This may put Trump's health back in the spotlight too, notwithstanding his doctor's hyperbolic claim that Trump would be the healthiest president ever.
IUUC he qualified that by saying most of the presidents ever are currently unhealthily dead.
So far the medical background and speculation relating to Hillary's fall/faint has been pretty low key in the major news media. Frankly one is likely to have become far better informed by reading this PB.com thread instead. However, this is likely to change and soon, when the news bosses at last realise what a huge story this is threatening to become. (OK .... it's fess up time .... I suppose I'm talking up my 199/1 bet with Betfair on Tim Kaine becoming the next POTUS, but should this come off, it would rank second only to Morris Dancer's 250/1 F1 triumph on Verstappen).
Check the terms of the bet, and US election law. It might still be Hillary's name on the ticket, and bets will likely be settled on who wins the election in November, not who actually becomes president in January.
Good point and thank you for reminding me ...... best illustrated by the fact that postal votes with Hillary's name on them have, I understand, already been issued. Oh well, that's a few more quid down the proverbial, which with other mugs around like me, I may yet be able to trade out!
From a New York Times article last month, summing it up:
"Voting actually starts in less than six weeks, on Sept. 23 in Minnesota and South Dakota, the first of some 35 states and the District of Columbia that allow people to cast ballots at polling sites or by mail before Nov. 8. Iowa is expected to have ballots ready by the end of September, as are Illinois and two other states.
The electoral battlegrounds of Arizona and Ohio are to begin voting on Oct. 12, nearly four weeks before Election Day. And North Carolina and Florida will be underway before Halloween."
Will Hilary step down within a year of taking her oath?
Plenty of professionals will be trying to work out if the pneumonia explanation matches the footage.
Collapsing is perfectly possible with Pneumonia if you don't rest (at it's worst Pneumonia can be fatal)
I don't doubt she's got Pneumonia but the real issue is whether there's a condition underlying the Pneumonia.
She's known to have had a persistent cough for several weeks (possibly months) so her doctors (if they haven't already) should certainly be doing investigations to see whether there's a respiratory problem underlying this.
It's kind of depressing though: my instinctive reaction is that Clinton's campaign is (at best) only telling us half the truth
Speaking of depressing as regards coughs - does anyone else find it extremely so to be constantly reminded by radio commercials, etc that in the event of a cough persisting for three weeks, we should rush off to have this checked out by one's GP as "it could be cancer" ..... Honestly, enough!
The obvious reason for wanting to understand modafinil would be to self-medicate for narcolepsy. But that would only likely be a side effect given that it has only become apparent at this age (it's more common to diagnose in late teens/early adulthood). They don't know what causes it though.
Oh well, it's back to bed for me for an hour or so, cheerio Rob, everyone.
A quick nap before the new thread? Dangerous!
There is no new thread. This thread is staying up until lunchtime.
Precisely, as I had already concluded ...... why close down a good story, as if the powers that be at PB.com would ever contemplate doing such a thing. Oh wait .....!
The obvious reason for wanting to understand modafinil would be to self-medicate for narcolepsy. But that would only likely be a side effect given that it has only become apparent at this age (it's more common to diagnose in late teens/early adulthood). They don't know what causes it though.
Modafinil is used for other sleep disorders too. In America, it is also used by the armed forces and students (as a misnamed "smart drug") to keep going on long days. My point is that it is more part of the culture over there, so should not be taken to mean Hillary has narcolepsy or even sleep apnea.
Oh well, it's back to bed for me for an hour or so, cheerio Rob, everyone.
A quick nap before the new thread? Dangerous!
There is no new thread. This thread is staying up until lunchtime.
Precisely, as I had already concluded ...... why close down a good story, as if the powers that be at PB.com would ever contemplate doing such a thing. Oh wait .....!
Announcing the result of the referendum prediction competition would be a good story...
The obvious reason for wanting to understand modafinil would be to self-medicate for narcolepsy. But that would only likely be a side effect given that it has only become apparent at this age (it's more common to diagnose in late teens/early adulthood). They don't know what causes it though.
Modafinil is used for other sleep disorders too. In America, it is also used by the armed forces and students (as a misnamed "smart drug") to keep going on long days. My point is that it is more part of the culture over there, so should not be taken to mean Hillary has narcolepsy or even sleep apnea.
Bollocks. Adderall is part of the culture. Modafinil is not. Yes it has been taken by pilots but that pretty controversial
The obvious reason for wanting to understand modafinil would be to self-medicate for narcolepsy. But that would only likely be a side effect given that it has only become apparent at this age (it's more common to diagnose in late teens/early adulthood). They don't know what causes it though.
I have several friends who swear by modafnil for jet lag. Apparently you feel awake and fine for incredibly long periods of time, without all the downsides of amphetamines.
Not taken it myself, mind. (Although as I'm flying to the West Coast today, perhaps that's my mistake.)
The obvious reason for wanting to understand modafinil would be to self-medicate for narcolepsy. But that would only likely be a side effect given that it has only become apparent at this age (it's more common to diagnose in late teens/early adulthood). They don't know what causes it though.
I have several friends who swear by modafnil for jet lag. Apparently you feel awake and fine for incredibly long periods of time, without all the downsides of amphetamines.
Not taken it myself, mind. (Although as I'm flying to the West Coast today, perhaps that's my mistake.)
You've made the right choice.
Modafinil is a serious drug with serious side effects. It has a role in the physician's armatorium but shouldn't be abused. Jet lag. FFS!
The obvious reason for wanting to understand modafinil would be to self-medicate for narcolepsy. But that would only likely be a side effect given that it has only become apparent at this age (it's more common to diagnose in late teens/early adulthood). They don't know what causes it though.
I have several friends who swear by modafnil for jet lag. Apparently you feel awake and fine for incredibly long periods of time, without all the downsides of amphetamines.
Not taken it myself, mind. (Although as I'm flying to the West Coast today, perhaps that's my mistake.)
You've made the right choice.
Modafinil is a serious drug with serious side effects. It has a role in the physician's armatorium but shouldn't be abused. Jet lag. FFS!
Oh come now, Charles. It seems more sensible that SeanT's self administered travel cocktail of a bottle of wine, rohypnol and ambien.
The obvious reason for wanting to understand modafinil would be to self-medicate for narcolepsy. But that would only likely be a side effect given that it has only become apparent at this age (it's more common to diagnose in late teens/early adulthood). They don't know what causes it though.
Modafinil is used for other sleep disorders too. In America, it is also used by the armed forces and students (as a misnamed "smart drug") to keep going on long days. My point is that it is more part of the culture over there, so should not be taken to mean Hillary has narcolepsy or even sleep apnea.
Bollocks. Adderall is part of the culture. Modafinil is not. Yes it has been taken by pilots but that pretty controversial
Hillary Clinton's medic says she was diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday. Did he say which Friday? Today she couldn't stand up without help. A month ago she couldn't either, when she had to be helped up steps.
I shudder to think how the narcissistic billionaire casino-owner will make mincemeat of her on 26 September, if she is still in the race at the time of the first TV debate. Remember Nixon against Kennedy in 1960.
I've said this for ages. Clinton is a poor candidate - narcissistic, arrogant, unable to think on her feet, with tons of her own baggage from her time as Secretary of State plus her husband's baggage. She is genuinely a hate figure for large numbers of Americans, and the risk was always that faced with an opponent who is mentally agile enough to wing it (not always successfully...) that she would be torn apart during the debates.
Add her apparent health problems into it and Mr "I've had no complaints" will have yet more accusations to hurl at her.And never mind the negatives against Clinton remember the positives against Trump. This election is like Brexit. A whole bunch of people insistent that Trump is a lunatic and that people won't vote for him and instead will maintain the status quo.
For tens of millions of Americans - like their British counterparts - the status quo is existing rather than living. They're as mad as hell, and they're not going to take it any more. A change - any change - has to be better than this, and if the change at least sounds like he knows their lives unlike the other politicians then all the better.
The obvious reason for wanting to understand modafinil would be to self-medicate for narcolepsy. But that would only likely be a side effect given that it has only become apparent at this age (it's more common to diagnose in late teens/early adulthood). They don't know what causes it though.
