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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » At this critical time a look at matters of Confidence in the p

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    kjhkjh Posts: 10,632

    kjh said:

    How pleased will the revokers be if their petition reaches 100 million signatures?

    They will be delighted at the solidarity from North Korea and Western Sahara......
    The petitions are a little bit cleverer than that - you can see the results broken down into constituencies on a map of the UK.
    It also lists, in the .json file linked on the petition page, all of the locations outside of the UK where it has been 'signed' and the numbers of signatories in each country. France had a greater total (c9000) than any UK constituency the last time I looked.
    That's logical given that more British people live in France than in any single constituency and they have a direct stake in the outcome of Brexit.
    The total number of UK citizens living in France is about 150k. What's the population of Islington South and Finsbury, where the signatory count is 4,500?
    I think the British residents in France might just be a little more concerned about Brexit don't you?
    How many of them have lived outside the UK for 15 years plus? They don't get a vote
    True. But:

    a) They would sign it anyway and I was only trying to demonstrate the numbers were not unreasonable, not that they were comparable to valid voters.
    b) Although neither of us have a clue, I suspect the British living in France would be multiple times more concerned than the Brits in the UK about Brexit.

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    nico67nico67 Posts: 4,502
    Sean_F said:

    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    dixiedean said:

    Sean_F said:


    As far as I can tell, there is only one poll that puts No Deal against Revoke, from Survation, in December. Helpfully, it's 49% to 51%.

    Landslide! Will of the People ;)
    The latest Survation poll also has 47% Leave, 53% Remain, so it's an almost perfect match.
    However, Matthew Goodwin reports a poll from Opinium showing 46% support No Deal, as opposed to 39% who support a delay to Brexit.
    https://twitter.com/goodwinmj/status/1108760249631211520?s=21
    Those are very worrying - no deal growing
    Collective insanity in evidence. The stupidity of the crowd
    I think it’s a case of some just being fed up and wanting it to end . The issue with the poll is just two choices . The Ipsos Mori shows more support a delay. Much depends on how you word these things .

    That's true. You can produce majorities for and against a second referendum, depending on the wording of the question.
    I have a big problem with a second EU vote and have an even bigger problem with no deal .

    I’m a staunch Remainer but think too much has happened now for the UK to stay . I want a deal that keeps close co-operation with the EU . But if forced I’d have to go for a second vote . This is not where I want to be . People are being forced into more polarized positions because of the impasse .
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,625
    Extend A50 until the end of May.

    If we see the end of May next Friday, that will be it for A50.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,626
    The latest Alzheimer's clinical trial fails, knocking about $18bn off the market value of Biogen.
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    RecidivistRecidivist Posts: 4,679

    eek said:

    148grss said:

    https://petitionmap.unboxedconsulting.com/?petition=241584

    I do find this map very interesting; some constituencies have upto 5% signing the petition, which isn't too bad.

    University towns. Snowflakes, Woke Remoaners. Actually "The correlation between the percentage of voters who voted Remain and the proportion of the electorate who have signed the petition is extremely high (r=0.93). There’s little to cut against the idea that this petition comes from people who lost and are unhappy about the result."
    https://medium.com/@chrishanretty/are-we-bremorseful-yet-e0506c826ad2
    Keep referencing an old survey about a different petition if it makes you feel happier...
    Apologies - I thought it was relevant. I accept that the current petition is gaining signatures fast. I wonder whether the geographic split will be similar?
    It is so far. It would be a very fastidious bot that was programmed to match that pattern.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,780

    Pulpstar said:

    Foxy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Big news in the @Pulpstar household, my other half has signed the revocation petition.

    Is she a bot? or are you feeling peer presurre? :)
    I've backed the petition to pass May's deal, we're up to 52 signatures but the petitiuon has now crashed !
    I was 58, and it crashed at 59
    I was 47
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    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    The one person on my facebook feed to announce that they have signed the referendum so far is exactly the person who I would have predicted would do so.
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    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786
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    dotsdots Posts: 615
    Your mate Macron has betrayed you Eagles

    In the case of a negative vote in the British parliament, we will be going to a no-deal. We all know that. It is absolutely essential to be clear in these days and these moments, because it is a matter of the good functioning of the EU. We cannot have what I would call an excessive extension which would harm our capacity to decision and to act.
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    TrèsDifficileTrèsDifficile Posts: 1,729
    kle4 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Foxy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Big news in the @Pulpstar household, my other half has signed the revocation petition.

