All over. Best team won, USA have been piss poor this week. I think the foursomes on Friday they were +13...4 pairs of world class players, 13 over par, it just terrible.
Just shows what Europe, united is capable of.
Gets coat, heads off to the pub for Sunday evening pint.
All over. Best team won, USA have been piss poor this week. I think the foursomes on Friday they were +13...4 pairs of world class players, 13 over par, it just terrible.
American golf not in a great place - maybe they need to make it Rest of the World and get some help from Asia.....
Though of course the EU is not the same as Europe, especially if we got some Swiss or Norwegian or Icelandic or Russian Ryder Cup players as well as those from post Brexit UK
'At least political life would be less complicated if the Brexit division were the only one. The other, austerity, remains a defining question for voters after nearly a decade.
It would help if the two divisions lined up neatly, but they don’t:my research finds that only a third of pro-austerity voters, the basis of David Cameron’s 2015 majority, voted to remain in the EU, while nearly four in ten on the anti-austerity side voted to leave.
Hence, as I explain at greater length in today’s Mail on Sunday, the result of the last election, and the extreme difficulty for both sides of putting together an election-winning coalition as things stand. The prize for the first party to appeal beyond these two divides is obvious.'
Interesting to see 40% of leftwing, statist voters voted Leave and a third of pro austerity fiscal conservatives were Remainers, showing that Brexit alone will not get a Tory majority as 2017 confirmed
Though of course the EU is not the same as Europe, especially if we got some Swiss or Norwegian or Icelandic or Russian Ryder Cup players as well as those from post Brexit UK
I'm not sure I'd be keen on the Russians taking part. Leaving aside the suspiciously perfect biceps, I'd always be wondering how they got those balls quite so luminous.
Anyone know what Theresa's "compromise" with the EU is going to entail?
I thought Chequers WAS the compromise?
Most likely it will be Chequers Plus ie stay in the SM and CU with a slightly different name after Brexit.
It was clear from her Marr interview this morning when May said she was working for a Deal that her talk of No Deal as a last resort was just lip service to the Tory right, she is not actually going to do it
May has made her red lines clear. The EU has done the same. There is no overlap, hence the impasse.
She has a simple choice. She can cave, and try to sell continued SM/CU membership or the de facto cession of Northern Ireland as somehow being compatible with the Brexit vote, or she admits that the negotiations have failed, and we will leave with no deal. Thanks to her stubbornness, she will do neither.
I expect that it will be the EU that declares the negotiations dead in November, at which point the British domestic crisis will begin.
What she will concede is greater alignment on services to coincide with the greater alignment she has already conceded on goods and the Irish backstop will be NI effectively stays in the Customs Union in all but name. She might also get some sort of Liechtenstein scenario on FoM.
It was clear from Marr this morning May has no desire for No Deal beyond paying lip service as a last restort to it for hardened Brexiteers
The EU have made it perfectly clear; we cannot cherry-pick the Single Market. We’re in it, or we’re not. It is not in their interest to concede a special variant for us; they regret the way EU-Swiss relations have developed, and won’t make the same mistake twice. The same goes for the customs union; a territory is in it, or it isn’t. May has made it clear a customs border within the U.K. is a nonstarter.
I realise that Theresa May doesn’t want no deal. That is not sufficient to prevent it from happening. Our politicians and media need to stop acting as if Brexit is like a restaurant where we get to specify the ingredients and the EU will cook the meal. They have given us 2 unappealing choices, or we can leave with nothing. That is it.
Anyone know what Theresa's "compromise" with the EU is going to entail?
I thought Chequers WAS the compromise?
Most likely it will be Chequers Plus ie stay in the SM and CU with a slightly different name after Brexit.
It was clear from her Marr interview this morning when May said she was working for a Deal that her talk of No Deal as a last resort was just lip service to the Tory right, she is not actually going to do it
May has made her red lines clear. The EU has done the same. There is no overlap, hence the impasse.
She has a simple choice. She can cave, and try to sell continued SM/CU membership or the de facto cession of Northern Ireland as somehow being compatible with the Brexit vote, or she admits that the negotiations have failed, and we will leave with no deal. Thanks to her stubbornness, she will do neither.
I expect that it will be the EU that declares the negotiations dead in November, at which point the British domestic crisis will begin.
What she will concede is greater alignment on services to coincide with the greater alignment she has already conceded on goods and the Irish backstop will be NI effectively stays in the Customs Union in all but name. She might also get some sort of Liechtenstein scenario on FoM.
It was clear from Marr this morning May has no desire for No Deal beyond paying lip service as a last restort to it for hardened Brexiteers
The EU have made it perfectly clear; we cannot cherry-pick the Single Market. We’re in it, or we’re not. It is not in their interest to concede a special variant for us; they regret the way EU-Swiss relations have developed, and won’t make the same mistake twice. The same goes for the customs union; a territory is in it, or it isn’t. May has made it clear a customs border within the U.K. is a nonstarter.
I realise that Theresa May doesn’t want no deal. That is not sufficient to prevent it from happening. Our politicians and media need to stop acting as if Brexit is like a restaurant where we get to specify the ingredients and the EU will cook the meal. They have given us 2 unappealing choices, or we can leave with nothing. That is it.
Or stay which seems more likely day by day as Boris and ERG overplay their hand
Perhaps Justine Greening will reflect on the wisdom of voting to triple student tuition fees and then supporting the freezing of the payment threshold.
Or she could consider how house prices and home ownership levels in Putney have changed since 2010.
