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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » As George Osborne prepares make his statement ComRes issue

24

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  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,984
    So Sheffield might get a directly elected Mayor
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300

    So Sheffield might get a directly elected Mayor

    You are most welcome to the one from Bristol.


  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,417
    Whats happening with the tax on my Peugeot 207 :D ?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533

    Bad move to totally get rid of student grants and replace them with loans..they were unsustainable, but genuinely poor students should get some help.

    Given that student loans are in no sense "loans" within the ordinary meaning of the term, this is utterly unobjectionable.
    No they aren't, they are a capped tax, but I don't like the idea that those who come from really poor backgrounds don't get a bit of a hand up.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    BLT landlords - brace yourselves....
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,417

    So Sheffield might get a directly elected Mayor

    I won't be eligible to vote for you I'm afraid
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    If I've got this right - new rate for new cars, old rate for old cars.
    Pulpstar said:

    Whats happening with the tax on my Peugeot 207 :D ?

  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064
    Here it bloody comes!
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    dr_spyn said:

    So Sheffield might get a directly elected Mayor

    You are most welcome to the one from Bristol.


    Is Mr Red Trousers not so popular these days?
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,142
    Really pleased to see that BTL mortgage relief is being sensibly reduced.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,142
    Here it comes, IHT
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,984
    dr_spyn said:

    So Sheffield might get a directly elected Mayor

    You are most welcome to the one from Bristol.


    Well I'm umming and ahhing about whether to run as Manchester's first Directly Elected Mayor, now I might go for Sheffield.

    Decisions, Decisions.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Sensible transition period on BTL mortgage relief.
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    justin124 said:

    No mention of the Balance of Payments. I wonder why? 'Britain is not paying its way in the world'

    A problem common to all UK governments, but one which has disappeared off the political radar.
  • FlightpathlFlightpathl Posts: 1,243

    Companies still have to pay tax.

    Yes, but inheritance tax is a charge on estates. A company, by definition, can never enter into anything equivalent to the affairs of a deceased testator.
    And individuals are not companies - unless your name is Ken Livingstone.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,417
    Mortimer said:

    Here it comes, IHT

    Reading the BBC article, do I need to get married to benefit from this or do I just need my parents to not get divorced :P ?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,984
    Pulpstar said:

    So Sheffield might get a directly elected Mayor

    I won't be eligible to vote for you I'm afraid
    I think you might, if they go for the Sheffield City Region area.

    Covers, South Yorkshire, parts of Derbyshire and Nottinghamshire

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheffield_City_Region
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Bad move to totally get rid of student grants and replace them with loans..they were unsustainable, but genuinely poor students should get some help.

    Given that student loans are in no sense "loans" within the ordinary meaning of the term, this is utterly unobjectionable.
    Not quite the point you were making but I've never really understood why income-contingent loans cannot be extended to other areas of public life.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    As always with Osborne, IHT changes never quite as simple or straight forward as advertised.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Pulpstar said:

    Mortimer said:

    Here it comes, IHT

    Reading the BBC article, do I need to get married to benefit from this or do I just need my parents to not get divorced :P ?
    That depends on your parents' will, really. They might not want to leave a valuable asset to an international playboy; you might be well advised to settle down.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Murray is playing tennis at Wimbledon and neither BBC1 nor BBC2 are showing the match.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,161
    "Hard-working singletons" :lol:
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300

    dr_spyn said:

    So Sheffield might get a directly elected Mayor

    You are most welcome to the one from Bristol.


    Is Mr Red Trousers not so popular these days?
    He has unblocked me on Twitter. Though his speeding exploits appeared on Top Gear.

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmT1jXKEwQU
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,161

    So Sheffield might get a directly elected Mayor

    Not a directly elected Dictator?
  • watford30watford30 Posts: 3,474
    Mortimer said:

    Really pleased to see that BTL mortgage relief is being sensibly reduced.

