It's not going to happen but if May was brave there is a logically consistent way out of this mess.
May should make a speech tomorrow saying she respects Parliament's decision that it has made, but that the decision of the British people in the referendum's decision must also be made. That at the start of this process that she said that no deal would be better than a bad deal, so with reluctance with Parliament determining this is a bad deal she will now be concentrating on no deal preparations. However if the EU can address Parliament's concerns in a legally binding manner, specifically with regards to the backstop, that an amended deal could be brought back to Parliament. Either way we continue to leave on 29 March 2019.
[Over to you Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar]
Two problems:
1) Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar would immediately and unanimously say lol no 2) The deal still wouldn't pass the House of Commons
1) Then we no deal and lets see Varadkar put up his hard border.
2) I think it would. The stated reason why well over one hundred MPs voted no having been dealt with.
You'd have 50 Tory MP's opposing it, regardless.
The Backstop's not the only objection.
Who would still oppose it even with the backstop dealt with? Its the backstop Boris, JRM and many others have been underpinning all their key objections on.
The transition was agreed in principle very early on. Its the backstop that is unbearable.
It's funny how even a totally expected outcome can still hit like a punch in the gut.
That's how I felt about David Cameron's announcing his resignation.
I'm not sure if I've recovered or ever will.
Oh, I'm sure that the emotional wounds will heal with time :-)
David Cameron wrecked his career and half-a-century of UK foreign policy, all for the sake of trying to solve his party's little Farage problem.
If his long-awaited memoirs ultimately reveal that Cameron was, in fact, a closet Eurosceptic all along then his actions might have had some sensible, from that standpoint, rationale to them. But somehow I doubt it.
The man's a fool.
You have to give Clegg a large share of the blame too given that a lot of the rot set in during the coalition years.
At some point, and we may be there already, a vote for May's government is a vote for No Deal Brexit. Only a new leader can renegotiate and get an a50 extension.
My husband was watching a discussion on Sky News earlier. Vernon Bogdanor apparently believes that the chance of No Deal has increased (with the caveat that we live in strange times and events could yet prove him wrong.) Suggested bounce in the value of the pound was down to traders not understanding the political intricacies.
(EDIT: Bogdanor did suggest that we might see more ministerial resignations in the near future, however)
It's funny how even a totally expected outcome can still hit like a punch in the gut.
That's how I felt about David Cameron's announcing his resignation.
I'm not sure if I've recovered or ever will.
Oh, I'm sure that the emotional wounds will heal with time :-)
David Cameron wrecked his career and half-a-century of UK foreign policy, all for the sake of trying to solve his party's little Farage problem.
If his long-awaited memoirs ultimately reveal that Cameron was, in fact, a closet Eurosceptic all along then his actions might have had some sensible, from that standpoint, rationale to them. But somehow I doubt it.
The man's a fool.
When Cameron was our MP, he would frequently pronounce that our little town - the one place that consistently voted Lib Dem in his overwhelming Tory constituency - was "disputatious" and "argumentative". He once said that "I can be flavour of the month in Westminster and everyone's applauding me, then I come back here and you tell me precisely what I've done wrong and why I'll never amount to anything."
All very affectionately - he liked us and, as a constituency MP, we liked him: we asked him back to open our new Community Centre the other year and he gave a terrific speech. But he'd have to drive past the EU flags fluttering from houses in the town to get there.
It's funny how even a totally expected outcome can still hit like a punch in the gut.
That's how I felt about David Cameron's announcing his resignation.
I'm not sure if I've recovered or ever will.
Oh, I'm sure that the emotional wounds will heal with time :-)
David Cameron wrecked his career and half-a-century of UK foreign policy, all for the sake of trying to solve his party's little Farage problem.
If his long-awaited memoirs ultimately reveal that Cameron was, in fact, a closet Eurosceptic all along then his actions might have had some sensible, from that standpoint, rationale to them. But somehow I doubt it.
The man's a fool.