How many of the US team have played this course before this week ?
I suspect there's a connection there between their unwillingness to play on European courses and their repeated shite performances when the Ryder Cup is held in Europe.
Anyone know what Theresa's "compromise" with the EU is going to entail?
I thought Chequers WAS the compromise?
Most likely it will be Chequers Plus ie stay in the SM and CU with a slightly different name after Brexit.
it
May has made her red lines clear. The EU has done the same. There is no overlap, hence the impasse.
She has a simple choice. She can cave, and try to sell continued SM/CU membership or the de facto cession of Northern Ireland as somehow being compatible with the Brexit vote, or she admits that the negotiations have failed, and we will leave with no deal. Thanks to her stubbornness, she will do neither.
I expect that it will be the EU that declares the negotiations dead in November, at which point the British domestic crisis will begin.
What she will concede is greater alignment on services to coincide with the greater alignment she has already conceded on goods and the Irish backstop will be NI effectively stays in the Customs Union in all but name. She might also get some sort of Liechtenstein scenario on FoM.
It was clear from Marr this morning May has no desire for No Deal beyond paying lip service as a last restort to it for hardened Brexiteers
The EU have made it perfectly clear; we cannot cherry-pick the Single Market. We’re in it, or we’re not. It is not in their interest to concede a special variant for us; they regret the way EU-Swiss relations have developed, and won’t make the same mistake twice. The same goes for the customs union; a territory is in it, or it isn’t. May has made it clear a customs border within the U.K. is a nonstarter.
I realise that Theresa May doesn’t want no deal. That is not sufficient to prevent it from happening. Our politicians and media need to stop acting as if Brexit is like a restaurant where we get to specify the ingredients and the EU will cook the meal. They have given us 2 unappealing choices, or we can leave with nothing. That is it.
Or stay which seems more likely day by day as Boris and ERG overplay their hand
That will very much depend on the price the EU demands for retracting Article 50. If anything worse than current terms is offered, it diminishes the likelihood of us Remaining at all, and if we did, it would guarantee a huge UKIP continent in the next European Parliament.
Perhaps when the negotiations fail, the heads of government of the 27 will make a unanimous offer of membership on existing terms. That could electrify the debate.
Overall 40% of all UK voters back a hard Brexit and no deal without full control over borders, laws and trade deals, 31% want a second referendum on whether to go ahead with Brexit once we know its terms and 17% of voters want a compromise deal with the EU that honours the referendum result but ensures trade continues smoothly with the EU even if following a common set of rules and regulations set by the EU making the latter the key swing voters.
Those who want a compromise deal with the EU are a plurality amongst Tory Remain voters while hard Brexiteers make up a majority of Tory and Labour Leave voters and those who want a second referendum make up a majority of Labour Remain voters
Anyone know what Theresa's "compromise" with the EU is going to entail?
I thought Chequers WAS the compromise?
Most likely it will be Chequers Plus ie stay in the SM and CU with a slightly different name after Brexit.
it
May has made her red lines clear. The EU has done the same. There is no overlap, hence the impasse.
I expect that it will be the EU that declares the negotiations dead in November, at which point the British domestic crisis will begin.
What she will concede is greater alignment on services to coincide with the greater alignment she has already conceded on goods and the Irish backstop will be NI effectively stays in the Customs Union in all but name. She might also get some sort of Liechtenstein scenario on FoM.
It was clear from Marr this morning May has no desire for No Deal beyond paying lip service as a last restort to it for hardened Brexiteers
The EU have made it perfectly clear; we cannot cherry-pick the Single Market. We’re in it, or we’re not. It is not in their interest to concede a special variant for us; they regret the way EU-Swiss relations have developed, and won’t make the same mistake twice. The same goes for the customs union; a territory is in it, or it isn’t. May has made it clear a customs border within the U.K. is a nonstarter.
I realise that Theresa May doesn’t want no deal. That is not sufficient to prevent it from happening. Our politicians and media need to stop acting as if Brexit is like a restaurant where we get to specify the ingredients and the EU will cook the meal. They have given us 2 unappealing choices, or we can leave with nothing. That is it.
Or stay which seems more likely day by day as Boris and ERG overplay their hand
That will very much depend on the price the EU demands for retracting Article 50. If anything worse than current terms is offered, it diminishes the likelihood of us Remaining at all, and if we did, it would guarantee a huge UKIP continent in the next European Parliament.
Perhaps when the negotiations fail, the heads of government of the 27 will make a unanimous offer of membership on existing terms. That could electrify the debate.
I am sure they would be relieved to reinstate our status
Mind you the referendum would have to have a decisive answer or years of anger would follow
Overall 40% of all UK voters back a hard Brexit and no deal without full control over borders, laws and trade deals, 31% want a second referendum on whether to go ahead with Brexit once we know its terms and 17% of voters want a compromise deal with the EU that honours the referendum result but ensure trade continues smoothly with the EU even if following a common set of rules and regulations set by the EU making the latter the key swing voters.
Those who want a compromise deal with the EU are a plurality amongst Tory Remain voters while hard Brexiteers make up a majority of Tory and Labour Leave voters and those who want a second referendum make up a majority of Labour Remain voters
Who are those 17% going to blame, if no compromise deal can be done with the EU? If they split 12:5 to accepting we had no alternative than Hard Brexit, then we have the same % accepting Hard Brexit as voted for Brexit in the Referendum......
