Bye bye EU, bye bye Cameron. Lets now declare Nigel Farage and UKIP as the most successful political insurgency in the Western world in the 21st Century.
Thanks Dave. IMO you did well. Not brilliantly, but well. But you prevented the catastrophe of another Brown government, or an Ed one.
Yes, he got rid of Brown for us and revived the economy. I think people forget just what a terrible state we was in back in 2010. The 2010 to 2015 coalition did make decent progress.
I think he could have been an all time great PM but in the end he was too much of a gambler.
Actually in 2010 the economy was recovering from the global crash until Osborne's Plan A flatlined it.
I'm doing my best to not cry like a disgraced televangelist
Permission for top lip to wobble; granted.
I'm really quite emotional about all this. I have ranted and railed at times, but I was "with him" generally from day 1 when Howard announced he was quitting.
What a stupid, stupid waste of a generally sound Premiership.
It is quite something how many British Tory PMs have - in the end - been destroyed by the EU issue: Thatcher, Major, Cameron i.e. all of them since Heath who took us in.
And how many other Tory leaders/would be leaders have had to or felt they needed to define themselves around the EU issue: Clarke, Portillo, IDS, Hague.
It is odd that the EU issue has been so toxic for the Tories when - arguably - it is Labour voters who have felt more of the disadvantages of being in the EU.
Discuss.........
I would say Heath was also destroyed by the Europe issue. Firstly if he hadn't gone into the EU the industrial strife would not have been as bad and secondly he was out by a handful of votes - and would probably have got them if senior tories including a former cabinet minister were not advising people to vote Labour in the 74 elections.
The majority of Tory MPs voted to stay out and Heath only got the legislation narrowly through with the help of Labour Europhiles like Woy.
That poisoned the party for 41 years, dividing it into Europhiles and Eurosceptics. That is over now and the intellectual energy can be focused on more useful things.
Genuine question to a (pre-referendum) committed Brexiteer. If you are told, out of EU, but keep a multilateral arrangement via the EEA, unrestricted freedom of movement, UK subject to foreign court, and no say on legislation enacted multilaterally, - would you say, I accept that, maybe not my first choice, but I can live with it?
Thats a bit of an exaggeration (there are some free movement get outs in terms of benefits etc. and "emergency" measures not available in the EU and the EDJ wont be meddling in our affairs other than a proxy court on single market matters but...
Yes. Sure I would love to get out of everything except EFTA but that would be mad and far too big a jump for the economy.
Join ETFA/EEA and get whatever free movement concessions we can in return for higher annual fees per capita than Norway Danegeld. Wait a decade and if then we are powering ahead with bilateral trade with RoW sorted and an ever smaller percentage of our foreign trade with the single market then we consider demanding a renegiotiation in which we are prepared to walk away from EEA if we don't get what we want.
Thanks Dave. IMO you did well. Not brilliantly, but well. But you prevented the catastrophe of another Brown government, or an Ed one.
Yes, he got rid of Brown for us and revived the economy. I think people forget just what a terrible state we was in back in 2010. The 2010 to 2015 coalition did make decent progress.
I think he could have been an all time great PM but in the end he was too much of a gambler.
Actually in 2010 the economy was recovering from the global crash until Osborne's Plan A flatlined it.
As I remember it, Brown simply sprayed around a lot of money we didn't have a few months before the election and got a little bump in GDP as a result.
why the fk are the cabinet being driven around in German cars ?
Saxe-Coburg-Gotha ---> Windsor
LOL
should be a Rolls Royce then. German car built in Sussex.
Built in Sussex? I think put together from parts manufactured all over would be a better description.
Incidentally my brother-in-law who works at the site is very critical of the body presses and other bits that come from Germany. Says the quality is crap.
Thanks Dave. IMO you did well. Not brilliantly, but well. But you prevented the catastrophe of another Brown government, or an Ed one.
