If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
The kep point seems that the £ has now been a one-way bet since the 1950s and nothing a P.M or govt. has done - least of all, that Bloody Woman 1979-90 - seems to improve UK PLC's ability to pay its way ... This ability might be improved by having 7 year vocational education programmes for all school leavers @ 16-17, as in Germany, and other drastic measures.
It seems a shameful verdict on the management of UK PLC. Whether you look at the S.Fr or 'softer' currencies like the US or Canadian $, the £ has been sliding at an average of many percent per year, all my life.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
Yes we get it but you know perfectly well that this scale of devaluation is not a sign of a national economy, strong and confident and ready to take on the world. It is a clear sign of weakness if businesses need a trashed currency to sell their goods abroad rather than operating efficiently in a competitive market.
Huge volatility, post-Brexit vote, was a given. The Brexiteers (and I have to admit there were some) who claimed it would all be plain sailing were fools or frauds.
Indeed and they are still saying it on this very thread. The pretence that a 30% devaluation is clever economics reflecting a strong and vibrant economy.. all in the name of 'taking control' and getting rid of foreigners.
It's looking like being an expensive Christmas. The prices of electronic gadgets and toys must surely be pretty vulnerable to sterling weakness.
I worked in the States for many years. Cost of children's clothes,CD,s and all manner of things I carried back was the the same number in dollars there but in sterling here hence hugely more expensive here for the same article.
Had nothing to do with exchange rates just we were always charged more on a commercial basis for the same product on the shelves and we had no choice. I noticed it as I regularly commuted back and forth for close on 10 years.
It also sends out terrible signals. It's no way to convince the markets that Global Britain is open for business.
But I'm not convinced it's terribly racist. The current law of this land mandates that employers generally must discriminate against non-British applicants for jobs, with certain exceptions for certain types of non-Brits, mostly white and European. It's written in the UN Declaration of Human Rights that Everyone has the right to work, to free choice of employment - a right for every adult on this planet - and yet if there is a job in London, an applicant from Madras is disbarred from it so long as there is a suitable applicant from Manchester (or, at present, Munich). If forcing companies to reveal how they complied with these laws is ethically wrong, isn't the underlying and essentially explicitly racist (if one believes the definition of "racism" includes discrimination by nationality) set of employment laws, several whole orders of magnitude more egregious? Surely it's a thousand-fold worse to deny tens of thousands of Indians and Chinese, Africans and Latin Americans, the prospect of economic prosperity in this country than it is to publish how many exceptions were made?
If I was seething at this publication proposal, I would be positively incandescent about the resident labour test - to the tune of giving up my job in solidarity with the global unemployed and starting a protest camp outside the Home Office. Why should any qualified candidate be banned from coming to the UK if there is a useful economic contribution they can make and an employer hoping to take them on?
Borders exclude. And the people they exclude are, by definition, foreigners. Borders are therefore, by definition, racist (if we carefully select the definition of the word "racist"). Isn't this where the logic - if not the "electoral viability test" - ultimately takes you, if we go down the "racism" rabbit hole?
The LDs have won the Highlands council seat by 25 votes after transfers despite being a long way behind on the first count which was as follows:
Culloden and Ardsier
SNP - 753 (27.2%) LIB - 463 (16.7%) CON - 439 (15.9%) IND - 315 (11.4%) IND - 274 (9.9%) GRN - 180 (6.5%) LAB - 163 (5.9%) IND - 158 (5.7%) IND - 23 (0.8%)
Any ideas why the LDs are in favour of AV????
The dynamic in Scotland is different. The SNP do badly in Council byelections because slightly more people hate it than love it. Second preference votes will go to another Unionist party.
Can someone explain to me how this is possible? Genuinely? Why is Germany allowed to implement a policy that means EU migrants need to have been in the Country FIVE years before they can claim benefits, when Cameron was forbidden from allowing the UK to restrict benefits for FOUR years?
Because they run the EU and nothing happens in the EU unless they say so.
Example Brexit negotiations ongoing but always quoted " will Merkel accept it" or "will Germany agree?" Just look at any paper it's the next thing to the reported story and statement of what is going to happen.
Merkel this Merkel that .... Etc It's why we are no longer there.
It's looking like being an expensive Christmas. The prices of electronic gadgets and toys must surely be pretty vulnerable to sterling weakness.
I worked in the States for many years. Cost of children's clothes,CD,s and all manner of things I carried back was the the same number in dollars there but in sterling here hence hugely more expensive here for the same article.
Had nothing to do with exchange rates just we were always charged more on a commercial basis for the same product on the shelves and we had no choice. I noticed it as I regularly commuted back and forth for close on 10 years.
I did specifically refer to electronic devices and toys. The margins on Android phones, for example, must be pretty tight given the intense competition in that area. It's hard to imagine manufacturers such as Samsung simply taking the loss.
Well on present positions then "a very narrow win" not representative of the people , a massive mistake, etc etc and they can spend the next few years arguing about it and trying every legal loophole in the book to overturn it.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
Yes we get it but you know perfectly well that this scale of devaluation is not a sign of a national economy, strong and confident and ready to take on the world. It is a clear sign of weakness if businesses need a trashed currency to sell their goods abroad rather than operating efficiently in a competitive market.
Huge volatility, post-Brexit vote, was a given. The Brexiteers (and I have to admit there were some) who claimed it would all be plain sailing were fools or frauds.
Indeed and they are still saying it on this very thread. The pretence that a 30% devaluation is clever economics reflecting a strong and vibrant economy.. all in the name of 'taking control' and getting rid of foreigners.
Yes it is now clear that some Brexiteers will accept anything, absolutely anything, as long as we leave the EU. That is all they care about. It's an obsession.
Can someone explain to me how this is possible? Genuinely? Why is Germany allowed to implement a policy that means EU migrants need to have been in the Country FIVE years before they can claim benefits, when Cameron was forbidden from allowing the UK to restrict benefits for FOUR years?
No doubt because the policy will apply to their own citizens as well. The UK could easily have done this and is one of the few EU countries which gives so many benefits that are not based on contributions
Precisely, the EU are not concerned what benefits we pay, how much they are, who is entitled or how long for, their only concern (and the primary intellectual underpinning of the European Union) that other EU nationals are not treated any differently to nationals of the member state.
We could give them golden elephants, or sweet FA, just that we dont treat EU nationals any worse (you are allowed to treat them better though, which is currently the case in Scotland. Only English students out of the entirely 750 million population of the EU are the ones liable for full tuition fees in Scotland).
Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.
The tone of Mrs May's speech has worried a lot of people. She needs to row back on some of it and put Rudd on a much tighter leash. The foreign workers register was a huge and unnecessary misstep as was the idea of deporting foreign doctors in 2025.
I agree on both counts....but then I voted Remain. Hard exit here we come: it's immigration, stupid (not directed at you).
May has undoubtably made a serious mistake this past week. I wonder what she will do.
This mistake?
At the Conservative party conference this week, Home Secretary Amber Rudd announced plans to make firms publish what proportion of their workforce is non-British in a bid to encourage them to hire more British nationals. Although derided by many media commentators, new YouGov research finds that the policy is very popular across most of society.