Those making connections between Ryder cup, EU, brexit...just thought would mention no German, french or beligum players...amazing what you can get done without them*
On the conservative conference policy must be influenced by the autumn statement coming up on the 29th October, my eldest sons 52nd birthday and he is coming in from Canada to see us
Anyone know what Theresa's "compromise" with the EU is going to entail?
I thought Chequers WAS the compromise?
Most likely it will be Chequers Plus ie stay in the SM and CU with a slightly different name after Brexit.
It was clear from her Marr interview this morning when May said she was working for a Deal that her talk of No Deal as a last resort was just lip service to the Tory right, she is not actually going to do it
May has made her red lines clear. The EU has done the same. There is no overlap, hence the impasse.
She has a simple choice. She can cave, and try to sell continued SM/CU membership or the de facto cession of Northern Ireland as somehow being compatible with the Brexit vote, or she admits that the negotiations have failed, and we will leave with no deal. Thanks to her stubbornness, she will do neither.
I expect that it will be the EU that declares the negotiations dead in November, at which point the British domestic crisis will begin.
What she will concede is greater alignment on services to coincide with the greater alignment she has already conceded on goods and the Irish backstop will be NI effectively stays in the Customs Union in all but name. She might also get some sort of Liechtenstein scenario on FoM.
It was clear from Marr this morning May has no desire for No Deal beyond paying lip service as a last restort to it for hardened Brexiteers
The EU have made it perfectly clear; we cannot cherry-pick the Single Market. We’re in it, or we’re not. It is not in their interest to concede a special variant for us; they regret the way EU-Swiss relations have developed, and won’t make the same mistake twice. The same goes for the customs union; a territory is in it, or it isn’t. May has made it clear a customs border within the U.K. is a nonstarter.
I realise that Theresa May doesn’t want no deal. That is not sufficient to prevent it from happening. Our politicians and media need to stop acting as if Brexit is like a restaurant where we get to specify the ingredients and the EU will cook the meal. They have given us 2 unappealing choices, or we can leave with nothing. That is it.
They won't be conceding a special variant for us, as I said May is likely to agree to stay in the SM and CU in all but name for the whole UK post Brexit.
As today's Ashcroft poll shows there is no majority in the country that will accept No Deal and the same applies in Parliament, more voters support BINO Brexit or a second referendum combined than will accept hard Brexit and No Deal
Overall 40% of all UK voters back a hard Brexit and no deal without full control over borders, laws and trade deals, 31% want a second referendum on whether to go ahead with Brexit once we know its terms and 17% of voters want a compromise deal with the EU that honours the referendum result but ensure trade continues smoothly with the EU even if following a common set of rules and regulations set by the EU making the latter the key swing voters.
Those who want a compromise deal with the EU are a plurality amongst Tory Remain voters while hard Brexiteers make up a majority of Tory and Labour Leave voters and those who want a second referendum make up a majority of Labour Remain voters
Who are those 17% going to blame, if no compromise deal can be done with the EU? If they split 12:5 to accepting we had no alternative than Hard Brexit, then we have the same % accepting Hard Brexit as voted for Brexit in the Referendum......
No as the compromise deal the question asked was accepting rules and regulations set by the EU for a trade deal post Brexit. They are effectively therefore already accepting staying in the SM and CU by the very nature of the question asked
Overall 40% of all UK voters back a hard Brexit and no deal without full control over borders, laws and trade deals, 31% want a second referendum on whether to go ahead with Brexit once we know its terms and 17% of voters want a compromise deal with the EU that honours the referendum result but ensure trade continues smoothly with the EU even if following a common set of rules and regulations set by the EU making the latter the key swing voters.
Those who want a compromise deal with the EU are a plurality amongst Tory Remain voters while hard Brexiteers make up a majority of Tory and Labour Leave voters and those who want a second referendum make up a majority of Labour Remain voters
Who are those 17% going to blame, if no compromise deal can be done with the EU? If they split 12:5 to accepting we had no alternative than Hard Brexit, then we have the same % accepting Hard Brexit as voted for Brexit in the Referendum......
No as the compromise deal the question asked was accepting rules and regulations set by the EU for a trade deal post Brexit. They are effectively therefore already accepting staying in the SM and CU by the very nature of the question asked
That doesn't negate my point. If there's No Deal, who do you then stand behind - the UK or the EU?
Hunt now speaking on Brexit at the Tory Conference after Williamson delivered his speech
Really strong speech from Hunt. Indeed top of the class
Are you watching Boris - this is how it is done
Interesting Hunt says he met Henry Kissinger who says he was asked to write an article backing Remain but declined as the world needed 'an independent British voice'
Those making connections between Ryder cup, EU, brexit...just thought would mention no German, french or beligum players...amazing what you can get done without them*
*just joking.
Hope that Noren monster putt hasn't cost you Christmas.....
Overall 40% of all UK voters back a hard Brexit and no deal without full control over borders, laws and trade deals, 31% want a second referendum on whether to go ahead with Brexit once we know its terms and 17% of voters want a compromise deal with the EU that honours the referendum result but ensure trade continues smoothly with the EU even if following a common set of rules and regulations set by the EU making the latter the key swing voters.
Those who want a compromise deal with the EU are a plurality amongst Tory Remain voters while hard Brexiteers make up a majority of Tory and Labour Leave voters and those who want a second referendum make up a majority of Labour Remain voters
Who are those 17% going to blame, if no compromise deal can be done with the EU? If they split 12:5 to accepting we had no alternative than Hard Brexit, then we have the same % accepting Hard Brexit as voted for Brexit in the Referendum......
