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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » It looks as though Mrs. May’s BREXIT strategy isn’t helping confidence on the markets

From the markets: Markets rattled by pound’s tumble https://t.co/yV1xyrZWpz pic.twitter.com/26BAOfN86o

Read the full story here

MattW

1st.

MattW

2nd.

MattW

3rd. Clean sweep.

TheScreamingEagles

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

logical_song

UKIP MEP Mike Hookem denies assaulting Steven Woolfe
Mr Woolfe, a frontrunner to be the next leader of the UKIP, has said he is happy to "extend the hand of friendship" to his colleague.

Ah, but how fast?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37587814

TheScreamingEagles

I did find this interesting

https://twitter.com/BethRigby/status/784316942521729024

MaxPB

If they had a strategy it might help.

On Wednesday the PM goes on stage and says a bunch of stuff that sounds like we're going to prioritise immigration over trade.

Today the chancellor is in NY telling Wall Street that actually it's all bullshit for domestic consumption, we're still looking at being in the single market.

The lack of a coherent position on what we want from the EU is really starting to hurt. It feels like we need to lock Cabinet in chequers for the weekend and not let them out until they agree a unified position on what benefits the nation and how best to deliver the Leave vote.

SouthamObserver

MaxPB said:

If they had a strategy it might help.

On Wednesday the PM goes on stage and says a bunch of stuff that sounds like we're going to prioritise immigration over trade.

Today the chancellor is in NY telling Wall Street that actually it's all bullshit for domestic consumption, we're still looking at being in the single market.

The lack of a coherent position on what we want from the EU is really starting to hurt. It feels like we need to lock Cabinet in chequers for the weekend and not let them out until they agree a unified position on what benefits the nation and how best to deliver the Leave vote.

They can't agree a unified position. That's the problem. What benefits the nation is not necessarily what is going to keep the Tories together. And what does "benefits the nation" actually mean?

Scott_P

@FerdiGiugliano: Dear Britain,

Thank you very much for your complaint.We regret to inform you that 'Take Control' did not apply to £.

Yours,

Leave Team

SouthamObserver

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

MaxPB

SouthamObserver said:

MaxPB said:

If they had a strategy it might help.

On Wednesday the PM goes on stage and says a bunch of stuff that sounds like we're going to prioritise immigration over trade.

Today the chancellor is in NY telling Wall Street that actually it's all bullshit for domestic consumption, we're still looking at being in the single market.

The lack of a coherent position on what we want from the EU is really starting to hurt. It feels like we need to lock Cabinet in chequers for the weekend and not let them out until they agree a unified position on what benefits the nation and how best to deliver the Leave vote.

They can't agree a unified position. That's the problem. What benefits the nation is not necessarily what is going to keep the Tories together. And what does "benefits the nation" actually mean?

That's why they need to be locked up together. It seems like they don't have any answers.

TheScreamingEagles

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

tlg86

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

CarlottaVance

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

When's the first post-conference poll due?

welshowl

We just ran a £12bn current account deficit in August. Something had to give anyway. Brexit or no.

As an exporter channeling my inner Kevin Keegan "I'm loving it just loving it". Bit of inflation and a rise in interest rates and I shall burst with joy.

JonathanD

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Once people start to feel their standard of living suffering things will move quite fast.

CarlottaVance

TheScreamingEagles said:

I did find this interesting

https://twitter.com/BethRigby/status/784316942521729024

Also happened in the gap between New York closing & Tokyo opening so market was very illiquid - but the good news is we get to blame the French!

edmundintokyo

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

The LDP was screwing up for decades. Under FPTP there's no limit to how long a bad government can keep going, provided the opposition are divided or worse.

CarlottaVance

Rudd vs Abbott - Hardly 'Predator vs Alien'.....more like 'Dumb vs Dumber'?

Indigo

Scott_P said:

@FerdiGiugliano: Dear Britain,

Thank you very much for your complaint.We regret to inform you that 'Take Control' did not apply to £.

Yours,

Leave Team

Don't be a fool. No one has more control of his country than Putin, how much did that help the ruble recently ?

Morris_Dancer

Mr. Owl, Carney seems minded to go the other way.

If rates do rise I suspect the banks won't be as swift to raise their interest on savings as they were to cut them when Carney reduced rates after the vote.

MaxPB

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

The question is who? If the orange bookers were running the Lib Dems then I'd definitely feel they could make headway, if the moderates were running Labour then they might. Right now it feels like the opposition is the economically liberal wing of the Tory party. Many of whom are fretting over the idea of big government.

TheScreamingEagles

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

rottenborough

All quiet on reshuffle front. Has Jezza spent the morning make jam?

CarlottaVance

Owen Jones tweets: There's plenty of useless, bungling and/or mediocre white male politicians who don't get the bile Diane Abbott does. Why is this exactly?

