Yes, but the process has been more than helped by a misdirected and out of touch campaign by the Lib Dems who blew it in the first fortnight by allowing Labour to totally dominate the scene. There was no way back after that. Whoever advised their campaign may be looking for a P45. Hammond might be PM by the weekend someone said, he might be Leader of the Opposition?
Ultimately, though, Tim Farron is a social conservative with left wing economic views.
If you are a social conservative, then your are already well served by the Conservatives. If you have left wing economic views, there is the Labour Party.
There is a niche for the Liberal Democrats. Under Tim Farron, who seems to have found it all a bit too much, they are not filling it.
One thing is that the Lib Dem vote comes out for every parish, town hall and all other local elections. Alot of support for the big two only bothers for a GE.
Which implies there is no more support out there for the LDs. If the LDs had two London based operatives directing 8 or 10 other helpers in Sedbergh for the Cumbria CC Elections - and they did, then what were they doing ? Either they were getting out voters who would have stayed at home otherwise or they were wasting time. In view of Sedbergh and Kirkby Lonsdale having I think the highest turnout in Cumbria, and probably anywhere on 4 May, at 55% I assume they were doing something. In that case, how many more LDs are there in Sedbergh to come out for Timmy on Thursday. Proportionally fewer than there are Tories.
Sedbergh is the most extreme example of this in Westmorland - it was always the hardest seat for the LDs to hold - curious they lost Windermere, presumably the Tories had a better candidate - but also the LDs didn't fight as hard there.
You might think the LDs would be trying harder in the four Kendal divisions where they had lesser fights on May 4 but the evidence on the ground suggests they are concentrating on their weakest Kendal division - one Kendal CCC has gone up to Carlisle to be parliamentary candidate.
Whilst we don't have much time for Farron himself W&L Conservatives do not under-estimate the power of the LD machine. Elections have always been intense in W&L since 2001 but it seems to me that CCHQ do not intend Farron to still be an MP on Friday, and they do not expect him to be either.
I was reading May's speech just now and for a second was genuinely bewildered that she was going on about Brexit - then remembered ah yes, that's what this election is supposed to be about. Really a classic example that you can't safely call an eleciton on one issue and expect it to stay that way.
Perhaps she should have called a referendum or something
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
Well said. Political differences aside, it was a hell of an effort by the police.
Those three terrorists would've set out thinking they'd kill a lot more people on a warm summer night with the UCL final on, in a trendy bar-area of London. To each be dead in eight minutes is very impressive.
Orkney and Shetland Ceredigion Westmorland and Lonsdale Edinborough West Twickenham North East Fife East Dunbartonshire Sheffield, Hallam Leeds North West
Do I win a prize if that is the final Lib Dem list ?
Looks very plausible to me that those 9 are won and no others. I've arranged into my personal order of probability too.
If I was doing a "wild stab in the dark", I would reckon the LDs would be more likely to get another London seat than Leeds NW. (I.e. one of Kingston, RP and C&W).
Other than that, it looks a very reasonable guesstimate.
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
Police officers will be issued with personal Tardises, enabling them to travel back to the moment before the crime was committed.
Tardi?
Nope, Tardises.
Grammar is not my strong point, TSE. I can see this site is edited by the alumnuses of very good schools.
I love my grammar, plus I remember the ComicCon where the plural of Tardis was discussed.
The debate was the plural of Tardis either Tardises or Tardis (like sheep is the plural of sheep) but definitely not Tardii.
One big difference is that while PIRA were willing to risk their lives, they never carried out suicide attacks (they forced other people to).
It's very difficult to provide complete protection, when the attacker is willing to die as a martyr.
There was a piece in The Times a few weeks ago which said if the IRA had the technology available now they would have caused a lot more carnage.
They'd have loved having mobile phones that triggered bombs for example
But, then public opinion might have supported a much more savage response from the authorities.
What would you have considered a 'much more savage response' in the context of the Troubles?
I'd imagine much of the time (like so many of these nasty little wars), a much more savage response was what the IRA wanted.
In most cases, there's a kind of unspoken bargain between the terrorists and security services. Each accepts limits on what they're willing to do. But, if the IRA had been carrying out random bombings on the Tube, or of pop concerts, I imagine the authorities would have responded much like the Israelis.
Another factor for the IRA was to keep its supporters both in Ireland and America onside, so there evolved a system of attacks against "justified" targets preceded by coded warnings to evacuate -- moving away from murdering civilians in pubs (or horses in parks or 8-year-olds at concerts) that caused a drop in donations.
Edit: of course it is often said that what ended the IRA's campaign was 9/11 after which terrorism was no longer seen by Americans as justifiable.
If it's 'often said' doesn't that suggest there are a lot of stupid people about, considering The Good Friday Agreement was signed in 1998.