    Is she a bot? or are you feeling peer presurre? :)
    I've backed the petition to pass May's deal, we're up to 52 signatures but the petitiuon has now crashed !
    I was 58, and it crashed at 59
    I was 47
    So at least 3 from the PB constituency, which is 50% higher than the most from any of the constituencies on the map last time I was able to look (2 from Folkestone and Hythe)!
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    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786

    The one person on my facebook feed to announce that they have signed the referendum so far is exactly the person who I would have predicted would do so.

    I've got incredibly savvy people on mine utterly bemused and confused by it all.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,780
    nico67 said:

    If you’re a Labour MP in a leave area worried about no deal but you don’t want to vote for the deal then doesn’t the current impasse give you the chance to support the Kyle/Wilson amendment .

    You stop no deal and ask for the public to ratify the deal .

    You'd hope so. But I must say I am not quite buying that they really are worried - they'd have been more amenable to the deal before now if that were so. I think they are worried at not being seen to worry about no deal, so it cannot be counted on that they will take appropriate measures, whatever those may be, to stop it. They too are just interested in the blame game.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,780

    Who gives a f what date they agree. The WA aint passing next week.
    OK, so TMay resigns and her Deal is dust. That might make it easier to break the logjam.
    Hopefully. I cannot quite believe even now that the problem is that MPs don't really think now is the crunch moment.
    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1108766076412850179
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    not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,341
    edited March 2019
    eek said:

    Petitions still "down for maintenance". If I were a leaver and I had been denied access to a "Stop all immigrants" petition I would be claiming it was a govt plot. However, I know how shit government IT generally is, so it is more likely cock-up than conspiracy! It'll probably be fixed on 30th March.

    The IT for the petitions website is pretty good. Scaling for one-off peaks in demand like this, without wasting a heap of money on wasted capacity, is hard.
    It's achievable but the costs of doing it easily (you would need a cloud provider) is far higher than hosting it in an unscaleable way (using your own servers)...
    Nonsense, auto-scaling easily achievable on a modern Cloud system such as AWS with about 5 minutes of configuration, and he instances cost peanuts (less than $1 an hour in many cases)
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    TrèsDifficileTrèsDifficile Posts: 1,729

    7 of my facebook friends have shared the revoke petition. I wonder how quickly that would drop if I shared the No Deal petition!

    Incidentally, of those 7, all resident in London, only 3 are eligible to vote.
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    rpjsrpjs Posts: 3,787
    Why? I thought you were predicting civil unrest for both no deal and revoke down thread.
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    Anyone else thinking thank God we are not in a situation where the default position is that we Nuke someone on 29th March and MPs are involved in trying to stop it?
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    not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,341
    eek said:
    The UK needs a version of the 25th Amendment
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    dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786
    edited March 2019
    rpjs said:

    Why? I thought you were predicting civil unrest for both no deal and revoke down thread.
    I think its very possible. I think it can probably be handled from the surface world though, not many UK protestors have nukes
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    numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 5,463
    eek said:
    For the last time for those at the back.

    There is a deal on the table. We could pass it tomorrow and all of this would go away. It is not perfect but it is better than no deal.

    I am becoming absolutely livid at MPs not just holding their nose and voting for it. Although May has been a gigantic prat and has handled this atrociously, MPs will share a tremendous amount of the responsibility if they precipitate a no deal Brexit.
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    nico67nico67 Posts: 4,502
    May could ask for a longer extension and then resign .

    She has only said that she wouldn’t be PM if the extension went past June . That doesn’t mean she’d refuse to ask for one .

    If May went there I think she’ll make a big deal of the peace process in NI and keeping the UK together.

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    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,790
    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    dixiedean said:

    Sean_F said:


    As far as I can tell, there is only one poll that puts No Deal against Revoke, from Survation, in December. Helpfully, it's 49% to 51%.

