By the way in answer to Foxinsox point earlier about Brexit screwing up the TTIP deal for the EU. I suppose it depends on how close the EU and US are to a deal at the moment. It seems very likely that a Brexit result would mean a couple of years before the UK left and it is possible the TTIP deal may have been signed by then in which case I assume Brexit wouldn't impact on the deal in the way you feared.
Checks in ... they are still whining about Obama ... checks out.
Some people are proud of this country and do not take it lightly when it is insulted. You are apparently not such a person.
Reality is insulting. Reality is harsh, cruel and uncaring. It will cripple you and put you in the ground regardless of virtue or vice. If you are lucky, you will die infirm half-blind: unlucky, in dreadful pain and fear. An adult copes with this: a child rails against it.
Obama told you a truth: a Britain post-Brexit would be deprioritised in favor of a larger EU. That will be true whether President Trump, Clinton, Cruz, Sanders, whoever, and will be true whether Russia, USA, China, whoever. Respect and attention come with power, not friendship, not culture, not history, just power: what can you do to me and what can you do for me?
Characterize it as an insult if you wish, declare your pride as you feel appropriate. But reality will not care one jot. Obama showed you what reality is: it will be hard
Yes - Let's put the UK at the back of the queue for a trade agreement with the USA.
Only: The USA is currently the NUMBER ONE UK EXPORT MARKET country - with no trade deal in place.
You tell em, tiger. Throw rocks at the sea.
I think Leave's position has moved from 'With Brexit, we'll get trade deals very easily' to 'With Brexit, we don't need trade deals'
Leave's position (and strength) was that it could promise all things: high growth, low inward migration, trade deals better, costs lower, more of everything good, less of everything bad, the penny and the bun, all wrapped up with a party hat. If Obama's intervention causes people to realise that reality just doesn't work like that, then it's all to the good.
He just gave his opinion, he's hardly infallible!
Viewcode is having a bit of a Michael Douglas in 'Falling Down' moment. It's to be hoped he's not in possession of any firearms.
Checks in ... they are still whining about Obama ... checks out.
Some people are proud of this country and do not take it lightly when it is insulted. You are apparently not such a person.
Reality is insulting. Reality is harsh, cruel and uncaring. It will cripple you and put you in the ground regardless of virtue or vice. If you are lucky, you will die infirm half-blind: unlucky, in dreadful pain and fear. An adult copes with this: a child rails against it.
Obama told you a truth: a Britain post-Brexit would be deprioritised in favor of a larger EU. That will be true whether President Trump, Clinton, Cruz, Sanders, whoever, and will be true whether Russia, USA, China, whoever. Respect and attention come with power, not friendship, not culture, not history, just power: what can you do to me and what can you do for me?
Characterize it as an insult if you wish, declare your pride as you feel appropriate. But reality will not care one jot. Obama showed you what reality is: it will be hard
Yes - Let's put the UK at the back of the queue for a trade agreement with the USA.
Only: The USA is currently the NUMBER ONE UK EXPORT MARKET country - with no trade deal in place.
You tell em, tiger. Throw rocks at the sea.
I think Leave's position has moved from 'With Brexit, we'll get trade deals very easily' to 'With Brexit, we don't need trade deals'
Turned to the Daft Side, young TSE has!
Wait until you see my morning thread. I suspect it will enrage many Leavers as I compare them to [Oh sorry, you'l have to wait until the morning]
But the piece overall should bring A New Hope to the Leavers
Out of interest, do the junior doctors get paid while they are on strike?
No. Indeed they do not get paid if the strike covers any part of their shift, so if on a 0800- 2200 "long day" and the strike is 0800-1700 then they work 5 hours for the NHS for free.
I'm not in favour of the strikes, but it seems a little unfair to count whole shifts rather than hours. Not that anyone should be doing double shifts either of course.
I thought Obama was doing what Cameron wanted and what he told him to say.so surely Obama should caddy
I think its always been American policy for the UK to be within the EU as it puts a more pro-US Element into EU decision making while also increasing internal tensions within the EU.
What the USA has never wanted has been a united European superstate hostile to American interests. Having the UK within the EU is a good way of blocking that.
If that results in damaging the UK's own interests then that's something the US will not worry about.
It isn't me who's screaming at the President of the United States or calling the PM a traitor (OK, it isn't you, either. But a lot of Brexiters are doing exactly that.)
The US will prioritise a trade deal with us if they think there's money in it for them. They'd prioritise a trade deal with Orpington if they thought there was money in it for them.