So, just to clarify, he thinks the Shadow Home Secretary is 'useless, bungling and/or mediocre'?

geoffw

"Of course this makes the UK’s exports cheaper but it also makes imports more expensive. " Well yes doh! That's the way to correct an imbalance in the BoP. Sterling is too high. Besides, we need a bit of inflation and higher interest rates.

welshowl

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. Owl, Carney seems minded to go the other way.

If rates do rise I suspect the banks won't be as swift to raise their interest on savings as they were to cut them when Carney reduced rates after the vote.

Yes Carnage still looks like he's crash diving rates till the rivets pop sadly. You're doubtless right about the banks but it's gilt yields I want to rise. Hopefully foreigners night baulk at buying UK debt and yields might start to surface, despite Kapitan zur See Carney still opening all the stop cocks the other way. I can hope at least. In the meantime must go invoice stuff at new higher prices. Oh goody!

Indigo

Someone posted this link at the end of the last thread, seems to be one of the more important contributions recently, any City/Finance types feel able to comment ?

http://brexitcentral.com/stanislas-yassukovich-eu-needs-city-city-needs-eu-debunking-myths-single-market-financial-services/

Those responsible for the dire predictions of job and business losses in the City post-Brexit should reflect on its unique attributes as a global centre, the nature of its wholesale services, the way in which they are accessed, how they are provided to passport-less counterparties all over the world, and how any international institution could function without them.

TheScreamingEagles

CarlottaVance said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

When's the first post-conference poll due?

I'm hopeful we'll see a poll or two this weekend.

I did partake in an Opinium poll on Wednesday with VI and who'd make the best PM.

Morris_Dancer

Miss Vance, Jones clearly never read PB's many comments on her predecessor.

taffys

''When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour''

NO wonder Blair wants to get back in. He sniffs an opportunity.

rottenborough

CarlottaVance said:

Owen Jones tweets: There's plenty of useless, bungling and/or mediocre white male politicians who don't get the bile Diane Abbott does. Why is this exactly?

So, just to clarify, he thinks the Shadow Home Secretary is 'useless, bungling and/or mediocre'?

Possibly because she is a grade A hypocrite who sends her kids to private school whilst spending her days extolling the virtues of a Marxist state.

CarlottaVance

TheScreamingEagles said:

CarlottaVance said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

When's the first post-conference poll due?

I did partake in an Opinium poll on Wednesday with VI and who'd make the best PM.

How many guesses do we get.....?

TheScreamingEagles

Off topic, Jos Buttler is something special isn't he?

TheScreamingEagles

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

The question is who? If the orange bookers were running the Lib Dems then I'd definitely feel they could make headway, if the moderates were running Labour then they might. Right now it feels like the opposition is the economically liberal wing of the Tory party. Many of whom are fretting over the idea of big government.

Tony Blair might make a comeback.

MaxPB

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

So who, or what, will depose the current status quo? Brexit was a seismic event but overall I don't think the political landscape has changed that much. You and I are still in the same party despite voting differently, we are also both wary of the new leadership as well. I'm not going to leave for the Lib Dems and definitely not for Labour. My only choice is to tough it out and if I get the chance vote for a liberal type of leader, even if it means Osborne coming back.

I also don't see any new party coming along, I'll never support a party with the "safe space" chumps in it and I doubt you would either. So where does that leave us?

MaxPB

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

The question is who? If the orange bookers were running the Lib Dems then I'd definitely feel they could make headway, if the moderates were running Labour then they might. Right now it feels like the opposition is the economically liberal wing of the Tory party. Many of whom are fretting over the idea of big government.

Tony Blair might make a comeback.

Would you join his new party along with Chuka and Liz?

rottenborough

taffys said:

''When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour''

NO wonder Blair wants to get back in. He sniffs an opportunity.

There is a huge opportunity, possible a once in a hundred years chance to break the mould.

welshowl

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

The question is who? If the orange bookers were running the Lib Dems then I'd definitely feel they could make headway, if the moderates were running Labour then they might. Right now it feels like the opposition is the economically liberal wing of the Tory party. Many of whom are fretting over the idea of big government.

Tony Blair might make a comeback.

He'll be rIding Shergar with Lord Lucan in attendance if he does. Lazarus doesn't come close.

TheScreamingEagles

CarlottaVance said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

CarlottaVance said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

When's the first post-conference poll due?

I did partake in an Opinium poll on Wednesday with VI and who'd make the best PM.

How many guesses do we get.....?

The choices were

1) Jeremy Corbyn

2) Theresa May

3) Don't know

I was also asked to rate Mrs May's performance...

TheScreamingEagles

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

The question is who? If the orange bookers were running the Lib Dems then I'd definitely feel they could make headway, if the moderates were running Labour then they might. Right now it feels like the opposition is the economically liberal wing of the Tory party. Many of whom are fretting over the idea of big government.

