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  • CD13CD13 Posts: 6,367
    Mr Owls,

    It's not the trivia question that's the problem, it was her whole attitude.

    "How dare you try to catch me out, you oik."

    The accusation of sexism was just embarrassing. Assuming Her Highnesss was on her best behaviour for the interview, I suggest she might be best suited for a back office role.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112
    MaxPB said:

    T.

    Think .
    Clinton just doesn't get it. She's making all the sneering mistakes of the Remain campaign, and worse.

    She still might just win, given that Trump is a US Farage (without the glamour and appeal of a Boris on his side too, as Leave did), but it could well be a very damn close run thing.

    And she is basically relying on hatred for Trump, and that alone, to carry the day for her.
    The Clinton campaign and Remain campaign are eerily similar, even down to the Clinton campaign's strapline "Stronger Together". She is making all of the same mistakes as well, insulting the other side's voters, resorting to calling the other candidate names. It makes her look petulant. The basic problem is that the majority of the US public agree with Trump's main idea of reducing immigration and deporting illegal immigrants. Clinton can't go head to head with Trump on immigration for exactly the same reason Remain chose not to debate immigration with Leave. Again, the similarities are there for anyone to see.

    I think the main difference is that Leave/Remain was a referendum, it wasn't picking the PM or setting the direction of the nation for the next 4/8 years (though in many ways it has done both).

    As of now, I can't see beyond a bunch of "shy" Trump supporters turning out in the rust belt and older voters in traditional GOP states doing what they have done for a lifetime which would hand Trump victory. There is a complete lack of enthusiasm for Clinton, again just as there was a lack of enthusiasm for Remain. I know a few people who campaigned for Remain, I was invited to one of their events in London, the difference with Leave was stark. Leave campaigners of all ages seemed to have boundless energy, were willing to get doors closed on them, be called names on the rare occasion and yet we all kept going even when the cause seemed hopeless. The Remain campaign, at least from the single event I went to, was basically paid activists leading a bunch of demoralised volunteers, they all had to be told their lines or read from their script (phone banking). No one seemed to know what the campaign stood for other than not losing to Nigel Farage and Boris Johnson. I get the feeling I could place the Trump and Clinton campaigns into that scenario and it would be quite true.
    A minor adjustment to your post. Remain didn't not choose to debate immigration. When they had to (DP in particular I recall, Newsnight, Pienaar), they simply, transparently, didn't have any kind of answer to the question. So they hesitated, tried to construct some kind of theoretically argument, and hence lost all hands down.

    For those, of course, who dislike immigration.
  • Mr. Max, he could replace Fox at Trade :D
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,755

    Mr. StClare, Trump should do nothing. It's genuinely a time when masterly inactivity would be a good thing. Why distract from the media airing concerns about Clinton's health?

    Never interrupt your opponent when he's making a mistake.
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    YouGov
    Which areas of the country most support new grammar schools? Try out our new interactive map https://t.co/3drkSh9jlW https://t.co/TFH00U1OHB
  • TOPPING said:

    IanB2 said:

    Also, why did the BBC News at Ten advertise the Archers for the last few minutes last night? Bloody weird.

    Not much news about? Yesterday was a slow news day, at least domestically. Clinton is foreign news, gold medals are sport. The front pages are all over the place.
    Wot, no mention of Emily's foreign affairs pint of milk?
    Because does anyone think Boris would know
    As per the R4 clip just now, of course he didn't know, but he managed not knowing much more elegantly than La Thornberry.

    Plus, as one of them noted, she had brought up her foreign trip herself. It wasn't as though they were talking about the NHS and she'd then been asked about the French foreign minister.
    Was it an old clip? Surely Boris has met him.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334

    Mr. Max, he could replace Fox at Trade :D

    I'd rather have him as Minister for Brexit, get rid of Davis.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,768
    CD13 said:

    Mr Owls,

    It's not the trivia question that's the problem, it was her whole attitude.

    "How dare you try to catch me out, you oik."

    The accusation of sexism was just embarrassing. Assuming Her Highnesss was on her best behaviour for the interview, I suggest she might be best suited for a back office role.

    Thought she said ask Boris.

    Do you think Boris would have said something similar to "How dare you try to catch me out, you oik."

    What would May have said?

    Dave would have said he knew without giving the name.
  • nunununu Posts: 6,024

    Mr. StClare, Trump should do nothing. It's genuinely a time when masterly inactivity would be a good thing. Why distract from the media airing concerns about Clinton's health?

    In which case he will do an impression of her falling.
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Matt Chorley
    I asked Team Corbyn what had gone well in his first year. This is what they said: https://t.co/er9XauywpZ https://t.co/f7qIu92t3X
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112

    TOPPING said:

    IanB2 said:

    Also, why did the BBC News at Ten advertise the Archers for the last few minutes last night? Bloody weird.

    Not much news about? Yesterday was a slow news day, at least domestically. Clinton is foreign news, gold medals are sport. The front pages are all over the place.
    Wot, no mention of Emily's foreign affairs pint of milk?
    Because does anyone think Boris would know
    As per the R4 clip just now, of course he didn't know, but he managed not knowing much more elegantly than La Thornberry.

    Plus, as one of them noted, she had brought up her foreign trip herself. It wasn't as though they were talking about the NHS and she'd then been asked about the French foreign minister.
    Was it an old clip? Surely Boris has met him.
    Not sure, they had a few such clips. Most handled much better than The Colonel.
  • Mr. F, quite.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112
    edited September 2016

    CD13 said:

    Mr Owls,

    It's not the trivia question that's the problem, it was her whole attitude.

    "How dare you try to catch me out, you oik."