Yes, he got rid of Brown for us and revived the economy. I think people forget just what a terrible state we was in back in 2010. The 2010 to 2015 coalition did make decent progress.
I think he could have been an all time great PM but in the end he was too much of a gambler.
Actually in 2010 the economy was recovering from the global crash until Osborne's Plan A flatlined it.
Strange how you lefties who laud Gordon Brown's economic recovery in 2010 never have "sustainable" in your vocabulary....
I would say Heath was also destroyed by the Europe issue. Firstly if he hadn't gone into the EU the industrial strife would not have been as bad and secondly he was out by a handful of votes - and would probably have got them if senior tories including a former cabinet minister were not advising people to vote Labour in the 74 elections.
The majority of Tory MPs voted to stay out and Heath only got the legislation narrowly through with the help of Labour Europhiles like Woy.
That poisoned the party for 41 years, dividing it into Europhiles and Eurosceptics. That is over now and the intellectual energy can be focused on more useful things.
Genuine question to a (pre-referendum) committed Brexiteer. If you are told, out of EU, but keep a multilateral arrangement via the EEA, unrestricted freedom of movement, UK subject to foreign court, and no say on legislation enacted multilaterally, - would you say, I accept that, maybe not my first choice, but I can live with it?
Thats a bit of an exaggeration (there are some free movement get outs in terms of benefits etc. and "emergency" measures not available in the EU and the EDJ wont be meddling in our affairs other than a proxy court on single market matters but...
Yes. Sure I would love to get out of everything except EFTA but that would be mad and far too big a jump for the economy.
Join ETFA/EEA and get whatever free movement concessions we can in return for higher annual fees per capita than Norway Danegeld. Wait a decade and if then we are powering ahead with bilateral trade with RoW sorted and an ever smaller percentage of our foreign trade with the single market then we consider demanding a renegiotiation in which we are prepared to walk away from EEA if we don't get what we want.
Sounds like a qualified Yes and a willingness to park the EU issue at least for a while.
I'm doing my best to not cry like a disgraced televangelist
Permission for top lip to wobble; granted.
I'm really quite emotional about all this. I have ranted and railed at times, but I was "with him" generally from day 1 when Howard announced he was quitting. That's 11 years ago, and that's more than a quarter of my lifetime.
What a stupid, stupid waste of a generally sound Premiership.
It is quite something how many British Tory PMs have - in the end - been destroyed by the EU issue: Thatcher, Major, Cameron i.e. all of them since Heath who took us in.
And how many other Tory leaders/would be leaders have had to or felt they needed to define themselves around the EU issue: Clarke, Portillo, IDS, Hague.
It is odd that the EU issue has been so toxic for the Tories when - arguably - it is Labour voters who have felt more of the disadvantages of being in the EU.
Discuss.........
I would say Heath was also destroyed by the Europe issue. Firstly if he hadn't gone into the EU the industrial strife would not have been as bad and secondly he was out by a handful of votes - and would probably have got them if senior tories including a former cabinet minister were not advising people to vote Labour in the 74 elections.
The majority of Tory MPs voted to stay out and Heath only got the legislation narrowly through with the help of Labour Europhiles like Woy.
That poisoned the party for 41 years, dividing it into Europhiles and Eurosceptics. That is over now and the intellectual energy can be focused on more useful things.
"That poisoned the party for 41 years, dividing it into Europhiles and Eurosceptics. That is over now"
Chuckle. I doubt it!
Approximately nobody in the Tory party is going to advocate rejoining.
It will become one of those things discussed earnestly every year at Libdem party conferences.
Thanks Dave. IMO you did well. Not brilliantly, but well. But you prevented the catastrophe of another Brown government, or an Ed one.
Yes, he got rid of Brown for us and revived the economy. I think people forget just what a terrible state we was in back in 2010. The 2010 to 2015 coalition did make decent progress.
I think he could have been an all time great PM but in the end he was too much of a gambler.
