I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
A VONC now would be too little, too late. If there's no deal we're out automatically by Friday of next week and a VONC won't change that. If there's no deal then the government will need to be running in crisis mode to deal with the aftershocks of that occuring and it'd be irresponsible in the extreme to go into purdah during that.
If it leads to PM Corbyn of course it will as he will renegotiate propped up by the SNP on the basis of permanent Customs Union and SM elements ie an even less Brexity Deal than May's Deal. Given No Deal will be an utter disaster anyway economically whatever the government does a general election will make little difference and at least offers the opportunity of a new government, we know the likes of Boles and Soubry have said they will VONC the government rather than accept No Deal and I expect them to do so
How will it lead to a PM Corbyn renegotiating? If there's an election called after 14 days we'd already have left still.
May needs to just back the Labour plan now for the sake of the country. The Tory and Labour loyalist votes will be more than enough. Place a motion endorsing a permanent customs union being added to the WA as a codicil, and ask the EU to approve the delay.
Labourite selling our future for a few beans today. And you wonder why this country hasn’t put Labour in power for over a decade...
"Selling our future", mate, no-one cared about us making our own trade deals until Boris brainwashed them that it would bring back the glorious Empire. I would have been satisfied for May's deal to go through but the Brexiteers made that impossible so the only option is a meaningfully different approach.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
If there is a short extension and we do not hold European Parliament elections the only way to avoid no deal by the end of June (discounting for the moment the unlikely option of May's Deal passing and all the legislative detail completed) would be a unilateral revocation that would plunge the governance of the EU into crisis.
That looks like where we are heading.
If we hold European elections there will be trouble. If we don't it will be double.
All May needs to do is to get the Kyle amendment to pass through the Commons so that her deal can pass on the basis that there’s a second referendum. It’s the simplest, cleanest way forward. She can then step down having done half a job but at least have some recognition for securing a deal. After all, for all the finger pointing, she’s the only bugger out of them all to put something firm on the table.
Having just listened to Katya Adler, BBC Europe correspondent and one of the best on the subject of brexit, she confirms the frustration and dismay throughout the EU 27 with mixed views on options for an extension.
An important point she made is that on any extension beyond the end of June, the UK would be required to put in place the legislation to take part in the EU elections by 21st April as that is the cut off date across Europe to confirm candidates.
I just cannot see that passing and without it the EU could not allow the UK to be a member as all their subsquent legislation would be voted by an illegitimate EU Parliament
Oh boy, is this complex and a mess
She added that the 27 are considering a final brexit meeting on the 28th March, the day before we leave on the 29th (are supposed to leave) to no doubt confirm extension or even no deal !!!!
Would new legislation be required for the UK to hold European elections? If we have not left the EU by the relevant date surely the existing legislation would automatically trigger the elections?
I believe the 2018 Withdrawal Act repealed the "existing legislation".
Assuming the legislation authorising EP elections was enacted as amendments to the original European Communities Act, it will be repealed by section 1 of the Withdrawal Act. However that section is not yet in force.
May must go in the next few days. She's killing the Tory party and the country's reputation. Tories need new PM in place asap.
It is not going to happen.
She's failed. She'll be gone/going within a fortnight.
And then what.
Leadership election. She either stays on for duration of leadership election (as Cameron did) or resigns with immediate effect and a caretaker PM takes over for its duration. Probably the former.
And anyone else is dramatically less popular with the public
Irrelevant. And also meaningless since whoever replaces her will be judged by their tenure as PM and not by how they're viewed now.
They may not be PM for more than a few days
If not, so be it. At least something will be happening, something will be changing.
The prospect of Boris as PM isn't an enticing one IMO.
No mine, but my greatest worry right now is just further prevarication and delay on an actual decision, and the actions of May and parliament generally seem to make that very possible. If Boris as PM was the price for a resolution now, of any kind, I'd take it. If Corbyn as PM was the price, I'd take it.
Nothing that would need to take 2 years delay could not be decided, in principle, a lot lot sooner, right now even, even if the technicalities require more time. Please gods can they at least decide something.
Incidentally I'd like to once more thank David Cameron's constitutional vandalism for leaving us where we are now.
If ever there was a vote to make a confidence vote it was this. Voting against the meaningful vote truly should have been a confidence matter with all it entailed. If it wasn't for the FTPA this would likely be over already.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
Incidentally I'd like to once more thank David Cameron's constitutional vandalism for leaving us where we are now.
If ever there was a vote to make a confidence vote it was this. Voting against the meaningful vote truly should have been a confidence matter with all it entailed. If it wasn't for the FTPA this would likely be over already.
One way or another and frankly that would be better, whatever happened. The FTPA is a total disaster and needs urgent repeal.
All May needs to do is to get the Kyle amendment to pass through the Commons so that her deal can pass on the basis that there’s a second referendum. It’s the simplest, cleanest way forward. She can then step down having done half a job but at least have some recognition for securing a deal. After all, for all the finger pointing, she’s the only bugger out of them all to put something firm on the table.