You have to give Clegg a large share of the blame too given that a lot of the rot set in during the coalition years.
They're both blameless. They acted with good intent, and did what they saw to be right. (How could anyone do otherwise?)
It's not going to happen but if May was brave there is a logically consistent way out of this mess.
May should make a speech tomorrow saying she respects Parliament's decision that it has made, but that the decision of the British people in the referendum's decision must also be made. That at the start of this process that she said that no deal would be better than a bad deal, so with reluctance with Parliament determining this is a bad deal she will now be concentrating on no deal preparations. However if the EU can address Parliament's concerns in a legally binding manner, specifically with regards to the backstop, that an amended deal could be brought back to Parliament. Either way we continue to leave on 29 March 2019.
[Over to you Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar]
Two problems:
1) Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar would immediately and unanimously say lol no 2) The deal still wouldn't pass the House of Commons
1) Then we no deal and lets see Varadkar put up his hard border.
2) I think it would. The stated reason why well over one hundred MPs voted no having been dealt with.
You'd have 50 Tory MP's opposing it, regardless.
The Backstop's not the only objection.
Who would still oppose it even with the backstop dealt with? Its the backstop Boris, JRM and many others have been underpinning all their key objections on.
The transition was agreed in principle very early on. Its the backstop that is unbearable.
You have to accept that there are a number who distrust the EU so deeply, that anything agreed with them is, by definition, unacceptable. Then there are those who simply like moaning about it, who probably don't want to leave as that would mean writing a new speech.
It's funny how even a totally expected outcome can still hit like a punch in the gut.
That's how I felt about David Cameron's announcing his resignation.
I'm not sure if I've recovered or ever will.
Allowing people into the UK parliament who did not finish first in their constituency was described by David Cameron as creating a "Parliament full of second-choices who no one really wanted but didn't really object to either." - David Cameron. "Why keeping first past the post is vital for democracy." Daily Telegraph. 30 Apr 2011
It's not going to happen but if May was brave there is a logically consistent way out of this mess.
May should make a speech tomorrow saying she respects Parliament's decision that it has made, but that the decision of the British people in the referendum's decision must also be made. That at the start of this process that she said that no deal would be better than a bad deal, so with reluctance with Parliament determining this is a bad deal she will now be concentrating on no deal preparations. However if the EU can address Parliament's concerns in a legally binding manner, specifically with regards to the backstop, that an amended deal could be brought back to Parliament. Either way we continue to leave on 29 March 2019.
[Over to you Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar]
Two problems:
1) Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar would immediately and unanimously say lol no 2) The deal still wouldn't pass the House of Commons
1) Then we no deal and lets see Varadkar put up his hard border.
2) I think it would. The stated reason why well over one hundred MPs voted no having been dealt with.
You'd have 50 Tory MP's opposing it, regardless.
The Backstop's not the only objection.
Who would still oppose it even with the backstop dealt with? Its the backstop Boris, JRM and many others have been underpinning all their key objections on.
The transition was agreed in principle very early on. Its the backstop that is unbearable.
They’re all too fired up now - frothing with the notion that only a total severance from continental Europe will satisfy the People’s Will. Nothing Theresa or anyone else brought back would have placated.
It's not going to happen but if May was brave there is a logically consistent way out of this mess.
May should make a speech tomorrow saying she respects Parliament's decision that it has made, but that the decision of the British people in the referendum's decision must also be made. That at the start of this process that she said that no deal would be better than a bad deal, so with reluctance with Parliament determining this is a bad deal she will now be concentrating on no deal preparations. However if the EU can address Parliament's concerns in a legally binding manner, specifically with regards to the backstop, that an amended deal could be brought back to Parliament. Either way we continue to leave on 29 March 2019.
[Over to you Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar]
+1
-1 from me.....just to equalise stuff...
this is a very British problem- we need to sort our shit out first-
My husband was watching a discussion on Sky News earlier. Vernon Bogdanor apparently believes that the chance of No Deal has increased (with the caveat that we live in strange times and events could yet prove him wrong.) Suggested bounce in the value of the pound was down to traders not understanding the political intricacies.