No as the compromise deal the question asked was accepting rules and regulations set by the EU for a trade deal post Brexit. They are effectively therefore already accepting staying in the SM and CU by the very nature of the question asked
That doesn't negate my point. If there's No Deal, who do you then stand behind - the UK or the EU?
It does negate your point. As it shows the median British voter wants to technically still leave the EU but will accept staying in the SM and CU if that is the price to pay for a Deal, they will not countenance No Deal.
Yes a sizeable 40% of voters will back No Deal rather than a second EU referendum or staying in the SM and CU but that is still far short of a majority
Hunt now speaking on Brexit at the Tory Conference after Williamson delivered his speech
Really strong speech from Hunt. Indeed top of the class
Are you watching Boris - this is how it is done
Interesting Hunt says he met Henry Kissinger who says he was asked to write an article backing Remain but declined as the world needed 'an independent British voice'
Indeed - are you impressed by his speech - I certainly am
Hunt now speaking on Brexit at the Tory Conference after Williamson delivered his speech
Really strong speech from Hunt. Indeed top of the class
Are you watching Boris - this is how it is done
Interesting Hunt says he met Henry Kissinger who says he was asked to write an article backing Remain but declined as the world needed 'an independent British voice'
Indeed - are you impressed by his speech - I certainly am
My favourite recent Four Yorkshireman failure was when some youthful twonk at a Miliband-era conference complained of his poverty, tweeting it from his iPad.
I had a woman working for me once who complained about how tough they were finding things financially.
One of the team asked her if her next holiday was the 3rd or 4th that year.........
Many, many years back I worked as part of a team and we were all bemoaning about all things financial on a Friday afternoon. One of the young ladies who was complaining came in on the Monday and was excitedly telling everyone about the brand new car they had ordered at weekend......
Different people have different ideas of finding things tough it seems :-)
Anyone know what Theresa's "compromise" with the EU is going to entail?
I thought Chequers WAS the compromise?
Most likely it will be Chequers Plus ie stay in the SM and CU with a slightly different name after Brexit.
It was clear from her Marr interview this morning when May said she was working for a Deal that her talk of No Deal as a last resort was just lip service to the Tory right, she is not actually going to do it
May has made her red lines clear. The EU has done the same. There is no overlap, hence the impasse.
She has a simple choice. She can cave, and try to sell continued SM/CU membership or the de facto cession of Northern Ireland as somehow being compatible with the Brexit vote, or she admits that the negotiations have failed, and we will leave with no deal. Thanks to her stubbornness, she will do neither.
I expect that it will be the EU that declares the negotiations dead in November, at which point the British domestic crisis will begin.
What she will concede is greater alignment on services to coincide with the greater alignment she has already conceded on goods and the Irish backstop will be NI effectively stays in the Customs Union in all but name. She might also get some sort of Liechtenstein scenario on FoM.
It was clear from Marr this morning May has no desire for No Deal beyond paying lip service as a last restort to it for hardened Brexiteers
The EU have made it perfectly clear; we cannot cherry-pick the Single Market. We’re in it, or we’re not. It is not in their interest to concede a special variant for us; they regret the way EU-Swiss relations have developed, and won’t make the same mistake twice. The same goes for the customs union; a territory is in it, or it isn’t. May has made it clear a customs border within the U.K. is a nonstarter.
I realise that Theresa May doesn’t want no deal. That is not sufficient to prevent it from happening. Our politicians and media need to stop acting as if Brexit is like a restaurant where we get to specify the ingredients and the EU will cook the meal. They have given us 2 unappealing choices, or we can leave with nothing. That is it.
I'm not sure even the Festival of Britain reenactment will distract people from the retro food rationing. The difference is that then we were under attack. This time it's completely unforced. We voted for it.
Hunt now speaking on Brexit at the Tory Conference after Williamson delivered his speech
Really strong speech from Hunt. Indeed top of the class
Are you watching Boris - this is how it is done
Interesting Hunt says he met Henry Kissinger who says he was asked to write an article backing Remain but declined as the world needed 'an independent British voice'
Indeed - are you impressed by his speech - I certainly am
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too'. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
It's important to remember the 48%, because Brexit should not about satisfying the greatest number of Leave voters, but the greatest total number of voters.
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
WTF is a "generous Brexit for the 48%"? A glass of champagne and a piece of Camembert for all?
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
It's important to remember the 48%, because Brexit should not about satisfying the greatest number of Leave voters, but the greatest total number of voters.
Would have been nice if that had been the approach from the beginning.
Those making connections between Ryder cup, EU, brexit...just thought would mention no German, french or beligum players...amazing what you can get done without them*
*just joking.
Hope that Noren monster putt hasn't cost you Christmas.....
I think even turkey twizzlers are off the menu now!
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
WTF is a "generous Brexit for the 48%"? A glass of champagne and a piece of Camembert for all?
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
It's important to remember the 48%, because Brexit should not about satisfying the greatest number of Leave voters, but the greatest total number of voters.
Indeed and it looks like the median voter is moving towards the Norway option, at least temporarily rather than a forced choice of Remain or No Deal
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
WTF is a "generous Brexit for the 48%"? A glass of champagne and a piece of Camembert for all?
I don't see what is confusing or upsetting about the term - obviously what is generous to some will still not satisfy others, bit clearly means a Brexit that does not aggravate every single person who voted remain. It's flexible and hardly defined, but as a sentiment it is reasonable.
