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  • Options
    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    Talking of idiocy, Nadine Dorries is up now.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,797
    TOPPING said:

    Nigelb said:

    Question - why are Labour MPs being whipped to vote against our own emergency debate motion?

    Answer - because Corbyn is a wassock

    I've always spelt it as 'wazzock'

    I'm so confused now.
    No, you were right. Yorkshire and Lancashire agree on the point, so it must be correct.

    (I think 'wassock' is some Midland dialect... and autocorrect tries to change it to cassock.)
    Derbyshire votes "wazzock".
    Hertfordshire would spell it wazzock too
    It is Wazzock. What is this ridiculous "Wassock"? FFS.

    Me duck.
    It is a thing, apparently (note the typo...):
    https://www.collinsdictionary.com/submission/4628/WASSOCK
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,967
    rcs1000 said:

    There's a big Green vote to squeeze in Childs Hill, and I suspect it was one of the most Remain wards in the country. There will also be a substantial number of EU professionals in the ward, who might wish to register a protest vote.

    For this reason, I'm going to disagree with OGH: I think Childs Hill will go from two Conservative councillors to zero - whether the beneficiary will be the LibDems or the Labour Party is another matter altogether.

    Barnet as a whole was strongly Remain, but the Conservatives still led 47% to 45% across the borough last year. Populus reckons the Conservatives led in Childs Hill. The Green vote is not as big as it appears in percentage terms, as they only stood one candidate out of three.
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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    edited April 2018
    Prince William is getting with the Corbyn future. Says he likes Nandos and talking issues of gender politics.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-5624359/Prince-William-reveals-hes-fan-NANDOS.html
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,005
    Mr. Labour, I'd sooner vote for Boris to be PM than Corbyn. And Boris isn't fit to be Foreign Secretary.

    Corbyn's the far left. He, and his sinister chums, are as reprehensible as the far right (who would not be so softly indulged for marching in front of swastikas and Hitler portraits as Corbyn has been for communist flags and Lenin/Stalin).
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,967



    Surely Rudd could have told the officials to apply an element of common sense?

    Both the policy and its implementation were minister-led. This is not some junior administrative bungle. In the current climate, common sense is not required - mindless cruelty against outsiders is to be preferred.

    The problem is not just immigration, bureaucrats not caring about people and just ticking boxes is a wide problem across society.

    It's not necessarily the bureaucrats fault, as if they do show some common sense, they can then be penalised themselves.

    It's a mess. And people get hurt.

    The problem is not just immigration. But immigration is a place where it's particularly visible and where by and large the system's cruelties are condoned by the public.

    It's that sentiment that secured Brexit, with a campaign of xenophobic lies, and reinforced this behaviour by the government who could act against poor, marginalised people without consequence. The yelps from some Leavers are crocodile tears: they played a large part in contributing to this problem.

    There will be no ministerial resignations. Conservatives simply don't care enough about this to force one, when it comes down to it.
    Conservative voters do care about it, so far as we can tell. They don't care sufficiently to wish to bring down the government over it.
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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    40% of London voted leave. The SNP underperformed the yes to independence vote by 8% at the last election.
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    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    edited April 2018
    Nigelb said:

    Deliberately pursuing a policy without giving much, if any thought to its likely effects on the most vulnerable, then.
    The years of official indifference to reports of such problems is equally offensive.

    And isn't that what impact assessments are supposed to be about ?

    Of course they have given thought to the effects of their policies, which have been very successful. As you will know, since 2010 many hundreds of thousands of disabled people have been helped into work, and benefits payments have been increased for the most badly disabled.

    And they are not resting on their laurels:

    https://www.gov.uk/government/news/strategy-seeks-one-million-more-disabled-people-in-work-by-2027
  • Options
    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238

    40% of London voted leave. The SNP underperformed the yes to independence vote by 8% at the last election.
    And over performed yes to independence by 5% in 2015.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    Sean_F said:



    Surely Rudd could have told the officials to apply an element of common sense?

    Both the policy and its implementation were minister-led. This is not some junior administrative bungle. In the current climate, common sense is not required - mindless cruelty against outsiders is to be preferred.

    The problem is not just immigration, bureaucrats not caring about people and just ticking boxes is a wide problem across society.

    It's not necessarily the bureaucrats fault, as if they do show some common sense, they can then be penalised themselves.

    It's a mess. And people get hurt.

    The problem is not just immigration. But immigration is a place where it's particularly visible and where by and large the system's cruelties are condoned by the public.