One big difference is that while PIRA were willing to risk their lives, they never carried out suicide attacks (they forced other people to).
It's very difficult to provide complete protection, when the attacker is willing to die as a martyr.
There was a piece in The Times a few weeks ago which said if the IRA had the technology available now they would have caused a lot more carnage.
They'd have loved having mobile phones that triggered bombs for example
But, then public opinion might have supported a much more savage response from the authorities.
What would you have considered a 'much more savage response' in the context of the Troubles?
I'd imagine much of the time (like so many of these nasty little wars), a much more savage response was what the IRA wanted.
In most cases, there's a kind of unspoken bargain between the terrorists and security services. Each accepts limits on what they're willing to do. But, if the IRA had been carrying out random bombings on the Tube, or of pop concerts, I imagine the authorities would have responded much like the Israelis.
Another factor for the IRA was to keep its supporters both in Ireland and America onside, so there evolved a system of attacks against "justified" targets preceded by coded warnings to evacuate -- moving away from murdering civilians in pubs (or horses in parks or 8-year-olds at concerts) that caused a drop in donations.
Edit: of course it is often said that what ended the IRA's campaign was 9/11 after which terrorism was no longer seen by Americans as justifiable.
The IRA made most of its money from extortion and from businesses it ran or took a cut from, not from passing a collection tin around people who had a choice whether to put something in or not. The US was a very minor source.
9/11 was in 2001 and was not a factor. More of a factor was the housing boom in Ireland in which there were big opportunities for gangsters to make lots of money without waving their shooters around so much.
Did all those extra officers,in the various forces, stop the attacks in 2005?
What point are you trying to make?
It appears that the meme from Labour HQ today is suggesting that the officers that took out the scum in 8 minutes weren't good enough. Nice.
Extra officers deploy into communities. Gathering intelligence. Which allows the authorities to stop attacks whilst they are being considered. Which is what the police federation told May in 2015. Which she described as "scaremongering"
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
Police officers will be issued with personal Tardises, enabling them to travel back to the moment before the crime was committed.
Tardi?
Nope, Tardises.
Grammar is not my strong point, TSE. I can see this site is edited by the alumnuses of very good schools.
I love my grammar, plus I remember the ComicCon where the plural of Tardis was discussed.
The debate was the plural of Tardis either Tardises or Tardis (like sheep is the plural of sheep) but definitely not Tardii.
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
Police officers will be issued with personal Tardises, enabling them to travel back to the moment before the crime was committed.
Tardi?
Nope, Tardises.
Grammar is not my strong point, TSE. I can see this site is edited by the alumnuses of very good schools.
I love my grammar, plus I remember the ComicCon where the plural of Tardis was discussed.
The debate was the plural of Tardis either Tardises or Tardis (like sheep is the plural of sheep) but definitely not Tardii.
What is the plural of penis? Go with what that suggests.
This gives the Tories a 76 seat range, 65 for Labour with SNP getting between 17 and 52 and LibDems between 7 and 21. It looks as though the uncertainty is so large it would be surprising if they got it wrong.
Note that the high/low numbers gap for the parties also seems to be getting larger the closer we get to the election, not smaller. Their first prediction (less than a week ago, although it seems like an age) had the Conservative spread at 69 seats, Labour at 62. Now we're at 76 for the Conservatives and 65 for Labour.
I find this very counter-intuitive, I expected the range the narrow over time.
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
Police officers will be issued with personal Tardises, enabling them to travel back to the moment before the crime was committed.
Tardi?
Nope, Tardises.
Grammar is not my strong point, TSE. I can see this site is edited by the alumnuses of very good schools.
I love my grammar, plus I remember the ComicCon where the plural of Tardis was discussed.
The debate was the plural of Tardis either Tardises or Tardis (like sheep is the plural of sheep) but definitely not Tardii.
'Tardis' is an acronym so shouldn't it be written 'TARDIS' with its plural as 'TARDISes'?
The Saudi government is no more responsible for the funding of Isis by some of its citizens than the UK government has been responsible for the funding of the IRA by some UK citizens.
Maybe not spending all the money so the government had to cut stuff would have been a good start.
And yet this government has added £700bn to the national debt since that cretin Byrne left his joke note
You lefties trot out this tired financially illiteral bullshit every time, it might wash with the more gullible members of the public, but don't expect it to be believed here.
Gordon Brown left us spending £160,000,000,000 more every year than we took in from taxes and other income. To not grow the national debt after that we would have had to slash public spending by that much in 2010 and keep it down every subsequent year, the equivalent of the entire health budget.... and you would not have complained ? Pull the other one.