Overall, 59% of people say they either strongly or somewhat support the proposals – more than double the 26% who somewhat or strongly oppose them.
......a majority (51%) of Labour voters supporting the proposals.
The policy is also highly popular among UKIP and Conservative voters, with 86% and 73% respectively supporting it, whilst even amongst Lib Dem voters it is supported more than opposed by a decent margin (48% vs 37%). Only SNP voters aren’t in obvious support – and even they are split 46%/46% over the policy.
The majority of the electorate could not care less about the markets, they voted to control immigration which May will do. In any case the low pound helps exports even if it makes imports and foreign travel more expensive. The fall in the pound today was due to Hollande's hard BREXIT statement and automated trading in Asia
Brexit has turned the UK into a 2nd world nation with a 3rd world currency .
A 2nd world nation which is still the fifth largest economy with still well above average GDP per capita and sterling is still an IMF reserve currency
We were the fifth largest economy, then Mrs May spoke.
Regardless of whether France occasionally overtakes us the trend is the same over there and will be confirmed when Le Pen tops the poll next May, voters across the west are rejecting economic liberalism and globalisation for nationalism and immigration control.
Le Pen won't win
She very probably will 'win' the first round. It's unlikely but not inconceivable that she will win the second. Her ratings have been good against Hollande, though it'd take a badly split centre-right to allow him through, and there's always the risk of 'events'.
Yes, that's my view too. The French left/centre-left too have shown a pragmatic willingness to vote for the centre-right candidate when they are in a run-off with the FN – Chirac being the case in point when he was up again Le Pen Sr.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
Yes we get it but you know perfectly well that this scale of devaluation is not a sign of a national economy, strong and confident and ready to take on the world. It is a clear sign of weakness if businesses need a trashed currency to sell their goods abroad rather than operating efficiently in a competitive market.
Huge volatility, post-Brexit vote, was a given. The Brexiteers (and I have to admit there were some) who claimed it would all be plain sailing were fools or frauds.
Indeed and they are still saying it on this very thread. The pretence that a 30% devaluation is clever economics reflecting a strong and vibrant economy.. all in the name of 'taking control' and getting rid of foreigners.
Yes it is now clear that some Brexiteers will accept anything, absolutely anything, as long as we leave the EU. That is all they care about. It's an obsession.
If it is an obsession, at least it's a long-standing one. The way that some Remainers have suddenly discovered how much they care about currency fluctuations is tragic and amusing.
Can someone explain to me how this is possible? Genuinely? Why is Germany allowed to implement a policy that means EU migrants need to have been in the Country FIVE years before they can claim benefits, when Cameron was forbidden from allowing the UK to restrict benefits for FOUR years?
Because they run the EU and nothing happens in the EU unless they say so.
Example Brexit negotiations ongoing but always quoted " will Merkel accept it" or "will Germany agree?" Just look at any paper it's the next thing to the reported story and statement of what is going to happen.
Merkel this Merkel that .... Etc It's why we are no longer there.
No. The issue is just whether their own nationals have the same conditions applied in terms of contributions and residency.
The government should maybe announce it is seeking a transitional arrangement. We will still get Brexit: it will take longer.
Why should they believe it, no transition arrangement could be official considered or condoned to the extent one could put faith in the possibility of it happening until after A50 next March.
A50 was explicitly written to make leaving as hard as possible, you dont know the rules or what is available, or what other people negotiating positions are until after you have already committed to leaving.
Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.
The tone of Mrs May's speech has worried a lot of people. She needs to row back on some of it and put Rudd on a much tighter leash. The foreign workers register was a huge and unnecessary misstep as was the idea of deporting foreign doctors in 2025.
I agree on both counts....but then I voted Remain. Hard exit here we come: it's immigration, stupid (not directed at you).
May has undoubtably made a serious mistake this past week. I wonder what she will do.
This mistake?
At the Conservative party conference this week, Home Secretary Amber Rudd announced plans to make firms publish what proportion of their workforce is non-British in a bid to encourage them to hire more British nationals. Although derided by many media commentators, new YouGov research finds that the policy is very popular across most of society.
Overall, 59% of people say they either strongly or somewhat support the proposals – more than double the 26% who somewhat or strongly oppose them.
......a majority (51%) of Labour voters supporting the proposals.
The policy is also highly popular among UKIP and Conservative voters, with 86% and 73% respectively supporting it, whilst even amongst Lib Dem voters it is supported more than opposed by a decent margin (48% vs 37%). Only SNP voters aren’t in obvious support – and even they are split 46%/46% over the policy.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
Yes we get it but you know perfectly well that this scale of devaluation is not a sign of a national economy, strong and confident and ready to take on the world. It is a clear sign of weakness if businesses need a trashed currency to sell their goods abroad rather than operating efficiently in a competitive market.
Huge volatility, post-Brexit vote, was a given. The Brexiteers (and I have to admit there were some) who claimed it would all be plain sailing were fools or frauds.
Indeed and they are still saying it on this very thread. The pretence that a 30% devaluation is clever economics reflecting a strong and vibrant economy.. all in the name of 'taking control' and getting rid of foreigners.
Yes it is now clear that some Brexiteers will accept anything, absolutely anything, as long as we leave the EU. That is all they care about. It's an obsession.
Good question. Is there a level of pain at which I would reverse my vote? Theoretically, yes - but I doubt I'd ever get there, because every time things got worse my determination to See It Through, fuck them, we're the British, etc etc, would surge in reaction.
I am sure this is a standard human reaction. Patriotic confirmation bias or something. The Blitz spirit.
And on this basis Remainers hoping for repentance from Leavers are probably pissing in the wind.
There is no chance of repentance exactly because of the dynamic you cite. Patriotism before country – you might say.
It's looking like being an expensive Christmas. The prices of electronic gadgets and toys must surely be pretty vulnerable to sterling weakness.
I worked in the States for many years. Cost of children's clothes,CD,s and all manner of things I carried back was the the same number in dollars there but in sterling here hence hugely more expensive here for the same article.
Had nothing to do with exchange rates just we were always charged more on a commercial basis for the same product on the shelves and we had no choice. I noticed it as I regularly commuted back and forth for close on 10 years.
I did specifically refer to electronic devices and toys. The margins on Android phones, for example, must be pretty tight given the intense competition in that area. It's hard to imagine manufacturers such as Samsung simply taking the loss.
I set up a local mobile quicker, easier and cheaper than ever I could do in the UK. Can't quote the figures now as it was a while ago but the difference for the phone and airtime costs were significant. Of course now you can do roaming etc with capped prices on data etc. I don't think 3G was even in service then though but I may be wrong? Don't recollect it?
I brought back a lot of children's toy packs as well. fisher price I remember as one because they were inordinately cheaper over in the states for the same thing here (because my girls were of that age at the time)
It's looking like being an expensive Christmas. The prices of electronic gadgets and toys must surely be pretty vulnerable to sterling weakness.
I worked in the States for many years. Cost of children's clothes,CD,s and all manner of things I carried back was the the same number in dollars there but in sterling here hence hugely more expensive here for the same article.