Actually in 2010 the economy was recovering from the global crash until Osborne's Plan A flatlined it.
Strange how you lefties who laud Gordon Brown's economic recovery in 2010 never have "sustainable" in your vocabulary....
why the fk are the cabinet being driven around in German cars ?
Saxe-Coburg-Gotha ---> Windsor
LOL
should be a Rolls Royce then. German car built in Sussex.
Built in Sussex? I think put together from parts manufactured all over would be a better description.
Incidentally my brother-in-law who works at the site is very critical of the body presses and other bits that come from Germany. Says the quality is crap.
All cars are modular these days Mr L and made of bits from across the work. Nobody really manufactures cars these days ( except perhaps Morgan! ) they are assembled.
As for body panels from memory RR make theirs in Dingolfing in Germany never really understood why, it must cost them a fortune to ship them over and there are loads of places in the UK could make them.
Good riddance to a man who first tried to bounce the public into voting away their future, then tried to scare and bully them into doing so. He disgraced his office and his departure is a very good thing.
Not even a kind word for delivering on the referendum.
Certaiinly not. It was a waste of time and money. The question was meaningless without greater precision.
The question was hardly meaningless, we'll be leaving the EU.
People were asked to vote without knowing what the possible alternatives were. The Leave campaign, headed by prominent Tories, promised any number of contradictory outcomes. And Caameron´s team just kept on threatening us. This was not a real choice.
Yeah, the choice was between staying in the EU, and leaving the EU...
What sort of EU?
The one based on Cameron's renegotiation.
I don´t think anybody voted on that basis!!!
So what were they voting for on remaining in the EU? Some wishful thinking that they'd give us an even better deal if we stayed in?
It seems to me that everybody understood Cameron´s referendum question in their own particular way- some thought it meant more money for the NHS, or an end to EU immigration, others an end to third world immigration, others increased privileges for bankers and the City of London, others for abolition of environmental control and workers´rights. Whatever you like.
And now that Cameron, Osborne, Johnson, Gove, Leadsome etc have all scarpered off, Mrs May is left trying to reconcile all these contradictions. She is doomed to failure, and will be remembered as the very worst prime minister ever.
The Wikipedia editors have decided Theresa May has now been appointed PM.
ANYONE is free to edit Wikipedia articles (as long as they haven't been locked), all you do is give away your IP address in the edit history.
If you sign up to become an editor, then you can hide your IP address, and edit locked articles.
or - unless you post something illegal or defamatory you just unplug your router and reboot it if you are posting from home and you get a new IP address with most service providers.
Most ISPs use dynamic IP addresses which means you are basically anonymous unless you do something so grave that a formal request gets made to your ISP to crossreference their IP addresses at a particular time with the offensive communication.
Thanks Dave. IMO you did well. Not brilliantly, but well. But you prevented the catastrophe of another Brown government, or an Ed one.
Yes, he got rid of Brown for us and revived the economy. I think people forget just what a terrible state we was in back in 2010. The 2010 to 2015 coalition did make decent progress.
I think he could have been an all time great PM but in the end he was too much of a gambler.
Actually in 2010 the economy was recovering from the global crash until Osborne's Plan A flatlined it.
Strange how you lefties who laud Gordon Brown's economic recovery in 2010 never have "sustainable" in your vocabulary....
AAA Brown vs. AA Cameron
All you need to know
Ah, the credit rating agencies which did so well in the last crash!
Good riddance to a man who first tried to bounce the public into voting away their future, then tried to scare and bully them into doing so. He disgraced his office and his departure is a very good thing.
Not even a kind word for delivering on the referendum.
Certaiinly not. It was a waste of time and money. The question was meaningless without greater precision.
The question was hardly meaningless, we'll be leaving the EU.
People were asked to vote without knowing what the possible alternatives were. The Leave campaign, headed by prominent Tories, promised any number of contradictory outcomes. And Caameron´s team just kept on threatening us. This was not a real choice.
