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    JamesPJamesP Posts: 85
    edited December 2019
    Ignore, error.
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607
    Byronic said:

    Been travelling for 24 hours.... back in London, I am surprised to see the Tory pessimism on here. And I am prone to pressimism.

    Looks pretty clear to me that the Tory lead has stabilised and probably widened again. 10-11%? And Boris' popularity has bounced back but as Corbyn's has fallen away once more.

    This is surely a result of the Neil interview and the aftermath.

    We are just 11 campaigning days from the GE. The Tories are 10-11 points ahead of a party led by a widely reviled leader. This is not cause for complacency, but it is surely cause for very timid OPTimism,

    Yes, I've said it for the last few days. Labour's onslaught of bribes resulted in a 2 point swing in their favour, around half of that seems to have unwound. They have nothing left in their cupboard that will move votes and people are drifting back towards the Tories. Corbyn is on the wrong side of the argument wrt terrorists and Boris is a lot better at delivering a human answer than May was in 2017 in the same circumstances. He's got the right answer already "terrorists will never be allowed out early and we will lock them up forever and a day if necessary" is not something May would have said. She would have dithered and come up with some technical reason as to why it wouldn't be possible to do that, by then Jez would have something to say that didn't sound completely baffling.

    The essence of this campaign is completely different to 2017.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,186

    egg said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    Good news for rats.
    Well, it is a Tory council :lol:
    Funnily it was the Independents who were accused of being rats in the last parliament...
  • Options
    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    In our case it is not a problem as we do recycle a lot but it is a big problem for families

    And they are about to introduce charges for picking up garden waste
    Our local Lib Dems went heavily for the "Brown Bin Tax" in the most recent district council elections.

    The Tories were subsequently thrown out and replaced by a red-yellow coalition.
  • Options
    speedy2 said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Lets all talk to HYUFD about it, he might convince the Conservatives to announce something about it next week.
    Honestly, the street lighting thing is the worst. Have they done it for others on here? At least half, and in places all, lights go off after a certain time. In other words precisely when you most need the sodding things!
  • Options

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    Lefty council?
    It is run by the Tories & independents, I think.
    Yes they are in coalition
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    nunu2 said:

    Nigel Farage doing best here.

    Burgon is laughable.

    Farage is a powerful bully but I think he is destroying the debate Burgon is an idiot. sturgeon doing well.
  • Options

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    Lefty council?
    It is run by the Tories & independents, I think.
    Ooops. Right-wing Tory-boy council, sorry :)
    No it is not a right wing tory boy council. It is a coalition
  • Options
    JamesPJamesP Posts: 85
    Byronic said:

    Been travelling for 24 hours.... back in London, I am surprised to see the Tory pessimism on here. And I am prone to pressimism.

    Looks pretty clear to me that the Tory lead has stabilised and probably widened again. 10-11%? And Boris' popularity has bounced back but as Corbyn's has fallen away once more.


    But we saw a tweet from a Corbynite canvasser saying that things feel really good on the ground in Hackney!
  • Options
    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905

    speedy2 said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Lets all talk to HYUFD about it, he might convince the Conservatives to announce something about it next week.
    Honestly, the street lighting thing is the worst. Have they done it for others on here? At least half, and in places all, lights go off after a certain time. In other words precisely when you most need the sodding things!
    Ah, but it's very green. Good for energy efficiency. Good for night-flying insects. And, if people get run over on the roads and killed as a result, they stop consuming the planet's finite resources and become compost instead. Everyone's a winner!
  • Options
    eggegg Posts: 1,749
    HYUFD said:

    No real surprises in the ITV debate so far though Burgon coming off worst

    Agreed. And your robot boy already bested Farage and sturgeon in exchanges.
    Swinson coming out best, but why is she always on edge of stage 😕 Why Tory robot always in middle, always gets first chance to answer. Every time etchy goes to him to answer first, that is disgraceful you agree HY? He gets more come back opportunities and speaking time than anyone else.
  • Options
    brokenwheelbrokenwheel Posts: 3,352
    edited December 2019
    JamesP said:

    Byronic said:

    Been travelling for 24 hours.... back in London, I am surprised to see the Tory pessimism on here. And I am prone to pressimism.

    Looks pretty clear to me that the Tory lead has stabilised and probably widened again. 10-11%? And Boris' popularity has bounced back but as Corbyn's has fallen away once more.

    But we saw a tweet from a Corbynite canvasser saying that things feel really good on the ground in Hackney!
    As Hackney goes, so goes the nation.
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    kinabalu said:

    egg said:

    Thank God for Boris decisive crack down to make us all safe, whether you respect him or not.

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    Lefty council?
    It is run by the Tories & independents, I think.
    Ooops. Right-wing Tory-boy council, sorry :)
    No it is not a right wing tory boy council. It is a coalition
    of right wing tory boys and right wing independent boys.
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,962

    JamesP said:

    Byronic said:

    Been travelling for 24 hours.... back in London, I am surprised to see the Tory pessimism on here. And I am prone to pressimism.

    Looks pretty clear to me that the Tory lead has stabilised and probably widened again. 10-11%? And Boris' popularity has bounced back but as Corbyn's has fallen away once more.