Tony Blair might make a comeback.

Would you join his new party along with Chuka and Liz?

Unlikely.

Depends how big his tent is.

brokenwheel

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

The question is who? If the orange bookers were running the Lib Dems then I'd definitely feel they could make headway, if the moderates were running Labour then they might. Right now it feels like the opposition is the economically liberal wing of the Tory party. Many of whom are fretting over the idea of big government.

Tony Blair might make a comeback.

That's one of those scary stories they tell children so they behave.

MaxPB

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

The question is who? If the orange bookers were running the Lib Dems then I'd definitely feel they could make headway, if the moderates were running Labour then they might. Right now it feels like the opposition is the economically liberal wing of the Tory party. Many of whom are fretting over the idea of big government.

Tony Blair might make a comeback.

Would you join his new party along with Chuka and Liz?

Unlikely.

Depends how big his tent is.

I don't think Michael Gove will be invited.

TheScreamingEagles

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

So who, or what, will depose the current status quo? Brexit was a seismic event but overall I don't think the political landscape has changed that much. You and I are still in the same party despite voting differently, we are also both wary of the new leadership as well. I'm not going to leave for the Lib Dems and definitely not for Labour. My only choice is to tough it out and if I get the chance vote for a liberal type of leader, even if it means Osborne coming back.

I also don't see any new party coming along, I'll never support a party with the "safe space" chumps in it and I doubt you would either. So where does that leave us?

Think of a party that would carry on the Cameron/The coalition's education reforms, that was focused on making the economic cake bigger, not equal.

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

MTimT

FPT Mr Dancer said:
"Mr. 43, I agree. As per Mr. Submarine's post, it would've been better to have a firmer vision in mind.

"However, the EU has an idea but nothing else. It's approach is to subvert democracy in favour of the ideal, to make economic policy based on political desire, to erode national sovereignty in favour of the ideal.

"What is best is to have an idea, and a sense of perspective."

What is best is to have a vision which provides purpose to the group, in this case the citizens - a purpose with which they agree and to which they can subscribe.

What those who fling around the terms 'racist' and 'fascist' with gay abandon ignore is that to create a movement you need a culture, and all culture is about identity, which is as much about who you are not as it is about who you are.

That is why Obama so often says "That is not who we are"

http://freebeacon.com/politics/46-times-president-obama-told-americans-thats-not-who-we-are/

Oh, I see. Obama is a racist.

TheScreamingEagles

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

The question is who? If the orange bookers were running the Lib Dems then I'd definitely feel they could make headway, if the moderates were running Labour then they might. Right now it feels like the opposition is the economically liberal wing of the Tory party. Many of whom are fretting over the idea of big government.

Tony Blair might make a comeback.

Would you join his new party along with Chuka and Liz?

Unlikely.

Depends how big his tent is.

I don't think Michael Gove will be invited.

It was Michael Gove who called Tony Blair the master. He's a fan, Gove's education reforms were based on Blair's reforms as Gove openly admits.

MaxPB

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

So who, or what, will depose the current status quo? Brexit was a seismic event but overall I don't think the political landscape has changed that much. You and I are still in the same party despite voting differently, we are also both wary of the new leadership as well. I'm not going to leave for the Lib Dems and definitely not for Labour. My only choice is to tough it out and if I get the chance vote for a liberal type of leader, even if it means Osborne coming back.

I also don't see any new party coming along, I'll never support a party with the "safe space" chumps in it and I doubt you would either. So where does that leave us?

Think of a party that would carry on the Cameron/The coalition's education reforms, that was focused on making the economic cake bigger, not equal.

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

That party currently sits on the back benches of the governing one. There is literally zero appetite to split, so where does it leave us?

Just want to add, I agree with all of those policy goals.

taffys

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/718632/Ukip-Hartlepool-by-election-Tim-Fleming-Strassborg-Steven-Woolfe-collapse

I guess not particularly significant, but interesting nevertheless.

Must be interesting times, being a labour councillor in the North.

david_herdson

"The PM’s need to say something strong at her conference seems to have gone down poorly. Announcing the March 2017 invoke Article 50 date, as she did, appears to have undermined what negotiating position that she had."

I don't get this. As soon as the Brexit vote was in, it was inevitable that A50 would be invoked sooner or later, and almost certainly within a year. The timeframe of 2017Q1 has been on the cards for months now - so what is it that has spooked the markets?

Similarly, the hard Brexit option was politically close to inevitable. Continued membership of the Single Market was obviously a deal that couldn't be done given the two sides' negotiating positions. how is it that they didn't see it coming?

I do wonder whether the investment banks could do with employing a half-decent political analyst?

JosiasJessop

Off-topic:

The company Mrs J works for is having a Christmas Party. So far, so good. Except it is going to be formal attire.