As HYUFD suggests, he might try to sell something generous for the 48 as there simply being a deal. That would be a bit cheeky - it is not as though no deal satisfied all of the 52 - but it's still a message that could have been pushed a lot harder than it has been for all this time.
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
It's important to remember the 48%, because Brexit should not about satisfying the greatest number of Leave voters, but the greatest total number of voters.
Indeed and it looks like the median voter is moving towards the Norway option, at least temporarily rather than a forced choice of Remain or No Deal
Sky reporting that Hunts speech and tone is the start of senior ministers marginalising the ERG and uniting behind TM.
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Overall 40% of all UK voters back a hard Brexit and no deal without full control over borders, laws and trade deals, 31% want a second referendum on whether to go ahead with Brexit once we know its terms and 17% of voters want a compromise deal with the EU that honours the referendum result but ensure trade continues smoothly with the EU even if following a common set of rules and regulations set by the EU making the latter the key swing voters.
Those who want a compromise deal with the EU are a plurality amongst Tory Remain voters while hard Brexiteers make up a majority of Tory and Labour Leave voters and those who want a second referendum make up a majority of Labour Remain voters
Who are those 17% going to blame, if no compromise deal can be done with the EU? If they split 12:5 to accepting we had no alternative than Hard Brexit, then we have the same % accepting Hard Brexit as voted for Brexit in the Referendum......
No as the compromise deal the question asked was accepting rules and regulations set by the EU for a trade deal post Brexit. They are effectively therefore already accepting staying in the SM and CU by the very nature of the question asked
That doesn't negate my point. If there's No Deal, who do you then stand behind - the UK or the EU?
If there's no deal, there's no deal. The question is whether the population will blame the EU or the British government for any economic disruption.
And, here's the thing. Even if 90% of Conservative voters blame the EU, and only 10% blame the government, those are votes the Conservative Party can ill afford to lose.
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Trials elsewhere have deemed it effective haven't they
No
I’m sure they’ve found in some situations there’s no productivity loss from moving to four days. But that will be narrow and kept to certain professions. Should schools go to four day weeks? What about people who work on the checkout at Asda?
Mr. Floater, indeed. Like maps, we tend to centre ourselves as the financial norm (with an added dose of feeling over-taxed personally whilst 'those rich people' don't pay enough).
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
They people are absolutely clueless. But then these are also the people who want to ban automated trains (even if they are already automated).
My wife and I regularly discuss this. She argues that guards are essential because of passenger disorder etc. I point out that it isn’t a guard, it’s a second member of staff on the train after the driver tat is essential. Guards are responsible for starting the train, a function entirely able to be done by the driver and has been done by drivers on lighter railways for decades.
I point out she is arguing against driver operating only trains, when the next generation of train won’t even need a driver never mind a guard.
Anyone know what Theresa's "compromise" with the EU is going to entail?
I thought Chequers WAS the compromise?
Most likely it will be Chequers Plus ie stay in the SM and CU with a slightly different name after Brexit.
It was clear from her Marr interview this morning when May said she was working for a Deal that her talk of No Deal as a last resort was just lip service to the Tory right, she is not actually going to do it
May has made her red lines clear. The EU has done the same. There is no overlap, hence the impasse.
She has a simple choice. She can cave, and try to sell continued SM/CU membership or the de facto cession of Northern Ireland as somehow being compatible with the Brexit vote, or she admits that the negotiations have failed, and we will leave with no deal. Thanks to her stubbornness, she will do neither.
I expect that it will be the EU that declares the negotiations dead in November, at which point the British domestic crisis will begin.
The EU made their Red Lines very clear 2 years ago, and since then our "politicians" have been wasting time trying to split up the countries from the commission and do separate deals, then trying to get the commission to back track and back down to returning to tying to split the countries again - all in all, a very convincing demonstration of what happens when you try urinating into the wind.
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Overall 40% of all UK voters back a hard Brexit and no deal without full control over borders, laws and trade deals, 31% want a second referendum on whether to go ahead with Brexit once we know its terms and 17% of voters want a compromise deal with the EU that honours the referendum result but ensure trade continues smoothly with the EU even if following a common set of rules and regulations set by the EU making the latter the key swing voters.
Those who want a compromise deal with the EU are a plurality amongst Tory Remain voters while hard Brexiteers make up a majority of Tory and Labour Leave voters and those who want a second referendum make up a majority of Labour Remain voters
Who are those 17% going to blame, if no compromise deal can be done with the EU? If they split 12:5 to accepting we had no alternative than Hard Brexit, then we have the same % accepting Hard Brexit as voted for Brexit in the Referendum......
No as the compromise deal the question asked was accepting rules and regulations set by the EU for a trade deal post Brexit. They are effectively therefore already accepting staying in the SM and CU by the very nature of the question asked
That doesn't negate my point. If there's No Deal, who do you then stand behind - the UK or the EU?
If there's no deal, there's no deal. The question is whether the population will blame the EU or the British government for any economic disruption.
And, here's the thing. Even if 90% of Conservative voters blame the EU, and only 10% blame the government, those are votes the Conservative Party can ill afford to lose.
Indeed, one thing the Ashcroft poll makes clear is the key swing voters on Brexit are now Tory Remainers who are closest to the median voter in technically now backing Brexit, unlike Labour Remainers who want a second referendum but opposing No Deal unlike Tory and Labour Leavers
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
They people are absolutely clueless. But then these are also the people who want to ban automated trains (even if they are already automated).