    The accusation of sexism was just embarrassing. Assuming Her Highnesss was on her best behaviour for the interview, I suggest she might be best suited for a back office role.

    Thought she said ask Boris.

    Do you think Boris would have said something similar to "How dare you try to catch me out, you oik."

    What would May have said?

    Dave would have said he knew without giving the name.
    Boris said: "I don't know, so what?"

    Edit: oh apologies I thought you meant about the milk. I think most others, having introduced the subject of their visit to foreign capitals, would have taken the time and trouble to know who they would be meeting.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/business/hinkley-style-reactor-has-serious-safety-flaw-wg50jzxhd

    More bad news for Hinkley, or at least the EPR design.

    Key quote:

    "The reactor could be approved for use running at 1,200 or 1,000 megawatts rather than its official 1,630MW capacity, for example.

    “That would be very bad for the economics of the plant,” said Stephen Thomas, an expert in nuclear energy at the University of Greenwich."
  • Mr. StClare, Trump should do nothing. It's genuinely a time when masterly inactivity would be a good thing. Why distract from the media airing concerns about Clinton's health?

    It's time for Clinton's medical staff to step in and do their professional duty. She's in no fit condition to continue this dangerous farce.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,755

    Trump can do it, but he will need to step-up a gear and act wholly Presidential over the next 8-9 weeks to contrast himself with Clinton.

    Think basically staying upright and lucid will be enough now.
    Clinton just doesn't get it. She's making all the sneering mistakes of the Remain campaign, and worse.

    She still might just win, given that Trump is a US Farage (without the glamour and appeal of a Boris on his side too, as Leave did), but it could well be a very damn close run thing.

    And she is basically relying on hatred for Trump, and that alone, to carry the day for her.
    Its a lack of comprehension that the status quo so beloved of the political establishment is a disaster for tens of millions. When you have nothing to lose - no job, no prospects - then the risk is voting for the status quo.

    It doesn't matter if Trump says things that sound off the wall to the establishment, everything they say and do is destructive to the people who have nothing.

    Grasping that unfettered free-market economics have destroyed the life chances of so many and offering an explanation and a solution (however far fetched we may see it) is how we've had the rise in non-establishment politics. Trump. Farage. Front Nationale, Podemos etc
    I wouldn't go so far as to call it a disaster, but it's not delivering the economic benefits that many people have come to expect (a rising standard of living) and is delivering some disbenefits (changes associated with mass migration, loss of status for many workers, loss of sovereignty) and it grates for the winners from the current set up to go on about how all is for the best in the best of all worlds.
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383

    CD13 said:

    Mr Owls,

    It's not the trivia question that's the problem, it was her whole attitude.

    "How dare you try to catch me out, you oik."

    The accusation of sexism was just embarrassing. Assuming Her Highnesss was on her best behaviour for the interview, I suggest she might be best suited for a back office role.

    Thought she said ask Boris.

    Do you think Boris would have said something similar to "How dare you try to catch me out, you oik."

    What would May have said?

    Dave would have said he knew without giving the name.
    Very good
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Good Morning all, and a very Happy Monday to all Brexiteers!

    Rejoice!!

    All of your pro-Brexit propaganda is now collected in single place.

    Let me be the first (of many) to link to it...

    http://www.brexitcentral.com/
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Ian Jones
    Jeremy Corbyn's first year as Labour leader, according to the polls. https://t.co/nfid1QhBr5
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    More doppelganger fun

    Heather Tapper
    @Conservative_VW no secret service and I took pics off tv. Not same person. Look at the ear. https://t.co/YfqQZbL2mV
  • Mr. P, *sighs*

    Most people said both campaigns were full of rubbish. Does it include Remain propaganda such as global war, and the downfall of Western civilisation?
  • PlatoSaid said:

    More doppelganger fun

    Heather Tapper
    @Conservative_VW no secret service and I took pics off tv. Not same person. Look at the ear. https://t.co/YfqQZbL2mV

    Thats some conspiracy level stuff.... but hmmmmm
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,591
    Morning. Is the big story today not how Trump has managed to shut up for 24!hours, rather than open his mouth for the purpose of putting his foot in it?
  • EssexitEssexit Posts: 1,963

    Mr. L, even so, it was tosh.

    Mr. Essexit, was it the Brexiteer, in the polling booth, with the ballot paper?

    It was the BBC Producers, with the pinko agenda, in the recording studio.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,591
    edited September 2016
    PlatoSaid said:

    More doppelganger fun

    Heather Tapper
    @Conservative_VW no secret service and I took pics off tv. Not same person. Look at the ear. https://t.co/YfqQZbL2mV

    It's all a bit conspiracy theory, but they are filling a void created by the lack of official comment from Hillary. The two photos could be of the same person, but could equally be two different people. If there is a doppelgänger though, she's the proverbial cooked bread.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334

    PlatoSaid said:

    More doppelganger fun

    Heather Tapper
    @Conservative_VW no secret service and I took pics off tv. Not same person. Look at the ear. https://t.co/YfqQZbL2mV

    Thats some conspiracy level stuff.... but hmmmmm
    On Friday people were saying that claims about Hillary's poor health were a conspiracy... :D
  • Sandpit said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    More doppelganger fun

    Heather Tapper
    @Conservative_VW no secret service and I took pics off tv. Not same person. Look at the ear. https://t.co/YfqQZbL2mV

    It's all a bit conspiracy theory, but they are filling a void created by the lack of official comment from Hillary. The two photos could be of the same person, but could equally be two different people.
    It does seem a bit strange that suddenly she's ill, to suddently she's fine, with a kid! To now 'she's got pneumonia.

    If she doesn't get in front of the cameras today, then even more questions are going to be asked.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    If the presidential election was just like brexit then the US pollsters Likely Voter screen should increase Hilary's lead over All Respondents as precious non voter who are going to go Trump this time around filtered out.

