in a five year period. We weren't talking about the EU much even 5 years ago.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
I can tell Leavers simply on sight much of the time. They tend to be overweight and rather primitive looking. I reckon I can get 70% just on that basis. Then if I have a quick chat - listen carefully for a certain lack of intellect and/or this very particular softhead sentimentality a la Tony Parsons - that 70% goes to 90%. So pretty good, but it still means that 1 in 10 slip through the net.
LadyG didn't mention anything to do with immutable characteristics like looks. You did.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
I can tell Leavers simply on sight much of the time. They tend to be overweight and rather primitive looking. I reckon I can get 70% just on that basis. Then if I have a quick chat - listen carefully for a certain lack of intellect and/or this very particular softhead sentimentality a la Tony Parsons - that 70% goes to 90%. So pretty good, but it still means that 1 in 10 slip through the net.
LadyG didn't mention anything to do with immutable characteristics like looks. You did.
Yes, another characteristic of Remainers is their easy, unselfaware recourse to pejorative visual stereotyping mixed with quasi-racist sneering (at white people)
"Oh look at those fat white people God they must be Leave-voters"
We can thus conclude that Kinabalu parks his Prius at Remoaner Central
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
One time was when she was parked up in the car park of her local pub waiting for her husband to arrive. To be fair to the police, it's not the greatest of pubs and I can very much understand that they might wonder what an M3 was doing there.
But then Hackney is dodgy as fuck, so I think the same applies to Butler I'm afraid.
When I was 21, I had a job in F&B, used to regularly drive home in a boy-racer type car at 2 or 3 in the morning at the weekends. Used to get stopped every 3-4 weeks, this being in leafy Surrey and Hampshire. They were always fine once I'd blown into their bag and got the green light.
My personal view was if they stopped everyone driving late at night, the personal inconvenience was worth it, for picking off one idiot a night who thought it was okay to drive home from a nightclub before he or she killed anyone.
I've regularly been a designated driver on a night out as I don't care about drinking. In 15 years of driving I've not been stopped once. I guess that's a combination of resourcing and perhaps a view that drink driving isn't all that common these days (at least that type - plenty get done driving the morning after when they are still over the limit).
I used to regularly drive from the North to the South at odd hours of the night and never got stopped once. I drove a 8 year old Mazda2, so I don't know if that made me unappealing to stop.
I overtook what turned out to be an unmarked police car on the M40 late at night and suddenly saw it put blue flashing lights on. I thought "uh oh", but it proceeded to tear off down the motorway. Generally I think they have better things to do than pull people over (even if they might not necessarily be sticking to the speed limit).
Back in the day I had a friend who had an old Riley Elf. It had no MOT, rust holes, he dressed like Neil from the young ones, smoked dope, had the windscreen wipers bent forward with washing up gloves, so the hands would wave as he drove along. The windscreen washers were turned sideways so he could squit pedestrians and other drivers at junctions.
He never got stopped by the police. Hiding in plain sight.
On the other hand he was the only guy in our party who got strip searched by French customs, going into the country. Incidentally if ever strip searched by French customs, best not take the piss out of them while they are putting their gloves on...
And yet, as has been pointed out earlier, the daily death update published on the main gov.uk Covid dashboard *this afternoon* was 77. When the death count arranged by date for England is now revealed to have been under 20 for pretty much an entire month, and we know that similar stats for the remainder of the country have ranged anywhere between zero and about 4 or 5.
They know they're publishing a total load of bollocks but they still keep on doing it.
On the thread topic - I wonder how much the figures are reflective of the belief that Scotland has had zero deaths for weeks whilst England had been registering dozens, nearly hundreds...
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
When I started going out with my ex from Ghana, years ago, I hadn't really encountered the police previously. Not sure I'd ever actually spoken to a policeman.
Within a month, I had conversed with a number of them. Apparently they had a deep and abiding concern for the welfare of drivers of large, black cars. With blacked out rear windows, as it happens...
Oh, and driven by black people.
The non-black people in the suburb in question drove similar vehicles. But the police showed an utterly bigoted lack of interest in their welfare.
That's shocking.
As a former Tory MP once told me, he was raised to respect the police, then he started to have to deal with them.
Not so long ago a police officer ended up going to prison for trying to fit up a cabinet minister.
If they can fit up a cabinet minister then what chance the rest of us?
