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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Motes and beams. Leading a response to a pandemic without mora

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  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,898
    TGOHF666 said:



    I await his feedback on tomorrows figures when they halve.

    It's only a "Shanghai Sniffle" as somebody once said....
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    I notice it is now just test and trace, not test, track and trace.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226

    Please tell me that you're only following Morgan on twatter so that you can laugh at him.

    Because its impossible to take seriously anyone who could post this:

    https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1265662409995423745
    I think the NHS badge is the start of his political career. Fancies himself as a populist PM.
    I sense that too. It must be nipped in the bud.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    Do you really think forty two conservative MPs would vote against their own government right now on a serious issue?

    really?
  • TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052
    Brom said:

    For the record I dont think Maitlis should go, but now that her bosses have said she got it wrong, perhaps she should apologise. After calling for Cumming's head it only seems fair.

    Her head should be shaved and she should walk through the studio with Nadine Dorries ringing a bell shouting "SHAME !"

    Of course she wont be on tonight and Kirsty Wark will have to mumble an apology 30 seconds before the end of the show.


  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    TGOHF666 said:

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    How many are standing down and fighting a bye election as an independent ?

    I mean if they were really serious they would do so ?
    I expect Labour would be just as delighted to have Conservatives in marginals on the record as supporting Dominic Cummings over this.
  • MangoMango Posts: 1,019

    Mango said:

    Mango said:



    I dislike Claire Fox. I don't support her, never have.

    Except, you know, when you voted for her.

    I'm not sure you understand this democracy business at all...
    I didn't vote for her. I voted a protest vote and I voted for there to be no MEPs.

    My protest was acknowledged and there are no MEPs. Job done.
    But you did vote for her. You marked a ballot paper in support of her party, in the constituency where she was top of the list. She was duly elected as your representative. Job done.

    She's not my representative. I have no EU representative. So I couldn't care less.

    If she was my EU representative and if that job mattered you'd have a point.
    Is it the concept of time that you struggle with? To explain, if you murder someone, you can't deny you are a murderer by stating one year later that you're no longer murdering them.
  • At this point I am convinced the Tories are trying to throw away their popularity
  • OldBasingOldBasing Posts: 173
    Emily Maitless was excellent, simply stating facts. The BBC should stand by their journalists.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,191
    Brom said:

    eek said:

    The Cummings saga is not a brexit issue
    Well, for some the hatred towards him / Cummings is 100% Brexit, but yes, Tory Bear pointing out all the Remainers on the panel ahead of time, is as I say just "getting excuses in early".
    The Cummings saga is not a Brexit issue but Brexit is an available excuse for why people are being mean to Dominic and that excuse seems to be being used (in part) to justify his retention.
    It is not a Brexit issue, it is a right or wrong issue.

    Two extreme ERG members, Stephen Baker and Laurence Robertson, have both expressed their dissatisfaction over Cummings. There are probably other of a Brexit persuasion who also ain't happy.
    Definitely a Brexit issue. Look at Alastair Campbell disobeying the rules today but getting angry at Cummings.
    Campbell should definitely be fired as chief advisor to the PM. Especially as he wrote the rules he's breaking. Oh wait...
    ydoethur said:

    This is a lose-lose for Bozo now. If he fires him he will look weak. if he keeps him he looks weak. POBWAS

    Cummings is clever but arrogant, he needs to stay, Boris comes over as a fool, he needs to take a rest until the end of the pandemic.
    "Boris" as you affectionately refer to him does not just come over as a fool, he is a fool. Not necessarily educationally (though an Eton education always helps), but from every aspect of leadership that one would expect from a PM he is an idiot. Cummings is clever, in that he is riding a donkey for as long as said donkey thinks it needs him and not the other way around.
    I previously regularly referred to him as Johnson, I have been criticised for using his surname for being agressively partisan as everyone knows him as Boris.
    It’s funny, but I think I’m the only poster who refers to him consistently as ‘Johnson.’ Never called him ‘Boris’ since he became FS.

    Just doesn’t feel right to me to call the PM by their first name.
    I consistently refer to him by his surname, like other politicians. He's not a very naughty boy, he's an adult arsehat.

    Similarly Trump isn't "The Donald" and Stalin wasn't "Uncle Joe"
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    BigRich said:

    kyf_100 said:

    Could I just say I find it absolutely barking mad that you are all still debating Cummings as if it will matter in four years time when the economic depression bites later this year.

    I really wish I could share some of the data I have seen under NDA, because it would terrify all of you. Suffice to say nobody is going to give a s*it about Cummings in six months time. Certainly not in 2024.