I was reading May's speech just now and for a second was genuinely bewildered that she was going on about Brexit - then remembered ah yes, that's what this election is supposed to be about. Really a classic example that you can't safely call an eleciton on one issue and expect it to stay that way.
Perhaps she should have called a referendum or something
It would also make the debate sharper if the parties were actually expressing coherent policies on it, rather than both of them wanting all the popular things and not wanting all the unpopular things and leaving the voters to guess which things they'd trade off against which other things.
Would those 20,000 police officers have all been on duty on London Bridge and at Borough on Saturday night?
And even if they had, could they have stopped that attack?
Did all those extra officers,in the various forces, stop the attacks in 2005?
What point are you trying to make?
You talk to any officer in London and they will tell you the force is underfunded and underresourced.
2 of my best friends are Dan. I was at their house Saturday night as this was kicking off. And yes, they do say that. But, they also accept that no amount of officers on the beat will stop this type of attack.
Their twopennerth is that more cash needs to go to the security services.
Yes, but the process has been more than helped by a misdirected and out of touch campaign by the Lib Dems who blew it in the first fortnight by allowing Labour to totally dominate the scene. There was no way back after that. Whoever advised their campaign may be looking for a P45. Hammond might be PM by the weekend someone said, he might be Leader of the Opposition?
Ultimately, though, Tim Farron is a social conservative with left wing economic views.
If you are a social conservative, then your are already well served by the Conservatives. If you have left wing economic views, there is the Labour Party.
There is a niche for the Liberal Democrats. Under Tim Farron, who seems to have found it all a bit too much, they are not filling it.
One thing is that the Lib Dem vote comes out for every parish, town hall and all other local elections. Alot of support for the big two only bothers for a GE.
Which implies there is no more support out there for the LDs. If the LDs had two London based operatives directing 8 or 10 other helpers in Sedbergh for the Cumbria CC Elections - and they did, then what were they doing ? Either they were getting out voters who would have stayed at home otherwise or they were wasting time. In view of Sedbergh and Kirkby Lonsdale having I think the highest turnout in Cumbria, and probably anywhere on 4 May, at 55% I assume they were doing something. In that case, how many more LDs are there in Sedbergh to come out for Timmy on Thursday. Proportionally fewer than there are Tories.
Sedbergh is the most extreme example of this in Westmorland - it was always the hardest seat for the LDs to hold - curious they lost Windermere, presumably the Tories had a better candidate - but also the LDs didn't fight as hard there.
You might think the LDs would be trying harder in the four Kendal divisions where they had lesser fights on May 4 but the evidence on the ground suggests they are concentrating on their weakest Kendal division - one Kendal CCC has gone up to Carlisle to be parliamentary candidate.
Whilst we don't have much time for Farron himself W&L Conservatives do not under-estimate the power of the LD machine. Elections have always been intense in W&L since 2001 but it seems to me that CCHQ do not intend Farron to still be an MP on Friday, and they do not expect him to be either.
If Farron were defeated, I think that would - longer-term - be bad for the Conservatives and good for the Liberal Democrats.
Much better for a speech and press conference to stand in front of a bookcase rather than variety of gurning youngsters bearing placards. Old school wins out.
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
There will be no need for a response. Jeremy will solve terrorism through talking, obviously.
If Jeremy is to be believed, his chats with the IRA worked a treat, so why not?
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
Police officers will be issued with personal Tardises, enabling them to travel back to the moment before the crime was committed.
Tardi?
Nope, Tardises.
Grammar is not my strong point, TSE. I can see this site is edited by the alumnuses of very good schools.
I love my grammar, plus I remember the ComicCon where the plural of Tardis was discussed.
The debate was the plural of Tardis either Tardises or Tardis (like sheep is the plural of sheep) but definitely not Tardii.
What is the plural of penis? Go with what that suggests.
Maybe not spending all the money so the government had to cut stuff would have been a good start.
And yet this government has added £700bn to the national debt since that cretin Byrne left his joke note
You lefties trot out this tired financial illiteral bullshit every time, it might wash with the more gullible members of the public, but don't expect it to be believed here.
Gordon Brown left us spending £160,000,000,000 more every year than we took in from taxes and other income. To not grow the national debt after that we would have had to slash public spending by that much in 2010 and keep it down every subsequent year, the equivalent of the entire health budget.... and you would not have complained ? Pull the other one.
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
Police officers will be issued with personal Tardises, enabling them to travel back to the moment before the crime was committed.
Tardi?
Nope, Tardises.
Grammar is not my strong point, TSE. I can see this site is edited by the alumnuses of very good schools.
I love my grammar, plus I remember the ComicCon where the plural of Tardis was discussed.
The debate was the plural of Tardis either Tardises or Tardis (like sheep is the plural of sheep) but definitely not Tardii.