(EDIT: Bogdanor did suggest that we might see more ministerial resignations in the near future, however)
Peeling off 30 Labour MPs, without a CU, aint gonna be easy.
What good does a united front do if the EU still won't budge? And since they want us to remain why would they? And since half the commons also wants to remain and 1/12th to no deal, there's no chance of a united front anyway.
Look, May has been crap, we all know that, but people have also made plenty of stupid demands of her, things that are not in her gift.
It's funny how even a totally expected outcome can still hit like a punch in the gut.
That's how I felt about David Cameron's announcing his resignation.
I'm not sure if I've recovered or ever will.
Oh, I'm sure that the emotional wounds will heal with time :-)
David Cameron wrecked his career and half-a-century of UK foreign policy, all for the sake of trying to solve his party's little Farage problem.
If his long-awaited memoirs ultimately reveal that Cameron was, in fact, a closet Eurosceptic all along then his actions might have had some sensible, from that standpoint, rationale to them. But somehow I doubt it.
The man's a fool.
I very much doubt Cameron's memoirs will ever appear. He will never be able to find words to justify his decision to call the referendum.
It's funny how even a totally expected outcome can still hit like a punch in the gut.
That's how I felt about David Cameron's announcing his resignation.
I'm not sure if I've recovered or ever will.
Oh, I'm sure that the emotional wounds will heal with time :-)
David Cameron wrecked his career and half-a-century of UK foreign policy, all for the sake of trying to solve his party's little Farage problem.
If his long-awaited memoirs ultimately reveal that Cameron was, in fact, a closet Eurosceptic all along then his actions might have had some sensible, from that standpoint, rationale to them. But somehow I doubt it.
The man's a fool.
You have to give Clegg a large share of the blame too given that a lot of the rot set in during the coalition years.
They're both blameless. They acted with good intent, and did what they saw to be right. (How could anyone do otherwise?)
I've no doubt Theresa May will claim she acted with good intent, and did what the saw to be right.
It's funny how even a totally expected outcome can still hit like a punch in the gut.
That's how I felt about David Cameron's announcing his resignation.
I'm not sure if I've recovered or ever will.
Oh, I'm sure that the emotional wounds will heal with time :-)
David Cameron wrecked his career and half-a-century of UK foreign policy, all for the sake of trying to solve his party's little Farage problem.
If his long-awaited memoirs ultimately reveal that Cameron was, in fact, a closet Eurosceptic all along then his actions might have had some sensible, from that standpoint, rationale to them. But somehow I doubt it.
The man's a fool.
You have to give Clegg a large share of the blame too given that a lot of the rot set in during the coalition years.
They're both blameless. They acted with good intent, and did what they saw to be right. (How could anyone do otherwise?)
A pure heart and good intent is not enough. You have to not fuck up. That last bit's important...
My husband was watching a discussion on Sky News earlier. Vernon Bogdanor apparently believes that the chance of No Deal has increased (with the caveat that we live in strange times and events could yet prove him wrong.) Suggested bounce in the value of the pound was down to traders not understanding the political intricacies.
(EDIT: Bogdanor did suggest that we might see more ministerial resignations in the near future, however)
Peeling off 30 Labour MPs, without a CU, aint gonna be easy.
Indeed. We've been hearing for months on this site about Labour MPs voting for this Deal, or abstaining in droves. Labour people insisted it would be minuscule. Turns out Labour people know the Labour Party better than PB Tories do. Who could have guessed?
It's not going to happen but if May was brave there is a logically consistent way out of this mess.
May should make a speech tomorrow saying she respects Parliament's decision that it has made, but that the decision of the British people in the referendum's decision must also be made. That at the start of this process that she said that no deal would be better than a bad deal, so with reluctance with Parliament determining this is a bad deal she will now be concentrating on no deal preparations. However if the EU can address Parliament's concerns in a legally binding manner, specifically with regards to the backstop, that an amended deal could be brought back to Parliament. Either way we continue to leave on 29 March 2019.