    This doesn't match reality. The Washington Post poll thr gave Hilary a 8vpointnlead in the two way race gave her a 15 point lead amongst all respondents and a 10 point lead amongst Registered Voters.


    Democrats have a lazy voter problem that he US polls adjust for, classic I'll say I'll vote Democrat, DNV on the day.

    Now you'd be needing not just CDE Non voters to vote Trump but for them to also say they will vote Hilary to the pollsters.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 73,016
    edited September 2016
    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    IanB2 said:

    Also, why did the BBC News at Ten advertise the Archers for the last few minutes last night? Bloody weird.

    Not much news about? Yesterday was a slow news day, at least domestically. Clinton is foreign news, gold medals are sport. The front pages are all over the place.
    Wot, no mention of Emily's foreign affairs pint of milk?
    Because does anyone think Boris would know
    As per the R4 clip just now, of course he didn't know, but he managed not knowing much more elegantly than La Thornberry.

    Plus, as one of them noted, she had brought up her foreign trip herself. It wasn't as though they were talking about the NHS and she'd then been asked about the French foreign minister.
    Was it an old clip? Surely Boris has met him.
    Not sure, they had a few such clips. Most handled much better than The Colonel.
    You'd think Boris would remember Ayrault after his various contretemps with the guy...
    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/28/boris-johnson-set-for-talks-with-french-foreign-minister
  • JonathanDJonathanD Posts: 2,400
    MaxPB said:

    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/business/hinkley-style-reactor-has-serious-safety-flaw-wg50jzxhd

    More bad news for Hinkley, or at least the EPR design.

    Key quote:

    "The reactor could be approved for use running at 1,200 or 1,000 megawatts rather than its official 1,630MW capacity, for example.

    “That would be very bad for the economics of the plant,” said Stephen Thomas, an expert in nuclear energy at the University of Greenwich."

    Nothing to do with the design as the last line of that article makes clear. It's a (debatable)manufacturing problem specific to the Reactor Pressure Vessel made for the EPR at Flammevale.

    Has no bearing on Hinkley C.
  • Pneumonia is, on the whole, contagious. Why would they think it would be reassuring to show Hillary hugging a small child on her re-emergence from the apartment??
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Pneumonia is, on the whole, contagious. Why would they think it would be reassuring to show Hillary hugging a small child on her re-emergence from the apartment??

    No it isn't
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    JonathanD said:

    MaxPB said:

    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/business/hinkley-style-reactor-has-serious-safety-flaw-wg50jzxhd

    More bad news for Hinkley, or at least the EPR design.

    Key quote:

    "The reactor could be approved for use running at 1,200 or 1,000 megawatts rather than its official 1,630MW capacity, for example.

    “That would be very bad for the economics of the plant,” said Stephen Thomas, an expert in nuclear energy at the University of Greenwich."

    Nothing to do with the design as the last line of that article makes clear. It's a (debatable)manufacturing problem specific to the Reactor Pressure Vessel made for the EPR at Flammevale.

    Has no bearing on Hinkley C.
    The same manufacturing process that will be used by EDF at HPC. Time to junk it. Theresa May should tell the Chinese that we aren't going ahead because the French can't be trusted to complete it.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    Alistair said:

    Pneumonia is, on the whole, contagious. Why would they think it would be reassuring to show Hillary hugging a small child on her re-emergence from the apartment??

    No it isn't
    According to Wikipedia it is an infectious disease.
  • Alistair said:

    Pneumonia is, on the whole, contagious. Why would they think it would be reassuring to show Hillary hugging a small child on her re-emergence from the apartment??

    No it isn't
    No it isn't reassuring or no pneumonia isn't contagious?

    Because as the majority of cases are viral or bacterial rather than fungal or aspirational, it really is contagious
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Jeremy Kyle is epic right now
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,755
    Alistair said:

    If the presidential election was just like brexit then the US pollsters Likely Voter screen should increase Hilary's lead over All Respondents as precious non voter who are going to go Trump this time around filtered out.

    This doesn't match reality. The Washington Post poll thr gave Hilary a 8vpointnlead in the two way race gave her a 15 point lead amongst all respondents and a 10 point lead amongst Registered Voters.


    Democrats have a lazy voter problem that he US polls adjust for, classic I'll say I'll vote Democrat, DNV on the day.

    Now you'd be needing not just CDE Non voters to vote Trump but for them to also say they will vote Hilary to the pollsters.

    Or for them to be difficult for pollsters to reach, or to give what they consider to be a socially correct answer to interviewers which doesn't match their real views.
  • JonathanDJonathanD Posts: 2,400
    MaxPB said:

    JonathanD said:

    MaxPB said:

    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/business/hinkley-style-reactor-has-serious-safety-flaw-wg50jzxhd

    More bad news for Hinkley, or at least the EPR design.

    Key quote:

    "The reactor could be approved for use running at 1,200 or 1,000 megawatts rather than its official 1,630MW capacity, for example.

    “That would be very bad for the economics of the plant,” said Stephen Thomas, an expert in nuclear energy at the University of Greenwich."

    Nothing to do with the design as the last line of that article makes clear. It's a (debatable)manufacturing problem specific to the Reactor Pressure Vessel made for the EPR at Flammevale.

    Has no bearing on Hinkley C.
    The same manufacturing process that will be used by EDF at HPC. Time to junk it. Theresa May should tell the Chinese that we aren't going ahead because the French can't be trusted to complete it.
    No, the manufacturing process for the RPV can be quite easily changed to modify the steel carbon levels. Or if we aren't convinced by Areva, we get Japan to manufacture it or bung Sheffield Forgemaster some money and have them do it.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    JonathanD said:

    MaxPB said:

    JonathanD said:

    MaxPB said:

    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/business/hinkley-style-reactor-has-serious-safety-flaw-wg50jzxhd

    More bad news for Hinkley, or at least the EPR design.