    Landlords will merely put up rents to make up the difference.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064
    Higher dividend tax rate incoming. :O
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    £5k free dividend income per year :D

    YIPPEE !
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,142
    Dividend taxation sounds much more complex, despite being sold as a simplefication...
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,822

    Pulpstar said:

    Mortimer said:

    Here it comes, IHT

    Reading the BBC article, do I need to get married to benefit from this or do I just need my parents to not get divorced :P ?
    That depends on your parents' will, really. They might not want to leave a valuable asset to an international playboy; .
    And a gambler to boot...
  • FlightpathlFlightpathl Posts: 1,243
    Pulpstar said:

    I pay £30 on my car VED...

    Am I about to be richer or poorer :P ?

    Poorer?
    But the point is it is going towards better roads and all those bores who bleat about the 'duty' not being a road fund tax can now shut up. Time to tax cyclists.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,984

    So Sheffield might get a directly elected Mayor

    Not a directly elected Dictator?
    A mere stepping stone. Kinda the way Chancellor Palpatine went on to become Emperor Palpatine
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    dr_spyn said:

    dr_spyn said:

    So Sheffield might get a directly elected Mayor

    You are most welcome to the one from Bristol.


    Is Mr Red Trousers not so popular these days?
    He has unblocked me on Twitter. Though his speeding exploits appeared on Top Gear.

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmT1jXKEwQU
    I know he has bloody 20mph zoned frigging everywhere, when I visited a couple of months ago. Also noticed parking restrictions everywhere and that the Downs are now one massive car park.
  • DaemonBarberDaemonBarber Posts: 1,626
    need to see details on the dividend relief changes...
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    F##king hell, 18% corporation tax.
  • DaemonBarberDaemonBarber Posts: 1,626
    wow 19, then 18% corp tax
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064
    Holy shit. Corporation tax cuts again. 18% by 17/18. :O
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,045
    Main corp tax rate heading towards Ireland... 18%
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,822
    There's a lot of stuff in this Budget.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,417
    TGOHF said:

    £5k free dividend income per year :D

    YIPPEE !

    watford30 said:

    Mortimer said:

    Really pleased to see that BTL mortgage relief is being sensibly reduced.

    Landlords will merely put up rents to make up the difference.
    Errm

    Shouldn't they just sell their BTL properties and buy Vodafone shares instead now though ?
  • As always with Osborne, IHT changes never quite as simple or straight forward as advertised.

    Utterly capricious. It encourages testators to keep their wealth in real property, rather than more productive investments.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Mortimer said:

    Dividend taxation sounds much more complex, despite being sold as a simplefication...

    It's much simpler for those that earn less than 5k pa from divis.
  • 18% corporation tax! Good man George.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,417

    wow 19, then 18% corp tax

    I guess I'll be trying to make a loss this year then...
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    Arbeit macht frei.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    As always with Osborne, IHT changes never quite as simple or straight forward as advertised.

    Utterly capricious. It encourages testators to keep their wealth in real property, rather than more productive investments.
    No it doesn't, he specifically said that those who downsize don't lost out.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,161

    So Sheffield might get a directly elected Mayor

    Not a directly elected Dictator?
    A mere stepping stone. Kinda the way Chancellor Palpatine went on to become Emperor Palpatine
    Ah, so will you re-organise the UK into the First Galactic Empire, for a safe and secure society?
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,142
    TGOHF said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dividend taxation sounds much more complex, despite being sold as a simplefication...

    It's much simpler for those that earn less than 5k pa from divis.
    How can it be simpler than currently: Either within personal allowance, 0% (well, 10% rate but coming with 10% tax credit) if under 40% tax rate, and within income tax rates after that...

  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    edited July 2015
    Parents of 3/4yrs old to get 30hrs of free child care. 18-21yrs obligation to Earn Or Learn. No Auto HB for this group.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Mortimer said:

    TGOHF said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dividend taxation sounds much more complex, despite being sold as a simplefication...

    It's much simpler for those that earn less than 5k pa from divis.
    How can it be simpler than currently: Either within personal allowance, 0% (well, 10% rate but coming with 10% tax credit) if under 40% tax rate, and within income tax rates after that...