    If you have a job at the end of all this, or are lucky enough to not need a job for a year or two, you will be thanking your lucky stars.

    We are in serious, serious trouble and the government has literally no idea what to do about it. That is the real story. Everything else is what I believe IT consultants call "bike shedding".



    I very much agree,

    Cummings has bade some tragic errers:

    1) He pushed for schools to be closed
    2) He pushed for the lock-down

    Both of theses where largely a result of his opinion and not IAW the siantific evidence.

    he also missed 2 possible opportunitys to intervene

    1) He could/should have countered PHE ban of the prvet sector doing testing at the start.
    2) He could/should have stopped old people being returned from hospitals to care homes and taking the virus with them.

    To be fire the last to apply to the whole government, but his is meant to be the outside thinker out of the box, countering the government blob, and he failed.

    What he did with his family, is an irrelevance, he pushed the rules to the point of absurdity, but largely to help his family, I do not care.
    I think he hinted in his press conference that he knew he'd made some big errors.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,036
    Hancock scratched the side of his head when he said that the App is working.

    In some people such an action would be a tell to indicate an untruth was being told.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226
    Andy_JS said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Michael Portillo was very interesting on the PM programme about 30 minutes ago. He described Johnson as being like a "spectator".

    Yes, very interesting.

    Also of interest was his opinion that the pursuit of Cummings was a bit of a waste of time now since the PM has decided that he will not be sacked come what may.

    Starmer is a very lucky General!
    Portillo is one of the best political analysts around IMO. He gets to the heart of the issues at hand without being overly partisan, at the same time as not pretending he doesn't have opinions of his own. In other words he gets the balance just right, something which most journalists and pundits seem to be increasingly incapable of.
    I agree. I really like Portillo as a pundit and as a presenter.
  • BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    TGOHF666 said:

    Brom said:

    For the record I dont think Maitlis should go, but now that her bosses have said she got it wrong, perhaps she should apologise. After calling for Cumming's head it only seems fair.

    Her head should be shaved and she should walk through the studio with Nadine Dorries ringing a bell shouting "SHAME !"

    Of course she wont be on tonight and Kirsty Wark will have to mumble an apology 30 seconds before the end of the show.


    LOL! If she was sacked with Newsnight they'd only replace her with Krishnan Guru Murty or some other anti Boris stooge.

    This will damage her reputation though. Perhaps Prince Andrew should interview her to help rebuild her image.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,002

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    I imagine they would fall into line. Would be entertaining though
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,620

    Please tell me that you're only following Morgan on twatter so that you can laugh at him.

    Because its impossible to take seriously anyone who could post this:

    https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1265662409995423745
    When it comes to the misreporting / still total misunderstanding of these figures but the media, i can't work out if it is deliberate or just they are morons. Prof Cricket has been on R4 a load of times to explain things and is widely quoted on twitter, yet Piers Moron still gets it wrong. Sky did yesterday with excess deaths using daily announced figures (not when died) vs average deaths in each calendar week.
    The safe assumptions are that it is deliberate and that they are also morons.

    Bad news is more newsworthy and scaremongering gets them attention while being able to analyse numbers is beyond their capabilities.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    My God, those 42 MPs are mostly just putting out messages to virtue-signal and save face with their constituents. That is completely different to taking on the Prime Minister directly in a trial of strength and voting with the Opposition on ... what? A fucking Bill of Attainder against Cummings?

    It's called politics. You can't just take everything at face value.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Pulpstar said:

    chloe said:

    Boris and Cummings should both go

    I think Sunak should be the man to lead. Hunt in as CoE.
    Laid Sunak so no thank you.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    ...
    stodge said:


    With the amount of sweat he seems to excrete on every TV appearance I'm surprised Schtarmer hasn't been confined to appearing in a biohazard suit.

    That you all got - "sweaty", "Schtarmer" ?

    Pathetic.
    Yes, just what I used to think when everyone banged on about Farage sweating and making hilarious mis-spellings/pronounciations of his name. It was fair game then, apparently... some used to think it was funny too

    It probably does mean they fear him though
  • TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052
    OldBasing said:

    Emily Maitless was excellent, simply stating facts. The BBC should stand by their journalists.

    They haven't because she wasn't on a private views network.

    She's due to be on tonight - will she front up ?

    Newsnight

    27/05/2020

    The day's important national and international news stories with Emily Maitlis.
  • BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    TGOHF666 said:

    OldBasing said:

    Emily Maitless was excellent, simply stating facts. The BBC should stand by their journalists.