Most police are fine (just like any profession) - Its the politics that create bad policing .
I broadly agree. Most of my dealings with them the vast majority have been helpful, kind and professional. However. If you are a wannabe authoritarian with issues around only being able to boost your self worth by belittling and bullying others... Well. You can see the attraction of the job. And the automatic default of most to defer to and believe these few helps immensely.
It’s shocking that Gavin Williamson hasn’t resigned in shame never to be seen again. Even if he was dealt a difficult hand his response has been appalling, for outcomes which were totally predictable. The ludicrous amendment involving mock exams is just the poo on the shoe.
The shock was that he attained cabinet rank. Everything after that is pitiful rather than shocking.
It is right he has a difficult hand but he was a member of the cabinet and ES that ,imo , needlessly cancelled the exams in the first place . He also has had 4 months to get it right ,anticipate the problems etc - Also politicians should not interfere really with grades except make sure that teachers know how it will be standardised before they compile students results. You cannot change the rules after the event when teachers have assumed those rules will be in place. He needs to resign or be sacked. His stint as Defence Minister was also a disgrace
And yet, as has been pointed out earlier, the daily death update published on the main gov.uk Covid dashboard *this afternoon* was 77. When the death count arranged by date for England is now revealed to have been under 20 for pretty much an entire month, and we know that similar stats for the remainder of the country have ranged anywhere between zero and about 4 or 5.
They know they're publishing a total load of bollocks but they still keep on doing it.
On the thread topic - I wonder how much the figures are reflective of the belief that Scotland has had zero deaths for weeks whilst England had been registering dozens, nearly hundreds...
It’s shocking that Gavin Williamson hasn’t resigned in shame never to be seen again. Even if he was dealt a difficult hand his response has been appalling, for outcomes which were totally predictable. The ludicrous amendment involving mock exams is just the poo on the shoe.
The shock was that he attained cabinet rank. Everything after that is pitiful rather than shocking.
Well yes quite, but one get’s the impression that having reached his exalted rank he didn’t actually realise that Cabinet members have responsibilities and that they are actually paid money to do a job which he appears to have made absolutely no efforts whatsoever.
Where’s the full video Ms Butler? twitter.com/guardiannews/status/1293608926399864832?s=20
Since Dawn Butler's "full video" could not possibly show the police looking up the wrong registration number, what's your point?
My point is she Tweeted that she’d “recorded everything” then only released 1 minute of an 8 minute recording. The Police should release their body cam footage so we get the whole picture.
The police case is they stopped the car after the registration lookup error. If they claimed the car was careering all over the road, or had a funky smell from the window, there might be value but they are not claiming that.
A full video might show the police as unfailingly polite and apologetic or that Butler and her mate were abusive or uncooperative but even if all that were true, it would not address the reason of why the car was stopped in the first place. That is the crucial question and the rest is just a smokescreen.
It was a BMW. It will be as simple as that; not that the police can admit to that.
With blacked-out windows, as the police have already said.
If the tinted/blacked out windows broke the law then the rozzers would have issued a prohibition notice? Did they? If not why not? Oh because they were legal.
I only ask as someone who drives a vehicle with tinted windows.
They were not stopped because of the tinted windows - as you know - but the tinted windows meant they couldn’t see the occupants to “racially profile” them, as Ms Butler claims in her edited video.
Rear windows. Neither illegal, nor obscuring the occupants.
If the police car was behind them it would.
FFS, that is not a reason for pulling someone over.
NPR did a feature on particulates some time in the last year, but before COVID, which came to that very same conclusion. This looks like very good supporting evidence.
That's a predictably grim thread, and almost certainly accurate (Sam F knows his stuff).
If it's relatively strong students in relatively weak institutions with large cohorts being marked down a lot, that'll be students in FE colleges (which tend to be a bit of a Red Wall type of place phenomenon) stitched up.
This fiasco ain't over.
I get the impression they've forgotten about the value added scores, which show up variations between cohorts.
If so, they are going to get absolutely destroyed.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
When I started going out with my ex from Ghana, years ago, I hadn't really encountered the police previously. Not sure I'd ever actually spoken to a policeman.
Within a month, I had conversed with a number of them. Apparently they had a deep and abiding concern for the welfare of drivers of large, black cars. With blacked out rear windows, as it happens...