WTH has a Christmas Party in formal attire? Nothing can stifle fun more than having to look smart.

MTimT

TheScreamingEagles said:

I did find this interesting

https://twitter.com/BethRigby/status/784316942521729024

TSE If that is indeed the reason for the move, I see a couple of things happening:

1. A correction to sterling's rate when humans intervene to bring sterling back to a sensible level appropriate to its economy relative to the world economy
2. A need to correct the trading algorithm so that something so trivial doesn't have such a big impact on trading
3. A major failure in trading (not necessarily related to sterling) at some point in the future if the algorithm goes uncorrected.

AlastairMeeks

Who would have thought that the currency of a country with a large deficit where the deficit reduction plan has just been abandoned without a replacement and with the government taking an increasingly business-unfriendly tone, while seeking to renegotiate its trading arrangements with its closest trading partners at high speed in bad temper might come under pressure?

TheScreamingEagles

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

So who, or what, will depose the current status quo? Brexit was a seismic event but overall I don't think the political landscape has changed that much. You and I are still in the same party despite voting differently, we are also both wary of the new leadership as well. I'm not going to leave for the Lib Dems and definitely not for Labour. My only choice is to tough it out and if I get the chance vote for a liberal type of leader, even if it means Osborne coming back.

I also don't see any new party coming along, I'll never support a party with the "safe space" chumps in it and I doubt you would either. So where does that leave us?

Think of a party that would carry on the Cameron/The coalition's education reforms, that was focused on making the economic cake bigger, not equal.

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

That party currently sits on the back benches of the governing one. There is literally zero appetite to split, so where does it leave us?

Just want to add, I agree with all of those policy goals.

I'm staying put, we're like Churchill on the backbenchers whilst the appeasers are in charge. Our time will come again.

MaxPB

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

The question is who? If the orange bookers were running the Lib Dems then I'd definitely feel they could make headway, if the moderates were running Labour then they might. Right now it feels like the opposition is the economically liberal wing of the Tory party. Many of whom are fretting over the idea of big government.

Tony Blair might make a comeback.

Would you join his new party along with Chuka and Liz?

Unlikely.

Depends how big his tent is.

I don't think Michael Gove will be invited.

It was Michael Gove who called Tony Blair the master. He's a fan, Gove's education reforms were based on Blair's reforms as Gove openly admits.

Yes, but Gove is also a small state supporting conservative in many other aspects. Blair's party would he big government social democracy, very similar to what TMay is proposing tbh.

Theuniondivvie

MaxPB said:

If they had a strategy it might help.

On Wednesday the PM goes on stage and says a bunch of stuff that sounds like we're going to prioritise immigration over trade.

Today the chancellor is in NY telling Wall Street that actually it's all bullshit for domestic consumption, we're still looking at being in the single market.

The lack of a coherent position on what we want from the EU is really starting to hurt. It feels like we need to lock Cabinet in chequers for the weekend and not let them out until they agree a unified position on what benefits the nation and how best to deliver the Leave vote.

These long times in politics seem to be getting shorter and shorter.

MarqueeMark

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

So who, or what, will depose the current status quo? Brexit was a seismic event but overall I don't think the political landscape has changed that much. You and I are still in the same party despite voting differently, we are also both wary of the new leadership as well. I'm not going to leave for the Lib Dems and definitely not for Labour. My only choice is to tough it out and if I get the chance vote for a liberal type of leader, even if it means Osborne coming back.

I also don't see any new party coming along, I'll never support a party with the "safe space" chumps in it and I doubt you would either. So where does that leave us?

Think of a party that would carry on the Cameron/The coalition's education reforms, that was focused on making the economic cake bigger, not equal.

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

That party currently sits on the back benches of the governing one. There is literally zero appetite to split, so where does it leave us?

Just want to add, I agree with all of those policy goals.

I'm stating put, we're like Churchill on the backbenchers whilst the appeasers are in charge. Our time will come again.

Rolls eyes heavenwards.....

edmundintokyo

MTimT said:

2. A need to correct the trading algorithm so that something so trivial doesn't have such a big impact on trading

May has been itching to regulate mathematics ever since she found out about cryptography. She could come up with some kind of licensing system where you have to get the government's permission before you're allowed to use an algorithm.

MaxPB

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

So who, or what, will depose the current status quo? Brexit was a seismic event but overall I don't think the political landscape has changed that much. You and I are still in the same party despite voting differently, we are also both wary of the new leadership as well. I'm not going to leave for the Lib Dems and definitely not for Labour. My only choice is to tough it out and if I get the chance vote for a liberal type of leader, even if it means Osborne coming back.

I also don't see any new party coming along, I'll never support a party with the "safe space" chumps in it and I doubt you would either. So where does that leave us?

Think of a party that would carry on the Cameron/The coalition's education reforms, that was focused on making the economic cake bigger, not equal.

