An interesting dilemma for Labour ... do they oppose Jezza when he talks about security and tried to lose even the most committed supporter, or do they shout him down and look like a divided party? I suspect the latter is less damaging.
The best option may be a shoot to kill policy on Jezza.
It seems to me that there was a certain degree of coordination in yesterday's questions designed to undermine Jezza. I think they're probably waiting for a trigger event to attempt a coup. Could be the Syria vote, or losing Oldham, but after yesterday I do think the end is likely to come quite soon. Certainly hope so.
What route do you see to the end? If Jeremy Corbyn doesn't want to go, how are his opponents going to make him? If he's directly challenged by the Parliamentary Labour Party, he'd explicitly run against them and in all probability win. If they try to exclude him from the ballot paper 1) they may not be able to 2) even if they're able to he may in practice get the necessary number of nominations 3) if they succeed in excluding him, the membership will correctly see this as a contempt for democracy.
I'm not sure the parliamentary party care too much if the Labour membership see such a move as contempt for democracy. They mass nominated Gordon Brown to the exclusion of all others, and imposed him as PM on the rest of us without any vote whatsoever.
The key thing is excluding him from the ballot paper.
Could Corbyn find 35 MPs to nominate him again, or just be stuck at his fan club of 20-25?
Michael Howard was imposed on Tory members without a vote by MPs after IDS
After IDS resigned. Correct me if I am wrong, this is supposed to be a betting site for experts on politics isn't it?
Those YouGov numbers have shifted A LOT - 22pt rise [to 49%] in those who want fewer or no refugees here, 16pt fall [to 20%] in those who think we should take more refugees.
Of course the Liberal Left are ignoring the fact that most polls on the 'refugee' issue have shown very clear support for the Cameron approach.
It's depressing to see use of idiotic Fox News terms like "liberal left" spreading here.
An interesting dilemma for Labour ... do they oppose Jezza when he talks about security and tried to lose even the most committed supporter, or do they shout him down and look like a divided party? I suspect the latter is less damaging.
The best option may be a shoot to kill policy on Jezza.
It seems to me that there was a certain degree of coordination in yesterday's questions designed to undermine Jezza. I think they're probably waiting for a trigger event to attempt a coup. Could be the Syria vote, or losing Oldham, but after yesterday I do think the end is likely to come quite soon. Certainly hope so.
What route do you see to the end? If Jeremy Corbyn doesn't want to go, how are his opponents going to make him? If he's directly challenged by the Parliamentary Labour Party, he'd explicitly run against them and in all probability win. If they try to exclude him from the ballot paper 1) they may not be able to 2) even if they're able to he may in practice get the necessary number of nominations 3) if they succeed in excluding him, the membership will correctly see this as a contempt for democracy.
I'm not sure the parliamentary party care too much if the Labour membership see such a move as contempt for democracy. They mass nominated Gordon Brown to the exclusion of all others, and imposed him as PM on the rest of us without any vote whatsoever.
The key thing is excluding him from the ballot paper.
Could Corbyn find 35 MPs to nominate him again, or just be stuck at his fan club of 20-25?
Michael Howard was imposed on Tory members without a vote by MPs after IDS
The issue may be timing. I believe the NEC are clarifying the rule so that sitting leader is automatically on ballot of members if someone stands against him or her. Currently there is a legal gap and it is unclear. I seem to recall reading that normally this kind of rule change would happen in the summer months just before conference, but NEC want to hurry it up. I wonder why.
I had a BF who had his back waxed. It looked bizarre as it stopped at the top of his shoulders and the fur carried on down the front/sides. When it went stubbly - it poked through his shirt - urgh urgh urgh.
In my dotage, I've decided to go for the witch look and let my hair grow - it's down to my backside now. I have the broomstick and cats - not keen on growing a wart though.
Miss Plato, not sure an angry-faced bald [well, shaved head] chap with a massive beard is a good look.
I'm mildly curious about how far it'd grow (never let it be more than a few days), but I really don't want a beard. Only Alan Rickman, Brian Blessed, and pirates can make beards work.
I'm the same -shaved on top to avoid a comb over. With a beard it looks like my hair fell through my skull. If I let my hair grow long it looks like it has slipped backwards.
ever see that Simpsons episode where Homer is shaving his shoulders? (I think he's even singing a little song about shaving his shoulders)
So, the BBC could see the red button service axed.
And F1 coverage. Well, maybe if they hadn't thrown away the exclusive rights and connived with pay TV to stop a terrestrial rival getting it I'd have more sympathy.
Will the executives be taking pay cuts? One suspects not.
Interesting that they think the ring leader was from a relatively privileged background who went to private schools. Not uncommon among revolutionary leaders including Che. Probably no better explanation than private schools pride themselves on teaching leadership
This is so common it is practically a truism (I discuss the phenomenon in Tom Knox's Genesis Secret). Rebels and revolutionaries, especially of the left, tend to come from the middle or upper middle classes. Practically all of the Khmer Rouge leadership was seriously bourgeois (they learned their Maoism as students in Paris, remember).
Bin Laden was the son of a billionaire, Trotsky was the child of prosperous farmers, Jeremy Corbyn was born in a seven bed house, etc.
In my dotage, I've decided to go for the witch look and let my hair grow - it's down to my backside now. I have the broomstick and cats - not keen on growing a wart though.
Miss Plato, not sure an angry-faced bald [well, shaved head] chap with a massive beard is a good look.