[Over to you Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar]
+1
-1 from me.....just to equalise stuff...
this is a very British problem- we need to sort our shit out first-
Hang on a minute lads... I've got a great idea...
www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-iDJj01CvE
You were only supposed to blow the bloody doors off....
If Beth is correct and we somehow end up on the EFTA train then it will be a good result.
I've been saying for a long time we might end up there be design or accident. It has always seemed to be the closest to what the average person might want for our relationship with the EU.
That said I expect a second referendum and Remain to win. But in no way will that resolve the EU question, and quite frankly I expect violent opposition to it.
I can't see any way the opposition parties come round in cross party talks. Corbyn's Labour will never officially throw a bone to May, and to get Labour MPs backing it would need much more movement towards Norway+, exactly the type of deal that would tear apart the tory party. May won't do that, and she herself has made ending FoM the single "good" talking point from her deal, it is the definition of brexit for her.
Parliament won't allow no deal. The MPs that voted to sabotage no deal know the choice they made, you don't vote for that then row back - they will be ready to VONC the government at a later date (not tomorrow) if no alternative is forthcoming, with an aim of GONU but accepting that Corbyn may be result.
If Corbyn can see a way to become PM he will bend whichever way he needs to on Brexit, be that a second ref, extending A50 or a "temporary" revocation.
Feels like the best chance for Brexit now is to win a 2nd ref (because i'm not at all sure that Remain has a second ref in the bag).
My husband was watching a discussion on Sky News earlier. Vernon Bogdanor apparently believes that the chance of No Deal has increased (with the caveat that we live in strange times and events could yet prove him wrong.) Suggested bounce in the value of the pound was down to traders not understanding the political intricacies.
(EDIT: Bogdanor did suggest that we might see more ministerial resignations in the near future, however)
Peeling off 30 Labour MPs, without a CU, aint gonna be easy.
Indeed. We've been hearing for months on this site about Labour MPs voting for this Deal, or abstaining in droves. Labour people insisted it would be minuscule. Turns out Labour people know the Labour Party better than PB Tories do. Who could have guessed?
I'm on record as saying I couldn't understand why ANY would vote for it. It just invited a word of pain. The only ones who might consider it must have already decided to retire.
It's not going to happen but if May was brave there is a logically consistent way out of this mess.
May should make a speech tomorrow saying she respects Parliament's decision that it has made, but that the decision of the British people in the referendum's decision must also be made. That at the start of this process that she said that no deal would be better than a bad deal, so with reluctance with Parliament determining this is a bad deal she will now be concentrating on no deal preparations. However if the EU can address Parliament's concerns in a legally binding manner, specifically with regards to the backstop, that an amended deal could be brought back to Parliament. Either way we continue to leave on 29 March 2019.
[Over to you Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar]
+1
-1 from me.....just to equalise stuff...
this is a very British problem- we need to sort our shit out first-
I don't think there will be any "cross party consensus" - They're all like ferrets in a sack. And time is literally up...
Indeed. Theoretically its soft brexit, remain or no deal, but there's too much political gain for the various sides (or they believe so) that the obvious option of cross party support at this late stage, meaning softer brexit, won't get off the ground.
It's time to stop pretending. Its no brexit or no deal, that's it.
My husband was watching a discussion on Sky News earlier. Vernon Bogdanor apparently believes that the chance of No Deal has increased (with the caveat that we live in strange times and events could yet prove him wrong.) Suggested bounce in the value of the pound was down to traders not understanding the political intricacies.
(EDIT: Bogdanor did suggest that we might see more ministerial resignations in the near future, however)
Peeling off 30 Labour MPs, without a CU, aint gonna be easy.
