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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » At least one of the final polls, surely, will have got GE2017

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  • Options
    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    I was having a browse for last minute bargains and this caught my eye in SkyBet Requestabets:

    Conservatives to win 345+ seats, Labour fewer than 215, SNP fewer than 50, P. Cymru < 4, L Dems < 8 & turnout < 65.0%

    Seems good value at 33/1

    I put on a purple.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,001

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats


    So who's taking Brighton P?
    There's a bit of wishful thinking there... :smile:
  • Options
    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,937

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.

    Corbyn talks about issues that concern young people. May doesn't.

    +1.

    Though I do feel that no one has really truly spoken to young people who haven't gone to uni (approx 50%). The tuition fees issue only addresses young people who do go to uni. When I was at uni I found most people there were already politically engaged and voting. I think those young people that aren't are those that haven't gone to uni.

    Agreed. That's why 18-24 turnout will remain relatively low.

  • Options
    BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    TOPPING said:

    One of my last election acts was trying to convince my Algerian Uber driver taking me to the polling station (to tell) to switch from Lab to Con.

    If the Algerian Uber drivers desert Labour then they really would be in trouble!
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,678

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.
    Feels sorry for Diane Abbott, thinks the social media bullying of her horrible.
    Would you have felt the same for a middle aged white male Tory?

    I feel sorry for her for the way she was treated by her party - "resigned due to ill health" at the peak of the campaign in the middle of Oxford Circus Tube en route to the BBC. Imagine the fuss if the Tories had behaved similarly.
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,282
    Roger said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    C 355
    L 215
    LD 11
    S 47
    O 22

    I am very close:

    Con 362
    Lab 215
    LD 11
    SNP 40

    My certainty level is low, and I think it quite possible that the Con seats could be 40 less. There is a palpable half heartedness about the Tories. The farmers fields that are usually full of posters are bare.
    The sheep have already voted?

    The change in the mood of the Tories was remarkable. Being a Tory canvasser can't be the most enjoyable of activities, yet the Tories I know were, for the first few weeks, absolutely loving it. Then everything changed.

    The big story of the campaign is May's personal loss of aura and mojo. Her limitations have been fully revealed. The team we're sending into bat for us in the Brexit talks is weak, ill-prepared and in possession of no strategic advantages. That's a huge worry.
    And the opposite for Corbyn: unless Labour are trounced, his star is ascendant. He'll have seen off his detractors within the party. Again.
    It's something of a tragedy that only a Tory landslide will make Labour electable again. When Corbyn's MPs voted overwhelmingly to get rid of him it had nothing to do with consorting with terrorists or harbouring anti-semites or being too left wing. It was because he had not the first idea how to be a leader of a major party.

    This election might have shown himto be a reasonable populist but it went nowhere towards showing he could lead a party. His equivocation on the EU and appointments like Diane Abbott and Long Bailey have cost Labour literally dozens of seats.
    BUT a) against May he didn't look so bad, and b) he was forced to make nonsense appointments by the boycott of the old top team.

    The What If? of this campaign could be a Corbyn campaign backed by New Labour's remaining big hitters. Cooper in the job would have meant no Diane Abbott moments - according to polls the single most remembered event of the campaign. Which I am sure is what the left will be saying afterwards.
  • Options
    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    Paddy Power reported in the Racing Post podcast that most of the bets they'd laid were for Labour. Of course, this might just reflect the prices on offer, with Tory-backers not seeing any merit in tying up stake money days in advance on a long odds-on shot.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,307
    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats


    And you've been telling us all how the Lib Dems are going to be hammered (except in Edinburgh West natch). They would bite your hand off for that right now. As I would for the SNP score!
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats

    Quite a hammering of the Scots Nats...Lib Dems doing well too!
    I shared one with my kids a few days ago very similar
    C 390
    Lab 200
    Ld 12
    SNP 45 possibly one ind in devon
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,995

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.
    Mrs Fox off to work, voting on the way.

    Still undecided between Lab and LD. Feels sorry for Diane Abbott, thinks the social media bullying of her horrible.
    One Lab, one undecided (prob Green) here. I’ve gone on a vote swap website and have agreed to vote Lab instead of LD, while someone else who normally votes Lab will vote LD.
    However we’re both in consitituencies the Tories should hold comfortably.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,929

    I was the 7th person in the queue when I got to the polling station at 7.02am, it didn't open until 7.04.

    Never seen that before, but then again I've never voted at this polling station so early.

    Were they old or young
  • Options
    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,937
    nichomar said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats

    Quite a hammering of the Scots Nats...Lib Dems doing well too!
    I shared one with my kids a few days ago very similar
    C 390
    Lab 200
    Ld 12
    SNP 45 possibly one ind in devon

    Labour will finish on well below 200 seats. I reckon around 180 is most likely.

  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,995

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.
    Feels sorry for Diane Abbott, thinks the social media bullying of her horrible.
    Would you have felt the same for a middle aged white male Tory?

    I feel sorry for her for the way she was treated by her party - "resigned due to ill health" at the peak of the campaign in the middle of Oxford Circus Tube en route to the BBC. Imagine the fuss if the Tories had behaved similarly.
    She’s pretty obviously ill.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,311
    Brom said:

    TOPPING said:

    One of my last election acts was trying to convince my Algerian Uber driver taking me to the polling station (to tell) to switch from Lab to Con.

    If the Algerian Uber drivers desert Labour then they really would be in trouble!
    Indeed.

    He didn't realise that all that free stuff had to be paid for.
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,282

    I was having a browse for last minute bargains and this caught my eye in SkyBet Requestabets:

    Conservatives to win 345+ seats, Labour fewer than 215, SNP fewer than 50, P. Cymru < 4, L Dems < 8 & turnout < 65.0%

    Seems good value at 33/1

    I put on a purple.

    If the LDs don't get you, turnout will....
  • Options
    BromBrom Posts: 3,760
    edited June 2017

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.

    Corbyn talks about issues that concern young people. May doesn't.

    +1.

    Though I do feel that no one has really truly spoken to young people who haven't gone to uni (approx 50%). The tuition fees issue only addresses young people who do go to uni. When I was at uni I found most people there were already politically engaged and voting. I think those young people that aren't are those that haven't gone to uni.

    Agreed. That's why 18-24 turnout will remain relatively low.

    This. There is less skin in the game for the non Uni attending 50% this time than there was for the EU ref. Party politics is also a bigger turnoff than a direct question for them to answer like 'should we leave the EU?'.