Guards on trains are necessary because:
* They help the blind and mobility-impaired to get on and off trains * They enable tickets to be sold to those who have not purchased one * They act as witnesses to violent events and peacekeepers to prevent them * They provide aid to the distressed * They enable the train to leave the station safely by spotting problems.
Taking guards away from trains is like taking emergency parachutes away from parachutists.
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
They people are absolutely clueless. But then these are also the people who want to ban automated trains (even if they are already automated).
Guards on trains are necessary because:
* They help the blind and mobility-impaired to get on and off trains * They enable tickets to be sold to those who have not purchased one * They act as witnesses to violent events and peacekeepers to prevent them * They provide aid to the distressed * They enable the train to leave the station safely by spotting problems.
Taking guards away from trains is like taking emergency parachutes away from parachutists.
Can't the majority of those points be dealt with by people at the station? I would probably feel a bit uncomfortable on a totally unmanned cross-country train, but wouldn't bat an eye about being on an unmaned Tube train.
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
They people are absolutely clueless. But then these are also the people who want to ban automated trains (even if they are already automated).
Guards on trains are necessary because:
* They help the blind and mobility-impaired to get on and off trains * They enable tickets to be sold to those who have not purchased one * They act as witnesses to violent events and peacekeepers to prevent them * They provide aid to the distressed * They enable the train to leave the station safely by spotting problems.
Taking guards away from trains is like taking emergency parachutes away from parachutists.
So the Vancouver metro system that has neither drivers or guards fails health and safety
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
They people are absolutely clueless. But then these are also the people who want to ban automated trains (even if they are already automated).
Guards on trains are necessary because:
* They help the blind and mobility-impaired to get on and off trains * They enable tickets to be sold to those who have not purchased one * They act as witnesses to violent events and peacekeepers to prevent them * They provide aid to the distressed * They enable the train to leave the station safely by spotting problems.
Taking guards away from trains is like taking emergency parachutes away from parachutists.
Can't the majority of those points be dealt with by people at the station? I would probably feel a bit uncomfortable on a totally unmanned cross-country train, but wouldn't bat an eye about being on an unmaned Tube train.
Trains run from about 4am to about 2am. The non-major stations are only manned from about 7am to about 6pm.
To give a real-life example: recently I witnessed an altercation between two groups of youth which involved a lot of pushing, shoving, bottle-throwing and threats of stabbing. One of the parties was left on the train and was alternately angry and (as the shock kicked in) considerably distressed. The guard stepped in, handled the situation and restored order, and got the traveller to another guard at the next station so the police could get involved.
There are other examples. The mentally disabled find train travel challenging and need help getting on and off. People in wheelchairs face similar problems. Lone women late at night will also need an independent witness to help them feel safe.
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
It's important to remember the 48%, because Brexit should not about satisfying the greatest number of Leave voters, but the greatest total number of voters.
Indeed and it looks like the median voter is moving towards the Norway option, at least temporarily rather than a forced choice of Remain or No Deal
Sky reporting that Hunts speech and tone is the start of senior ministers marginalising the ERG and uniting behind TM.
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
They people are absolutely clueless. But then these are also the people who want to ban automated trains (even if they are already automated).
Guards on trains are necessary because:
* They help the blind and mobility-impaired to get on and off trains * They enable tickets to be sold to those who have not purchased one * They act as witnesses to violent events and peacekeepers to prevent them * They provide aid to the distressed * They enable the train to leave the station safely by spotting problems.
Taking guards away from trains is like taking emergency parachutes away from parachutists.
We aren't talking about guards, talking about drivers. DLR is driverless, the underground could be made driverless.
According to last Labour manifesto, that would require somebody to sit there...a bit like lift attendants.
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
It's important to remember the 48%, because Brexit should not about satisfying the greatest number of Leave voters, but the greatest total number of voters.
Indeed and it looks like the median voter is moving towards the Norway option, at least temporarily rather than a forced choice of Remain or No Deal
Sky reporting that Hunts speech and tone is the start of senior ministers marginalising the ERG and uniting behind TM.
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
It's important to remember the 48%, because Brexit should not about satisfying the greatest number of Leave voters, but the greatest total number of voters.
Indeed and it looks like the median voter is moving towards the Norway option, at least temporarily rather than a forced choice of Remain or No Deal
Sky reporting that Hunts speech and tone is the start of senior ministers marginalising the ERG and uniting behind TM.
Jeremy Hunt compared the European Union to the Soviet Union as he warned Brussels: You cannot keep us prisoner.
The conference will be interesting to see how and if ministers marginalise Boris and row in behind TM
Todays speech by Hunt was terrific and the speeches from Ruth Davidson, other ministers, conservative mayoral candidate Shaun Bailey, a Windrush descendant, and TM speech itself will be interesting
See Javid and David Davis have both atttacked Boris's Irish bridge
Lord Digby Jones attacks Boris as a irrelevant and seriously offensive. Sky saying there is no doubt a great deal of bash Boris going on
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
They people are absolutely clueless. But then these are also the people who want to ban automated trains (even if they are already automated).
Guards on trains are necessary because:
* They help the blind and mobility-impaired to get on and off trains * They enable tickets to be sold to those who have not purchased one * They act as witnesses to violent events and peacekeepers to prevent them * They provide aid to the distressed * They enable the train to leave the station safely by spotting problems.
Taking guards away from trains is like taking emergency parachutes away from parachutists.