    It's that sentiment that secured Brexit, with a campaign of xenophobic lies, and reinforced this behaviour by the government who could act against poor, marginalised people without consequence. The yelps from some Leavers are crocodile tears: they played a large part in contributing to this problem.

    There will be no ministerial resignations. Conservatives simply don't care enough about this to force one, when it comes down to it.
    Conservative voters do care about it, so far as we can tell. They don't care sufficiently to wish to bring down the government over it.
    Yep and what are a few ruined lives in the mix?
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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    Johnny Mercer on his feet now.
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,967

    40% of London voted leave. The SNP underperformed the yes to independence vote by 8% at the last election.
    32% is about where I'd expect the Conservatives' vote share in London to be this time. By comparison, it was 31% in 1994, 32% in 1998, 34% in 2002, 35% in 2006, 34% in 2010, and 26% in 2010 (depressed by the UKIP vote share).
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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    edited April 2018
    If I heard correctly (was distracted), Johnny Mercer against War Powers Act in case parliament voted against military action.
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    oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,831

    Tools. Let the couple enjoy their happy day.

    This is like the Westboro Church protesting at military funerals

    https://twitter.com/chrisshipitv/status/986236513582178311?s=21

    They should let the gays and the old ladies enjoy the occasion and not ruin their day.
    Why the casual homophobia???
    Looks in mirror. Nah!
    Then why 'the gays' and not 'us gays' or some other more positive use of language?
    FFS. I am from Scotland. I promise in future to say "we Scots" rather than "the Scots". Do not throw your crap at me.
    I simply wanted to know why you chose to use 'the gays' - which is a form of language that can be seen to diminish gay people. I am not throwing crap - I am just disappointed that you chose to use that way to express yourself.
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,823
    Sean_F said:

    rcs1000 said:

    There's a big Green vote to squeeze in Childs Hill, and I suspect it was one of the most Remain wards in the country. There will also be a substantial number of EU professionals in the ward, who might wish to register a protest vote.

    For this reason, I'm going to disagree with OGH: I think Childs Hill will go from two Conservative councillors to zero - whether the beneficiary will be the LibDems or the Labour Party is another matter altogether.

    Barnet as a whole was strongly Remain, but the Conservatives still led 47% to 45% across the borough last year. Populus reckons the Conservatives led in Childs Hill. The Green vote is not as big as it appears in percentage terms, as they only stood one candidate out of three.
    The Borough looks finely balanced, and Childs Hill could easily be LD gains.

    I reckon the 12/1 with Shadsy on NoC is worth a punt.
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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    Twitter is going down on and off. Mad Vlad's cyber war has started.
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    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    A debate where the Leader of the Opposition plans to vote against his own motion, and where no-one quite seems to know what the vote is about, isn't a terribly effective way of promoting the idea that parliament should have a veto on action.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,001
    Tw@tter down!

    Twitter is going down on and off. Mad Vlad's cyber war has started.

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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,146
    This is unbelievable, and was published by the Home Office in 2013.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coming-home-to-jamaica-guide
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,823

    If I heard correctly (was distracted), Johnny Mercer against War Powers Act in case parliament voted against military action.

    Well, that would be the risk!

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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,967
    Foxy said:

    Sean_F said:

    rcs1000 said:

    There's a big Green vote to squeeze in Childs Hill, and I suspect it was one of the most Remain wards in the country. There will also be a substantial number of EU professionals in the ward, who might wish to register a protest vote.

    For this reason, I'm going to disagree with OGH: I think Childs Hill will go from two Conservative councillors to zero - whether the beneficiary will be the LibDems or the Labour Party is another matter altogether.

    Barnet as a whole was strongly Remain, but the Conservatives still led 47% to 45% across the borough last year. Populus reckons the Conservatives led in Childs Hill. The Green vote is not as big as it appears in percentage terms, as they only stood one candidate out of three.
    The Borough looks finely balanced, and Childs Hill could easily be LD gains.

    I reckon the 12/1 with Shadsy on NoC is worth a punt.
    That looks good value as well.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068

    rcs1000 said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    If this is true, Rudd must go.
    It happened in 2010.
    But she is Home Secretary now. It's her job to take one for her boss.
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    AndrewAndrew Posts: 2,900

    Twitter is going down on and off. Mad Vlad's cyber war has started.

    Use Tweetdeck (tweetdeck.twitter.com). It often stays up when the main twitter site crashes, and it's vastly more usable, plus no adverts.
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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238

    Tools. Let the couple enjoy their happy day.