I have several friends who swear by modafnil for jet lag. Apparently you feel awake and fine for incredibly long periods of time, without all the downsides of amphetamines.
Not taken it myself, mind. (Although as I'm flying to the West Coast today, perhaps that's my mistake.)
You've made the right choice.
Modafinil is a serious drug with serious side effects. It has a role in the physician's armatorium but shouldn't be abused. Jet lag. FFS!
Oh come now, Charles. It seems more sensible that SeanT's self administered travel cocktail of a bottle of wine, rohypnol and ambien.
I don't like dizzies either!
I spend my life talking to the people who make this shit
Pharmaceutical executives as a rule try to avoid their products wherever possible!
The obvious reason for wanting to understand modafinil would be to self-medicate for narcolepsy. But that would only likely be a side effect given that it has only become apparent at this age (it's more common to diagnose in late teens/early adulthood). They don't know what causes it though.
Modafinil is used for other sleep disorders too. In America, it is also used by the armed forces and students (as a misnamed "smart drug") to keep going on long days. My point is that it is more part of the culture over there, so should not be taken to mean Hillary has narcolepsy or even sleep apnea.
Bollocks. Adderall is part of the culture. Modafinil is not. Yes it has been taken by pilots but that pretty controversial
1-2 articles from 3 years ago (mainly linking to a voodoo survey in the tab in 2012) are my evidence ofsomething being embedded in a culture. It's evidence that some students are idiots.
Hillary Clinton's medic says she was diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday. Did he say which Friday? Today she couldn't stand up without help. A month ago she couldn't either, when she had to be helped up steps.
I shudder to think how the narcissistic billionaire casino-owner will make mincemeat of her on 26 September, if she is still in the race at the time of the first TV debate. Remember Nixon against Kennedy in 1960.
I've said this for ages. Clinton is a poor candidate - narcissistic, arrogant, unable to think on her feet, with tons of her own baggage from her time as Secretary of State plus her husband's baggage. She is genuinely a hate figure for large numbers of Americans, and the risk was always that faced with an opponent who is mentally agile enough to wing it (not always successfully...) that she would be torn apart during the debates.
Add her apparent health problems into it and Mr "I've had no complaints" will have yet more accusations to hurl at her.And never mind the negatives against Clinton remember the positives against Trump. This election is like Brexit. A whole bunch of people insistent that Trump is a lunatic and that people won't vote for him and instead will maintain the status quo.
For tens of millions of Americans - like their British counterparts - the status quo is existing rather than living. They're as mad as hell, and they're not going to take it any more. A change - any change - has to be better than this, and if the change at least sounds like he knows their lives unlike the other politicians then all the better.
Trump will win.
Trump has a problem with the truth. There was a big fuss over Matt Lauer giving Trump an easy ride. In the next debates, Trump needs to rein it in a bit and not make bizarre claims with figures he's plucked out of thin air, or the moderators and media will be all over him. Trump should play it straight and let Hillary hang herself on her own record.
Hillary Clinton's medic says she was diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday. Did he say which Friday? Today she couldn't stand up without help. A month ago she couldn't either, when she had to be helped up steps.
I shudder to think how the narcissistic billionaire casino-owner will make mincemeat of her on 26 September, if she is still in the race at the time of the first TV debate. Remember Nixon against Kennedy in 1960.
I've said this for ages. Clinton is a poor candidate - narcissistic, arrogant, unable to think on her feet, with tons of her own baggage from her time as Secretary of State plus her husband's baggage. She is genuinely a hate figure for large numbers of Americans, and the risk was always that faced with an opponent who is mentally agile enough to wing it (not always successfully...) that she would be torn apart during the debates.
Add her apparent health problems into it and Mr "I've had no complaints" will have yet more accusations to hurl at her.And never mind the negatives against Clinton remember the positives against Trump. This election is like Brexit. A whole bunch of people insistent that Trump is a lunatic and that people won't vote for him and instead will maintain the status quo.
For tens of millions of Americans - like their British counterparts - the status quo is existing rather than living. They're as mad as hell, and they're not going to take it any more. A change - any change - has to be better than this, and if the change at least sounds like he knows their lives unlike the other politicians then all the better.
Maybe I'm ignorant of medical matters but AIUI pneumonia is the vulture of the bacteria world.
Unless someone healthy does something incredibly stupid like having a cold bath then going for a long walk in wet clothes on a cold day while suffering from a heavy cold, my understanding is that the immune system fight it off no prob.
Only if the body is compromised by a serious underlying illness does pneumonia get its claws in, hence it often carries away people wjth advanced parkinsons, cancer and the like (and is a blessed relief).
Seems to me that there is something seriously wrong with Mrs Clinton.
Farage will be smiling come November - and it will be the EU, not us, at the back of the queue.
Whatever the ultimate cause of Clinton’s ‘medical episode’ turns out to be, it is quite clear that Team Hilary are prepared obfuscate and lie about the true status of her health.
Hillary is doing her fund raising by Skype instead.
Wonder what he'll do next? Something very bouncy I presume - she ate the whole news cycle yesterday for all the worst reasons, no surprise he didn't interrupt it.
Maybe I'm ignorant of medical matters but AIUI pneumonia is the vulture of the bacteria world.
Unless someone healthy does something incredibly stupid like having a cold bath then going for a long walk in wet clothes on a cold day while suffering from a heavy cold, my understanding is that the immune system fight it off no prob.
Only if the body is compromised by a serious underlying illness does pneumonia get its claws in, hence it often carries away people wjth advanced parkinsons, cancer and the like (and is a blessed relief).
Seems to me that there is something seriously wrong with Mrs Clinton.
Farage will be smiling come November - and it will be the EU, not us, at the back of the queue.
It's something people living incredibly stressful lives get. When I was at Goldman, several of my peers got it, while I managed to contact glandular fever.
But there's something weird about her movements. As if she's conscious but has lost control of motor function. It doesn't look like any faint I've seen.
If you faint standing up, motor function goes. Lie the patient flat and elevate the legs, and they are back to normal within minutes.
Post ictal states usually last for hours so not the quick recovery seen.
Parkinsons is not episodic, it is always present.
Anti-parkinsons sunglasses? Not credible. What is the mechanism of action of light on the basal ganglia?
As someone who has fainted standing up, there is no way that female member of the entourage would have been able to keep her propped-up, head-up, like that.
Also note that the only people startled by the behavour are the cops.
Having watched the video clip a few times there's something not quite right, but I can't work out what it is. As the car arrives, she's conscious but weak, being supported by an aide (doctor?) and a post, but as people try and move her towards the car she has some sort of a spasm then passes out. She's bundled into the car which leaves quickly, yet doesn't go to the hospital, rather to a private residence. This suggests that those with her knew what was wrong and how to deal with it.
The thing is if this was a one off after a month of day in day out rallies I could buy it. You get sick, you keep going at it, flying day in day out, and eventually you go pop.
But it is just the latest in a long line of odd things, 2-3 weird seizure type things caught on camera, the constant coughing, now this odd incident...and always covered up with lies that fall apart.
Quite. The press corps have kept quiet so far, but she's not held a proper press conference since her nomination, .
Yes she has, the press even ran a story about how she had finally had a press conference.
She travels with the press on her plane, Trump doesn't.
Trump was sitting down during the commander in chief forum, Trump recently cancelled a series of events without explanation. What is Trump hiding!!!
But there's something weird about her movements. As if she's conscious but has lost control of motor function. It doesn't look like any faint I've seen.
If you faint standing up, motor function goes. Lie the patient flat and elevate the legs, and they are back to normal within minutes.
Post ictal states usually last for hours so not the quick recovery seen.
Parkinsons is not episodic, it is always present.
Anti-parkinsons sunglasses? Not credible. What is the mechanism of action of light on the basal ganglia?
As someone who has fainted standing up, there is no way that female member of the entourage would have been able to keep her propped-up, head-up, like that.
Also note that the only people startled by the behavour are the cops.
Having watched the video clip a few times there's something not quite right, but I can't work out what it is. As the car arrives, she's conscious but weak, being supported by an aide (doctor?) and a post, but as people try and move her towards the car she has some sort of a spasm then passes out. She's bundled into the car which leaves quickly, yet doesn't go to the hospital, rather to a private residence. This suggests that those with her knew what was wrong and how to deal with it.