    Wouldn't work with Corporation Tax rates below 20%
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,417
    The big message from George today is:

    Keep the life support machine on till April 17th 2016 :P
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,161
    AndyJS said:

    Murray is playing tennis at Wimbledon and neither BBC1 nor BBC2 are showing the match.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/live/tennis/32625716
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Mortimer said:

    TGOHF said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dividend taxation sounds much more complex, despite being sold as a simplefication...

    It's much simpler for those that earn less than 5k pa from divis.
    How can it be simpler than currently: Either within personal allowance, 0% (well, 10% rate but coming with 10% tax credit) if under 40% tax rate, and within income tax rates after that...

    I earn about £3k pa from divis - I have to do a tax return and pay the 40% rate difference.

    I will no longer have to do either.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    There's a lot of stuff in this Budget.

    Oh, I'm sure it was all in the election campaign and manifesto just a month back. It's not as if we spent the entire campaign debating Ed eating Nicola's bacon sandwiches.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,708
    edited July 2015

    Companies still have to pay tax.

    Yes, but inheritance tax is a charge on estates. A company, by definition, can never enter into anything equivalent to the affairs of a deceased testator.
    In the not-so-distant future companies will be artificially intelligent life-forms. They'll probably reproduce sexually by sharing articles of incorporation with other companies. I'm glad Osborne's thinking ahead.
  • Life_ina_market_townLife_ina_market_town Posts: 2,319
    edited July 2015

    No it doesn't, he specifically said that those who downsize don't lost out.

    That relief is tapered, and, in any event, it has no application where a person has a choice of buying a larger property to avoid inheritance tax, or to invest in productive economic activity which is taxable as personalty.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    TGOHF said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dividend taxation sounds much more complex, despite being sold as a simplefication...

    It's much simpler for those that earn less than 5k pa from divis.
    Sounds like the aim is to stop the tax dodge where people form companies and pay out as dividends rather than salary. Have to do my sums to see how it affects my own finances.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,672
    This dividend tax thing is going to hurt a lot of self-employed folk, I imagine.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,142
    edited July 2015
    TGOHF said:

    Mortimer said:

    TGOHF said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dividend taxation sounds much more complex, despite being sold as a simplefication...

    It's much simpler for those that earn less than 5k pa from divis.
    How can it be simpler than currently: Either within personal allowance, 0% (well, 10% rate but coming with 10% tax credit) if under 40% tax rate, and within income tax rates after that...

    I earn about £3k pa from divis - I have to do a tax return and pay the 40% rate difference.

    I will no longer have to do either.

    Ohhh, its another pensioner/small shareholder boost isn't it. Gotcha.

    Less handy for owners of small ltd companies.

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    Wow, freezing benefits for 4 years....
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    Plato said:

    Parents of 3/4yrs old to get 30hrs of free child care. 18-21yrs obligation to Earn Or Learn. No Auto HB for this group.

    Raising the school leaving age to hide unemployment -- has there been a government in the last half century not to have done this?
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    All working benefits frozen for 4 years ?
  • DaemonBarberDaemonBarber Posts: 1,626
    sharp intake of breath there...

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    edited July 2015
    Housing benefit, not just frozen, but reduced.

    Guardianistas will be going into meltdown.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Lots of changes in welfare reform - need to unpick that lot. No rises for 4yrs for in-work benefits.
  • watford30watford30 Posts: 3,474

    This dividend tax thing is going to hurt a lot of self-employed folk, I imagine.

    Osborne has likely just damaged his chances of becoming PM.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    This dividend tax thing is going to hurt a lot of self-employed folk, I imagine.

    Those that have been playing the system might feel some discomfort ...
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,424
    edited July 2015



    Yes, precisely.