I'm mildly curious about how far it'd grow (never let it be more than a few days), but I really don't want a beard. Only Alan Rickman, Brian Blessed, and pirates can make beards work.
I'm the same -shaved on top to avoid a comb over. With a beard it looks like my hair fell through my skull. If I let my hair grow long it looks like it has slipped backwards.
A witch? Then you have the final qualification necessary as ... a) a woman and a) a person of objective views ... to stand as leader of the Labour Party (when a vacancy arrises)
Miss Plato, not sure an angry-faced* bald [well, shaved head] chap with a massive beard is a good look.
I'm mildly curious about how far it'd grow (never let it be more than a few days), but I really don't want a beard. Only Alan Rickman, Brian Blessed, and pirates can make beards work.
Edited extra bit: *for context, at university three separate people said I looked like a psychopath/serial killer within my first few weeks there,
Sean Connery had success with a beard and male pattern baldness.
Interesting that they think the ring leader was from a relatively privileged background who went to private schools. Not uncommon among revolutionary leaders including Che. Probably no better explanation than private schools pride themselves on teaching leadership
This is so common it is practically a truism (I discuss the phenomenon in Tom Knox's Genesis Secret). Rebels and revolutionaries, especially of the left, tend to come from the middle or upper middle classes. Practically all of the Khmer Rouge leadership was seriously bourgeois (they learned their Maoism as students in Paris, remember).
Bin Laden was the son of a billionaire, Trotsky was the child of prosperous farmers, Jeremy Corbyn was born in a seven bed house, etc.
A mobile phone found in a bin outside the Bataclan led French police to the hotel appartment in Alfortville where Salah Abdeslam, the suspected "eighth terrorist", is believed to have stayed for the two nights before last Friday's attacks.
You do realise that you sound like one of the enemy within, continually denigrating the armed forces, government and security services for not doing a good enough job with poorly maintained equipment?
Miss Plato, not sure an angry-faced* bald [well, shaved head] chap with a massive beard is a good look.
I'm mildly curious about how far it'd grow (never let it be more than a few days), but I really don't want a beard. Only Alan Rickman, Brian Blessed, and pirates can make beards work.
Edited extra bit: *for context, at university three separate people said I looked like a psychopath/serial killer within my first few weeks there,
Sean Connery had success with a beard and male pattern baldness.
By then he was also a world star as 007. He made Zardoz. Who has made more bad movies - Sean Connery or Michael Caine?
A mobile phone found in a bin outside the Bataclan led French police to the hotel appartment in Alfortville where Salah Abdeslam, the suspected "eighth terrorist", is believed to have stayed for the two nights before last Friday's attacks.
They have multiple mobile phones - it was announced yesterday
So, the BBC could see the red button service axed.
And F1 coverage. Well, maybe if they hadn't thrown away the exclusive rights and connived with pay TV to stop a terrestrial rival getting it I'd have more sympathy.
Will the executives be taking pay cuts? One suspects not.
If the Argies had any sense they'd invade Los Malvinas again now, Cameron would huff and puff and do nothing.
Without an effective Navy what could he do? We haven’t got the ships we had in 1982, and it’s a long way from any substantial air-bases. Unless I’m much mistaken.
Unlike 30 years ago, the Falklands are defended now.
There are 3-4 advanced fighter jets, a destroyer, a company of infantry and decent logistics and signals support.
It'd be enough to severely disrupt or stall anything but a truly serious landing. The thinking is that there'd be sufficient warning at 72+ hours to reinforce Mount Pleasant if needed.
The true vulnerability would be a surprise attack to take out the airbase and, in particular, cripple its runway.
Once the aircraft carriers come online with planes (hopefully) in 2019/2020 that should be slightly less of a concern.
The carriers would only be good for retaking them. A carrier deployed to the middle East cannot defend the South Atlantic. The destroyer on station is an air defence T45. It can track and attack scores of targets at once. We also have a hunter killer submarine which can sink troopships, a single sinking would cause totally unacceptable losses for Argentina. As it is Argentina has no effective navy no effective army and no effective air force. And no economy to speak of. All a bit like the UK under a corbynista régime.
You do realise that you sound like one of the enemy within, continually denigrating the armed forces, government and security services for not doing a good enough job with poorly maintained equipment?
Thanks for attempting to put words in my mouth.
This govt has cut spending on both the armed forces and police, something I absolutely disagree with. The poorly maintained equipment is purely down to this govt. And now the chump is sitting on his hands and singing le Marseillaise.
I wonder if the pb tories think the late Mrs Thatcher would have done the same.
Interesting that they think the ring leader was from a relatively privileged background who went to private schools. Not uncommon among revolutionary leaders including Che. Probably no better explanation than private schools pride themselves on teaching leadership
This is so common it is practically a truism (I discuss the phenomenon in Tom Knox's Genesis Secret). Rebels and revolutionaries, especially of the left, tend to come from the middle or upper middle classes. Practically all of the Khmer Rouge leadership was seriously bourgeois (they learned their Maoism as students in Paris, remember).
Bin Laden was the son of a billionaire, Trotsky was the child of prosperous farmers, Jeremy Corbyn was born in a seven bed house, etc.
Bin Laden was an aristocrat. In fact the most successful revolutionaries in history were slave-owning Virginian aristocrats.
Those YouGov numbers have shifted A LOT - 22pt rise [to 49%] in those who want fewer or no refugees here, 16pt fall [to 20%] in those who think we should take more refugees.
Of course the Liberal Left are ignoring the fact that most polls on the 'refugee' issue have shown very clear support for the Cameron approach.