    This is like the Westboro Church protesting at military funerals

    https://twitter.com/chrisshipitv/status/986236513582178311?s=21

    They should let the gays and the old ladies enjoy the occasion and not ruin their day.
    Why the casual homophobia???
    Looks in mirror. Nah!
    Then why 'the gays' and not 'us gays' or some other more positive use of language?
    FFS. I am from Scotland. I promise in future to say "we Scots" rather than "the Scots". Do not throw your crap at me.
    I simply wanted to know why you chose to use 'the gays' - which is a form of language that can be seen to diminish gay people. I am not throwing crap - I am just disappointed that you chose to use that way to express yourself.
    I speak as I speak. If you do not like it, Edmund in Tokyo has a computer programme where you can block having to read my contributions if they disturb you so much. I was going to write a sentence including the words "Johnny Mercer" and "Pregabalin", but I decided not to in case it upset anyone.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,001

    This is unbelievable, and was published by the Home Office in 2013.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coming-home-to-jamaica-guide

    "I say
    I don't like cricket oh no"
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,001
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    If this is true, Rudd must go.
    It happened in 2010.
    But she is Home Secretary now. It's her job to take one for her boss.
    Rudd did that in the debates, she was also dealing with a personal tragedy at the time. I definitely think she needs to stay in post - at least till Gauke resigns over the Worboys stuff !
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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    Corbyn hater, Ian Dunt on Theresa May.

    Ian Dunt
    ‏Verified account @IanDunt
    22m22 minutes ago

    This is her Brexit communications strategy projected up onto foreign policy: total secrecy and full freedom for the government, or else it helps the enemy.

    https://twitter.com/IanDunt/status/986246518465269766
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    DadgeDadge Posts: 2,038

    On topic, from someone else with a keen interest in this:

    https://twitter.com/LadPolitics/status/986234885823016960

    LD is the spoiler. I expect LD to comfortably outperform their GE opinion poll ratings, especially across the south.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Nigelb said:

    Question - why are Labour MPs being whipped to vote against our own emergency debate motion?

    Answer - because Corbyn is a wassock

    I've always spelt it as 'wazzock'

    I'm so confused now.
    No, you were right. Yorkshire and Lancashire agree on the point, so it must be correct.

    (I think 'wassock' is some Midland dialect... and autocorrect tries to change it to cassock.)
    Wassock / Wazzock spelling row. What do you think started the War of the Roses?
    The War of the Rozes you mean?
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,146
    Apologies, that “Going Home to Jamaica” guide seems to have come from the FCO.
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,967
    Dadge said:

    On topic, from someone else with a keen interest in this:

    https://twitter.com/LadPolitics/status/986234885823016960

    LD is the spoiler. I expect LD to comfortably outperform their GE opinion poll ratings, especially across the south.
    They usually do.
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    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981

    This is unbelievable, and was published by the Home Office in 2013.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coming-home-to-jamaica-guide

    ”From: Foreign & Commonwealth Office” on the front page is a false flag ruse, I take it.

    ”compliments” for ”complements” is disappointing.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Tory candidate in Hoxton suspended for anti-Muslim posts on social media

    Alexander van Terheyden went to a far-right rally and has defended the crusades

    https://twitter.com/j_bloodworth/status/986234589294161920?s=21

    “Defending the crusades” is now thought crime? His rationale for the defence was ahistorical (aka bollocks) as I doubt he’s familiar with the argument that the Reconquista should be classified as a Crusade, but that doesn’t mean you can shut it down as an argument.
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    AndrewAndrew Posts: 2,900
    edited April 2018
    Charles said:


    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister

    I note the article only says they were destroyed in October, but doesn't say when the decision was taken. The general election was only a few months before .....
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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    Andrew said:

    Charles said:


    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister

    I note the article only says they were destroyed in October, but doesn't say when the decision was taken. The general election was only a few months before .....
    The Home Secretary before the 2010 election was Alan Johnson, leader of the successful Labour remain campaign. Before him, it was Jacqui Smith.
  • Options
    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,990

    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
    Perhaps HMG hasn't heard of document scanners? Blimey...
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    YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 4,382
    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    True , However the policy in regard to document retention should be .In the Police , the heads of departments would sign it off.Also in today's world any document destroyed would be scanned and linked to a reference number.Nevertheless previously the storage of old paper records was lamentable .
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    RobD said:

    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
    Perhaps HMG hasn't heard of document scanners? Blimey...
    These are the people that want to read your WhatsApp messages
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,967
    Charles said:

    Tory candidate in Hoxton suspended for anti-Muslim posts on social media

    Alexander van Terheyden went to a far-right rally and has defended the crusades

    https://twitter.com/j_bloodworth/status/986234589294161920?s=21

    “Defending the crusades” is now thought crime? His rationale for the defence was ahistorical (aka bollocks) as I doubt he’s familiar with the argument that the Reconquista should be classified as a Crusade, but that doesn’t mean you can shut it down as an argument.
    A Tory candidate shouldn't go to a rally organised by Tommy Robinson.