No. If the Kyle amendment passes then May must stay on til the referendum. Nobody else should take over at this point and try and sell May's deal.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
Think how Theresa must be feeling tonight. I got a twinge of panic just now when I saw that my water bill is due on 1 April. She has a few days less than that!
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
May must go in the next few days. She's killing the Tory party and the country's reputation. Tories need new PM in place asap.
It is not going to happen.
She's failed. She'll be gone/going within a fortnight.
And then what.
Leadership election. She either stays on for duration of leadership election (as Cameron did) or resigns with immediate effect and a caretaker PM takes over for its duration. Probably the former.
And anyone else is dramatically less popular with the public
Irrelevant. And also meaningless since whoever replaces her will be judged by their tenure as PM and not by how they're viewed now.
They may not be PM for more than a few days
If not, so be it. At least something will be happening, something will be changing.
The prospect of Boris as PM isn't an enticing one IMO.
No mine, but my greatest worry right now is just further prevarication and delay on an actual decision, and the actions of May and parliament generally seem to make that very possible. If Boris as PM was the price for a resolution now, of any kind, I'd take it. If Corbyn as PM was the price, I'd take it.
Nothing that would need to take 2 years delay could not be decided, in principle, a lot lot sooner, right now even, even if the technicalities require more time. Please gods can they at least decide something.
Yes - they have a duty to act to save us from an economic armageddon
Think how Theresa must be feeling tonight. I got a twinge of panic just now when I saw that my water bill is due on 1 April. She has a few days less than that!
Mostly her own fault frankly. Too many reasons to bother writing them all down. But her desperation not to split the Party is the main one. Pathetic. A total failure of statesmanship that history will not forget.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
A VONC now would be too little, too late. If there's no deal we're out automatically by Friday of next week and a VONC won't change that. If there's no deal then the government will need to be running in crisis mode to deal with the aftershocks of that occuring and it'd be irresponsible in the extreme to go into purdah during that.
If it leads to PM Corbyn of course it will as he will renegotiate propped up by the SNP on the basis of permanent Customs Union and SM elements ie an even less Brexity Deal than May's Deal. Given No Deal will be an utter disaster anyway economically whatever the government does a general election will make little difference and at least offers the opportunity of a new government, we know the likes of Boles and Soubry have said they will VONC the government rather than accept No Deal and I expect them to do so
How will it lead to a PM Corbyn renegotiating? If there's an election called after 14 days we'd already have left still.
So what, we can Leave the EU with No Deal and PM Corbyn can still renegotiate a Deal with the EU on permanent Customs Union and Single Market terms as he would
All May needs to do is to get the Kyle amendment to pass through the Commons so that her deal can pass on the basis that there’s a second referendum. It’s the simplest, cleanest way forward. She can then step down having done half a job but at least have some recognition for securing a deal. After all, for all the finger pointing, she’s the only bugger out of them all to put something firm on the table.
No. If the Kyle amendment passes then May must stay on til the referendum. Nobody else should take over at this point and try and sell May's deal.
Think how Theresa must be feeling tonight. I got a twinge of panic just now when I saw that my water bill is due on 1 April. She has a few days less than that!
Incidentally I'd like to once more thank David Cameron's constitutional vandalism for leaving us where we are now.
If ever there was a vote to make a confidence vote it was this. Voting against the meaningful vote truly should have been a confidence matter with all it entailed. If it wasn't for the FTPA this would likely be over already.
I wonder if she'd have dared call one. The Maastricht rebellion was like 20 guys, the WA one was getting on for half her party...
Every page is full of startling insights, or the most gruesome yet compelling factoids. One of my favourites is about Genghis Khan.
We all know that the Mongols were hideously brutal - exterminating every living THING in conquered cities, down to the last cats, dogs and hens, but I never knew THIS: during a war, they would take the fat out of the slain corpses of their enemies, hurl it at the walls of enemy houses and buildings, then set fire to the human fat, thereby burning down the cities.
100% recommended. One of the best books of general history I have read in a decade.
And 800 years later 'we' were taking the fat out of the slain to make soap. Civilisation, eh?
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
As someone committed to leaving in 10 days. The current chaos is worse than any possible outcome which is why even a no deal is better than a lengthy extension (as is revocation) and yet unemployment falls to the lowest since 1971, employment is both the highest ever in absolute terms and getting close to our peace time record as a share of the adult population. The hysteria about Brexit continues to be massively overblown and counterproductive. But the deal is still the best way out from here.
Incidentally I'd like to once more thank David Cameron's constitutional vandalism for leaving us where we are now.
If ever there was a vote to make a confidence vote it was this. Voting against the meaningful vote truly should have been a confidence matter with all it entailed. If it wasn't for the FTPA this would likely be over already.
The referendum itself too. If the referendum had been held by a PM who believed in the change offered we wouldn't be in half as much trouble.
Its not a national humiliation its a humiliation of our political class.
And well deserved too.
Although it is revealing that out political class regard themselves as the nation, very Louis IV.
Oh no this is a humiliation for us all.
Really it isn't, we might think so because we're political nerds but life continues on as normal for almost everything else.
