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  • Ishmael_XIshmael_X Posts: 3,664
    edited April 2015

    The VAT law move, like the foreign aid budget law, is pathetic and ridiculous in equal measure.

    Is it possible they have received leaked info that Lab were going to go big on "don't believe tory pledges on tax" in the final week?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031
    RodCrosby said:

    RodCrosby said:

    RodCrosby said:

    What about the scenario where Labour join the SNP in voting down a Tory queen speech, but then decline to form a government themselves. That would lead to a second election, right? One in which the SNP's "vote us, you'll still get Labour" argument would be diminished, and the Tories' "vote Labour, you'll get SNP" will be dead.

    Problem with that is Labour would be perceived as

    i) gutless
    ii) wreckers, trying to force a re-run of an election they had just lost

    I would go so far as to say the the Constitution expects the Leader of the Opposition to step up to the plate in such a scenario, or not bother bringing down the government...
    Yeah, if Labour were significantly behind this would likely be the case. If it was closer, I'm not so sure. I think in England Labour would get credit for not doing a deal with the SNP if that was clearly an option.
    Ludicrous. It would sanction parties bringing each other down, with repeated returns to the polls until someone secured a majority. UK Plc would meantime go down the U-bend...
    I really don't think there's any great public feeling that Labour has a duty not to vote against the Conservatives. If a party doesn't want to be voted down, they need to have a majority who either support them or who they've reached an agreement with not to vote against them. That's the way everyone expects it to be.
    Miliband would have caused a Constitutional crisis.
    But you wouldn't put it past him to do just that though, that's the problem.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    GIN1138 said:

    Shocking what's going on in Scotland...

    If we do get an EU referendum (which is won by IN) will UKIP get a similar boost in 2020?

    Using the SNP model, if everyone but UKIP campaigns for IN then the result would be for all the OUT voters to coalesce around the only party of OUT.
  • DanielDaniel Posts: 160
    Courting the Scottish Tories would ensure the death of SLAB.
  • MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    weejonnie said:

    marke09 said:

    sorry link to my previous post didn't appear

    https://twitter.com/angus_young61/status/593375520487829504

    An absolute guess, but as Turner comes after Nolan, have they just been cut in the wrong place? If so, printer error?
    Yep - two missing candidates
    Karl Turner (Labour)
    Sarah Walpole (Green)

    (UKIP to win Hull as their candidate comes first. All Candidates to change their name to mr/mrs/miss Aaron ........Aaaainsworth in 2020.) (dots come before letters in Ascii)
    There was also apparently an error in one or more of the Newcastle seats in the Instructions To Postal Voters . The section missed out one word and instructed voters to vote for more than one candidate .
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860

    I think this law against tax rises might be the dumbest pledge of the campaign so far. Hopefully some respected former chancellors come out against it, I expect Ken Clarke thinks the idea is barking mad.

    Has Cameron been hanging around with Grover Norquist or something? This is the kind of idiot litmus test GOP candidates have to pledge.

    It's economically insane, but electorally well timed
    Totally bonkers. In fact most of the 'pass a law to prevent/make government doing/do something' ideas are bonkers.

    Using legislature to signal policy intent is no way to run a country sensibly and a worrying trend.

  • malcolmg said:

    MikeK said:

    With the SNP even more leftie than the Labour Party; on a par with the Communist Party in many respects. Will the next government fortify our border with Scotland? England will need to stop these ravaging Picts from infesting the North.

    The Tories are more leftie than labour nowadays, a centre left SNP government will do well with only London right wing parties as competition.
    Yes, there is a massive gap in the market for a right wing Scottish party. Either a renamed Tory breakaway (if the Tories are sensible) or a brand new party. Even a well-disguised UKIP offshoot would work if it was done very well and certain people were kept away from it *cough*David Coburn*cough*.

    Pulpstar said:

    My final (long) blogpost before GE2015. Rehearsing out my thoughts on GE2010, minor party positions for GE2015, potential seat bands, and potential next government compositions:

    https://royaleleseaux.wordpress.com/2015/04/26/picking-the-players-our-next-government/

    An excellent piece. Scan reading it I think UKIP coalition can be ruled out. Labour abstaining the QS motion is a possibility though, which perhaps means there can be a Conservative Gov't on 285 seats or so - not necessarily lead by Dave...
    Many thanks for your kind words, Pulpstar.

    Yes, you could be right. A Conservative seat tally of 285+ is interesting.

    If the Lib Dems did, by some miracle, walk away with 30 seats, and the DUP could be squared, a temporary arrangement on Con - 286, LD - 30, DUP - 9 could perhaps be reached to govern for a year or so.