    Landslide! Will of the People ;)
    The latest Survation poll also has 47% Leave, 53% Remain, so it's an almost perfect match.
    However, Matthew Goodwin reports a poll from Opinium showing 46% support No Deal, as opposed to 39% who support a delay to Brexit.
    https://twitter.com/goodwinmj/status/1108760249631211520?s=21
    Those are very worrying - no deal growing
    Collective insanity in evidence. The stupidity of the crowd
    I think it’s a case of some just being fed up and wanting it to end . The issue with the poll is just two choices . The Ipsos Mori shows more support a delay. Much depends on how you word these things .

    That's true. You can produce majorities for and against a second referendum, depending on the wording of the question.
    I have a big problem with a second EU vote and have an even bigger problem with no deal .

    I’m a staunch Remainer but think too much has happened now for the UK to stay . I want a deal that keeps close co-operation with the EU . But if forced I’d have to go for a second vote . This is not where I want to be . People are being forced into more polarized positions because of the impasse .
    Agreed.
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    not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,341

    Anyone else thinking thank God we are not in a situation where the default position is that we Nuke someone on 29th March and MPs are involved in trying to stop it?

    Isn’t that essentially what NATO is?
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    El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 3,870

    NEW THREAD

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    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,794

    rpjs said:

    Why? I thought you were predicting civil unrest for both no deal and revoke down thread.
    I think its very possible. I think it can probably be handled from the surface world though, not many UK protestors have nukes
    You use the civil planning facilities you have. It's not like new ones were built for Operation Yellowhammer.
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311

    eek said:
    For the last time for those at the back.

    There is a deal on the table. We could pass it tomorrow and all of this would go away. It is not perfect but it is better than no deal.

    I am becoming absolutely livid at MPs not just holding their nose and voting for it. Although May has been a gigantic prat and has handled this atrociously, MPs will share a tremendous amount of the responsibility if they precipitate a no deal Brexit.
    Which was just about what Theresa May said yesterday. Apart from the gigantic prat bit.
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    AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    dixiedean said:

    Sean_F said:


    As far as I can tell, there is only one poll that puts No Deal against Revoke, from Survation, in December. Helpfully, it's 49% to 51%.

    Landslide! Will of the People ;)
    The latest Survation poll also has 47% Leave, 53% Remain, so it's an almost perfect match.
    However, Matthew Goodwin reports a poll from Opinium showing 46% support No Deal, as opposed to 39% who support a delay to Brexit.
    https://twitter.com/goodwinmj/status/1108760249631211520?s=21
    Those are very worrying - no deal growing
    Collective insanity in evidence. The stupidity of the crowd
    I think it’s a case of some just being fed up and wanting it to end . The issue with the poll is just two choices . The Ipsos Mori shows more support a delay. Much depends on how you word these things.
    Which is, of course, why we have a representative democracy. Those few whom we elect to represent us have a much better understanding (on the whole - exceptions apply) of the implications of a no deal. I'm sure it's better than mine, for that matter.

    Wanting something to just "go away" is not the right way to approach a decision that will affect us all for a generation.
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    nico67nico67 Posts: 4,502

    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    dixiedean said:

    Sean_F said:


    As far as I can tell, there is only one poll that puts No Deal against Revoke, from Survation, in December. Helpfully, it's 49% to 51%.

    Landslide! Will of the People ;)
    The latest Survation poll also has 47% Leave, 53% Remain, so it's an almost perfect match.
    However, Matthew Goodwin reports a poll from Opinium showing 46% support No Deal, as opposed to 39% who support a delay to Brexit.
    https://twitter.com/goodwinmj/status/1108760249631211520?s=21
    Those are very worrying - no deal growing
    Collective insanity in evidence. The stupidity of the crowd
    I think it’s a case of some just being fed up and wanting it to end . The issue with the poll is just two choices . The Ipsos Mori shows more support a delay. Much depends on how you word these things .

    That's true. You can produce majorities for and against a second referendum, depending on the wording of the question.
    I have a big problem with a second EU vote and have an even bigger problem with no deal .