    50% of our youngsters did not turn into far left firebrands over a 6 week campaign, it's just ridiculous.
  • Options
    SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats

    And you've been telling us all how the Lib Dems are going to be hammered (except in Edinburgh West natch). They would bite your hand off for that right now. As I would for the SNP score!
    I think Robert bet heavily on the LDs getting 12 seats @GE2015, he's hoping 2nd time lucky.
  • Options
    HaroldOHaroldO Posts: 1,185
    Voted, no queue and no youngsters about. Two people came in after me but they were fifties at best.

    To work!
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,929
    HaroldO said:

    Voted, no queue and no youngsters about. Two people came in after me but they were fifties at best.

    To work!

    Gooood Gooood
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,001
    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats


    And you've been telling us all how the Lib Dems are going to be hammered (except in Edinburgh West natch). They would bite your hand off for that right now. As I would for the SNP score!
    Not true.

    I've been - by the standards of this site - pretty optimistic on the LibDems.

    Here's my list:

    Twickenham
    One other SW London seat (either Richmond, Kingston, or C&W)

    O&S
    Edinburgh West
    Fife NE
    East Dunbartonshire

    Ceredgion

    Westmoreland & Lonsdale
    North Norfolk
    Sheffield Hallam

    Plus two from my possible list:
    Argyll & Bute
    Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross
    St Ives
    Bath
    Cheltenham
    Eastbourne
    Lewes
    OxWAb
  • Options
    paulyork64paulyork64 Posts: 2,461
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats


    So who's taking Brighton P?
    There's a bit of wishful thinking there... :smile:
    Ha. Nothing wrong with a bit of that. I'm on Con 370 also. I get your total there to 630. Plus speaker plus NI=649. East Devon indy =1?
  • Options
    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133

    Also: word of warning. If seats are to be swinging wildly all over the place tonight, I'd expect the exit poll to perhaps be a little less accurate than usual, possibly with both Con/Lab seats predictions having an error of +/- 20 seats.

    That is the usual margin of error for the exit poll, I seem to remember from last time.
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,678

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.
    Feels sorry for Diane Abbott, thinks the social media bullying of her horrible.
    Would you have felt the same for a middle aged white male Tory?

    I feel sorry for her for the way she was treated by her party - "resigned due to ill health" at the peak of the campaign in the middle of Oxford Circus Tube en route to the BBC. Imagine the fuss if the Tories had behaved similarly.
    She’s pretty obviously ill.
    If she is, then Corbyn should have protected her earlier rather than subjecting an unwell woman to public humiliation. Instead we had Paul Mason questioning Mrs May's health. While Labour repeatedly sent an ill woman into TV studios.
  • Options
    WinstanleyWinstanley Posts: 434

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.

    Corbyn talks about issues that concern young people. May doesn't.

    +1.

    Though I do feel that no one has really truly spoken to young people who haven't gone to uni (approx 50%). The tuition fees issue only addresses young people who do go to uni. When I was at uni I found most people there were already politically engaged and voting. I think those young people that aren't are those that haven't gone to uni.

    Agreed. That's why 18-24 turnout will remain relatively low.

    There was a discussion yesterday about why young people seem more engaged now, maybe it's for exactly the same reasons the old are. Older yoi get the more politics becomes a real practical matter - if you own a house, taxation on earnings etc. More young people are facing practical political concerns too: dealing with the benefits system, struggling with zero hour or precarious contracts, struggling with housing. My FB has a lot of Labour noise linked to things they've experienced rather than abstract ideas about fairness and justice.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,001
    edited June 2017

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats

    And you've been telling us all how the Lib Dems are going to be hammered (except in Edinburgh West natch). They would bite your hand off for that right now. As I would for the SNP score!
    I think Robert bet heavily on the LDs getting 12 seats @GE2015, he's hoping 2nd time lucky.
    It's funny. In 2012 that was the lowest forecast on the site. This time around it's the highest.
  • Options
    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    IanB2 said:

    I was having a browse for last minute bargains and this caught my eye in SkyBet Requestabets:

    Conservatives to win 345+ seats, Labour fewer than 215, SNP fewer than 50, P. Cymru < 4, L Dems < 8 & turnout < 65.0%

    Seems good value at 33/1

    I put on a purple.

    If the LDs don't get you, turnout will....
    That is the risk with the accumulators!

    I think the biggest risk is the Lib Dems <8, I have become more optomistic over the last week.
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,995

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.
    Feels sorry for Diane Abbott, thinks the social media bullying of her horrible.
    Would you have felt the same for a middle aged white male Tory?

    I feel sorry for her for the way she was treated by her party - "resigned due to ill health" at the peak of the campaign in the middle of Oxford Circus Tube en route to the BBC. Imagine the fuss if the Tories had behaved similarly.
    She’s pretty obviously ill.
    If she is, then Corbyn should have protected her earlier rather than subjecting an unwell woman to public humiliation. Instead we had Paul Mason questioning Mrs May's health. While Labour repeatedly sent an ill woman into TV studios.
    Yup.
  • Options
    RobinWiggsRobinWiggs Posts: 621
    Polls have been open 20 minutes.

    Where are all the reports from the ground on turnout? Is the Crimson Tide washing all before it, or are they still all in bed?
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,282
    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats


    And you've been telling us all how the Lib Dems are going to be hammered (except in Edinburgh West natch). They would bite your hand off for that right now. As I would for the SNP score!
    Not true.

    I've been - by the standards of this site - pretty optimistic on the LibDems.

    Here's my list:

    Twickenham
    One other SW London seat (either Richmond, Kingston, or C&W)

    O&S
    Edinburgh West
    Fife NE
    East Dunbartonshire

    Ceredgion

    Westmoreland & Lonsdale
    North Norfolk
    Sheffield Hallam

    Plus two from my possible list:
    Argyll & Bute
    Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross
    St Ives
    Bath
    Cheltenham
    Eastbourne
    Lewes
    OxWAb
    LibDem 'sources' seem optimistic about Twickenham, Kingston, Richmond at least being in play, East Dun, Cheltenham & W Ox in play, St Albans a better than average swing. Gloomier re. southport, worried for Norfolk - Lewes, St Ives, Caithness most unlikely.
  • Options
    paulyork64paulyork64 Posts: 2,461
    nichomar said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats

    Quite a hammering of the Scots Nats...Lib Dems doing well too!
    I shared one with my kids a few days ago very similar
    C 390
    Lab 200
    Ld 12
    SNP 45 possibly one ind in devon
    I think that would require some of them winning seats in NI.
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    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.
    Feels sorry for Diane Abbott, thinks the social media bullying of her horrible.
    Would you have felt the same for a middle aged white male Tory?

