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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Corbyn slumps to new YouGov leader ratings low while latest

SystemSystem Posts: 12,292
edited 2015 18 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Corbyn slumps to new YouGov leader ratings low while latest Survation #EUREF polling has REMAIN back in the lead

It used to be that YouGov published its well/badly party leader ratings on a weekly basis. Now in this post-GE2015 polling disaster era we only get them once a month. The latest, for November, is just out for the Times and the figures continue to decline for Mr. Corbyn. Of those polled 52% said he was doing badly with 30% saying well.

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Go Jezza !!
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,233
    Channelling the Jacobite within by being second :D
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    edited 2015 18
    I did speculate that the Paris attacks would make people aware of the need for more european solidarity. (All polls to be taken with a substantial pinch of salt though!)

    More gunfire in Paris St Denis. Relates to a police raid it seems.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738
    foxinsoxuk said:

    I did speculate that the Paris attacks would make people aware of the need for more european solidarity.

    More gunfire in Paris St Denis. Relates to a police raid it seems.

    You think Frau Merkel will stop inviting the Middle East to come and stay ?
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    foxinsoxuk said:

    I did speculate that the Paris attacks would make people aware of the need for more european solidarity. (All polls to be taken with a substantial pinch of salt though!)

    More gunfire in Paris St Denis. Relates to a police raid it seems.

    EU solidarity? Pull up the drawbridge - Merkel has made their bed for them, let them lie in it.
  • SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    Morning all.

    Jeremy’s ability to limbo under a very low bar set by Ed is rather impressive for an OAP.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,360
    Presumably the leader polling was before Corbyn demonstrated to the UK that in a crisis the man will be a complete cock?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,016
    Given the relentless negativity across most of the media towards him I’m surprised Jezza’s positives are as high as they are!
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,346
    foxinsoxuk said:

    I did speculate that the Paris attacks would make people aware of the need for more european solidarity. (All polls to be taken with a substantial pinch of salt though!).

    I think there might be some truth in that. But then the US et al are not in the EU and they have shown solidarity with the French.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 61,451
    What on earth is wrong with 30% of our population?
  • RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    foxinsoxuk said:

    I did speculate that the Paris attacks would make people aware of the need for more european solidarity. (All polls to be taken with a substantial pinch of salt though!)

    More gunfire in Paris St Denis. Relates to a police raid it seems.

    We can expect an exponential rise in attacks and casualties from here on in.

    We are now entering the phase of the ISIS gameplan defined as "Total Confrontation", which is intended to radicalize the world's 1.5 billion Muslims to achieve "Definitive Victory" - coterminous with Armageddon - in 2020.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Alanbrooke said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    I did speculate that the Paris attacks would make people aware of the need for more european solidarity.

    More gunfire in Paris St Denis. Relates to a police raid it seems.

    You think Frau Merkel will stop inviting the Middle East to come and stay ?
    I think that the exodus from the barbarism of the middle east will continue, Merkel or no Merkel, EU or no EU. If people are to stay or return to the region then it needs to become habitable again.

    Solidarity about common european values is at the core of the EU, so I am not too surprised at the polling. It may be just a blip in an unrelible indicator though.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,739
    Casino_Royale said:

    What on earth is wrong with 30% of our population?

    Labour core vote and Tactical Tory voters for Corbyn
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,739
    MarqueeMark said:

    Presumably the leader polling was before Corbyn demonstrated to the UK that in a crisis the man will be a complete cock?

    Fieldwork was Monday and Tuesday of this week.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,739
    edited 2015 18
    From the YouGov

    @TSEofPB: Times/@YouGov poll finds 76% support decision to kill Jihadi John. 11% say the killing was wrong. 64% of 2015 Lab voters supported the attack

    @TSEofPB: Times/@YouGov poll finds 43% (+23) of voters support Sending ground troops to fight Isis 37% (-21) disapproved. Changes since summer 14

    @TSEofPB: Times/@YouGov poll finds 56% of those asked said intelligence agencies needed greater access to the public’s communications, 29% disagreed.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 61,451
    edited 2015 18
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Casino_Royale said:

    What on earth is wrong with 30% of our population?