The thing is if this was a one off after a month of day in day out rallies I could buy it. You get sick, you keep going at it, flying day in day out, and eventually you go pop.
But it is just the latest in a long line of odd things, 2-3 weird seizure type things caught on camera, the constant coughing, now this odd incident...and always covered up with lies that fall apart.
Quite. The press corps have kept quiet so far, but she's not held a proper press conference since her nomination, .
Yes she has, the press even ran a story about how she had finally had a press conference.
She travels with the press on her plane, Trump doesn't.
Trump was sitting down during the commander in chief forum, Trump recently cancelled a series of events without explanation. What is Trump hiding!!!
The obvious reason for wanting to understand modafinil would be to self-medicate for narcolepsy. But that would only likely be a side effect given that it has only become apparent at this age (it's more common to diagnose in late teens/early adulthood). They don't know what causes it though.
I have several friends who swear by modafnil for jet lag. Apparently you feel awake and fine for incredibly long periods of time, without all the downsides of amphetamines.
Not taken it myself, mind. (Although as I'm flying to the West Coast today, perhaps that's my mistake.)
You've made the right choice.
Modafinil is a serious drug with serious side effects. It has a role in the physician's armatorium but shouldn't be abused. Jet lag. FFS!
Keep yourself going until 10 pm, take a couple of Nytol, tough out the next day, two more Nytol, then let nature take its course. That's my West Coast/China/Japan formula.
After being diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday, Hillary Clinton ran a two-hour national security meeting, gave a press conference, and spent an hour and a half in the heat at a September 11 commemoration ceremony. It was an impressive feat of physical strength that obliterated months of health conspiracies.
After being diagnosed with pneumonia -- after -- Hillary went to the 9/11 event in the stifling heat. Damned if she did, and damned if she didn't, perhaps, but it still seems a bizarre judgement.
If she hadn't have collapsed she would have got away with it. Presumably, there was some medical advice involved.
Serious question. Are the Republic of Ireland also going to be subject to this EU visa waiver regime, as they are outside Schenegan too?
No-one knows yet. If we want to restrict movement from the EU it's difficult to see how the CTA can survive.
?
The CTA long predates the EU.
And both members of it joined the EU at the same time. Now one wants to leave.
Even Bertie Ahern foresees this leading to border controls being introduced.
Don't be silly, they will leave the EU as well if push comes to shove. They only joined it in the first place because we were going to and they didnt want things like the CTA and effective domestic trade arrangements to go.
Serious question. Are the Republic of Ireland also going to be subject to this EU visa waiver regime, as they are outside Schenegan too?
No-one knows yet. If we want to restrict movement from the EU it's difficult to see how the CTA can survive.
?
The CTA long predates the EU.
And both members of it joined the EU at the same time. Now one wants to leave.
Even Bertie Ahern foresees this leading to border controls being introduced.
Don't be silly, they will leave the EU as well if push comes to shove. They only joined it in the first place because we were going to and they didnt want things like the CTA and effective domestic trade arrangements to go.
The Irish will not leave the EU. To do so would be to put all their eggs in the British basket. For any number of cultural, social, historical and political reasons that would never happen. Being the only common law, English-speaking country in the EU could well bring the Irish a fair number of long-term advantages.
After being diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday, Hillary Clinton ran a two-hour national security meeting, gave a press conference, and spent an hour and a half in the heat at a September 11 commemoration ceremony. It was an impressive feat of physical strength that obliterated months of health conspiracies.
After being diagnosed with pneumonia -- after -- Hillary went to the 9/11 event in the stifling heat. Damned if she did, and damned if she didn't, perhaps, but it still seems a bizarre judgement.
If she hadn't have collapsed she would have got away with it. Presumably, there was some medical advice involved.
Presumably given, but maybe not taken.
I expect the election to go to whichever of the candidates rules out a second term first. I hope that makes some kind of sense.
Trump can do it, but he will need to step-up a gear and act wholly Presidential over the next 8-9 weeks to contrast himself with Clinton.
Think basically staying upright and lucid will be enough now.
Clinton just doesn't get it. She's making all the sneering mistakes of the Remain campaign, and worse.
She still might just win, given that Trump is a US Farage (without the glamour and appeal of a Boris on his side too, as Leave did), but it could well be a very damn close run thing.
And she is basically relying on hatred for Trump, and that alone, to carry the day for her.
Maybe I'm ignorant of medical matters but AIUI pneumonia is the vulture of the bacteria world.
Unless someone healthy does something incredibly stupid like having a cold bath then going for a long walk in wet clothes on a cold day while suffering from a heavy cold, my understanding is that the immune system fight it off no prob.
Only if the body is compromised by a serious underlying illness does pneumonia get its claws in, hence it often carries away people wjth advanced parkinsons, cancer and the like (and is a blessed relief).
Seems to me that there is something seriously wrong with Mrs Clinton.
Farage will be smiling come November - and it will be the EU, not us, at the back of the queue.
It's something people living incredibly stressful lives get. When I was at Goldman, several of my peers got it, while I managed to contact glandular fever.
Pneumonia is known as "the old man's friend" with good reason.
After being diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday, Hillary Clinton ran a two-hour national security meeting, gave a press conference, and spent an hour and a half in the heat at a September 11 commemoration ceremony. It was an impressive feat of physical strength that obliterated months of health conspiracies.
After being diagnosed with pneumonia -- after -- Hillary went to the 9/11 event in the stifling heat. Damned if she did, and damned if she didn't, perhaps, but it still seems a bizarre judgement.
If she hadn't have collapsed she would have got away with it. Presumably, there was some medical advice involved.
After being diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday, Hillary Clinton ran a two-hour national security meeting, gave a press conference, and spent an hour and a half in the heat at a September 11 commemoration ceremony. It was an impressive feat of physical strength that obliterated months of health conspiracies.
After being diagnosed with pneumonia -- after -- Hillary went to the 9/11 event in the stifling heat. Damned if she did, and damned if she didn't, perhaps, but it still seems a bizarre judgement.
If she hadn't have collapsed she would have got away with it. Presumably, there was some medical advice involved.
After being diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday, Hillary Clinton ran a two-hour national security meeting, gave a press conference, and spent an hour and a half in the heat at a September 11 commemoration ceremony. It was an impressive feat of physical strength that obliterated months of health conspiracies.
After being diagnosed with pneumonia -- after -- Hillary went to the 9/11 event in the stifling heat. Damned if she did, and damned if she didn't, perhaps, but it still seems a bizarre judgement.
If she hadn't have collapsed she would have got away with it. Presumably, there was some medical advice involved.
After being diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday, Hillary Clinton ran a two-hour national security meeting, gave a press conference, and spent an hour and a half in the heat at a September 11 commemoration ceremony. It was an impressive feat of physical strength that obliterated months of health conspiracies.
After being diagnosed with pneumonia -- after -- Hillary went to the 9/11 event in the stifling heat. Damned if she did, and damned if she didn't, perhaps, but it still seems a bizarre judgement.
If she hadn't have collapsed she would have got away with it. Presumably, there was some medical advice involved.
Serious question. Are the Republic of Ireland also going to be subject to this EU visa waiver regime, as they are outside Schenegan too?
No-one knows yet. If we want to restrict movement from the EU it's difficult to see how the CTA can survive.
?
The CTA long predates the EU.
And both members of it joined the EU at the same time. Now one wants to leave.
Even Bertie Ahern foresees this leading to border controls being introduced.
Don't be silly, they will leave the EU as well if push comes to shove. They only joined it in the first place because we were going to and they didnt want things like the CTA and effective domestic trade arrangements to go.
It is worth remembering that the Irish are very fond of the Euro, something like 85:15 agree with "the Euro has been good for Ireland". I think only the Dutch are as enthusiastic.
It seems all too likely that Hillary was told to rest up but just felt she could not miss the 9/11 remembrance ceremony in New York. Standing for 1.5 hours when you are exhausted and on medication may well result in a collapse without any underlying cause.