    I feel sorry for her for the way she was treated by her party - "resigned due to ill health" at the peak of the campaign in the middle of Oxford Circus Tube en route to the BBC. Imagine the fuss if the Tories had behaved similarly.
    She’s pretty obviously ill.
    If she is, then Corbyn should have protected her earlier rather than subjecting an unwell woman to public humiliation. Instead we had Paul Mason questioning Mrs May's health. While Labour repeatedly sent an ill woman into TV studios.
    Nick Robinson said she was 'taken ill' in a taxi on the way to a radio interview with him too. An indictment of London air pollution under the Tories.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,937
    IanB2 said:

    Roger said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    C 355
    L 215
    LD 11
    S 47
    O 22

    I am very close:

    Con 362
    Lab 215
    LD 11
    SNP 40

    My certainty level is low, and I think it quite possible that the Con seats could be 40 less. There is a palpable half heartedness about the Tories. The farmers fields that are usually full of posters are bare.
    The sheep have already voted?

    The change in the mood of the Tories was remarkable. Being a Tory canvasser can't be the most enjoyable of activities, yet the Tories I know were, for the first few weeks, absolutely loving it. Then everything changed.

    The big story of the campaign is May's personal loss of aura and mojo. Her limitations have been fully revealed. The team we're sending into bat for us in the Brexit talks is weak, ill-prepared and in possession of no strategic advantages. That's a huge worry.
    And the opposite for Corbyn: unless Labour are trounced, his star is ascendant. He'll have seen off his detractors within the party. Again.
    It's something of a tragedy that only a Tory landslide will make Labour electable again. When Corbyn's MPs voted overwhelmingly to get rid of him it had nothing to do with consorting with terrorists or harbouring anti-semites or being too left wing. It was because he had not the first idea how to be a leader of a major party.

    This election might have shown himto be a reasonable populist but it went nowhere towards showing he could lead a party. His equivocation on the EU and appointments like Diane Abbott and Long Bailey have cost Labour literally dozens of seats.
    BUT a) against May he didn't look so bad, and b) he was forced to make nonsense appointments by the boycott of the old top team.

    The What If? of this campaign could be a Corbyn campaign backed by New Labour's remaining big hitters. Cooper in the job would have meant no Diane Abbott moments - according to polls the single most remembered event of the campaign. Which I am sure is what the left will be saying afterwards.

    But there was a reason why people like Cooper could not work with Corbyn. Milne, McDonnell & co are hugely divisive figures with overtly Marxist agendas. They are in charge behind the scenes. If that changes, then compromise is possible. If it doesn't, it's not. That's why Labour needs to take a deep breath, not make quick decisions.

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    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    Freggles said:

    YouGov asked me how naughty running through fields of wheat is
    Me too. I had no idea why until just now.
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    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.
    Feels sorry for Diane Abbott, thinks the social media bullying of her horrible.
    Would you have felt the same for a middle aged white male Tory?

    I feel sorry for her for the way she was treated by her party - "resigned due to ill health" at the peak of the campaign in the middle of Oxford Circus Tube en route to the BBC. Imagine the fuss if the Tories had behaved similarly.
    Indeed. Though come to think of it, wasn't there something odd early on about Theresa May's replacement for an interview?
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    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    IanB2 said:

    I was the 7th person in the queue when I got to the polling station at 7.02am, it didn't open until 7.04.

    Never seen that before, but then again I've never voted at this polling station so early.

    Opening four minutes late is poor. Are things really that slack your way?
    Apparently so.
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    paulyork64paulyork64 Posts: 2,461
    IanB2 said:

    I was having a browse for last minute bargains and this caught my eye in SkyBet Requestabets:

    Conservatives to win 345+ seats, Labour fewer than 215, SNP fewer than 50, P. Cymru < 4, L Dems < 8 & turnout < 65.0%

    Seems good value at 33/1

    I put on a purple.

    If the LDs don't get you, turnout will....
    I think that's a fair bet to give you some entertainment that will hopefully last beyond 22:05.
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    CookieCookie Posts: 11,449

    I was having a browse for last minute bargains and this caught my eye in SkyBet Requestabets:

    Conservatives to win 345+ seats, Labour fewer than 215, SNP fewer than 50, P. Cymru < 4, L Dems < 8 & turnout < 65.0%

    Seems good value at 33/1

    I put on a purple.

    Where did you find that? Is it still there? I've had a hunt round the site but can't see it?
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,282
    edited June 2017
    HaroldO said:

    Voted, no queue and no youngsters about. Two people came in after me but they were fifties at best.

    To work!

    students seen voting at 7 am really would be the moment to wonder whether this is Remain and Clinton take three!
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    BromBrom Posts: 3,760




    There was a discussion yesterday about why young people seem more engaged now, maybe it's for exactly the same reasons the old are. Older yoi get the more politics becomes a real practical matter - if you own a house, taxation on earnings etc. More young people are facing practical political concerns too: dealing with the benefits system, struggling with zero hour or precarious contracts, struggling with housing. My FB has a lot of Labour noise linked to things they've experienced rather than abstract ideas about fairness and justice.

    I don't see how things are much different for youngsters than 2015? The Corbyn message is better but not 43% turnout to 70% upwards better IMO
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    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,001
    IanB2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats


    And you've been telling us all how the Lib Dems are going to be hammered (except in Edinburgh West natch). They would bite your hand off for that right now. As I would for the SNP score!
    Not true.

    I've been - by the standards of this site - pretty optimistic on the LibDems.

    Here's my list:

    Twickenham
    One other SW London seat (either Richmond, Kingston, or C&W)

    O&S
    Edinburgh West
    Fife NE
    East Dunbartonshire

    Ceredgion

    Westmoreland & Lonsdale
    North Norfolk
    Sheffield Hallam

    Plus two from my possible list:
    Argyll & Bute
    Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross
    St Ives
    Bath
    Cheltenham
    Eastbourne
    Lewes
    OxWAb
    LibDem 'sources' seem optimistic about Twickenham, Kingston, Richmond at least being in play, East Dun, Cheltenham & W Ox in play, St Albans a better than average swing. Gloomier re. southport, worried for Norfolk - Lewes, St Ives, Caithness most unlikely.
    There was a big swing to the LDs in the Holyrood elections last year, and the SNP will likely be down to 38-39%. I think it's likelier than people think.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,937

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.
    Feels sorry for Diane Abbott, thinks the social media bullying of her horrible.
    Would you have felt the same for a middle aged white male Tory?