    But we saw a tweet from a Corbynite canvasser saying that things feel really good on the ground in Hackney!
    As Hackney goes, so goes the nation.
    I thought that was Bootle? :o
  • Options
    StereotomyStereotomy Posts: 4,092
    https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/opendemocracyuk/what-are-jo-swinsons-liberal-democrats-so-desperate-to-hide/

    I've been wondering for a while what the lib dems actually stand for, but this election has opened my eyes: it's deception.
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    ydoethur said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    In our case it is not a problem as we do recycle a lot but it is a big problem for families

    And they are about to introduce charges for picking up garden waste
    I hope they pick up food waste more regularly than that.
    Yes - weekly
    I get my bins entered every night in summer and six nights a week in winter, but then I don’t live in the UK. My council tax is €500 pa with a degree of thought anything is possible or are you to lazy to walk at most 50 to 100 ?meters to the bin
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,658
    edited December 2019

    speedy2 said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Lets all talk to HYUFD about it, he might convince the Conservatives to announce something about it next week.
    Honestly, the street lighting thing is the worst. Have they done it for others on here? At least half, and in places all, lights go off after a certain time. In other words precisely when you most need the sodding things!
    Ah, but it's very green. Good for energy efficiency. Good for night-flying insects. And, if people get run over on the roads and killed as a result, they stop consuming the planet's finite resources and become compost instead. Everyone's a winner!
    No street lights in our village. We manage fine. Lovely starry skies as side benefit.
    Buy a torch and get over it.
  • Options
    BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    Swinson has no authority about her, just a grown up version of a teachers pet. Sunak is on message but knows the script inside out. I like the Plaid guy’s voice, green woman away with the fairies on immigration but like Sturgeon knows her crowd. If Burgon was part of a Labour strategy to win round Lab leavers I’m not sure he’s working. A northern accent just isn’t enough.
  • Options
    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905

    JamesP said:

    Byronic said:

    Been travelling for 24 hours.... back in London, I am surprised to see the Tory pessimism on here. And I am prone to pressimism.

    Looks pretty clear to me that the Tory lead has stabilised and probably widened again. 10-11%? And Boris' popularity has bounced back but as Corbyn's has fallen away once more.

    But we saw a tweet from a Corbynite canvasser saying that things feel really good on the ground in Hackney!
    As Hackney goes, so goes the nation.
    Oh fucking hell, our high streets aren't all about to be taken over by avant garde art collectives and cereal cafes, are they?
  • Options
    IshmaelZ said:

    kinabalu said:

    egg said:

    Thank God for Boris decisive crack down to make us all safe, whether you respect him or not.

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    Lefty council?
    It is run by the Tories & independents, I think.
    Ooops. Right-wing Tory-boy council, sorry :)
    No it is not a right wing tory boy council. It is a coalition
    of right wing tory boys and right wing independent boys.
    Why sexiest
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    IshmaelZ said:

    kinabalu said:

    egg said:

    Thank God for Boris decisive crack down to make us all safe, whether you respect him or not.

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    Lefty council?
    It is run by the Tories & independents, I think.
    Ooops. Right-wing Tory-boy council, sorry :)
    No it is not a right wing tory boy council. It is a coalition
    of right wing tory boys and right wing independent boys.
    Why sexiest
    I don't know, I've just always been that way.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,881

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Yes, but this election is for an MP to sit in Parliament. Bin collections and street lighting are issues for local elections to the council that makes these decisions.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,986
    egg said:

    HYUFD said:

    No real surprises in the ITV debate so far though Burgon coming off worst

    Agreed. And your robot boy already bested Farage and sturgeon in exchanges.
    Swinson coming out best, but why is she always on edge of stage 😕 Why Tory robot always in middle, always gets first chance to answer. Every time etchy goes to him to answer first, that is disgraceful you agree HY? He gets more come back opportunities and speaking time than anyone else.
    He is getting about the same speaking time as Swinson, Sturgeon, Burgon and Farage
  • Options
    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905

    speedy2 said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Lets all talk to HYUFD about it, he might convince the Conservatives to announce something about it next week.
    Honestly, the street lighting thing is the worst. Have they done it for others on here? At least half, and in places all, lights go off after a certain time. In other words precisely when you most need the sodding things!
    Ah, but it's very green. Good for energy efficiency. Good for night-flying insects. And, if people get run over on the roads and killed as a result, they stop consuming the planet's finite resources and become compost instead. Everyone's a winner!
    No street lights in our village. We manage fine. Lovely starry skies as side benefit.
    Buy a torch and get over it.
    When I go out to the sticks to visit my Mum there are no street lights either, but then again there's very little traffic and the night time economy consists of one pub. People's concerns about this aren't entirely risible.
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    speedy2 said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Lets all talk to HYUFD about it, he might convince the Conservatives to announce something about it next week.
    Honestly, the street lighting thing is the worst. Have they done it for others on here? At least half, and in places all, lights go off after a certain time. In other words precisely when you most need the sodding things!
    Ah, but it's very green. Good for energy efficiency. Good for night-flying insects. And, if people get run over on the roads and killed as a result, they stop consuming the planet's finite resources and become compost instead. Everyone's a winner!
    Oh come on the last place I lived in the streets went out at midnight and we had to navigate our way home from the pub in the dark, nobody was killed but I did fall over occasionally but not as a result of the lights being off.
  • Options
    nichomar said:

    ydoethur said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    In our case it is not a problem as we do recycle a lot but it is a big problem for families