    Labour core vote and Tactical Tory voters for Corbyn
    In all honesty, I don't think Corbyn is good either for the Tories or Labour or for the country.

    I want him out asap.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,739
    ICYMI last night the Corbyn comedy circus continues

    @georgeeaton: Ken Livingstone revealed tonight that he will be co-chair of Labour's defence review with Maria Eagle - pair opposed on Trident.

    @tnewtondunn: Senior Labour MP texts with news about Ken Livingstone co-chairing Labour defence review... "You couldn't make this shit up".
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Casino_Royale said:

    What on earth is wrong with 30% of our population?

    Labour core vote and Tactical Tory voters for Corbyn
    Core vote or not it is hard to concieve the mindset that looks at the chaos of the Labour party at present and thinks the leader is doing well. One wonders what he would have to do in order to be thought to be doing badly!

  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    foxinsoxuk said:

    Alanbrooke said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    I did speculate that the Paris attacks would make people aware of the need for more european solidarity.

    More gunfire in Paris St Denis. Relates to a police raid it seems.

    You think Frau Merkel will stop inviting the Middle East to come and stay ?
    I think that the exodus from the barbarism of the middle east will continue, Merkel or no Merkel, EU or no EU. If people are to stay or return to the region then it needs to become habitable again.

    Solidarity about common european values is at the core of the EU, so I am not too surprised at the polling. It may be just a blip in an unrelible indicator though.
    There are no such thing as "common european values". Even a potentially shared desire not to be killed doesn't seem to be shared by Merkel ... but is by the USA and other non EU countries.

    Although quite how they survive outside of the EU remains a mystery as we're constantly told it's not possible.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    https://twitter.com/bengoldacre/status/666235695330103296

    Snouts in the trough.
  • RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    edited 2015 18
    Updated: French media reporting female suicide bomber exploded in St-Denis, Paris...

    Passer-by killed....

    It's only a matter of time before ISIS deploy child suicide bombers.
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    Front page of the Guardian agrees with the Home Secretary, Paris is nothing to do with religion. The only difference between Clegg and Cameron is one of them is PM.

    What an ineffective, insipid bunch of liberals we have running the country. Russia has allied with France and launched attacks, Cameron has pledged to look at strategy. Still, at least he looked concerned at the football last night.
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    RodCrosby said:

    French media reporting female suicide bomber killed in St-Denis, Paris...

    It's only a matter of time before ISIS deploy child suicide bombers.

    Wasn't one of the attackers 15?

  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    blackburn63 said:

    RodCrosby said:

    French media reporting female suicide bomber killed in St-Denis, Paris...

    It's only a matter of time before ISIS deploy child suicide bombers.

    Wasn't one of the attackers 15?

    Initially thought to have been. It turned out he was one of the victims at the Bataclan.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    edited 2015 18
    siege in Saint-Denis. AFP reporting that one of the people in the apartment is Abaaoud, the attack mastermind, thought to be in Syria. They are not sure how many people are in the apartment.

    Stade de France is also in Saint-Denis
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,351
    Casino_Royale said:

    What on earth is wrong with 30% of our population?

    That was my immediate reaction as well. What on earth does it take to get a significant part of our population to pay any attention at all?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,351
    RodCrosby said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    I did speculate that the Paris attacks would make people aware of the need for more european solidarity. (All polls to be taken with a substantial pinch of salt though!)

    More gunfire in Paris St Denis. Relates to a police raid it seems.

    We can expect an exponential rise in attacks and casualties from here on in.

    We are now entering the phase of the ISIS gameplan defined as "Total Confrontation", which is intended to radicalize the world's 1.5 billion Muslims to achieve "Definitive Victory" - coterminous with Armageddon - in 2020.
    Why are Da'ash so interested in the death of the Labour party? Will it be a sign of the end of days? They don't really strike me as Guardian types.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    edited 2015 18
    French TV saying woman in building detonated her suicide belt.