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

That party currently sits on the back benches of the governing one. There is literally zero appetite to split, so where does it leave us?

Just want to add, I agree with all of those policy goals.

I'm staying put, we're like Churchill on the backbenchers whilst the appeasers are in charge. Our time will come again.

TMay as Chamberlain and Davis as Halifax?

AlastairMeeks

Charles Grant of the Centre for European Reform is gloomy about the chances of a favourable Brexit deal for Britain:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/oct/07/europe-hard-brexit-hurt-british-trade-deal?utm_term=Autofeed&CMP=twt_b-gdnnews

Morris_Dancer

Mr. Herdson, I quite agree.

Some people have decided to complain and are merely waiting for announcements to inform them about what they are complaining.

Not to say May doesn't deserve scrutiny and, in some cases, criticism. If nothing else, Rudd's rhetoric has been foolish, and I'm still not persuaded by the nuclear policy.

CarlottaVance

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

So who, or what, will depose the current status quo? Brexit was a seismic event but overall I don't think the political landscape has changed that much. You and I are still in the same party despite voting differently, we are also both wary of the new leadership as well. I'm not going to leave for the Lib Dems and definitely not for Labour. My only choice is to tough it out and if I get the chance vote for a liberal type of leader, even if it means Osborne coming back.

I also don't see any new party coming along, I'll never support a party with the "safe space" chumps in it and I doubt you would either. So where does that leave us?

Think of a party that would carry on the Cameron/The coalition's education reforms, that was focused on making the economic cake bigger, not equal.

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

That party currently sits on the back benches of the governing one. There is literally zero appetite to split, so where does it leave us?

Just want to add, I agree with all of those policy goals.

I'm staying put, we're like Churchill on the backbenchers whilst the appeasers are in charge. Our time will come again.

Or Heath in 'the great sulk'?

TheScreamingEagles

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

So who, or what, will depose the current status quo? Brexit was a seismic event but overall I don't think the political landscape has changed that much. You and I are still in the same party despite voting differently, we are also both wary of the new leadership as well. I'm not going to leave for the Lib Dems and definitely not for Labour. My only choice is to tough it out and if I get the chance vote for a liberal type of leader, even if it means Osborne coming back.

I also don't see any new party coming along, I'll never support a party with the "safe space" chumps in it and I doubt you would either. So where does that leave us?

Think of a party that would carry on the Cameron/The coalition's education reforms, that was focused on making the economic cake bigger, not equal.

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

That party currently sits on the back benches of the governing one. There is literally zero appetite to split, so where does it leave us?

Just want to add, I agree with all of those policy goals.

I'm staying put, we're like Churchill on the backbenchers whilst the appeasers are in charge. Our time will come again.

TMay as Chamberlain and Davis as Halifax?

Yah.

I'm writing a peace on Cameron's legacy, I have reluctantly concluded he's the modern day Stanley Baldwin.

Like Baldwin, he put party before country to win a general election, and his legacy is truly damaging for the country.

Tykejohnno

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

So who, or what, will depose the current status quo? Brexit was a seismic event but overall I don't think the political landscape has changed that much. You and I are still in the same party despite voting differently, we are also both wary of the new leadership as well. I'm not going to leave for the Lib Dems and definitely not for Labour. My only choice is to tough it out and if I get the chance vote for a liberal type of leader, even if it means Osborne coming back.

I also don't see any new party coming along, I'll never support a party with the "safe space" chumps in it and I doubt you would either. So where does that leave us?

Think of a party that would carry on the Cameron/The coalition's education reforms, that was focused on making the economic cake bigger, not equal.

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

That party currently sits on the back benches of the governing one. There is literally zero appetite to split, so where does it leave us?

Just want to add, I agree with all of those policy goals.

I'm staying put, we're like Churchill on the backbenchers whilst the appeasers are in charge. Our time will come again.

And like churchill who wanted Britain seperate from a European superstate, better example for you would be Blair or clegg.

Lennon

JosiasJessop said:

Off-topic:

The company Mrs J works for is having a Christmas Party. So far, so good. Except it is going to be formal attire.

WTH has a Christmas Party in formal attire? Nothing can stifle fun more than having to look smart.

Formal as in suit, or 'party formal' as in Black Tie? For a Cambridge-based company used to Formal Halls, Matric Dinners, etc. I can see the latter being seen as a 'nice idea' for a Christmas party - no excuse for the former at all in my view.

JohnO

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

So who, or what, will depose the current status quo? Brexit was a seismic event but overall I don't think the political landscape has changed that much. You and I are still in the same party despite voting differently, we are also both wary of the new leadership as well. I'm not going to leave for the Lib Dems and definitely not for Labour. My only choice is to tough it out and if I get the chance vote for a liberal type of leader, even if it means Osborne coming back.

I also don't see any new party coming along, I'll never support a party with the "safe space" chumps in it and I doubt you would either. So where does that leave us?