    Key quote:

    "The reactor could be approved for use running at 1,200 or 1,000 megawatts rather than its official 1,630MW capacity, for example.

    “That would be very bad for the economics of the plant,” said Stephen Thomas, an expert in nuclear energy at the University of Greenwich."

    Nothing to do with the design as the last line of that article makes clear. It's a (debatable)manufacturing problem specific to the Reactor Pressure Vessel made for the EPR at Flammevale.

    Has no bearing on Hinkley C.
    The same manufacturing process that will be used by EDF at HPC. Time to junk it. Theresa May should tell the Chinese that we aren't going ahead because the French can't be trusted to complete it.
    No, the manufacturing process for the RPV can be quite easily changed to modify the steel carbon levels. Or if we aren't convinced by Areva, we get Japan to manufacture it or bung Sheffield Forgemaster some money and have them do it.
    Or not waste £18bn (or more if we're paying for better steelworks) on a guaranteed white elephant.
  • Alistair said:

    If the presidential election was just like brexit then the US pollsters Likely Voter screen should increase Hilary's lead over All Respondents as precious non voter who are going to go Trump this time around filtered out.

    This doesn't match reality. The Washington Post poll thr gave Hilary a 8vpointnlead in the two way race gave her a 15 point lead amongst all respondents and a 10 point lead amongst Registered Voters.


    Democrats have a lazy voter problem that he US polls adjust for, classic I'll say I'll vote Democrat, DNV on the day.

    Now you'd be needing not just CDE Non voters to vote Trump but for them to also say they will vote Hilary to the pollsters.

    The risk for Hillary - if she carries on as she has - is that her base don't turn out, whilst Trump's does.
  • Alistair said:

    Pneumonia is, on the whole, contagious. Why would they think it would be reassuring to show Hillary hugging a small child on her re-emergence from the apartment??

    No it isn't
    No it isn't reassuring or no pneumonia isn't contagious?

    Because as the majority of cases are viral or bacterial rather than fungal or aspirational, it really is contagious
    I thought Hillary's respiratory problems were due to Trump allergy. Not an infection.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    MaxPB said:

    Alistair said:

    Pneumonia is, on the whole, contagious. Why would they think it would be reassuring to show Hillary hugging a small child on her re-emergence from the apartment??

    No it isn't
    According to Wikipedia it is an infectious disease.
    Unless Clinton was squuezing mucus straight down the girl's throat she isn't going to catch pneumonia from her.
  • Sean_F said:

    Trump can do it, but he will need to step-up a gear and act wholly Presidential over the next 8-9 weeks to contrast himself with Clinton.

    Think basically staying upright and lucid will be enough now.
    Clinton just doesn't get it. She's making all the sneering mistakes of the Remain campaign, and worse.

    She still might just win, given that Trump is a US Farage (without the glamour and appeal of a Boris on his side too, as Leave did), but it could well be a very damn close run thing.

    And she is basically relying on hatred for Trump, and that alone, to carry the day for her.
    Its a lack of comprehension that the status quo so beloved of the political establishment is a disaster for tens of millions. When you have nothing to lose - no job, no prospects - then the risk is voting for the status quo.

    It doesn't matter if Trump says things that sound off the wall to the establishment, everything they say and do is destructive to the people who have nothing.

    Grasping that unfettered free-market economics have destroyed the life chances of so many and offering an explanation and a solution (however far fetched we may see it) is how we've had the rise in non-establishment politics. Trump. Farage. Front Nationale, Podemos etc
    I wouldn't go so far as to call it a disaster, but it's not delivering the economic benefits that many people have come to expect (a rising standard of living) and is delivering some disbenefits (changes associated with mass migration, loss of status for many workers, loss of sovereignty) and it grates for the winners from the current set up to go on about how all is for the best in the best of all worlds.
    The two are linked, of course.

    It makes it much easier for those who are prospering from the status quo to defend their own economic interests, and unthinkingly dismiss those who aren't, if they symbiotically attach race to it.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334

    Alistair said:

    Pneumonia is, on the whole, contagious. Why would they think it would be reassuring to show Hillary hugging a small child on her re-emergence from the apartment??

    No it isn't
    No it isn't reassuring or no pneumonia isn't contagious?

    Because as the majority of cases are viral or bacterial rather than fungal or aspirational, it really is contagious
    I thought Hillary's respiratory problems were due to Trump allergy. Not an infection.
    Allergies was the story on Friday, heat stroke on Sunday morning and then by Sunday afternoon a retrospective diagnosis of pneumonia which conveniently covered her coughing attack on Friday.
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    PlatoSaid said:

    Jeremy Kyle is epic right now

    Jeremy Kyle is unwatchable.. right now!
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Alistair said:

    If the presidential election was just like brexit then the US pollsters Likely Voter screen should increase Hilary's lead over All Respondents as precious non voter who are going to go Trump this time around filtered out.

    This doesn't match reality. The Washington Post poll thr gave Hilary a 8vpointnlead in the two way race gave her a 15 point lead amongst all respondents and a 10 point lead amongst Registered Voters.


    Democrats have a lazy voter problem that he US polls adjust for, classic I'll say I'll vote Democrat, DNV on the day.

    Now you'd be needing not just CDE Non voters to vote Trump but for them to also say they will vote Hilary to the pollsters.