    AP says at least 7 explosions heard on scene.

    French TV saying 3 dead, including 1 woman, 3 detained

    French TV saying operation approaching conclusion
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,016
    edited 2015 18
    foxinsoxuk said:

    https://twitter.com/bengoldacre/status/666235695330103296

    Snouts in the trough.

    Are you surprised?
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    OldKingCole said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    https://twitter.com/bengoldacre/status/666235695330103296

    Snouts in the trough.

    Are you surprised?
    Disappointed, but no longer surprised at this sort of thing.
  • ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    Casino_Royale said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Casino_Royale said:

    What on earth is wrong with 30% of our population?

    Labour core vote and Tactical Tory voters for Corbyn
    In all honesty, I don't think Corbyn is good either for the Tories or Labour or for the country.

    I want him out asap.
    I'm so glad I didn't vote for him. I didn't imagine he'd be this appalling this soon though...
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 61,451
    DavidL said:

    Casino_Royale said:

    What on earth is wrong with 30% of our population?

    That was my immediate reaction as well. What on earth does it take to get a significant part of our population to pay any attention at all?
    Good question. A not insignificant part of the population are just totally uninterested in politics I guess.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    BFMTV reports 1 suspect still alive in raid, and 1 female passer by killed. At least 3 police wounded. 1 suspect shot by police sniper
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,351
    ThreeQuidder said:

    Casino_Royale said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Casino_Royale said:

    What on earth is wrong with 30% of our population?

    Labour core vote and Tactical Tory voters for Corbyn
    In all honesty, I don't think Corbyn is good either for the Tories or Labour or for the country.

    I want him out asap.
    I'm so glad I didn't vote for him. I didn't imagine he'd be this appalling this soon though...
    He's been a bit unlucky with developments. Paris etc has highlighted his most painful and serious inadequacies in ways that could have remained hidden for a considerable time in more peaceful times.

    People expect economic incompetence and incoherence from Labour, many of their supporters don't even regard it as a flaw. But looking like a genuine risk to the safety and security of the country is unacceptable, even in the PLP. Not that they are rushing to do anything about it of course.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    Good morning.

    Looks like Abdelhamid Abaaoud has been cornered and maybe killed in Paris this morning.
    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/paris-terror-siege-live-updates-6852306#ICID=FB_mirror_main
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    edited 2015 18
    DavidL said:

    ThreeQuidder said:

    Casino_Royale said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Casino_Royale said:

    What on earth is wrong with 30% of our population?

    Labour core vote and Tactical Tory voters for Corbyn
    In all honesty, I don't think Corbyn is good either for the Tories or Labour or for the country.

    I want him out asap.
    I'm so glad I didn't vote for him. I didn't imagine he'd be this appalling this soon though...
    He's been a bit unlucky with developments. Paris etc has highlighted his most painful and serious inadequacies in ways that could have remained hidden for a considerable time in more peaceful times.

    People expect economic incompetence and incoherence from Labour, many of their supporters don't even regard it as a flaw. But looking like a genuine risk to the safety and security of the country is unacceptable, even in the PLP. Not that they are rushing to do anything about it of course.
    We can expect Corbyn to condemn the shootings this morning in Paris and that they should have been talked out by police negotiators?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,351
    edited 2015 18
    Tim_B said:

    BFMTV reports 1 suspect still alive in raid, and 1 female passer by killed. At least 3 police wounded. 1 suspect shot by police sniper

    Now got 2 arrested. Much as I like to see these people of doubtful heritage dead hopefully they can extract further information from them. Good work by the French police so far.

    Edit 3 arrests, even better.
  • watford30watford30 Posts: 3,474
    OldKingCole said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    https://twitter.com/bengoldacre/status/666235695330103296

    Snouts in the trough.

    Are you surprised?
    Lansley's merely following the example set by so many former Labour ministers and politicians in the previous government.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,739
    Final thought for the morning.