Oh, and driven by black people.
The non-black people in the suburb in question drove similar vehicles. But the police showed an utterly bigoted lack of interest in their welfare.
That's shocking.
As a former Tory MP once told me, he was raised to respect the police, then he started to have to deal with them.
Not so long ago a police officer ended up going to prison for trying to fit up a cabinet minister.
If they can fit up a cabinet minister then what chance the rest of us?
Most police are fine (just like any profession) - Its the politics that create bad policing .
I broadly agree. Most of my dealings with them the vast majority have been helpful, kind and professional. However. If you are a wannabe authoritarian with issues around only being able to boost your self worth by belittling and bullying others... Well. You can see the attraction of the job. And the automatic default of most to defer to and believe these few helps immensely.
I think it's getting a lot better, the current climate of everyone having a video camera certainly stops things getting out of hand in most cases, and police forces services are much more careful in their selection than they used to be.
It’s shocking that Gavin Williamson hasn’t resigned in shame never to be seen again. Even if he was dealt a difficult hand his response has been appalling, for outcomes which were totally predictable. The ludicrous amendment involving mock exams is just the poo on the shoe.
The shock was that he attained cabinet rank. Everything after that is pitiful rather than shocking.
Well yes quite, but one get’s the impression that having reached his exalted rank he didn’t actually realise that Cabinet members have responsibilities and that they are actually paid money to do a job which he appears to have made absolutely no efforts whatsoever.
It’s not a surprise that a useless eff remains a useless eff once he is in cabinet.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
I can tell Leavers simply on sight much of the time. They tend to be overweight and rather primitive looking. I reckon I can get 70% just on that basis. Then if I have a quick chat - listen carefully for a certain lack of intellect and/or this very particular softhead sentimentality a la Tony Parsons - that 70% goes to 90%. So pretty good, but it still means that 1 in 10 slip through the net.
LadyG didn't mention anything to do with immutable characteristics like looks. You did.
Yes, another characteristic of Remainers is their easy, unselfaware recourse to pejorative visual stereotyping mixed with quasi-racist sneering (at white people)
"Oh look at those fat white people God they must be Leave-voters"
We can thus conclude that Kinabalu parks his Prius at Remoaner Central
"Gammon" is undoubtedly a racial slur.
It's pretty fucking blatant, as well. It actively refers to pink skin colour. The same way "sooty" or "darkie" or the various versions of the N word refer to blackness.
In a few years "gammon" will be seen in this light and everyone who uses it now will have to do struggle sessions of apology, etc etc. And so the world wearyingly continues.
Can somebody explain how Johnson will be running on a hard Brexit ticket in 2024. Aren't we ending the transition period this December, is HYUFD implying we're going to delay ending it? Can't see that going down too well with Tory voters
He will be running on a ticket of staying out of the single market and customs union and controlling our own borders by retaining the new points system not returning to free movement and doing our own trade deals
Labour may very well be running on the same ticket. That wont be “hard Brexit” that will be “status quo”.
If Starmer ruled out returning to the single market and customs union he would lose Remainers back to the LDs
You’re delusional.
If Brexit is going fine, there will be no clamour for the Single Market, even amongst so called “Remainers”. If Brexit is not going fine, then a “status quo” position will have little electoral value to the Conservatives.
You’re looking at the next election through the eyes of 2019. That is in my opinion misguided.
Yeah I'm going to call bs on HYUFD's claims too.
If in 2024 Brexit has worked under Johnson's plans, it won't even be up for debate unless Starmer is a moron.
If we're still debating Brexit in 2024 something has gone badly wrong, or it will be a repeat of 2024 when other issues come into focus and the Tories suffer for it.
Great 2019 electoral strategy, it is likely to be dreadful in 2024. I am not surprised though, the Tory plan was get elected, Brexit, then they gave up.
I confess that I get a bit nervous when @HYUFD likes my posts outlining how to keep Brexit in peril for 2024. I do think that's the best (maybe only) way to keep Johnson's coalition together, and that once the Brexit endstate becomes concrete, the 40% or so who currently think it's a good idea will fracture terminally. And that nobody seems that serious about preparing for the extra faff involved in a Canadian-style relationship with the EU.
But trying to make 2024 about whether the UK uses its new freedoms or just orbits the EU feels insane. If the government thinks it can use this freedom positively, get on with it, and reap the reward in 2024. If it doesn't, that should tell the government something important.