    The risk for Hillary - if she carries on as she has - is that her base don't turn out, whilst Trump's does.
    Hilary is polling better with African Americans than Obama did. The base is solid, the difficulty is the floating voters.
  • MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Betfair market has HC down from a 78% chance to a 63% chance.

    Under reaction ?

  • Alistair said:

    Alistair said:

    If the presidential election was just like brexit then the US pollsters Likely Voter screen should increase Hilary's lead over All Respondents as precious non voter who are going to go Trump this time around filtered out.

    This doesn't match reality. The Washington Post poll thr gave Hilary a 8vpointnlead in the two way race gave her a 15 point lead amongst all respondents and a 10 point lead amongst Registered Voters.


    Democrats have a lazy voter problem that he US polls adjust for, classic I'll say I'll vote Democrat, DNV on the day.

    Now you'd be needing not just CDE Non voters to vote Trump but for them to also say they will vote Hilary to the pollsters.

    The risk for Hillary - if she carries on as she has - is that her base don't turn out, whilst Trump's does.
    Hilary is polling better with African Americans than Obama did. The base is solid, the difficulty is the floating voters.
    That base might not turn out for her.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,296

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
  • TGOHF said:

    Betfair market has HC down from a 78% chance to a 63% chance.

    Under reaction ?

    A drop of 15% is about right for the incident but she was and remains too short.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Mr. P, *sighs*

    Most people said both campaigns were full of rubbish. Does it include Remain propaganda such as global war, and the downfall of Western civilisation?

    This not not about the campaign.

    This is about how BRILLIANT everything is now we have voted.

    How much control we have taken back, and exactly how much Sovereignty per head will be bestowed upon us the the 3 Brexiteers.
  • Alistair said:

    MaxPB said:

    Alistair said:

    Pneumonia is, on the whole, contagious. Why would they think it would be reassuring to show Hillary hugging a small child on her re-emergence from the apartment??

    No it isn't
    According to Wikipedia it is an infectious disease.
    Unless Clinton was squuezing mucus straight down the girl's throat she isn't going to catch pneumonia from her.
    NHS website:

    "...most cases of pneumonia are bacterial and aren't passed on from one person to another"
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Hopefully it is enough to get Gove back into Mrs. May's good graces and he takes over the Brexit brief. Davis is proving to be the disappointment that many predicted.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Scott_P said:

    Mr. P, *sighs*

    Most people said both campaigns were full of rubbish. Does it include Remain propaganda such as global war, and the downfall of Western civilisation?

    This not not about the campaign.

    This is about how BRILLIANT everything is now we have voted.

    How much control we have taken back, and exactly how much Sovereignty per head will be bestowed upon us the the 3 Brexiteers.
    Still feel let down by democracy Scott ? Lolza.

  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    It is 56 days till the election. In the last month there have been (according to the errant source that is RCP) 26 National polls

    Hilary Leads - 24
    Ties - 1
    Trump Leads - 1

    With 56 days to go in the European Referendum in the previous month there had been 29 polls

    Remain Leads - 16
    Ties - 3
    Leave Leads - 10

    I can see why peopel think these votes are similar.
  • tlg86 said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
    She wasn't exactly a Nobel prize winner before either.
  • TGOHF said:

    Betfair market has HC down from a 78% chance to a 63% chance.

    Under reaction ?

    A drop of 15% is about right for the incident but she was and remains too short.
    What's the weather forecast for North America ? An autumnal cold snap might thin the presidential field.
  • tlg86 said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
    Greening for first cabinet exit?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,239
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Hopefully it is enough to get Gove back into Mrs. May's good graces and he takes over the Brexit brief. Davis is proving to be the disappointment that many predicted.
    If we all predicted he would be useless (and we did) have we any right to be disappointed?
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,782
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Hopefully it is enough to get Gove back into Mrs. May's good graces and he takes over the Brexit brief. Davis is proving to be the disappointment that many predicted.
    Fox is the disappointment. He has now realised that his trade deals are going to come to nothing, and he has lined up "fat" "lazy" British business to take the blame.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,239

    tlg86 said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
    Greening for first cabinet exit?
    I heard Liz Truss on the radio last week, giggling away in front of a Select Committee. Out of her depth did not come even close to describing it. Just embarrassing.
  • TGOHF said:

    Scott_P said:

    Mr. P, *sighs*

    Most people said both campaigns were full of rubbish. Does it include Remain propaganda such as global war, and the downfall of Western civilisation?

    This not not about the campaign.

    This is about how BRILLIANT everything is now we have voted.

    How much control we have taken back, and exactly how much Sovereignty per head will be bestowed upon us the the 3 Brexiteers.
    Still feel let down by democracy Scott ? Lolza.

    Where's the £350million/week, the NHS needs it now!
  • DavidL said:

    tlg86 said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
    Greening for first cabinet exit?
    I heard Liz Truss on the radio last week, giggling away in front of a Select Committee. Out of her depth did not come even close to describing it. Just embarrassing.
    "That is a DISGRACE."
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,782

    TGOHF said:

    Betfair market has HC down from a 78% chance to a 63% chance.

    Under reaction ?

    A drop of 15% is about right for the incident but she was and remains too short.
    What's the weather forecast for North America ? An autumnal cold snap might thin the presidential field.
    I see Biden is the third favourite, ahead of Bernie.

    Johnson, at 410, must surely be worth a pop in spite of Aleppo. If he gets into the debates, and he now might get his 15%, his odds will surely shorten.
  • Scott_P said:

    Mr. P, *sighs*

    Most people said both campaigns were full of rubbish. Does it include Remain propaganda such as global war, and the downfall of Western civilisation?

    This not not about the campaign.

    This is about how BRILLIANT everything is now we have voted.