    I’m a staunch Remainer but think too much has happened now for the UK to stay . I want a deal that keeps close co-operation with the EU . But if forced I’d have to go for a second vote . This is not where I want to be . People are being forced into more polarized positions because of the impasse .
    Agreed.
    Thanks . I really fear this is going to end very badly . A no deal will guarantee there’s no chance to bring the country together . Another vote the same. A deal which both sides aren’t overjoyed with is the best solution . We can all moan together !
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    RobCRobC Posts: 398
    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    dixiedean said:

    Sean_F said:


    As far as I can tell, there is only one poll that puts No Deal against Revoke, from Survation, in December. Helpfully, it's 49% to 51%.

    Landslide! Will of the People ;)
    The latest Survation poll also has 47% Leave, 53% Remain, so it's an almost perfect match.
    However, Matthew Goodwin reports a poll from Opinium showing 46% support No Deal, as opposed to 39% who support a delay to Brexit.
    https://twitter.com/goodwinmj/status/1108760249631211520?s=21
    Those are very worrying - no deal growing
    Collective insanity in evidence. The stupidity of the crowd
    I think it’s a case of some just being fed up and wanting it to end . The issue with the poll is just two choices . The Ipsos Mori shows more support a delay. Much depends on how you word these things .

    That's true. You can produce majorities for and against a second referendum, depending on the wording of the question.
    I have a big problem with a second EU vote and have an even bigger problem with no deal .

    I’m a staunch Remainer but think too much has happened now for the UK to stay . I want a deal that keeps close co-operation with the EU . But if forced I’d have to go for a second vote . This is not where I want to be . People are being forced into more polarized positions because of the impasse .
    Well quite. That is why I think the parliamentary centre-left should support the Deal as the only way to avoid a No Deal outcome and make use of the subsequently divided parliamentary Tory party to force a VONC and general election so that a new gov't in further negotiations can achieve a soft Brexit as possible after 2021.
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    dotsdots Posts: 615

    Other possible game changers - 500,000 remainers trash London on the weekend. Senior politician is caught saying something inflammatory about Brexit. VONC causes timeout. May refuses to act on parliaments vote and holds on till 11pm 29th. EU intervene and rule out any extension

    Both Paris and London could be burning simultaneously this saturday

    Anyone planning on going to demo on Saturday, you are conscious Trotsky yellow vests anarchists can hijack it and the deplorable violence will play perfectly into May’s grid for the week.
    hijack it means the bigger the crowd the higher their profile when they hoist themselves on your shoulders. It’s the classic, I have got to do something, damn the thing I done undermined my argument by adding support to rioting
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    nico67nico67 Posts: 4,502
    RobC said:

    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    dixiedean said:

    Sean_F said:


    As far as I can tell, there is only one poll that puts No Deal against Revoke, from Survation, in December. Helpfully, it's 49% to 51%.

    Landslide! Will of the People ;)
    The latest Survation poll also has 47% Leave, 53% Remain, so it's an almost perfect match.
    However, Matthew Goodwin reports a poll from Opinium showing 46% support No Deal, as opposed to 39% who support a delay to Brexit.
    https://twitter.com/goodwinmj/status/1108760249631211520?s=21
    Those are very worrying - no deal growing
    Collective insanity in evidence. The stupidity of the crowd
    I think it’s a case of some just being fed up and wanting it to end . The issue with the poll is just two choices . The Ipsos Mori shows more support a delay. Much depends on how you word these things .

    That's true. You can produce majorities for and against a second referendum, depending on the wording of the question.
    I have a big problem with a second EU vote and have an even bigger problem with no deal .

    I’m a staunch Remainer but think too much has happened now for the UK to stay . I want a deal that keeps close co-operation with the EU . But if forced I’d have to go for a second vote . This is not where I want to be . People are being forced into more polarized positions because of the impasse .
    Well quite. That is why I think the parliamentary centre-left should support the Deal as the only way to avoid a No Deal outcome and make use of the subsequently divided parliamentary Tory party to force a VONC and general election so that a new gov't in further negotiations can achieve a soft Brexit as possible after 2021.
    Exactly . Labours position is bizarre . They don’t have an issue with the WA . The future framework can be changed . They can’t avoid blame in a no deal .
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,283
    nico67 said:

    RobC said:

    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    dixiedean said:

    Sean_F said:


    As far as I can tell, there is only one poll that puts No Deal against Revoke, from Survation, in December. Helpfully, it's 49% to 51%.