    And they are about to introduce charges for picking up garden waste
    I hope they pick up food waste more regularly than that.
    Yes - weekly
    I get my bins entered every night in summer and six nights a week in winter, but then I don’t live in the UK. My council tax is €500 pa with a degree of thought anything is possible or are you to lazy to walk at most 50 to 100 ?meters to the bin
    Not sure about walking to bins as we do not have communal bins. Each home has a food waste container, a 3 section trolley block and a bin

    And my council tax is £2,700 for this year
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,150
    It is really upsetting that the two people in Fishmongers Hall were so young and had so much positivity to offer for the future.
    It may well be the fault of Corbyn and Labour and they should be held to account and apologise for it should that be the case. However, I was disturbed by the casuality of Boris' use of language during the Marr Show. The term 'leftie' as used when apportioning blame for the incident struck me as spoken by someone who really didn't care.
  • Options
    ralphmalphralphmalph Posts: 2,201
    nichomar said:

    Won’t answer the wto exit end of 2010 issue hiding behind claiming they have deal, this is the biggest con unless they sign up for total alignment with the EU it’s going to take a lot longer than five months, which is all they have before having to ask for an extension.

    Because the opposition politicians just shout "no deal" If they were smarter they would be shouting "No trade deal."
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,658
    HYUFD said:
    This is just not true.
    Average Tory lead (last 6 polls) 11 days ahead of GE19 = 9.2%
    Average Tory lead 11 days ahead of GE17 = 8.8%
    (Based on last six polls in wiki)
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    nichomar said:

    ydoethur said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    In our case it is not a problem as we do recycle a lot but it is a big problem for families

    And they are about to introduce charges for picking up garden waste
    I hope they pick up food waste more regularly than that.
    Yes - weekly
    I get my bins entered every night in summer and six nights a week in winter, but then I don’t live in the UK. My council tax is €500 pa with a degree of thought anything is possible or are you to lazy to walk at most 50 to 100 ?meters to the bin
    Not sure about walking to bins as we do not have communal bins. Each home has a food waste container, a 3 section trolley block and a bin

    And my council tax is £2,700 for this year
    You don’t have communal bins but I bet with some thought 60% could have. The refuse collection team is 1 driver and two operators who hook up the grundons highly efficient but do occasionally wake me up at four in the morning in the summer,
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,280
    edited December 2019

    HYUFD said:
    This is just not true.
    Average Tory lead (last 6 polls) 11 days ahead of GE19 = 9.2%
    Average Tory lead 11 days ahead of GE17 = 8.8%
    (Based on last six polls in wiki)
    I assume it depends on the number of polls used for the average
  • Options
    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Yes, but this election is for an MP to sit in Parliament. Bin collections and street lighting are issues for local elections to the council that makes these decisions.
    Except that, because central Government rather than local taxation supplies so much of the local Government budget, this could be argued to be a General Election issue. Councils commonly blame cost cutting measures like long bin collection periods and turning off the lights on lack of cash.
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    i'm not watching the debate although the wife is.

    Her view is

    Sturgeon best by a mile.

    Burgon the worst by a mile

    Others "all good"
  • Options
    What's the more accurate prediction tool for general election results out of hypothetical polls and European election results?
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195

    HYUFD said:
    This is just not true.
    Average Tory lead (last 6 polls) 11 days ahead of GE19 = 9.2%
    Average Tory lead 11 days ahead of GE17 = 8.8%
    (Based on last six polls in wiki)
    Because Wiki is always right.....
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,881
    nichomar said:

    speedy2 said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Lets all talk to HYUFD about it, he might convince the Conservatives to announce something about it next week.
    Honestly, the street lighting thing is the worst. Have they done it for others on here? At least half, and in places all, lights go off after a certain time. In other words precisely when you most need the sodding things!
    Ah, but it's very green. Good for energy efficiency. Good for night-flying insects. And, if people get run over on the roads and killed as a result, they stop consuming the planet's finite resources and become compost instead. Everyone's a winner!
    Oh come on the last place I lived in the streets went out at midnight and we had to navigate our way home from the pub in the dark, nobody was killed but I did fall over occasionally but not as a result of the lights being off.
    Ah, that classic lack of joined up thinking, as seen by many councils. Change pub closing time from 11 to 1 or 2am, but still switch off the street lights at midnight.
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    He gets his steer from Milne

    I read something about Milne today and he really is the worst of a bad lot.
  • Options
    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    ydoethur said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    In our case it is not a problem as we do recycle a lot but it is a big problem for families

    And they are about to introduce charges for picking up garden waste
    I hope they pick up food waste more regularly than that.
    Yes - weekly
    I get my bins entered every night in summer and six nights a week in winter, but then I don’t live in the UK. My council tax is €500 pa with a degree of thought anything is possible or are you to lazy to walk at most 50 to 100 ?meters to the bin
    Not sure about walking to bins as we do not have communal bins. Each home has a food waste container, a 3 section trolley block and a bin

    And my council tax is £2,700 for this year
    You don’t have communal bins but I bet with some thought 60% could have. The refuse collection team is 1 driver and two operators who hook up the grundons highly efficient but do occasionally wake me up at four in the morning in the summer,
    It is not in our tradition to have communal bins unless you are living in apartment blocks and in our village the vast majority of properties are houses and bungalows

    Believe you me if anyone suggested such a scheme there would be uproar

    To be honest for us the system works well
  • Options
    Floater said:

    i'm not watching the debate although the wife is.