Had nothing to do with exchange rates just we were always charged more on a commercial basis for the same product on the shelves and we had no choice. I noticed it as I regularly commuted back and forth for close on 10 years.
I did specifically refer to electronic devices and toys. The margins on Android phones, for example, must be pretty tight given the intense competition in that area. It's hard to imagine manufacturers such as Samsung simply taking the loss.
The Iphone 7 in the USA is $649, at current exchange rates its $749 in the UK. Look at for example DJI (drones etc), the dollar and sterling prices for all their gear is identical.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
Yes we get it but you know perfectly well that this scale of devaluation is not a sign of a national economy, strong and confident and ready to take on the world. It is a clear sign of weakness if businesses need a trashed currency to sell their goods abroad rather than operating efficiently in a competitive market.
Huge volatility, post-Brexit vote, was a given. The Brexiteers (and I have to admit there were some) who claimed it would all be plain sailing were fools or frauds.
Indeed and they are still saying it on this very thread. The pretence that a 30% devaluation is clever economics reflecting a strong and vibrant economy.. all in the name of 'taking control' and getting rid of foreigners.
Yes it is now clear that some Brexiteers will accept anything, absolutely anything, as long as we leave the EU. That is all they care about. It's an obsession.
Oh I accept the referendum result - that's democracy. However, there was and is no mandate for a hard Brexit and May's rhetoric this week was not at all helpful. I hope it is still just posturing but this silly talk can be very damaging in inexperienced hands.
Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.
The tone of Mrs May's speech has worried a lot of people. She needs to row back on some of it and put Rudd on a much tighter leash. The foreign workers register was a huge and unnecessary misstep as was the idea of deporting foreign doctors in 2025.
I agree on both counts....but then I voted Remain. Hard exit here we come: it's immigration, stupid (not directed at you).
May has undoubtably made a serious mistake this past week. I wonder what she will do.
This mistake?
At the Conservative party conference this week, Home Secretary Amber Rudd announced plans to make firms publish what proportion of their workforce is non-British in a bid to encourage them to hire more British nationals. Although derided by many media commentators, new YouGov research finds that the policy is very popular across most of society.
Overall, 59% of people say they either strongly or somewhat support the proposals – more than double the 26% who somewhat or strongly oppose them.
......a majority (51%) of Labour voters supporting the proposals.
The policy is also highly popular among UKIP and Conservative voters, with 86% and 73% respectively supporting it, whilst even amongst Lib Dem voters it is supported more than opposed by a decent margin (48% vs 37%). Only SNP voters aren’t in obvious support – and even they are split 46%/46% over the policy.
Must be nice to dismiss the views of almost 60% of the population so easily and with such certainty.
Nope. Nothing nice about this at all. It's fucked up.
In your minority opinion. Jeez
Yes it's called tyranny of the majority.
It's called democracy round here
No. Democracy is where we vote for a government on a range of issues, not when we adopt one ludicrous reactionary illiberal state-snooping policy on the basis of an opinion poll.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
Yes we get it but you know perfectly well that this scale of devaluation is not a sign of a national economy, strong and confident and ready to take on the world. It is a clear sign of weakness if businesses need a trashed currency to sell their goods abroad rather than operating efficiently in a competitive market.
Huge volatility, post-Brexit vote, was a given. The Brexiteers (and I have to admit there were some) who claimed it would all be plain sailing were fools or frauds.
Indeed and they are still saying it on this very thread. The pretence that a 30% devaluation is clever economics reflecting a strong and vibrant economy.. all in the name of 'taking control' and getting rid of foreigners.
Yes it is now clear that some Brexiteers will accept anything, absolutely anything, as long as we leave the EU. That is all they care about. It's an obsession.
Oh I accept the referendum result - that's democracy. However, there was and is no mandate for a hard Brexit and May's rhetoric this week was not at all helpful. I hope it is still just posturing but this silly talk can be very damaging in inexperienced hands.
Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.
The tone of Mrs May's speech has worried a lot of people. She needs to row back on some of it and put Rudd on a much tighter leash. The foreign workers register was a huge and unnecessary misstep as was the idea of deporting foreign doctors in 2025.
I agree on both counts....but then I voted Remain. Hard exit here we come: it's immigration, stupid (not directed at you).
May has undoubtably made a serious mistake this past week. I wonder what she will do.
This mistake?
At the Conservative party conference this week, Home Secretary Amber Rudd announced plans to make firms publish what proportion of their workforce is non-British in a bid to encourage them to hire more British nationals. Although derided by many media commentators, new YouGov research finds that the policy is very popular across most of society.
Overall, 59% of people say they either strongly or somewhat support the proposals – more than double the 26% who somewhat or strongly oppose them.
......a majority (51%) of Labour voters supporting the proposals.
The policy is also highly popular among UKIP and Conservative voters, with 86% and 73% respectively supporting it, whilst even amongst Lib Dem voters it is supported more than opposed by a decent margin (48% vs 37%). Only SNP voters aren’t in obvious support – and even they are split 46%/46% over the policy.
Must be nice to dismiss the views of almost 60% of the population so easily and with such certainty.
Nope. Nothing nice about this at all. It's fucked up.
In your minority opinion. Jeez
Yes it's called tyranny of the majority.
It's called democracy round here
No. Democracy is where we vote for a government on a range of issues, not when we adopt one ludicrous reactionary illiberal state-snooping policy on the basis of an opinion poll.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
But it's not. The damage is entirely sure to the native who were conned into voting leave. Either that or they were too stupid to pay any attention to any damage
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
Yes we get it but you know perfectly well that this scale of devaluation is not a sign of a national economy, strong and confident and ready to take on the world. It is a clear sign of weakness if businesses need a trashed currency to sell their goods abroad rather than operating efficiently in a competitive market.
Huge volatility, post-Brexit vote, was a given. The Brexiteers (and I have to admit there were some) who claimed it would all be plain sailing were fools or frauds.
Indeed and they are still saying it on this very thread. The pretence that a 30% devaluation is clever economics reflecting a strong and vibrant economy.. all in the name of 'taking control' and getting rid of foreigners.
Yes it is now clear that some Brexiteers will accept anything, absolutely anything, as long as we leave the EU. That is all they care about. It's an obsession.
If it is an obsession, at least it's a long-standing one. The way that some Remainers have suddenly discovered how much they care about currency fluctuations is tragic and amusing.
It's not amusing for pensioners living abroad on limited sterling based incomes - and while inflation at home is currently subdued that may well change and then the proverbial could hit the fan. Similarly if the BoE is forced to raise interest rates other than very gradually and awful ot of mortgage payers won't be laughing. Oh and 30% devaluations don't come under the category of currency fluctuations.
The majority of the electorate could not care less about the markets, they voted to control immigration which May will do. In any case the low pound helps exports even if it makes imports and foreign travel more expensive. The fall in the pound today was due to Hollande's hard BREXIT statement and automated trading in Asia
Brexit has turned the UK into a 2nd world nation with a 3rd world currency .