Not to mention few people are bothered about what happens in other countries.
England losing to Iceland at football would be a more widespread view of our ** 'national humiliation'.
** With apologies to non-English PBers.
Our reputation is in tatters today. We used to be solid, reliable types.
The nation's government is, and that makes many of us sad of course, but I don't know why you must insist that everybody must share in that in some personal fashion just because you wish to wallow in the feeling. I'm annoyed, saddened, embarrassed, including at myself for elements of this, but no matter how many times people weep profusely about it political crises do happen, and it is just plain silly to treat every crisis like it will be a national and personal humiliation which will never be overcome. It's unconvincing.
Blair on Newsnight now says we need to come to a clear decision on Brexit, he thinks the EU will grant an extension as they do not want No Deal but Parliament must come to a decision on a soft or hard Brexit.
Blair says he has told Macron to prepare for Britain thinking again on Brexit and then can reconsider the future of Europe once Britain back in the EU
Its not a national humiliation its a humiliation of our political class.
And well deserved too.
Although it is revealing that out political class regard themselves as the nation, very Louis IV.
Oh no this is a humiliation for us all.
Rubbish. Our economy is booming, whilst everyone laughs at Parliament’s inability to accept it was overruled.
I don't think the economy is in good shape, even if the data on employment is good. There are long term structural problems, which Robert Smithson explains well.
Brexit is just an unknown. There are too many variables to be able to make meaningful predictions about what will happen. But it seems foolish to celebrate the fact that the government seem to have lost control over the whole process. The situation has got so intractibly complicated, and the positions of the players have become so entrenched, that no deal can happen even though no one wants it to, and that is what might well happen.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
Well, she's been busy. Staring at the wall and trying not to cry is time-consuming.
(Lest I be thought of as sexist, I need to point out that according to 'Fall Out" she does have form for zoning out and/or breaking into tears at stressful moments. Some people are invigorated by stress, some are not, and she's one of the "nots")
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
As someone committed to leaving in 10 days. The current chaos is worse than any possible outcome which is why even a no deal is better than a lengthy extension (as is revocation) and yet unemployment falls to the lowest since 1971, employment is both the highest ever in absolute terms and getting close to our peace time record as a share of the adult population. The hysteria about Brexit continues to be massively overblown and counterproductive. But the deal is still the best way out from here.
I must say considering we're all supposed to be in a terrible crisis the like of which none of us have ever been in before I'm feeling remarkably relaxed.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
We are still in the EU, the SM and the CU not crashing out of all overnight without any trading deal with our biggest trading partner
Who knows where we will be in 2 weeks time. If Brexit is going to have a material effect on the economy it should be absolutely evident by now. And yet the economy marches on, apparently unaffected.
Blair on Newsnight now says we need to come to a clear decision on Brexit, he thinks the EU will grant an extension as they do not want No Deal but Parliament must come to a decision on a soft or hard Brexit
Always said that man spoke sense. But how will parliament make such a decision in advance of an extension being asked for? They are no closer to doing so, because they clearly want to defer a decision until we are in the extension. Which may not happen unless we make a decision, and so round it goes.
Blair on Newsnight now says we need to come to a clear decision on Brexit, he thinks the EU will grant an extension as they do not want No Deal but Parliament must come to a decision on a soft or hard Brexit.
Blair says he has told Macron to prepare for Britain thinking again on Brexit and then can reconsider the future of Europe once Britain back in the EU
That is just asinine. It is blatantly obvious but saying it changes nothing
Every page is full of startling insights, or the most gruesome yet compelling factoids. One of my favourites is about Genghis Khan.
We all know that the Mongols were hideously brutal - exterminating every living THING in conquered cities, down to the last cats, dogs and hens, but I never knew THIS: during a war, they would take the fat out of the slain corpses of their enemies, hurl it at the walls of enemy houses and buildings, then set fire to the human fat, thereby burning down the cities.
100% recommended. One of the best books of general history I have read in a decade.
And 800 years later 'we' were taking the fat out of the slain to make soap. Civilisation, eh?
May give it a read.
She'll soon have some time on her hands for reading......
Its not a national humiliation its a humiliation of our political class.
And well deserved too.
Although it is revealing that out political class regard themselves as the nation, very Louis IV.
Oh no this is a humiliation for us all.
Really it isn't, we might think so because we're political nerds but life continues on as normal for almost everything else.
Not to mention few people are bothered about what happens in other countries.
England losing to Iceland at football would be a more widespread view of our ** 'national humiliation'.
** With apologies to non-English PBers.
Our reputation is in tatters today. We used to be solid, reliable types.
The nation's government is, and that makes many of us sad of course, but I don't know why you must insist that everybody must share in that in some personal fashion just because you wish to wallow in the feeling. I'm annoyed, saddened, embarrassed, including at myself for elements of this, but no matter how many times people weep profusely about it political crises do happen, and it is just plain silly to treat every crisis like it will be a national and personal humiliation which will never be overcome. It's unconvincing.