    Her view is

    Sturgeon best by a mile.

    Burgon the worst by a mile

    Others "all good"

    Farage wiping the floor with the anti US gang of Swinson,Burgon & Sturgeon.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,187
    No complaints on the bins here. Camden council has absolutely nailed it in this department. Pick them up every Tuesday morning like clockwork. Empty them and put them back where they came from. It's impressive.
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,962

    HYUFD said:
    This is just not true.
    Average Tory lead (last 6 polls) 11 days ahead of GE19 = 9.2%
    Average Tory lead 11 days ahead of GE17 = 8.8%
    (Based on last six polls in wiki)
    Why only use the last six polls?
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    Men say some awful things sometimes as Farage tries to defend trump and the unknown Tory fails to condemn him, audience at last reacts.
  • Options

    HYUFD said:
    This is just not true.
    Average Tory lead (last 6 polls) 11 days ahead of GE19 = 9.2%
    Average Tory lead 11 days ahead of GE17 = 8.8%
    (Based on last six polls in wiki)
    ELBOW (sans Survation) is 9.7%. That's all 10 polls with fieldwork ending within the last seven days.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,187
    Adam Price! 👍
  • Options
    alb1onalb1on Posts: 698

    alb1on said:

    kinabalu said:

    That is true for pretty much all human endeavors. Our lives are better across the board, our sportsmen are better trained, our hospitals and schools are better resourced and the education and health offered is much richer. Our roads are much safer, our air is much cleaner, our cars are much more reliable, our computers are much better and faster. It goes on and on and on.

    Absolutely right. And IMO this applies to the arts too. Music, films, TV, novels, poetry, plays etc, all better now than they used to be. Why? Because wider access means more product, thus harder to stand out. Every week there are songs released that are as good as anything by the Beatles. Just that you won't come across them. Yes, progress in everything is inevitable. I believe that. We are even getting better looking. Well, we aren't, quite the opposite, but you know what I mean.
    True, and its why that film Yesterday was just nostalgic mush. All those songs are fantastic. But our joy in hearing beatles songs is in how familiar we are with them and how they flood our minds with memories when we hear them.

    My significant other got me onto an obscure artist that most people havent heard of. Having been forced to listen to many of his songs over the space of a couple of years i now listen to him a lot and some of them feel to me as good as those classics.
    Sorry but I have to disagree. I cannot rate any modern composer with the likes of Schubert. No living artist can rival past masters such as Casper David Friedrich. And I defy anyone to find a play to equal Stoppard's Arcadia since it was written nearly 30 years ago. The real benefit of wider access is that it makes it easier to find the hidden gems from all eras. The example I like is Willy DeVille. A neglected genius in the UK and USA, I first heard his music in Germany (where he is still huge 10 years after his death), and youtube has given me the access to confirm his genius.
    Yay, Spanish Stroll is one of my fave singles.
    I recommend the acoustic album (mainly recorded live in Berlin) from the early noughties. Unfortunately very difficult to get hold of, but readily accessed on youtube.
  • Options
    MightyAlexMightyAlex Posts: 1,442
    edited December 2019
    [moderated]

    No unsubstantiated claims like this please. -PB Moderator
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195

    https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/opendemocracyuk/what-are-jo-swinsons-liberal-democrats-so-desperate-to-hide/

    I've been wondering for a while what the lib dems actually stand for, but this election has opened my eyes: it's deception.

    To be fair they always fought dirty - but this time they have been exposed to sunlight
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    Floater said:

    i'm not watching the debate although the wife is.

    Her view is

    Sturgeon best by a mile.

    Burgon the worst by a mile

    Others "all good"

    Farage wiping the floor with the anti US gang of Swinson,Burgon & Sturgeon.
    With his view that it’s ok is for men to say some awful things about women I think he has just destroyed what little reputation he had.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,881

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Yes, but this election is for an MP to sit in Parliament. Bin collections and street lighting are issues for local elections to the council that makes these decisions.
    Except that, because central Government rather than local taxation supplies so much of the local Government budget, this could be argued to be a General Election issue. Councils commonly blame cost cutting measures like long bin collection periods and turning off the lights on lack of cash.
    That sounds like an excellent reason for more devolution to local authorities, let them raise more of their own cash and choose how to spend it.
    Actually, a lot of the recent bin madness is down to EU directives on waste disposal and landfill.
  • Options

    HYUFD said:
    This is just not true.
    Average Tory lead (last 6 polls) 11 days ahead of GE19 = 9.2%
    Average Tory lead 11 days ahead of GE17 = 8.8%
    (Based on last six polls in wiki)
    ELBOW (sans Survation) is 9.7%. That's all 10 polls with fieldwork ending within the last seven days.
    Rounded that is 10%
  • Options

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Yes, but this election is for an MP to sit in Parliament. Bin collections and street lighting are issues for local elections to the council that makes these decisions.
    Except that, because central Government rather than local taxation supplies so much of the local Government budget, this could be argued to be a General Election issue. Councils commonly blame cost cutting measures like long bin collection periods and turning off the lights on lack of cash.
    Fortnightly collection and grass collection charges are in the hands of local government, but the requirement to align with the ponzi landfill tax credits system, and even the suggested food waste collection proposals means that with councils limited to inflation 2% increases the means to fund them must come directly.
    PS. recycling is a money changing hands scam most of the time.
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,202
    RobD said:


    I am a pineapple pizza lover, and I approve of this message.
    😱
    Worse even than chocolate sprinkled on coffee.