    This polling shows why the Tories are right to be worried by Corbynmania.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    DavidL said:

    Tim_B said:

    BFMTV reports 1 suspect still alive in raid, and 1 female passer by killed. At least 3 police wounded. 1 suspect shot by police sniper

    Now got 2 arrested. Much as I like to see these people of doubtful heritage dead hopefully they can extract further information from them. Good work by the French police so far.

    Edit 3 arrests, even better.
    According to BFMTV 3 arrested.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Saint-Denis looks an interesting place. A big sign down the side of a building says 'Exotic Center'.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Justice Minister says raid coming to an end - again
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    SquareRoot said:

    DavidL said:

    ThreeQuidder said:

    Casino_Royale said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Casino_Royale said:

    What on earth is wrong with 30% of our population?

    Labour core vote and Tactical Tory voters for Corbyn
    In all honesty, I don't think Corbyn is good either for the Tories or Labour or for the country.

    I want him out asap.
    I'm so glad I didn't vote for him. I didn't imagine he'd be this appalling this soon though...
    He's been a bit unlucky with developments. Paris etc has highlighted his most painful and serious inadequacies in ways that could have remained hidden for a considerable time in more peaceful times.

    People expect economic incompetence and incoherence from Labour, many of their supporters don't even regard it as a flaw. But looking like a genuine risk to the safety and security of the country is unacceptable, even in the PLP. Not that they are rushing to do anything about it of course.
    We can expect Corbyn to condemn the shootings this morning in Paris and that they should have been talked out by police negotiators?
    Especially when it's the fair sex blowing themselves and others up.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    edited 2015 18
    Edit: deleted. Just been paged.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    DavidL said:

    Tim_B said:

    BFMTV reports 1 suspect still alive in raid, and 1 female passer by killed. At least 3 police wounded. 1 suspect shot by police sniper

    Now got 2 arrested. Much as I like to see these people of doubtful heritage dead hopefully they can extract further information from them. Good work by the French police so far.

    Edit 3 arrests, even better.
    Why would they talk? They're probably pissed off they didn't get the virgins. Getting rear ended in a prison shower is not quite the same.
  • richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    TimB St Denis was a notorious red light district..it may still be..
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,351
    DecrepitJohnL said:

    DavidL said:

    Tim_B said:

    BFMTV reports 1 suspect still alive in raid, and 1 female passer by killed. At least 3 police wounded. 1 suspect shot by police sniper

    Now got 2 arrested. Much as I like to see these people of doubtful heritage dead hopefully they can extract further information from them. Good work by the French police so far.

    Edit 3 arrests, even better.
    Arrested: that's the point. Shoot to kill is out of favour in the real world. The problem with Corbyn is he could not see a way to acknowledge people's anger first.
    And 3 dead including one shot by a sniper. No one even vaguely normal will be weeping any tears for them. Can Corbyn include himself amongst the normal? I seriously doubt it.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    richardDodd said:

    TimB St Denis was a notorious red light district..it may still be..

    Were the prices reasonable?
  • not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,449
    Casino_Royale said:

    What on earth is wrong with 30% of our population?

    Nothing, it's a democracy.
  • not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,449
    Alanbrooke said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    I did speculate that the Paris attacks would make people aware of the need for more european solidarity.

    More gunfire in Paris St Denis. Relates to a police raid it seems.

    You think Frau Merkel will stop inviting the Middle East to come and stay ?
    Right now it looks like none of the Paris attackers were Syrian refugees as those passports have turned out to be fakes. All seem to have been living in Europe as citizens of their country.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,351
    not_on_fire said:

    Alanbrooke said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    I did speculate that the Paris attacks would make people aware of the need for more european solidarity.

    More gunfire in Paris St Denis. Relates to a police raid it seems.

    You think Frau Merkel will stop inviting the Middle East to come and stay ?
    Right now it looks like none of the Paris attackers were Syrian refugees as those passports have turned out to be fakes. All seem to have been living in Europe as citizens of their country.
    I hadn't seen that but I did speculate on here that the finding of the passport was highly convenient to the Da'ash agenda and might well have been a plant. It seems they were either French or Belgian so far.
  • ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    Tim_B said:

    Saint-Denis looks an interesting place. A big sign down the side of a building says 'Exotic Center'.