Stop blaming others. Take responsibility and look at the reality of an entirely self inflicted crisis that unless we act, will inflict economic harm.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
We are still in the EU, the SM and the CU not crashing out of all overnight without any trading deal with our biggest trading partner
Who knows where we will be in 2 weeks time. If Brexit is going to have a material effect on the economy it should be absolutely evident by now. And yet the economy marches on, apparently unaffected.
Everybody marches off to war singing in the sunshine. Everybody stumbles back in tears in the dark.
Blair on Newsnight now says we need to come to a clear decision on Brexit, he thinks the EU will grant an extension as they do not want No Deal but Parliament must come to a decision on a soft or hard Brexit.
Blair says he has told Macron to prepare for Britain thinking again on Brexit and then can reconsider the future of Europe once Britain back in the EU
As very little has materially changed yet, it's unsurprising that very little feels different. This curious logic has been applied since the referendum, and its shallowness will only be found out if there's any significant material change - in others words if there's anything other than a very soft Brexit.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
As someone committed to leaving in 10 days. The current chaos is worse than any possible outcome which is why even a no deal is better than a lengthy extension (as is revocation) and yet unemployment falls to the lowest since 1971, employment is both the highest ever in absolute terms and getting close to our peace time record as a share of the adult population. The hysteria about Brexit continues to be massively overblown and counterproductive. But the deal is still the best way out from here.
I must say considering we're all supposed to be in a terrible crisis the like of which none of us have ever been in before I'm feeling remarkably relaxed.
I am angry with our utterly contemptible political class but I have no apprehensions about what Brexit is actually going to mean in practice for me and mine. We will have to go looking for consequences. Hard.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
We are still in the EU, the SM and the CU not crashing out of all overnight without any trading deal with our biggest trading partner
Who knows where we will be in 2 weeks time. If Brexit is going to have a material effect on the economy it should be absolutely evident by now. And yet the economy marches on, apparently unaffected.
Of course it won't be as the markets expect an extension and maybe no Brexit at all, if we crash out with No Deal in a week we could see a FTSE crash of 1929 or 2008 proportions. We still have not yet Brexited for goodness sake
Blair on Newsnight now says we need to come to a clear decision on Brexit, he thinks the EU will grant an extension as they do not want No Deal but Parliament must come to a decision on a soft or hard Brexit
Always said that man spoke sense. But how will parliament make such a decision in advance of an extension being asked for? They are no closer to doing so, because they clearly want to defer a decision until we are in the extension. Which may not happen unless we make a decision, and so round it goes.
Parliament has already voted for extension, his assumption was the EU will grant it
Its not a national humiliation its a humiliation of our political class.
And well deserved too.
Although it is revealing that out political class regard themselves as the nation, very Louis IV.
Oh no this is a humiliation for us all.
Really it isn't, we might think so because we're political nerds but life continues on as normal for almost everything else.
Not to mention few people are bothered about what happens in other countries.
England losing to Iceland at football would be a more widespread view of our ** 'national humiliation'.
** With apologies to non-English PBers.
Our reputation is in tatters today. We used to be solid, reliable types.
And we still are.
All of us not in Parliament.
There is a national flaw in that we like to blame others. We all own part of this mess. We need to grow up. We got into this mess because we blamed the EU.
Its not a national humiliation its a humiliation of our political class.
And well deserved too.
Although it is revealing that out political class regard themselves as the nation, very Louis IV.
Oh no this is a humiliation for us all.
Really it isn't, we might think so because we're political nerds but life continues on as normal for almost everything else.
Not to mention few people are bothered about what happens in other countries.
England losing to Iceland at football would be a more widespread view of our ** 'national humiliation'.
** With apologies to non-English PBers.
Our reputation is in tatters today. We used to be solid, reliable types.
The nation's government is, and that makes many of us sad of course, but I don't know why you must insist that everybody must share in that in some personal fashion just because you wish to wallow in the feeling. I'm annoyed, saddened, embarrassed, including at myself for elements of this, but no matter how many times people weep profusely about it political crises do happen, and it is just plain silly to treat every crisis like it will be a national and personal humiliation which will never be overcome. It's unconvincing.
Stop blaming others. Take responsibility and look at the reality of an entirely self inflicted crisis that unless we act, will inflict economic harm.
What the blathering hell are you on about? I already said I was annoyed, saddened and embarrassed at myself and I've said I regretted voting leave and we need to take actions to remain now, what about that is me blaming others?
Also, what in my paragraph is me blaming others for anything anyway? It had nothing about blaming anyone, it was suggesting you need to stop whinging like a little baby that everyone must feel the same personal humiliation you want them to feel. Grow up and stop acting like anyone who does not feel the same shame you do therefore has no acceptance of any concerns in the current situation. You can feel any personal shame you want, others can feel embarrassment and regret, if they have any, in their own way. The idea we are obliged to feel personal shame because of a political crisis is just dumb.
But I'll play: when I was saying that expecting everyone to feel personal humiliation for a political crisis is silly, who is that blaming? It's not blaming you for anything, just disagreeing with you.
Blair on Newsnight now says we need to come to a clear decision on Brexit, he thinks the EU will grant an extension as they do not want No Deal but Parliament must come to a decision on a soft or hard Brexit.