It's depressing to see use of idiotic Fox News terms like "liberal left" spreading here.
Nerve hit. Good.
Yes, it is pleasing to see "liberal left" entering our lexicon as a pejorative. It's a nice catch-all phrase for these vain, feeble, whining, bien pensant scumbags.
Hey SeanT. Saw a poster for your book at Victoria station this week.
I did speculate that the Paris attacks would make people aware of the need for more european solidarity.
More gunfire in Paris St Denis. Relates to a police raid it seems.
You think Frau Merkel will stop inviting the Middle East to come and stay ?
Right now it looks like none of the Paris attackers were Syrian refugees as those passports have turned out to be fakes. All seem to have been living in Europe as citizens of their country.
Did they not use those passports to gain access to Europe?
Right now it seems the Parisian terrorists are not refugees, they are - some of them - FAKE refugees who bought Syrian passports, knowing that Syrians were being welcomed with open bingo-wing arms by Frau Merkel, so they could easily cross into Europe undetected.
The passports are possibly fake, and probably swapped hands in Turkey.
I thought the Parisian terrorists were - all or at least mostly - home grown.
Mr. Owls, F1 adds a billion pounds a year to the UK economy. Most teams are based here, which also means substantial numbers of people employed down the supply chain, as well as those employed directly. It's important the UK maintains strong interest in the sport.
I do agree, however, that the Judas Iscariot approach adopted to coverage a few years ago means sympathy for the BBC will be minimal.
You do realise that you sound like one of the enemy within, continually denigrating the armed forces, government and security services for not doing a good enough job with poorly maintained equipment?
Thanks for attempting to put words in my mouth.
This govt has cut spending on both the armed forces and police, something I absolutely disagree with. The poorly maintained equipment is purely down to this govt. And now the chump is sitting on his hands and singing le Marseillaise.
I wonder if the pb tories think the late Mrs Thatcher would have done the same.
The active kit is very well maintained. But keep denigrating those who work on it, if it makes you feel any better.
If it wasn't that people have pitifully short memories REMAIN would be nailed on certainties. I'm sure there's never been a time when European solidarity has been as solid.
For those on the 'remain' side it's time to consolidate.
It must be clear to everyone how vital European solidarity is now we have this common enemy
What solidarity? I will start with one rather large European nation and supposedly a key ally of France.
Mr. Owls, F1 adds a billion pounds a year to the UK economy. Most teams are based here, which also means substantial numbers of people employed down the supply chain, as well as those employed directly. It's important the UK maintains strong interest in the sport.
I do agree, however, that the Judas Iscariot approach adopted to coverage a few years ago means sympathy for the BBC will be minimal.
If you're an F1 fan you'll watch it whatever station it's on. It used to be on Speed here. Then NBC Sports Network got the rights. They signed the Speed commentary team and other than the channel number (and all the free practices are shown) it's exactly the same.So whether it's on Sky, Eurosport or Discovery, you can still watch it.
You do realise that you sound like one of the enemy within, continually denigrating the armed forces, government and security services for not doing a good enough job with poorly maintained equipment?
Thanks for attempting to put words in my mouth.
This govt has cut spending on both the armed forces and police, something I absolutely disagree with. The poorly maintained equipment is purely down to this govt. And now the chump is sitting on his hands and singing le Marseillaise.
I wonder if the pb tories think the late Mrs Thatcher would have done the same.
As I said earlier we spend the fifth highest amount on the military in the world and as others have said the active equipment is very well maintained and the active personnel very well trained. Keep denigrating them all you like but that's the truth.
An interesting dilemma for Labour ... do they oppose Jezza when he talks about security and tried to lose even the most committed supporter, or do they shout him down and look like a divided party? I suspect the latter is less damaging.
The best option may be a shoot to kill policy on Jezza.
It seems to me that there was a certain degree of coordination in yesterday's questions designed to undermine Jezza. I think they're probably waiting for a trigger event to attempt a coup. Could be the Syria vote, or losing Oldham, but after yesterday I do think the end is likely to come quite soon. Certainly hope so.
What route do you see to the end? If Jeremy Corbyn doesn't want to go, how are his opponents going to make him? If he's directly challenged by the Parliamentary Labour Party, he'd explicitly run against them and in all probability win. If they try to exclude him from the ballot paper 1) they may not be able to 2) even if they're able to he may in practice get the necessary number of nominations 3) if they succeed in excluding him, the membership will correctly see this as a contempt for democracy.
I'm not sure the parliamentary party care too much if the Labour membership see such a move as contempt for democracy. They mass nominated Gordon Brown to the exclusion of all others, and imposed him as PM on the rest of us without any vote whatsoever.
The key thing is excluding him from the ballot paper.
Could Corbyn find 35 MPs to nominate him again, or just be stuck at his fan club of 20-25?
Michael Howard was imposed on Tory members without a vote by MPs after IDS
After IDS resigned. Correct me if I am wrong, this is supposed to be a betting site for experts on politics isn't it?
The GOPers set their press pack wifi access password as StopHillary - to which the Dems responded with the username 13MillionNewJobs - but password free as Dems believed in access for all...so the GOP responded that confirmed the Dems were weak on security.
You do realise that you sound like one of the enemy within, continually denigrating the armed forces, government and security services for not doing a good enough job with poorly maintained equipment?
Thanks for attempting to put words in my mouth.
This govt has cut spending on both the armed forces and police, something I absolutely disagree with. The poorly maintained equipment is purely down to this govt. And now the chump is sitting on his hands and singing le Marseillaise.