Being a candidate for POTUS is incredibly exhausting and neither of these candidates are young. It is possible that there is not much more to this than that reality but the problem Hillary has is that too many people do not believe a word she says. Cancelling her trip to California is sensible but is unlikely to stop the rumour mill.
Serious question. Are the Republic of Ireland also going to be subject to this EU visa waiver regime, as they are outside Schenegan too?
No-one knows yet. If we want to restrict movement from the EU it's difficult to see how the CTA can survive.
You seriously think RoI would ruin their economy and partion the country de facto not just de jure by leaving the CTA and joining Schenegen?
It would be us leaving the CTA, not vice versa.
Lol
You've never been to Ireland have you. EU membership has been the making to modern Ireland. There's a fine appreciation of its flaws but equally there's a real understanding of its benefits.
The immigration debate in the US is a lot more nuanced than it is here, even with regard to illegal immigration. I would not see too many parallels between what Trump says about it and what the Leave campaign were saying during the referendum. And while Farage may have got close to the racist line once or twice during the campaign he just about managed to stay on the right side of it. Trump has crossed it several times. If he is going to win, I am not sure that a relentless focus on immigration is the way to do it.
So far the medical background and speculation relating to Hillary's fall/faint has been pretty low key in the major news media. Frankly one is likely to have become far better informed by reading this PB.com thread instead. However, this is likely to change and soon, when the news bosses at last realise what a huge story this is threatening to become. (OK .... it's fess up time .... I suppose I'm talking up my 199/1 bet with Betfair on Tim Kaine becoming the next POTUS, but should this come off, it would rank second only to Morris Dancer's 250/1 F1 triumph on Verstappen).
Traditional media follow where PB leads! (especially in AV-related discussions!)
It seems all too likely that Hillary was told to rest up but just felt she could not miss the 9/11 remembrance ceremony in New York. Standing for 1.5 hours when you are exhausted and on medication may well result in a collapse without any underlying cause.
Being a candidate for POTUS is incredibly exhausting and neither of these candidates are young. It is possible that there is not much more to this than that reality but the problem Hillary has is that too many people do not believe a word she says. Cancelling her trip to California is sensible but is unlikely to stop the rumour mill.
She may also have had a touch of Ptsd at the ceremony. I expected she saw horrific things 15 years ago, the memory of which could have tipped her over the edge.
Serious question. Are the Republic of Ireland also going to be subject to this EU visa waiver regime, as they are outside Schenegan too?
No-one knows yet. If we want to restrict movement from the EU it's difficult to see how the CTA can survive.
You seriously think RoI would ruin their economy and partion the country de facto not just de jure by leaving the CTA and joining Schenegen?
I would expect the Common Travel Area to go by default. If you are Northern Irish you get your freedom of movement by becoming an Irish and therefore EU citizen. The bigger issue is goods, which the CTA doesn't deal with. I would expect an EU border arrangement covering the whole of northern Ireland to partially address that.
As an aside, the UK came close to voiding the CTA on a couple of occasions.
Serious question. Are the Republic of Ireland also going to be subject to this EU visa waiver regime, as they are outside Schenegan too?
No-one knows yet. If we want to restrict movement from the EU it's difficult to see how the CTA can survive.
You seriously think RoI would ruin their economy and partion the country de facto not just de jure by leaving the CTA and joining Schenegen?
It would be us leaving the CTA, not vice versa.
Lol
You've never been to Ireland have you. EU membership has been the making to modern Ireland. There's a fine appreciation of its flaws but equally there's a real understanding of its benefits.
The EU is, of course, currently trying to take one of those benefits away.
Serious question. Are the Republic of Ireland also going to be subject to this EU visa waiver regime, as they are outside Schenegan too?
No-one knows yet. If we want to restrict movement from the EU it's difficult to see how the CTA can survive.
?
The CTA long predates the EU.
And both members of it joined the EU at the same time. Now one wants to leave.
Even Bertie Ahern foresees this leading to border controls being introduced.
Don't be silly, they will leave the EU as well if push comes to shove. They only joined it in the first place because we were going to and they didnt want things like the CTA and effective domestic trade arrangements to go.
It is worth remembering that the Irish are very fond of the Euro, something like 85:15 agree with "the Euro has been good for Ireland". I think only the Dutch are as enthusiastic.
It's also worth remembering that Catholic Ireland has very strong ties with Catholic Southern Europe. Anyone who thinks that Ireland may leave the EU in favour of a trading bloc of the isles knows absolutely nothing about Irish history.
The problem for Clinton is that we expect the President's or candidate's physicians to be economical with the truth.
A persistent cough, a sudden bout of pneumonia, and aged 68. Is she a smoker?
It could all be harmless, or due to the stress of the campaign, but we expect to be lied to and that's what will feed the conspiracy theories.
I tend to go for the stress rather than anything more serious, but only because I can't see the point of the Democrats continuing with a genuinely sick woman.
Maybe I'm ignorant of medical matters but AIUI pneumonia is the vulture of the bacteria world.
Unless someone healthy does something incredibly stupid like having a cold bath then going for a long walk in wet clothes on a cold day while suffering from a heavy cold, my understanding is that the immune system fight it off no prob.
Only if the body is compromised by a serious underlying illness does pneumonia get its claws in, hence it often carries away people wjth advanced parkinsons, cancer and the like (and is a blessed relief).
Seems to me that there is something seriously wrong with Mrs Clinton.
Farage will be smiling come November - and it will be the EU, not us, at the back of the queue.
It's something people living incredibly stressful lives get. When I was at Goldman, several of my peers got it, while I managed to contact glandular fever.
Pneumonia is known as "the old man's friend" with good reason.
Pneumonia is absolutely bloody awful. I had it at university when I was revising for exams and it laid me out for a week.
You feel utterly awful: pale white, drained, cold, hot, sweaty and weak - all at the same time. In fact, at times it felt like the cold finger of death was lingering over me (obviously it wasn't, and I was only 21, but you get the point)
If you're elderly I'd be surprised if it didn't carry you off in hours.
It seems all too likely that Hillary was told to rest up but just felt she could not miss the 9/11 remembrance ceremony in New York. Standing for 1.5 hours when you are exhausted and on medication may well result in a collapse without any underlying cause.
Being a candidate for POTUS is incredibly exhausting and neither of these candidates are young. It is possible that there is not much more to this than that reality but the problem Hillary has is that too many people do not believe a word she says. Cancelling her trip to California is sensible but is unlikely to stop the rumour mill.
It's a whole pattern of things that looks odd.
She's hardly on the campaign trail, the coughing, collapsing, changing explanations of what's wrong, AWOL for 90mins.
With her truth ratings in the toilet, who's going to believe this is just a health blip?
Hillary is doing her fund raising by Skype instead.
Wonder what he'll do next? Something very bouncy I presume - she ate the whole news cycle yesterday for all the worst reasons, no surprise he didn't interrupt it.
Morning all,
Actually it is a surprise he didn't interrupt it. His normally methods would have involved a snarky 'I told you all she was ill' tweet etc. Trump is clearly now listening to sensible campaign advice imho.
Hilliary may have a health issue to deal with for the rest of campaign, but Trump still has a massive demographic issue to deal with.
Maybe I'm ignorant of medical matters but AIUI pneumonia is the vulture of the bacteria world.
Unless someone healthy does something incredibly stupid like having a cold bath then going for a long walk in wet clothes on a cold day while suffering from a heavy cold, my understanding is that the immune system fight it off no prob.
Only if the body is compromised by a serious underlying illness does pneumonia get its claws in, hence it often carries away people wjth advanced parkinsons, cancer and the like (and is a blessed relief).
Seems to me that there is something seriously wrong with Mrs Clinton.
Farage will be smiling come November - and it will be the EU, not us, at the back of the queue.
It's something people living incredibly stressful lives get. When I was at Goldman, several of my peers got it, while I managed to contact glandular fever.
Pneumonia is known as "the old man's friend" with good reason.
Pneumonia is absolutely bloody awful. I had it at university when I was revising for exams and it laid me out for a week.