  • Options
    BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    Burgon is the Tories best gift. This will get decent viewing figures too.
  • Options
    alb1onalb1on Posts: 698
    rcs1000 said:

    alb1on said:

    kinabalu said:

    That is true for pretty much all human endeavors. Our lives are better across the board, our sportsmen are better trained, our hospitals and schools are better resourced and the education and health offered is much richer. Our roads are much safer, our air is much cleaner, our cars are much more reliable, our computers are much better and faster. It goes on and on and on.

    Absolutely right. And IMO this applies to the arts too. Music, films, TV, novels, poetry, plays etc, all better now than they used to be. Why? Because wider access means more product, thus harder to stand out. Every week there are songs released that are as good as anything by the Beatles. Just that you won't come across them. Yes, progress in everything is inevitable. I believe that. We are even getting better looking. Well, we aren't, quite the opposite, but you know what I mean.
    True, and its why that film Yesterday was just nostalgic mush. All those songs are fantastic. But our joy in hearing beatles songs is in how familiar we are with them and how they flood our minds with memories when we hear them.

    My significant other got me onto an obscure artist that most people havent heard of. Having been forced to listen to many of his songs over the space of a couple of years i now listen to him a lot and some of them feel to me as good as those classics.
    Sorry but I have to disagree. I cannot rate any modern composer with the likes of Schubert. No living artist can rival past masters such as Casper David Friedrich. And I defy anyone to find a play to equal Stoppard's Arcadia since it was written nearly 30 years ago. The real benefit of wider access is that it makes it easier to find the hidden gems from all eras. The example I like is Willy DeVille. A neglected genius in the UK and USA, I first heard his music in Germany (where he is still huge 10 years after his death), and youtube has given me the access to confirm his genius.
    You'd rate Schubert ahead of Thom Yorke?

    That's a gutsy call on here. People have been banned for less.
    I would rate Boney M ahead of Thom Yorke - at least their version of Heart of Gold. :)
  • Options
    America bombed Libya in 1986 and Iraq in 1991.
  • Options
    nunu2nunu2 Posts: 1,453
    Seems Tories have stepped up their twitter game.

    Have they finally woken up in the final two weeks? 😂
  • Options

    HYUFD said:
    This is just not true.
    Average Tory lead (last 6 polls) 11 days ahead of GE19 = 9.2%
    Average Tory lead 11 days ahead of GE17 = 8.8%
    (Based on last six polls in wiki)
    ELBOW (sans Survation) is 9.7%. That's all 10 polls with fieldwork ending within the last seven days.
    Rounded that is 10%
    Yes, that's true :)
  • Options

    [moderated]

    No unsubstantiated claims like this please. -PB Moderator

    He is lots of things but I have not heard that one
  • Options
    eggegg Posts: 1,749
    alb1on said:

    rcs1000 said:

    alb1on said:

    kinabalu said:

    That is true for pretty much all human endeavors. Our lives are better across the board, our sportsmen are better trained, our hospitals and schools are better resourced and the education and health offered is much richer. Our roads are much safer, our air is much cleaner, our cars are much more reliable, our computers are much better and faster. It goes on and on and on.

    Absolutely right. And IMO this applies to the arts too. Music, films, TV, novels, poetry, plays etc, all better now than they used to be. Why? Because wider access means more product, thus harder to stand out. Every week there are songs released that are as good as anything by the Beatles. Just that you won't come across them. Yes, progress in everything is inevitable. I believe that. We are even getting better looking. Well, we aren't, quite the opposite, but you know what I mean.
    True, and its why that film Yesterday was just nostalgic mush. All those songs are fantastic. But our joy in hearing beatles songs is in how familiar we are with them and how they flood our minds with memories when we hear them.

    My significant other got me onto an obscure artist that most people havent heard of. Having been forced to listen to many of his songs over the space of a couple of years i now listen to him a lot and some of them feel to me as good as those classics.
    Sorry but I have to disagree. I cannot rate any modern composer with the likes of Schubert. No living artist can rival past masters such as Casper David Friedrich. And I defy anyone to find a play to equal Stoppard's Arcadia since it was written nearly 30 years ago. The real benefit of wider access is that it makes it easier to find the hidden gems from all eras. The example I like is Willy DeVille. A neglected genius in the UK and USA, I first heard his music in Germany (where he is still huge 10 years after his death), and youtube has given me the access to confirm his genius.
    You'd rate Schubert ahead of Thom Yorke?

    That's a gutsy call on here. People have been banned for less.
    I would rate Boney M ahead of Thom Yorke - at least their version of Heart of Gold. :)
    Goodbye Alb 👋🏻
  • Options
    nichomar said:

    Floater said:

    i'm not watching the debate although the wife is.

    Her view is

    Sturgeon best by a mile.

    Burgon the worst by a mile

    Others "all good"

    Farage wiping the floor with the anti US gang of Swinson,Burgon & Sturgeon.
    With his view that it’s ok is for men to say some awful things about women I think he has just destroyed what little reputation he had.
    Farage said that ???
  • Options

    Floater said:

    i'm not watching the debate although the wife is.