Indeed. We've been hearing for months on this site about Labour MPs voting for this Deal, or abstaining in droves. Labour people insisted it would be minuscule. Turns out Labour people know the Labour Party better than PB Tories do. Who could have guessed?
I'm on record as saying I couldn't understand why ANY would vote for it. It just invited a word of pain. The only ones who might consider it must have already decided to retire.
When the Government has only one discernible policy, and an opposition MP votes for it, it may be regarded as a cause for consideration as to why one is an opposition MP in the first place. Surprised it was 3 in the end TBH.
Grayling went to Cambridge and was chosen by a Tory association to be its candidate. What the fuck does that say about the selection procedures of these organisations?
Who would still oppose it even with the backstop dealt with?
Some people have been so virulently against the EU for so long that they cannot accept any deal with it and will find any reason to object to it, even if those reasons are ridiculous. Some of the MPs fall into that category.
"We believe that there remains scope to secure a Parliamentary majority for a version of May's current deal..."
I don't understand why anybody thinks this is possible.
The City expect a cross party agreement that will stop no deal and move to a softer brexit or even remain
I hope I don't bore you by repeating myself, but I think the pessimists(?) on here are correct: the most likely outcome is no-deal. I don't see anything stopping it unless May asks for an extension, and I don't think she will.
I can't see any way the opposition parties come round in cross party talks. Corbyn's Labour will never officially throw a bone to May, and to get Labour MPs backing it would need much more movement towards Norway+, exactly the type of deal that would tear apart the tory party. May won't do that, and she herself has made ending FoM the single "good" talking point from her deal, it is the definition of brexit for her.
Parliament won't allow no deal. The MPs that voted to sabotage no deal know the choice they made, you don't vote for that then row back - they will be ready to VONC the government at a later date (not tomorrow) if no alternative is forthcoming, with an aim of GONU but accepting that Corbyn may be result.
If Corbyn can see a way to become PM he will bend whichever way he needs to on Brexit, be that a second ref, extending A50 or a "temporary" revocation.
Feels like the best chance for Brexit now is to win a 2nd ref (because i'm not at all sure that Remain has a second ref in the bag).
Farage seemed to be coming to same conclusion when he got extended airtime on BBC with Andrew Neil (five guests - Farage did almost all the talking).
It's not going to happen but if May was brave there is a logically consistent way out of this mess.
May should make a speech tomorrow saying she respects Parliament's decision that it has made, but that the decision of the British people in the referendum's decision must also be made. That at the start of this process that she said that no deal would be better than a bad deal, so with reluctance with Parliament determining this is a bad deal she will now be concentrating on no deal preparations. However if the EU can address Parliament's concerns in a legally binding manner, specifically with regards to the backstop, that an amended deal could be brought back to Parliament. Either way we continue to leave on 29 March 2019.
[Over to you Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar]
+1
-1 from me.....just to equalise stuff...
this is a very British problem- we need to sort our shit out first-
I wasn’t aware one could negate the teeth-grindingly awful PB meme of +1.
So if Deal+Remain Referendum somehow loses zero Tories, you need to swing 230/2 = 115. SNP+LD gets you like 45, so add that to 75 Lab and you just squeak it (120). But you'd lose more than zero Tories...
It's not going to happen but if May was brave there is a logically consistent way out of this mess.
May should make a speech tomorrow saying she respects Parliament's decision that it has made, but that the decision of the British people in the referendum's decision must also be made. That at the start of this process that she said that no deal would be better than a bad deal, so with reluctance with Parliament determining this is a bad deal she will now be concentrating on no deal preparations. However if the EU can address Parliament's concerns in a legally binding manner, specifically with regards to the backstop, that an amended deal could be brought back to Parliament. Either way we continue to leave on 29 March 2019.
[Over to you Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar]
+1
-1 from me.....just to equalise stuff...
this is a very British problem- we need to sort our shit out first-
I wasn’t aware one could negate the teeth-grindingly awful PB meme of +1.