    I feel sorry for her for the way she was treated by her party - "resigned due to ill health" at the peak of the campaign in the middle of Oxford Circus Tube en route to the BBC. Imagine the fuss if the Tories had behaved similarly.
    She’s pretty obviously ill.
    If she is, then Corbyn should have protected her earlier rather than subjecting an unwell woman to public humiliation. Instead we had Paul Mason questioning Mrs May's health. While Labour repeatedly sent an ill woman into TV studios.

    It's possible Abbott did not tell anyone she was ill. She likes being on the telly.

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    CookieCookie Posts: 11,449

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.

    Corbyn talks about issues that concern young people. May doesn't.

    +1.

    Though I do feel that no one has really truly spoken to young people who haven't gone to uni (approx 50%). The tuition fees issue only addresses young people who do go to uni. When I was at uni I found most people there were already politically engaged and voting. I think those young people that aren't are those that haven't gone to uni.
    Good point.
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    SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.
    Mrs Fox off to work, voting on the way.

    Still undecided between Lab and LD. Feels sorry for Diane Abbott, thinks the social media bullying of her horrible.
    I never saw any of that. I saw her being found out for what she really is by the media.
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    EssexitEssexit Posts: 1,956
    Ninth to vote at my polling station. The Lib Dem teller asked the chap behind me in the queue for his number. Like mine, it started with AV. I turned around and said that I thought our elections were First Past the Post, not AV. A few people chuckled awkwardly and turned away.
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    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    Pulpstar said:

    I was the 7th person in the queue when I got to the polling station at 7.02am, it didn't open until 7.04.

    Never seen that before, but then again I've never voted at this polling station so early.

    Were they old or young
    Nobody under 30.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,282
    Essexit said:

    Ninth to vote at my polling station. The Lib Dem teller asked the chap behind me in the queue for his number. Like mine, it started with AV. I turned around and said that I thought our elections were First Past the Post, not AV. A few people chuckled awkwardly and turned away.

    LibDems telling at 7am? Are you in one of their hard fought targets?
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    GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    Freggles said:

    YouGov asked me how naughty running through fields of wheat is
    Yes I got that question too.
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    ab195ab195 Posts: 477

    Polls have been open 20 minutes.

    Where are all the reports from the ground on turnout? Is the Crimson Tide washing all before it, or are they still all in bed?

    In front of me in the queue was a (mid-twenties) lady in pyjamas who needed to be talked through how many boxes you could cross. Both charming, and good for democracy.

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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,454
    I miss voting at a polling station.
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    numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 5,463
    So here we are. After the crappiest campaign of all time.

    My final prediction:

    Con: 357
    Lab: 219
    LD: 10
    Green: 1
    SNP: 44
    Speaker: 1
    NI: 18

    Tory Majority 64
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    not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,341
    edited June 2017
    DavidL said:

    JackW said:

    Are we still awaiting one more poll ?

    Just one ....

    UKGE .. Sampling 7am-10pm - Size 31,023,731 ..

    With a sample like that it should be definitive.
    Will that poll use MI5's new "adjustments"? ;-)
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,454
    rcs1000 said:

    IanB2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats


    And you've been telling us all how the Lib Dems are going to be hammered (except in Edinburgh West natch). They would bite your hand off for that right now. As I would for the SNP score!
    Not true.

    I've been - by the standards of this site - pretty optimistic on the LibDems.

    Here's my list:

    Twickenham
    One other SW London seat (either Richmond, Kingston, or C&W)

    O&S
    Edinburgh West
    Fife NE
    East Dunbartonshire

    Ceredgion

    Westmoreland & Lonsdale
    North Norfolk
    Sheffield Hallam

    Plus two from my possible list:
    Argyll & Bute
    Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross
    St Ives
    Bath
    Cheltenham
    Eastbourne
    Lewes
    OxWAb
    LibDem 'sources' seem optimistic about Twickenham, Kingston, Richmond at least being in play, East Dun, Cheltenham & W Ox in play, St Albans a better than average swing. Gloomier re. southport, worried for Norfolk - Lewes, St Ives, Caithness most unlikely.
    There was a big swing to the LDs in the Holyrood elections last year, and the SNP will likely be down to 38-39%. I think it's likelier than people think.
    Lib Dems also ahead in Vauxhall too.

    https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/872550006934433792
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,929
    ab195 said:

    Polls have been open 20 minutes.

    Where are all the reports from the ground on turnout? Is the Crimson Tide washing all before it, or are they still all in bed?

    In front of me in the queue was a (mid-twenties) lady in pyjamas who needed to be talked through how many boxes you could cross. Both charming, and good for democracy.

    That is a first time Tory voter. Guaranteed - SHE WANTS BREXIT
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    I miss voting at a polling station.

    If I had my way not voting at a polling station would count for half as it just isn't as good.

    Then we'd see how many of the oldies cared about democracy.

    I may be amenable for some exemptions.
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    Any reports from IOS on the ground war so far?
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    EssexitEssexit Posts: 1,956
    IanB2 said:

    Essexit said:

    Ninth to vote at my polling station. The Lib Dem teller asked the chap behind me in the queue for his number. Like mine, it started with AV. I turned around and said that I thought our elections were First Past the Post, not AV. A few people chuckled awkwardly and turned away.

    LibDems telling at 7am? Are you in one of their hard fought targets?
    Colchester. Held by them until 2015 but I don't think they're fighting particularly hard. That said it is a strongly Lib Dem ward I'm in.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,282
    ab195 said:

    Polls have been open 20 minutes.

    Where are all the reports from the ground on turnout? Is the Crimson Tide washing all before it, or are they still all in bed?

    In front of me in the queue was a (mid-twenties) lady in pyjamas who needed to be talked through how many boxes you could cross. Both charming, and good for democracy.

    Our first high turnout klaxon?
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,929

    I miss voting at a polling station.

    The Private message is a thread by the way, was thinking about this sort of stuff at the pb meet.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,282
    Essexit said:

    IanB2 said:

    Essexit said:

    Ninth to vote at my polling station. The Lib Dem teller asked the chap behind me in the queue for his number. Like mine, it started with AV. I turned around and said that I thought our elections were First Past the Post, not AV. A few people chuckled awkwardly and turned away.

    LibDems telling at 7am? Are you in one of their hard fought targets?
    Colchester. Held by them until 2015 but I don't think they're fighting particularly hard. That said it is a strongly Lib Dem ward I'm in.
    Go Battlin' Bob! His last hurrah.
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    edited June 2017
    IanB2 said:

    Roger said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    C 355
    L 215
    LD 11
    S 47
    O 22

    I am very close:

    Con 362
    Lab 215
    LD 11
    SNP 40

    My certainty level is low, and I think it quite possible that the Con seats could be 40 less. There is a palpable half heartedness about the Tories. The farmers fields that are usually full of posters are bare.
    The sheep have already voted?