A 2nd world nation which is still the fifth largest economy with still well above average GDP per capita and sterling is still an IMF reserve currency
We were the fifth largest economy, then Mrs May spoke.
Regardless of whether France occasionally overtakes us the trend is the same over there and will be confirmed when Le Pen tops the poll next May, voters across the west are rejecting economic liberalism and globalisation for nationalism and immigration control.
Le Pen won't win
She very probably will 'win' the first round. It's unlikely but not inconceivable that she will win the second. Her ratings have been good against Hollande, though it'd take a badly split centre-right to allow him through, and there's always the risk of 'events'.
Yes, that's my view too. The French left/centre-left too have shown a pragmatic willingness to vote for the centre-right candidate when they are in a run-off with the FN – Chirac being the case in point when he was up again Le Pen Sr.
True, although whereas Le Pen pere took only 18% in 2002, Le Pen fille regularly scores in the 30s and even the 40s against Juppe and Sarkozy in the head-to-head polls.
Moses we'll carry one whingeing and moaning (just like your lot had done for decades) until we can stop the damage being done to our country and ensure vile racists like Rudd are consigned to the back benches where at best she belongs.
Indeed you will with one significant difference
"we" as you put it are in the minority and you will do very well to now remember that. You had a lifetime to prove your case and failed.
You always were in the minority of course and for my entire lifetime the majority were never asked. When they were they spoke loudly and very clearly despite the threats. No amount of tears before bedtime will change the will of the people .
I recently read a book "The Real Cruel Sea" by Richard Woodman regarding the battle of the Atlantic up to 1943 and In his forward he said without assistance by the United States the outcome was by far certain in addition to and I quote.....
"that other inexplicable and inveterate British characteristic, a bloody minded objection to being shoved around"
In the minority perhaps from 0700 to 2200 on 23rd June. Democracy which all you Leavers bang on about does not mean making a decision and it be set in stone forever.
I'm starting to feel queasy. Suez, Black Wednesday - perhaps we're due another national humiliation on an epic scale. And you never see these things coming, and they all stem from what seemed like a jolly clever wheeze at the time. Why do we British continually insist on putting ourselves through the grinder?
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
Yes we get it but you know perfectly well that this scale of devaluation is not a sign of a national economy, strong and confident and ready to take on the world. It is a clear sign of weakness if businesses need a trashed currency to sell their goods abroad rather than operating efficiently in a competitive market.
Huge volatility, post-Brexit vote, was a given. The Brexiteers (and I have to admit there were some) who claimed it would all be plain sailing were fools or frauds.
Indeed and they are still saying it on this very thread. The pretence that a 30% devaluation is clever economics reflecting a strong and vibrant economy.. all in the name of 'taking control' and getting rid of foreigners.
Yes it is now clear that some Brexiteers will accept anything, absolutely anything, as long as we leave the EU. That is all they care about. It's an obsession.
If it is an obsession, at least it's a long-standing one. The way that some Remainers have suddenly discovered how much they care about currency fluctuations is tragic and amusing.
It's not amusing for pensioners living abroad on limited sterling based incomes - and while inflation at home is currently subdued that may well change and then the proverbial could hit the fan. Similarly if the BoE is forced to raise interest rates other than very gradually and awful ot of mortgage payers won't be laughing. Oh and 30% devaluations don't come under the category of currency fluctuations.
On the plus side (for those keen to reduce immigration), a 30% smaller wage packet is less likely to entice migrants to our shores.
Can someone explain to me how this is possible? Genuinely? Why is Germany allowed to implement a policy that means EU migrants need to have been in the Country FIVE years before they can claim benefits, when Cameron was forbidden from allowing the UK to restrict benefits for FOUR years?
Because they run the EU and nothing happens in the EU unless they say so.
Example Brexit negotiations ongoing but always quoted " will Merkel accept it" or "will Germany agree?" Just look at any paper it's the next thing to the reported story and statement of what is going to happen.
Merkel this Merkel that .... Etc It's why we are no longer there.
No. The issue is just whether their own nationals have the same conditions applied in terms of contributions and residency.
As I read it (badly) it requires you to either be in work in Germany, have accumulated sufficient benefit rights (I assume analogous to National Insurance payments), or been in residence in Germany for five years. That could be have been done here with in the EU, but it has all the problems everyone always talks about here, if you turn up in Germany with no job, you get nothing because you have no accumulated benefit rights and insufficient residency.
Well on present positions then "a very narrow win" not representative of the people , a massive mistake, etc etc and they can spend the next few years arguing about it and trying every legal loophole in the book to overturn it.
Or they can accept the democratic will?
Which is it?
Don't have to argue about it for years, there'll be another council election in 7 months.
Can someone explain to me how this is possible? Genuinely? Why is Germany allowed to implement a policy that means EU migrants need to have been in the Country FIVE years before they can claim benefits, when Cameron was forbidden from allowing the UK to restrict benefits for FOUR years?
Because they run the EU and nothing happens in the EU unless they say so.
Example Brexit negotiations ongoing but always quoted " will Merkel accept it" or "will Germany agree?" Just look at any paper it's the next thing to the reported story and statement of what is going to happen.
Merkel this Merkel that .... Etc It's why we are no longer there.
No. The issue is just whether their own nationals have the same conditions applied in terms of contributions and residency.
Perhaps I Misunderstand you?
A person born in the country and paying into the system all their life for years and years then for example falls on hard times but then has to wait the same amount of time for help as someone who came to that same country( let's be generous) 2 years previously and probably has made little or even no contribution to that country. If the time to wait for the foreign national is 5 years then that same person born there has to be treated similarly?
I am sure I have not correctly understood your point to be fair......
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
Yes we get it but you know perfectly well that this scale of devaluation is not a sign of a national economy, strong and confident and ready to take on the world. It is a clear sign of weakness if businesses need a trashed currency to sell their goods abroad rather than operating efficiently in a competitive market.
Huge volatility, post-Brexit vote, was a given. The Brexiteers (and I have to admit there were some) who claimed it would all be plain sailing were fools or frauds.
Indeed and they are still saying it on this very thread. The pretence that a 30% devaluation is clever economics reflecting a strong and vibrant economy.. all in the name of 'taking control' and getting rid of foreigners.
Yes it is now clear that some Brexiteers will accept anything, absolutely anything, as long as we leave the EU. That is all they care about. It's an obsession.
Oh I accept the referendum result - that's democracy. However, there was and is no mandate for a hard Brexit and May's rhetoric this week was not at all helpful. I hope it is still just posturing but this silly talk can be very damaging in inexperienced hands.
What about if "Hard Brexit" is the only BrExit on offer, which seems likely to be the case ? We wont actually know until next March, all we have at the moment are "indications".
Can someone explain to me how this is possible? Genuinely? Why is Germany allowed to implement a policy that means EU migrants need to have been in the Country FIVE years before they can claim benefits, when Cameron was forbidden from allowing the UK to restrict benefits for FOUR years?
Because they run the EU and nothing happens in the EU unless they say so.
Example Brexit negotiations ongoing but always quoted " will Merkel accept it" or "will Germany agree?" Just look at any paper it's the next thing to the reported story and statement of what is going to happen.