    I think the Lib Dems under Clegg might go for that if LD+Lab was < Conservatives, and the alternative was a shaky Lab-SNP deal.
    Lab + SNP + LD coalition seems nailed on.

    The Conservative poster showing Militwat in Salmond's pocket is spot-on accurate.

    You have to hand it the Tories: their characterisation of Labour's leader always is spot-on accurate. Who now would seriously dispute the 'demon eyes' characterisation of Blair, for example?

    Miliband in the SNP pocket - same thing. Labouroids are angry about it because they know it's true.
  • FinancierFinancier Posts: 3,916
    Plato said:
    Just the way to refute those who are not Imperial literate.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    marke09 said:

    sorry link to my previous post didn't appear

    https://twitter.com/angus_young61/status/593375520487829504

    Erm, isn't it just folded over?
    The MP has retweeted - I doubt it's a windup.

    https://twitter.com/KarlTurnerMP
    Blimey.
    A minor cockup, with potentially massive implications.
    UKIP may well argue they've got a decent puncher's chance there. And this has screwed it up.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031
    :D
    Plato said:

    Love this

    Take a look at @Otto_English's Tweet: twitter.com/Otto_English/status/593384616658100225?s=09

  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,964
    Miss Plato, a few days ago I explained the pre-decimal system of currency we had to an American (he'd read something about Thatcher looking forward to decimalisation), and his gast was utterly flabbered by it.

    I rather like the bonkers old systems. There's something soulless about the metric system.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,708
    GIN1138 said:

    Shocking what's going on in Scotland...

    If we do get an EU referendum (which is won by IN) will UKIP get a similar boost in 2020?

    Great question, and note that even more than the Scottish promise, the referendum will have been won based on a claim of powers to be returned in future, and "out" voters will be hopping mad at what they'll see as a scam.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,688
    dr_spyn said:

    BBC Brand doesn't vote...POEMWAS.

    As was pointed out on the utterly brilliant 'Ballot Monkeys' last night, even if Brand had come out and told all his supporters - that he had previously told not to vote - to now vote Labour, the chances are they wouldn't be able to because Miliband was so stupid he waited until after the last registration date had passed before he made an approach to Brand.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,964
    Mr. X, that's possible. What's certain is that, as Mr. Ghedebrav states, legislating in this way is crackers. It's madder than a box of frogs.
  • The ineptitude of Labour 's Stephen Timms on BB 5Live is unparalleled. He repeated the economic lie that a rise in the minimum wage will generate higher tax receipts. It won't, in fact it will probably produce lower tax receipts.

    Increasing the pay of low paid employees, (who probably won't be paying tax anyhow), will reduce the taxable profits of their employers by the same amount so the employers tax will go down.
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143
    Ghedebrav said:

    I think this law against tax rises might be the dumbest pledge of the campaign so far. Hopefully some respected former chancellors come out against it, I expect Ken Clarke thinks the idea is barking mad.

    Has Cameron been hanging around with Grover Norquist or something? This is the kind of idiot litmus test GOP candidates have to pledge.

    It's economically insane, but electorally well timed
    Totally bonkers. In fact most of the 'pass a law to prevent/make government doing/do something' ideas are bonkers.

    Using legislature to signal policy intent is no way to run a country sensibly and a worrying trend.
    I understand why the politicians have done this - pledges have been devalued by broken promises in the past, so they have to ratchet up the words for the electorate to take them seriously.

    The problem is that at some point circumstances will force a government to repeal such a silly law and this will then devalue the law in the eyes of the electorate.

    It's one of the things that makes our politics so fracking rubbish at the moment.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    edited April 2015

    Speedy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Speedy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Murphy must be close to having a breakdown live on National TV now.

    Which channel?
    Talking generally. His count should be fun to watch.
    I know.
    PB's "The Future Leader of Labour" losing his seat will be a nice dessert after the Clegg main course.

    I really dislike leaders who lead their party to sure oblivion.
    When the ship sinks the captain must go with it.
    If it happens, it will hardly be Murphy's fault. The ship was set on course for the reef and the steering disabled ages before he got to the bridge.
    I disagree.
    Most here were sure that Murphy would be the salvation of SLAB, only a very few (including my self) predicted that he would make matters even worse because he is a bad fit for the average scottish voter.