Sent you an email with links to papers/articles on the benefits or otherwise of quick but less sensitive/specific COVID testing. Haven't yet read them, but thought you might be interested
And yet, as has been pointed out earlier, the daily death update published on the main gov.uk Covid dashboard *this afternoon* was 77. When the death count arranged by date for England is now revealed to have been under 20 for pretty much an entire month, and we know that similar stats for the remainder of the country have ranged anywhere between zero and about 4 or 5.
They know they're publishing a total load of bollocks but they still keep on doing it.
On the thread topic - I wonder how much the figures are reflective of the belief that Scotland has had zero deaths for weeks whilst England had been registering dozens, nearly hundreds...
And so, the mortality rate over the period in question in that article is approximately the same in England as it is in Scotland, i.e. one in a million. Quelle surprise.
Where has this idea Biden can't string a sentence together come from?
He's actually pretty good, he's not Obama but he's not bad. I thought he'd be terrible, he might even do a decent job in the debates
He's doing fine tonight. Hammering Trump. Battle for a soul of the nation.
The "Biden is a demented vegetable" theme is Putinist propaganda. As for debates, Uncle Joe has had his stumbles, but his track record as a debater is pretty good - just ask Judge (never Justice) Bork.
Can somebody explain how Johnson will be running on a hard Brexit ticket in 2024. Aren't we ending the transition period this December, is HYUFD implying we're going to delay ending it? Can't see that going down too well with Tory voters
He will be running on a ticket of staying out of the single market and customs union and controlling our own borders by retaining the new points system not returning to free movement and doing our own trade deals
Labour may very well be running on the same ticket. That wont be “hard Brexit” that will be “status quo”.
If Starmer ruled out returning to the single market and customs union he would lose Remainers back to the LDs
You’re delusional.
If Brexit is going fine, there will be no clamour for the Single Market, even amongst so called “Remainers”. If Brexit is not going fine, then a “status quo” position will have little electoral value to the Conservatives.
You’re looking at the next election through the eyes of 2019. That is in my opinion misguided.
Yeah I'm going to call bs on HYUFD's claims too.
If in 2024 Brexit has worked under Johnson's plans, it won't even be up for debate unless Starmer is a moron.
If we're still debating Brexit in 2024 something has gone badly wrong, or it will be a repeat of 2024 when other issues come into focus and the Tories suffer for it.
Great 2019 electoral strategy, it is likely to be dreadful in 2024. I am not surprised though, the Tory plan was get elected, Brexit, then they gave up.
I confess that I get a bit nervous when @HYUFD likes my posts outlining how to keep Brexit in peril for 2024. I do think that's the best (maybe only) way to keep Johnson's coalition together, and that once the Brexit endstate becomes concrete, the 40% or so who currently think it's a good idea will fracture terminally. And that nobody seems that serious about preparing for the extra faff involved in a Canadian-style relationship with the EU.
But trying to make 2024 about whether the UK uses its new freedoms or just orbits the EU feels insane. If the government thinks it can use this freedom positively, get on with it, and reap the reward in 2024. If it doesn't, that should tell the government something important.
Okay but how is Brexit kept in peril, this is what I am trying to understand.
We've either left on No Deal or a Johnson deal in which case it goes as well or as badly as it does, or we've got stuck in which case it's sounds of betrayal.
I can't see how in five years we have another Brexit election, it just doesn't make sense to me - I'm happy to be proved wrong I just can't understand how it happens.
I agree with your point on the voting coalition though. Currently Johnson's 44% or thereabouts is pretty strong around Brexit. Probably a good proportion of that stays with him whatever (maybe mid 30s, as Cameron achieved) but it starts splintering all over the place when Brexit means something concrete.
I believe he will disappoint at least some of his coalition and polling parity will come from the Tories falling, not Labour going up much. Labour probably gets stuck around 40% (although it did poll 45% for a bit after 2017, I wonder where those voters are now) and the Tories probably fall to a similar level.
Do you think my sister should have kicked off about being harassed by police when she drove an M3?
Depends on the context.
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
When I started going out with my ex from Ghana, years ago, I hadn't really encountered the police previously. Not sure I'd ever actually spoken to a policeman.