Think of a party that would carry on the Cameron/The coalition's education reforms, that was focused on making the economic cake bigger, not equal.

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

That party currently sits on the back benches of the governing one. There is literally zero appetite to split, so where does it leave us?

Just want to add, I agree with all of those policy goals.

I'm staying put, we're like Churchill on the backbenchers whilst the appeasers are in charge. Our time will come again.

Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.

surbiton

https://www.poundsterlinglive.com/eur/5552-gbp-to-eur-parity-forecast-ubs-3454

PBrexiters favourite mantra: the EUR imploding.

2003: £1= EUR 1.37

2016:: £1= EUR 1.11

It really is imploding. Sterling, I mean.

Indigo

TheScreamingEagles said:

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

And if told by an intransigent EU that the choices were either "Full FoM & Full Single Market" or "piss off", what would this party do, and what would it tell the voters ?

kle4

CarlottaVance said:

Owen Jones tweets: There's plenty of useless, bungling and/or mediocre white male politicians who don't get the bile Diane Abbott does. Why is this exactly?

Because she has a much higher media presence than most of those, and because people try to excuse her patronising, hypocritical approach by asking leading questions like that implying it must be racism.

MarkSenior

Highland Culloden after Stage 6

SNP 908
LDem 703
Con 515
Ind MacPherson 414

Heading for a SNP / LD close finish

HYUFD

The majority of the electorate could not care less about the markets, they voted to control immigration which May will do. In any case the low pound helps exports even if it makes imports and foreign travel more expensive. The fall in the pound today was due to Hollande's hard BREXIT statement and automated trading in Asia

Lennon

edmundintokyo said:

MTimT said:

2. A need to correct the trading algorithm so that something so trivial doesn't have such a big impact on trading

May has been itching to regulate mathematics ever since she found out about cryptography. She could come up with some kind of licensing system where you have to get the government's permission before you're allowed to use an algorithm.

Please stop giving her ideas...

MaxPB

JohnO said:

Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.

The tone of Mrs May's speech has worried a lot of people. She needs to row back on some of it and put Rudd on a much tighter leash. The foreign workers register was a huge and unnecessary misstep as was the idea of deporting foreign doctors in 2025.

surbiton

The market is all wrong.

The EU is going to roll out the red carpet to a single market.

Remember, "they need us" more than we need them. Something to do with Balance of Payments !

MTimT

edmundintokyo said:

MTimT said:

2. A need to correct the trading algorithm so that something so trivial doesn't have such a big impact on trading

May has been itching to regulate mathematics ever since she found out about cryptography. She could come up with some kind of licensing system where you have to get the government's permission before you're allowed to use an algorithm.

Perhaps we'll end up with politically correct and un-PC mathematics.

What I was thinking about was how the risk management algorithms contributed to 2008. Not a matter for government regulation, but good business.

taffys

surbiton said:

https://www.poundsterlinglive.com/eur/5552-gbp-to-eur-parity-forecast-ubs-3454

PBrexiters favourite mantra: the EUR imploding.

2003: £1= EUR 1.37

2016:: £1= EUR 1.11

It really is imploding. Sterling, I mean.

Hands up, you have a point.

But the EU left us no choice.

HYUFD

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

So who, or what, will depose the current status quo? Brexit was a seismic event but overall I don't think the political landscape has changed that much. You and I are still in the same party despite voting differently, we are also both wary of the new leadership as well. I'm not going to leave for the Lib Dems and definitely not for Labour. My only choice is to tough it out and if I get the chance vote for a liberal type of leader, even if it means Osborne coming back.

I also don't see any new party coming along, I'll never support a party with the "safe space" chumps in it and I doubt you would either. So where does that leave us?

Think of a party that would carry on the Cameron/The coalition's education reforms, that was focused on making the economic cake bigger, not equal.

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

That party currently sits on the back benches of the governing one. There is literally zero appetite to split, so where does it leave us?

Just want to add, I agree with all of those policy goals.

I'm staying put, we're like Churchill on the backbenchers whilst the appeasers are in charge. Our time will come again.

Since when is sucking up to the EU remotely Churchillian? Churchill was prepared for Britain to stand alone rather than suck up to Hitler

surbiton

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-37583196

Oh, dear ! It is not getting any better.

Moses_

It's a pig in a poke

Remainers want the Brexit mob to sort out in 47 days what Remainers took 47 years to build on a sand of lies.......

Yet when the people were finally asked Remainers still could not carry the popular vote and win the argument after 47 fecking years? They then mope and they weep and they winge and they moan. Perhaps they need to look inwards and see why the majority do not agree.

FFS .....enough already.

HYUFD

MaxPB said:

JohnO said:

Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.