What is the plural of penis? Go with what that suggests.
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
Police officers will be issued with personal Tardises, enabling them to travel back to the moment before the crime was committed.
Tardi?
Nope, Tardises.
Grammar is not my strong point, TSE. I can see this site is edited by the alumnuses of very good schools.
I love my grammar, plus I remember the ComicCon where the plural of Tardis was discussed.
The debate was the plural of Tardis either Tardises or Tardis (like sheep is the plural of sheep) but definitely not Tardii.
'Tardis' is an acronym so shouldn't it be written 'TARDIS' with its plural as 'TARDISes'?
Not all acronyms are in block caps, e.g. laser, radar.
It's not cellphones that would have made the big difference it's portable, extremely low cost microcontrollers with connectivity, sensors and power switching capability, like arduinos.
I agree with that generally, although a phone could serve almost as well. I'm still not convinced that it would make a great difference to the IRA, as they had the technical skill.
Really though they main difference was that the IRA could either acquire high-explosives or make them, and current day terrorists either can't or do a relatively poor job.
Much better for a speech and press conference to stand in front of a bookcase rather than variety of gurning youngsters bearing placards. Old school wins out.
Is it the same venue where she launched her bid for the leadership?
One big difference is that while PIRA were willing to risk their lives, they never carried out suicide attacks (they forced other people to).
It's very difficult to provide complete protection, when the attacker is willing to die as a martyr.
There was a piece in The Times a few weeks ago which said if the IRA had the technology available now they would have caused a lot more carnage.
They'd have loved having mobile phones that triggered bombs for example
They were very much able to trigger bombs with radio devices.
But mobiles make it much more easier and devastating.
Easier maybe, but there a big downsides to using a mobile for a trigger, but how is it more devastating?
It's not cellphones that would have made the big difference it's portable, extremely low cost microcontrollers with connectivity, sensors and power switching capability, like arduinos.
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
Police officers will be issued with personal Tardises, enabling them to travel back to the moment before the crime was committed.
Tardi?
Nope, Tardises.
Grammar is not my strong point, TSE. I can see this site is edited by the alumnuses of very good schools.
I love my grammar, plus I remember the ComicCon where the plural of Tardis was discussed.
The debate was the plural of Tardis either Tardises or Tardis (like sheep is the plural of sheep) but definitely not Tardii.
Maybe not spending all the money so the government had to cut stuff would have been a good start.
And yet this government has added £700bn to the national debt since that cretin Byrne left his joke note
You lefties trot out this tired financial illiteral bullshit every time, it might wash with the more gullible members of the public, but don't expect it to be believed here.
Gordon Brown left us spending £160,000,000,000 more every year than we took in from taxes and other income. To not grow the national debt after that we would have had to slash public spending by that much in 2010 and keep it down every subsequent year, the equivalent of the entire health budget.... and you would not have complained ? Pull the other one.
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
Police officers will be issued with personal Tardises, enabling them to travel back to the moment before the crime was committed.
Tardi?
Nope, Tardises.
Grammar is not my strong point, TSE. I can see this site is edited by the alumnuses of very good schools.
I love my grammar, plus I remember the ComicCon where the plural of Tardis was discussed.
The debate was the plural of Tardis either Tardises or Tardis (like sheep is the plural of sheep) but definitely not Tardii.
What is the plural of penis? Go with what that suggests.
Maybe not spending all the money so the government had to cut stuff would have been a good start.
And yet this government has added £700bn to the national debt since that cretin Byrne left his joke note
You lefties trot out this tired financially illiteral bullshit every time, it might wash with the more gullible members of the public, but don't expect it to be believed here.
Gordon Brown left us spending £160,000,000,000 more every year than we took in from taxes and other income. To not grow the national debt after that we would have had to slash public spending by that much in 2010 and keep it down every subsequent year, the equivalent of the entire health budget.... and you would not have complained ? Pull the other one.
Does seem a little unfair to criticize the cuts for being to deep and whine about the national debt rising in the same breath. Tough gig...
Yes, but the process has been more than helped by a misdirected and out of touch campaign by the Lib Dems who blew it in the first fortnight by allowing Labour to totally dominate the scene. There was no way back after that. Whoever advised their campaign may be looking for a P45. Hammond might be PM by the weekend someone said, he might be Leader of the Opposition?
Ultimately, though, Tim Farron is a social conservative with left wing economic views.
If you are a social conservative, then your are already well served by the Conservatives. If you have left wing economic views, there is the Labour Party.
There is a niche for the Liberal Democrats. Under Tim Farron, who seems to have found it all a bit too much, they are not filling it.
One thing is that the Lib Dem vote comes out for every parish, town hall and all other local elections. Alot of support for the big two only bothers for a GE.