Within a month, I had conversed with a number of them. Apparently they had a deep and abiding concern for the welfare of drivers of large, black cars. With blacked out rear windows, as it happens...
Oh, and driven by black people.
The non-black people in the suburb in question drove similar vehicles. But the police showed an utterly bigoted lack of interest in their welfare.
That's shocking.
As a former Tory MP once told me, he was raised to respect the police, then he started to have to deal with them.
Not so long ago a police officer ended up going to prison for trying to fit up a cabinet minister.
If they can fit up a cabinet minister then what chance the rest of us?
Most police are fine (just like any profession) - Its the politics that create bad policing .
The police’s refusal to follow the recommendations of the Henriques Report is an utter disgrace. They are basically waving two fingers at the basic tenets of English criminal law.
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
James O'Brien wannabes. "Everything is so tiresomely obvious, when will you guys finally get it?" They think everyone who voted or thinks differently to them has been conned by the politicians they disagree with
They think that Leavers are a motley collection of racists, fantasists and mugs. And they are totally wrong. Some are none of those things.
i voted remain myself as i thought on balance the EU gave more freedom to the individual than it took but the reason why Remain lost was the sneering of the liberal establishment of anyone who declared they would vote leave - the close vote would have been won without that sneering . A failure of the so called political elite due to them being out of touch so much they actually thought anyone wanting to leave the EU was somehow inferior.
I'm simply expressing the non PC truth as I see it. Telling it as it is. It's patronizing to do otherwise. And as for all this "sneering", are you sure you saw lots of that during the campaign and are not just regurgitating the received wisdom of the right wing blog-sphere? I mean, I remember that rather ghastly Geldof Farage thing on the river but apart from that ...
Sent you an email with links to papers/articles on the benefits or otherwise of quick but less sensitive/specific COVID testing. Haven't yet read them, but thought you might be interested
"If students want to use a valid mock result they would use the appeals process and would need to tell their school or college who will then provide the necessary evidence to their exam board. Schools and colleges will also be able to appeal if they believe their historic data does not reflect the ability of their current students – that may be because they have experienced a recent change in leadership or because they have one or a number of exceptional students.
"All three grades will hold exactly the same value with universities, colleges and employers, and similar arrangements if necessary will apply to vocational and technical qualifications. In the event that any students do want to appeal their grades, we have asked universities to hold places open for them until September 7 and I know that exam boards will do everything they can to conclude appeals in good time."
Where’s the full video Ms Butler? twitter.com/guardiannews/status/1293608926399864832?s=20
Since Dawn Butler's "full video" could not possibly show the police looking up the wrong registration number, what's your point?
My point is she Tweeted that she’d “recorded everything” then only released 1 minute of an 8 minute recording. The Police should release their body cam footage so we get the whole picture.
The police case is they stopped the car after the registration lookup error. If they claimed the car was careering all over the road, or had a funky smell from the window, there might be value but they are not claiming that.
A full video might show the police as unfailingly polite and apologetic or that Butler and her mate were abusive or uncooperative but even if all that were true, it would not address the reason of why the car was stopped in the first place. That is the crucial question and the rest is just a smokescreen.
It was a BMW. It will be as simple as that; not that the police can admit to that.
With blacked-out windows, as the police have already said.
If the tinted/blacked out windows broke the law then the rozzers would have issued a prohibition notice? Did they? If not why not? Oh because they were legal.
I only ask as someone who drives a vehicle with tinted windows.
They were not stopped because of the tinted windows - as you know - but the tinted windows meant they couldn’t see the occupants to “racially profile” them, as Ms Butler claims in her edited video.
Rear windows. Neither illegal, nor obscuring the occupants.
If the police car was behind them it would.
FFS, that is not a reason for pulling someone over.
Wasn't the reason they pulled them over that a policeman entered the number plate incorrectly into the computer?
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
James O'Brien wannabes. "Everything is so tiresomely obvious, when will you guys finally get it?" They think everyone who voted or thinks differently to them has been conned by the politicians they disagree with
They think that Leavers are a motley collection of racists, fantasists and mugs. And they are totally wrong. Some are none of those things.
i voted remain myself as i thought on balance the EU gave more freedom to the individual than it took but the reason why Remain lost was the sneering of the liberal establishment of anyone who declared they would vote leave - the close vote would have been won without that sneering . A failure of the so called political elite due to them being out of touch so much they actually thought anyone wanting to leave the EU was somehow inferior.