You feel utterly awful: pale white, drained, cold, hot, sweaty and weak - all at the same time. In fact, at times it felt like the cold finger of death was lingering over me (obviously it wasn't, and I was only 21, but you get the point)
If you're elderly I'd be surprised if it didn't carry you off in hours.
Well Pneumonia you should recover from. So Clinton should recover if they have told the truth. If she falls again, she is toast.
Hillary Clinton's medic says she was diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday. Did he say which Friday? Today she couldn't stand up without help. A month ago she couldn't either, when she had to be helped up steps.
I shudder to think how the narcissistic billionaire casino-owner will make mincemeat of her on 26 September, if she is still in the race at the time of the first TV debate. Remember Nixon against Kennedy in 1960.
I've said this for ages. Clinton is a poor candidate - narcissistic, arrogant, unable to think on her feet, with tons of her own baggage from her time as Secretary of State plus her husband's baggage. She is genuinely a hate figure for large numbers of Americans, and the risk was always that faced with an opponent who is mentally agile enough to wing it (not always successfully...) that she would be torn apart during the debates.
Add her apparent health problems into it and Mr "I've had no complaints" will have yet more accusations to hurl at her.And never mind the negatives against Clinton remember the positives against Trump. This election is like Brexit. A whole bunch of people insistent that Trump is a lunatic and that people won't vote for him and instead will maintain the status quo.
For tens of millions of Americans - like their British counterparts - the status quo is existing rather than living. They're as mad as hell, and they're not going to take it any more. A change - any change - has to be better than this, and if the change at least sounds like he knows their lives unlike the other politicians then all the better.
Trump will win.
Frying Pan / Fire.
Given all previous options have been Frying Pan / Frying Pan any other choice may be preferable for a large percentage of voters.
Serious question. Are the Republic of Ireland also going to be subject to this EU visa waiver regime, as they are outside Schenegan too?
No-one knows yet. If we want to restrict movement from the EU it's difficult to see how the CTA can survive.
?
The CTA long predates the EU.
And both members of it joined the EU at the same time. Now one wants to leave.
Even Bertie Ahern foresees this leading to border controls being introduced.
Don't be silly, they will leave the EU as well if push comes to shove. They only joined it in the first place because we were going to and they didnt want things like the CTA and effective domestic trade arrangements to go.
It is worth remembering that the Irish are very fond of the Euro, something like 85:15 agree with "the Euro has been good for Ireland". I think only the Dutch are as enthusiastic.
It's also worth remembering that Catholic Ireland has very strong ties with Catholic Southern Europe. Anyone who thinks that Ireland may leave the EU in favour of a trading bloc of the isles knows absolutely nothing about Irish history.
I don't think that's really correct (north/south ties that is) except in a legacy emotional way but that's changing with changing demographics and the relative strength of Dublin to the rest of the country. But, the legacy of British Imperialism is still there - 100 years since 1916 is not helpful timing in that regard.
Trump can do it, but he will need to step-up a gear and act wholly Presidential over the next 8-9 weeks to contrast himself with Clinton.
Think basically staying upright and lucid will be enough now.
Clinton just doesn't get it. She's making all the sneering mistakes of the Remain campaign, and worse.
She still might just win, given that Trump is a US Farage (without the glamour and appeal of a Boris on his side too, as Leave did), but it could well be a very damn close run thing.
And she is basically relying on hatred for Trump, and that alone, to carry the day for her.
Its a lack of comprehension that the status quo so beloved of the political establishment is a disaster for tens of millions. When you have nothing to lose - no job, no prospects - then the risk is voting for the status quo.
It doesn't matter if Trump says things that sound off the wall to the establishment, everything they say and do is destructive to the people who have nothing.
Grasping that unfettered free-market economics have destroyed the life chances of so many and offering an explanation and a solution (however far fetched we may see it) is how we've had the rise in non-establishment politics. Trump. Farage. Front Nationale, Podemos etc
Maybe I'm ignorant of medical matters but AIUI pneumonia is the vulture of the bacteria world.
Unless someone healthy does something incredibly stupid like having a cold bath then going for a long walk in wet clothes on a cold day while suffering from a heavy cold, my understanding is that the immune system fight it off no prob.
Only if the body is compromised by a serious underlying illness does pneumonia get its claws in, hence it often carries away people wjth advanced parkinsons, cancer and the like (and is a blessed relief).
Seems to me that there is something seriously wrong with Mrs Clinton.
Farage will be smiling come November - and it will be the EU, not us, at the back of the queue.
It's something people living incredibly stressful lives get. When I was at Goldman, several of my peers got it, while I managed to contact glandular fever.
Pneumonia is known as "the old man's friend" with good reason.
Pneumonia is absolutely bloody awful. I had it at university when I was revising for exams and it laid me out for a week.
You feel utterly awful: pale white, drained, cold, hot, sweaty and weak - all at the same time. In fact, at times it felt like the cold finger of death was lingering over me (obviously it wasn't, and I was only 21, but you get the point)
If you're elderly I'd be surprised if it didn't carry you off in hours.
Well Pneumonia you should recover from. So Clinton should recover if they have told the truth. If she falls again, she is toast.
Nothing like a good dose of hyperbole to start the morning off.
Hillary Clinton's medic says she was diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday. Did he say which Friday? Today she couldn't stand up without help. A month ago she couldn't either, when she had to be helped up steps.
I shudder to think how the narcissistic billionaire casino-owner will make mincemeat of her on 26 September, if she is still in the race at the time of the first TV debate. Remember Nixon against Kennedy in 1960.
I've said this for ages. Clinton is a poor candidate - narcissistic, arrogant, unable to think on her feet, with tons of her own baggage from her time as Secretary of State plus her husband's baggage. She is genuinely a hate figure for large numbers of Americans, and the risk was always that faced with an opponent who is mentally agile enough to wing it (not always successfully...) that she would be torn apart during the debates.
Add her apparent health problems into it and Mr "I've had no complaints" will have yet more accusations to hurl at her.And never mind the negatives against Clinton remember the positives against Trump. This election is like Brexit. A whole bunch of people insistent that Trump is a lunatic and that people won't vote for him and instead will maintain the status quo.
For tens of millions of Americans - like their British counterparts - the status quo is existing rather than living. They're as mad as hell, and they're not going to take it any more. A change - any change - has to be better than this, and if the change at least sounds like he knows their lives unlike the other politicians then all the better.
Trump will win.
Frying Pan / Fire.
Given all previous options have been Frying Pan / Frying Pan any other choice may be preferable for a large percentage of voters.
Nope the fire is always worse than the frying pan.
It seems all too likely that Hillary was told to rest up but just felt she could not miss the 9/11 remembrance ceremony in New York. Standing for 1.5 hours when you are exhausted and on medication may well result in a collapse without any underlying cause.
Being a candidate for POTUS is incredibly exhausting and neither of these candidates are young. It is possible that there is not much more to this than that reality but the problem Hillary has is that too many people do not believe a word she says. Cancelling her trip to California is sensible but is unlikely to stop the rumour mill.
She may also have had a touch of Ptsd at the ceremony. I expected she saw horrific things 15 years ago, the memory of which could have tipped her over the edge.
One day, if you ever meet someone with genuine PTSD you'll realise how embarrassing your comment is.
I really enjoy how it seems whenever the media wants a non terrifying, light story on North Korea, my hometown usually pops up during discussion of North Korean beer. I think it's the second time this year already.
Hillary Clinton's medic says she was diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday. Did he say which Friday? Today she couldn't stand up without help. A month ago she couldn't either, when she had to be helped up steps.
I shudder to think how the narcissistic billionaire casino-owner will make mincemeat of her on 26 September, if she is still in the race at the time of the first TV debate. Remember Nixon against Kennedy in 1960.
I've said this for ages. Clinton is a poor candidate - narcissistic, arrogant, unable to think on her feet, with tons of her own baggage from her time as Secretary of State plus her husband's baggage. She is genuinely a hate figure for large numbers of Americans, and the risk was always that faced with an opponent who is mentally agile enough to wing it (not always successfully...) that she would be torn apart during the debates.
Add her apparent health problems into it and Mr "I've had no complaints" will have yet more accusations to hurl at her.And never mind the negatives against Clinton remember the positives against Trump. This election is like Brexit. A whole bunch of people insistent that Trump is a lunatic and that people won't vote for him and instead will maintain the status quo.