I wonder if the pb tories think the late Mrs Thatcher would have done the same.
As I said earlier we spend the fifth highest amount on the military in the world and as others have said the active equipment is very well maintained and the active personnel very well trained. Keep denigrating them all you like but that's the truth.
Correct. Mr Blackburn should remember that the Falklands were invaded under Mrs Thatcher. The memory he invokes is one of determination to correct her mistake. Mrs Thatcher deserves credit for that and for persisting with the confrontation with the soviet union over nuclear disarmament. But its not the credit he tries to pretend it is.
The GOPers set their press pack wifi access password as StopHillary - to which the Dems responded with the username 13MillionNewJobs - but password free as Dems believed in access for all...so the GOP responded that confirmed the Dems were weak on security.
If it wasn't that people have pitifully short memories REMAIN would be nailed on certainties. I'm sure there's never been a time when European solidarity has been as solid.
For those on the 'remain' side it's time to consolidate.
It must be clear to everyone how vital European solidarity is now we have this common enemy
What solidarity? I will start with one rather large European nation and supposedly a key ally of France.
Germany.
I think people are confusing EU solidarity with normal human emotions such as compassion which is something felt globally. The Little European Unioner mentality can be witnessed here this morning.
If the Argies had any sense they'd invade Los Malvinas again now, Cameron would huff and puff and do nothing.
They could try. They'd probably fail.
I love the way so many people on the left and right of politics are so keen to dismiss our military capabilities: the left because they don't want them, and the right because they don't think they're good enough.
Well said. Our forces are from memory the fourth largest in the world by funding and unlike three decades ago there is a permanent base in and around the Falklands that a tinpot nation will need to get past.
Looked it up. Current defence forces should be enough to deter the Argies, should they be thinking of trying again.
Also we have been making continued investments in our armed forces, while the Argentinians are still using similar tech as 30 years ago. Just one of our type 45 destroyers could take down the combined air force of all the countries in South America.
And, for that matter, the fleet we sent south in 1982. There really is a lot of nonsense talked about this. We don't have enough kit, enough men or enough logistical capability. It adversely affects our flexibility and capability to intervene where we might want to. But what we do have is world class, probably only the US can match it.
An interesting dilemma for Labour ... do they oppose Jezza when he talks about security and tried to lose even the most committed supporter, or do they shout him down and look like a divided party? I suspect the latter is less damaging.
The best option may be a shoot to kill policy on Jezza.
It seems to me that there was a certain degree of coordination in yesterday's questions designed to undermine Jezza. I think they're probably waiting for a trigger event to attempt a coup. Could be the Syria vote, or losing Oldham, but after yesterday I do think the end is likely to come quite soon. Certainly hope so.
What route do you see to the end? If Jeremy Corbyn doesn't want to go, how are his opponents going to make him? If he's directly challenged by the Parliamentary Labour Party, he'd explicitly run against them and in all probability win. If they try to exclude him from the ballot paper 1) they may not be able to 2) even if they're able to he may in practice get the necessary number of nominations 3) if they succeed in excluding him, the membership will correctly see this as a contempt for democracy.
I'm not sure the parliamentary party care too much if the Labour membership see such a move as contempt for democracy. They mass nominated Gordon Brown to the exclusion of all others, and imposed him as PM on the rest of us without any vote whatsoever.
The key thing is excluding him from the ballot paper.
Could Corbyn find 35 MPs to nominate him again, or just be stuck at his fan club of 20-25?
Michael Howard was imposed on Tory members without a vote by MPs after IDS
If it wasn't that people have pitifully short memories REMAIN would be nailed on certainties. I'm sure there's never been a time when European solidarity has been as solid.
For those on the 'remain' side it's time to consolidate.
It must be clear to everyone how vital European solidarity is now we have this common enemy
What solidarity? I will start with one rather large European nation and supposedly a key ally of France.
Germany.
I think people are confusing EU solidarity with normal human emotions such as compassion which is something felt globally. The Little European Unioner mentality can be witnessed here this morning.
A problem for LEAVE is that a lot of people, and media sources, mistake 'EU' for 'Europe'... The BBC do it quite often, I wouldn't know whether it is deliberate or not
If the Argies had any sense they'd invade Los Malvinas again now, Cameron would huff and puff and do nothing.
Without an effective Navy what could he do? We haven’t got the ships we had in 1982, and it’s a long way from any substantial air-bases. Unless I’m much mistaken.
Unlike 30 years ago, the Falklands are defended now.
There are 3-4 advanced fighter jets, a destroyer, a company of infantry and decent logistics and signals support.
It'd be enough to severely disrupt or stall anything but a truly serious landing. The thinking is that there'd be sufficient warning at 72+ hours to reinforce Mount Pleasant if needed.
The true vulnerability would be a surprise attack to take out the airbase and, in particular, cripple its runway.
Once the aircraft carriers come online with planes (hopefully) in 2019/2020 that should be slightly less of a concern.
The carriers would only be good for retaking them. A carrier deployed to the middle East cannot defend the South Atlantic. The destroyer on station is an air defence T45. It can track and attack scores of targets at once. We also have a hunter killer submarine which can sink troopships, a single sinking would cause totally unacceptable losses for Argentina. As it is Argentina has no effective navy no effective army and no effective air force. And no economy to speak of. All a bit like the UK under a corbynista régime.
Yes, that's my point. If the UK has a credible ability to retake the Falklands then that itself is a deterrent to invading them.