I'm simply expressing the non PC truth as I see it. Telling it as it is. It's patronizing to do otherwise. And as for all this "sneering", are you sure you saw lots of that during the campaign and are not just regurgitating the received wisdom of the right wing blog-sphere? I mean, I remember that rather ghastly Geldof Farage thing on the river but apart from that ...
Yes i am sure - I was actually a Civil Servant at the time and most of my middle class university educated colleagues were posting all sorts of ridicule and sneering of leavers - One older colleague was actually a leaver and got so much rubbish thrown at him about being a UKIPer (bad insult in the Civil Service) and talking behind his back it was frustrating to me as I knew it would derail the remain cause - one as I said I supported
There's even a self-isolation hotline he could have called.
You can tell Remainers even when they are talking about something entirely different (like this). Their comments/tweets always have this petulant, whiney, narcissistic, personally entitled and recently affronted quality.
They probably sound like this when they are discussing breakfast. Ghastly wankers.
It occurs to me these Remainers are the modern equivalent of "Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells". Whatever subject has alerted them, their mental response is comically predictable in tone and attitude.
James O'Brien wannabes. "Everything is so tiresomely obvious, when will you guys finally get it?" They think everyone who voted or thinks differently to them has been conned by the politicians they disagree with
They think that Leavers are a motley collection of racists, fantasists and mugs. And they are totally wrong. Some are none of those things.
i voted remain myself as i thought on balance the EU gave more freedom to the individual than it took but the reason why Remain lost was the sneering of the liberal establishment of anyone who declared they would vote leave - the close vote would have been won without that sneering . A failure of the so called political elite due to them being out of touch so much they actually thought anyone wanting to leave the EU was somehow inferior.
I'm simply expressing the non PC truth as I see it. Telling it as it is. It's patronizing to do otherwise. And as for all this "sneering", are you sure you saw lots of that during the campaign and are not just regurgitating the received wisdom of the right wing blog-sphere? I mean, I remember that rather ghastly Geldof Farage thing on the river but apart from that ...
Yes i am sure - I was actually a Civil Servant at the time and most of my middle class university educated colleagues were posting all sorts of ridicule and sneering of leavers - One older colleague was actually a leaver and got so much rubbish thrown at him about being a UKIPer (bad insult in the Civil Service) and talking behind his back it was frustrating to me as I knew it would derail the remain cause - one as I said I supported
Remain completely cocked it up as you are right to point out.
I do find it frustrating though that people that just want to talk about what's going wrong or how things could be done, get told about talking the country down.
I've accepted Brexit is/has happening/happened. But I don't see any issue with arguing about EEA.
Where’s the full video Ms Butler? twitter.com/guardiannews/status/1293608926399864832?s=20
Since Dawn Butler's "full video" could not possibly show the police looking up the wrong registration number, what's your point?
My point is she Tweeted that she’d “recorded everything” then only released 1 minute of an 8 minute recording. The Police should release their body cam footage so we get the whole picture.
The police case is they stopped the car after the registration lookup error. If they claimed the car was careering all over the road, or had a funky smell from the window, there might be value but they are not claiming that.
A full video might show the police as unfailingly polite and apologetic or that Butler and her mate were abusive or uncooperative but even if all that were true, it would not address the reason of why the car was stopped in the first place. That is the crucial question and the rest is just a smokescreen.
It was a BMW. It will be as simple as that; not that the police can admit to that.
With blacked-out windows, as the police have already said.
If the tinted/blacked out windows broke the law then the rozzers would have issued a prohibition notice? Did they? If not why not? Oh because they were legal.
I only ask as someone who drives a vehicle with tinted windows.
They were not stopped because of the tinted windows - as you know - but the tinted windows meant they couldn’t see the occupants to “racially profile” them, as Ms Butler claims in her edited video.
Rear windows. Neither illegal, nor obscuring the occupants.
If the police car was behind them it would.
FFS, that is not a reason for pulling someone over.
Wasn't the reason they pulled them over that a policeman entered the number plate incorrectly into the computer?
That's a predictably grim thread, and almost certainly accurate (Sam F knows his stuff).