    Plumb Center, Builder Center, Exotic Center...
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    edited 2015 18
    Police sources - 3 terrorists killed in this operation - 3 other suspects arrested
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Trucks and command vehicles starting to pull out. Looks like we're done.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,351
    Matt on the button as usual: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/matt/
  • Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,069
    New Order - Brixton Academy.

    Simply fantastic.

    That is all.
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    edited 2015 18
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Final thought for the morning.

    This polling shows why the Tories are right to be worried by Corbynmania.

    It's as much a reflection on the govt as anything, Corbyn is a disaster, the fact the polls are as tight as they are says everything about this govt, dreadful.

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,739
    Scrapheap_as_was said:

    New Order - Brixton Academy.

    Simply fantastic.

    That is all.

    More fantastic than Reckless losing in May?
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    Britain Elects ‏@britainelects 7m7 minutes ago
    On airstrikes against ISIS in Syria:
    Support: 58%
    Oppose: 22%
    (via YouGov / 16 - 17 Nov)

    Britain Elects ‏@britainelects 9m9 minutes ago
    On Britain accepting refugees:
    Should accept more: 20%
    Content w/ current number: 24%
    Should accept fewer/none: 49%
    (via YouGov / 16-17 Nov)

    Yet with Survation it's the complete opposite, although the questions have been not so subtly twisted

    http://us1.campaign-archive2.com/?u=e17762efe2cccb1f0ed943c1f&id=240ea1c110&e=50c0187e78
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Police say operation ongoing
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    blackburn63 said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Final thought for the morning.

    This polling shows why the Tories are right to be worried by Corbynmania.

    It's as much a reflection on the govt as anything, Corbyn is a disaster, the fact the polls are as tight as they are says everything about this govt, dreadful.

    Nonsense.. The pollsters don't even know if the polls are correct, they have had nothing to test against. Making judgements based on data you cannot rely on is sub optimal.
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    SquareRoot said:

    blackburn63 said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Final thought for the morning.

    This polling shows why the Tories are right to be worried by Corbynmania.

    It's as much a reflection on the govt as anything, Corbyn is a disaster, the fact the polls are as tight as they are says everything about this govt, dreadful.

    Nonsense.. The pollsters don't even know if the polls are correct, they have had nothing to test against. Making judgements based on data you cannot rely on is sub optimal.
    Really? Even the labour supporters on here think Corbyn is a disaster, this place is exclusively politicos. Out in the real world people can see Corbyn is odd but also that Cameron is a vacuous PR man who can win elections and do nothing else.

    Of course that doesn't matter to Tories, it's about power for the sake of power.

    Cameron's response to Paris - he sang a song.

  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Saint-Denis can't be all bad, though it looks pretty grim: they have a McDonalds.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    blackburn63 said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Final thought for the morning.

    This polling shows why the Tories are right to be worried by Corbynmania.

    It's as much a reflection on the govt as anything, Corbyn is a disaster, the fact the polls are as tight as they are says everything about this govt, dreadful.

    It also shows that the pollsters are in a mess and no amount of fiddling with methodology will make it better.
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    If the Argies had any sense they'd invade Los Malvinas again now, Cameron would huff and puff and do nothing.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    MikeK said:

    blackburn63 said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Final thought for the morning.

    This polling shows why the Tories are right to be worried by Corbynmania.

    It's as much a reflection on the govt as anything, Corbyn is a disaster, the fact the polls are as tight as they are says everything about this govt, dreadful.

    It also shows that the pollsters are in a mess and no amount of fiddling with methodology will make it better.
    Over 20 years ago I used to sell Great Plains accounting software. I had a client who was setting up their chart of accounts, and it became apparent that their figures were nonsense. I asked if they based their projections and performance on these figures, and they said they did. I said that they were nonsense, and they replied that they knew but they were all the numbers they had.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,016
    blackburn63 said:

    If the Argies had any sense they'd invade Los Malvinas again now, Cameron would huff and puff and do nothing.