True...but that's just rephrasing what I said. ("Respect and attention come with power...what can you do to me and what can you do for me?") You can get whatever deal you like...provided you pay for it. And the shape of that deal will be shaped (ouch!) by the power and wealth of both parties.
Checks in ... they are still whining about Obama ... checks out.
Some people are proud of this country and do not take it lightly when it is insulted. You are apparently not such a person.
Reality is insulting. Reality is harsh, cruel and uncaring. It will cripple you and put you in the ground regardless of virtue or vice. If you are lucky, you will die infirm half-blind: unlucky, in dreadful pain and fear. An adult copes with this: a child rails against it.
Obama told you a truth: a Britain post-Brexit would be deprioritised in favor of a larger EU. That will be true whether President Trump, Clinton, Cruz, Sanders, whoever, and will be true whether Russia, USA, China, whoever. Respect and attention come with power, not friendship, not culture, not history, just power: what can you do to me and what can you do for me?
Characterize it as an insult if you wish, declare your pride as you feel appropriate. But reality will not care one jot. Obama showed you what reality is: it will be hard
Respect and attention does come with power not friendship.
Which is why decades of the lapdog fawning of the British establishment towards the USA has only resulted in Britain being despised by American politicians.
Out of interest, do the junior doctors get paid while they are on strike?
No. Indeed they do not get paid if the strike covers any part of their shift, so if on a 0800- 2200 "long day" and the strike is 0800-1700 then they work 5 hours for the NHS for free.
I'm not in favour of the strikes, but it seems a little unfair to count whole shifts rather than hours. Not that anyone should be doing double shifts either of course.
That is a standard "long day" as on both current and new contracts. The hours are not optional on either, they are compulsory.
If you go to Chelsea Old Church, you will find the following monument, dated 1633
"To say a Stanley lies here, that alone were epitaph enough; no brass, no stone, no glorious tomb, no monumental hearse, no guilded trophy or lamp-laboured verse can dignify his grave or set it forth like the immortal fame of his own worth. Then, reader, fix not here, but quit this room and fly to Abraham's bosom - there's his tomb. There rests his soul, and for his other parts they are embalmed and lodged in good men's hearts. A braver monument of stone or lime, no art can raise, for this shall outlast time."
It is on the tomb of Robert Stanley, son of William Stanley, the Sixth Earl of Derby (1561-1642).
William Stanley was educated at St. John's College, Oxford and enrolled at both Grays Inn and Lincoln's Inn. His family was the most powerful in the north of England, "Kings of Lancashire" and legally also the Kings of the Isle of Man.
In his twenties he spent three years travelling Europe, visiting almost every place that appears in the "Shakespeare" plays. He was immensely wealthy and fanatical about the theatre, and actually owned the theatre troupes that put on the "Shakespeare" plays, Lord Strange's Men, Derby's Men.
William was the younger brother of Ferdinando, the Fifth Earl, who died suddenly and mysteriously in 1594, suspected of being murdered. Ferdinando was heir-presumptive to the English Throne, via his mother Margaret Clifford, under the will of Henry VIII.
William, thought to be sympathetic to Catholicism, was then touted as a possible successor by continental Catholics. Two letters from a Jesuit spy were discovered in the national archives in the 19th Century. The spy reported ruefully to his masters that the "the Earl of Derby is busied only in penning comedies for the common players..." One might ask, where are these plays?
Was lucky enough to see Prince Charles, Judi Dench, David Mellor and George Alagiah outside the RSC theatre in Stratford today.
I'm sorry that has to be the silliest post in the history of PB.
No one who sees/meets David Mellor can be considered lucky.
Are you speaking from experience ?
I've not had that pleasure. But I know someone who has, according to them, Mellor splits opinion. There are those who says Mellor deserves to be kicked in the balls all day long, whilst there are those that Mellor deserves to be kicked in the head all day long.
It isn't me who's screaming at the President of the United States or calling the PM a traitor (OK, it isn't you, either. But a lot of Brexiters are doing exactly that.)
The US will prioritise a trade deal with us if they think there's money in it for them. They'd prioritise a trade deal with Orpington if they thought there was money in it for them.
True...but that's just rephrasing what I said. ("Respect and attention come with power...what can you do to me and what can you do for me?") You can get whatever deal you like...provided you pay for it. And the shape of that deal will be shaped (ouch!) by the power and wealth of both parties.
But you're not getting the basic point. If there's money in it for them, there's minus money in it for us. That's basic arithmetic. The more keen they are to do it, the less keen we should be. I'd love to be at the back of the queue. Not in the queue at all would suit me.