If it's relatively strong students in relatively weak institutions with large cohorts being marked down a lot, that'll be students in FE colleges (which tend to be a bit of a Red Wall type of place phenomenon) stitched up.
This fiasco ain't over.
I get the impression they've forgotten about the value added scores, which show up variations between cohorts.
If so, they are going to get absolutely destroyed.
Trouble is that the class of 2020 are the first lot to do the new-style GCSEs in most subjects, so the baselines for VA calculations are even flakier than they normally are.
The thing to look for over Thursday and Friday is the individual stories. Because keeping the national stats roughly in the right place is going to be made up of unadjusted winners and adjusted losers. (The last few Y13 physics classes I've had have been small enough that the Ofqual factor wouldn't touch them, and that's in a state comprehensive.) At what point does "your school/college can appeal or you can resit (neither of which is likely to help much if you want to start uni in October) stop being tenable?
Comments
Apparently the number of stroke cases (in the US) is down significantly. Particulates are evidently really bad for you.
https://twitter.com/drvox/status/1293551092052131840
I've been stopped a few than a half dozen times by the rozzer in the 25 years I've been driving, the majority of times driving high end vehicles/4x4s.
Mostly due to slow driving (once due to a similar situation to Dawn Butler, where the private number plate change hadn't fully updated.)
I can only compare and contrast with a few black colleagues who used to get stopped on a weekly basis.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/908781/Technical_Summary_PHE_Data_Series_COVID-19_Deaths_20200812.pdf
"8. Does this methodology not mean that deaths will be undercounted from now on?
No. We are conscious that due to the unstable nature of the disease, applying a time limitation could potentially miss COVID-19 deaths, hence all cases with COVID-19- reported on their death registration will be included regardless of their time to death from the initial infection date."
My bold
The Norman Book of Roger describes England as in perpetual winter.
If Brexit is going fine, there will be no clamour for the Single Market, even amongst so called “Remainers”. If Brexit is not going fine, then a “status quo” position will have little electoral value to the Conservatives.
You’re looking at the next election through the eyes of 2019. That is in my opinion misguided.
But then Hackney is dodgy as fuck, so I think the same applies to Butler I'm afraid.
Within a month, I had conversed with a number of them. Apparently they had a deep and abiding concern for the welfare of drivers of large, black cars. With blacked out rear windows, as it happens...
Oh, and driven by black people.
The non-black people in the suburb in question drove similar vehicles. But the police showed an utterly bigoted lack of interest in their welfare.
My personal view was if they stopped everyone driving late at night, the personal inconvenience was worth it, for picking off one idiot a night who thought it was okay to drive home from a nightclub before he or she killed anyone.
As a former Tory MP once told me, he was raised to respect the police, then he started to have to deal with them.
Not so long ago a police officer ended up going to prison for trying to fit up a cabinet minister.
If they can fit up a cabinet minister then what chance the rest of us?
If in 2024 Brexit has worked under Johnson's plans, it won't even be up for debate unless Starmer is a moron.
If we're still debating Brexit in 2024 something has gone badly wrong, or it will be a repeat of 2024 when other issues come into focus and the Tories suffer for it.
Great 2019 electoral strategy, it is likely to be dreadful in 2024. I am not surprised though, the Tory plan was get elected, Brexit, then they gave up.
https://twitter.com/CNBCPolitics/status/1293616561547366400
They know they're publishing a total load of bollocks but they still keep on doing it.
This was '99-'01, I think attitudes have changed somewhat since then. Of half a dozen acquaintances who liked to drive home regularly from nightclubs, over the course of a few years every single one of them got caught and served a ban.
My son is mixed race and has a bunch of black mates who he sometimes hangs out with in and out of (non Beemer) cars. Been stopped a fair few times.
So. There you go.
EDIT: In fact Rishi's first budget had him repeat phrasing along the lines of "getting things done," "gets things done," etc.
"Oh look at those fat white people God they must be Leave-voters"
We can thus conclude that Kinabalu parks his Prius at Remoaner Central
Everything after that is pitiful rather than shocking.
One was knocked down by a car, walking home from working in a pub. A policeman found him - a long haired young man, bloodied up, semi conscious in the gutter, smelling of booze.
So, obviously, he had to give him a bit of tune up.
Which was all caught, hilariously, on early CCTV - the hit-and-run, the passage-a-tabac.