    Her view is

    Sturgeon best by a mile.

    Burgon the worst by a mile

    Others "all good"

    Farage wiping the floor with the anti US gang of Swinson,Burgon & Sturgeon.
    Have the US sent over Mrs Sacoolas yet?
  • Options
    Survation… must have Survation...
  • Options
    MightyAlexMightyAlex Posts: 1,442

    [moderated]

    No unsubstantiated claims like this please. -PB Moderator

    He is lots of things but I have not heard that one
    Cheers, I'll put it down to over-excitement.
  • Options

    America bombed Libya in 1986 and Iraq in 1991.
    After Libya blew up a Berlin Disco and Iraq invaded Kuwait....but yeah, it’s all the West's fault.
    We’re far from blameless - but to suggest we’re solely to blame is purile.
  • Options
    mattmatt Posts: 3,789
    alb1on said:

    alb1on said:

    kinabalu said:

    That is true for pretty much all human endeavors. Our lives are better across the board, our sportsmen are better trained, our hospitals and schools are better resourced and the education and health offered is much richer. Our roads are much safer, our air is much cleaner, our cars are much more reliable, our computers are much better and faster. It goes on and on and on.

    Absolutely right. And IMO this applies to the arts too. Music, films, TV, novels, poetry, plays etc, all better now than they used to be. Why? Because wider access means more product, thus harder to stand out. Every week there are songs released that are as good as anything by the Beatles. Just that you won't come across them. Yes, progress in everything is inevitable. I believe that. We are even getting better looking. Well, we aren't, quite the opposite, but you know what I mean.
    True, and its why that film Yesterday was just nostalgic mush. All those songs are fantastic. But our joy in hearing beatles songs is in how familiar we are with them and how they flood our minds with memories when we hear them.

    My significant other got me onto an obscure artist that most people havent heard of. Having been forced to listen to many of his songs over the space of a couple of years i now listen to him a lot and some of them feel to me as good as those classics.
    Sorry but I have to disagree. I cannot rate any modern composer with the likes of Schubert. No living artist can rival past masters such as Casper David Friedrich. And I defy anyone to find a play to equal Stoppard's Arcadia since it was written nearly 30 years ago. The real benefit of wider access is that it makes it easier to find the hidden gems from all eras. The example I like is Willy DeVille. A neglected genius in the UK and USA, I first heard his music in Germany (where he is still huge 10 years after his death), and youtube has given me the access to confirm his genius.
    Yay, Spanish Stroll is one of my fave singles.
    I recommend the acoustic album (mainly recorded live in Berlin) from the early noughties. Unfortunately very difficult to get hold of, but readily accessed on youtube.
    I’ve never heard of him but if you mean Unplugged in Berlin, it’s freely available on Spotify.
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Yes, but this election is for an MP to sit in Parliament. Bin collections and street lighting are issues for local elections to the council that makes these decisions.
    Except that, because central Government rather than local taxation supplies so much of the local Government budget, this could be argued to be a General Election issue. Councils commonly blame cost cutting measures like long bin collection periods and turning off the lights on lack of cash.
    That sounds like an excellent reason for more devolution to local authorities, let them raise more of their own cash and choose how to spend it.
    Actually, a lot of the recent bin madness is down to EU directives on waste disposal and landfill.
    But at the moment (I think) council tax rates are capped and central government funding is continually reduced. The local council is faced every year with making choices, quite correctly, between competing priorities and are in a no win situation whatever color they are.
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,962
    nunu2 said:

    Seems Tories have stepped up their twitter game.

    Have they finally woken up in the final two weeks? 😂

    What have they done? :p
  • Options
    felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    From their poll yesterday which saw Labour down and the Tories up :)
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    edited December 2019
    nichomar said:

    Floater said:

    i'm not watching the debate although the wife is.

    Her view is

    Sturgeon best by a mile.

    Burgon the worst by a mile

    Others "all good"

    Farage wiping the floor with the anti US gang of Swinson,Burgon & Sturgeon.
    With his view that it’s ok is for men to say some awful things about women I think he has just destroyed what little reputation he had.
    He didn't say it was ok, he said it happens and - quite specifically - that it is unacceptable. Please don't make misrepresentations of that kind.
  • Options
    timmotimmo Posts: 1,469
    nico67 said:

    No one really cares about these debates without Corbyn and Johnson .

    Burgon is really annoying , I find his voice grates but clearly they’ve stuck on a Labour MP from the north with the appropriate accent to appeal to Labour Leave voters .