For tens of millions of Americans - like their British counterparts - the status quo is existing rather than living. They're as mad as hell, and they're not going to take it any more. A change - any change - has to be better than this, and if the change at least sounds like he knows their lives unlike the other politicians then all the better.
Trump will win.
Frying Pan / Fire.
Given all previous options have been Frying Pan / Frying Pan any other choice may be preferable for a large percentage of voters.
Nope the fire is always worse than the frying pan.
You would be surprised how many people won't see things that way until its too late....
People keep talking like Trump is posting consistent poll leads. People disapprove of Trump's immigration policy more than they disapprove of Hilary's email handling.
If Hilary's e-mail is inexcusable then what does that make Trump's immigration policy?
The Clinton collapse video should be a slam dunk for the Trump campaign but I'm reasonably confident they will find some way to fuck it up.
Hillary Clinton's medic says she was diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday. Did he say which Friday? Today she couldn't stand up without help. A month ago she couldn't either, when she had to be helped up steps.
I shudder to think how the narcissistic billionaire casino-owner will make mincemeat of her on 26 September, if she is still in the race at the time of the first TV debate. Remember Nixon against Kennedy in 1960.
I've said this for ages. Clinton is a poor candidate - narcissistic, arrogant, unable to think on her feet, with tons of her own baggage from her time as Secretary of State plus her husband's baggage. She is genuinely a hate figure for large numbers of Americans, and the risk was always that faced with an opponent who is mentally agile enough to wing it (not always successfully...) that she would be torn apart during the debates.
Add her apparent health problems into it and Mr "I've had no complaints" will have yet more accusations to hurl at her.And never mind the negatives against Clinton remember the positives against Trump. This election is like Brexit. A whole bunch of people insistent that Trump is a lunatic and that people won't vote for him and instead will maintain the status quo.
For tens of millions of Americans - like their British counterparts - the status quo is existing rather than living. They're as mad as hell, and they're not going to take it any more. A change - any change - has to be better than this, and if the change at least sounds like he knows their lives unlike the other politicians then all the better.
Trump will win.
Frying Pan / Fire.
Given all previous options have been Frying Pan / Frying Pan any other choice may be preferable for a large percentage of voters.
Nope the fire is always worse than the frying pan.
People keep talking like Trump is posting consistent poll leads. People disapprove of Trump's immigration policy more than they disapprove of Hilary's email handling.
If Hilary's e-mail is inexcusable then what does that make Trump's immigration policy?
The Clinton collapse video should be a slam dunk for the Trump campaign but I'm reasonably confident they will find some way to fuck it up.
As the header says his chances of not messing up are slim. The last day had been bad for Clinton, but he's so bad he needs a bit more still.
The woman who played a starring role in one of the most famous photos of the 20th century has died. Greta Friedman passed away in an assisted living facility in Virginia at the age of 92, her family confirmed to the New York Daily News.
And while her name may not ring any bells, the famous photograph of the woman being kissed by a sailor in the middle of Times Square celebrating the Japanese surrender in WWII is seen and known by millions
I would have thought given the extra polarised nature of this campaign it's unlikely that traditional "undecided" voters are as prior elections (the ones who swing regularly between dem and gop). The changes this time are AB republicans going for Hillary, and DE democrats going Trump. These people are changing votes for more fundamental reasons than Hillarys health. I don't think her health will actually affect many votes - if you vote for her and she dies early into the presidency you get Tim Kaine - surely better taking a punt on Hillary than voting for Trump (assuming you don't like Trump)
Also, why did the BBC News at Ten advertise the Archers for the last few minutes last night? Bloody weird.
It was at least a very rare chance to hear the theme tune in full. I didn't think that the rest of it bore much musical relation to the familiar main theme.
Serious question. Are the Republic of Ireland also going to be subject to this EU visa waiver regime, as they are outside Schenegan too?
No-one knows yet. If we want to restrict movement from the EU it's difficult to see how the CTA can survive.
?
The CTA long predates the EU.
And both members of it joined the EU at the same time. Now one wants to leave.
Even Bertie Ahern foresees this leading to border controls being introduced.
Don't be silly, they will leave the EU as well if push comes to shove. They only joined it in the first place because we were going to and they didnt want things like the CTA and effective domestic trade arrangements to go.
It is worth remembering that the Irish are very fond of the Euro, something like 85:15 agree with "the Euro has been good for Ireland". I think only the Dutch are as enthusiastic.
It's also worth remembering that Catholic Ireland has very strong ties with Catholic Southern Europe. Anyone who thinks that Ireland may leave the EU in favour of a trading bloc of the isles knows absolutely nothing about Irish history.
Catholic Ireland is alas now Northern Ireland, the Church remains strong and well attended
Southern Ireland is now anti catholic Ireland with empty churches and hostility to the Church from state and people alike.
The EU would do well to remember that the southern Irish in particular can be very fickle with their loyalites and more than happy to cut their hand off to spite their opponents face if slighted, continue a feud for months, years or even decades and then suddenly end it and carry on as if nothing happened.
The EU have pushed their luck with the RoI for years and it would not take much for them to be hated like the Catholic Church are now and the British were before them.
I may not have been born there but genetically I am 75% Irish and so are my kids. All of us could get an RoI passport if we wanted.
It seems all too likely that Hillary was told to rest up but just felt she could not miss the 9/11 remembrance ceremony in New York. Standing for 1.5 hours when you are exhausted and on medication may well result in a collapse without any underlying cause.
Being a candidate for POTUS is incredibly exhausting and neither of these candidates are young. It is possible that there is not much more to this than that reality but the problem Hillary has is that too many people do not believe a word she says. Cancelling her trip to California is sensible but is unlikely to stop the rumour mill.
It's a whole pattern of things that looks odd.
She's hardly on the campaign trail, the coughing, collapsing, changing explanations of what's wrong, AWOL for 90mins.
With her truth ratings in the toilet, who's going to believe this is just a health blip?
The basic problem is no one believes a word she says.
Also, why did the BBC News at Ten advertise the Archers for the last few minutes last night? Bloody weird.
It was at least a very rare chance to hear the theme tune in full. I didn't think that the rest of it bore much musical relation to the familiar main theme.
Shame they messed up the actual episode. Needless 'celebrity' appearances and a rather unsubtle pro-Remain agenda (yes, really).
Also, why did the BBC News at Ten advertise the Archers for the last few minutes last night? Bloody weird.
Not much news about? Yesterday was a slow news day, at least domestically. Clinton is foreign news, gold medals are sport. The front pages are all over the place.
Also, why did the BBC News at Ten advertise the Archers for the last few minutes last night? Bloody weird.
It was at least a very rare chance to hear the theme tune in full. I didn't think that the rest of it bore much musical relation to the familiar main theme.
Shame they messed up the actual episode. Needless 'celebrity' appearances and a rather unsubtle pro-Remain agenda (yes, really).
I agree about the celebrity jurists.. Nigel Havers played a particularly nasty character.. The jury seemed to me to about "Twelve Angry Men" revisited with Dame Eileen Atkins playing the equvalent to Henry Fonda if less dramatically.
It seems all too likely that Hillary was told to rest up but just felt she could not miss the 9/11 remembrance ceremony in New York. Standing for 1.5 hours when you are exhausted and on medication may well result in a collapse without any underlying cause.
Being a candidate for POTUS is incredibly exhausting and neither of these candidates are young. It is possible that there is not much more to this than that reality but the problem Hillary has is that too many people do not believe a word she says. Cancelling her trip to California is sensible but is unlikely to stop the rumour mill.
It's a whole pattern of things that looks odd.
She's hardly on the campaign trail, the coughing, collapsing, changing explanations of what's wrong, AWOL for 90mins.
With her truth ratings in the toilet, who's going to believe this is just a health blip?
The basic problem is no one believes a word she says.
It seems all too likely that Hillary was told to rest up but just felt she could not miss the 9/11 remembrance ceremony in New York. Standing for 1.5 hours when you are exhausted and on medication may well result in a collapse without any underlying cause.
