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  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868

    IanB2 said:

    412 dead today? Second wave approaching?

    Really Sunil I thought better of you.
    Explain. I did use "question marks".
    So Sunil is a panicking alarmist?

    --> ? <—</p>
    Or an alarming panickist :)
    No '?', so you must be right.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,217

    Any Brexiteer not supporting Cummings is apparently "letting the side down".

    https://twitter.com/montie/status/1265664834504400898

    My side, right or wrong.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669

    Tim_B said:

    Is anyone else geeking out over the Spacex launch in 90 minutes or so, weather permitting? I was an avid fan of Apollo and this brings it all back. TV coverage began over 4 hours before the launch and I'm just lapping it up. I've found my inner 18 year old again.

    What channel?
    Over here pretty much any news channel plus Discovery
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720
    IanB2 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Has anyone done an analysis of the Remain/Leave-supporting status of the Tory MPs who've called for Cummings to go?

    What for?

    Brexit Tory MPs hate Cummings because he correctly identified that they were a load of useless idiotic tossers who would do their campaign more harm than good unless they were ruthlessly pushed aside.

    Remainers hate Cummings for precisely the same reason.
    All Tory MPs are Leave supporters. Kissing Johnson's ring and pledging support for his "oven ready deal" was a condition of them being reselected to stand.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,217
    Tim_B said:

    Tim_B said:

    Is anyone else geeking out over the Spacex launch in 90 minutes or so, weather permitting? I was an avid fan of Apollo and this brings it all back. TV coverage began over 4 hours before the launch and I'm just lapping it up. I've found my inner 18 year old again.

    What channel?
    Over here pretty much any news channel plus Discovery
    I'm going to watch.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Tim_B said:

    Is anyone else geeking out over the Spacex launch in 90 minutes or so, weather permitting? I was an avid fan of Apollo and this brings it all back. TV coverage began over 4 hours before the launch and I'm just lapping it up. I've found my inner 18 year old again.

    This is the first manned mission from US soil since the Shuttle right?

    I'd forgotten that was taking place today. Shows how quickly space technology has developed in recent years that this isn't bigger news.
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,354

    I believe a similar reason was why many prominent people were investigated for witchcraft in the olden days.

    And some people are already in a panic at the possibility:

    https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1265693847545360390
    Well one can imagine it, but would they necessarily be idiots?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,766
    Tim_B said:

    Tim_B said:

    Is anyone else geeking out over the Spacex launch in 90 minutes or so, weather permitting? I was an avid fan of Apollo and this brings it all back. TV coverage began over 4 hours before the launch and I'm just lapping it up. I've found my inner 18 year old again.

    What channel?
    Over here pretty much any news channel plus Discovery
    but I'm over there :smiley:
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,766
    I see Johnson now on about pubs opening early.

    There are so many dead cats on the Cummings table that the legs have shattered.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669

    Tim_B said:

    Is anyone else geeking out over the Spacex launch in 90 minutes or so, weather permitting? I was an avid fan of Apollo and this brings it all back. TV coverage began over 4 hours before the launch and I'm just lapping it up. I've found my inner 18 year old again.

    This is the first manned mission from US soil since the Shuttle right?

    I'd forgotten that was taking place today. Shows how quickly space technology has developed in recent years that this isn't bigger news.
    Since 2011 yes. It's getting blanket coverage here
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    rcs1000 said:

    Tim_B said:

    Tim_B said:

    Is anyone else geeking out over the Spacex launch in 90 minutes or so, weather permitting? I was an avid fan of Apollo and this brings it all back. TV coverage began over 4 hours before the launch and I'm just lapping it up. I've found my inner 18 year old again.

    What channel?
    Over here pretty much any news channel plus Discovery
    I'm going to watch.
    Discovery coverage started 3 hours ago.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,217
    Tim_B said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Tim_B said:

    Tim_B said:

    Is anyone else geeking out over the Spacex launch in 90 minutes or so, weather permitting? I was an avid fan of Apollo and this brings it all back. TV coverage began over 4 hours before the launch and I'm just lapping it up. I've found my inner 18 year old again.

    What channel?
    Over here pretty much any news channel plus Discovery
    I'm going to watch.
    Discovery coverage started 3 hours ago.
    I have work to do, so will tune in in about 15 minutes time!
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Pulpstar said:



    Its insane. The government is doing an awful job here going arse over tit.

    Glad you've noticed.
    Nothing new.

    I've criticised the government quite frequently, whenever I think its doing wrong. Its in the wrong here, so I'm content to attack it.