So the Vancouver metro system that has neither drivers or guards fails health and safety
I was talking about the common-or-garden trains, not metro/tube services, whose short journey times and frequent stops put them in a different category.
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
They people are absolutely clueless. But then these are also the people who want to ban automated trains (even if they are already automated).
Guards on trains are necessary because:
* They help the blind and mobility-impaired to get on and off trains * They enable tickets to be sold to those who have not purchased one * They act as witnesses to violent events and peacekeepers to prevent them * They provide aid to the distressed * They enable the train to leave the station safely by spotting problems.
Taking guards away from trains is like taking emergency parachutes away from parachutists.
So the Vancouver metro system that has neither drivers or guards fails health and safety
I was talking about the common-or-garden trains, not metro/tube services, whose short journey times and frequent stops put them in a different category.
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
They people are absolutely clueless. But then these are also the people who want to ban automated trains (even if they are already automated).
Guards on trains are necessary because:
* They help the blind and mobility-impaired to get on and off trains * They enable tickets to be sold to those who have not purchased one * They act as witnesses to violent events and peacekeepers to prevent them * They provide aid to the distressed * They enable the train to leave the station safely by spotting problems.
Taking guards away from trains is like taking emergency parachutes away from parachutists.
So the Vancouver metro system that has neither drivers or guards fails health and safety
I was talking about the common-or-garden trains, not metro/tube services, whose short journey times and frequent stops put them in a different category.
Driverless trains are the future
They have also recently started testing driverless street trams in Germany.
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
They people are absolutely clueless. But then these are also the people who want to ban automated trains (even if they are already automated).
Guards on trains are necessary because:
* They help the blind and mobility-impaired to get on and off trains * They enable tickets to be sold to those who have not purchased one * They act as witnesses to violent events and peacekeepers to prevent them * They provide aid to the distressed * They enable the train to leave the station safely by spotting problems.
Taking guards away from trains is like taking emergency parachutes away from parachutists.
So the Vancouver metro system that has neither drivers or guards fails health and safety
I was talking about the common-or-garden trains, not metro/tube services, whose short journey times and frequent stops put them in a different category.
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
It's important to remember the 48%, because Brexit should not about satisfying the greatest number of Leave voters, but the greatest total number of voters.
Indeed and it looks like the median voter is moving towards the Norway option, at least temporarily rather than a forced choice of Remain or No Deal
Sky reporting that Hunts speech and tone is the start of senior ministers marginalising the ERG and uniting behind TM.
Labour considers a plan where everyone would work 4 days but be paid for 5 with bosses required to pass on efficiency savings from new technology to workers
They people are absolutely clueless. But then these are also the people who want to ban automated trains (even if they are already automated).
Guards on trains are necessary because:
* They help the blind and mobility-impaired to get on and off trains * They enable tickets to be sold to those who have not purchased one * They act as witnesses to violent events and peacekeepers to prevent them * They provide aid to the distressed * They enable the train to leave the station safely by spotting problems.
Taking guards away from trains is like taking emergency parachutes away from parachutists.
So the Vancouver metro system that has neither drivers or guards fails health and safety
I was talking about the common-or-garden trains, not metro/tube services, whose short journey times and frequent stops put them in a different category.
Driverless trains are the future
...which doesn't mean they're good
I am perfectly happy with them. Far more so then cars
Why have the number of top level Scottish golfers declined in the way that top level Scottish footballers have ?
Expansion of the game and money. 1) Scottish golfers simply make up a far smaller proportion of the overall golfing population 2) It's much more expensive to play the game.
Hunt promises 'a true Brexit for the 52%' but 'a generous Brexit for the 48% too', he even mentions the end of discussions may not need to any Brexit at all. Looks like a clear shift back to the pro Deal and anti ERG camp on his part
It's important to remember the 48%, because Brexit should not about satisfying the greatest number of Leave voters, but the greatest total number of voters.
Indeed and it looks like the median voter is moving towards the Norway option, at least temporarily rather than a forced choice of Remain or No Deal
Sky reporting that Hunts speech and tone is the start of senior ministers marginalising the ERG and uniting behind TM.
At the moment you, European friends, seem to think the way to keep the club together is to punish a member who leaves, not just with economic disruption, but even by breaking up the United Kingdom with a border down the Irish Sea…
“The EU was set up to protect freedom – it was the Soviet Union that stopped people leaving. The lesson from history is clear – if you turn the EU club into a prison, the desire to get out of it won’t diminish, it will grow, and we won’t be the only prisoner that wants to escape…
Comments
Although the BBC presumably meant 'pâté' when they said Stenson was turning him into Patty.
Gets coat, heads off to the pub for Sunday evening pint.
The problem is that many of the courses are of a low standard that is the issue, and the pressure on faculty to pass any dullard.
(Joke !!! )
It would help if the two divisions lined up neatly, but they don’t:my research finds that only a third of pro-austerity voters, the basis of David Cameron’s 2015 majority, voted to remain in the EU, while nearly four in ten on the anti-austerity side voted to leave.