Blair says he has told Macron to prepare for Britain thinking again on Brexit and then can reconsider the future of Europe once Britain back in the EU
That is just asinine. It is blatantly obvious but saying it changes nothing
The whole process has been a useful reminder on the perfidious nature of party politicians. And grimly amusing from the perspective of enjoying middle class panic
You've got to feel for the MEP being interviewed on Newsnight - pointed out 2 years of pissing about, now coming back 10 days from the brink to ask for something, but they don't know what.
The view on our sofa was that these interviews with EU people could be edited down to a Gallic shrug and “wtf?”, without losing much meaning.
In fact, we concluded that this would have been a more appropriate opening song than All Saints
Blair on Newsnight now says we need to come to a clear decision on Brexit, he thinks the EU will grant an extension as they do not want No Deal but Parliament must come to a decision on a soft or hard Brexit.
Blair says he has told Macron to prepare for Britain thinking again on Brexit and then can reconsider the future of Europe once Britain back in the EU
Blair hedging his bets now?
He's always been saying we'll have another referendum and get the result right (thats what he's been advising the French and Germans) yet now he's saying Parliament must decide on hard or soft Brexit?
So he's shifted his position from Brexit won't happen to what kind of Brexit happens needs to be decided?
Maybe this makes 'nothing is agreed, until everything is agreed' very 'live' at present and the increasing stress, anger, recriminations, doubt, fear etc adds a real context to what seems a bland statement
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
We are still in the EU, the SM and the CU not crashing out of all overnight without any trading deal with our biggest trading partner
Who knows where we will be in 2 weeks time. If Brexit is going to have a material effect on the economy it should be absolutely evident by now. And yet the economy marches on, apparently unaffected.
Everybody marches off to war singing in the sunshine. Everybody stumbles back in tears in the dark.
I fully expect panic buying to start this weekend to be honest unless EU has agreed an extension until late May/June.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
We are still in the EU, the SM and the CU not crashing out of all overnight without any trading deal with our biggest trading partner
Who knows where we will be in 2 weeks time. If Brexit is going to have a material effect on the economy it should be absolutely evident by now. And yet the economy marches on, apparently unaffected.
Of course it won't be as the markets expect an extension and maybe no Brexit at all, if we crash out with No Deal in a week we could see a FTSE crash of 1929 or 2008 proportions. We still have not yet Brexited for goodness sake
Seriously, there are times where just for a moment I wish that we could have a no deal Brexit so we could all laugh at these predictions. But then I remember, unlike those in the House of Commons, I am a grown up.
Would we really want our politicians meddling in other things ?
It did occur to me earlier that one reason the economy is doing so well* is that the politicians have been kept occupied with Brexit so that they haven't been able to wreck it by meddling with it.
* Though it may not be doing so well. This could all be temporary froth built on an edifice of debt. Again.
Its not a national humiliation its a humiliation of our political class.
And well deserved too.
Although it is revealing that out political class regard themselves as the nation, very Louis IV.
Oh no this is a humiliation for us all.
Really it isn't, we might think so because we're political nerds but life continues on as normal for almost everything else.
Not to mention few people are bothered about what happens in other countries.
England losing to Iceland at football would be a more widespread view of our ** 'national humiliation'.
** With apologies to non-English PBers.
Our reputation is in tatters today. We used to be solid, reliable types.
And we still are.
All of us not in Parliament.
There is a national flaw in that we like to blame others. We all own part of this mess. We need to grow up. We got into this mess because we blamed the EU.
Blair on Newsnight now says we need to come to a clear decision on Brexit, he thinks the EU will grant an extension as they do not want No Deal but Parliament must come to a decision on a soft or hard Brexit.
Blair says he has told Macron to prepare for Britain thinking again on Brexit and then can reconsider the future of Europe once Britain back in the EU
Blair hedging his bets now?
He's always been saying we'll have another referendum and get the result right (thats what he's been advising the French and Germans) yet now he's saying Parliament must decide on hard or soft Brexit?
So he's shifted his position from Brexit won't happen to what kind of Brexit happens needs to be decided?
He still maintains Brexit may not happen at all if the mood changes in an extension
Its not a national humiliation its a humiliation of our political class.
And well deserved too.
Although it is revealing that out political class regard themselves as the nation, very Louis IV.
Oh no this is a humiliation for us all.
Really it isn't, we might think so because we're political nerds but life continues on as normal for almost everything else.
Not to mention few people are bothered about what happens in other countries.
England losing to Iceland at football would be a more widespread view of our ** 'national humiliation'.
** With apologies to non-English PBers.
Our reputation is in tatters today. We used to be solid, reliable types.
And we still are.
All of us not in Parliament.
There is a national flaw in that we like to blame others. We all own part of this mess. We need to grow up. We got into this mess because we blamed the EU.
Do you not think there is something fundamentally wrong with a free association causing this much pain and chaos to leave?