    I'm not a blind partisan. I'm happy to call out mistakes.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,205
    Tim_B said:

    Is anyone else geeking out over the Spacex launch in 90 minutes or so, weather permitting? I was an avid fan of Apollo and this brings it all back. TV coverage began over 4 hours before the launch and I'm just lapping it up. I've found my inner 18 year old again.

    Oh yes.The most important day for the USA's space program in years.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720
    .y practical issue is that I have contact with someone Covid-19 positive perhaps weekly. Should I be in permanent isolation?

    Definitely off to the Isle of Wight next week, can stay in empty family property.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,217
    rcs1000 said:

    Tim_B said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Tim_B said:

    Tim_B said:

    Is anyone else geeking out over the Spacex launch in 90 minutes or so, weather permitting? I was an avid fan of Apollo and this brings it all back. TV coverage began over 4 hours before the launch and I'm just lapping it up. I've found my inner 18 year old again.

    What channel?
    Over here pretty much any news channel plus Discovery
    I'm going to watch.
    Discovery coverage started 3 hours ago.
    I have work to do, so will tune in in about 15 minutes time!
    Oops, I think it's in about 85 minutes, not 15 mintues...
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    I see Johnson now on about pubs opening early.

    There are so many dead cats on the Cummings table that the legs have shattered.

    Why isn’t this all in a clearly laid out step by step document with potential dates, broken down into clear phases which people understand. It comes over as if the UK hasn’t actually got a clue what it’s doing throwing out ideas in an uncoordinated way. What happened to the ‘r’ meter? Who’s in charge? What are the objectives?
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,620
    Those missed open goals.

    The odd thing about the government's response is that when they've done something its been pretty good.

    But they've tended too often to lapse into doing nothing.

    Which has been fatal, literally, as there's been a lack of dynamism throughout our institutions.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,205
    Well I think that was a daft decision by him but there was no guidance against going there at that point in time.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,868
    Pulpstar said:

    Andy_JS said:

    412 dead today? Second wave approaching?

    IMO it's better to rely on David Paton's figures which are based on the number of deaths taking place on a particular day rather than the government figures which include people who died many days and even weeks ago.
    I'm using those figures for analysis too - afraid the exponent has slipped, which indicates the halving time for the virus is now around 15 days rather than 14

    893e-0.047x R² = 0.9879 since the peak.
    If it's not too much trouble could you do the same exercise for each of the main English regions? It would be interesting to see if there's a big regional variance.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,205
    It's Captain James T
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,868
    edited May 2020
    Pulpstar said:

    Well I think that was a daft decision by him but there was no guidance against going there at that point in time.
    "Don't cancel it, I've got tickets!"
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,354

    Those missed open goals.

    The odd thing about the government's response is that when they've done something its been pretty good.

    But they've tended too often to lapse into doing nothing.

    Which has been fatal, literally, as there's been a lack of dynamism throughout our institutions.
    Yes, I think on the whole the Government were getting a fairly warm appraisal from the public and with some justification. It's turned now though, obviously.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,729

    If we name all the Liverpool players they may yet still miss out on the title too.....

    If we name all the Liverpool players they may yet still miss out on the title too.....

    I believe a similar reason was why many prominent people were investigated for witchcraft in the olden days.

    And some people are already in a panic at the possibility:

    https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1265693847545360390
    Now that IS funny!
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720
    edited May 2020
    Andrew said:


    Controversial opinion: I am surprised its not higher. Care homes have done a good job to keep it such a low proportion, I believe in many nations they're the majority of deaths and for good reason.

    Our care home death numbers are surprisingly a (relatively) small fraction of our total deaths - in Europe it's a half or more, even 2/3 in Spain. Here it's less than a quarter.

    The problem has been the wider death rate outside care homes. Our hospital numbers are horrendous.

    They are. In my hospital 30% of our thousand odd Covid-19 admissions have died.

    No one seems interested that our 111 policy of telling people with Covid-19 symptoms not to see a GP, Pharmacy or Hospital, but to go home and self medicate is not appropriate. We have the capacity to see and assess every suspect case now, unlike 2 months ago.

    This disease is a major killer. We wouldn't tell people with other conditions of similar mortality to piss off and take hot broth.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,413
    nichomar said:

    I see Johnson now on about pubs opening early.

    There are so many dead cats on the Cummings table that the legs have shattered.