    The change in the mood of the Tories was remarkable. Being a Tory canvasser can't be the most enjoyable of activities, yet the Tories I know were, for the first few weeks, absolutely loving it. Then everything changed.

    The big story of the campaign is May's personal loss of aura and mojo. Her limitations have been fully revealed. The team we're sending into bat for us in the Brexit talks is weak, ill-prepared and in possession of no strategic advantages. That's a huge worry.
    And the opposite for Corbyn: unless Labour are trounced, his star is ascendant. He'll have seen off his detractors within the party. Again.
    It's something of a tragedy that only a Tory landslide will make Labour electable again. When Corbyn's MPs voted overwhelmingly to get rid of him it had nothing to do with consorting with terrorists or harbouring anti-semites or being too left wing. It was because he had not the first idea how to be a leader of a major party.

    This election might have shown himto be a reasonable populist but it went nowhere towards showing he could lead a party. His equivocation on the EU and appointments like Diane Abbott and Long Bailey have cost Labour literally dozens of seats.
    BUT a) against May he didn't look so bad, and b) he was forced to make nonsense appointments by the boycott of the old top team.

    The What If? of this campaign could be a Corbyn campaign backed by New Labour's remaining big hitters. Cooper in the job would have meant no Diane Abbott moments - according to polls the single most remembered event of the campaign. Which I am sure is what the left will be saying afterwards.
    I was told by a senior resigner before the event that the parliamentary party was necrotising with Corbyn in charge. His leadership and administrative skills were non existant. He was changing policy on a whim not turning up for meetings and if he did being unprepared. In other words it couldn't have continued whoever had stayed in the shadow cabinet.

    It's interesting but not surprising that the Abbott moment is the most remembered but if Corbyn had continued as he was doing pre-coup things would likely have been a good deal worse albeit in different ways
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,678

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    Y

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.
    Feels sorry for Diane Abbott, thinks the social media bullying of her horrible.
    Would you have felt the same for a middle aged white male Tory?

    I feel sorry for her for the way she was treated by her party - "resigned due to ill health" at the peak of the campaign in the middle of Oxford Circus Tube en route to the BBC. Imagine the fuss if the Tories had behaved similarly.
    She’s pretty obviously ill.
    If she is, then Corbyn should have protected her earlier rather than subjecting an unwell woman to public humiliation. Instead we had Paul Mason questioning Mrs May's health. While Labour repeatedly sent an ill woman into TV studios.

    It's possible Abbott did not tell anyone she was ill. She likes being on the telly.
    Other than a pre-existing medical condition, one not untypical in ladies of her age or ethnicity, Abbott said in reply to the spoof email that she enjoys good health. I do hope she recovers quickly from her (diplomatic?) illness.
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    freetochoosefreetochoose Posts: 1,107
    Looking at the chart in the header with all its contradictions surely polling companies are in big trouble, it seems after every election even more doubts are cast. I have my own theory which has got me in trouble in the past.

    If you were to commission one of the pollsters who would it be? Not sure if they're complacent or simply unable to accurately monitor their database but the models are clearly flawed.
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    numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 5,463
    Essexit said:

    Ninth to vote at my polling station. The Lib Dem teller asked the chap behind me in the queue for his number. Like mine, it started with AV. I turned around and said that I thought our elections were First Past the Post, not AV. A few people chuckled awkwardly and turned away.

    AV mania sweeping the nation!
  • Options
    not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,341
    edited June 2017
    On polling day in 2015 we shared our GE constituency voting history which was quite interesting. Here's mine:

    2017 - Kingston &a Surbiton (Con/LD Marginal)
    2015 - ditto
    2010 - Vauxhall (safe Lab)
    2005 - Hammersmith (Lab/Con marginal)

    I missed out on voting in 2001 by being less than 10 days underage
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,454
    Alistair said:

    I miss voting at a polling station.

    If I had my way not voting at a polling station would count for half as it just isn't as good.

    Then we'd see how many of the oldies cared about democracy.

    I may be amenable for some exemptions.
    I live in Sheffield, I work in Manchester, and usually spend Thursday nights in Manchester.

    I am allowed an exemption.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,929

    rcs1000 said:

    IanB2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats


    And you've been telling us all how the Lib Dems are going to be hammered (except in Edinburgh West natch). They would bite your hand off for that right now. As I would for the SNP score!
    Not true.

    I've been - by the standards of this site - pretty optimistic on the LibDems.

    Here's my list:

    Twickenham
    One other SW London seat (either Richmond, Kingston, or C&W)

    O&S
    Edinburgh West
    Fife NE
    East Dunbartonshire

    Ceredgion

    Westmoreland & Lonsdale
    North Norfolk
    Sheffield Hallam

    Plus two from my possible list:
    Argyll & Bute
    Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross
    St Ives
    Bath
    Cheltenham
    Eastbourne
    Lewes
    OxWAb
    LibDem 'sources' seem optimistic about Twickenham, Kingston, Richmond at least being in play, East Dun, Cheltenham & W Ox in play, St Albans a better than average swing. Gloomier re. southport, worried for Norfolk - Lewes, St Ives, Caithness most unlikely.
    There was a big swing to the LDs in the Holyrood elections last year, and the SNP will likely be down to 38-39%. I think it's likelier than people think.
    Lib Dems also ahead in Vauxhall too.

    https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/872550006934433792
    I'm on Labour at 4-9 and the Lib Dems at ~ 21-4.

    Imagine being on at 1-10, that'd be uncomfortable.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,454
    Pulpstar said:

    I miss voting at a polling station.

    The Private message is a thread by the way, was thinking about this sort of stuff at the pb meet.
    Understood.
  • Options
    not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,341
    edited June 2017
    Brom said:



    I don't see how things are much different for youngsters than 2015? The Corbyn message is better but not 43% turnout to 70% upwards better IMO

    Brexit, obviously.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,979

    So, anyone here having doubts about a Con majority?

    Not in God's country, even if we do have our share of dumb halfwits who will believe Tory lies
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,929

    On polling day in 2015 we shared our GE constituency voting history which was quite interesting. Here's mine:

    2017 - Kingston &a Surbiton (Con/LD Marginal)
    2015 - ditto
    2010 - Vauxhall (safe Lab)
    2005 - Hammersmith (Lab/Con marginal)

    I missed out on voting in 2001 by being less than 10 days underage

    My vote history is as follows:

    2001 - Bath, Tory
    2005 - Coventry South, Lib Dem
    2010 - Sheffield Central, Tory
    2015 - NE Derbyshire, Green
  • Options
    EssexitEssexit Posts: 1,956
    IanB2 said:

    Essexit said:

    IanB2 said:

    Essexit said:

    Ninth to vote at my polling station. The Lib Dem teller asked the chap behind me in the queue for his number. Like mine, it started with AV. I turned around and said that I thought our elections were First Past the Post, not AV. A few people chuckled awkwardly and turned away.