    How much control we have taken back, and exactly how much Sovereignty per head will be bestowed upon us the the 3 Brexiteers.
    If nothing else, all the anti-democratic whining from all the right people is wonderful to see.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    TGOHF said:

    Scott_P said:

    Mr. P, *sighs*

    Most people said both campaigns were full of rubbish. Does it include Remain propaganda such as global war, and the downfall of Western civilisation?

    This not not about the campaign.

    This is about how BRILLIANT everything is now we have voted.

    How much control we have taken back, and exactly how much Sovereignty per head will be bestowed upon us the the 3 Brexiteers.
    Still feel let down by democracy Scott ? Lolza.

    Where's the £350million/week, the NHS needs it now!
    With that level of debate I can't believe remain lost.
  • tlg86 said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
    Indeed. It seems to me that any school which is free of LEA control and wants to enforce some discipline and standards is likely to be a good school. Call them grammars or free schools or academies or charter schools (in the USA) or whatever - the name is immaterial. Morgan seems to have missed this key point. It's also true that having a range of different schools, some catering to the more academic some to the more vocational makes good sense:

    http://www.adamsmith.org/blog/just-what-is-the-problem-with-grammar-schools

    Aren't we trying to emulate German educational outcomes and employment stats? Their school system is highly graded.
  • Alistair said:

    It is 56 days till the election. In the last month there have been (according to the errant source that is RCP) 26 National polls

    Hilary Leads - 24
    Ties - 1
    Trump Leads - 1

    With 56 days to go in the European Referendum in the previous month there had been 29 polls

    Remain Leads - 16
    Ties - 3
    Leave Leads - 10

    I can see why peopel think these votes are similar.

    The POTUS election is not a single national one.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112
    edited September 2016
    TGOHF said:

    Scott_P said:

    Mr. P, *sighs*

    Most people said both campaigns were full of rubbish. Does it include Remain propaganda such as global war, and the downfall of Western civilisation?

    This not not about the campaign.

    This is about how BRILLIANT everything is now we have voted.

    How much control we have taken back, and exactly how much Sovereignty per head will be bestowed upon us the the 3 Brexiteers.
    Still feel let down by democracy Scott ? Lolza.

    We love democracy. And when Jezza is democratically elected leader of Labour I presume you will join in the accepted wisdom that it was the best outcome.

    No one disputes such a decision has democratic legitimacy, nor would any sensible person disagree that it would be an idiotic one.
  • Alistair said:

    MaxPB said:

    Alistair said:

    Pneumonia is, on the whole, contagious. Why would they think it would be reassuring to show Hillary hugging a small child on her re-emergence from the apartment??

    No it isn't
    According to Wikipedia it is an infectious disease.
    Unless Clinton was squuezing mucus straight down the girl's throat she isn't going to catch pneumonia from her.
    'Clinton was squeezing mucus straight down the girl's throat'

    Trump's nascent tweet before his mobile was wrestled from his grasp by aides.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    TOPPING said:

    TGOHF said:

    Scott_P said:

    Mr. P, *sighs*

    Most people said both campaigns were full of rubbish. Does it include Remain propaganda such as global war, and the downfall of Western civilisation?

    This not not about the campaign.

    This is about how BRILLIANT everything is now we have voted.

    How much control we have taken back, and exactly how much Sovereignty per head will be bestowed upon us the the 3 Brexiteers.
    Still feel let down by democracy Scott ? Lolza.

    We love democracy. And when Jezza is democratically elected leader of Labour I presume you will join in the accepted wisdom that it was the best outcome.

    No one disputes such a decision has democratic legitimacy, nor would any sensible person disagree that it would be an idiotic one.
    JC winning the leadership election is indeed the best outcome for the country. Not for Labour mind you but well..

  • IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    Patrick said:

    tlg86 said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
    Indeed. It seems to me that any school which is free of LEA control and wants to enforce some discipline and standards is likely to be a good school. Call them grammars or free schools or academies or charter schools (in the USA) or whatever - the name is immaterial. Morgan seems to have missed this key point. It's also true that having a range of different schools, some catering to the more academic some to the more vocational makes good sense:

    http://www.adamsmith.org/blog/just-what-is-the-problem-with-grammar-schools

    Aren't we trying to emulate German educational outcomes and employment stats? Their school system is highly graded.
    Morgan was utterly housetrained at the Department of Education, all the signs are she is still singing from their civil service hymn sheet after losing her job.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,239
    Patrick said:

    tlg86 said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
    Indeed. It seems to me that any school which is free of LEA control and wants to enforce some discipline and standards is likely to be a good school. Call them grammars or free schools or academies or charter schools (in the USA) or whatever - the name is immaterial. Morgan seems to have missed this key point. It's also true that having a range of different schools, some catering to the more academic some to the more vocational makes good sense:

    http://www.adamsmith.org/blog/just-what-is-the-problem-with-grammar-schools

    Aren't we trying to emulate German educational outcomes and employment stats? Their school system is highly graded.
    That is probably true but calling schools Grammar Schools is like walking around a petrol depot with lit matches. It would have been so easy to avoid most of the grief by just using a different word. Madness.
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    DavidL said:

    tlg86 said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
    Greening for first cabinet exit?
    I heard Liz Truss on the radio last week, giggling away in front of a Select Committee. Out of her depth did not come even close to describing it. Just embarrassing.
    She's a lightweight. I was astonished May gave her that job.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,654
    edited September 2016
    I'm levelled up on the main market at the moment, I think the odds are about right.