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
We are still in the EU, the SM and the CU not crashing out of all overnight without any trading deal with our biggest trading partner
Who knows where we will be in 2 weeks time. If Brexit is going to have a material effect on the economy it should be absolutely evident by now. And yet the economy marches on, apparently unaffected.
Of course it won't be as the markets expect an extension and maybe no Brexit at all, if we crash out with No Deal in a week we could see a FTSE crash of 1929 or 2008 proportions. We still have not yet Brexited for goodness sake
Seriously, there are times where just for a moment I wish that we could have a no deal Brexit so we could all laugh at these predictions. But then I remember, unlike those in the House of Commons, I am a grown up.
Also rather overconfident I would suggest about a No Deal we are almost completely unprepared for
Its not a national humiliation its a humiliation of our political class.
And well deserved too.
Although it is revealing that out political class regard themselves as the nation, very Louis IV.
Oh no this is a humiliation for us all.
Really it isn't, we might think so because we're political nerds but life continues on as normal for almost everything else.
Not to mention few people are bothered about what happens in other countries.
England losing to Iceland at football would be a more widespread view of our ** 'national humiliation'.
** With apologies to non-English PBers.
Our reputation is in tatters today. We used to be solid, reliable types.
And we still are.
All of us not in Parliament.
There is a national flaw in that we like to blame others. We all own part of this mess. We need to grow up. We got into this mess because we blamed the EU.
Do you not think there is something fundamentally wrong with a free association causing this much pain and chaos to leave?
They say your legs make your life better but see how much it hurts when you try to cut them off
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
We are still in the EU, the SM and the CU not crashing out of all overnight without any trading deal with our biggest trading partner
Who knows where we will be in 2 weeks time. If Brexit is going to have a material effect on the economy it should be absolutely evident by now. And yet the economy marches on, apparently unaffected.
Of course it won't be as the markets expect an extension and maybe no Brexit at all, if we crash out with No Deal in a week we could see a FTSE crash of 1929 or 2008 proportions. We still have not yet Brexited for goodness sake
Seriously, there are times where just for a moment I wish that we could have a no deal Brexit so we could all laugh at these predictions. But then I remember, unlike those in the House of Commons, I am a grown up.
I've seen economic forecasts which talk about a 0.5% short term hit - in other words end of days it is not.
Would we really want our politicians meddling in other things ?
It did occur to me earlier that one reason the economy is doing so well* is that the politicians have been kept occupied with Brexit so that they haven't been able to wreck it by meddling with it.
* Though it may not be doing so well. This could all be temporary froth built on an edifice of debt. Again.
Our political class gives no impression it is capable of 'adding value' to anything it gets involved in.
Its not a national humiliation its a humiliation of our political class.
And well deserved too.
Although it is revealing that out political class regard themselves as the nation, very Louis IV.
Oh no this is a humiliation for us all.
Really it isn't, we might think so because we're political nerds but life continues on as normal for almost everything else.
Not to mention few people are bothered about what happens in other countries.
England losing to Iceland at football would be a more widespread view of our ** 'national humiliation'.
** With apologies to non-English PBers.
Our reputation is in tatters today. We used to be solid, reliable types.
And we still are.
All of us not in Parliament.
There is a national flaw in that we like to blame others. We all own part of this mess. We need to grow up. We got into this mess because we blamed the EU.
Do you not think there is something fundamentally wrong with a free association causing this much pain and chaos to leave?
They say your legs make your life better but see how much it hurts when you try to cut them off
The shock that MPs have not as yet (or even looking very likely) managed to find some kind of resolution is perhaps not unreasonable even of MPs themselves. However, the fake shock of MPs of the legal consequence of their not resolving the situation, and the occasional suggestion that it is only the government's fault that that is the consequence when nearly all voted for that, has been one of the more shameless elements in the Brexit debate. It would be fairer if they qualified comments with never having expected any government to be so incompetent as to bring back a deal that could not get through, but most of the time comments are not so nuanced as that, it is just insincere anger at the A50 timescales and what that leads to if they refuse to act.
Remainer and Leaver MPs have not covered themselves in glory on that point.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
We are still in the EU, the SM and the CU not crashing out of all overnight without any trading deal with our biggest trading partner
Who knows where we will be in 2 weeks time. If Brexit is going to have a material effect on the economy it should be absolutely evident by now. And yet the economy marches on, apparently unaffected.
Of course it won't be as the markets expect an extension and maybe no Brexit at all, if we crash out with No Deal in a week we could see a FTSE crash of 1929 or 2008 proportions. We still have not yet Brexited for goodness sake
Seriously, there are times where just for a moment I wish that we could have a no deal Brexit so we could all laugh at these predictions. But then I remember, unlike those in the House of Commons, I am a grown up.
Also rather overconfident I would suggest about a No Deal we are almost completely unprepared for
Again not true - but any lack of preparations would be an act of criminal negligence by ... oh the Conservative government
Its not a national humiliation its a humiliation of our political class.
And well deserved too.
Although it is revealing that out political class regard themselves as the nation, very Louis IV.
Oh no this is a humiliation for us all.
Really it isn't, we might think so because we're political nerds but life continues on as normal for almost everything else.