If it did happen (on a small scale) we just might be able to do something about it, although I suspect it would require all hands to the pump and the call up of reservists.
Worth noting that the new airport on St. Helena would also help.
An interesting dilemma for Labour ... do they oppose Jezza when he talks about security and tried to lose even the most committed supporter, or do they shout him down and look like a divided party? I suspect the latter is less damaging.
The best option may be a shoot to kill policy on Jezza.
It seems to me that there was a certain degree of coordination in yesterday's questions designed to undermine Jezza. I think they're probably waiting for a trigger event to attempt a coup. Could be the Syria vote, or losing Oldham, but after yesterday I do think the end is likely to come quite soon. Certainly hope so.
What route do you see to the end? If Jeremy Corbyn doesn't want to go, how are his opponents going to make him? If he's directly challenged by the Parliamentary Labour Party, he'd explicitly run against them and in all probability win. If they try to exclude him from the ballot paper 1) they may not be able to 2) even if they're able to he may in practice get the necessary number of nominations 3) if they succeed in excluding him, the membership will correctly see this as a contempt for democracy.
I'm not sure the parliamentary party care too much if the Labour membership see such a move as contempt for democracy. They mass nominated Gordon Brown to the exclusion of all others, and imposed him as PM on the rest of us without any vote whatsoever.
The key thing is excluding him from the ballot paper.
Could Corbyn find 35 MPs to nominate him again, or just be stuck at his fan club of 20-25?
Dear oh dear. He will not need nominating. He is the incumbent. But let us suppose the parliamentary party did find some subterfuge to remove him, what effect will that have on the membership? They will go ape. Labour are split. Who would replace Corbyn? The normal factionalism within Labour would only return. Labour dug themselves a big hole and then fell in it.
Corbyn needs to stay until 2020 because the Stop the War Coalition' need him there so they can deselect their opponents in the PLP and get their own people in. Corbyn was not elected by the PLP. Him being leader is none of their business. If the PLP is down to 200 the STWC do not care. They have a golden opportunity to control the labour party.
Is the incumbent leader automatically renominated, or does it require 35 MPs to put their names to a form?
Mr. Royale, it was said earlier in the thread that the NEC are looking to tighten this up so that it's clear the incumbent is automatically on the ballot.
An interesting dilemma for Labour ... do they oppose Jezza when he talks about security and tried to lose even the most committed supporter, or do they shout him down and look like a divided party? I suspect the latter is less damaging.
The best option may be a shoot to kill policy on Jezza.
It seems to me that there was a certain degree of coordination in yesterday's questions designed to undermine Jezza. I think they're probably waiting for a trigger event to attempt a coup. Could be the Syria vote, or losing Oldham, but after yesterday I do think the end is likely to come quite soon. Certainly hope so.
What route do you see to the end? If Jeremy Corbyn doesn't want to go, how are his opponents going to make him? If he's directly challenged by the Parliamentary Labour Party, he'd explicitly run against them and in all probability win. If they try to exclude him from the ballot paper 1) they may not be able to 2) even if they're able to he may in practice get the necessary number of nominations 3) if they succeed in excluding him, the membership will correctly see this as a contempt for democracy.
I'm not sure the parliamentary party care too much if the Labour membership see such a move as contempt for democracy. They mass nominated Gordon Brown to the exclusion of all others, and imposed him as PM on the rest of us without any vote whatsoever.
The key thing is excluding him from the ballot paper.
Could Corbyn find 35 MPs to nominate him again, or just be stuck at his fan club of 20-25?
Dear oh dear. He will not need nominating. He is the incumbent. But let us suppose the parliamentary party did find some subterfuge to remove him, what effect will that have on the membership? They will go ape. Labour are split. Who would replace Corbyn? The normal factionalism within Labour would only return. Labour dug themselves a big hole and then fell in it.
Corbyn needs to stay until 2020 because the Stop the War Coalition' need him there so they can deselect their opponents in the PLP and get their own people in. Corbyn was not elected by the PLP. Him being leader is none of their business. If the PLP is down to 200 the STWC do not care. They have a golden opportunity to control the labour party.
Is the incumbent leader automatically renominated, or does it require 35 MPs to put their names to a form?
That is apparently unclear from the wording, hence my point 1. It hasn't mattered previously.
An interesting dilemma for Labour ... do they oppose Jezza when he talks about security and tried to lose even the most committed supporter, or do they shout him down and look like a divided party? I suspect the latter is less damaging.
The best option may be a shoot to kill policy on Jezza.
It seems to me that there was a certain degree of coordination in yesterday's questions designed to undermine Jezza. I think they're probably waiting for a trigger event to attempt a coup. Could be the Syria vote, or losing Oldham, but after yesterday I do think the end is likely to come quite soon. Certainly hope so.
I'm not sure the parliamentary party care too much if the Labour membership see such a move as contempt for democracy. They mass nominated Gordon Brown to the exclusion of all others, and imposed him as PM on the rest of us without any vote whatsoever.
The key thing is excluding him from the ballot paper.
Could Corbyn find 35 MPs to nominate him again, or just be stuck at his fan club of 20-25?
Dear oh dear. He will not need nominating. He is the incumbent. But let us suppose the parliamentary party did find some subterfuge to remove him, what effect will that have on the membership? They will go ape. Labour are split. Who would replace Corbyn? The normal factionalism within Labour would only return. Labour dug themselves a big hole and then fell in it.