Merkel this Merkel that .... Etc It's why we are no longer there.
No. The issue is just whether their own nationals have the same conditions applied in terms of contributions and residency.
Perhaps I Misunderstand you?
A person born in the country and paying into the system all their life for years and years then for example falls on hard times but then has to wait the same amount of time for help as someone who came to that same country( let's be generous) 2 years previously and probably has made little or even no contribution to that country. If the time to wait for the foreign national is 5 years then that same person born there has to be treated similarly?
I am sure I have not correctly understood your point to be fair......
No, the German proposals allow for 5 years of residency to make benefits available.
Turns out the freelance filmmaker who shot the pictures of the Labour leader sitting on the floor was being paid by the Jeremy For Leader campaign. The Trotskyite freelance journalist who wrote the story wasn’t even on the train. The authors first pitched their pro-Jez propaganda to BuzzFeed, who embarrassingly for the Guardian smelled a rat and turned it down
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
Yes we get it but you know perfectly well that this scale of devaluation is not a sign of a national economy, strong and confident and ready to take on the world. It is a clear sign of weakness if businesses need a trashed currency to sell their goods abroad rather than operating efficiently in a competitive market.
Huge volatility, post-Brexit vote, was a given. The Brexiteers (and I have to admit there were some) who claimed it would all be plain sailing were fools or frauds.
Indeed and they are still saying it on this very thread. The pretence that a 30% devaluation is clever economics reflecting a strong and vibrant economy.. all in the name of 'taking control' and getting rid of foreigners.
Yes it is now clear that some Brexiteers will accept anything, absolutely anything, as long as we leave the EU. That is all they care about. It's an obsession.
Oh I accept the referendum result - that's democracy. However, there was and is no mandate for a hard Brexit and May's rhetoric this week was not at all helpful. I hope it is still just posturing but this silly talk can be very damaging in inexperienced hands.
What about if "Hard Brexit" is the only BrExit on offer, which seems likely to be the case ? We wont actually know until next March, all we have at the moment are "indications".
Moses we'll carry one whingeing and moaning (just like your lot had done for decades) until we can stop the damage being done to our country and ensure vile racists like Rudd are consigned to the back benches where at best she belongs.
Indeed you will with one significant difference
"we" as you put it are in the minority and you will do very well to now remember that. You had a lifetime to prove your case and failed.
You always were in the minority of course and for my entire lifetime the majority were never asked. When they were they spoke loudly and very clearly despite the threats. No amount of tears before bedtime will change the will of the people .
I recently read a book "The Real Cruel Sea" by Richard Woodman regarding the battle of the Atlantic up to 1943 and In his forward he said without assistance by the United States the outcome was by far certain in addition to and I quote.....
"that other inexplicable and inveterate British characteristic, a bloody minded objection to being shoved around"
In the minority perhaps from 0700 to 2200 on 23rd June. Democracy which all you Leavers bang on about does not mean making a decision and it be set in stone forever.
Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.
The tone of Mrs May's speech has worried a lot of people. She needs to row back on some of it and put Rudd on a much tighter leash. The foreign workers register was a huge and unnecessary misstep as was the idea of deporting foreign doctors in 2025.
I agree on both counts....but then I voted Remain. Hard exit here we come: it's immigration, stupid (not directed at you).
May has undoubtably made a serious mistake this past week. I wonder what she will do.
This mistake?
At the Conservative party conference this week, Home Secretary Amber Rudd announced plans to make firms publish what proportion of their workforce is non-British in a bid to encourage them to hire more British nationals. Although derided by many media commentators, new YouGov research finds that the policy is very popular across most of society.
Overall, 59% of people say they either strongly or somewhat support the proposals – more than double the 26% who somewhat or strongly oppose them.
......a majority (51%) of Labour voters supporting the proposals.
The policy is also highly popular among UKIP and Conservative voters, with 86% and 73% respectively supporting it, whilst even amongst Lib Dem voters it is supported more than opposed by a decent margin (48% vs 37%). Only SNP voters aren’t in obvious support – and even they are split 46%/46% over the policy.
Must be nice to dismiss the views of almost 60% of the population so easily and with such certainty.
Nope. Nothing nice about this at all. It's fucked up.
In your minority opinion. Jeez
Yes it's called tyranny of the majority.
It's called democracy round here
No. Democracy is where we vote for a government on a range of issues, not when we adopt one ludicrous reactionary illiberal state-snooping policy on the basis of an opinion poll.
Well on present positions then "a very narrow win" not representative of the people , a massive mistake, etc etc and they can spend the next few years arguing about it and trying every legal loophole in the book to overturn it.
Or they can accept the democratic will?
Which is it?
Don't have to argue about it for years, there'll be another council election in 7 months.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
Yes we get it but you know perfectly well that this scale of devaluation is not a sign of a national economy, strong and confident and ready to take on the world. It is a clear sign of weakness if businesses need a trashed currency to sell their goods abroad rather than operating efficiently in a competitive market.
Huge volatility, post-Brexit vote, was a given. The Brexiteers (and I have to admit there were some) who claimed it would all be plain sailing were fools or frauds.
Indeed and they are still saying it on this very thread. The pretence that a 30% devaluation is clever economics reflecting a strong and vibrant economy.. all in the name of 'taking control' and getting rid of foreigners.
Yes it is now clear that some Brexiteers will accept anything, absolutely anything, as long as we leave the EU. That is all they care about. It's an obsession.
Oh I accept the referendum result - that's democracy. However, there was and is no mandate for a hard Brexit and May's rhetoric this week was not at all helpful. I hope it is still just posturing but this silly talk can be very damaging in inexperienced hands.
What about if "Hard Brexit" is the only BrExit on offer, which seems likely to be the case ? We wont actually know until next March, all we have at the moment are "indications".
Let Parliament take back power and vote on it.
In which case it will be a hard BrExit, parliament is not going to oppose the vote of the referendum.
The government should maybe announce it is seeking a transitional arrangement. We will still get Brexit: it will take longer.
Why should they believe it, no transition arrangement could be official considered or condoned to the extent one could put faith in the possibility of it happening until after A50 next March.
A50 was explicitly written to make leaving as hard as possible, you dont know the rules or what is available, or what other people negotiating positions are until after you have already committed to leaving.
Can someone explain to me how this is possible? Genuinely? Why is Germany allowed to implement a policy that means EU migrants need to have been in the Country FIVE years before they can claim benefits, when Cameron was forbidden from allowing the UK to restrict benefits for FOUR years?
Because they run the EU and nothing happens in the EU unless they say so.
Example Brexit negotiations ongoing but always quoted " will Merkel accept it" or "will Germany agree?" Just look at any paper it's the next thing to the reported story and statement of what is going to happen.
Merkel this Merkel that .... Etc It's why we are no longer there.
No. The issue is just whether their own nationals have the same conditions applied in terms of contributions and residency.
Perhaps I Misunderstand you?
A person born in the country and paying into the system all their life for years and years then for example falls on hard times but then has to wait the same amount of time for help as someone who came to that same country( let's be generous) 2 years previously and probably has made little or even no contribution to that country. If the time to wait for the foreign national is 5 years then that same person born there has to be treated similarly?