Which implies there is no more support out there for the LDs. If the LDs had two London based operatives directing 8 or 10 other helpers in Sedbergh for the Cumbria CC Elections - and they did, then what were they doing ? Either they were getting out voters who would have stayed at home otherwise or they were wasting time. In view of Sedbergh and Kirkby Lonsdale having I think the highest turnout in Cumbria, and probably anywhere on 4 May, at 55% I assume they were doing something. In that case, how many more LDs are there in Sedbergh to come out for Timmy on Thursday. Proportionally fewer than there are Tories.
Sedbergh is the most extreme example of this in Westmorland - it was always the hardest seat for the LDs to hold - curious they lost Windermere, presumably the Tories had a better candidate - but also the LDs didn't fight as hard there.
You might think the LDs would be trying harder in the four Kendal divisions where they had lesser fights on May 4 but the evidence on the ground suggests they are concentrating on their weakest Kendal division - one Kendal CCC has gone up to Carlisle to be parliamentary candidate.
Whilst we don't have much time for Farron himself W&L Conservatives do not under-estimate the power of the LD machine. Elections have always been intense in W&L since 2001 but it seems to me that CCHQ do not intend Farron to still be an MP on Friday, and they do not expect him to be either.
Yes Sedbergh is always the closest CC contest but the Lib Dems were helped this year by the Conservatives putting up a retread serial loser .
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
There will be no need for a response. Jeremy will solve terrorism through talking, obviously.
If Jeremy is to be believed, his chats with the IRA worked a treat, so why not?
You want a global caliphate? Well ok. But we want a united Ireland.
Did all those extra officers,in the various forces, stop the attacks in 2005?
What point are you trying to make?
It appears that the meme from Labour HQ today is suggesting that the officers that took out the scum in 8 minutes weren't good enough. Nice.
Extra officers deploy into communities. Gathering intelligence.
The Manchester bomber was already known as a wrong-u n. What wasn't connected was that he had flipped out, been back to Libya had training and tooled himself up with some bomb-making gear.
An extra few PCSOs walking around are not going to pick that up. More money can be spent on anti-terror work but it needs to be targeted where it will make the most difference not just hosed all over special interests.
The Saudi government is no more responsible for the funding of Isis by some of its citizens than the UK government has been responsible for the funding of the IRA by some UK citizens.
There are no grounds for thinking that there is a valid analogy there. The wealth of SA is concentrated among about 2,000 members of the royal family, which is also the government. An analogy with the UK might work a bit better if everyone in both Houses of Parliament were also a cousin of Mrs May, and the IRA were funded by MPs.
One big difference is that while PIRA were willing to risk their lives, they never carried out suicide attacks (they forced other people to).
It's very difficult to provide complete protection, when the attacker is willing to die as a martyr.
There was a piece in The Times a few weeks ago which said if the IRA had the technology available now they would have caused a lot more carnage.
They'd have loved having mobile phones that triggered bombs for example
They were very much able to trigger bombs with radio devices.
But mobiles make it much more easier and devastating.
Easier maybe, but there a big downsides to using a mobile for a trigger, but how is it more devastating?
It's not cellphones that would have made the big difference it's portable, extremely low cost microcontrollers with connectivity, sensors and power switching capability, like arduinos.
Is it wise posting something like that?
If you have people prepared to commit suicide its all a bit beside the point, he just has it inside his suitcase or jacket. That fact that they don't implies the problem is getting hold of the explosives.
Would those 20,000 police officers have all been on duty on London Bridge and at Borough on Saturday night?
And even if they had, could they have stopped that attack?
Did all those extra officers,in the various forces, stop the attacks in 2005?
What point are you trying to make?
You talk to any officer in London and they will tell you the force is underfunded and underresourced.
2 of my best friends are Dan. I was at their house Saturday night as this was kicking off. And yes, they do say that. But, they also accept that no amount of officers on the beat will stop this type of attack.
Their twopennerth is that more cash needs to go to the security services.
My best mate is an officer, the stories he's told me about working conditions have convinced me there is no debate to be had, the police needs more money and fast.
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
Police officers will be issued with personal Tardises, enabling them to travel back to the moment before the crime was committed.
Tardi?
Nope, Tardises.
Grammar is not my strong point, TSE. I can see this site is edited by the alumnuses of very good schools.
I love my grammar, plus I remember the ComicCon where the plural of Tardis was discussed.
The debate was the plural of Tardis either Tardises or Tardis (like sheep is the plural of sheep) but definitely not Tardii.
What is the plural of penis? Go with what that suggests.
Would those 20,000 police officers have all been on duty on London Bridge and at Borough on Saturday night?
And even if they had, could they have stopped that attack?
Did all those extra officers,in the various forces, stop the attacks in 2005?