Not to mention few people are bothered about what happens in other countries.
England losing to Iceland at football would be a more widespread view of our ** 'national humiliation'.
** With apologies to non-English PBers.
Our reputation is in tatters today. We used to be solid, reliable types.
The nation's government is, and that makes many of us sad of course, but I don't know why you must insist that everybody must share in that in some personal fashion just because you wish to wallow in the feeling. I'm annoyed, saddened, embarrassed, including at myself for elements of this, but no matter how many times it is just plain silly to treat every crisis like it will be a national and personal humiliation which will never be overcome. It's unconvincing.
Stop blaming others. Take responsibility and look at the reality of an entirely self inflicted crisis that unless we act, will inflict economic harm.
What the blathering hell are you on about? I already said I was annoyed, saddened and embarrassed at myself and I've said I regretted voting leave and we need to take actions to remain now, what about that is me blaming others?
Also, what in my paragraph is me blaming others for anything anyway? It had nothing about blaming anyone, it was suggesting you need to stop whinging like a little baby that everyone must feel the same personal humiliation you want them to feel. Grow up and stop acting like anyone who does not feel the same shame you do therefore has no acceptance of any concerns in the current situation. You can feel any personal shame you want, others can feel embarrassment and regret, if they have any, in their own way. The idea we are obliged to feel personal shame because of a political crisis is just dumb.
But I'll play: when I was saying that expecting everyone to feel personal humiliation for a political crisis is silly, who is that blaming? It's not blaming you for anything, just disagreeing with you.
You make no sense.
One can only take responsibility for one's own actions, not other peoples'.
Its not a national humiliation its a humiliation of our political class.
And well deserved too.
Although it is revealing that out political class regard themselves as the nation, very Louis IV.
Oh no this is a humiliation for us all.
Really it isn't, we might think so because we're political nerds but life continues on as normal for almost everything else.
Not to mention few people are bothered about what happens in other countries.
England losing to Iceland at football would be a more widespread view of our ** 'national humiliation'.
** With apologies to non-English PBers.
Our reputation is in tatters today. We used to be solid, reliable types.
And we still are.
All of us not in Parliament.
There is a national flaw in that we like to blame others. We all own part of this mess. We need to grow up. We got into this mess because we blamed the EU.
Do you not think there is something fundamentally wrong with a free association causing this much pain and chaos to leave?
The problem stems from the notion sold in the referendum that we could leave with next to no economic and political damage. It turns out we can’t have our cake and eat it.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
We are still in the EU, the SM and the CU not crashing out of all overnight without any trading deal with our biggest trading partner
Who knows where we will be in 2 weeks time. If Brexit is going to have a material effect on the economy it should be absolutely evident by now. And yet the economy marches on, apparently unaffected.
Of course it won't be as the markets expect an extension and maybe no Brexit at all, if we crash out with No Deal in a week we could see a FTSE crash of 1929 or 2008 proportions. We still have not yet Brexited for goodness sake
Seriously, there are times where just for a moment I wish that we could have a no deal Brexit so we could all laugh at these predictions. But then I remember, unlike those in the House of Commons, I am a grown up.
Look at the bright side. If we do have a great crash, then it'll be a really good time to buy shares immediately afterwards, on "buy at the bottom of the curve" grounds. Or have I got that wrong.
Gove's biggest fears are much bigger than that when it comes to Brexit.
1) No Deal leads to the Tories being out of power for a generation and/or full blown split
2) A generation of Corbyn and/or Corbynism in government.
3) We rejoin the EU PDQ after sustained No Deal, so the 2016 referendum sees us become full members of the project
4) Scottish independence caused by Brexit (which is the one that keeps him up at night). Remain wins in 2016 and there's no causus belli for another Indyref.
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
We are still in the EU, the SM and the CU not crashing out of all overnight without any trading deal with our biggest trading partner
Who knows where we will be in 2 weeks time. If Brexit is going to have a material effect on the economy it should be absolutely evident by now. And yet the economy marches on, apparently unaffected.
Of course it won't be as the markets expect an extension and maybe no Brexit at all, if we crash out with No Deal in a week we could see a FTSE crash of 1929 or 2008 proportions. We still have not yet Brexited for goodness sake
Seriously, there are times where just for a moment I wish that we could have a no deal Brexit so we could all laugh at these predictions. But then I remember, unlike those in the House of Commons, I am a grown up.
I've seen economic forecasts which talk about a 0.5% short term hit - in other words end of days it is not.
The IMF says No Deal would cause an 8% hit to GDP, in 2008 it shrank by 4.1%
I think the probability must be increasing that we just leave without a deal.
Which likely leads to a general election within weeks given enough Tory diehard anti No Dealers like Boles will VONC the government rather than accept that and most likely a Corbyn Labour-SNP government shortly after and SM and CU BINO or EUref2
No deal would destroy the Conservatives' electoral chances for 20-30 years, which is why I don't think Theresa May will allow it. She still holds the revocation card, as the last fallback and most nuclear option.