    Without an effective Navy what could he do? We haven’t got the ships we had in 1982, and it’s a long way from any substantial air-bases.
    Unless I’m much mistaken.
  • Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,069
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Scrapheap_as_was said:

    New Order - Brixton Academy.

    Simply fantastic.

    That is all.

    More fantastic than Reckless losing in May?
    Yup - much & without a shadow of a doubt. And that's a high bar as we know.

    I was looking where else their tour takes them as soon as I was home, Mrs Scrap has ruled out the Hong Kong one at the end of the month. The others left are tup north which clearly is even less do-able.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    blackburn63 said:

    If the Argies had any sense they'd invade Los Malvinas again now, Cameron would huff and puff and do nothing.

    You're right only by the fact that Cameron has almost nothing to puff back with.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,351
    Tim_B said:

    Police say operation ongoing

    There will be a lot of forensics etc and hopefully some computers etc to analyse but the shooting seems to have stopped. I would imagine they would want the fingerprints and DNA of everyone who had been in those rooms to identify the next ports of call.
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    OldKingCole said:

    blackburn63 said:

    If the Argies had any sense they'd invade Los Malvinas again now, Cameron would huff and puff and do nothing.

    Without an effective Navy what could he do? We haven’t got the ships we had in 1982, and it’s a long way from any substantial air-bases.
    Unless I’m much mistaken.
    As someone who has a son in the Royal Navy I'm always keen to discuss what the govt has done for the armed forces since 2010. Spunked millions on Kids Co for a start.

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 125,135
    edited 2015 18
    MikeK said:

    blackburn63 said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Final thought for the morning.

    This polling shows why the Tories are right to be worried by Corbynmania.

    It's as much a reflection on the govt as anything, Corbyn is a disaster, the fact the polls are as tight as they are says everything about this govt, dreadful.

    It also shows that the pollsters are in a mess and no amount of fiddling with methodology will make it better.
    There is also variation, Comres for the Independent has the Tories with a 13% lead compared to just six per cent at the election, ICM and Survation have a 5% and 6% Tory lead i.e. the same essentially as May and Mori has a 4% Tory lead i.e. a slight narrowing. Not one poll since Corbyn's election has given a Labour lead and his leadership ratings are dire as OGH suggests, the difference is the margin
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    blackburn63 said:

    Front page of the Guardian agrees with the Home Secretary, Paris is nothing to do with religion. The only difference between Clegg and Cameron is one of them is PM.

    What an ineffective, insipid bunch of liberals we have running the country. Russia has allied with France and launched attacks, Cameron has pledged to look at strategy. Still, at least he looked concerned at the football last night.

    Of course it's not simply due to religion. I'm an atheist who dislikes religion and even I'd accept that

    A quarter of the world's population is Muslim but these atrocities are not routine and not normal. This is medieval barbarism and not what a quarter of the globe believes in.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Before the raid, 2 Air France flights were diverted due to bomb scares. LAX to Paris landed at Salt Lake City UT, and Washington DC to Paris landed at Halifax NS. Both were hoaxes.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    edited 2015 18
    Breakfast now. Gallops off to kitchen............
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,137
    Good morning, everyone.

    Sad to hear of more innocent death in Paris. Good that some terrorists are dead/captive.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    edited 2015 18
    Report - 1 suspect remains holed up in 3rd floor apartment.
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    edited 2015 18
    The Fink has an interesting column today referencing Matt Singh's new analysis = Tory modernisnation worked http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/opinion/columnists/article4616625.ece

    Matt's stuff http://www.ncpolitics.uk/2015/11/new-ncp-analysis-where-the-polls-went-wrong.html/#more-1385
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 44,238
    blackburn63 said:

    If the Argies had any sense they'd invade Los Malvinas again now, Cameron would huff and puff and do nothing.