What point are you trying to make?
You talk to any officer in London and they will tell you the force is underfunded and underresourced.
whoever has ever said "this job's a doddle, plenty of time to keep on top of my social media so I really don't need any help or deserve a pay rise"? even if that's the position - not that I'm suggesting that our policemen aren't wonderful.
Would those 20,000 police officers have all been on duty on London Bridge and at Borough on Saturday night?
And even if they had, could they have stopped that attack?
Did all those extra officers,in the various forces, stop the attacks in 2005?
What point are you trying to make?
You talk to any officer in London and they will tell you the force is underfunded and underresourced.
2 of my best friends are Dan. I was at their house Saturday night as this was kicking off. And yes, they do say that. But, they also accept that no amount of officers on the beat will stop this type of attack.
Their twopennerth is that more cash needs to go to the security services.
My best mate is an officer, the stories he's told me about working conditions have convinced me there is no debate to be had, the police needs more money and fast.
The police have had ACTUAL cuts unlike alot of other departments. I've got alot more time for them than the whinging coming out from Doctors.
If the Lib Dem vote is as efficient as it was between 1997 and 2010 then you'd expect the party to elect 20-22 MPs on an 8% share of the vote. Even with only a partial return to the tactical voting that fuelled the gains in the late '90s and early '00s, the LDs could lose vote share and double the size of the Parliamentary party.
I think predicting the number of Lib Dem MPs that are going to be elected is a uniquely tricky exercise. 2015 was an exceptional election.
Did all those extra officers,in the various forces, stop the attacks in 2005? What point are you trying to make? It appears that the meme from Labour HQ today is suggesting that the officers that took out the scum in 8 minutes weren't good enough. Nice.
Extra officers deploy into communities. Gathering intelligence.
The Manchester bomber was already known as a wrong-u n. What wasn't connected was that he had flipped out, been back to Libya had training and tooled himself up with some bomb-making gear.
An extra few PCSOs walking around are not going to pick that up. More money can be spent on anti-terror work but it needs to be targeted where it will make the most difference not just hosed all over special interests.
It was said at the time the Americans were trying to track AQ across Afghanistan that the opposition had learned to go very low tech inorder to remove their exposure to electronic intelligence gathering, and make inflitration extremely difficult. In essence meetings were always held face to face, no one used the internet or cellphones, and cells were composed of family groups who knew and trusted each other by sight, and would spot anyone trying to slip in amongst them instantly. Not sure a few PCSO are going to get very far.
The Saudi government is no more responsible for the funding of Isis by some of its citizens than the UK government has been responsible for the funding of the IRA by some UK citizens.
The parallel would be extremely rich British people based in Britain - members of the elite - funding terrorism and long-term terrorist networks in many countries around the world, and everyone knowing that they were doing it. Much of the Saudi funding is state funding anyway, insofar as the distinction between state and private hardly exists in the Saudi company state.
The Saudi government is no more responsible for the funding of Isis by some of its citizens than the UK government has been responsible for the funding of the IRA by some UK citizens.
There are no grounds for thinking that there is a valid analogy there. The wealth of SA is concentrated among about 2,000 members of the royal family, which is also the government. An analogy with the UK might work a bit better if everyone in both Houses of Parliament were also a cousin of Mrs May, and the IRA were funded by MPs.
Which members of the Saudi government are funding ISIS?
Would those 20,000 police officers have all been on duty on London Bridge and at Borough on Saturday night?
And even if they had, could they have stopped that attack?
Did all those extra officers,in the various forces, stop the attacks in 2005?
What point are you trying to make?
You talk to any officer in London and they will tell you the force is underfunded and underresourced.
2 of my best friends are Dan. I was at their house Saturday night as this was kicking off. And yes, they do say that. But, they also accept that no amount of officers on the beat will stop this type of attack.
Their twopennerth is that more cash needs to go to the security services.
My best mate is an officer, the stories he's told me about working conditions have convinced me there is no debate to be had, the police needs more money and fast.
and that fact that your man was on the telly telling everyone this just now makes no difference to this ? Anyone seen Mandy around?
Would those 20,000 police officers have all been on duty on London Bridge and at Borough on Saturday night?
And even if they had, could they have stopped that attack?
Did all those extra officers,in the various forces, stop the attacks in 2005?
What point are you trying to make?
You talk to any officer in London and they will tell you the force is underfunded and underresourced.
2 of my best friends are Dan. I was at their house Saturday night as this was kicking off. And yes, they do say that. But, they also accept that no amount of officers on the beat will stop this type of attack.
Their twopennerth is that more cash needs to go to the security services.
My best mate is an officer, the stories he's told me about working conditions have convinced me there is no debate to be had, the police needs more money and fast.