    Landslide! Will of the People ;)
    The latest Survation poll also has 47% Leave, 53% Remain, so it's an almost perfect match.
    However, Matthew Goodwin reports a poll from Opinium showing 46% support No Deal, as opposed to 39% who support a delay to Brexit.
    https://twitter.com/goodwinmj/status/1108760249631211520?s=21
    Those are very worrying - no deal growing
    Collective insanity in evidence. The stupidity of the crowd
    I think it’s a case of some just being fed up and wanting it to end . The issue with the poll is just two choices . The Ipsos Mori shows more support a delay. Much depends on how you word these things .

    That's true. You can produce majorities for and against a second referendum, depending on the wording of the question.
    I have a big problem with a second EU vote and have an even bigger problem with no deal .

    I’m a staunch Remainer but think too much has happened now for the UK to stay . I want a deal that keeps close co-operation with the EU . But if forced I’d have to go for a second vote . This is not where I want to be . People are being forced into more polarized positions because of the impasse .
    Well quite. That is why I think the parliamentary centre-left should support the Deal as the only way to avoid a No Deal outcome and make use of the subsequently divided parliamentary Tory party to force a VONC and general election so that a new gov't in further negotiations can achieve a soft Brexit as possible after 2021.
    Exactly . Labours position is bizarre . They don’t have an issue with the WA . The future framework can be changed . They can’t avoid blame in a no deal .
    Rule One: the government is always to blame
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,658
    dots said:

    Other possible game changers - 500,000 remainers trash London on the weekend. Senior politician is caught saying something inflammatory about Brexit. VONC causes timeout. May refuses to act on parliaments vote and holds on till 11pm 29th. EU intervene and rule out any extension

    Both Paris and London could be burning simultaneously this saturday

    Anyone planning on going to demo on Saturday, you are conscious Trotsky yellow vests anarchists can hijack it and the deplorable violence will play perfectly into May’s grid for the week.
    hijack it means the bigger the crowd the higher their profile when they hoist themselves on your shoulders. It’s the classic, I have got to do something, damn the thing I done undermined my argument by adding support to rioting
    The October demonstration was impeccably behaved. I fear no Neon Nazis.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,658
    IanB2 said:

    nico67 said:

    RobC said:

    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    nico67 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    dixiedean said:

    Sean_F said:


    As far as I can tell, there is only one poll that puts No Deal against Revoke, from Survation, in December. Helpfully, it's 49% to 51%.

    Landslide! Will of the People ;)
    The latest Survation poll also has 47% Leave, 53% Remain, so it's an almost perfect match.
    However, Matthew Goodwin reports a poll from Opinium showing 46% support No Deal, as opposed to 39% who support a delay to Brexit.
    https://twitter.com/goodwinmj/status/1108760249631211520?s=21
    Those are very worrying - no deal growing
    Collective insanity in evidence. The stupidity of the crowd
    I think it’s a case of some just being fed up and wanting it to end . The issue with the poll is just two choices . The Ipsos Mori shows more support a delay. Much depends on how you word these things .

    That's true. You can produce majorities for and against a second referendum, depending on the wording of the question.
    I have a big problem with a second EU vote and have an even bigger problem with no deal .

    I’m a staunch Remainer but think too much has happened now for the UK to stay . I want a deal that keeps close co-operation with the EU . But if forced I’d have to go for a second vote . This is not where I want to be . People are being forced into more polarized positions because of the impasse .
    Well quite. That is why I think the parliamentary centre-left should support the Deal as the only way to avoid a No Deal outcome and make use of the subsequently divided parliamentary Tory party to force a VONC and general election so that a new gov't in further negotiations can achieve a soft Brexit as possible after 2021.
    Exactly . Labours position is bizarre . They don’t have an issue with the WA . The future framework can be changed . They can’t avoid blame in a no deal .
    Rule One: the government is always to blame
    https://twitter.com/foxinsoxuk/status/1108755537003536389?s=19
  • Options
    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,722
    edited March 2019
    .
This discussion has been closed.