    They could try. They'd probably fail.

    I love the way so many people on the left and right of politics are so keen to dismiss our military capabilities: the left because they don't want them, and the right because they don't think they're good enough.
  • ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    OldKingCole said:

    blackburn63 said:

    If the Argies had any sense they'd invade Los Malvinas again now, Cameron would huff and puff and do nothing.

    Without an effective Navy what could he do? We haven’t got the ships we had in 1982, and it’s a long way from any substantial air-bases.
    Unless I’m much mistaken.
    Unlike 30 years ago, the Falklands are defended now.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    @JananGanesh: How many events have ever made anyone change their mind about anything? My timeline has been a waterfall of confirmation bias since Friday.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    MikeK said:

    Breakfast now. Gallops off to kitchen............

    I love the smell of horse meat in the morning... ;)
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 125,135
    edited 2015 18
    blackburn63 said:

    If the Argies had any sense they'd invade Los Malvinas again now, Cameron would huff and puff and do nothing.

    Mauricio Macri, the man likely to win the Argentine presidency on Sunday and defeat Kirchner's candidate on Sunday according to polls has said the Falklands are no longer a priority and he wants a better relationship with the UK and to focus on the economy, so actually the opposite may occur. In any case the Argentine military is even weaker
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Police reinforcements going in....
  • CD13CD13 Posts: 6,368
    edited 2015 18
    An interesting dilemma for Labour ... do they oppose Jezza when he talks about security and tried to lose even the most committed supporter, or do they shout him down and look like a divided party? I suspect the latter is less damaging.

    The best option may be a shoot to kill policy on Jezza.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 125,135
    MikeK said:

    Britain Elects ‏@britainelects 7m7 minutes ago
    On airstrikes against ISIS in Syria:
    Support: 58%
    Oppose: 22%
    (via YouGov / 16 - 17 Nov)

    Britain Elects ‏@britainelects 9m9 minutes ago
    On Britain accepting refugees:
    Should accept more: 20%
    Content w/ current number: 24%
    Should accept fewer/none: 49%
    (via YouGov / 16-17 Nov)

    Yet with Survation it's the complete opposite, although the questions have been not so subtly twisted

    http://us1.campaign-archive2.com/?u=e17762efe2cccb1f0ed943c1f&id=240ea1c110&e=50c0187e78

    Survation actually has 52% backing a UN mandated military strike against IS and 15% a UK response without U.N. backing. Only 13% want non military action and just 12% no action at all so little different
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,062
    If it wasn't that people have pitifully short memories REMAIN would be nailed on certainties.
    I'm sure there's never been a time when European solidarity has been as solid.

    For those on the 'remain' side it's time to consolidate.

    It must be clear to everyone how vital European solidarity is now we have this common enemy
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    Sky reporting 5 arrested now.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    JosiasJessop said:

    blackburn63 said:

    If the Argies had any sense they'd invade Los Malvinas again now, Cameron would huff and puff and do nothing.

    They could try. They'd probably fail.

    I love the way so many people on the left and right of politics are so keen to dismiss our military capabilities: the left because they don't want them, and the right because they don't think they're good enough.
    Well said. Our forces are from memory the fourth largest in the world by funding and unlike three decades ago there is a permanent base in and around the Falklands that a tinpot nation will need to get past.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    edited 2015 18
    This a bit odd - French prosecutors say 5 suspected terrorists have been arrested.

    We'll just have to let this work itself out.

    Seems that includes 2 people arrested in the street. Who are they?
  • CD13CD13 Posts: 6,368
    Mr Meeks as is,


    confirmation bias? I know a couple of fans of Jezza's economics who just wish he'd STFU about security.
  • Innocent_AbroadInnocent_Abroad Posts: 3,294
    Philip_Thompson said:

    blackburn63 said:

    Front page of the Guardian agrees with the Home Secretary, Paris is nothing to do with religion. The only difference between Clegg and Cameron is one of them is PM.