    I came across an interesting pair of statistics recently. I'd be interested in people's guesses as to the correct answers to these two questions (no Googling!):

    1. How often does the average house change hands (i.e. number of years)?

    2. What proportion of housing transactions are new-build?

    [edit: extraneous blockquote tag removed]

    When I was looking at auction properties, I had to delve thru the property history to find out if the person auctioning the property actually owned it (surprisingly, there were legitimate doubts about whether two of them actually did!). I was taken aback by the number of houses that are kept in the family: grandparents buy in the 1920s, leave to their son, who leaves to their sister, who leaves to her son, and so on. The impression I came away with was that the majority of property in England and Wales is simply never sold in the conventional sense, it's kept in the family instead. Is my impression correct?
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,142
    watford30 said:

    This dividend tax thing is going to hurt a lot of self-employed folk, I imagine.

    Osborne has likely just damaged his chances of becoming PM.
    Afraid he has lost my vote. Silly attack on small and family ltd companies.

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,417
    Sounds like a great budget to me - I'm assuming I'm a winner, especially once that Lloyds giveaway gets going.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,708

    TGOHF said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dividend taxation sounds much more complex, despite being sold as a simplefication...

    It's much simpler for those that earn less than 5k pa from divis.
    Sounds like the aim is to stop the tax dodge where people form companies and pay out as dividends rather than salary. Have to do my sums to see how it affects my own finances.
    I guess he has to do that because Britain has this ludicrously huge difference between the tax you pay on salary and the tax you pay on dividends, and he's making it even ludicrouslier huger.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,161

    AndyJS said:

    Murray is playing tennis at Wimbledon and neither BBC1 nor BBC2 are showing the match.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/live/tennis/32625716
    Oh dear - rain stops play at Wimbledon!
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064

    This dividend tax thing is going to hurt a lot of self-employed folk, I imagine.

    I think that's the point. "Self-employed" anyway.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,142

    TGOHF said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dividend taxation sounds much more complex, despite being sold as a simplefication...

    It's much simpler for those that earn less than 5k pa from divis.
    Sounds like the aim is to stop the tax dodge where people form companies and pay out as dividends rather than salary. Have to do my sums to see how it affects my own finances.
    I guess he has to do that because Britain has this ludicrously huge difference between the tax you pay on salary and the tax you pay on dividends, and he's making it even ludicrouslier huger.
    As I've argued ad nauseum, the difference between tax on salary and tax on dividends is because if you're receiving dividends you are:

    a) risking capital (which will already have been taxed at some point)
    b) not receiving the same employment benefits as the employed

  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Chav breeding tax introduced.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Confirmed £23k/£20k caps on benefits and no UC/Tax Credit after 2017 for more than 2 kids. Same with HB. Exceptions for multiple births.
  • MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584

    @MaxPB will be pleased.
  • I guess he has to do that because Britain has this ludicrously huge difference between the tax you pay on salary and the tax you pay on dividends, and he's making it even ludicrouslier huger.

    The money that constitutes dividends has already been charged to corporation tax.
  • FlightpathlFlightpathl Posts: 1,243
    We need to remember that at the start of the budget Osborne pointed out that over the parliament there would be '£37bn of fiscal consolidation'. Thats a big figure and anyone trying to pretend there is any weakness in the govts approach needs a pretty convincing argument.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    I don't think I will be able to listen to BBC or read the Guardian for the next 3 months after this budget...the screaming is going to be like nothing heard since the days of Thatcher.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064
    Two child limit for tax credits. Finally.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,591
    Plato said:

    Bags under her bags. Being Home Sec must be a killer task master and always teetering on the edge of some crisis.

    Theresa May looks totally knackered.

    Plato said:

    Bags under her bags. Being Home Sec must be a killer task master and always teetering on the edge of some crisis.

    Theresa May looks totally knackered.

    Longest serving Home Secretary for decades, cannot be an easy role.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Tax credit threshold reduced from £6420 to £3850.

    Social rents reduced by 1% for next 4yrs.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    MaxPB said:

    Two child limit for tax credits. Finally.

    With an exemption for multiple births. Eminently sensible policy!
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,690
    MaxPB said:

    This dividend tax thing is going to hurt a lot of self-employed folk, I imagine.

    I think that's the point. "Self-employed" anyway.
    The trouble is that people like me whose type of work means I have to move from one client to another continuously on short term contracts have no choice but to be self employed.

    I have no idea what these changes mean but I guess from what people are saying here that it is going to make life much harder for people like me.