Corbyn needs to stay until 2020 because the Stop the War Coalition' need him there so they can deselect their opponents in the PLP and get their own people in. Corbyn was not elected by the PLP. Him being leader is none of their business. If the PLP is down to 200 the STWC do not care. They have a golden opportunity to control the labour party.
Is the incumbent leader automatically renominated, or does it require 35 MPs to put their names to a form?
That is apparently unclear from the wording, hence my point 1. It hasn't mattered previously.
Think this is an issue you can go around in circles over.
If he's on the ballot, he'll probably win again. If he's not, then that'll split the party.
Removing Corbyn if he doesn't want to go is not going to be an easy thing at all.
Those YouGov numbers have shifted A LOT - 22pt rise [to 49%] in those who want fewer or no refugees here, 16pt fall [to 20%] in those who think we should take more refugees.
Of course the Liberal Left are ignoring the fact that most polls on the 'refugee' issue have shown very clear support for the Cameron approach.
It's depressing to see use of idiotic Fox News terms like "liberal left" spreading here.
Nerve hit. Good.
Yes, it is pleasing to see "liberal left" entering our lexicon as a pejorative. It's a nice catch-all phrase for these vain, feeble, whining, bien pensant scumbags.
In my experience, friends of mine who post this bilge on Facebook seem to be far more circumspect, equivocal and reflective in the pub over a beer.
It might just be (sorry.. values signalling) or it might be them being polite in person, because they hold different views to me and don't want to forcefully say so to my face. But even if it's true that they have reservations and doubts over some of the standard shibboleths of the Left their reticence to go public with it is part of the problem. They certainly don't want to be the ones saying so out loud.
I agree - they are almost all successful middle-class graduates in London and the south-east.
PMQ's should be interesting today, that's if Corbyn shows up. I have to go out, so will see it on iPlayer later. Hope you guys leave a good commentary.
If it wasn't that people have pitifully short memories REMAIN would be nailed on certainties. I'm sure there's never been a time when European solidarity has been as solid.
For those on the 'remain' side it's time to consolidate.
It must be clear to everyone how vital European solidarity is now we have this common enemy
What solidarity? I will start with one rather large European nation and supposedly a key ally of France.
Germany.
I think people are confusing EU solidarity with normal human emotions such as compassion which is something felt globally. The Little European Unioner mentality can be witnessed here this morning.
The BOOers were saying how these attacks would help Leave. Just pointing out (and borne out in this poll) that many feel the opposite.
So if the Nats white paper was known to be fibs by the writers, will the LDs be launching 56 suits against them as this clearly swayed the GE results in Scotland ?
So if the Nats white paper was known to be fibs by the writers, will the LDs be launching 56 suits against them as this clearly swayed the GE results in Scotland ?
So if the Nats white paper was known to be fibs by the writers, will the LDs be launching 56 suits against them as this clearly swayed the GE results in Scotland ?
If it wasn't that people have pitifully short memories REMAIN would be nailed on certainties. I'm sure there's never been a time when European solidarity has been as solid.
For those on the 'remain' side it's time to consolidate.
It must be clear to everyone how vital European solidarity is now we have this common enemy
What solidarity? I will start with one rather large European nation and supposedly a key ally of France.
Germany.
I think people are confusing EU solidarity with normal human emotions such as compassion which is something felt globally. The Little European Unioner mentality can be witnessed here this morning.
A problem for LEAVE is that a lot of people, and media sources, mistake 'EU' for 'Europe'... The BBC do it quite often, I wouldn't know whether it is deliberate or not
A lot of Leavers (I'm think about AEP at the Telegraph in particular) make the same mistake.
Mr. Royale, it was said earlier in the thread that the NEC are looking to tighten this up so that it's clear the incumbent is automatically on the ballot.
So we're left with three options: (1) orchestrate a mass resignation of the Labour frontbench and make leading the Labour Party so impossible or unpleasant for Corbyn that he's forced to resign (2) Split away in mass block in parliament and form a new party (3) spend the next four years continuing to grumble, shout and moan, with increasing indignation, leaking to the media, and publicly disagreeing with him, and hope he just goes away and the Labour members change their minds about him.
No bets being accepted by me on which one Labour MPs will pick.
Mr. Royale, it was said earlier in the thread that the NEC are looking to tighten this up so that it's clear the incumbent is automatically on the ballot.
So we're left with three options: (1) orchestrate a mass resignation of the Labour frontbench and make leading the Labour Party so impossible or unpleasant for Corbyn that he's forced to resign (2) Split away in mass block in parliament and form a new party (3) spend the next four years continuing to grumble, shout and moan, with increasing indignation, leaking to the media, and publicly disagreeing with him, and hope he just goes away and the Labour members change their minds about him.
No bets being accepted by me on which one Labour MPs will pick.
In other news, while Sky were live in Paris this morning broadcasting explosions and gunfire, the BBC were showing the status of London tube services, followed by the local weather...
In other news, while Sky were live in Paris this morning broadcasting explosions and gunfire, the BBC were showing the status of London tube services, followed by the local weather...
You forgot to mention the BBC interview with Duran Duran.
So if the Nats white paper was known to be fibs by the writers, will the LDs be launching 56 suits against them as this clearly swayed the GE results in Scotland ?
Mr. Royale, it was said earlier in the thread that the NEC are looking to tighten this up so that it's clear the incumbent is automatically on the ballot.