Not likely but the thing I like about Pezza is he is prepared to speculate and be provocative.
Unlike Laura The Borer.
It's possible. If standing order 14 remains in force and Theresa May won't budge on her Withdrawal Agreement, then pro-EU MPs will have to think of creative ways to get rid of her. Otherwise, the clock runs down and they either have to swallow the Deal or watch Hard Brexit happen.
A gross failure to reach agreement followed by Deal or No Deal, or a small breakaway by Tory Hard Remainers (eight should be sufficient) both seem more likely, but a major realignment isn't impossible. The barriers to it are high: party loyalty, abandoning the party name and organisation to the rump left behind, and the need for the move to be co-ordinated so that a trap isn't sprung (where only one side splits and it ends up being routed by the other in a GE.) But there are also advantages for centrist MPs - jettisoning the ERG wing on one side, escaping the control of Corbyn on the other - so if they get desperate enough then they might just end up giving it a go.
I think if MPs were honest we would see that the only thing there's really a majority for is Remain. Parliament has always been at odds with the country in that regard, they were never 50/50 on the EU.
As a body they offered us a referendum where one outcome was unacceptable to the majority of MPs. Everything that has followed has been driven by that simple fact. If they could get away with it they'd revoke and Remain now, a 2nd Referendum will merely serve as political cover for what MPs really want to do.
It's not going to happen but if May was brave there is a logically consistent way out of this mess.
May should make a speech tomorrow saying she respects Parliament's decision that it has made, but that the decision of the British people in the referendum's decision must also be made. That at the start of this process that she said that no deal would be better than a bad deal, so with reluctance with Parliament determining this is a bad deal she will now be concentrating on no deal preparations. However if the EU can address Parliament's concerns in a legally binding manner, specifically with regards to the backstop, that an amended deal could be brought back to Parliament. Either way we continue to leave on 29 March 2019.
[Over to you Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar]
+1
-1 from me.....just to equalise stuff...
this is a very British problem- we need to sort our shit out first-
I wasn’t aware one could negate the teeth-grindingly awful PB meme of +1.
I’ll submit another -1.
You're a hypocrite - a few minutes earlier you were chortling over the Cameron 'chaos with Ed M' tweet meme. You don't dislike memes, you just dislike some others like. Why do you think your memes deserve to be chuckled at but others condemned?
And +1 isn't even a meme for crying out loud. It's just people indicating they really liked a statement, as there's no like button.
It's not going to happen but if May was brave there is a logically consistent way out of this mess.
May should make a speech tomorrow saying she respects Parliament's decision that it has made, but that the decision of the British people in the referendum's decision must also be made. That at the start of this process that she said that no deal would be better than a bad deal, so with reluctance with Parliament determining this is a bad deal she will now be concentrating on no deal preparations. However if the EU can address Parliament's concerns in a legally binding manner, specifically with regards to the backstop, that an amended deal could be brought back to Parliament. Either way we continue to leave on 29 March 2019.
[Over to you Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar]
Two problems:
1) Juncker/Barnier/Varadkar would immediately and unanimously say lol no 2) The deal still wouldn't pass the House of Commons
1) Then we no deal and lets see Varadkar put up his hard border.
2) I think it would. The stated reason why well over one hundred MPs voted no having been dealt with.
You'd have 50 Tory MP's opposing it, regardless.
The Backstop's not the only objection.
Who would still oppose it even with the backstop dealt with? Its the backstop Boris, JRM and many others have been underpinning all their key objections on.
The transition was agreed in principle very early on. Its the backstop that is unbearable.
1. Continuity Remain (Grieve, Allen ,Soubry, Wollaston, Gyimah, Lee, Jo Johnson, Bebb,)
They must have a lot on their plates, they've resolutely failed to do so for years.
The bottom line of that particularly unicorn fantasy is that if we say to the EU we are prepared to suffer the consequences of walking away they will believe us, but when they say they are prepared to suffer the consequences of walking away we don't believe them because they could not possibly mean it as who would be so foolish as to do that?