    LibDems telling at 7am? Are you in one of their hard fought targets?
    Colchester. Held by them until 2015 but I don't think they're fighting particularly hard. That said it is a strongly Lib Dem ward I'm in.
    Go Battlin' Bob! His last hurrah.
    In all honesty I can see Labour coming second to the Tories here. I did like Bob as a constituency MP though.
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891

    rcs1000 said:

    IanB2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats


    And you've been telling us all how the Lib Dems are going to be hammered (except in Edinburgh West natch). They would bite your hand off for that right now. As I would for the SNP score!
    Not true.

    I've been - by the standards of this site - pretty optimistic on the LibDems.

    Here's my list:

    Twickenham
    One other SW London seat (either Richmond, Kingston, or C&W)

    O&S
    Edinburgh West
    Fife NE
    East Dunbartonshire

    Ceredgion

    Westmoreland & Lonsdale
    North Norfolk
    Sheffield Hallam

    Plus two from my possible list:
    Argyll & Bute
    Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross
    St Ives
    Bath
    Cheltenham
    Eastbourne
    Lewes
    OxWAb
    LibDem 'sources' seem optimistic about Twickenham, Kingston, Richmond at least being in play, East Dun, Cheltenham & W Ox in play, St Albans a better than average swing. Gloomier re. southport, worried for Norfolk - Lewes, St Ives, Caithness most unlikely.
    There was a big swing to the LDs in the Holyrood elections last year, and the SNP will likely be down to 38-39%. I think it's likelier than people think.
    Lib Dems also ahead in Vauxhall too.

    https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/872550006934433792
    Excellent news! One less Tory/UKIPer and they haven't even started counting the votes yet.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,984
    Good morning, my fellow voters.

    The Morris Dancer prediction: Con majority 60-80
    The octo-lemur prophecy (possibly taking the piss): Con majority 102

    The Labour seat changes as compared to historical battlefield defeats of the Western Roman Empire list:
    -100 Adrianople [Malmesbury]
    -90 Cap Bon [Malmesbury’s suggestion]
    -80 Allia [another_richard’s suggestion]

    -70 Cannae
    -60 Arausio
    -50 Teutoberg Forest
    -40 Carrhae
    -30 Lake Trasimene

    If it's not too bad:
    -20 Asculum
    -10 Heraclea

    And, if Labour actually increase their seat numbers:
    +10 Zela
    +20 Tigranocerta
    +30 Zama

    On-topic: I agree that kudos must be given for sticking their necks out. In Morley & Outwood, it's raining quite a bit and likely to continue for much of the day.
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    currystarcurrystar Posts: 1,171
    Just been to vote in Hedge End, Eastleigh, I was the only one in there. In 30 minutes they had only crossed off 3 names. A very slow start. But then round here it does not seem that there has been an election taking place. No banners, no canvessers. Normally I am bombarded with Lib Dem leaflets. This time I have only had one.
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,755
    malcolmg said:

    So, anyone here having doubts about a Con majority?

    Not in God's country, even if we do have our share of dumb halfwits who will believe Tory lies
    salmond - gone and now forgotten
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,678
    malcolmg said:

    So, anyone here having doubts about a Con majority?

    Not in God's country, even if we do have our share of dumb halfwits who will believe Tory lies
    Well, the SNP lies have worn a bit thin......off to do some FerreroRochering?
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,984
    F1: oh, and this is a story worth reading. McLaren are having doubts (potentially deal-ending) about Honda. And rightly so.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/40196307
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,678

    malcolmg said:

    So, anyone here having doubts about a Con majority?

    Not in God's country, even if we do have our share of dumb halfwits who will believe Tory lies
    salmond - gone and now forgotten
    https://twitter.com/GeneralBoles/status/872478487109652480
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    BromptonautBromptonaut Posts: 1,113
    edited June 2017
    Roger said:

    rcs1000 said:

    IanB2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats


    And you've been telling us all how the Lib Dems are going to be hammered (except in Edinburgh West natch). They would bite your hand off for that right now. As I would for the SNP score!
    Not true.

    I've been - by the standards of this site - pretty optimistic on the LibDems.

    Here's my list:

    Twickenham
    One other SW London seat (either Richmond, Kingston, or C&W)

    O&S
    Edinburgh West
    Fife NE
    East Dunbartonshire

    Ceredgion

    Westmoreland & Lonsdale
    North Norfolk
    Sheffield Hallam

    Plus two from my possible list:
    Argyll & Bute
    Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross
    St Ives
    Bath
    Cheltenham
    Eastbourne
    Lewes
    OxWAb
    LibDem 'sources' seem optimistic about Twickenham, Kingston, Richmond at least being in play, East Dun, Cheltenham & W Ox in play, St Albans a better than average swing. Gloomier re. southport, worried for Norfolk - Lewes, St Ives, Caithness most unlikely.
    There was a big swing to the LDs in the Holyrood elections last year, and the SNP will likely be down to 38-39%. I think it's likelier than people think.
    Lib Dems also ahead in Vauxhall too.

    https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/872550006934433792
    Excellent news! One less Tory/UKIPer and they haven't even started counting the votes yet.
    Whatever the overall result, Hoey being thrown off the boat would be very pleasing.

    Edit to say - not least because of her anti-cycling views.
  • Options
    nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    Just had a look at my fb feed for the last few days and to my surprise quite a few people 40 and younger, who were not particularly interested in politics waking up to the fact it's happening. They ask the question "are you voting for Corbyn" and almost universally their friends say "no way". Tend to come from WWC backgrounds as well. MOIWYW
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,282
    currystar said:

    Just been to vote in Hedge End, Eastleigh, I was the only one in there. In 30 minutes they had only crossed off 3 names. A very slow start. But then round here it does not seem that there has been an election taking place. No banners, no canvessers. Normally I am bombarded with Lib Dem leaflets. This time I have only had one.