    They haven't because she wasn't on a private views network.

    She's due to be on tonight - will she front up ?

    Newsnight

    27/05/2020

    The day's important national and international news stories with Emily Maitlis.
    She should definitely field questions from the public for 90 minutes abut her imprtiality. Possibly in a rose garden. Only seems fair given we pay her wages and she's 'broken the rules'.
  • TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052
    edited May 2020
    Scott_xP said:
    Ah - Scott has given up on Cummings...

    When he resorted to mentioning Amber Rudd it was inevitable.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    Brom said:

    For the record I dont think Maitlis should go, but now that her bosses have said she got it wrong, perhaps she should apologise. After calling for Cumming's head it only seems fair.

    Oh, she shouldn't go. But the Government should give radical reform of the BBC a very high priority indeed.

    Let's put Cummings on it :wink:
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    kinabalu said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Michael Portillo was very interesting on the PM programme about 30 minutes ago. He described Johnson as being like a "spectator".

    Yes, very interesting.

    Also of interest was his opinion that the pursuit of Cummings was a bit of a waste of time now since the PM has decided that he will not be sacked come what may.

    Starmer is a very lucky General!
    Portillo is one of the best political analysts around IMO. He gets to the heart of the issues at hand without being overly partisan, at the same time as not pretending he doesn't have opinions of his own. In other words he gets the balance just right, something which most journalists and pundits seem to be increasingly incapable of.
    I agree. I really like Portillo as a pundit and as a presenter.
    He was on QT earlier this year. Talking about the suicide of Caroline Flack, he recalled the story of a friend of his who was due to stand trial, but it got cancelled. He wondered whether Flack had been hasty. I wonder if her trial would have taken place in the manner she thought it would, given the covid crisis?

    On checking, March 4th was the date. I guess it would have
  • ozymandiasozymandias Posts: 1,503
    kinabalu said:

    So let me get this straight: undermining the lockdown / T&T is a moral outrage and the crime of the century when Cummings does it once (in private), but no problem at all when Piers Morgan does it all day, every single day, in public to his vast audience.

    Have I got this pious moralizing thing right yet? :grimace:
    With the amount of sweat he seems to excrete on every TV appearance I'm surprised Schtarmer hasn't been confined to appearing in a biohazard suit.
    Oh dear. What an unfortunate comment. A window to the soul and the view is murky.
    Wouldn't be murky if he took a shower once in a while :smile:
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,002
    TGOHF666 said:

    Ah - Scott has given up on Cummings...

    When he resorted to mentioning Amber Rudd it was inevitable.

    https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/1265696243109498880
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381
    HYUFD said:
    Doesn't bode well for the second wave lockdown.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    kamski said:

    Brom said:

    eek said:

    The Cummings saga is not a brexit issue
    Well, for some the hatred towards him / Cummings is 100% Brexit, but yes, Tory Bear pointing out all the Remainers on the panel ahead of time, is as I say just "getting excuses in early".
    The Cummings saga is not a Brexit issue but Brexit is an available excuse for why people are being mean to Dominic and that excuse seems to be being used (in part) to justify his retention.
    It is not a Brexit issue, it is a right or wrong issue.

    Two extreme ERG members, Stephen Baker and Laurence Robertson, have both expressed their dissatisfaction over Cummings. There are probably other of a Brexit persuasion who also ain't happy.
    Definitely a Brexit issue. Look at Alastair Campbell disobeying the rules today but getting angry at Cummings.
    Campbell should definitely be fired as chief advisor to the PM. Especially as he wrote the rules he's breaking. Oh wait...
    ydoethur said:

    This is a lose-lose for Bozo now. If he fires him he will look weak. if he keeps him he looks weak. POBWAS

    Cummings is clever but arrogant, he needs to stay, Boris comes over as a fool, he needs to take a rest until the end of the pandemic.
    "Boris" as you affectionately refer to him does not just come over as a fool, he is a fool. Not necessarily educationally (though an Eton education always helps), but from every aspect of leadership that one would expect from a PM he is an idiot. Cummings is clever, in that he is riding a donkey for as long as said donkey thinks it needs him and not the other way around.
    I previously regularly referred to him as Johnson, I have been criticised for using his surname for being agressively partisan as everyone knows him as Boris.
    It’s funny, but I think I’m the only poster who refers to him consistently as ‘Johnson.’ Never called him ‘Boris’ since he became FS.