    Why isn’t this all in a clearly laid out step by step document with potential dates, broken down into clear phases which people understand. It comes over as if the UK hasn’t actually got a clue what it’s doing throwing out ideas in an uncoordinated way. What happened to the ‘r’ meter? Who’s in charge? What are the objectives?
    Maybe that's because they don't know what they're doing.
    Occam's. Razor.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    eristdoof said:

    412 dead today? Second wave approaching?

    Probably just catching up with the weekend reporting, although I will eat my trousers if there is no second wave.
    If a second wave is expected later in the year then we should be removing restrictions now and building herd immunity.
    How do you know that the second wave is not coming in three weeks, soon after the two Bank Holidays in May?
    In all fairness we’d be on our fourth wave by now if the warnings of PBers rang true.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,317
    Foxy said:

    Andrew said:


    Controversial opinion: I am surprised its not higher. Care homes have done a good job to keep it such a low proportion, I believe in many nations they're the majority of deaths and for good reason.

    Our care home death numbers are surprisingly a (relatively) small fraction of our total deaths - in Europe it's a half or more, even 2/3 in Spain. Here it's less than a quarter.

    The problem has been the wider death rate outside care homes. Our hospital numbers are horrendous.

    They are. In my hospital 30% of our thousand odd Covid-19 admissions have died.

    No one seems interested that our 111 policy of telling people with Covid-19 symptoms not to see a GP, Pharmacy or Hospital, but to go home and self medicate is not appropriate. We have the capacity to see and assess every suspect case now, unlike 2 months ago.

    This disease is a major killer. We wouldn't tell people with other conditions of similar mortality to piss off and take hot broth.
    Well it was raised in a thread header on here ......

    Perhaps MPs might read and note and follow up.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,620
    Foxy said:

    Andrew said:


    Controversial opinion: I am surprised its not higher. Care homes have done a good job to keep it such a low proportion, I believe in many nations they're the majority of deaths and for good reason.

    Our care home death numbers are surprisingly a (relatively) small fraction of our total deaths - in Europe it's a half or more, even 2/3 in Spain. Here it's less than a quarter.

    The problem has been the wider death rate outside care homes. Our hospital numbers are horrendous.

    They are. In my hospital 30% of our thousand odd Covid-19 admissions have died.

    No one seems interested that our 111 policy of telling people with Covid-19 symptoms not to see a GP, Pharmacy or Hospital, but to go home and self medicate is not appropriate. We have the capacity to see and assess every suspect case now, unlike 2 months ago.

    This disease is a major killer. We wouldn't tell people with other conditions of similar mortality to piss off and take hot broth.
    The 'protect the NHS' slogan has been too successful.

    Are you also seeing people with other problems not wanting to go to hospital out of fear of catching covid there ?
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,620

    Those missed open goals.

    The odd thing about the government's response is that when they've done something its been pretty good.

    But they've tended too often to lapse into doing nothing.

    Which has been fatal, literally, as there's been a lack of dynamism throughout our institutions.
    Yes, I think on the whole the Government were getting a fairly warm appraisal from the public and with some justification. It's turned now though, obviously.
    Looking back the two organisations which have impressed me have been the supermarkets and, much to my surprise, the Treasury / HMRC with the furlough policy.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,002
    The interesting thing about Peny and The Saj breaking cover tonight is that they don't care about Cummings, they are already positioning for the post-BoZo world.

    As Penny is still a minister, that's pretty ballsy...
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    You and the Correct Horse really should get a bloody room.

    The rest of us will then be able to ignore pointless early-term polls in peace.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,837
    Foxy said:

    Andrew said:


    Controversial opinion: I am surprised its not higher. Care homes have done a good job to keep it such a low proportion, I believe in many nations they're the majority of deaths and for good reason.

    Our care home death numbers are surprisingly a (relatively) small fraction of our total deaths - in Europe it's a half or more, even 2/3 in Spain. Here it's less than a quarter.

    The problem has been the wider death rate outside care homes. Our hospital numbers are horrendous.

    They are. In my hospital 30% of our thousand odd Covid-19 admissions have died.

    No one seems interested that our 111 policy of telling people with Covid-19 symptoms not to see a GP, Pharmacy or Hospital, but to go home and self medicate is not appropriate. We have the capacity to see and assess every suspect case now, unlike 2 months ago.

    This disease is a major killer. We wouldn't tell people with other conditions of similar mortality to piss off and take hot broth.
    As a layman Id imagined we would have made much more use of the combination of empty hotels and 1 million volunteers.