I am sure I have not correctly understood your point to be fair......
No, the German proposals allow for 5 years of residency to make benefits available.
In the minority perhaps from 0700 to 2200 on 23rd June. Democracy which all you Leavers bang on about does not mean making a decision and it be set in stone forever.
Hypobollocks, after a general election the result is (effectively) set in stone until the next GE when people get up and campaign for their party to be elected. After this referendum the result is set in stone until people like you get enough like minded people together campaign to rejoin that it either wins a referendum, or commands the support of the house. If you can't manage that, the idea clearly doesn't have enough support.
Can someone explain to me how this is possible? Genuinely? Why is Germany allowed to implement a policy that means EU migrants need to have been in the Country FIVE years before they can claim benefits, when Cameron was forbidden from allowing the UK to restrict benefits for FOUR years?
Because they run the EU and nothing happens in the EU unless they say so.
Example Brexit negotiations ongoing but always quoted " will Merkel accept it" or "will Germany agree?" Just look at any paper it's the next thing to the reported story and statement of what is going to happen.
Merkel this Merkel that .... Etc It's why we are no longer there.
No. The issue is just whether their own nationals have the same conditions applied in terms of contributions and residency.
Perhaps I Misunderstand you?
A person born in the country and paying into the system all their life for years and years then for example falls on hard times but then has to wait the same amount of time for help as someone who came to that same country( let's be generous) 2 years previously and probably has made little or even no contribution to that country. If the time to wait for the foreign national is 5 years then that same person born there has to be treated similarly?
I am sure I have not correctly understood your point to be fair......
No, the German proposals allow for 5 years of residency to make benefits available.
Ok I misunderstood Sorry
Cameron got only 4 offered though?
Mmmmm....
I think on closer inspection that 4 years was in many cases more like six months as well.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
But it's not. The damage is entirely sure to the native who were conned into voting leave. Either that or they were too stupid to pay any attention to any damage
In the minority perhaps from 0700 to 2200 on 23rd June. Democracy which all you Leavers bang on about does not mean making a decision and it be set in stone forever.
Hypobollocks, after a general election the result is (effectively) set in stone until the next GE when people get up and campaign for their party to be elected. After this referendum the result is set in stone until people like you get enough like minded people together campaign to rejoin that it either wins a referendum, or commands the support of the house. If you can't manage that, the idea clearly doesn't have enough support.
Trouble is the referendum didn't specify which sort of Brexit. That has to be sorted out by our politicians - and should be voted on by our sovereign Parliament.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
But it's not. The damage is entirely sure to the native who were conned into voting leave. Either that or they were too stupid to pay any attention to any damage
What is it today with all the left leaners suggesting in as many words that we should have a special kind of voting card for stupid people that is worth less. Perhaps there should be a special "gold" voting card worth 2 votes given out for people that read The Guardian as well.
Democracy seems to be only a good thing when it gives you the answer you like.
On topic: Well, I've been saying for a while that I thought the markets were under-estimating the risk of a messy Brexit. All that's happening is that they are becoming less complacent.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
But it's not. The damage is entirely sure to the native who were conned into voting leave. Either that or they were too stupid to pay any attention to any damage
What is it today with all the left leaners suggesting in as many words that we should have a special kind of voting card for stupid people that is worth less. Perhaps there should be a special "gold" voting card give out for people that read The Guardian as well.
Democracy seems to be only a good thing when it gives you the answer you like.
The basket of deplorables and basement dwellers must be banned from voting for their own good.
So The Con vote split No preference 325 LibDem 233 SNP 31
31? We need names.....
On the proboards forum, someone speculated that the Conservative vote was partly transfers from Independents, who only listed their preferences down to a certain level. That maybe explains the quite high final 'No preference' level.
Can someone explain to me how this is possible? Genuinely? Why is Germany allowed to implement a policy that means EU migrants need to have been in the Country FIVE years before they can claim benefits, when Cameron was forbidden from allowing the UK to restrict benefits for FOUR years?
Because they run the EU and nothing happens in the EU unless they say so.
Example Brexit negotiations ongoing but always quoted " will Merkel accept it" or "will Germany agree?" Just look at any paper it's the next thing to the reported story and statement of what is going to happen.
Merkel this Merkel that .... Etc It's why we are no longer there.
No. The issue is just whether their own nationals have the same conditions applied in terms of contributions and residency.
Perhaps I Misunderstand you?
A person born in the country and paying into the system all their life for years and years then for example falls on hard times but then has to wait the same amount of time for help as someone who came to that same country( let's be generous) 2 years previously and probably has made little or even no contribution to that country. If the time to wait for the foreign national is 5 years then that same person born there has to be treated similarly?
I am sure I have not correctly understood your point to be fair......
No, the German proposals allow for 5 years of residency to make benefits available.
Ok I misunderstood Sorry
Cameron got only 4 offered though?
Mmmmm....
I think Cameron's four year ban was on EU immigrants receiving in-work benefits - working tax credits and the like. The new German ban on unemployment benefits for up to five years is already in place in the UK:
In the minority perhaps from 0700 to 2200 on 23rd June. Democracy which all you Leavers bang on about does not mean making a decision and it be set in stone forever.
Hypobollocks, after a general election the result is (effectively) set in stone until the next GE when people get up and campaign for their party to be elected. After this referendum the result is set in stone until people like you get enough like minded people together campaign to rejoin that it either wins a referendum, or commands the support of the house. If you can't manage that, the idea clearly doesn't have enough support.
Trouble is the referendum didn't specify which sort of Brexit. That has to be sorted out by our politicians - and should be voted on by our sovereign Parliament.
Yes. But at the moment we dont know which one we are going to get, because the negotiations haven't started. There is no point parliament voting on a "type" of BrExit now only to find that it isnt on offer after we invoke A50. Once the negotiations have started we will know what is on offer, its quite likely the only thing on offer will be different flavors of hard BrExit, but its too late then because we are in the process, we either take one of those flavours, or fall out the end after two years into the WTO.
Moses we'll carry one whingeing and moaning (just like your lot had done for decades) until we can stop the damage being done to our country and ensure vile racists like Rudd are consigned to the back benches where at best she belongs.
Indeed you will with one significant difference
"we" as you put it are in the minority and you will do very well to now remember that. You had a lifetime to prove your case and failed.
You always were in the minority of course and for my entire lifetime the majority were never asked. When they were they spoke loudly and very clearly despite the threats. No amount of tears before bedtime will change the will of the people .
I recently read a book "The Real Cruel Sea" by Richard Woodman regarding the battle of the Atlantic up to 1943 and In his forward he said without assistance by the United States the outcome was by far certain in addition to and I quote.....
"that other inexplicable and inveterate British characteristic, a bloody minded objection to being shoved around"
In the minority perhaps from 0700 to 2200 on 23rd June. Democracy which all you Leavers bang on about does not mean making a decision and it be set in stone forever.
Recent polls show that Leave voters are still the majority.
Further analysis shows that Leave was probably in the lead throughout the referendum campaign
The settled will of the British people, albeit on a narrow majority, was to quit the EU.