Fair enough. I've heard similar. Though to be fair I hear a fair amount of whinging for the sake of it too!
But again, I stand by the point, no amount of coppers will stop this type of attack. This is my police friends' professional opinion. Yes money may be needed but surely intelligence is where it needs to go?
If there were 20,000 extra spooks that may actually be massively beneficial?!
Would those 20,000 police officers have all been on duty on London Bridge and at Borough on Saturday night?
And even if they had, could they have stopped that attack?
Did all those extra officers,in the various forces, stop the attacks in 2005?
What point are you trying to make?
You talk to any officer in London and they will tell you the force is underfunded and underresourced.
2 of my best friends are Dan. I was at their house Saturday night as this was kicking off. And yes, they do say that. But, they also accept that no amount of officers on the beat will stop this type of attack.
Their twopennerth is that more cash needs to go to the security services.
My best mate is an officer, the stories he's told me about working conditions have convinced me there is no debate to be had, the police needs more money and fast.
The police have had ACTUAL cuts unlike alot of other departments. I've got alot more time for them than the whinging coming out from Doctors.
It is more a question of transferring resources from aimlessly patrolling police on the beat to terrorist police and internet oversight.
If ICM is correct and the Tories are on 45%, they would beat John Major's record for the most votes ever if turnout is at least 68% or so.
Whats your feeling on turnout ?
And everyone elses for that matter.
I reckon perhaps 64% or so, with more potential on the upside than downside.
At the start of the campaign I thought it might be down slightly but now I think it's more likely to be up slightly, to around 67-68%. I'd be surprised by 70% despite Corbyn's "youth surge".
The Saudi government is no more responsible for the funding of Isis by some of its citizens than the UK government has been responsible for the funding of the IRA by some UK citizens.
There are no grounds for thinking that there is a valid analogy there. The wealth of SA is concentrated among about 2,000 members of the royal family, which is also the government. An analogy with the UK might work a bit better if everyone in both Houses of Parliament were also a cousin of Mrs May, and the IRA were funded by MPs.
Which members of the Saudi government are funding ISIS?
The ones with all the money. And with immediate access to very expensive London libel lawyers.
And as far as I'm aware that doesn't have Labour Central office laying out mega wonga to slap it infront of every Youtube video.
It was made by Ealing Labour and pushed through Facebook so of course it comes from Labour funding in any case I doubt these social media videos make much difference, they are mainly watched by the already converted, old fashioned PPBs and posters are a more effective method of reaching genuine swing voters
So, to be clear: if 8 minutes from first 999 call to the three terrorists lying dead and riddled with 50 bullets is evidence of insufficient police resources and preparation, how effective can we expect the response to be under Labour?
Police officers will be issued with personal Tardises, enabling them to travel back to the moment before the crime was committed.
Tardi?
Nope, Tardises.
Grammar is not my strong point, TSE. I can see this site is edited by the alumnuses of very good schools.
I love my grammar, plus I remember the ComicCon where the plural of Tardis was discussed.
The debate was the plural of Tardis either Tardises or Tardis (like sheep is the plural of sheep) but definitely not Tardii.
What is the plural of penis? Go with what that suggests.
One mouse... two mice One house... two... oh
The upper class say hice - don't ya know.
No, they don't.
"The Hice" is the correct pronunciation for "Christchurch" in twit.
Yes, but the process has been more than helped by a misdirected and out of touch campaign by the Lib Dems who blew it in the first fortnight by allowing Labour to totally dominate the scene. There was no way back after that. Whoever advised their campaign may be looking for a P45. Hammond might be PM by the weekend someone said, he might be Leader of the Opposition?
Ultimately, though, Tim Farron is a social conservative with left wing economic views.
If you are a social conservative, then your are already well served by the Conservatives. If you have left wing economic views, there is the Labour Party.
There is a niche for the Liberal Democrats. Under Tim Farron, who seems to have found it all a bit too much, they are not filling it.
One thing is that the Lib Dem vote comes out for every parish, town hall and all other local elections. Alot of support for the big two only bothers for a GE.
Which implies there is no more support out there for the LDs. If the LDs had two London based operatives directing 8 or 10 other helpers in Sedbergh for the Cumbria CC Elections - and they did, then what were they doing ? Either they were getting out voters who would have stayed at home otherwise or they were wasting time. In view of Sedbergh and Kirkby Lonsdale having I think the highest turnout in Cumbria, and probably anywhere on 4 May, at 55% I assume they were doing something. In that case, how many more LDs are there in Sedbergh to come out for Timmy on Thursday. Proportionally fewer than there are Tories.
Sedbergh is the most extreme example of this in Westmorland - it was always the hardest seat for the LDs to hold - curious they lost Windermere, presumably the Tories had a better candidate - but also the LDs didn't fight as hard there.