Yeah, the choice was between staying in the EU, and leaving the EU...
What sort of EU?
The one based on Cameron's renegotiation.
I don´t think anybody voted on that basis!!!
So what were they voting for on remaining in the EU? Some wishful thinking that they'd give us an even better deal if we stayed in?
It seems to me that everybody understood Cameron´s referendum question in their own particular way- some thought it meant more money for the NHS, or an end to EU immigration, others an end to third world immigration, others increased privileges for bankers and the City of London, others for abolition of environmental control and workers´rights. Whatever you like.
And now that Cameron, Osborne, Johnson, Gove, Leadsome etc have all scarpered off, Mrs May is left trying to reconcile all these contradictions. She is doomed to failure, and will be remembered as the very worst prime minister ever.
LOL. Let's at least see her as PM before making such judgments.
Watching all of this can anyone imagine that it was Andrea Leadsom meeting the Queen just now to become PM.
I expect the party faithful would be bigging up Leadsom and publicly wondering how Theresa May ever got on the ballot paper after single-handedly losing the referendum by failing to curb immigration. Likewise if Boris were the new PM, we'd be overwhelmed with Heineken similes and pictures of bikes and the Olympics. Everyone loves a winner.
Thanks Dave. IMO you did well. Not brilliantly, but well. But you prevented the catastrophe of another Brown government, or an Ed one.
Yes, he got rid of Brown for us and revived the economy. I think people forget just what a terrible state we was in back in 2010. The 2010 to 2015 coalition did make decent progress.
I think he could have been an all time great PM but in the end he was too much of a gambler.
Actually in 2010 the economy was recovering from the global crash until Osborne's Plan A flatlined it.
Strange how you lefties who laud Gordon Brown's economic recovery in 2010 never have "sustainable" in your vocabulary....
AAA Brown vs. AA Cameron
All you need to know
Lol. Does anyone still take ratings agencies seriously.
Good riddance to a man who first tried to bounce the public into voting away their future, then tried to scare and bully them into doing so. He disgraced his office and his departure is a very good thing.
Not even a kind word for delivering on the referendum.
Certaiinly not. It was a waste of time and money. The question was meaningless without greater precision.
The question was hardly meaningless, we'll be leaving the EU.
People were asked to vote without knowing what the possible alternatives were. The Leave campaign, headed by prominent Tories, promised any number of contradictory outcomes. And Caameron´s team just kept on threatening us. This was not a real choice.
Yeah, the choice was between staying in the EU, and leaving the EU...
What sort of EU?
The one based on Cameron's renegotiation.
I don´t think anybody voted on that basis!!!
So what were they voting for on remaining in the EU? Some wishful thinking that they'd give us an even better deal if we stayed in?
It seems to me that everybody understood Cameron´s referendum question in their own particular way- some thought it meant more money for the NHS, or an end to EU immigration, others an end to third world immigration, others increased privileges for bankers and the City of London, others for abolition of environmental control and workers´rights. Whatever you like.
And now that Cameron, Osborne, Johnson, Gove, Leadsome etc have all scarpered off, Mrs May is left trying to reconcile all these contradictions. She is doomed to failure, and will be remembered as the very worst prime minister ever.
I think you're forgetting that the UK electorate just aren't ideological. I hate pigeonholing myself, but I probably lean Hannanite. However, I'm not going to die in a ditch if we went for an EEA-like option.
Similarly, immigration just has to be demonstrably better controlled rather than reduced to zero. We're a phlegmatic bunch. We'll adapt to the new reality and get on with what's actually important; family, friends, community.
A good PM stabbed in the back by people like Plato who a year ago went round asking people to vote for him as PM
The tragedy of it is, he did it to himself.
Nobody made him do a half-arsed renegotiation. Nobody made him attempt to sell his half-arsed renegotiation as the best thing since sliced bread.
Exactly. He tried to play the Brits for fools. His downfall was entirely self-inflicted.