    That's odd. Have they all gone to Portsmouth?
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    ab195ab195 Posts: 477
    I owe some thanks by the way. I commute in to London and usually vote after work to award myself ten minutes in bed; but I remembered the poster last year who almost didn't get back in time. Thanks, whoever it was, you roused me from my sleep.
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    chloechloe Posts: 308
    Morning all what time will this final Mori poll be out?
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    CookieCookie Posts: 11,449

    On polling day in 2015 we shared our GE constituency voting history which was quite interesting. Here's mine:

    2017 - Kingston &a Surbiton (Con/LD Marginal)
    2015 - ditto
    2010 - Vauxhall (safe Lab)
    2005 - Hammersmith (Lab/Con marginal)

    I missed out on voting in 2001 by being less than 10 days underage

    2017 - Wythenshawe and Sale East (Safe Lab)
    2015 - Wythenshawe and Sale East (Safe Lab)
    2010 - Wythenshawe and Sale East (Safe Lab)
    2005 - Broxtowe (Marginal Lab)
    2001 - Broxtowe (Marginal Lab)
    1997 - Darlington (Lab)

    Never voted fpr the winning candidate! (In national or local elections) - Sorry NickP!
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    Bob__SykesBob__Sykes Posts: 1,176

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    The Revenge of the Youthful Remainers is what woke me up in a cold sweat this morning.

    It would be the perfect response to what the oldies did to them last June.

    I think we'll have record turnout today and massive queues at polling stations etc. The young are angry.

    Roll on this time tomorrow. I cannot stand the tension...
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,282
    Pulpstar said:

    rcs1000 said:

    IanB2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats


    And you've been telling us all how the Lib Dems are going to be hammered (except in Edinburgh West natch). They would bite your hand off for that right now. As I would for the SNP score!
    Not true.

    I've been - by the standards of this site - pretty optimistic on the LibDems.

    Here's my list:

    Twickenham
    One other SW London seat (either Richmond, Kingston, or C&W)

    O&S
    Edinburgh West
    Fife NE
    East Dunbartonshire

    Ceredgion

    Westmoreland & Lonsdale
    North Norfolk
    Sheffield Hallam

    Plus two from my possible list:
    Argyll & Bute
    Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross
    St Ives
    Bath
    Cheltenham
    Eastbourne
    Lewes
    OxWAb
    LibDem 'sources' seem optimistic about Twickenham, Kingston, Richmond at least being in play, East Dun, Cheltenham & W Ox in play, St Albans a better than average swing. Gloomier re. southport, worried for Norfolk - Lewes, St Ives, Caithness most unlikely.
    There was a big swing to the LDs in the Holyrood elections last year, and the SNP will likely be down to 38-39%. I think it's likelier than people think.
    Lib Dems also ahead in Vauxhall too.

    https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/872550006934433792
    I'm on Labour at 4-9 and the Lib Dems at ~ 21-4.

    Imagine being on at 1-10, that'd be uncomfortable.
    :)
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,242
    if we Baxter my prediction of 45-32-assign approximate figures to other parties and allow for a fall in Scotland, we get:

    Con 373
    Lab 205
    SNP 39
    Lib 11
    Green 1
    NI 18

    I think the SNP figure is a bit low and Labour a bit high. But an approximate majority of 90-100 seems possible.

    The key thing to remember is all polls are still showing the Tories in the 40s. If that's replicated in the final vote they will have a majority, especially as Labour are clearly still stuck in the thirties (in more ways than one)! The real question will be the size of it.

    It will doubtless reassure all bedwetters to know I was wrong about Trump, Brexit, 2015, 2010. However, I was right about Corbyn.
  • Options
    MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,203
    edited June 2017
    Pulpstar said:

    On polling day in 2015 we shared our GE constituency voting history which was quite interesting. Here's mine:

    2017 - Kingston &a Surbiton (Con/LD Marginal)
    2015 - ditto
    2010 - Vauxhall (safe Lab)
    2005 - Hammersmith (Lab/Con marginal)

    I missed out on voting in 2001 by being less than 10 days underage

    My vote history is as follows:

    2001 - Bath, Tory
    2005 - Coventry South, Lib Dem
    2010 - Sheffield Central, Tory
    2015 - NE Derbyshire, Green
    1987 Harrogate
    1992 Tayside North
    1997 North Norfolk
    2001 Ludlow
    2005 Ludlow
    2010 Ludlow
    2015 Ludlow
    2017 Ludlow

    6 votes for LD/SDP and one for SNP. Today I'll be voting for something different...
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    CookieCookie Posts: 11,449
    Right - just off to vote. Turnout in Trafford expected to be down slightly - it's our special extra week of half term where we can take the kids on holiday and not pay summer holiday prices - pretty much all my daughters' schoolfreinds are away. Not that any of the Trafford seats are interesting enough for this to have an impact.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,454
    edited June 2017

    On polling day in 2015 we shared our GE constituency voting history which was quite interesting. Here's mine:

    2017 - Kingston &a Surbiton (Con/LD Marginal)
    2015 - ditto
    2010 - Vauxhall (safe Lab)
    2005 - Hammersmith (Lab/Con marginal)

    I missed out on voting in 2001 by being less than 10 days underage

    1997 - Sheffield Hallam

    2001/2005 - Kensington and Chelsea

    2010 - Tatton

    2012 - Manchester Central (by election)

    2015/2017 - Sheffield Hallam
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,678
    Daily Record eve of voting poll predicts all three pro-UK parties will take seats from the SNP

    SNP support slumps to 39 per cent as 61 per cent of voters reject independence while Labour pulls ahead of Tories in Scotland.


    http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/daily-record-eve-voting-poll-10581625.amp
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    isamisam Posts: 40,930

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.
    Feels sorry for Diane Abbott, thinks the social media bullying of her horrible.
    Would you have felt the same for a middle aged white male Tory?

    I feel sorry for her for the way she was treated by her party - "resigned due to ill health" at the peak of the campaign in the middle of Oxford Circus Tube en route to the BBC. Imagine the fuss if the Tories had behaved similarly.
    She’s pretty obviously ill.
    Really? What's she got?
  • Options
    currystarcurrystar Posts: 1,171
    IanB2 said:

    currystar said:

    Just been to vote in Hedge End, Eastleigh, I was the only one in there. In 30 minutes they had only crossed off 3 names. A very slow start. But then round here it does not seem that there has been an election taking place. No banners, no canvessers. Normally I am bombarded with Lib Dem leaflets. This time I have only had one.