So we're left with three options: (1) orchestrate a mass resignation of the Labour frontbench and make leading the Labour Party so impossible or unpleasant for Corbyn that he's forced to resign (2) Split away in mass block in parliament and form a new party (3) spend the next four years continuing to grumble, shout and moan, with increasing indignation, leaking to the media, and publicly disagreeing with him, and hope he just goes away and the Labour members change their minds about him.
No bets being accepted by me on which one Labour MPs will pick.
Ooh that's tricky. It can only be 1 or 2 .
They may follow 3 until about a year from the election when it's clear they will lose their seat. However by then they will probably have been deselected by the boundary changes anyway.
In other news, while Sky were live in Paris this morning broadcasting explosions and gunfire, the BBC were showing the status of London tube services, followed by the local weather...
You forgot to mention the BBC interview with Duran Duran.
In other news, while Sky were live in Paris this morning broadcasting explosions and gunfire, the BBC were showing the status of London tube services, followed by the local weather...
BBC World News has been covering the raid quite well. The were the first to report that police dog Diesel had been killed.
In other news, while Sky were live in Paris this morning broadcasting explosions and gunfire, the BBC were showing the status of London tube services, followed by the local weather...
You forgot to mention the BBC interview with Duran Duran.
Police raids in Paris suburb - woman blows herself up 5 arrested. The BBC also reports the name of the police dog killed in the raids
Mr. Owls, F1 adds a billion pounds a year to the UK economy. Most teams are based here, which also means substantial numbers of people employed down the supply chain, as well as those employed directly. It's important the UK maintains strong interest in the sport.
I do agree, however, that the Judas Iscariot approach adopted to coverage a few years ago means sympathy for the BBC will be minimal.
Not that I am for a moment suggesting any other read across, but the arguments you make in support of F1 were made in support of slavery and ensured that massive compensation was paid to slave owners on abolition. F1 would be a lot more interesting if the best cars started at the back instead of reinforcing F1's present processional nature.
In other news, while Sky were live in Paris this morning broadcasting explosions and gunfire, the BBC were showing the status of London tube services, followed by the local weather...
You forgot to mention the BBC interview with Duran Duran.
I have CNN, BBC World News and Fox News on split screen. Occasionally Fox will go to 'our sister network' Sky News for a report.
Mr. Royale, it was said earlier in the thread that the NEC are looking to tighten this up so that it's clear the incumbent is automatically on the ballot.
So we're left with three options: (1) orchestrate a mass resignation of the Labour frontbench and make leading the Labour Party so impossible or unpleasant for Corbyn that he's forced to resign (2) Split away in mass block in parliament and form a new party (3) spend the next four years continuing to grumble, shout and moan, with increasing indignation, leaking to the media, and publicly disagreeing with him, and hope he just goes away and the Labour members change their minds about him.
No bets being accepted by me on which one Labour MPs will pick.
Ooh that's tricky. It can only be 1 or 2 .
For a start they need to say they want a change in the rules for re-electing the leader. But when a party's activists are so stupid, what do they expect to happen?
In other news, while Sky were live in Paris this morning broadcasting explosions and gunfire, the BBC were showing the status of London tube services, followed by the local weather...
You forgot to mention the BBC interview with Duran Duran.
I have CNN, BBC World News and Fox News on split screen. Occasionally Fox will go to 'our sister network' Sky News for a report.
Turkish police say they have detained eight Islamic State suspects who they claim were bound for Germany, BBC Monitoring reports.
The Istanbul counter-terrorism squad says eight Moroccans were detained at the city's airport after they arrived from Casablanca and their story of being tourists with an Istanbul hotel booking did not check out.
A document found on one of the suspects reportedly shows a planned route to Germany through the Turkish city of Izmir, Greece, Serbia and Hungary, Anatolia news agency says.
F1's current problems are many. The aero issue may be reduced due to new wider front wings and narrower rear wings. Finance and governance need sorting. More than half the grid's struggling, and that's unacceptable. They also need to stop shedding good circuits for lucrative but tedious processional street circuits.
The engine gaps are excessive. If Ferrari can't compete next year, rules may need to be changed (there's some talk of a 'neutral' engine in 2017, but that may be just a negotiating tactic by Ecclestone and the FIA).
In other news, while Sky were live in Paris this morning broadcasting explosions and gunfire, the BBC were showing the status of London tube services, followed by the local weather...
You forgot to mention the BBC interview with Duran Duran.
ITV's report last night after the football with Tom Bradby was excellent I thought. Made it clear that Putin was explicitly going after IS now for the jet.
In other news, while Sky were live in Paris this morning broadcasting explosions and gunfire, the BBC were showing the status of London tube services, followed by the local weather...
You forgot to mention the BBC interview with Duran Duran.
Police raids in Paris suburb - woman blows herself up 5 arrested. The BBC also reports the name of the police dog killed in the raids
Diesel, a Belgian Shepherd. All the other police dogs were German Shepherds. As one who lives with a German Shepherd (her name is Heidi) on hearing that Diesel wasn't a GSD I felt relieved, then felt guilty for feeling relieved.
Diesel's family will be missing a family member tonight. I feel for them.
There's no way replacement nuclear power will be in place for 2025. We're heading for brownouts and a much greater dependency on the import of gas, with all the volality that implies.
In other news, while Sky were live in Paris this morning broadcasting explosions and gunfire, the BBC were showing the status of London tube services, followed by the local weather...
You forgot to mention the BBC interview with Duran Duran.
I have CNN, BBC World News and Fox News on split screen. Occasionally Fox will go to 'our sister network' Sky News for a report.