No. It was inflicted by the EU obsessives within his own party who demanded a referendum. Many of the same guys who stabbed Major in the back.
Sad to see you're not being in the least bit gracious today, and that your dislike of Cameron still shines through.
Be fair, Mr Jessop, see my post in response to Mr. Nabavi in which I agreed that Cameron has probably been the best PM in the last half-century save Thatcher.
Personally I couldn't stand the bloke but that doesn't stop me recognising his talents as well as his failings.
Cameron told us that he was prepared to lead the UK out of the EU if he didn't get a good enough deal and that the UK could thrive outside the EU. He secured what I thought was a crap, in fact pretty much meaningless, deal. He then told us that if we voted to leave the EU armageddon would descend on us. So was he lying to me with his first set of views or with his second set of views?
Cameron caused his own downfall playing fast and loose with the British people and, I think, he thought he could take us for fools, who would back him because he was, to quote the person of whom he was supposed to be the heir, " a pretty straight kind of guy".
So, I'll not feel sad at his political passing. He brought it on himself.
Perhaps in his wisdom he didn't think the deal was cr@p or pretty much meaningless. You know, opinions do differ. And ISTR you had made up your mind on that matter well before the negotiations.
As for "He then told us that if we voted to leave the EU armageddon would descend on us." - really? That's playing a little fast and loose with what was said, is it not?
Lets leave it there Mr. Jessop and, hopefully, remain friends. Or, if you want, I'll buy you dinner on Saturday 10th September (when I am going to be up near Cambridge) and then we can thrash it out face to face, and hopefully remain friends afterwards.
A good PM stabbed in the back by people like Plato who a year ago went round asking people to vote for him as PM
The tragedy of it is, he did it to himself.
Nobody made him do a half-arsed renegotiation. Nobody made him attempt to sell his half-arsed renegotiation as the best thing since sliced bread.
Exactly. He tried to play the Brits for fools. His downfall was entirely self-inflicted.
No. It was inflicted by the EU obsessives within his own party who demanded a referendum. Many of the same guys who stabbed Major in the back.
Sad to see you're not being in the least bit gracious today, and that your dislike of Cameron still shines through.
Be fair, Mr Jessop, see my post in response to Mr. Nabavi in which I agreed that Cameron has probably been the best PM in the last half-century save Thatcher.
Personally I couldn't stand the bloke but that doesn't stop me recognising his talents as well as his failings.
Cameron told us that he was prepared to lead the UK out of the EU if he didn't get a good enough deal and that the UK could thrive outside the EU. He secured what I thought was a crap, in fact pretty much meaningless, deal. He then told us that if we voted to leave the EU armageddon would descend on us. So was he lying to me with his first set of views or with his second set of views?
Cameron caused his own downfall playing fast and loose with the British people and, I think, he thought he could take us for fools, who would back him because he was, to quote the person of whom he was supposed to be the heir, " a pretty straight kind of guy".
So, I'll not feel sad at his political passing. He brought it on himself.
Perhaps in his wisdom he didn't think the deal was cr@p or pretty much meaningless. You know, opinions do differ. And ISTR you had made up your mind on that matter well before the negotiations.
As for "He then told us that if we voted to leave the EU armageddon would descend on us." - really? That's playing a little fast and loose with what was said, is it not?
Lets leave it there Mr. Jessop and, hopefully, remain friends. Or, if you want, I'll buy you dinner on Saturday 10th September (when I am going to be up near Cambridge) and then we can thrash it out face to face, and hopefully remain friends afterwards.
Agreed. Let's hope we're both well enough for such a meeting.
Good riddance to a man who first tried to bounce the public into voting away their future, then tried to scare and bully them into doing so. He disgraced his office and his departure is a very good thing.
Not even a kind word for delivering on the referendum.
Certaiinly not. It was a waste of time and money. The question was meaningless without greater precision.
The question was hardly meaningless, we'll be leaving the EU.