Hilariously, since the policeman's lawyers tried to claim that filming people with CCTV was against his (the policeman's) rights. Yes, in the days before CCTV was a police thing....
The funny thing was, at the same time this was going on, another policeman was being drummed out of the police for a mistake with expenses. That amounted to pence. Yes, not even one pound. But apparently, Policemen Must Be Like Caesars WIfe.
My friend of the long hair pointed that out, in the paper, in the column next to the reporting on his case.
There is another funny story I can tell, of why no-one in modern politics believes the police. It's another Oxford story....
I think we underestimate how quickly things can change in a five year period. We weren't talking about the EU much even 5 years ago.
He never got stopped by the police. Hiding in plain sight.
On the other hand he was the only guy in our party who got strip searched by French customs, going into the country. Incidentally if ever strip searched by French customs, best not take the piss out of them while they are putting their gloves on...
https://www.nytimes.com/live/2020/08/12/us/biden-vs-trump?action=click&module=Spotlight&pgtype=Homepage
However. If you are a wannabe authoritarian with issues around only being able to boost your self worth by belittling and bullying others...
Well. You can see the attraction of the job.
And the automatic default of most to defer to and believe these few helps immensely.
IIRC both of them came on as substitutes in the Liverpool v PSG CL group game three months after they were relegated with Stoke.
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1293652579075981313?s=20
If so, they are going to get absolutely destroyed.
An old but good video, to a US law school. Never talk to the police.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE
In a few years "gammon" will be seen in this light and everyone who uses it now will have to do struggle sessions of apology, etc etc. And so the world wearyingly continues.
But trying to make 2024 about whether the UK uses its new freedoms or just orbits the EU feels insane. If the government thinks it can use this freedom positively, get on with it, and reap the reward in 2024. If it doesn't, that should tell the government something important.
He's actually pretty good, he's not Obama but he's not bad. I thought he'd be terrible, he might even do a decent job in the debates
Sent you an email with links to papers/articles on the benefits or otherwise of quick but less sensitive/specific COVID testing. Haven't yet read them, but thought you might be interested
Republican shill, please.
He's still better than Trump.
We've either left on No Deal or a Johnson deal in which case it goes as well or as badly as it does, or we've got stuck in which case it's sounds of betrayal.
I can't see how in five years we have another Brexit election, it just doesn't make sense to me - I'm happy to be proved wrong I just can't understand how it happens.
I agree with your point on the voting coalition though. Currently Johnson's 44% or thereabouts is pretty strong around Brexit. Probably a good proportion of that stays with him whatever (maybe mid 30s, as Cameron achieved) but it starts splintering all over the place when Brexit means something concrete.
I believe he will disappoint at least some of his coalition and polling parity will come from the Tories falling, not Labour going up much. Labour probably gets stuck around 40% (although it did poll 45% for a bit after 2017, I wonder where those voters are now) and the Tories probably fall to a similar level.
But what do I know, I'm always wrong
The police’s refusal to follow the recommendations of the Henriques Report is an utter disgrace. They are basically waving two fingers at the basic tenets of English criminal law.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/08/12/system-determining-a-level-results-england-robust-fair/
"If students want to use a valid mock result they would use the appeals process and would need to tell their school or college who will then provide the necessary evidence to their exam board. Schools and colleges will also be able to appeal if they believe their historic data does not reflect the ability of their current students – that may be because they have experienced a recent change in leadership or because they have one or a number of exceptional students.
"All three grades will hold exactly the same value with universities, colleges and employers, and similar arrangements if necessary will apply to vocational and technical qualifications. In the event that any students do want to appeal their grades, we have asked universities to hold places open for them until September 7 and I know that exam boards will do everything they can to conclude appeals in good time."
I wonder how this is going to go down
I do find it frustrating though that people that just want to talk about what's going wrong or how things could be done, get told about talking the country down.
I've accepted Brexit is/has happening/happened. But I don't see any issue with arguing about EEA.
Happens all the time.
The thing to look for over Thursday and Friday is the individual stories. Because keeping the national stats roughly in the right place is going to be made up of unadjusted winners and adjusted losers. (The last few Y13 physics classes I've had have been small enough that the Ofqual factor wouldn't touch them, and that's in a state comprehensive.) At what point does "your school/college can appeal or you can resit (neither of which is likely to help much if you want to start uni in October) stop being tenable?