    It's the way he says Tories
  • Options
    NovoNovo Posts: 27

    HYUFD said:
    This is just not true.
    Average Tory lead (last 6 polls) 11 days ahead of GE19 = 9.2%
    Average Tory lead 11 days ahead of GE17 = 8.8%
    (Based on last six polls in wiki)
    ELBOW (sans Survation) is 9.7%. That's all 10 polls with fieldwork ending within the last seven days.
    Rounded that is 10%
    You cannot selectively delete polls you don’t like. Rounded these are both 9% and the same given the MOE.
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,962
    felix said:

    From their poll yesterday which saw Labour down and the Tories up :)
    Boris is keeping the legions of the blue rinse brigade on standby.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,658

    HYUFD said:
    This is just not true.
    Average Tory lead (last 6 polls) 11 days ahead of GE19 = 9.2%
    Average Tory lead 11 days ahead of GE17 = 8.8%
    (Based on last six polls in wiki)
    I assume it depends on the number of polls used for the average
    If you use the wikipedia list you cannot get those results with any consistent number of consecutive polls in both years.
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,263

    speedy2 said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Lets all talk to HYUFD about it, he might convince the Conservatives to announce something about it next week.
    Honestly, the street lighting thing is the worst. Have they done it for others on here? At least half, and in places all, lights go off after a certain time. In other words precisely when you most need the sodding things!
    Ah, but it's very green. Good for energy efficiency. Good for night-flying insects. And, if people get run over on the roads and killed as a result, they stop consuming the planet's finite resources and become compost instead. Everyone's a winner!
    You can save a lot of money by turning them off at night
  • Options
    nunu2nunu2 Posts: 1,453
    RobD said:

    nunu2 said:

    Seems Tories have stepped up their twitter game.

    Have they finally woken up in the final two weeks? 😂

    What have they done? :p
    Just upped their number of tweets and the quality.
  • Options
    timmotimmo Posts: 1,469
    Because they can never be seen to be wrong..they are brazen beyond belief and I think.it is institutionalized within the party..the Millwall of the political.system
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    IshmaelZ said:

    nichomar said:

    Floater said:

    i'm not watching the debate although the wife is.

    Her view is

    Sturgeon best by a mile.

    Burgon the worst by a mile

    Others "all good"

    Farage wiping the floor with the anti US gang of Swinson,Burgon & Sturgeon.
    With his view that it’s ok is for men to say some awful things about women I think he has just destroyed what little reputation he had.
    He didn't say it was ok, he said it happens and - quite specifically - that it is unacceptable. Please don't make misrepresentations of that kind.
    I didn’t hear the ‘it’s unacceptable’
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,269
    edited December 2019
    Novo said:

    HYUFD said:
    This is just not true.
    Average Tory lead (last 6 polls) 11 days ahead of GE19 = 9.2%
    Average Tory lead 11 days ahead of GE17 = 8.8%
    (Based on last six polls in wiki)
    ELBOW (sans Survation) is 9.7%. That's all 10 polls with fieldwork ending within the last seven days.
    Rounded that is 10%
    You cannot selectively delete polls you don’t like. Rounded these are both 9% and the same given the MOE.
    9.7% rounded up is 10%. I haven't included Survation because they only publish late on the Sunday. In other words it doesn't exist - yet!
    An ELBOW week runs from Monday to Sunday, you see.
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,202
    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    camel said:

    You can hire an escort and get a steak dinner with drinks for £33. Seems good value. Would this be Kilburn. Or Hampstead?

    If you're going the steak dinner route that is definitely Kilburn. It's a no no in Hampstead, that sort of thing. Even our MacDonalds got the chop.
    With the exception of Jin Kichi, there are no good restaurants in Hampstead. Which is quite extraordinary, when you think about it.
    The Wells Tavern is good.
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    timmo said:

    Because they can never be seen to be wrong..they are brazen beyond belief and I think.it is institutionalized within the party..the Millwall of the political.system
    Yes tories are paragons of virtue never do anything wrong and are open and welcoming to none Tory councilors who get elected. Lovely people
  • Options
    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,331


    It is not in our tradition to have communal bins unless you are living in apartment blocks and in our village the vast majority of properties are houses and bungalows

    Believe you me if anyone suggested such a scheme there would be uproar

    To be honest for us the system works well

    I've tried both - in Haslemere around a dozen homes shared a common bin area (gated to avoid foxes getting at the bins), while where I live in Godalming we have individual bins. I preferred the Haslemere solution, as you could drop rubbish in any day of the week, and when the rubbish was collected was a matter of indifference to us - they could have gone over to 4-weekly and it would have been fine. Cluttering up every home with individual bins and trundling them in and out is as tiresome as having a boiler of doubtful quality in every home instead of district heating. But clearly joint solutions only work if the homes are reasonably close together.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,881

    America bombed Libya in 1986 and Iraq in 1991.
    After Libya blew up a Berlin Disco and Iraq invaded Kuwait....but yeah, it’s all the West's fault.
    We’re far from blameless - but to suggest we’re solely to blame is purile.
    And Lockerbie in 1988, another Libyan bomb in the U.K.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,186

    America bombed Libya in 1986 and Iraq in 1991.
    After Libya blew up a Berlin Disco and Iraq invaded Kuwait....but yeah, it’s all the West's fault.
    We’re far from blameless - but to suggest we’re solely to blame is purile.
    Didn’t we bomb Iraq, Sudan and Afghanistan in 1998 as well?
  • Options

    America bombed Libya in 1986 and Iraq in 1991.
    After Libya blew up a Berlin Disco and Iraq invaded Kuwait....but yeah, it’s all the West's fault.
    We’re far from blameless - but to suggest we’re solely to blame is purile.
    Well, innocent civilians - lots of them - were killed by US bombs in both nations, no?
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,186
    edited December 2019
    IanB2 said:

    speedy2 said:

    RobD said:

    speedy2 said:

    Why does no one talk about bread and butter issues on the debate?
    "Bringing people together"? I read that people in Leigh moan about the 3 week bin collections, and probably everyone else in Britain too.
    If Boris promises to shift from 3 week bin collections to 1 week it would have far more impact with voters than vacuous slogans.