People were asked to vote without knowing what the possible alternatives were. The Leave campaign, headed by prominent Tories, promised any number of contradictory outcomes. And Caameron´s team just kept on threatening us. This was not a real choice.
Yeah, the choice was between staying in the EU, and leaving the EU...
What sort of EU?
The one based on Cameron's renegotiation.
I don´t think anybody voted on that basis!!!
So what were they voting for on remaining in the EU? Some wishful thinking that they'd give us an even better deal if we stayed in?
She is doomed to failure, and will be remembered as the very worst prime minister ever.
Thanks Dave. IMO you did well. Not brilliantly, but well. But you prevented the catastrophe of another Brown government, or an Ed one.
Yes, he got rid of Brown for us and revived the economy. I think people forget just what a terrible state we was in back in 2010. The 2010 to 2015 coalition did make decent progress.
I think he could have been an all time great PM but in the end he was too much of a gambler.
Actually in 2010 the economy was recovering from the global crash until Osborne's Plan A flatlined it.
Strange how you lefties who laud Gordon Brown's economic recovery in 2010 never have "sustainable" in your vocabulary....
Thanks Dave. IMO you did well. Not brilliantly, but well. But you prevented the catastrophe of another Brown government, or an Ed one.
Yes, he got rid of Brown for us and revived the economy. I think people forget just what a terrible state we was in back in 2010. The 2010 to 2015 coalition did make decent progress.
I think he could have been an all time great PM but in the end he was too much of a gambler.
Actually in 2010 the economy was recovering from the global crash until Osborne's Plan A flatlined it.
Strange how you lefties who laud Gordon Brown's economic recovery in 2010 never have "sustainable" in your vocabulary....
AAA Brown vs. AA Cameron
All you need to know
Lol. Does anyone still take ratings agencies seriously.
The ratings agencies are another casualty of the 2008 crash. We lost our AAA rating with Fitch and Moodys in 2013. S&P just joined the club. The day they did that, our borrowing costs went down. I would be entirely unsurprised if gilts carry negative interest rates in the next couple of years.
Good riddance to a man who first tried to bounce the public into voting away their future, then tried to scare and bully them into doing so. He disgraced his office and his departure is a very good thing.
Not even a kind word for delivering on the referendum.
Certaiinly not. It was a waste of time and money. The question was meaningless without greater precision.
The question was hardly meaningless, we'll be leaving the EU.
People were asked to vote without knowing what the possible alternatives were. The Leave campaign, headed by prominent Tories, promised any number of contradictory outcomes. And Caameron´s team just kept on threatening us. This was not a real choice.
Yeah, the choice was between staying in the EU, and leaving the EU...
What sort of EU?
The one based on Cameron's renegotiation.
I don´t think anybody voted on that basis!!!
So what were they voting for on remaining in the EU? Some wishful thinking that they'd give us an even better deal if we stayed in?
It seems to me that everybody understood Cameron´s referendum question in their own particular way- some thought it meant more money for the NHS, or an end to EU immigration, others an end to third world immigration, others increased privileges for bankers and the City of London, others for abolition of environmental control and workers´rights. Whatever you like.
And now that Cameron, Osborne, Johnson, Gove, Leadsome etc have all scarpered off, Mrs May is left trying to reconcile all these contradictions. She is doomed to failure, and will be remembered as the very worst prime minister ever.
I think you're forgetting that the UK electorate just aren't ideological. I hate pigeonholing myself, but I probably lean Hannanite. However, I'm not going to die in a ditch if we went for an EEA-like option.
Similarly, immigration just has to be demonstrably better controlled rather than reduced to zero. We're a phlegmatic bunch. We'll adapt to the new reality and get on with what's actually important; family, friends, community.
You are probably right, Mr M. We will.
However, this particular argument started off with the foolish assertion that the Referendum gave us a totally clear decision about what the public wanted.
why the fk are the cabinet being driven around in German cars ?