    What an ineffective, insipid bunch of liberals we have running the country. Russia has allied with France and launched attacks, Cameron has pledged to look at strategy. Still, at least he looked concerned at the football last night.

    Of course it's not simply due to religion. I'm an atheist who dislikes religion and even I'd accept that

    A quarter of the world's population is Muslim but these atrocities are not routine and not normal. This is medieval barbarism and not what a quarter of the globe believes in.
    It doesn't need to be. Let's say the world population is 7.2 billion - that's 1.8 billion Muslims. Let's estimate the attraction of medievalism at 1 in 500 - that provides 3.5 million potential terrorists. Quite enough to destroy Western civilization with.

  • TomsToms Posts: 2,478
    edited 2015 18
    foxinsoxuk said:

    https://twitter.com/bengoldacre/status/666235695330103296

    Snouts in the trough.

    Good journalist, Ben Goldacre, especially regarding research in things medical He's numerate and understands how science works. We need more such. I miss his regular Guardian articles.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331
    JosiasJessop said:

    blackburn63 said:

    If the Argies had any sense they'd invade Los Malvinas again now, Cameron would huff and puff and do nothing.

    They could try. They'd probably fail.

    I love the way so many people on the left and right of politics are so keen to dismiss our military capabilities: the left because they don't want them, and the right because they don't think they're good enough.
    Presidential run-off coming up this weekend. Difficult to call but looks like the Kirchnistas may be on the way out, which would probably cool things down considerably.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,062
    Philip Thompson

    "A quarter of the world's population is Muslim but these atrocities are not routine and not normal. This is medieval barbarism and not what a quarter of the globe believes in"

    You would have thought that so obvious it didn't need saying but reading some of the posters here you sometimes wonder who's posting on this site.
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    edited 2015 18
    I think it's 3 minus the dead woman bomber, plus another woman elsewhere plus the guy who said on the radio that he'd rented out the flat they are in - but had no idea who they were.

    EDIT What time is it where you are?!?!
    Tim_B said:

    This a bit odd - French prosecutors say 5 suspected terrorists have been arrested.

    We'll just have to let this work itself out.

  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    This short YouTube clip is very moving. No political point as such, other than a small example of the human impact of last Friday:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jb_5QlLQQH8
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Innocent_Abroad said:

    Philip_Thompson said:

    blackburn63 said:

    Front page of the Guardian agrees with the Home Secretary, Paris is nothing to do with religion. The only difference between Clegg and Cameron is one of them is PM.

    What an ineffective, insipid bunch of liberals we have running the country. Russia has allied with France and launched attacks, Cameron has pledged to look at strategy. Still, at least he looked concerned at the football last night.

    Of course it's not simply due to religion. I'm an atheist who dislikes religion and even I'd accept that

    A quarter of the world's population is Muslim but these atrocities are not routine and not normal. This is medieval barbarism and not what a quarter of the globe believes in.
    It doesn't need to be. Let's say the world population is 7.2 billion - that's 1.8 billion Muslims. Let's estimate the attraction of medievalism at 1 in 500 - that provides 3.5 million potential terrorists. Quite enough to destroy Western civilization with.

    No not enough to destroy western civilization with. Because our police and security forces are very good at what they do so it is only when they fail to prevent a disaster that it occurs. Just because someone wishes to do us harm does not mean it will succeed.

    Since this barbarism first really struck the west in 2001 our civilization hasn't failed and life by and large goes on. More people will die this year in traffic accidents than terrorist atrocities. We will not surrender to this barbarism.
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,958
    Toms said:


    foxinsoxuk said:

    https://twitter.com/bengoldacre/status/666235695330103296

    Snouts in the trough.

    Good journalist, Ben Goldacre, especially regarding research in things medical He's numerate and understands how science works. We need more such. I miss his regular Guardian articles.
    I've got his book 'Bad Science', scathing about homeopathy. David Tredinnick MP should read it.
    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mp-who-believes-astrology-homeopathy-5852936
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    edited 2015 18
    Abbaaoud presumed dead! - police sources, yet to be confirmed
This discussion has been closed.