It wouldn't as Leavers would rally behind Leader of the Opposition Boris while PM Corbyn gets on with negotiating permanent CU and SM elements BINO with the EU
No they wont. A No Deal catastrophe, and that is what it will be, will mean most leavers will forget all about their vote to leave. They will be too busy panicking about paying their mortgage now they have lost their job.
We are still in the EU, the SM and the CU not crashing out of all overnight without any trading deal with our biggest trading partner
Who knows where we will be in 2 weeks time. If Brexit is going to have a material effect on the economy it should be absolutely evident by now. And yet the economy marches on, apparently unaffected.
Of course it won't be as the markets expect an extension and maybe no Brexit at all, if we crash out with No Deal in a week we could see a FTSE crash of 1929 or 2008 proportions. We still have not yet Brexited for goodness sake
Seriously, there are times where just for a moment I wish that we could have a no deal Brexit so we could all laugh at these predictions. But then I remember, unlike those in the House of Commons, I am a grown up.
I've seen economic forecasts which talk about a 0.5% short term hit - in other words end of days it is not.
I suspect it would be rather worse, especially so in certain sectors.
More importantly though would be how soon and how easily all the 'little deals' could be arranged to get things moving smoothly again.
Comments
They've managed it again over Brexit.
Perhaps this is going to be the normal state of affairs.
I would have been satisfied for May's deal to go through but the Brexiteers made that impossible so the only option is a meaningfully different approach.
That looks like where we are heading.
If we hold European elections there will be trouble. If we don't it will be double.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/judge-walks-out-amid-chaos-at-hearing-of-activist-who-called-anna-soubry-a-nazi-g65zq3r9k
Nothing that would need to take 2 years delay could not be decided, in principle, a lot lot sooner, right now even, even if the technicalities require more time. Please gods can they at least decide something.
If ever there was a vote to make a confidence vote it was this. Voting against the meaningful vote truly should have been a confidence matter with all it entailed. If it wasn't for the FTPA this would likely be over already.
I think you mean Louis XIV...
2016: If you vote to leave you’ll be poorer
2018: You’ll be too busy being poorer to want to leave
It would be hilarious if it wasn’t so tragically out of touch.
Not to mention few people are bothered about what happens in other countries.
England losing to Iceland at football would be a more widespread view of our ** 'national humiliation'.
** With apologies to non-English PBers.
2016: The sunlit uplands are when we leave the EU
2019: You were warned it would cause economic damage
For those who thought I was applying to be Jeremy Hunt's next speech writer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbOlJAU8llY
May give it a read.
Blair says he has told Macron to prepare for Britain thinking again on Brexit and then can reconsider the future of Europe once Britain back in the EU
Brexit is just an unknown. There are too many variables to be able to make meaningful predictions about what will happen. But it seems foolish to celebrate the fact that the government seem to have lost control over the whole process. The situation has got so intractibly complicated, and the positions of the players have become so entrenched, that no deal can happen even though no one wants it to, and that is what might well happen.
http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2016/05/16/mortimer-with-a-tip-for-the-more-adventurous-gamblers/
(Lest I be thought of as sexist, I need to point out that according to 'Fall Out" she does have form for zoning out and/or breaking into tears at stressful moments. Some people are invigorated by stress, some are not, and she's one of the "nots")
All of us not in Parliament.
Also, what in my paragraph is me blaming others for anything anyway? It had nothing about blaming anyone, it was suggesting you need to stop whinging like a little baby that everyone must feel the same personal humiliation you want them to feel. Grow up and stop acting like anyone who does not feel the same shame you do therefore has no acceptance of any concerns in the current situation. You can feel any personal shame you want, others can feel embarrassment and regret, if they have any, in their own way. The idea we are obliged to feel personal shame because of a political crisis is just dumb.
But I'll play: when I was saying that expecting everyone to feel personal humiliation for a political crisis is silly, who is that blaming? It's not blaming you for anything, just disagreeing with you.
You make no sense.
In fact, we concluded that this would have been a more appropriate opening song than All Saints
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sBlY53fgN-k
He's always been saying we'll have another referendum and get the result right (thats what he's been advising the French and Germans) yet now he's saying Parliament must decide on hard or soft Brexit?
So he's shifted his position from Brexit won't happen to what kind of Brexit happens needs to
be decided?
I've said that all the way along....
* Though it may not be doing so well. This could all be temporary froth built on an edifice of debt. Again.
Has it shown any intention to 'grow up' ?
So either I was the brilliant one or the only idiot :-)
Remainer and Leaver MPs have not covered themselves in glory on that point.
1) No Deal leads to the Tories being out of power for a generation and/or full blown split
2) A generation of Corbyn and/or Corbynism in government.
3) We rejoin the EU PDQ after sustained No Deal, so the 2016 referendum sees us become full members of the project
4) Scottish independence caused by Brexit (which is the one that keeps him up at night). Remain wins in 2016 and there's no causus belli for another Indyref.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-no-deal-news-imf-forecast-gdp-world-trade-organisation-economy-a8633681.html
More importantly though would be how soon and how easily all the 'little deals' could be arranged to get things moving smoothly again.