What marque would you recommend? I'm struggling to think of anything British that would fit the bill.
Reliant Robin
Brompton bicycle.
I'm sure I passed the PMs motorcade coming the other way when he attended the first day of the tour de france in yorkshire. all black range rovers. looked suitably impressive I thought.
Sounds like a qualified Yes and a willingness to park the EU issue at least for a while.
Basically - Yes, provided the EU don't take the piss in the Brexit negotiations.
Certainly not park the EU issue for a while. It needs to be done as soon as possible so we can get on with bilaterial RoW trade deals, defenestrate the ECJ and take back control of Agricultural and Fisheries so we can implement sane conservation measures instead of the nonsense of the CFP etc. That is another reason to stay in EEA/EFTA as it makes Brexit far quicker to sort and gets it done before anyone gets cold feet.
The deal ought to be sorted out by the diplomats in principle before we trigger A50 and the formal negotiations can just be some high profile grandstanding about what the Danegeld/Freedom of movement concessions will be before, perhaps with one short breakdown in talks and public huffiness, everyone emerges into the Sunlight with a deal that takes Britian out of the EU but allows the EU to claim that Britain and the EU are still valued partners in Europe or whatever flowery guff.
Thanks Dave. IMO you did well. Not brilliantly, but well. But you prevented the catastrophe of another Brown government, or an Ed one.
Yes, he got rid of Brown for us and revived the economy. I think people forget just what a terrible state we was in back in 2010. The 2010 to 2015 coalition did make decent progress.
I think he could have been an all time great PM but in the end he was too much of a gambler.
Actually in 2010 the economy was recovering from the global crash until Osborne's Plan A flatlined it.
Strange how you lefties who laud Gordon Brown's economic recovery in 2010 never have "sustainable" in your vocabulary....
AAA Brown vs. AA Cameron
All you need to know
Lol. Does anyone still take ratings agencies seriously.
The ratings agencies are another casualty of the 2008 crash. We lost our AAA rating with Fitch and Moodys in 2013. S&P just joined the club. The day they did that, our borrowing costs went down. I would be entirely unsurprised if gilts carry negative interest rates in the next couple of years.
The rating agencies lost all their credibility in the 2008 crash, it is of far less consequence what they think now
Yeah, if public and private education gave the same results. That's where the problem is. I don't think we should be handicapping ourselves just to meet some sort of quota. Rather, we should be making public education better.
Of course, but the privately educated are still vastly over-represented even taking that into account.
We need to become a society where everybody gets a good education and the same opportunities, not one where a handful of schools and universities still dominate high-office.
You are Michael Gove and ICMFP.
Perhaps the privately educated are more capable :-o
why the fk are the cabinet being driven around in German cars ?
Saxe-Coburg-Gotha ---> Windsor
LOL
should be a Rolls Royce then. German car built in Sussex.
Built in Sussex? I think put together from parts manufactured all over would be a better description.
Incidentally my brother-in-law who works at the site is very critical of the body presses and other bits that come from Germany. Says the quality is crap.
All cars are modular these days Mr L and made of bits from across the work. Nobody really manufactures cars these days ( except perhaps Morgan! ) they are assembled.
As for body panels from memory RR make theirs in Dingolfing in Germany never really understood why, it must cost them a fortune to ship them over and there are loads of places in the UK could make them.
Quite so, Mr. B, and a German company giving contacts to another German company to produce second rate products, which have to be corrected and finished at the UK plant (so adding to the plant's costs) should not surprise us.
Makes me cross though.
Anyway, enough! I am off up the road for a meeting of the Hurstpierpoint and District Gentlemen's Temperance Association. Item 1 on the agenda is this Summer's outings and as I am Hon. Sec. Outings Committee, I need to be there early to put the fixes in.
Very good PM certainly the best probably during my lifetime. Could have gone down as an all time great but now probably isn't the time to really judge his legacy in terms of Europe. Who knows he may be proven right and history may judge him differently (though if that is indeed the case I have no doubt he will be blamed for giving the people the choice in the first place).