    I don't see anything in his stated opinions that is beyond the pale, though. In fact, several posters here make similar points.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
    I understand government better than you. That’s much more important than the political w*nkery that excites you so much
  • Options
    On Salisbury the BBC and Sky are reporting that large areas of pavers and the grass in the park adjacent to the shops will have to be lifted and removed to ensure decontamination. This is far beyond what I would think anyone expected. In all there are 9 separate sites for decontamination
  • Options
    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    Have fun everyone. Bye for now.
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,880
    edited April 2018
    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,164

    Prince William is getting with the Corbyn future. Says he likes Nandos and talking issues of gender politics.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-5624359/Prince-William-reveals-hes-fan-NANDOS.html

    If he could vote Prince William would probably be a LD like his father, indeed Charles likely agrees with Corbyn and the Greens on many environmental issues and scepticism of big corporations and US foreign policy. Harry is probably a Tory though
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,227

    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
    I would be interested to know, nonetheless:-

    - who gave the order for these records to be destroyed
    - when
    - the reason for the decision
    - whether it was a default decision
    - whether the decision was reviewed or escalated to any Minister shortly before destruction.

    Perhaps some MP or journalist might make such inquiries rather than emoting all the time. The facts are usually more useful and interesting than the products of fevered and partisan imaginations.
  • Options
    Charles said:

    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
    I understand government better than you. That’s much more important than the political w*nkery that excites you so much
    This is a political betting site.

    It is the sort of thing that does excite.

    Or do you think Amber Rudd moving from 33/1 to 6/1 as next out of the cabinet shouldn’t be discussed?
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,967

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,880
    Cyclefree said:

    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
    I would be interested to know, nonetheless:-

    - who gave the order for these records to be destroyed
    - when
    - the reason for the decision
    - whether it was a default decision
    - whether the decision was reviewed or escalated to any Minister shortly before destruction.

    Perhaps some MP or journalist might make such inquiries rather than emoting all the time. The facts are usually more useful and interesting than the products of fevered and partisan imaginations.
    Indeed.
    I’m no fan of Rudd, but calls for her to resign seem rather stupid.

    Again though, we are relying on the media, too busy hatching click bait to worry about the detail - and the Opposition, who prefers to give succour to our enemies.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,164
    Cyclefree said:

    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
    I would be interested to know, nonetheless:-

    - who gave the order for these records to be destroyed
    - when
    - the reason for the decision
    - whether it was a default decision
    - whether the decision was reviewed or escalated to any Minister shortly before destruction.

    Perhaps some MP or journalist might make such inquiries rather than emoting all the time. The facts are usually more useful and interesting than the products of fevered and partisan imaginations.
    I presume it was the Home Office Records Manager or Archivist as I work in that field but it should have been agreed with the owner of the records beforehand and any statutory rate room time in accordance with the Home Office retention schedule
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,880
    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
  • Options
    YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 4,382
    Cyclefree said:

    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
    I would be interested to know, nonetheless:-

    - who gave the order for these records to be destroyed
    - when
    - the reason for the decision
    - whether it was a default decision
    - whether the decision was reviewed or escalated to any Minister shortly before destruction.

    Perhaps some MP or journalist might make such inquiries rather than emoting all the time. The facts are usually more useful and interesting than the products of fevered and partisan imaginations.

    Most departments should have a destruction policy.Surprised if recent they were not scanned and linked on their computer systems.For example a Police Murder Enquiry would have a keep order for 100 years .
  • Options
    Corbyn loses again - 317 - 256
  • Options
    YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 4,382

    On Salisbury the BBC and Sky are reporting that large areas of pavers and the grass in the park adjacent to the shops will have to be lifted and removed to ensure decontamination. This is far beyond what I would think anyone expected. In all there are 9 separate sites for decontamination

    Big g if this goes on and gets worse Surely there will be calls for England not to participate in the world cup in Russia in June this year.
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Sean_F said:

    Charles said:

    Tory candidate in Hoxton suspended for anti-Muslim posts on social media

    Alexander van Terheyden went to a far-right rally and has defended the crusades

    https://twitter.com/j_bloodworth/status/986234589294161920?s=21

    “Defending the crusades” is now thought crime? His rationale for the defence was ahistorical (aka bollocks) as I doubt he’s familiar with the argument that the Reconquista should be classified as a Crusade, but that doesn’t mean you can shut it down as an argument.
    A Tory candidate shouldn't go to a rally organised by Tommy Robinson.