"There are Africans, Algerians, Indians, Chinese, Turkish and many more people from different backgrounds living in the area. The majority of the population is in “sans-papiers” status - meaning they do not yet have a legal status and an ID which would allow them to find a job."
That would be long hand for there a lot of illegal immigrants living there.
Comments
Correct me if I am wrong, this is supposed to be a betting site for experts on politics isn't it?
Here he is treating Mike Catt as a door mat:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPMZrPjW5cs
And F1 coverage. Well, maybe if they hadn't thrown away the exclusive rights and connived with pay TV to stop a terrestrial rival getting it I'd have more sympathy.
Will the executives be taking pay cuts? One suspects not.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-34851369
Cameron: Corbyn won't shoot to kill.
Corbyn: at least I'm honest, what are you doing?
a) a woman
and
a) a person of objective views
... to stand as leader of the Labour Party (when a vacancy arrises)
Mr. T, not sure I agree. Liberal is a good counter to authoritarian. Or should be.
The BBC is clearly being marginalized and IMO it deserves whatever is coming its way.
The destroyer on station is an air defence T45. It can track and attack scores of targets at once.
We also have a hunter killer submarine which can sink troopships, a single sinking would cause totally unacceptable losses for Argentina.
As it is Argentina has no effective navy no effective army and no effective air force. And no economy to speak of.
All a bit like the UK under a corbynista régime.
This govt has cut spending on both the armed forces and police, something I absolutely disagree with. The poorly maintained equipment is purely down to this govt. And now the chump is sitting on his hands and singing le Marseillaise.
I wonder if the pb tories think the late Mrs Thatcher would have done the same.
I do agree, however, that the Judas Iscariot approach adopted to coverage a few years ago means sympathy for the BBC will be minimal.
Germany.
The GOPers set their press pack wifi access password as StopHillary - to which the Dems responded with the username 13MillionNewJobs - but password free as Dems believed in access for all...so the GOP responded that confirmed the Dems were weak on security.
Childish but rather fun.
I would have posted but...
Mr Blackburn should remember that the Falklands were invaded under Mrs Thatcher. The memory he invokes is one of determination to correct her mistake. Mrs Thatcher deserves credit for that and for persisting with the confrontation with the soviet union over nuclear disarmament. But its not the credit he tries to pretend it is.
I was surprised 'no booking' wasn't odds on. Coral were 4/9 under 3 bookings!!! That was free money
If it did happen (on a small scale) we just might be able to do something about it, although I suspect it would require all hands to the pump and the call up of reservists.
Worth noting that the new airport on St. Helena would also help.
Forensic teams have now moved into the apartment, so it looks like the shooting might be over.
If he's on the ballot, he'll probably win again.
If he's not, then that'll split the party.
Removing Corbyn if he doesn't want to go is not going to be an easy thing at all.
It might just be (sorry.. values signalling) or it might be them being polite in person, because they hold different views to me and don't want to forcefully say so to my face. But even if it's true that they have reservations and doubts over some of the standard shibboleths of the Left their reticence to go public with it is part of the problem. They certainly don't want to be the ones saying so out loud.
I agree - they are almost all successful middle-class graduates in London and the south-east.
By @JohnJCrace
https://t.co/4tiSOigunI https://t.co/AsT7FAtt7m
RIP Diesel.
https://t.co/AVEz6o4ffN
Innocent face.
No bets being accepted by me on which one Labour MPs will pick.
*cough*Yentob*cough*
I will play an extravagant leave
(post-Cameron speech)
Remain 43% (-3)
Leave 38% (-)
Don't know 19% (+3)
#EURef @UKandEU
LOL
New kinder politics indeed.
[Kinder = children].
The BBC also reports the name of the police dog killed in the raids
@carolewalkercw: Aides to Maria Eagle deny she is considering resigning over Ken Livingstone's appointment to Trident review
If she had any gumption she would of course resign.
But she won't
Maria Eagle learned of Ken Livingstone's Trident appointment on Twitter and is so angry she is considering position
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/defence/12002379/Jeremy-Corbyn-ally-Ken-Livingstone-to-lead-Labours-Trident-review.html …
Th new politics.
Turkish police say they have detained eight Islamic State suspects who they claim were bound for Germany, BBC Monitoring reports.
The Istanbul counter-terrorism squad says eight Moroccans were detained at the city's airport after they arrived from Casablanca and their story of being tourists with an Istanbul hotel booking did not check out.
A document found on one of the suspects reportedly shows a planned route to Germany through the Turkish city of Izmir, Greece, Serbia and Hungary, Anatolia news agency says.
F1's current problems are many. The aero issue may be reduced due to new wider front wings and narrower rear wings. Finance and governance need sorting. More than half the grid's struggling, and that's unacceptable. They also need to stop shedding good circuits for lucrative but tedious processional street circuits.
The engine gaps are excessive. If Ferrari can't compete next year, rules may need to be changed (there's some talk of a 'neutral' engine in 2017, but that may be just a negotiating tactic by Ecclestone and the FIA).
Diesel's family will be missing a family member tonight. I feel for them.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-34851718
There's no way replacement nuclear power will be in place for 2025. We're heading for brownouts and a much greater dependency on the import of gas, with all the volality that implies.
"There are Africans, Algerians, Indians, Chinese, Turkish and many more people from different backgrounds living in the area. The majority of the population is in “sans-papiers” status - meaning they do not yet have a legal status and an ID which would allow them to find a job."
That would be long hand for there a lot of illegal immigrants living there.