The tone of Mrs May's speech has worried a lot of people. She needs to row back on some of it and put Rudd on a much tighter leash. The foreign workers register was a huge and unnecessary misstep as was the idea of deporting foreign doctors in 2025.

Yet most voters backed it

MarkSenior

HYUFD said:

The majority of the electorate could not care less about the markets, they voted to control immigration which May will do. In any case the low pound helps exports even if it makes imports and foreign travel more expensive. The fall in the pound today was due to Hollande's hard BREXIT statement and automated trading in Asia

Brexit has turned the UK into a 2nd world nation with a 3rd world currency .

CarlottaVance

surbiton said:

https://www.poundsterlinglive.com/eur/5552-gbp-to-eur-parity-forecast-ubs-3454

PBrexiters favourite mantra: the EUR imploding.

2003: £1= EUR 1.37

2016:: £1= EUR 1.11

It really is imploding. Sterling, I mean.

2007: £1 = EUR 1.52
2008 £1 = EUR 1.03

I think we can safely say the rate tends to fluctuate......

felix

AlastairMeeks said:

Who would have thought that the currency of a country with a large deficit where the deficit reduction plan has just been abandoned without a replacement and with the government taking an increasingly business-unfriendly tone, while seeking to renegotiate its trading arrangements with its closest trading partners at high speed in bad temper might come under pressure?

If only some 'experts' had been available beforehand to warn us of.....oh waittttttt.......

TheScreamingEagles

John said:

Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.

Indeed, the expectation management game for Mrs May are quite bad. Everyone expects her to beat Corbyn comfortably in a general election, if there's a plethora of polls that puts the Tories ahead of Labour but within in the margin of error then people will start talking.

One of the things I heard most at conference was the 'absolute monarchy moderated by regicide' quote.

kle4

surbiton said:

The market is all wrong.

The EU is going to roll out the red carpet to a single market.

Remember, "they need us" more than we need them. Something to do with Balance of Payments !

A deal that works for us is, I am sure, possible, but there is no doubt some had unrealistic expectations. For one, all the talk about it being in the EU's interest to give us things might well be true, but even if they are, that is no guarantee they will do so. For one, a little bit more pain in exchange for not making our exit look too comfortable helps spread the message it isn't worth leaving, might be considered worth the cost for many. For two, who is to say the nations and bureaucracy will act rationally even if it is in their interest to give us things? We were just told things were in our interest and voted the other way, Columbians were told a historic peace deal might flounder if they voted No but did anyway - time will tell on both, if I helped contribute to a mistake for instance, but things a lot of people say are in the interests of others to do does not end up happening.

MaxPB

Indigo said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

And if told by an intransigent EU that the choices were either "Full FoM & Full Single Market" or "piss off", what would this party do, and what would it tell the voters ?

Take the former and move one circle away from the EU, rebuild our non-EU relationships, use weak Sterling to rebuild our balance of payments and look at moving another circle out in another few years.

What the PM is proposing is moving from the inside lane of a 6 lane motorway onto a slip road that is fast approaching crossing all the traffic to get there in time. It's not a simple process.

HYUFD

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

The Tories are actually polling better under May than Cameron was when he left

TheScreamingEagles

Indigo said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

And if told by an intransigent EU that the choices were either "Full FoM & Full Single Market" or "piss off", what would this party do, and what would it tell the voters ?

I'd say well the people have voted against full freedom of movement, and we'd have to make the best of no full single market membership/access deal.

It isn't like the voters weren't warned about this.

TonyE

Apparently, despite the massive movement in price there wasn't a great deal of liquidity involved in the Asian market overnight. There may be no political element to this at all.

There's a very good chance that this was a trader (or a small number of traders) choosing to push the market down for advantage or to mitigate another position.

Chris_A

Moses we'll carry one whingeing and moaning (just like your lot had done for decades) until we can stop the damage being done to our country and ensure vile racists like Rudd are consigned to the back benches where at best she belongs.

TheScreamingEagles

HYUFD said:

MaxPB said:

JohnO said:

Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.

The tone of Mrs May's speech has worried a lot of people. She needs to row back on some of it and put Rudd on a much tighter leash. The foreign workers register was a huge and unnecessary misstep as was the idea of deporting foreign doctors in 2025.

Yet most voters backed it

The voters also backed Gordon Brown's British Jobs for British Workers, then changed their mind.

JohnO

MaxPB said:

JohnO said:

Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.

The tone of Mrs May's speech has worried a lot of people. She needs to row back on some of it and put Rudd on a much tighter leash. The foreign workers register was a huge and unnecessary misstep as was the idea of deporting foreign doctors in 2025.

I agree on both counts....but then I voted Remain. Hard exit here we come: it's immigration, stupid (not directed at you).

MarkSenior

Highland Culloden after Stage 7

SNP 970
LDem 793
Con 589

HYUFD

TheScreamingEagles said:

HYUFD said:

MaxPB said:

JohnO said:

Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.