    I don't see anything in his stated opinions that is beyond the pale, though. In fact, several posters here make similar points.
    Agreed. And quoting articles from Gates of Vienna a little dubious as well.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,967

    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
    I don't feel the need to beat my breast about what a horrible country this is.
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,880
    Who the fuck signed this off?

    ‘Deportation is not a sentence or punishment but a second chance to build a new life and make a meaningful contribution to build the nation.’

    From govt 'coming home to Jamaica' booklet.
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Charles said:

    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
    I understand government better than you. That’s much more important than the political w*nkery that excites you so much
    This is a political betting site.

    It is the sort of thing that does excite.

    Or do you think Amber Rudd moving from 33/1 to 6/1 as next out of the cabinet shouldn’t be discussed?
    You seem to have more of a personal chip on your shoulder where it comes to May. I suspect you have seen your hopes of preferment dashed with Osborne’s fall from grace
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,164

    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
    We are one of the most densely populated nations in the world, people are complaining about too high demand for housing pushing up house prices and putting pressure on the greenbelt etc.

    In some respects we need more emigrants not immigrants, there is a reason the largest destination for UK emigrants is Australia, it is one of the least densely populated nations in the world with better weather
  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    Yorkcity said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Charles said:

    ...
    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
    I would be interested to know, nonetheless:-

    - who gave the order for these records to be destroyed
    - when
    - the reason for the decision
    - whether it was a default decision
    - whether the decision was reviewed or escalated to any Minister shortly before destruction.

    Perhaps some MP or journalist might make such inquiries rather than emoting all the time. The facts are usually more useful and interesting than the products of fevered and partisan imaginations.

    Most departments should have a destruction policy.Surprised if recent they were not scanned and linked on their computer systems.For example a Police Murder Enquiry would have a keep order for 100 years .
    A lot of the older immigration docs are made available online via the National Archives. If these were the ONLY COPY IN EXISTENCE this is a waste for more reasons than one.
  • Options
    Yorkcity said:

    On Salisbury the BBC and Sky are reporting that large areas of pavers and the grass in the park adjacent to the shops will have to be lifted and removed to ensure decontamination. This is far beyond what I would think anyone expected. In all there are 9 separate sites for decontamination

    Big g if this goes on and gets worse Surely there will be calls for England not to participate in the world cup in Russia in June this year.
    It must be possible - indeed I find it difficult to jusify being there but having a lifetime of following football I can understand why supporters want to go.

    They are talking of taking to Christmas and goodness knows what happens to the businesses
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Guff
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,880
    edited April 2018
    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
    I don't feel the need to beat my breast about what a horrible country this is.
    Well time to give your flabby white man breasts a paddle, because Windrush stinks.
  • Options
    Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 4,819

    Nigelb said:

    Question - why are Labour MPs being whipped to vote against our own emergency debate motion?

    Answer - because Corbyn is a wassock

    I've always spelt it as 'wazzock'

    I'm so confused now.
    No, you were right. Yorkshire and Lancashire agree on the point, so it must be correct.

    (I think 'wassock' is some Midland dialect... and autocorrect tries to change it to cassock.)
    Derbyshire votes "wazzock".
    -Looks on Wikipedia-

    -Derbyshire constituencies almost evenly split between Conservative and Labour-


    Fair enough. Some might think you're being harsh on the Big Two parties, but I can see where you're coming from.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763
    Charles said:

    Charles said:

    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
    I understand government better than you. That’s much more important than the political w*nkery that excites you so much
    This is a political betting site.

    It is the sort of thing that does excite.

    Or do you think Amber Rudd moving from 33/1 to 6/1 as next out of the cabinet shouldn’t be discussed?
    You seem to have more of a personal chip on your shoulder where it comes to May. I suspect you have seen your hopes of preferment dashed with Osborne’s fall from grace
    He spent years kissing the wrong butt and cant move on
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,880

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Guff
    Another Pb Tory with his head in the sand.
  • Options
    YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 4,382
    RobD said:

    Charles said:

    The Home Office destroyed thousands of landing card slips recording Windrush immigrants’ arrival dates in the UK, despite staff warnings that the move would make it harder to check the records of older Caribbean-born residents experiencing residency difficulties.