I'm just getting pissed off with the constant moaning and the dickhead threats from Europe. After the Obama fiasco youd have thought they might have learnt threats are counter productive. Though obviously this is aimed more at at cowing their domestic audience into submission for the project.
Being fair to Mrs M if she's taking her negotiating position as the worst possible, then all the bad news gets priced in up front. Any improvement on that and the pound and markets bounce back.
Maybe we should just have some fun next year and force a run on Deutsche Bank in the middle of all the european elections. And watch how the french and germans argue their banks need help unlike the greek and italian ones.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
Yes we get it but you know perfectly well that this scale of devaluation is not a sign of a national economy, strong and confident and ready to take on the world. It is a clear sign of weakness if businesses need a trashed currency to sell their goods abroad rather than operating efficiently in a competitive market.
Huge volatility, post-Brexit vote, was a given. The Brexiteers (and I have to admit there were some) who claimed it would all be plain sailing were fools or frauds.
Indeed and they are still saying it on this very thread. The pretence that a 30% devaluation is clever economics reflecting a strong and vibrant economy.. all in the name of 'taking control' and getting rid of foreigners.
Yes it is now clear that some Brexiteers will accept anything, absolutely anything, as long as we leave the EU. That is all they care about. It's an obsession.
If it is an obsession, at least it's a long-standing one. The way that some Remainers have suddenly discovered how much they care about currency fluctuations is tragic and amusing.
It's not amusing for pensioners living abroad on limited sterling based incomes - and while inflation at home is currently subdued that may well change and then the proverbial could hit the fan. Similarly if the BoE is forced to raise interest rates other than very gradually and awful ot of mortgage payers won't be laughing. Oh and 30% devaluations don't come under the category of currency fluctuations.
What 30% devaluation?
The average GBP/USD exchange rate from the start of January to June 23rd was around $1.45 The current GBP/USD exchange rate is $1.245
That is a 20.5 cent fall. But 20 cents is not 20%, it is a 14% fall. Less than half what you're claiming. A 30% fall would be GBP/USD parity.
So The Con vote split No preference 325 LibDem 233 SNP 31
31? We need names.....
On the proboards forum, someone speculated that the Conservative vote was partly transfers from Independents, who only listed their preferences down to a certain level. That maybe explains the quite high final 'No preference' level.
Yes the original Conservative vote was 439 so 150 were previous transfers
Lord Ashcroft “It’s not how many votes you get, it’s who’s counting them”: fears of fraud in the new #AshcroftInAmerica podcast: https://t.co/9T6PkLTzWE
Mr. Urquhart, could you explain to me, a non-clubbing Yorkshireman, why this story has so many articles?
I refer you to Andrew Marr's opinion of the BBC..."a publicly-funded urban organisation with an abnormally large proportion of younger people, of people in ethnic minorities and almost certainly of gay people, compared with the population at large".
I don't remember an article a day for weeks on end reporting on some Working Men's club closing in a Northern town.
Moses we'll carry one whingeing and moaning (just like your lot had done for decades) until we can stop the damage being done to our country and ensure vile racists like Rudd are consigned to the back benches where at best she belongs.
Indeed you will with one significant difference
"we" as you put it are in the minority and you will do very well to now remember that. You had a lifetime to prove your case and failed.
You always were in the minority of course and for my entire lifetime the majority were never asked. When they were they spoke loudly and very clearly despite the threats. No amount of tears before bedtime will change the will of the people .
I recently read a book "The Real Cruel Sea" by Richard Woodman regarding the battle of the Atlantic up to 1943 and In his forward he said without assistance by the United States the outcome was by far certain in addition to and I quote.....
"that other inexplicable and inveterate British characteristic, a bloody minded objection to being shoved around"
In the minority perhaps from 0700 to 2200 on 23rd June. Democracy which all you Leavers bang on about does not mean making a decision and it be set in stone forever.
Recent polls show that Leave voters are still the majority.
I’m off to Thailand shortly to vistit family. We’ve certainly seen over 30% devaliuation since we first went.... 66TB =£1 10 or so years ago, 55 last year, 43.4 this. However being with that set of grandchildren is worth it!
Maybe we should just have some fun next year and force a run on Deutsche Bank in the middle of all the european elections. And watch how the french and germans argue their banks need help unlike the greek and italian ones.
I'm puzzled as to how the British Government could precipitate a run on the German banking system, but anyway: the next stage of the Eurozone crisis may not be too long in coming. If Renzi has as much luck winning his referendum in December as Cameron did in June, then he's finished - and Beppe Grillo's populists are anywhere between about six point adrift of the ruling Democratic Party and in a statistical dead heat in the polls.
The last I heard, the Five Star Movement sat with Ukip in the European Parliament and were committed to a plebiscite on the restoration of the lira. Needless to say, this is not something that the European institutions would particularly welcome.
Mr. Rook, if the EU has another crisis, a sensible step might be to conclude a rapid deal with the UK, on an interim basis, with a long deadline for a full deal.
Not that the EU is an organisation founded upon sense.
I’m off to Thailand shortly to vistit family. We’ve certainly seen over 30% devaliuation since we first went.... 66TB =£1 10 or so years ago, 55 last year, 43.4 this. However being with that set of grandchildren is worth it!
And the pound is tanking today the most against those ultra strong currencies like the Colombian peso and Brazilian real. Even India where I'm of to next week I'll get 20% fewer rupees than I would have got earlier this year.
Will this end Steven Woolfe's 2nd bid for UKIP leadership?
"He said Mr Woolfe had objected to remarks which he made. "He then stood up in front of everybody and said 'if it's that, let's take it outside of the room', I think his words were 'mano a mano'." "When I walked in he approached me to attack me. He came at me, I defended myself. There were no punches thrown, there was no face slapping, there were no digs, there was nothing," he said."
''I'm just getting pissed off with the constant moaning and the dickhead threats from Europe. After the Obama fiasco youd have thought they might have learnt threats are counter productive. Though obviously this is aimed more at at cowing their domestic audience into submission for the project.''
What astonishes me is the total, complete and utter absence of soul searching, self appraisal and self questioning on the EU's part. And the remainers too. No 'where are we going wrong', no 'taking a long look at ourselves in the mirror'.
If Sterling were appreciating in value, I wonder how many of the headless chickens would be shrieking about the harm being done to exporters.
But it's not. The damage is entirely sure to the native who were conned into voting leave. Either that or they were too stupid to pay any attention to any damage
Lord Ashcroft “It’s not how many votes you get, it’s who’s counting them”: fears of fraud in the new #AshcroftInAmerica podcast: https://t.co/9T6PkLTzWE
There are five elements to any fair election:
1. Equal and relatively easy registration of voters and parties. 2. A level playing field for campaigning, at least in terms of proportionality to support 3. That voters can cast their votes as they see fit without intimidation or undue hindrance 4. That the votes cast are fairly counted and reported 5. That the results once reported are translated into effect.
The US scores pretty poorly compared with its peers for at least the first three. It would be even more worrying if the fourth were added to the list.