Or even more simply, that politicians on the other side won't play politics, even as we complain about their playing politics. And they would never prioritise things other than economic impacts, even as we do that very thing.
DD still seeing unicorns in front of his eyes, as he claims, yet again, that German car manufacturers will force EU to renegotiated.
Did he actually go to Brussels at all?
He was sat in Green Park eating a sandwich and doing a sudoku when everyone thought he was in Bruxelles like one of those blokes that get made redundant and can't tell their Mrs.
He hasn't displayed any to get brexit over the line
I think that shortly TM will go to Brussels, some improvements may be offered, then the EU will state this is the end state of the deal, will not re-open discussions with anyone including labour, and that A50 can only be deferred until the 18th April, the date the EU elections commence
Not likely but the thing I like about Pezza is he is prepared to speculate and be provocative.
Unlike Laura The Borer.
It's possible. If standing order 14 remains in force and Theresa May won't budge on her Withdrawal Agreement, then pro-EU MPs will have to think of creative ways to get rid of her. Otherwise, the clock runs down and they either have to swallow the Deal or watch Hard Brexit happen.
A gross failure to reach agreement followed by Deal or No Deal, or a small breakaway by Tory Hard Remainers (eight should be sufficient) both seem more likely, but a major realignment isn't impossible. The barriers to it are high: party loyalty, abandoning the party name and organisation to the rump left behind, and the need for the move to be co-ordinated so that a trap isn't sprung (where only one side splits and it ends up being routed by the other in a GE.) But there are also advantages for centrist MPs - jettisoning the ERG wing on one side, escaping the control of Corbyn on the other - so if they get desperate enough then they might just end up giving it a go.
They can split in the Commons and give themselves three years to sort out the details.
Important point: so long as Corbyn keeps running confidence votes on a loop, he doesn't have to admit that his attempt to secure a General Election has failed - so the party's policy of moving on to look at other options (e.g. the dreaded second referendum) can be safely set fire to and dropped into the nearest bin.
And all the time, the countdown to No Deal continues...
DD still seeing unicorns in front of his eyes, as he claims, yet again, that German car manufacturers will force EU to renegotiated.
Did he actually go to Brussels at all?
He was sat in Green Park eating a sandwich and doing a sudoku when everyone thought he was in Bruxelles like one of those blokes that get made redundant and can't tell their Mrs.
Comments
The transition was agreed in principle very early on. Its the backstop that is unbearable.
Only a new leader can renegotiate and get an a50 extension.
(EDIT: Bogdanor did suggest that we might see more ministerial resignations in the near future, however)
All very affectionately - he liked us and, as a constituency MP, we liked him: we asked him back to open our new Community Centre the other year and he gave a terrific speech. But he'd have to drive past the EU flags fluttering from houses in the town to get there.
Should have listened to us, Dave, shouldn't you?
https://twitter.com/christopherhope/status/1085295107560091648
- David Cameron. "Why keeping first past the post is vital for democracy." Daily Telegraph. 30 Apr 2011
https://twitter.com/amyklobuchar/status/1085299140043657217
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-iDJj01CvE
Look, May has been crap, we all know that, but people have also made plenty of stupid demands of her, things that are not in her gift.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/01/15/must-now-maximise-strength-negotiating-position/
I don't understand why anybody thinks this is possible.
As did Tony Blair.
Who could have guessed?
https://twitter.com/Kevin_Maguire/status/1085256577161052160?s=19
So even the ERG weren't willing to back the Deal with a softening of the Irish Backstop. They cannot be won round.
Only an appeal to the Labour front bench or No Deal Brexit.
https://twitter.com/StevePeers/status/1085300662143987712
We cannot work with May, but will work with a different PM.
That said I expect a second referendum and Remain to win. But in no way will that resolve the EU question, and quite frankly I expect violent opposition to it.