    A former Home Office employee said the records, stored in the basement of a government tower block, were a vital resource for case workers when they were asked to find information about someone’s arrival date in the UK from the West Indies – usually when the individual was struggling to resolve immigration status problems.

    Although the home secretary, Amber Rudd, has promised to make it easier for Windrush-generation residents to regularise their status, the destruction of the database is likely to make the process harder, even with the support of the new taskforce announced this week.

    The former employee (who has asked for his name not to be printed) said it was decided in 2010 to destroy the disembarkation cards, which dated back to the 1950s and 60s, when the Home Office’s Whitgift Centre in Croydon was closed and the staff were moved to another site. Employees in his department told their managers it was a bad idea, because these papers were often the last remaining record of a person’s arrival date, in the event of uncertainty or lost documents.

    The files were destroyed in October that year, when Theresa May was Home Secretary


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/17/home-office-destroyed-windrush-landing-cards-says-ex-staffer?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    Desperate to blame her aren’t you?

    Document retention decisions would get nowhere near a minister
    You don’t understand how the world of politics works do you?

    Perceptions matter more than the facts on occasion.

    It happened on her watch.
    Perhaps HMG hasn't heard of document scanners? Blimey...
    When I had to deal with the Immigration Service , in a professional capacity.They did not fill me full of confidence.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,967

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
    I don't feel the need to beat my breast about what a horrible country this is.
    Well time to give your flabby white man breasts a paddle, because Windrush stinks.
    I'll leave the emoting to you. You like it.
  • Options
    Charles said:


    You seem to have more of a personal chip on your shoulder where it comes to May. I suspect you have seen your hopes of preferment dashed with Osborne’s fall from grace

    Nah, I care about my country and my party, and Mrs May is proving to be a piss poor steward of both.

    But interesting that you couldn't rebut me on the substance of my posts but decided to play the man not the ball.

    Quite frankly I never had any expectations of preferment, I really don't fancy working/living in London again, plus I couldn't afford the pay cut working on a government salary.

    Shoes aren't cheap nor is the rest of my wardrobe.
  • Options
    Anti Semitism debate live now
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,880
    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
    I don't feel the need to beat my breast about what a horrible country this is.
    Well time to give your flabby white man breasts a paddle, because Windrush stinks.
    I'll leave the emoting to you. You like it.
    Not at all. I’m simply pointing out that many on here who now profess to be disturbed by Windrush have spent the last few years denying the lived reality of migrants to this country, especially since Brexit.

    It’s no fun to have your state-hood under threat.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Guff
    Another Pb Tory with his head in the sand.
    Well I suppose that's progress of sorts normally you default to calling everyone a kipper
  • Options

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
    I don't feel the need to beat my breast about what a horrible country this is.
    Well time to give your flabby white man breasts a paddle, because Windrush stinks.
    I'll leave the emoting to you. You like it.
    Not at all. I’m simply pointing out that many on here who now profess to be disturbed by Windrush have spent the last few years denying the lived reality of migrants to this country, especially since Brexit.

    It’s no fun to have your state-hood under threat.
    I am not one of them
  • Options

    Anti Semitism debate live now

    This is getting highly charged
  • Options
    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,790
    Callous incompetence and obstruction for the sake of it are features, not bugs of the UK immigration "service". That's the key thing to understand. Mrs May's involvement was and remains to make it even more impossible to deal with.
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,880

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
    I don't feel the need to beat my breast about what a horrible country this is.
    Well time to give your flabby white man breasts a paddle, because Windrush stinks.
    I'll leave the emoting to you. You like it.
    Not at all. I’m simply pointing out that many on here who now profess to be disturbed by Windrush have spent the last few years denying the lived reality of migrants to this country, especially since Brexit.

    It’s no fun to have your state-hood under threat.
    I am not one of them
    No, Big G. You are not. You’ve been a very honest broker these past few days and your instinct on both Windrush and Corbyn has been faultless.

    You’re keeping the whole site together half the time.
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,880

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Guff
    Another Pb Tory with his head in the sand.
    Well I suppose that's progress of sorts normally you default to calling everyone a kipper
    Nope. Only Tyndall. And he admits it.
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    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
    I don't feel the need to beat my breast about what a horrible country this is.
    Well time to give your flabby white man breasts a paddle, because Windrush stinks.
    I'll leave the emoting to you. You like it.
    Not at all. I’m simply pointing out that many on here who now profess to be disturbed by Windrush have spent the last few years denying the lived reality of migrants to this country, especially since Brexit.