Being a candidate for POTUS is incredibly exhausting and neither of these candidates are young. It is possible that there is not much more to this than that reality but the problem Hillary has is that too many people do not believe a word she says. Cancelling her trip to California is sensible but is unlikely to stop the rumour mill.
It's a whole pattern of things that looks odd.
She's hardly on the campaign trail, the coughing, collapsing, changing explanations of what's wrong, AWOL for 90mins.
With her truth ratings in the toilet, who's going to believe this is just a health blip?
The basic problem is no one believes a word she says.
Indeed. Does it matter? Seriously -- in a two-horse race between two badly flawed candidates, both with truth issues, will it swing a single vote? Or bet?
Also, why did the BBC News at Ten advertise the Archers for the last few minutes last night? Bloody weird.
Not much news about? Yesterday was a slow news day, at least domestically. Clinton is foreign news, gold medals are sport. The front pages are all over the place.
Wot, no mention of Emily's foreign affairs pint of milk?
It seems all too likely that Hillary was told to rest up but just felt she could not miss the 9/11 remembrance ceremony in New York. Standing for 1.5 hours when you are exhausted and on medication may well result in a collapse without any underlying cause.
Being a candidate for POTUS is incredibly exhausting and neither of these candidates are young. It is possible that there is not much more to this than that reality but the problem Hillary has is that too many people do not believe a word she says. Cancelling her trip to California is sensible but is unlikely to stop the rumour mill.
It's a whole pattern of things that looks odd.
She's hardly on the campaign trail, the coughing, collapsing, changing explanations of what's wrong, AWOL for 90mins.
With her truth ratings in the toilet, who's going to believe this is just a health blip?
The basic problem is no one believes a word she says.
Both Hillary and Bill are near corpses. They make for a sad and gruesome power couple at the end of the road.
Trump can do it, but he will need to step-up a gear and act wholly Presidential over the next 8-9 weeks to contrast himself with Clinton.
Think basically staying upright and lucid will be enough now.
Clinton just doesn't get it. She's making all the sneering mistakes of the Remain campaign, and worse.
She still might just win, given that Trump is a US Farage (without the glamour and appeal of a Boris on his side too, as Leave did), but it could well be a very damn close run thing.
And she is basically relying on hatred for Trump, and that alone, to carry the day for her.
Its a lack of comprehension that the status quo so beloved of the political establishment is a disaster for tens of millions. When you have nothing to lose - no job, no prospects - then the risk is voting for the status quo.
It doesn't matter if Trump says things that sound off the wall to the establishment, everything they say and do is destructive to the people who have nothing.
Grasping that unfettered free-market economics have destroyed the life chances of so many and offering an explanation and a solution (however far fetched we may see it) is how we've had the rise in non-establishment politics. Trump. Farage. Front Nationale, Podemos etc
To those voters, their standard of living has stagnated or deteriorated and the whole shape/look/feel of their communities has changed, often due to high levels of inmigration.
If you are then told by well-off prosperous establishment types that you're a racist or idiot if you disagree with them, that's going to piss you off.
Also, why did the BBC News at Ten advertise the Archers for the last few minutes last night? Bloody weird.
Not much news about? Yesterday was a slow news day, at least domestically. Clinton is foreign news, gold medals are sport. The front pages are all over the place.
Wot, no mention of Emily's foreign affairs pint of milk?
With Clinton’s campaign trip to California cancelled due to ill health and her funding raising stints now being done via Skype, Trump should seize this opportunity and fill the campaign vacuum. Whether more Trump on TV helps him or not, is a different matter however
Trump can do it, but he will need to step-up a gear and act wholly Presidential over the next 8-9 weeks to contrast himself with Clinton.
Think basically staying upright and lucid will be enough now.
Clinton just doesn't get it. She's making all the sneering mistakes of the Remain campaign, and worse.
She still might just win, given that Trump is a US Farage (without the glamour and appeal of a Boris on his side too, as Leave did), but it could well be a very damn close run thing.
And she is basically relying on hatred for Trump, and that alone, to carry the day for her.
The Clinton campaign and Remain campaign are eerily similar, even down to the Clinton campaign's strapline "Stronger Together". She is making all of the same mistakes as well, insulting the other side's voters, resorting to calling the other candidate names. It makes her look petulant. The basic problem is that the majority of the US public agree with Trump's main idea of reducing immigration and deporting illegal immigrants. Clinton can't go head to head with Trump on immigration for exactly the same reason Remain chose not to debate immigration with Leave. Again, the similarities are there for anyone to see.
I think the main difference is that Leave/Remain was a referendum, it wasn't picking the PM or setting the direction of the nation for the next 4/8 years (though in many ways it has done both).
As of now, I can't see beyond a bunch of "shy" Trump supporters turning out in the rust belt and older voters in traditional GOP states doing what they have done for a lifetime which would hand Trump victory. There is a complete lack of enthusiasm for Clinton, again just as there was a lack of enthusiasm for Remain. I know a few people who campaigned for Remain, I was invited to one of their events in London, the difference with Leave was stark. Leave campaigners of all ages seemed to have boundless energy, were willing to get doors closed on them, be called names on the rare occasion and yet we all kept going even when the cause seemed hopeless. The Remain campaign, at least from the single event I went to, was basically paid activists leading a bunch of demoralised volunteers, they all had to be told their lines or read from their script (phone banking). No one seemed to know what the campaign stood for other than not losing to Nigel Farage and Boris Johnson. I get the feeling I could place the Trump and Clinton campaigns into that scenario and it would be quite true.
Mr. StClare, Trump should do nothing. It's genuinely a time when masterly inactivity would be a good thing. Why distract from the media airing concerns about Clinton's health?
Also, why did the BBC News at Ten advertise the Archers for the last few minutes last night? Bloody weird.
Not much news about? Yesterday was a slow news day, at least domestically. Clinton is foreign news, gold medals are sport. The front pages are all over the place.
Wot, no mention of Emily's foreign affairs pint of milk?
Because does anyone think Boris would know
As per the R4 clip just now, of course he didn't know, but he managed not knowing much more elegantly than La Thornberry.
Plus, as one of them noted, she had brought up her foreign trip herself. It wasn't as though they were talking about the NHS and she'd then been asked about the French foreign minister.
But there's something weird about her movements. As if she's conscious but has lost control of motor function. It doesn't look like any faint I've seen.
If you faint standing up, motor function goes. Lie the patient flat and elevate the legs, and they are back to normal within minutes.
Post ictal states usually last for hours so not the quick recovery seen.
Parkinsons is not episodic, it is always present.
Anti-parkinsons sunglasses? Not credible. What is the mechanism of action of light on the basal ganglia?
As someone who has fainted standing up, there is no way that female member of the entourage would have been able to keep her propped-up, head-up, like that.
Also note that the only people startled by the behavour are the cops.
Having watched the video clip a few times there's something not quite right, but I can't work out what it is. As the car arrives, she's conscious but weak, being supported by an aide (doctor?) and a post, but as people try and move her towards the car she has some sort of a spasm then passes out. She's bundled into the car which leaves quickly, yet doesn't go to the hospital, rather to a private residence. This suggests that those with her knew what was wrong and how to deal with it.
The thing is if this was a one off after a month of day in day out rallies I could buy it. You get sick, you keep going at it, flying day in day out, and eventually you go pop.
But it is just the latest in a long line of odd things, 2-3 weird seizure type things caught on camera, the constant coughing, now this odd incident...and always covered up with lies that fall apart.
Quite. The press corps have kept quiet so far, but she's not held a proper press conference since her nomination, .
Yes she has, the press even ran a story about how she had finally had a press conference.
She travels with the press on her plane, Trump doesn't.
Trump was sitting down during the commander in chief forum, Trump recently cancelled a series of events without explanation. What is Trump hiding!!!
Has Obama revealed he's really a Muslim Kenyan yet?
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"Voting actually starts in less than six weeks, on Sept. 23 in Minnesota and South Dakota, the first of some 35 states and the District of Columbia that allow people to cast ballots at polling sites or by mail before Nov. 8. Iowa is expected to have ballots ready by the end of September, as are Illinois and two other states.