    Just doesn’t feel right to me to call the PM by their first name.
    I consistently refer to him by his surname, like other politicians. He's not a very naughty boy, he's an adult arsehat.

    Similarly Trump isn't "The Donald" and Stalin wasn't "Uncle Joe"
    Its probably an age thing but I've never got the idea of caring about firstname or surname - except for eg at schools where children address teachers by surname or as eg "Sir" as a respect thing.

    Between adults calling people by the name they want to be addressed by, so long as it doesn't lead to confusion, is just respectful.
  • ozymandiasozymandias Posts: 1,503
    stodge said:


    With the amount of sweat he seems to excrete on every TV appearance I'm surprised Schtarmer hasn't been confined to appearing in a biohazard suit.

    That you all got - "sweaty", "Schtarmer" ?

    Pathetic.
    For now :wink:
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Scott_xP said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    Ah - Scott has given up on Cummings...

    When he resorted to mentioning Amber Rudd it was inevitable.

    https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/1265696243109498880
    Is that all? Surprisingly low and that's at peak mob hysteria.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,707
    Scott_xP said:

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    I imagine they would fall into line. Would be entertaining though
    Maybe that's the quickest way to make it all go away then...
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,620

    Please tell me that you're only following Morgan on twatter so that you can laugh at him.

    Because its impossible to take seriously anyone who could post this:

    https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1265662409995423745
    I think the NHS badge is the start of his political career. Fancies himself as a populist PM.
    I've just had a thought.

    Isn't the NHS supposed to be the 'envy of the world' ?

    Well isn't twatter the perfect medium to see if it is ?

    So could any of the twatter experts tell me if NHSenvyoftheworld is some favoured hashtag around the world.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381
    Scott_xP said:
    That sounds like a SeanT comment. Is he moonlighting elsewhere?
  • TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052
    Scott_xP said:
    Yeah - why didn't Dom apologise for being white ?
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,898
    isam said:


    Yes, just what I used to think when everyone banged on about Farage sweating and making hilarious mis-spellings/pronunciations of his name. It was fair game then, apparently... some used to think it was funny too

    It probably does mean they fear him though

    The curious thing is if this is the reaction when the Conservatives are still 6 points ahead - what will it be like when Labour leads by 10-15 points?
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    edited May 2020
    Scott_xP said:
    Perhaps we could pass a new law that activism and journalism are to be treated as mutually exclusive...
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381
    edited May 2020
    TGOHF666 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Yeah - why didn't Dom apologise for being white ?
    A Moronic comment.
  • BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    TGOHF666 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Ah - Scott has given up on Cummings...

    When he resorted to mentioning Amber Rudd it was inevitable.
    He'll be mining twitter despertately every second until nightfall to find that smoking gun. To him Twitter holds all the answers.

    As I said yesterday and the day before I beleive the peak of the Cummings story has passed. Those who chose to disagree yesterday might rethink tonight. He has done enough to survive and I expect he will get to work with added vigour and maybe even a few new scores to settle.
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,708
    edited May 2020
    Number in hospital with Covid UP from 8,802 to 8,879.

    This isn't really like reporting deaths where there is obvious weekend / Bank Holiday effect.

    OK, maybe marginal Bank Holiday effect but still worth keeping very close eye on.

    Number of NEW admissions almost bang on flat - 472 vs 471 day before.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,676
    Foxy said:

    Chris said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Freggles said:

    I'm wondering how many people speaking about the instruction to stay at home would have done so if their fire alarm was going off and the building was being engulfed in flames.

    Using your own personal judgement is what any sentient intelligent person should do. People banging on as if there's one rule for every situation don't just insult our intelligence they're insulting their own.

    The regulations specifically allow you to leave home in order to prevent injury.
    Very specific aren't they?
    Indeed and having a young infant with no childcare is harmful. QED it is reasonable to leave the home to get childcare.
    In all your comments, you seem to pretend there was only one beach of regulations, not three or more.

    Forget the trips (plural) between London and Durham, and tell me how the Castle Bernard sojourn was in the rules.
    I think it's logical before you go for a long cross country drive if you've just recovered from illness to take a half hour drive to see that you're up to the pressures of driving.

    I believe that's what Cummings meant but not what he said. The way it was phrased was awful but the logic I understood.
    If I wanted to take a drive to test my eyesight* I would probably prefer not to stray too far from home, in case I decided it wasn't up to a long drive. It's a bit risky going 25 miles away, IMHO, because what do you do in this CV-19 world if you get to Castle Bernard and decide your eyesight is not good enough.