    4 week bin collection here in Aberconwy
    How is that even tolerable :o
    This really is the stuff that matters. Round my way a promise to restore weekly bin collections and reinstate proper street lighting would get a majority for anyone.
    Lets all talk to HYUFD about it, he might convince the Conservatives to announce something about it next week.
    Honestly, the street lighting thing is the worst. Have they done it for others on here? At least half, and in places all, lights go off after a certain time. In other words precisely when you most need the sodding things!
    Ah, but it's very green. Good for energy efficiency. Good for night-flying insects. And, if people get run over on the roads and killed as a result, they stop consuming the planet's finite resources and become compost instead. Everyone's a winner!
    You can save a lot of money by turning them off at night
    Ummmm...
    My favourite on this, to be serious, was a village council who turned street lights off for three days as an economy measure. It saved £18 but there were two £15 fees to disconnect and reconnect them. It cost £12 to spend three days nights in darkness.

    Edited after I noticed how stupid my chosen word was...
  • Options
    Tory majority drifting out a bit again
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    alb1on said:

    rcs1000 said:

    alb1on said:

    kinabalu said:

    That is true for pretty much all human endeavors. Our lives are better across the board, our sportsmen are better trained, our hospitals and schools are better resourced and the education and health offered is much richer. Our roads are much safer, our air is much cleaner, our cars are much more reliable, our computers are much better and faster. It goes on and on and on.

    Absolutely right. And IMO this applies to the arts too. Music, films, TV, novels, poetry, plays etc, all better now than they used to be. Why? Because wider access means more product, thus harder to stand out. Every week there are songs released that are as good as anything by the Beatles. Just that you won't come across them. Yes, progress in everything is inevitable. I believe that. We are even getting better looking. Well, we aren't, quite the opposite, but you know what I mean.
    True, and its why that film Yesterday was just nostalgic mush. All those songs are fantastic. But our joy in hearing beatles songs is in how familiar we are with them and how they flood our minds with memories when we hear them.

    My significant other got me onto an obscure artist that most people havent heard of. Having been forced to listen to many of his songs over the space of a couple of years i now listen to him a lot and some of them feel to me as good as those classics.
    Sorry but I have to disagree. I cannot rate any modern composer with the likes of Schubert. No living artist can rival past masters such as Casper David Friedrich. And I defy anyone to find a play to equal Stoppard's Arcadia since it was written nearly 30 years ago. The real benefit of wider access is that it makes it easier to find the hidden gems from all eras. The example I like is Willy DeVille. A neglected genius in the UK and USA, I first heard his music in Germany (where he is still huge 10 years after his death), and youtube has given me the access to confirm his genius.
    You'd rate Schubert ahead of Thom Yorke?

    That's a gutsy call on here. People have been banned for less.
    I would rate Boney M ahead of Thom Yorke - at least their version of Heart of Gold. :)
    Thank you for that, I had no idea that existed.

    Nothing will ever persuade me that Mink DeVille was not the Byronic to Lou Reed's SeanT.
  • Options
    dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,287
    Has Richard Burgon changed Labour's defence policy on live TV just before the NATO summit?
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,186
    dr_spyn said:

    Has Richard Burgon changed Labour's defence policy on live TV just before the NATO summit?

    What did he say?
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    Sandpit said:

    America bombed Libya in 1986 and Iraq in 1991.
    After Libya blew up a Berlin Disco and Iraq invaded Kuwait....but yeah, it’s all the West's fault.
    We’re far from blameless - but to suggest we’re solely to blame is purile.
    And Lockerbie in 1988, another Libyan bomb in the U.K.
    How do you rewind 1000 years of history? I’ve no idea but a start would be to see all religious leaders sit down together and provide a united force for peace. It would help if all religions withdrew from front line politics, it would help if we were more tolerant of our differences and it would help if politicians did not use those differences for their own advantage. It’s probably impossible but until people stop gaming religion to their advantage we won’t get anywhere.
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,658

    HYUFD said:
    This is just not true.
    Average Tory lead (last 6 polls) 11 days ahead of GE19 = 9.2%
    Average Tory lead 11 days ahead of GE17 = 8.8%
    (Based on last six polls in wiki)
    ELBOW (sans Survation) is 9.7%. That's all 10 polls with fieldwork ending within the last seven days.
    And if you take the same approach to GE17 at D-11 you get...
    9.69%
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    SunnyJimSunnyJim Posts: 1,106
    nichomar said:


    I didn’t hear the ‘it’s unacceptable’

    Drowned out by the screeching.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,917
    I've just found THE BET of the election
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    ralphmalphralphmalph Posts: 2,201
    I find it most extraordinary that all these other leftie parties are ganging up on Labour and giving the Tory a free ride. Fantastic to watch leftie on leftie action though.
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,269
    edited December 2019
    Sandpit said:

    America bombed Libya in 1986 and Iraq in 1991.
    After Libya blew up a Berlin Disco and Iraq invaded Kuwait....but yeah, it’s all the West's fault.
    We’re far from blameless - but to suggest we’re solely to blame is purile.
    And Lockerbie in 1988, another Libyan bomb in the U.K.
    And the Iran Air shoot-down by the US, five months earlier.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655

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