Made the Conservative party re-electable again and governed what was one of the best governments during my lifetime in coalition and that was no easy task. Implementation of gay marriage at a time when he went against a large part of his party and membership. 2.5 million more people in work and the significant progress made on the deficit. Winning his party a majority for the first time in over 20 years. He has plenty to be proud of but it's such a shame that he could have done so much more with the talent he had.
Comments
Yes. Sure I would love to get out of everything except EFTA but that would be mad and far too big a jump for the economy.
Join ETFA/EEA and get whatever free movement concessions we can in return for higher annual fees per capita than Norway Danegeld. Wait a decade and if then we are powering ahead with bilateral trade with RoW sorted and an ever smaller percentage of our foreign trade with the single market then we consider demanding a renegiotiation in which we are prepared to walk away from EEA if we don't get what we want.
But it's all Murdoch's fault, not the fact that Leadsom proved herself incapable of conducting even one interview.
In no real sense was the economy "recovering".
Long Live the Prime Minister!
Incidentally my brother-in-law who works at the site is very critical of the body presses and other bits that come from Germany. Says the quality is crap.
Good evening, former Prime Minister...
How satisfying is that ....
All you need to know
As for body panels from memory RR make theirs in Dingolfing in Germany never really understood why, it must cost them a fortune to ship them over and there are loads of places in the UK could make them.
And now that Cameron, Osborne, Johnson, Gove, Leadsome etc have all scarpered off, Mrs May is left trying to reconcile all these contradictions. She is doomed to failure, and will be remembered as the very worst prime minister ever.
Most ISPs use dynamic IP addresses which means you are basically anonymous unless you do something so grave that a formal request gets made to your ISP to crossreference their IP addresses at a particular time with the offensive communication.
twitter.com/Number10gov/status/753192970015350784
How can the BBC get such a basic thing wrong? Totally hopeless.
Similarly, immigration just has to be demonstrably better controlled rather than reduced to zero. We're a phlegmatic bunch. We'll adapt to the new reality and get on with what's actually important; family, friends, community.
No PM after May market yet, though
Peace.
However, this particular argument started off with the foolish assertion that the Referendum gave us a totally clear decision about what the public wanted.
So long and thanks for all the fish
Certainly not park the EU issue for a while. It needs to be done as soon as possible so we can get on with bilaterial RoW trade deals, defenestrate the ECJ and take back control of Agricultural and Fisheries so we can implement sane conservation measures instead of the nonsense of the CFP etc. That is another reason to stay in EEA/EFTA as it makes Brexit far quicker to sort and gets it done before anyone gets cold feet.
The deal ought to be sorted out by the diplomats in principle before we trigger A50 and the formal negotiations can just be some high profile grandstanding about what the Danegeld/Freedom of movement concessions will be before, perhaps with one short breakdown in talks and public huffiness, everyone emerges into the Sunlight with a deal that takes Britian out of the EU but allows the EU to claim that Britain and the EU are still valued partners in Europe or whatever flowery guff.
Brown - worst ever financial crisis
Reminds me of that Ali G indahouse line
'I eard the prime minister of Wales called yor mum a slag...'
3/10
https://twitter.com/LouiseMensch/status/753273584966049793
Makes me cross though.
Anyway, enough! I am off up the road for a meeting of the Hurstpierpoint and District Gentlemen's Temperance Association. Item 1 on the agenda is this Summer's outings and as I am Hon. Sec. Outings Committee, I need to be there early to put the fixes in.
Made the Conservative party re-electable again and governed what was one of the best governments during my lifetime in coalition and that was no easy task. Implementation of gay marriage at a time when he went against a large part of his party and membership. 2.5 million more people in work and the significant progress made on the deficit. Winning his party a majority for the first time in over 20 years. He has plenty to be proud of but it's such a shame that he could have done so much more with the talent he had.