The electoral battlegrounds of Arizona and Ohio are to begin voting on Oct. 12, nearly four weeks before Election Day. And North Carolina and Florida will be underway before Halloween."
It all ended up rather romantically ....
Not taken it myself, mind. (Although as I'm flying to the West Coast today, perhaps that's my mistake.)
Modafinil is a serious drug with serious side effects. It has a role in the physician's armatorium but shouldn't be abused. Jet lag. FFS!
Villi Wilson
Not a Secret Service Agent in Sight
that's why people are saying this is Hillary's Doppelgänger‼️
#HillaryHealth https://t.co/kV0J12FSp8
A quick google finds, for instance:
http://nymag.com/news/intelligencer/modafinil-2013-4/ -- Wall Street
https://www.theguardian.com/education/mortarboard/2013/may/31/is-modafinil-safe-in-long-term -- students (the 1 in 5 claim sounds a bit high)
Add her apparent health problems into it and Mr "I've had no complaints" will have yet more accusations to hurl at her.And never mind the negatives against Clinton remember the positives against Trump. This election is like Brexit. A whole bunch of people insistent that Trump is a lunatic and that people won't vote for him and instead will maintain the status quo.
For tens of millions of Americans - like their British counterparts - the status quo is existing rather than living. They're as mad as hell, and they're not going to take it any more. A change - any change - has to be better than this, and if the change at least sounds like he knows their lives unlike the other politicians then all the better.
Trump will win.
I spend my life talking to the people who make this shit
Pharmaceutical executives as a rule try to avoid their products wherever possible!
Unless someone healthy does something incredibly stupid like having a cold bath then going for a long walk in wet clothes on a cold day while suffering from a heavy cold, my understanding is that the immune system fight it off no prob.
Only if the body is compromised by a serious underlying illness does pneumonia get its claws in, hence it often carries away people wjth advanced parkinsons, cancer and the like (and is a blessed relief).
Seems to me that there is something seriously wrong with Mrs Clinton.
Farage will be smiling come November - and it will be the EU, not us, at the back of the queue.
40% Americans: Prez nominees' health is important in how I'll vote (3,400 by @YouGov, 23Aug) https://t.co/w4VbEbvPi2 https://t.co/bT7wJHwxII
2/2 40% of US voters say health is "very important" in deciding how to vote (32% say it's one of a no. of factors) https://t.co/nSzDD1N9kG
Whatever the ultimate cause of Clinton’s ‘medical episode’ turns out to be, it is quite clear that Team Hilary are prepared obfuscate and lie about the true status of her health.
Hillary is doing her fund raising by Skype instead.
Wonder what he'll do next? Something very bouncy I presume - she ate the whole news cycle yesterday for all the worst reasons, no surprise he didn't interrupt it.
The CTA long predates the EU.
Even Bertie Ahern foresees this leading to border controls being introduced.
She travels with the press on her plane, Trump doesn't.
Trump was sitting down during the commander in chief forum, Trump recently cancelled a series of events without explanation. What is Trump hiding!!!
I expect the election to go to whichever of the candidates rules out a second term first. I hope that makes some kind of sense.
She still might just win, given that Trump is a US Farage (without the glamour and appeal of a Boris on his side too, as Leave did), but it could well be a very damn close run thing.
And she is basically relying on hatred for Trump, and that alone, to carry the day for her.
That footage is very damaging.
Being a candidate for POTUS is incredibly exhausting and neither of these candidates are young. It is possible that there is not much more to this than that reality but the problem Hillary has is that too many people do not believe a word she says. Cancelling her trip to California is sensible but is unlikely to stop the rumour mill.
As an aside, the UK came close to voiding the CTA on a couple of occasions.
A persistent cough, a sudden bout of pneumonia, and aged 68. Is she a smoker?
It could all be harmless, or due to the stress of the campaign, but we expect to be lied to and that's what will feed the conspiracy theories.
I tend to go for the stress rather than anything more serious, but only because I can't see the point of the Democrats continuing with a genuinely sick woman.
You feel utterly awful: pale white, drained, cold, hot, sweaty and weak - all at the same time. In fact, at times it felt like the cold finger of death was lingering over me (obviously it wasn't, and I was only 21, but you get the point)
If you're elderly I'd be surprised if it didn't carry you off in hours.
She's hardly on the campaign trail, the coughing, collapsing, changing explanations of what's wrong, AWOL for 90mins.
With her truth ratings in the toilet, who's going to believe this is just a health blip?
Actually it is a surprise he didn't interrupt it. His normally methods would have involved a snarky 'I told you all she was ill' tweet etc. Trump is clearly now listening to sensible campaign advice imho.
Hilliary may have a health issue to deal with for the rest of campaign, but Trump still has a massive demographic issue to deal with.
Like others, I am not necessarily persuaded the pneumonia line is quite true.
It doesn't matter if Trump says things that sound off the wall to the establishment, everything they say and do is destructive to the people who have nothing.
Grasping that unfettered free-market economics have destroyed the life chances of so many and offering an explanation and a solution (however far fetched we may see it) is how we've had the rise in non-establishment politics. Trump. Farage. Front Nationale, Podemos etc
Nothing like a good dose of hyperbole to start the morning off.
http://www.newstatesman.com/2016/09/what-david-miliband-thinks-jeremy-corbyn
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-37316967
If Hilary's e-mail is inexcusable then what does that make Trump's immigration policy?
The Clinton collapse video should be a slam dunk for the Trump campaign but I'm reasonably confident they will find some way to fuck it up.
The woman who played a starring role in one of the most famous photos of the 20th century has died.
Greta Friedman passed away in an assisted living facility in Virginia at the age of 92, her family confirmed to the New York Daily News.
And while her name may not ring any bells, the famous photograph of the woman being kissed by a sailor in the middle of Times Square celebrating the Japanese surrender in WWII is seen and known by millions
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3783454/Woman-iconic-V-J-Day-Times-Square-photograph-died-aged-92.html#ixzz4K1XfttO6
Southern Ireland is now anti catholic Ireland with empty churches and hostility to the Church from state and people alike.
The EU would do well to remember that the southern Irish in particular can be very fickle with their loyalites and more than happy to cut their hand off to spite their opponents face if slighted, continue a feud for months, years or even decades and then suddenly end it and carry on as if nothing happened.
The EU have pushed their luck with the RoI for years and it would not take much for them to be hated like the Catholic Church are now and the British were before them.
I may not have been born there but genetically I am 75% Irish and so are my kids. All of us could get an RoI passport if we wanted.
Mr. Essexit, was it the Brexiteer, in the polling booth, with the ballot paper?
If you are then told by well-off prosperous establishment types that you're a racist or idiot if you disagree with them, that's going to piss you off.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/09/12/jeremy-corbyns-labour-suffers-worst-opinion-poll-ratings-the-par/
We're in for a long period of Tory rule by the looks of things.
You could easily say the same about Trump of course.
I don't think we'll see a PM of this country in their 70s. Thersea May is 60 (in Oct) for example, but I doubt she'll be PM when she's 70.
I think the main difference is that Leave/Remain was a referendum, it wasn't picking the PM or setting the direction of the nation for the next 4/8 years (though in many ways it has done both).
As of now, I can't see beyond a bunch of "shy" Trump supporters turning out in the rust belt and older voters in traditional GOP states doing what they have done for a lifetime which would hand Trump victory. There is a complete lack of enthusiasm for Clinton, again just as there was a lack of enthusiasm for Remain. I know a few people who campaigned for Remain, I was invited to one of their events in London, the difference with Leave was stark. Leave campaigners of all ages seemed to have boundless energy, were willing to get doors closed on them, be called names on the rare occasion and yet we all kept going even when the cause seemed hopeless. The Remain campaign, at least from the single event I went to, was basically paid activists leading a bunch of demoralised volunteers, they all had to be told their lines or read from their script (phone banking). No one seemed to know what the campaign stood for other than not losing to Nigel Farage and Boris Johnson. I get the feeling I could place the Trump and Clinton campaigns into that scenario and it would be quite true.
Plus, as one of them noted, she had brought up her foreign trip herself. It wasn't as though they were talking about the NHS and she'd then been asked about the French foreign minister.
Gove clearly looking to get back in the Cabinet!