    It’s no fun to have your state-hood under threat.
    I am not one of them
    No, Big G. You are not. You’ve been a very honest broker these past few days and your instinct on both Windrush and Corbyn has been faultless.

    You’re keeping the whole site together half the time.
    That is a very kind comment - thank you
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
    I don't feel the need to beat my breast about what a horrible country this is.
    Well time to give your flabby white man breasts a paddle, because Windrush stinks.
    I'll leave the emoting to you. You like it.
    Not at all. I’m simply pointing out that many on here who now profess to be disturbed by Windrush have spent the last few years denying the lived reality of migrants to this country, especially since Brexit.

    It’s no fun to have your state-hood under threat.
    maybe if people like yourself stopped scare mongering on everything and let the process sort itself out migrants would sleep easier. Winding people up for the sake of it rarely leads to chillaxing.
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    YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 4,382

    Yorkcity said:

    On Salisbury the BBC and Sky are reporting that large areas of pavers and the grass in the park adjacent to the shops will have to be lifted and removed to ensure decontamination. This is far beyond what I would think anyone expected. In all there are 9 separate sites for decontamination

    Big g if this goes on and gets worse Surely there will be calls for England not to participate in the world cup in Russia in June this year.
    It must be possible - indeed I find it difficult to jusify being there but having a lifetime of following football I can understand why supporters want to go.

    They are talking of taking to Christmas and goodness knows what happens to the businesses
    I am the same as you as a football supporter , totally understand they want to go to a world cup.However if this goes on and on , it will have the feel of a previous English team in 1938.http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/3128202.stm
  • Options
    another_richardanother_richard Posts: 25,132
    I see redundancies in the Dec-Feb quarter were at their lowest level for this period and the sixth lowest on record.

    Page 10 of the linked spreadsheet:

    https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/employmentandemployeetypes/datasets/summaryoflabourmarketstatistics

    Now the much reported retail apocalypse might still be working itself through the system but so far doesn't seem to be having a noticeable effect on employment
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,227
    Can I praise one bit of government. I received my VAT refund - following my first VAT return (yay!) - within a week of filing. Most impressive. And welcome.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,967
    Cyclefree said:

    Can I praise one bit of government. I received my VAT refund - following my first VAT return (yay!) - within a week of filing. Most impressive. And welcome.

    The former Customs and Excise is pretty efficient, in my experience.
  • Options
    another_richardanother_richard Posts: 25,132
    Two years ago:

    ' The threat of a potential vote to leave the EU in June could be partly to blame for the first rise in unemployment in seven months, the work and pensions secretary has warned.

    Stephen Crabb said the latest labour report, which showed the unemployment total rose by 21,000 in the three months to February to 1.7 million, was a signal that the looming EU referendum vote was hitting the jobs market. '

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/apr/20/uk-unemployment-rises-and-pay-growth-falls

    Today unemployment is down to 1.4 million.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Charles said:


    You seem to have more of a personal chip on your shoulder where it comes to May. I suspect you have seen your hopes of preferment dashed with Osborne’s fall from grace

    Nah, I care about my country and my party, and Mrs May is proving to be a piss poor steward of both.

    But interesting that you couldn't rebut me on the substance of my posts but decided to play the man not the ball.

    Quite frankly I never had any expectations of preferment, I really don't fancy working/living in London again, plus I couldn't afford the pay cut working on a government salary.

    Shoes aren't cheap nor is the rest of my wardrobe.
    You quoted an article which was broadly interesting background but highlighted one comment that - while factually accurate - was irrelevant to the detail. Purely, in my view, in an attempt to apportion blame. I’m not sure what other substance there was.

    As for country she seems to be navigating towards an ok outcome in Brexit. My view has always been - and remains - that there will be a lot of guff in public but in the background serious folks will work towards a sensible outcome.

    On the party she’s managing it ok especially given the times.

    Her big failure was clearly the election, which showed up her weaknesses and (sadly) has probably resulted in some interesting policies being unsellable in future. But she will pay for it with her job in due course.

    And Osborne has proved himself a petty minded individual by his conduct.
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,880

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
    I don't feel the need to beat my breast about what a horrible country this is.
    Well time to give your flabby white man breasts a paddle, because Windrush stinks.
    I'll leave the emoting to you. You like it.
    Not at all. I’m simply pointing out that many on here who now profess to be disturbed by Windrush have spent the last few years denying the lived reality of migrants to this country, especially since Brexit.