You might think the LDs would be trying harder in the four Kendal divisions where they had lesser fights on May 4 but the evidence on the ground suggests they are concentrating on their weakest Kendal division - one Kendal CCC has gone up to Carlisle to be parliamentary candidate.
Whilst we don't have much time for Farron himself W&L Conservatives do not under-estimate the power of the LD machine. Elections have always been intense in W&L since 2001 but it seems to me that CCHQ do not intend Farron to still be an MP on Friday, and they do not expect him to be either.
Yes Sedbergh is always the closest CC contest but the Lib Dems were helped this year by the Conservatives putting up a retread serial loser .
Mark you do yourself no credit with this sort of unpleasant pettiness.
I think that ICM poll will match the actual result almost exactly, Labour up to 1992 levels but still a swing of 2% from Labour to Tory as the Tories are up to 1970 levels. I expect the Labour to Tory swing to be higher in the North and Scotland but lower in London and there may even be a small swing to Labour in the South
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Sedbergh is the most extreme example of this in Westmorland - it was always the hardest seat for the LDs to hold - curious they lost Windermere, presumably the Tories had a better candidate - but also the LDs didn't fight as hard there.
You might think the LDs would be trying harder in the four Kendal divisions where they had lesser fights on May 4 but the evidence on the ground suggests they are concentrating on their weakest Kendal division - one Kendal CCC has gone up to Carlisle to be parliamentary candidate.
Whilst we don't have much time for Farron himself W&L Conservatives do not under-estimate the power of the LD machine. Elections have always been intense in W&L since 2001 but it seems to me that CCHQ do not intend Farron to still be an MP on Friday, and they do not expect him to be either.
Perhaps she should have called a referendum or something
Those three terrorists would've set out thinking they'd kill a lot more people on a warm summer night with the UCL final on, in a trendy bar-area of London. To each be dead in eight minutes is very impressive.
Other than that, it looks a very reasonable guesstimate.
https://www.gov.uk/government/world/qatar
The debate was the plural of Tardis either Tardises or Tardis (like sheep is the plural of sheep) but definitely not Tardii.
9/11 was in 2001 and was not a factor. More of a factor was the housing boom in Ireland in which there were big opportunities for gangsters to make lots of money without waving their shooters around so much.
https://twitter.com/stephentall/status/871677783130464256
Surely it is 'alumni' lover of grammar.
Or were you using sarcasm?
(I predicted both Leave and Trump, but ballsed up with Le Pen.)
I find this very counter-intuitive, I expected the range the narrow over time.
WillS.
https://twitter.com/danbloom1/status/871675529937784833
Gordon Brown left us spending £160,000,000,000 more every year than we took in from taxes and other income. To not grow the national debt after that we would have had to slash public spending by that much in 2010 and keep it down every subsequent year, the equivalent of the entire health budget.... and you would not have complained ? Pull the other one.
Their twopennerth is that more cash needs to go to the security services.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06/05/duty-doctors-staying-sober-saturday-nights-ready-major-terror/
Nameof the consultant is a bit
One house... two... oh
Really though they main difference was that the IRA could either acquire high-explosives or make them, and current day terrorists either can't or do a relatively poor job.
https://twitter.com/waddeller/status/870640117773459456
Hth.
Perpetual Economic Nonsense Involving Socialism
FFS this woman does not have a clue.
An extra few PCSOs walking around are not going to pick that up. More money can be spent on anti-terror work but it needs to be targeted where it will make the most difference not just hosed all over special interests.
This video has got over 5 million views in less than a day, and it's not exactly optimal for Theresa May
https://www.facebook.com/EalingLabour4Corbyn/videos/538044779919764/
You started it!
But yes - pretty damning, suspect all the more powerful because delivered by an apparently independent police officer...
I think predicting the number of Lib Dem MPs that are going to be elected is a uniquely tricky exercise. 2015 was an exceptional election.
And everyone elses for that matter.
I reckon perhaps 64% or so, with more potential on the upside than downside.
But again, I stand by the point, no amount of coppers will stop this type of attack. This is my police friends' professional opinion. Yes money may be needed but surely intelligence is where it needs to go?
If there were 20,000 extra spooks that may actually be massively beneficial?!
On most definitions I've seen, it involves (at least) two individuals, though.
@MartinHoscik: As @PickardJE just said, this is a baffling thing to say 3 days out from polling day. twitter.com/rachyoungeritv…
@JamesTapsfield: This is just a bit odd three days before an election twitter.com/rachyoungeritv…
Tactically I suspect this exaggeration is a good move to ensure police funding stays in the news.
WillS
"The Hice" is the correct pronunciation for "Christchurch" in twit.