    My last move was to lay Trump rather than back Clinton though, which I'm happy with this morning.
  • IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    DavidL said:

    Patrick said:

    tlg86 said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
    Indeed. It seems to me that any school which is free of LEA control and wants to enforce some discipline and standards is likely to be a good school. Call them grammars or free schools or academies or charter schools (in the USA) or whatever - the name is immaterial. Morgan seems to have missed this key point. It's also true that having a range of different schools, some catering to the more academic some to the more vocational makes good sense:

    http://www.adamsmith.org/blog/just-what-is-the-problem-with-grammar-schools

    Aren't we trying to emulate German educational outcomes and employment stats? Their school system is highly graded.
    That is probably true but calling schools Grammar Schools is like walking around a petrol depot with lit matches. It would have been so easy to avoid most of the grief by just using a different word. Madness.
    It wouldnt have had half the resonance or "red meat" value with a different name. This has all the hallmarks of picking a popular fight before the BrExit fight starts in earnest. Possibly as a pretext to doing something about the House of Lords without it looking like it is linked to BrExit.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,296

    tlg86 said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
    Greening for first cabinet exit?
    The thought had crossed my mind. Not a market I'm interested in, though - they'll probably be some unexpected resignation.
  • ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    edited September 2016
    Barnesian said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Hopefully it is enough to get Gove back into Mrs. May's good graces and he takes over the Brexit brief. Davis is proving to be the disappointment that many predicted.
    Fox is the disappointment. He has now realised that his trade deals are going to come to nothing, and he has lined up "fat" "lazy" British business to take the blame.
    I'm assuming you haven't read what he actually said.
  • Ishmael_XIshmael_X Posts: 3,664
    edited September 2016
    TOPPING said:

    TGOHF said:

    Scott_P said:

    Mr. P, *sighs*

    Most people said both campaigns were full of rubbish. Does it include Remain propaganda such as global war, and the downfall of Western civilisation?

    This not not about the campaign.

    This is about how BRILLIANT everything is now we have voted.

    How much control we have taken back, and exactly how much Sovereignty per head will be bestowed upon us the the 3 Brexiteers.
    Still feel let down by democracy Scott ? Lolza.

    We love democracy. And when Jezza is democratically elected leader of Labour I presume you will join in the accepted wisdom that it was the best outcome.

    No one disputes such a decision has democratic legitimacy, nor would any sensible person disagree that it would be an idiotic one.
    Nor that it would not have come about but for the utter and absolute incompetent feckwittery of those on the other side of the argument.
  • IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    edited September 2016

    Barnesian said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Hopefully it is enough to get Gove back into Mrs. May's good graces and he takes over the Brexit brief. Davis is proving to be the disappointment that many predicted.
    Fox is the disappointment. He has now realised that his trade deals are going to come to nothing, and he has lined up "fat" "lazy" British business to take the blame.
    I'm assuming you haven't read what he actually said.
    The Guardian didn't read what he actually said, most left-leaning people are regurgitating their synthetic outrage about something he didn't say. Plus ce la change.

    It is objectively the case that only 11 percent of British businesses export anything, and our exports expressed as a percentage of GDP are the lowest in Europe, and half the average.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,239
    PlatoSaid said:

    DavidL said:

    tlg86 said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
    Greening for first cabinet exit?
    I heard Liz Truss on the radio last week, giggling away in front of a Select Committee. Out of her depth did not come even close to describing it. Just embarrassing.
    She's a lightweight. I was astonished May gave her that job.
    Agreed. She couldn't make her mind up whether to proceed with Gove's prison reforms or not. No clear views, no ideas, no principles that she wanted to apply, no obvious concerns, she just didn't know. Having equality of the sexes in the cabinet is just not worth this.
  • PClippPClipp Posts: 2,138
    TGOHF said:

    Where's the £350million/week, the NHS needs it now!

    With that level of debate I can't believe remain lost.
    But that was Leave`s strongest argument, Mr TGOHF.

    The whole Referendum was a nonsense from beginning to end. Nobody ought to take any notice of it, and Mrs May ought to sack her three goons immediately. Save a lot of time and money.
  • Indigo said:

    Barnesian said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Hopefully it is enough to get Gove back into Mrs. May's good graces and he takes over the Brexit brief. Davis is proving to be the disappointment that many predicted.
    Fox is the disappointment. He has now realised that his trade deals are going to come to nothing, and he has lined up "fat" "lazy" British business to take the blame.
    I'm assuming you haven't read what he actually said.
    The Guardian didn't read what he actually said, most left-leaning people are regurgitating their synthetic outrage about something he didn't say. Plus ce la change.

    It is objectively the case that only 11 percent of British businesses export anything, and our exports expressed as a percentage of GDP are the lowest in Europe, and half the average.
    This is what he actually said, verbatim:
    In a recording of the event published in The Times, Dr Fox is heard saying: "This country is not the free-trading nation that it once was. We have become too lazy, and too fat on our successes in previous generations."
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112
    Ishmael_X said:

    TOPPING said:

    TGOHF said:

    Scott_P said:

    Mr. P, *sighs*

    Most people said both campaigns were full of rubbish. Does it include Remain propaganda such as global war, and the downfall of Western civilisation?

    This not not about the campaign.

    This is about how BRILLIANT everything is now we have voted.

    How much control we have taken back, and exactly how much Sovereignty per head will be bestowed upon us the the 3 Brexiteers.
    Still feel let down by democracy Scott ? Lolza.

    We love democracy. And when Jezza is democratically elected leader of Labour I presume you will join in the accepted wisdom that it was the best outcome.

    No one disputes such a decision has democratic legitimacy, nor would any sensible person disagree that it would be an idiotic one.
    Nor that it would not have come about but for the utter and absolute incompetent feckwittery of those on the other side of the argument.
    Yep there was plenty of that also.
  • IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    PClipp said:

    TGOHF said:

    Where's the £350million/week, the NHS needs it now!

    With that level of debate I can't believe remain lost.
    But that was Leave`s strongest argument, Mr TGOHF.