  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,142
    Only thought on divi income. If this has been done cleverly, personal allowance threshhold will rise quite a lot
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064

    MaxPB said:

    Two child limit for tax credits. Finally.

    With an exemption for multiple births. Eminently sensible policy!
    Indeed.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    edited July 2015
    IC unchanged - thresholds now £11k next year = £900pa extra. Higher rate £43k.

    29m paying less tax
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    MaxPB said:

    This dividend tax thing is going to hurt a lot of self-employed folk, I imagine.

    I think that's the point. "Self-employed" anyway.
    The trouble is that people like me whose type of work means I have to move from one client to another continuously on short term contracts have no choice but to be self employed.

    I have no idea what these changes mean but I guess from what people are saying here that it is going to make life much harder for people like me.

    Depends - do you pay yourself via dividends or wages ?
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064
    £11k tax free allowance.
  • DaemonBarberDaemonBarber Posts: 1,626
    11k and 43k tax thresholds.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Mortimer said:

    TGOHF said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dividend taxation sounds much more complex, despite being sold as a simplefication...

    It's much simpler for those that earn less than 5k pa from divis.
    Sounds like the aim is to stop the tax dodge where people form companies and pay out as dividends rather than salary. Have to do my sums to see how it affects my own finances.
    I guess he has to do that because Britain has this ludicrously huge difference between the tax you pay on salary and the tax you pay on dividends, and he's making it even ludicrouslier huger.
    As I've argued ad nauseum, the difference between tax on salary and tax on dividends is because if you're receiving dividends you are:

    a) risking capital (which will already have been taxed at some point)
    b) not receiving the same employment benefits as the employed

    c) are paying Corporation Tax.

    That is being reduced, you need to look at it as a whole package of reforms.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    Has he bottled combining IC/NI? It is sounding like it.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064

    MaxPB said:

    This dividend tax thing is going to hurt a lot of self-employed folk, I imagine.

    I think that's the point. "Self-employed" anyway.
    The trouble is that people like me whose type of work means I have to move from one client to another continuously on short term contracts have no choice but to be self employed.

    I have no idea what these changes mean but I guess from what people are saying here that it is going to make life much harder for people like me.

    As long as you pay yourself via wages rather than using the dividends wheeze this isn't going to change anything.
  • He seems to have forgotten to screw the Jocks.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,690
    TGOHF said:

    MaxPB said:

    This dividend tax thing is going to hurt a lot of self-employed folk, I imagine.

    I think that's the point. "Self-employed" anyway.
    The trouble is that people like me whose type of work means I have to move from one client to another continuously on short term contracts have no choice but to be self employed.

    I have no idea what these changes mean but I guess from what people are saying here that it is going to make life much harder for people like me.

    Depends - do you pay yourself via dividends or wages ?
    Both.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,984
    Tory Defence fans climaxing at that announcement
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    2% defence budget -ZING !
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Defence/Security - increase in real terms every year, £1.5bn extra for Joint Security Fund.

    2% for Defence each year.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,309
    Liz Kendall influencing government policy already.
  • DaemonBarberDaemonBarber Posts: 1,626

    Mortimer said:

    TGOHF said:

    Mortimer said:

    Dividend taxation sounds much more complex, despite being sold as a simplefication...

    It's much simpler for those that earn less than 5k pa from divis.
    Sounds like the aim is to stop the tax dodge where people form companies and pay out as dividends rather than salary. Have to do my sums to see how it affects my own finances.
    I guess he has to do that because Britain has this ludicrously huge difference between the tax you pay on salary and the tax you pay on dividends, and he's making it even ludicrouslier huger.
    As I've argued ad nauseum, the difference between tax on salary and tax on dividends is because if you're receiving dividends you are:

    a) risking capital (which will already have been taxed at some point)
    b) not receiving the same employment benefits as the employed

    c) are paying Corporation Tax.

    That is being reduced, you need to look at it as a whole package of reforms.
    And changes to thresholds too.
    My accountant is going to earn his fee the next couple of years/

This discussion has been closed.