    That's odd. Have they all gone to Portsmouth?
    No idea, in 2010 this area was awash with orange everywhere. Nothing this time.
  • Options
    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133

    On polling day in 2015 we shared our GE constituency voting history which was quite interesting. Here's mine:

    2017 - Kingston &a Surbiton (Con/LD Marginal)
    2015 - ditto
    2010 - Vauxhall (safe Lab)
    2005 - Hammersmith (Lab/Con marginal)

    I missed out on voting in 2001 by being less than 10 days underage

    1997: 4 months too young
    2001: Bethnal Green & Bow
    2005: One of the Lewishams, I think West
    2010: Battersea
    2012by: Croydon North
    2015/2017: Greenwich & Woolwich
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,282

    Brom said:



    I don't see how things are much different for youngsters than 2015? The Corbyn message is better but not 43% turnout to 70% upwards better IMO

    Brexit, obviously.
    And no #Miliboredom
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,018
    Roger said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    C 355
    L 215
    LD 11
    S 47
    O 22

    I am very close:

    Con 362
    Lab 215
    LD 11
    SNP 40

    My certainty level is low, and I think it quite possible that the Con seats could be 40 less. There is a palpable half heartedness about the Tories. The farmers fields that are usually full of posters are bare.
    The sheep have already voted?

    The change in the mood of the Tories was remarkable. Being a Tory canvasser can't be the most enjoyable of activities, yet the Tories I know were, for the first few weeks, absolutely loving it. Then everything changed.

    The big story of the campaign is May's personal loss of aura and mojo. Her limitations have been fully revealed. The team we're sending into bat for us in the Brexit talks is weak, ill-prepared and in possession of no strategic advantages. That's a huge worry.
    And the opposite for Corbyn: unless Labour are trounced, his star is ascendant. He'll have seen off his detractors within the party. Again.
    It's something of a tragedy that only a Tory landslide will make Labour electable again. When Corbyn's MPs voted overwhelmingly to get rid of him it had nothing to do with consorting with terrorists or harbouring anti-semites or being too left wing. It was because he had not the first idea how to be a leader of a major party.

    This election might have shown himto be a reasonable populist but it went nowhere towards showing he could lead a party. His equivocation on the EU and appointments like Diane Abbott and Long Bailey have cost Labour literally dozens of seats.
    Yes, I think that's very fair. He's proven himself to be a competent campaigner. In the past I've described him as a poor salesman selling a poor message:

    I was wrong. He's a competent salesman selling a poor message to idiots.

    Whereas May comes out of this election as a poor sales manager who has just screwed up a product launch into an empty market.

    But Corbyn's leadership skills still appear to be terrible. *If* we have PM Corbyn tomorrow morning, then it'll be interesting to see if he can avert chaos.
  • Options
    CookieCookie Posts: 11,449
    These voting histories are interesting. It's surely not normal to find people moving around the country to this extent?
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,242
    Cookie said:

    Right - just off to vote. Turnout in Trafford expected to be down slightly - it's our special extra week of half term where we can take the kids on holiday and not pay summer holiday prices - pretty much all my daughters' schoolfreinds are away. Not that any of the Trafford seats are interesting enough for this to have an impact.

    How can you have an extra week of half term in the middle of GCSEs and A-levels? Genuine question.
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,678
    isam said:

    Brom said:

    https://twitter.com/Birdyword/status/872561253155299329

    Presumably something similar is also going on with Survation?

    You'd have to think that if turnout for GE2017 isn't up significantly (probably over 70%,) then the youth surge will have failed to materialise and that would be a good early indicator that the more Labour-leaning pollsters are wrong.

    And beyond that, what if there is a rise in turnout - but it consists disproportionately of people who stayed at home in 2015, but were motivated to vote Leave last year, and have now decided to back Mrs May to deliver Brexit?

    Voting commences in about 45 minutes, less than 16 hours to the Exit Poll. Tick, tock...

    Anecdote alert. I’ve never seen my 20-something grandchildren so fired up to vote. It’s not their first election, either.

    And it’s for Labour!
    Oh, and they voted Remain!
    As I've mentioned before it's not the children and grandchildren of PB members that Labour need the vote of. It's the 'don't care about politics' or 'the left school at 18s'. Are they really turned on to politics for the first time ever by Jeremy Corbyn? I have very, very strong doubts.
    One of my grandchildren, and a 'soon to be’ granddaughter-in-law teach what I still call VI formers. Thoise who can vote will, apparently, vote Labour. And the area in which they live is Tory .And it’s not JC that turns them on, appaerently, but the problems of housing, paying for Uni, and the (effective) cuts in education and health.

    Anecdote, tiny sample etc I know, I know.
    Feels sorry for Diane Abbott, thinks the social media bullying of her horrible.
    Would you have felt the same for a middle aged white male Tory?

    I feel sorry for her for the way she was treated by her party - "resigned due to ill health" at the peak of the campaign in the middle of Oxford Circus Tube en route to the BBC. Imagine the fuss if the Tories had behaved similarly.
    She’s pretty obviously ill.
    Really? What's she got?
    Chronic Embarrasment, Inflamed Ego and Bruised Self Esteem. Self awareness unaffected.
  • Options
    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891

    Roger said:

    rcs1000 said:

    IanB2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Smithson Junior, official 2017 election forecast.

    Con 42%, 370 seats
    Lab 34%, 203 seats
    SNP 4%, 42 seats
    LD 11%, 12 seats
    UKIP, 3%, 0 seats
    Green 2%, 0 seats
    PC, 3 seats


    And you've been telling us all how the Lib Dems are going to be hammered (except in Edinburgh West natch). They would bite your hand off for that right now. As I would for the SNP score!
    Not true.

    I've been - by the standards of this site - pretty optimistic on the LibDems.

    Here's my list:

    Twickenham
    One other SW London seat (either Richmond, Kingston, or C&W)

    O&S
    Edinburgh West
    Fife NE
    East Dunbartonshire

    Ceredgion

    Westmoreland & Lonsdale
    North Norfolk
    Sheffield Hallam

    Plus two from my possible list:
    Argyll & Bute
    Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross
    St Ives
    Bath
    Cheltenham
    Eastbourne
    Lewes
    OxWAb
    LibDem 'sources' seem optimistic about Twickenham, Kingston, Richmond at least being in play, East Dun, Cheltenham & W Ox in play, St Albans a better than average swing. Gloomier re. southport, worried for Norfolk - Lewes, St Ives, Caithness most unlikely.
    There was a big swing to the LDs in the Holyrood elections last year, and the SNP will likely be down to 38-39%. I think it's likelier than people think.
    Lib Dems also ahead in Vauxhall too.

    https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/872550006934433792
    Excellent news! One less Tory/UKIPer and they haven't even started counting the votes yet.
    Whatever the overall result, Hoey being thrown off the boat would be very pleasing.

    Edit to say - not least because of her anti-cycling views.
    But they do make a lovely couple......

    http://cdn.images.express.co.uk/img/dynamic/1/590x/BrexitCensureHoeyVoter-716427.jpg
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