Hence, as I explain at greater length in today’s Mail on Sunday, the result of the last election, and the extreme difficulty for both sides of putting together an election-winning coalition as things stand. The prize for the first party to appeal beyond these two divides is obvious.'
https://www.conservativehome.com/thecolumnists/2018/09/lord-ashcrofts-conference-diary-how-leave-voters-reflect-good-humouredly-for-the-most-part-on-being-lablelled-knuckle-dragging-bigots.html
Interesting to see 40% of leftwing, statist voters voted Leave and a third of pro austerity fiscal conservatives were Remainers, showing that Brexit alone will not get a Tory majority as 2017 confirmed
"Europe Elects
@EuropeElects
4h4 hours ago
UK, BMG poll:
LAB-S&D: 40% (+2)
CON-ECR: 35% (-3)
LDEM-ALDE: 12% (+2)
UKIP-EFDD: 5%
Field work: 28/09/18 – 29/09/18
Sample size: 1,203"
I realise that Theresa May doesn’t want no deal. That is not sufficient to prevent it from happening. Our politicians and media need to stop acting as if Brexit is like a restaurant where we get to specify the ingredients and the EU will cook the meal. They have given us 2 unappealing choices, or we can leave with nothing. That is it.
Or she could consider how house prices and home ownership levels in Putney have changed since 2010.
I suspect there's a connection there between their unwillingness to play on European courses and their repeated shite performances when the Ryder Cup is held in Europe.
Perhaps when the negotiations fail, the heads of government of the 27 will make a unanimous offer of membership on existing terms. That could electrify the debate.
Those who want a compromise deal with the EU are a plurality amongst Tory Remain voters while hard Brexiteers make up a majority of Tory and Labour Leave voters and those who want a second referendum make up a majority of Labour Remain voters
https://www.conservativehome.com/platform/2018/09/lord-ashcroft-the-two-divides-austerity-brexit-and-the-problem-of-building-a-winning-coalition.html
Mind you the referendum would have to have a decisive answer or years of anger would follow
*just joking.
As today's Ashcroft poll shows there is no majority in the country that will accept No Deal and the same applies in Parliament, more voters support BINO Brexit or a second referendum combined than will accept hard Brexit and No Deal
Are you watching Boris - this is how it is done
Yes a sizeable 40% of voters will back No Deal rather than a second EU referendum or staying in the SM and CU but that is still far short of a majority
One of the team asked her if her next holiday was the 3rd or 4th that year.........
Many, many years back I worked as part of a team and we were all bemoaning about all things financial on a Friday afternoon. One of the young ladies who was complaining came in on the Monday and was excitedly telling everyone about the brand new car they had ordered at weekend......
Different people have different ideas of finding things tough it seems :-)
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/labour-party-work-four-days-be-paid-for-five-z3kqpzk5t
Britain Elects
@britainelects
Following Following @britainelects
More
Westminster voting intention:
LAB: 40% (+2)
CON: 35% (-3)
LDEM: 12% (+2)
UKIP: 5% (-)
via @BMGResearch, 28 - 29 Sep
Chgs. w/ 22 Sep
It would still be one day a week more than their brains are working at present.
Westminster voting intention:
LAB: 40% (+2)
CON: 35% (-3)
LDEM: 12% (+2)
UKIP: 5% (-)
via @BMGResearch, 28 - 29 Sep
Chgs. w/ 22 Sep
As HYUFD suggests, he might try to sell something generous for the 48 as there simply being a deal. That would be a bit cheeky - it is not as though no deal satisfied all of the 52 - but it's still a message that could have been pushed a lot harder than it has been for all this time.
He received a generous ovation
Trials elsewhere have deemed it effective haven't they
Oh wait. No it didn't.
And, here's the thing. Even if 90% of Conservative voters blame the EU, and only 10% blame the government, those are votes the Conservative Party can ill afford to lose.
Actually, since 2000 I'd say GB and Ireland could compete with the USA. Continental Europe might struggle without GB, however.
I point out she is arguing against driver operating only trains, when the next generation of train won’t even need a driver never mind a guard.
* They help the blind and mobility-impaired to get on and off trains
* They enable tickets to be sold to those who have not purchased one
* They act as witnesses to violent events and peacekeepers to prevent them
* They provide aid to the distressed
* They enable the train to leave the station safely by spotting problems.
Taking guards away from trains is like taking emergency parachutes away from parachutists.
To give a real-life example: recently I witnessed an altercation between two groups of youth which involved a lot of pushing, shoving, bottle-throwing and threats of stabbing. One of the parties was left on the train and was alternately angry and (as the shock kicked in) considerably distressed. The guard stepped in, handled the situation and restored order, and got the traveller to another guard at the next station so the police could get involved.
There are other examples. The mentally disabled find train travel challenging and need help getting on and off. People in wheelchairs face similar problems. Lone women late at night will also need an independent witness to help them feel safe.
And so on.
Jeremy Hunt compared the European Union to the Soviet Union as he warned Brussels: You cannot keep us prisoner.
According to last Labour manifesto, that would require somebody to sit there...a bit like lift attendants.
*innocent face*
Todays speech by Hunt was terrific and the speeches from Ruth Davidson, other ministers, conservative mayoral candidate Shaun Bailey, a Windrush descendant, and TM speech itself will be interesting
See Javid and David Davis have both atttacked Boris's Irish bridge
Lord Digby Jones attacks Boris as a irrelevant and seriously offensive. Sky saying there is no doubt a great deal of bash Boris going on
Why have the number of top level Scottish golfers declined in the way that top level Scottish footballers have ?
At the moment you, European friends, seem to think the way to keep the club together is to punish a member who leaves, not just with economic disruption, but even by breaking up the United Kingdom with a border down the Irish Sea…
“The EU was set up to protect freedom – it was the Soviet Union that stopped people leaving. The lesson from history is clear – if you turn the EU club into a prison, the desire to get out of it won’t diminish, it will grow, and we won’t be the only prisoner that wants to escape…