Parliament won't allow no deal. The MPs that voted to sabotage no deal know the choice they made, you don't vote for that then row back - they will be ready to VONC the government at a later date (not tomorrow) if no alternative is forthcoming, with an aim of GONU but accepting that Corbyn may be result.
If Corbyn can see a way to become PM he will bend whichever way he needs to on Brexit, be that a second ref, extending A50 or a "temporary" revocation.
Feels like the best chance for Brexit now is to win a 2nd ref (because i'm not at all sure that Remain has a second ref in the bag).
It's time to stop pretending. Its no brexit or no deal, that's it.
What a choice. Good night all. The rest are awaiting the Jezziah.
I’m on the fucking pig ignorant side of the bet.
Not likely but the thing I like about Pezza is he is prepared to speculate and be provocative.
Unlike Laura The Borer.
Gets me every time.
I’ll submit another -1.
Always nice to emerge all green.
Oh, my coat?
A gross failure to reach agreement followed by Deal or No Deal, or a small breakaway by Tory Hard Remainers (eight should be sufficient) both seem more likely, but a major realignment isn't impossible. The barriers to it are high: party loyalty, abandoning the party name and organisation to the rump left behind, and the need for the move to be co-ordinated so that a trap isn't sprung (where only one side splits and it ends up being routed by the other in a GE.) But there are also advantages for centrist MPs - jettisoning the ERG wing on one side, escaping the control of Corbyn on the other - so if they get desperate enough then they might just end up giving it a go.
https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1085141000488669184
As a body they offered us a referendum where one outcome was unacceptable to the majority of MPs. Everything that has followed has been driven by that simple fact. If they could get away with it they'd revoke and Remain now, a 2nd Referendum will merely serve as political cover for what MPs really want to do.
Did he actually go to Brussels at all?
And +1 isn't even a meme for crying out loud. It's just people indicating they really liked a statement, as there's no like button.
These people are just plain deluded.
If TM wins tomorrow and carries on as PM I will admit I have no idea how she squares the circle between remain and leave
On the other hand Corbyn was poor at the dispatch box today and frankly looks out of his depth
Where is the saviour in a political sense for our once great country
2. Ex-ministers, furious about leaving office (Fallon, Villiers, , Shapps, Hands, Greening, Collins, Mitchell, )
3. The Thick (Bridgen, Wiggin, Baron, Patel, Syms, Jenkyns, Francois, Bradley, David Davis, Duddridge, Philip Davies, IDS, Bone, Holloborne,
4. The opportunists (Boris, Raab, McVey, Pursglove)
The bottom line of that particularly unicorn fantasy is that if we say to the EU we are prepared to suffer the consequences of walking away they will believe us, but when they say they are prepared to suffer the consequences of walking away we don't believe them because they could not possibly mean it as who would be so foolish as to do that?
Or even more simply, that politicians on the other side won't play politics, even as we complain about their playing politics. And they would never prioritise things other than economic impacts, even as we do that very thing.
Idiocy.
I think that shortly TM will go to Brussels, some improvements may be offered, then the EU will state this is the end state of the deal, will not re-open discussions with anyone including labour, and that A50 can only be deferred until the 18th April, the date the EU elections commence
Fantasy politics. But, as you say, who knows?
Important point: so long as Corbyn keeps running confidence votes on a loop, he doesn't have to admit that his attempt to secure a General Election has failed - so the party's policy of moving on to look at other options (e.g. the dreaded second referendum) can be safely set fire to and dropped into the nearest bin.
And all the time, the countdown to No Deal continues...
Don’t forget the “French wine producers”.
I am fond of the idea of agricultural workers in the Medoc saving our bacon, but am not holding out great hopes.
1) May wants her deal.
2) Labour (officially) wants a perma customs union.
3) The EU won't touch the WA, but there's room for some sort of letter of intent on the direction of future travel wrt the trade agreement.
Norway+CU as a commonly-declared intended future state, based on the WA in the short term? Corbyn and May can both claim victory. No crash-exit.