Comments
Had nothing to do with exchange rates just we were always charged more on a commercial basis for the same product on the shelves and we had no choice. I noticed it as I regularly commuted back and forth for close on 10 years.
It also sends out terrible signals. It's no way to convince the markets that Global Britain is open for business.
But I'm not convinced it's terribly racist. The current law of this land mandates that employers generally must discriminate against non-British applicants for jobs, with certain exceptions for certain types of non-Brits, mostly white and European. It's written in the UN Declaration of Human Rights that Everyone has the right to work, to free choice of employment - a right for every adult on this planet - and yet if there is a job in London, an applicant from Madras is disbarred from it so long as there is a suitable applicant from Manchester (or, at present, Munich). If forcing companies to reveal how they complied with these laws is ethically wrong, isn't the underlying and essentially explicitly racist (if one believes the definition of "racism" includes discrimination by nationality) set of employment laws, several whole orders of magnitude more egregious? Surely it's a thousand-fold worse to deny tens of thousands of Indians and Chinese, Africans and Latin Americans, the prospect of economic prosperity in this country than it is to publish how many exceptions were made?
If I was seething at this publication proposal, I would be positively incandescent about the resident labour test - to the tune of giving up my job in solidarity with the global unemployed and starting a protest camp outside the Home Office. Why should any qualified candidate be banned from coming to the UK if there is a useful economic contribution they can make and an employer hoping to take them on?
Borders exclude. And the people they exclude are, by definition, foreigners. Borders are therefore, by definition, racist (if we carefully select the definition of the word "racist"). Isn't this where the logic - if not the "electoral viability test" - ultimately takes you, if we go down the "racism" rabbit hole?
Example Brexit negotiations ongoing but always quoted " will Merkel accept it" or "will Germany agree?" Just look at any paper it's the next thing to the reported story and statement of what is going to happen.
Merkel this Merkel that .... Etc
It's why we are no longer there.
http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/299672-disastrous-strech-for-gary-johnson-gives-boost-to-clinton
Or they can accept the democratic will?
Which is it?
We could give them golden elephants, or sweet FA, just that we dont treat EU nationals any worse (you are allowed to treat them better though, which is currently the case in Scotland. Only English students out of the entirely 750 million population of the EU are the ones liable for full tuition fees in Scotland).
BREAKING: Brother of Brussels knife attacker charged with terrorism: prosecutor - AFP
Disgraced Radio One star Chris Denning jailed for 13 years for sexually abusing 11 boys between 1968-1986.
A50 was explicitly written to make leaving as hard as possible, you dont know the rules or what is available, or what other people negotiating positions are until after you have already committed to leaving.
It's a bigger this democratic lark, isn't it?
LD 1,026
SNP 1,001
http://vote-2012.proboards.com/thread/8736/elections-october-6th?page=7
I brought back a lot of children's toy packs as well. fisher price I remember as one because they were inordinately cheaper over in the states for the same thing here (because my girls were of that age at the time)
Next...
A person born in the country and paying into the system all their life for years and years then for example falls on hard times but then has to wait the same amount of time for help as someone who came to that same country( let's be generous) 2 years previously and probably has made little or even no contribution to that country. If the time to wait for the foreign national is 5 years then that same person born there has to be treated similarly?
I am sure I have not correctly understood your point to be fair......
Turns out the freelance filmmaker who shot the pictures of the Labour leader sitting on the floor was being paid by the Jeremy For Leader campaign. The Trotskyite freelance journalist who wrote the story wasn’t even on the train. The authors first pitched their pro-Jez propaganda to BuzzFeed, who embarrassingly for the Guardian smelled a rat and turned it down
http://order-order.com/2016/10/07/guardian-blasts-editors-traingate-blunder-buzzfeed-turned-story/
No preference 325
LibDem 233
SNP 31
31? We need names.....
Sorry
Cameron got only 4 offered though?
Mmmmm....
Reuters
Venezuela oil workers forced to sell their boots in order to eat https://t.co/v6EfHgmpy7
Mr. Chestnut, sounds more like a circle than a Venn diagram there, I think.
F1: I have just remembered I need to finish off and post the pre-qualifying piece. Ahem.
I did try earlier but all the markets were drowsy as a sloth in an opium den.
Democracy seems to be only a good thing when it gives you the answer you like.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jun/14/uk-can-refuse-benefits-to-unemployed-eu-migrants-judges-rule
Being fair to Mrs M if she's taking her negotiating position as the worst possible, then all the bad news gets priced in up front. Any improvement on that and the pound and markets bounce back.
Maybe we should just have some fun next year and force a run on Deutsche Bank in the middle of all the european elections. And watch how the french and germans argue their banks need help unlike the greek and italian ones.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-37546558
The average GBP/USD exchange rate from the start of January to June 23rd was around $1.45
The current GBP/USD exchange rate is $1.245
That is a 20.5 cent fall. But 20 cents is not 20%, it is a 14% fall. Less than half what you're claiming. A 30% fall would be GBP/USD parity.
Jon Ashworth: Shadow Health Secretary.
If he and Hamilton win every race in a 1-2, and Hamilton wins 4/5 and Rosberg just 1/5, Rosberg wins the title.
It likely won't turn out that way, but it's still very much Rosberg's to lose and the odds are worth considering.
“It’s not how many votes you get, it’s who’s counting them”: fears of fraud in the new #AshcroftInAmerica podcast: https://t.co/9T6PkLTzWE
I don't remember an article a day for weeks on end reporting on some Working Men's club closing in a Northern town.
Then two days later Ashworth will get reshuffled out of Health - muppet.
Mark Senior - take a look at Venezuela - that's what a fecked up country looks like.
Does Corbyn have an NEC majority yet?
Mr. Urquhart, sounds about right.
Reminds me of the EU
However being with that set of grandchildren is worth it!
The last I heard, the Five Star Movement sat with Ukip in the European Parliament and were committed to a plebiscite on the restoration of the lira. Needless to say, this is not something that the European institutions would particularly welcome.
Not that the EU is an organisation founded upon sense.
"He said Mr Woolfe had objected to remarks which he made. "He then stood up in front of everybody and said 'if it's that, let's take it outside of the room', I think his words were 'mano a mano'."
"When I walked in he approached me to attack me. He came at me, I defended myself. There were no punches thrown, there was no face slapping, there were no digs, there was nothing," he said."
UKIP MEP Mike Hookem denies assaulting Steven Woolfe
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37587814
What astonishes me is the total, complete and utter absence of soul searching, self appraisal and self questioning on the EU's part. And the remainers too. No 'where are we going wrong', no 'taking a long look at ourselves in the mirror'.
Just a punishment beating until morale improves.
quite unbelievable.
Now you really are being a complete idiot. Get a hold of yourself.
1. Equal and relatively easy registration of voters and parties.
2. A level playing field for campaigning, at least in terms of proportionality to support
3. That voters can cast their votes as they see fit without intimidation or undue hindrance
4. That the votes cast are fairly counted and reported
5. That the results once reported are translated into effect.
The US scores pretty poorly compared with its peers for at least the first three. It would be even more worrying if the fourth were added to the list.