    * Which, I would assume, the DVLA does not recommend
    It's strange, isn't it that opticians tend to sit people down in a chair and ask them to read letters, rather than putting them in a car and doing it that way.

    Perhaps Cummings plans to set up his own chain of opticians based around that concept. Perhaps he could call it JobSavers?
    The numberplate eyesight test is still the standard, and is changed only in minor ways for nearly a century.

    The reason is so that anyone can measure out the distance and test themselves.
    Without driving
  • TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052

    TGOHF666 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Yeah - why didn't Dom apologise for being white ?
    Moron.
    The questioner mined the grievance seam and found a race angle to the Cummings story.

    A LBTQ+ angle can't be far off.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381
    edited May 2020
    TGOHF666 said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Yeah - why didn't Dom apologise for being white ?
    Moron.
    The questioner mined the grievance seam and found a race angle to the Cummings story.

    A LBTQ+ angle can't be far off.
    My comment to you was offensive and I have ammended it. Your comment was also offensive irrespective of whether your reply was teed up for you.

    I apologise for my knee-jerk response.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,999
    edited May 2020
    Even if you didn't know her record, you just know a country is fucked when you have Hancock gushingly announce that someone called Baroness Dido Harding is going to help sort everything out.
  • BromBrom Posts: 3,760

    TGOHF666 said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Yeah - why didn't Dom apologise for being white ?
    Moron.
    The questioner mined the grievance seam and found a race angle to the Cummings story.

    A LBTQ+ angle can't be far off.
    My comment to you was offensive and I have ammended it. Your comment was also offensive irrespective of whether your reply was teed up for you.

    I apologise for my knee-jerk response.
    In fairness Mexicans are known for being hot headed. :smiley:
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,729

    Even if you didn't know her record, you just know a country is fucked when you have Hancock gushingly announce that someone called Baroness Dido Harding is going to help sort everything out.

    The halo will not be over Nicola forever you know!
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,620

    Even if you didn't know her record, you just know a country is fucked when you have Hancock gushingly announce that someone called Baroness Dido Harding is going to help sort everything out.

    What's that ? Some sort of sex toy ?
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 5,065

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    My God, those 42 MPs are mostly just putting out messages to virtue-signal and save face with their constituents. That is completely different to taking on the Prime Minister directly in a trial of strength and voting with the Opposition on ... what? A fucking Bill of Attainder against Cummings?

    It's called politics. You can't just take everything at face value.
    But if those 42 MPs then choose to walk through the same lobby as the prime minister, they will rapidly lose the "face" that they were trying to save.
  • TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052

    TGOHF666 said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Yeah - why didn't Dom apologise for being white ?
    Moron.
    The questioner mined the grievance seam and found a race angle to the Cummings story.

    A LBTQ+ angle can't be far off.
    My comment to you was offensive and I have ammended it. Your comment was also offensive irrespective of whether your reply was teed up for you.

    I apologise for my knee-jerk response.
    The original question on the presser was moronic.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Brom said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Ah - Scott has given up on Cummings...

    When he resorted to mentioning Amber Rudd it was inevitable.
    He'll be mining twitter despertately every second until nightfall to find that smoking gun. To him Twitter holds all the answers.

    As I said yesterday and the day before I beleive the peak of the Cummings story has passed. Those who chose to disagree yesterday might rethink tonight. He has done enough to survive and I expect he will get to work with added vigour and maybe even a few new scores to settle.
    They tried to get their man, but failed. This may drag on with Starmer trying perhaps at PMQs when it returns, but its all over bar the shouting.
  • ozymandiasozymandias Posts: 1,503
    stodge said:

    isam said:


    Yes, just what I used to think when everyone banged on about Farage sweating and making hilarious mis-spellings/pronunciations of his name. It was fair game then, apparently... some used to think it was funny too

    It probably does mean they fear him though

    The curious thing is if this is the reaction when the Conservatives are still 6 points ahead - what will it be like when Labour leads by 10-15 points?
    Getting a bit ahead of yourself there. I realise last December still hurts and all - and I'm very sorry for your loss but it's a looooong road to the next election. And just checking - yep - still 160 more Tory MP's than Labour ones.


  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,317
    Scott_xP said:

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    I imagine they would fall into line. Would be entertaining though
    Of course they would. They are only making these statements to show their constituents at the next election, should it be raised. An Opposition Motion showing that they voted to keep him in place would undercut their strategy.

    I suspect Starmer will hold his fire, though.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    eristdoof said:

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    My God, those 42 MPs are mostly just putting out messages to virtue-signal and save face with their constituents. That is completely different to taking on the Prime Minister directly in a trial of strength and voting with the Opposition on ... what? A fucking Bill of Attainder against Cummings?