    Couldnt we have used empty hotels for things like:

    1) Self isolation for people who live with family but in a place not big enough to isolate from the rest of the family. Or those who just want to be more cautious about spreading it to their family.
    2) Monitoring place for people who live on their own with covid in case their symptoms get worse rapidly
    3) Staging post for people leaving hospital but before they re-enter society whether care home or normal life until they have been tested

    even

    4) place of refuge for families worried they may not be able to look after their children for those without family castles
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    You and the Correct Horse really should get a bloody room.

    The rest of us will then be able to ignore pointless early-term polls in peace.
    To be honest I wouldn’t miss the partisan posters from either side whilst they continue to just back the party line. Some original thought on the other hand...
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,675

    NEW THREAD

  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,599
    Tim_B said:

    Tim_B said:

    Is anyone else geeking out over the Spacex launch in 90 minutes or so, weather permitting? I was an avid fan of Apollo and this brings it all back. TV coverage began over 4 hours before the launch and I'm just lapping it up. I've found my inner 18 year old again.

    What channel?
    Over here pretty much any news channel plus Discovery
    T minus 54 minutes and counting...
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rjb9FdVdX5I
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,775
    Re Header

    @AlastairMeeks

    'Motes and beams' get's your article read. Such a lovely phrase.

    You're all for 'all wrong'. It can't be as such. This is true of this government as all others.

    You say at the end of your piece

    In the middle of a pandemic, we have reached the point where the government lacks any moral authority and any ability to communicate the reasons behind its decisions. Many of the most difficult decisions lie ahead. It is very difficult to see how the government can take them without any public confidence in it.

    However it's not equally arguable to say

    In the middle of a pandemic, with the PM having been disabled for a while, the Government has robustly functioned. Hard decisions lie ahead, but the public can take confidence in the good sense that the government has shown.

    Can you really argue that your phrase is closer to the truth than mine?




  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,205
    MaxPB said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Andy_JS said:

    412 dead today? Second wave approaching?

    IMO it's better to rely on David Paton's figures which are based on the number of deaths taking place on a particular day rather than the government figures which include people who died many days and even weeks ago.
    I'm using those figures for analysis too - afraid the exponent has slipped, which indicates the halving time for the virus is now around 15 days rather than 14

    893e-0.047x R² = 0.9879 since the peak.
    If it's not too much trouble could you do the same exercise for each of the main English regions? It would be interesting to see if there's a big regional variance.
    The rest of the country is much of a muchness but London definitely has the steepest curve, 10 day halving time.

    y = 236e-0.071x R² = 0.9695 L
    y = 47.294e-0.057x R² = 0.7552 SW
    y = 111e-0.045x R² = 0.8865 E
    y = 109.61e-0.045x R² = 0.8985 SE
    y = 153.63e-0.043x R² = 0.9489 NW
    y = 154.24e-0.04x R² = 0.9447 M
    y = 122.77e-0.039x R² = 0.9291 NE/Y
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,604
    IanB2 said:

    eristdoof said:

    412 dead today? Second wave approaching?

    Probably just catching up with the weekend reporting, although I will eat my trousers if there is no second wave.
    If a second wave is expected later in the year then we should be removing restrictions now and building herd immunity.
    How do you know that the second wave is not coming in three weeks, soon after the two Bank Holidays in May?
    We don't but there doesn't appear to have been a second wave in other countries which have eased restrictions earlier.

    Nor does there seem to be any increase in positive tests since the first bank holiday.
    If it weren’t for the handful of small scale studies finding low levels of antibodies, you’d look at the data and conclude that significant proportions of the population now has either immunity or significant resistance.
    It may be that a significant proportion of the population has innate immunity (at least to small viral loads) rather than acquired immunity - which is why there are low levels on antibodies in the population but sufficient levels of overall immunity (innate and acquired) to contain the virus.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited May 2020
    ...
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,929
    edited May 2020
    deleted
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,798

    Following on from the discussion on "Boris" Vs "Johnson", I was wondering whether there is anyone else in political life who uses one name in public and another in private? George Osborne changed his name but as far as I know his family and friends don't call him Gideon. It's a bit weird, no? And maybe a bit unsurprising that he has a rather distant relationship with the truth?

    What drugs are you taking?

    If his friends and family don't call him Gideon then why should the public call him Gideon?

    There's something deeply nasty about this name shaming. Call people what they want to be called, its just basic respect.
    You have completely misunderstood me. Point I was making was that weird to have one name in public and another in private, like "Boris". I was holding up Osborne as a counter-example, who had chosen to go by a different name uniformly not selectively. I have never referred to him as Gideon for the reason you give. No drugs taken.
This discussion has been closed.