The tone of Mrs May's speech has worried a lot of people. She needs to row back on some of it and put Rudd on a much tighter leash. The foreign workers register was a huge and unnecessary misstep as was the idea of deporting foreign doctors in 2025.

Yet most voters backed it

The voters also backed Gordon Brown's British Jobs for British Workers, then changed their mind.

They did not change their mind as the Leave vote showed, they just preferred Cameron in 2010

kle4

Moses_ said:

It's a pig in a poke

Remainers want the Brexit mob to sort out in 47 days what Remainers took 47 years to build on a sand of lies.......

Yet when the people were finally asked Remainers still could not carry the popular vote and win the argument after 47 fecking years? They then mope and they weep and they winge and they moan. Perhaps they need to look inwards and see why the majority do not agree.

FFS .....enough already.

People have the right to say 'I told you so' of course. But ultimately that point is pretty strong - why were so many outright hostile and so many others apathetic or lukewarm, to the point positive arguments in favour of the EU go barely a look in? Blaming the media, populists and general population idiocy is no excuse given so long to make a benign impression.

TGOHF

I for one will gladly give up the running of our country to avoid a temporary dip in the Forex rates.

Who is with me ?

Charles

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SouthamObserver said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sleazy broken Sterling on the slide.

Just like the Tories under Mrs May?

This is part of the problem. The Tories cannot lose, so there is no fear factor.

Of course they can lose. Politics, like nature, abhors a vacuum, if the Tories screw up, someone, eventually, will prosper from the Tories screwing up.

In 2050?

Hubris old bean.

What do you think David Lloyd George's reaction would have been in 1918 that he would be the last Liberal Prime Minister?

Or the reaction of Campbell-Bannerman after winning in 1906 a majority of 120 odd that the Liberals would be screwed forever in a little over a decade.

When these kind of seismic changes come, they happen very rapidly. Cf Scottish Labour

So who, or what, will depose the current status quo? Brexit was a seismic event but overall I don't think the political landscape has changed that much. You and I are still in the same party despite voting differently, we are also both wary of the new leadership as well. I'm not going to leave for the Lib Dems and definitely not for Labour. My only choice is to tough it out and if I get the chance vote for a liberal type of leader, even if it means Osborne coming back.

I also don't see any new party coming along, I'll never support a party with the "safe space" chumps in it and I doubt you would either. So where does that leave us?

Think of a party that would carry on the Cameron/The coalition's education reforms, that was focused on making the economic cake bigger, not equal.

Socially liberal, not someone obsessed with 'safe spaces' or naming and shaming companies for the number of Jonny Foreigners they employ.

That party currently sits on the back benches of the governing one. There is literally zero appetite to split, so where does it leave us?

Just want to add, I agree with all of those policy goals.

I'm staying put, we're like Churchill on the backbenchers whilst the appeasers are in charge. Our time will come again.

As modest as Churchill, I see.

Indigo

MaxPB said:

JohnO said:

Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.

The tone of Mrs May's speech has worried a lot of people. She needs to row back on some of it and put Rudd on a much tighter leash. The foreign workers register was a huge and unnecessary misstep as was the idea of deporting foreign doctors in 2025.

I am sure it was the talk of the No10 Bus in Basildon. Outside the metropolitan circles it will have been met by general approval or at least indifference. We seem to roll from one instance of finance, media and other inner city types feeling that they speak for the population to another. Wasn't that fact that 59% approved of Rudd's list a bit of a clue, and that will be a low result because some people will have been concerned it was the non-PC view.

CarlottaVance

MaxPB said:

JohnO said:

Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.

deporting foreign doctors in 2025.

In shackles and orange jump suits no doubt?

Or will we simply have time limited work permits like much of the rest of the world?

And as for publishing foreign workers - it could be worse, we could publish their employer, job title, location and nationality, like that other fascist regime.....the USA....

Gardenwalker

CarlottaVance said:

surbiton said:

https://www.poundsterlinglive.com/eur/5552-gbp-to-eur-parity-forecast-ubs-3454

PBrexiters favourite mantra: the EUR imploding.

2003: £1= EUR 1.37

2016:: £1= EUR 1.11

It really is imploding. Sterling, I mean.

2007: £1 = EUR 1.52
2008 £1 = EUR 1.03

I think we can safely say the rate tends to fluctuate......

I wonder if there was anything happening in 2008 to devalue sterling so much.

Oh yes, I remember now.

I'd rather not have that every decade, thanks.

CarlottaVance

TheScreamingEagles said:

John said:

Tranquility, mon brave, senex Johannus ex Hershamo, exhorts moderation in temper and tone. These are not (yet at least) the worst of IDS times. Internal exile is unwarranted.

One of the things I heard most at conference was the 'absolute monarchy moderated by regicide' quote.

You went?

I thought you stayed away?