    The whole Referendum was a nonsense from beginning to end. Nobody ought to take any notice of it, and Mrs May ought to sack her three goons immediately. Save a lot of time and money.
    Demonstrating once again that a more accurate name for the LDs would be the Illiberal Statists
  • IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966

    Indigo said:

    Barnesian said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Hopefully it is enough to get Gove back into Mrs. May's good graces and he takes over the Brexit brief. Davis is proving to be the disappointment that many predicted.
    Fox is the disappointment. He has now realised that his trade deals are going to come to nothing, and he has lined up "fat" "lazy" British business to take the blame.
    I'm assuming you haven't read what he actually said.
    The Guardian didn't read what he actually said, most left-leaning people are regurgitating their synthetic outrage about something he didn't say. Plus ce la change.

    It is objectively the case that only 11 percent of British businesses export anything, and our exports expressed as a percentage of GDP are the lowest in Europe, and half the average.
    This is what he actually said, verbatim:
    In a recording of the event published in The Times, Dr Fox is heard saying: "This country is not the free-trading nation that it once was. We have become too lazy, and too fat on our successes in previous generations."
    Indeed. Can you see the words "british business" in that sentence, because I can't.
  • Is it morally correct to take $700,000 a year for running a charity?
    http://www.newstatesman.com/2016/09/what-david-miliband-thinks-jeremy-corbyn

    Should Terry Wogan be paid for Children in Need? Large charities are more like corporations these days, so they need to pay a lot. I suspect in most cases they still offer six-figure salaries for what would normally be seven-figure jobs. I could perhaps be persuaded the whole market is out of control and most organisations are paying Premier League salaries for Championship players.

    Oh, and it's a clickbait title from the New Statesman because all Milband says is they disagree.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Pulpstar said:

    I'm levelled up on the main market at the moment, I think the odds are about right.

    My last move was to lay Trump rather than back Clinton though, which I'm happy with this morning.

    I'm at work who block bookmakers including Betfair so I'm really hoping for no dramatic moves today as my book, while green, is quite skewed at the moment.
  • PClipp said:

    TGOHF said:

    Where's the £350million/week, the NHS needs it now!

    With that level of debate I can't believe remain lost.
    But that was Leave`s strongest argument, Mr TGOHF.

    The whole Referendum was a nonsense from beginning to end. Nobody ought to take any notice of it, and Mrs May ought to sack her three goons immediately. Save a lot of time and money.
    That whole democracy thing is silly, isn't it?
  • Morgan is the female Burnham.
  • TGOHF said:

    TGOHF said:

    Scott_P said:

    Mr. P, *sighs*

    Most people said both campaigns were full of rubbish. Does it include Remain propaganda such as global war, and the downfall of Western civilisation?

    This not not about the campaign.

    This is about how BRILLIANT everything is now we have voted.

    How much control we have taken back, and exactly how much Sovereignty per head will be bestowed upon us the the 3 Brexiteers.
    Still feel let down by democracy Scott ? Lolza.

    Where's the £350million/week, the NHS needs it now!
    With that level of debate I can't believe remain lost.
    It's simple. That's how Leave won, by lying to the electorate on a grand scale. Now they've won, they've dropped the claim that they considered so important that it was in huge letters on their battlebus.
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-vote-leave-wipes-nhs-350m-claim-and-rest-of-its-website-after-eu-referendum-a7105546.html
  • PlatoSaid said:

    DavidL said:

    tlg86 said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Morgan looks utterly stupid this morning.
    Greening for first cabinet exit?
    I heard Liz Truss on the radio last week, giggling away in front of a Select Committee. Out of her depth did not come even close to describing it. Just embarrassing.
    She's a lightweight. I was astonished May gave her that job.
    May has made a few dodgy appointments, Truss clearly one of them. But counting the number of obvious duffers in Cabinet, I reckon she's about on par with Cameron - no obvious deterioration.

  • Indigo said:

    Indigo said:

    Barnesian said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:
    I was waiting for Gove to show his hand, and that's quite significant. Given he might have been the nucleus around which a backbench rebellion (dominated by dillusioned Cameroons) could have formed. It contrasts starkly with Morgan.

    May will be grateful.
    Hopefully it is enough to get Gove back into Mrs. May's good graces and he takes over the Brexit brief. Davis is proving to be the disappointment that many predicted.
    Fox is the disappointment. He has now realised that his trade deals are going to come to nothing, and he has lined up "fat" "lazy" British business to take the blame.
    I'm assuming you haven't read what he actually said.
    The Guardian didn't read what he actually said, most left-leaning people are regurgitating their synthetic outrage about something he didn't say. Plus ce la change.

    It is objectively the case that only 11 percent of British businesses export anything, and our exports expressed as a percentage of GDP are the lowest in Europe, and half the average.
    This is what he actually said, verbatim:
    In a recording of the event published in The Times, Dr Fox is heard saying: "This country is not the free-trading nation that it once was. We have become too lazy, and too fat on our successes in previous generations."
    Indeed. Can you see the words "british business" in that sentence, because I can't.
    What does "we" refer to, in this context? Who does Liam Fox mean when he says "we" have become too lazy?
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Alistair said:

    It is 56 days till the election. In the last month there have been (according to the errant source that is RCP) 26 National polls

    Hilary Leads - 24
    Ties - 1
    Trump Leads - 1

    With 56 days to go in the European Referendum in the previous month there had been 29 polls

    Remain Leads - 16
    Ties - 3
    Leave Leads - 10

    I can see why peopel think these votes are similar.

    The POTUS election is not a single national one.
    I take it you are betting on Trump to win while losing the National Popular Vote then?
This discussion has been closed.