    It's called politics. You can't just take everything at face value.
    But if those 42 MPs then choose to walk through the same lobby as the prime minister, they will rapidly lose the "face" that they were trying to save.
    And give Labour some very useful material for mailshots from now to 2024.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,240

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    My God, those 42 MPs are mostly just putting out messages to virtue-signal and save face with their constituents. That is completely different to taking on the Prime Minister directly in a trial of strength and voting with the Opposition on ... what? A fucking Bill of Attainder against Cummings?

    It's called politics. You can't just take everything at face value.
    OK- how many backbench Conservatives have to go public saying "Cummings must go" for it to be a problem? How many for that problem to be terminal?
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 5,065

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    Do you really think forty two conservative MPs would vote against their own government right now on a serious issue?

    really?
    No, but then their constituents will know they have a two faced MP.
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,006
    stodge said:


    With the amount of sweat he seems to excrete on every TV appearance I'm surprised Schtarmer hasn't been confined to appearing in a biohazard suit.

    That you all got - "sweaty", "Schtarmer" ?

    Pathetic.
    That's about the level of the Cumming's fanboys these days, sad.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226

    kinabalu said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    Anyone at Newsnight been sacked ?

    I look forward to them doing a partisan hatchet job on themselves on the next Newsnight! :lol:
    Did you watch Emily's tour de force?

    Talk about growing in stature with each passing week.

    I was never a fan but these days - gosh - one senses a national treasure in the making.
    Er, even the BBC has admitted that her propaganda 'did not meet our standards of due impartiality', so no.

    I've never had a problem with her before, but I'm afraid she's definitely Emily No-Mates to me now.
    But did you watch it?

    I haven't. I'm just assuming it was great based on feedback.

    Thought I'd check with somebody who I thought MUST have tuned in.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,317
    edited May 2020
    And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.

    44 hotels were owned by the group: all over the country.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,999
    edited May 2020

    Even if you didn't know her record, you just know a country is fucked when you have Hancock gushingly announce that someone called Baroness Dido Harding is going to help sort everything out.

    The halo will not be over Nicola forever you know!

    You must stop obsessing about the leader of another country, it's not healthy.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Cyclefree said:

    And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.

    First of many. Many companies rely on Spring and Summer and losing this period will never be regained.

    For many summer season businesses this will be truly devastating. Many companies will lose money autumn/winter but gain it Spring/Summer.

    For companies that have survived last winter only to have now lost money Spring/Summer and now facing an even worse than normal Winter this is just destructive.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    Cyclefree said:

    And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.

    In the end, we will have to face the real choice.

    Back to our lives and accept the risk. Or economic collapse.

    New normal is not sustainable.
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,006
    TGOHF666 said:

    Brom said:

    For the record I dont think Maitlis should go, but now that her bosses have said she got it wrong, perhaps she should apologise. After calling for Cumming's head it only seems fair.

    Her head should be shaved and she should walk through the studio with Nadine Dorries ringing a bell shouting "SHAME !"

    Of course she wont be on tonight and Kirsty Wark will have to mumble an apology 30 seconds before the end of the show.


    The same Nadine Dorries that had to rapidly delete the doctored video of Starmer that she was tweeting a week or so ago? Interesting choice of role model
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,006
    edited May 2020
    deleted
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,898


    Getting a bit ahead of yourself there. I realise last December still hurts and all - and I'm very sorry for your loss but it's a looooong road to the next election. And just checking - yep - still 160 more Tory MP's than Labour ones.

    First, I'm no Labour supporter as anyone who has been on here longer than 5 seconds will realise.

    Second, much though I and many others will enjoy the long drawn out torture and demise of this Government, the country deserves so much better. The fact we have to endure this slow motion car crash for the next four years is the one aspect which does annoy.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381
    Brom said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Yeah - why didn't Dom apologise for being white ?
    Moron.
    The questioner mined the grievance seam and found a race angle to the Cummings story.

    A LBTQ+ angle can't be far off.
    My comment to you was offensive and I have ammended it. Your comment was also offensive irrespective of whether your reply was teed up for you.

    I apologise for my knee-jerk response.
    In fairness Mexicans are known for being hot headed. :smiley:
    Donald Trump doesn't like us too.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Mango said:

    Mango said:

    Mango said:



    I dislike Claire Fox. I don't support her, never have.

    Except, you know, when you voted for her.