    It’s no fun to have your state-hood under threat.
    maybe if people like yourself stopped scare mongering on everything and let the process sort itself out migrants would sleep easier. Winding people up for the sake of it rarely leads to chillaxing.
    Who is scaremongering?

    The government has consistently failed to reassure migrants to this country and in fact has seldom missed a chance to disturb them.

    I like this country because, by and large, it is tolerant. Sadly, Brexit (via a whole range of actors and effects) turned the dial in the other direction and the government has never bothered to think about what that means to many people in this country, not to mention perceptions abroad.
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,227

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
    I don't feel the need to beat my breast about what a horrible country this is.
    Well time to give your flabby white man breasts a paddle, because Windrush stinks.
    I'll leave the emoting to you. You like it.
    Not at all. I’m simply pointing out that many on here who now profess to be disturbed by Windrush have spent the last few years denying the lived reality of migrants to this country, especially since Brexit.

    It’s no fun to have your state-hood under threat.
    I am not one of them
    No, Big G. You are not. You’ve been a very honest broker these past few days and your instinct on both Windrush and Corbyn has been faultless.

    You’re keeping the whole site together half the time.
    Mr Big G is the sort of Conservative who gives them their good name and of whom we need more. Ready to call out his own party, willing to give credit to others and fundamentally decent.

  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    Sean_F said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Can I praise one bit of government. I received my VAT refund - following my first VAT return (yay!) - within a week of filing. Most impressive. And welcome.

    The former Customs and Excise is pretty efficient, in my experience.
    Depends on the team.
  • Options
    Cyclefree said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    Sean_F said:

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Yet, over the past few years, people have continued to emigrate here in large numbers, so there must be something attractive about living here.
    Typical little England complacency.
    Just one logical step from, “piss off home if you don’t like it.”
    I don't feel the need to beat my breast about what a horrible country this is.
    Well time to give your flabby white man breasts a paddle, because Windrush stinks.
    I'll leave the emoting to you. You like it.
    Not at all. I’m simply pointing out that many on here who now profess to be disturbed by Windrush have spent the last few years denying the lived reality of migrants to this country, especially since Brexit.

    It’s no fun to have your state-hood under threat.
    I am not one of them
    No, Big G. You are not. You’ve been a very honest broker these past few days and your instinct on both Windrush and Corbyn has been faultless.

    You’re keeping the whole site together half the time.
    Mr Big G is the sort of Conservative who gives them their good name and of whom we need more. Ready to call out his own party, willing to give credit to others and fundamentally decent.

    You are so kind
  • Options
    Labour turning on Livingstone
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,426
    Wow.

    Labour literally tearing itself apart in parliament by looks of it.
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    glwglw Posts: 9,554

    Two years ago:

    ' The threat of a potential vote to leave the EU in June could be partly to blame for the first rise in unemployment in seven months, the work and pensions secretary has warned.

    Stephen Crabb said the latest labour report, which showed the unemployment total rose by 21,000 in the three months to February to 1.7 million, was a signal that the looming EU referendum vote was hitting the jobs market. '

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/apr/20/uk-unemployment-rises-and-pay-growth-falls

    Today unemployment is down to 1.4 million.

    Did Project Fear get any prediction right?
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    MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584

    An article by Lord Ashcroft of Polls

    "Brexit Britain won’t forget its old friends"

    http://lordashcroftpolls.com/2018/04/brexit-britain-wont-forget-old-friends/

  • Options
    Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 31,014

    It is heartening to see the widespread public revulsion in reaction to the Windrush scandal - a revulsion that cuts across age and party affiliation.

    But think, ye PB Brexiters, what it has felt like these past few years to be a non British born migrant. Or, one married to a non British born spouse.

    *Would you trust the British government to look after you and your family?*

    Brexit remains the canker in the rose.

    Guff
    Another Pb Tory with his head in the sand.
    Well I suppose that's progress of sorts normally you default to calling everyone a kipper
    Nope. Only Tyndall. And he admits it.
    I've not been a Kipper since July 2016. But then I certainly wouldn't be a Tory either.

    And on the Windrush issue it just confirms to me both how bad a PM May is and how idiotic our immigration rules are.

    But then I am in a tiny minority that opposes limits on migration anyway.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,426
    edited April 2018
    "Those who deny the holocaust need calling out" - Gwynne.

    So why doesn't or didn't Corbyn when he read exactly that view on his precious Facebook groups?
This discussion has been closed.