I thought Obama was doing what Cameron wanted and what he told him to say.so surely Obama should caddy
I think its always been American policy for the UK to be within the EU as it puts a more pro-US Element into EU decision making while also increasing internal tensions within the EU.
What the USA has never wanted has been a united European superstate hostile to American interests. Having the UK within the EU is a good way of blocking that.
If that results in damaging the UK's own interests then that's something the US will not worry about.
In the early days of the EU some continental integrationists actually said that the EU should be a counterbalance to the USA.
Viewcode is having a bit of a Michael Douglas in 'Falling Down' moment
That's exactly wrong.
And I'll tell you why...
I have fond memories of that film. It was directed by Joel Schumacher before he became a joke and was part of Michael Douglas's "Angry White Man" trilogy - which to my despair does not have a Wikipedia article (Sunil!) - namely "Disclosure", "Basic Instinct" and "Falling Down", in which our hero encounters new aspects of 90's life - women in the workplace, homosexuality, the end of the Cold War - and attempts to deal with them, with varying success.
Contrary to popular belief, the protagonist of the film is Robert Duvall, the antagonist Douglas. Duvall plays a man subdued by life: an unsympathetic boss, an overanxious wife, a forced retirement to Arizona and the site of the relocated London Bridge (hence "London Bridge is Falling Down") yet finds the inner strength to cope with his troubles, realise that he loves his wife despite her shortcomings, defeats his boss ("Fuck you Captain, fuck you very much"), and wins. Douglas is similarly beset but acts irrationally and violently, eventually accepting his own destruction ("You mean I'm the bad guy?"). Duvall is the adult, Douglas the child.
My aria of the bleakness of reality was not to rail against it, but to describe and accept it - life is like that and always has been - and commend to LEAVE a similar acceptance of the nature of Brexit and (subtextually) transmit my hope that it promotes it despite its shortcomings, not by pretending that it has none.
I see Boris is unfamiliar with the expression...'When in a hole...':
Boris Johnson has launched an astonishing attack on Barack Obama's 'ridiculous and weird' arguments for Britain to stay in the EU. In an outspoken assault last night, the London Mayor mocked the US President's controversial claim that Anglo-US trade would be hit by Brexit.
Comments
But the piece overall should bring A New Hope to the Leavers
No one who sees/meets David Mellor can be considered lucky.
The US President walks into a country.
And tells everyone to "get to the back of the queue".
...
No it's not a joke. He really did.
What the USA has never wanted has been a united European superstate hostile to American interests. Having the UK within the EU is a good way of blocking that.
If that results in damaging the UK's own interests then that's something the US will not worry about.
Lots of Twitterers running with this now...
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/723965656643809280
Really? What did Trump say?
Which is why decades of the lapdog fawning of the British establishment towards the USA has only resulted in Britain being despised by American politicians.
Nathaniel Hawthorne used it while American Consul in Liverpool. He hated it, but then - he seemed to hate everyone and everything...
NEW THREAD NEW THREAD
And I'll tell you why...
I have fond memories of that film. It was directed by Joel Schumacher before he became a joke and was part of Michael Douglas's "Angry White Man" trilogy - which to my despair does not have a Wikipedia article (Sunil!) - namely "Disclosure", "Basic Instinct" and "Falling Down", in which our hero encounters new aspects of 90's life - women in the workplace, homosexuality, the end of the Cold War - and attempts to deal with them, with varying success.
Contrary to popular belief, the protagonist of the film is Robert Duvall, the antagonist Douglas. Duvall plays a man subdued by life: an unsympathetic boss, an overanxious wife, a forced retirement to Arizona and the site of the relocated London Bridge (hence "London Bridge is Falling Down") yet finds the inner strength to cope with his troubles, realise that he loves his wife despite her shortcomings, defeats his boss ("Fuck you Captain, fuck you very much"), and wins. Douglas is similarly beset but acts irrationally and violently, eventually accepting his own destruction ("You mean I'm the bad guy?"). Duvall is the adult, Douglas the child.
My aria of the bleakness of reality was not to rail against it, but to describe and accept it - life is like that and always has been - and commend to LEAVE a similar acceptance of the nature of Brexit and (subtextually) transmit my hope that it promotes it despite its shortcomings, not by pretending that it has none.
Boris Johnson has launched an astonishing attack on Barack Obama's 'ridiculous and weird' arguments for Britain to stay in the EU.
In an outspoken assault last night, the London Mayor mocked the US President's controversial claim that Anglo-US trade would be hit by Brexit.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3555600/Boris-rage-ridiculous-weird-Obama-Extraordinary-statement-MoS-mocks-President-trade-threats.html#ixzz46h56ejGA
Front Page Lead of the MoS.....