    I'm not sure you understand this democracy business at all...
    I didn't vote for her. I voted a protest vote and I voted for there to be no MEPs.

    My protest was acknowledged and there are no MEPs. Job done.
    But you did vote for her. You marked a ballot paper in support of her party, in the constituency where she was top of the list. She was duly elected as your representative. Job done.

    She's not my representative. I have no EU representative. So I couldn't care less.

    If she was my EU representative and if that job mattered you'd have a point.
    Is it the concept of time that you struggle with? To explain, if you murder someone, you can't deny you are a murderer by stating one year later that you're no longer murdering them.
    No its the idea that I was voting for an MEP that I'm struggling with.

    Its preposterous. I was voting for there to be no MEPs.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868

    At this point I am convinced the Tories are trying to throw away their popularity

    It makes them uneasy, being so unnatural.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,601
    Scott_xP said:
    If you live in an urban area you're more likely to find yourself in breach of a regulation based on getting too close to other people than people living in the middle of nowhere.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    My God, those 42 MPs are mostly just putting out messages to virtue-signal and save face with their constituents. That is completely different to taking on the Prime Minister directly in a trial of strength and voting with the Opposition on ... what? A fucking Bill of Attainder against Cummings?

    It's called politics. You can't just take everything at face value.
    OK- how many backbench Conservatives have to go public saying "Cummings must go" for it to be a problem? How many for that problem to be terminal?
    Literally five times as many. For it to have an actual effect beyond virtue-signalling, they would have to resign the whip and destroy their own careers, and even then they probably wouldn't achieve their goal. They ain't gonna do that for this pointless nonsense.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,317

    Cyclefree said:

    And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.

    First of many. Many companies rely on Spring and Summer and losing this period will never be regained.

    For many summer season businesses this will be truly devastating. Many companies will lose money autumn/winter but gain it Spring/Summer.

    For companies that have survived last winter only to have now lost money Spring/Summer and now facing an even worse than normal Winter this is just destructive.
    You don’t need to tell me. I’ve been boring on about it for weeks now.

    When a lot of those job losses are concentrated in particular areas with few alternatives and even those affected by the loss of trade etc, the prospects are poor for those areas.

    “Levelling up” my arse!
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,708
    Any Brexiteer not supporting Cummings is apparently "letting the side down".

    https://twitter.com/montie/status/1265664834504400898

  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381
    Cyclefree said:

    Scott_xP said:

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    I imagine they would fall into line. Would be entertaining though
    Of course they would. They are only making these statements to show their constituents at the next election, should it be raised. An Opposition Motion showing that they voted to keep him in place would undercut their strategy.

    I suspect Starmer will hold his fire, though.
    It makes sense whilst Johnson is still digging furiously.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216

    Any Brexiteer not supporting Cummings is apparently "letting the side down".

    https://twitter.com/montie/status/1265664834504400898

    A majority of Leave voters think the Cummings issue is important...(52 vs 44)
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,878
    412 dead today? Second wave approaching?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720
    stodge said:


    With the amount of sweat he seems to excrete on every TV appearance I'm surprised Schtarmer hasn't been confined to appearing in a biohazard suit.

    That you all got - "sweaty", "Schtarmer" ?

    Pathetic.
    Just shows that he wasn't in air combat in the Falklands, nothing more...
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,878

    So if 42 Conservative MPs think Dominic Cummings should stand down, that’s the majority gone. Sounds like there’s scope for an imaginative Opposition motion there.

    My God, those 42 MPs are mostly just putting out messages to virtue-signal and save face with their constituents. That is completely different to taking on the Prime Minister directly in a trial of strength and voting with the Opposition on ... what? A fucking Bill of Attainder against Cummings?

    It's called politics. You can't just take everything at face value.
    OK- how many backbench Conservatives have to go public saying "Cummings must go" for it to be a problem? How many for that problem to be terminal?
    Literally five times as many. For it to have an actual effect beyond virtue-signalling, they would have to resign the whip and destroy their own careers, and even then they probably wouldn't achieve their goal. They ain't gonna do that for this pointless nonsense.
    "Brexit educates the senses, calls into disrepute the political will, makes imperfect the unwritten constitution, brings Tories into such swift and close collision in critical moments that Leaver measures Remainer."
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381

    Any Brexiteer not supporting Cummings is apparently "letting the side down".

    https://twitter.com/montie/status/1265664834504400898

    Even Montie has realised some of his erstwhile chums are barking at the moon.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    Anyone at Newsnight been sacked ?

    I look forward to them doing a partisan hatchet job on themselves on the next Newsnight! :lol:
    Did you watch Emily's tour de force?

    Talk about growing in stature with each passing week.

    I was never a fan but these days - gosh - one senses a national treasure in the making.
    Er, even the BBC has admitted that her propaganda 'did not meet our standards of due impartiality', so no.

    I've never had a problem with her before, but I'm afraid she's definitely Emily No-Mates to me now.
    But did you watch it?

    I haven't. I'm just assuming it was great based on feedback.

    Thought I'd check with somebody who I thought MUST have tuned in.
    To be perfectly honest, live TV has almost entirely lost me. Watching Newsnight used to be a pleasure, but like the rest of the BBC it has long given up the pretence of impartiality in its personnel and programming, so why inflict that on myself?

    A side effect of this kind of shift, which I'm sure affects a lot more people than me, means that many of the big TV media moments are seen live by only a fraction of those who would have done so a decade ago or earlier.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,620
    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    And so it begins: a large hotel/holiday company goes into administration. 2 hotels in Windermere and Keswick close and, according to the press, 2500 people lose their jobs.

    First of many. Many companies rely on Spring and Summer and losing this period will never be regained.

    For many summer season businesses this will be truly devastating. Many companies will lose money autumn/winter but gain it Spring/Summer.

    For companies that have survived last winter only to have now lost money Spring/Summer and now facing an even worse than normal Winter this is just destructive.
    You don’t need to tell me. I’ve been boring on about it for weeks now.

    When a lot of those job losses are concentrated in particular areas with few alternatives and even those affected by the loss of trade etc, the prospects are poor for those areas.

    “Levelling up” my arse!
    So what do you suggest ?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    Scott_xP said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    Ah - Scott has given up on Cummings...

    When he resorted to mentioning Amber Rudd it was inevitable.

    https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/1265696243109498880
    Actually I thought it would be higher than that
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,620
    Andy_JS said:

    Scott_xP said:
    If you live in an urban area you're more likely to find yourself in breach of a regulation based on getting too close to other people than people living in the middle of nowhere.
    There might be an age factor as well.

    Detailed data would be needed if people wanted a proper answer rather than to posture.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381

    412 dead today? Second wave approaching?

    Probably just catching up with the weekend reporting, although I will eat my trousers if there is no second wave.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,766
    Just realised they have put the former Chief Exec of Talk Talk in charge of track and trace and the app.

    Erm, massive data hack anyone?
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,898


    In the end, we will have to face the real choice.

    Back to our lives and accept the risk. Or economic collapse.

    New normal is not sustainable.

    Of course it is - it's just going to be different. There will be adversity, job losses, pain and it will be difficult for many...

    BUT it is also an opportunity - I thought as a believer in capitalism you would understand that. New businesses will emerge, new jobs will be created, new ways to make money will be there for the forward thinking, the adept, the entrepreneur.

    Imagining everything has to go back to exactly how it was on March 1st is naive and simplistic - the world has changed. The one thing human beings are good at is adaptation - we evolve as the world around us evolves.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    Virtue signalled. Majority protected. Effect on government nil.

    A nice bit of political theatre.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,405

    Just realised they have put the former Chief Exec of Talk Talk in charge of track and trace and the app.

    Erm, massive data hack anyone?

    Hasn't there already been one, or at least a data leak?
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,620

    412 dead today? Second wave approaching?

    Really Sunil I thought better of you.
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 4,042
    eek said:

    Just realised they have put the former Chief Exec of Talk Talk in charge of track and trace and the app.

    Erm, massive data hack anyone?

    Hasn't there already been one, or at least a data leak?
    Yes, Serco leaked 300 emails by accident.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2020/05/20/serco-apologises-leaking-contact-tracers-personal-email-addresses/
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,620

    412 dead today? Second wave approaching?

    Probably just catching up with the weekend reporting, although I will eat my trousers if there is no second wave.
    If a second wave is expected later in the year then we should be removing restrictions now and building herd immunity.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,766
    Stand by for endless tales of people being txted to self isolate about people they have never met.

  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,680

    Any Brexiteer not supporting Cummings is apparently "letting the side down".

    https://twitter.com/montie/status/1265664834504400898

    Even Montie has realised some of his erstwhile chums are barking at the moon.
    Are these people actually under the impression that Brexit hasn't happened yet and Cummings needs to be kept in place to protect it? There can be no other explanation.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    Election in 4 years folks. His letter also makes it clear that's he's being personally harrassed with false accusations by stupid 'journalists'.
This discussion has been closed.