    Murphy was such a bad captain he sunk his ship before it even hit the reef.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031
    edited April 2015

    weejonnie said:

    marke09 said:

    sorry link to my previous post didn't appear

    https://twitter.com/angus_young61/status/593375520487829504

    An absolute guess, but as Turner comes after Nolan, have they just been cut in the wrong place? If so, printer error?
    Yep - two missing candidates
    Karl Turner (Labour)
    Sarah Walpole (Green)

    (UKIP to win Hull as their candidate comes first. All Candidates to change their name to mr/mrs/miss Aaron ........Aaaainsworth in 2020.) (dots come before letters in Ascii)
    There was also apparently an error in one or more of the Newcastle seats in the Instructions To Postal Voters . The section missed out one word and instructed voters to vote for more than one candidate .
    Really? Do councils not have these things proof read then formally signed off by a number of people??
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    I was taught by our very keen pre-history teacher about cubits and hands and all things unmetric.

    It's so wonderfully colourful. I hate metric bar millimetres which are great for tiny things in DIY or centilitres for chemistry calculations - otherwise, I'm all Imperial and mentally turn everything metric back into Imperial to get a visual feel for it.

    Miss Plato, a few days ago I explained the pre-decimal system of currency we had to an American (he'd read something about Thatcher looking forward to decimalisation), and his gast was utterly flabbered by it.

    I rather like the bonkers old systems. There's something soulless about the metric system.

  • Assume Ben at mori tweet saying tories pulling ahead and referring to those in progress gives a clue for theirs due soon, has been covered here?

    Mentioned by SeanT on the previous thread, but then the Scottish poll came out....
    OGH has woken up.

    Mike Smithson‏@MSmithsonPB·3 mins3 minutes ago
    This from @benatipsosmori seems to suggest that tomorrow's Standard poll has CON in lead
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031

    dr_spyn said:

    BBC Brand doesn't vote...POEMWAS.

    As was pointed out on the utterly brilliant 'Ballot Monkeys' last night, even if Brand had come out and told all his supporters - that he had previously told not to vote - to now vote Labour, the chances are they wouldn't be able to because Miliband was so stupid he waited until after the last registration date had passed before he made an approach to Brand.
    +1 for 'Ballot Monkeys' - it was obviously written, filmed and edited only a couple of hours before it went out, while remaining impartial enough to lampoon everyone. Great work by the production team at C4.
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 7,172

    Speedy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Speedy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Murphy must be close to having a breakdown live on National TV now.

    Which channel?
    Talking generally. His count should be fun to watch.
    I know.
    PB's "The Future Leader of Labour" losing his seat will be a nice dessert after the Clegg main course.

    I really dislike leaders who lead their party to sure oblivion.
    When the ship sinks the captain must go with it.
    If it happens, it will hardly be Murphy's fault. The ship was set on course for the reef and the steering disabled ages before he got to the bridge.
    Who was the captain of the ship who set the course & struck the reef ?

    Miliband took over a party in 2010 in a commanding position in Scotland, and has presided over one disastrous decision after another. It was the win by the SNP in Holyrood in 2011 that led to the Indyref.

    Behind the scenes, there must be some Labour apparatchniks absolutely furious with Miliband.

  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,711
    GIN1138 said:

    Shocking what's going on in Scotland...

    If we do get an EU referendum (which is won by IN) will UKIP get a similar boost in 2020?

    Great question. I'd be looking to back UKIP for wins in their strong areas for c.20 seats in 2020 if a 2nd Tory/LD coalition is formed.
  • MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584

    Salmond must really be regretting resigning too quickly.

  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    It's been a long time since C4 was like that - Drop The Dead Donkey was utterly brilliant and filmed within hours of broadcast.
    Sandpit said:

    dr_spyn said:

    BBC Brand doesn't vote...POEMWAS.

    As was pointed out on the utterly brilliant 'Ballot Monkeys' last night, even if Brand had come out and told all his supporters - that he had previously told not to vote - to now vote Labour, the chances are they wouldn't be able to because Miliband was so stupid he waited until after the last registration date had passed before he made an approach to Brand.
    +1 for 'Ballot Monkeys' - it was obviously written, filmed and edited only a couple of hours before it went out, while remaining impartial enough to lampoon everyone. Great work by the production team at C4.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415


    Salmond must really be regretting resigning too quickly.

    No. His resignation was one of the most politically brilliant tactical moves ever. He has passed the baton to Sturgeon who is reaching the voters that Salmond couldn't.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Speedy said:

    Speedy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Speedy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Murphy must be close to having a breakdown live on National TV now.

    Which channel?
    Talking generally. His count should be fun to watch.
    I know.
    PB's "The Future Leader of Labour" losing his seat will be a nice dessert after the Clegg main course.

    I really dislike leaders who lead their party to sure oblivion.
    When the ship sinks the captain must go with it.
    If it happens, it will hardly be Murphy's fault. The ship was set on course for the reef and the steering disabled ages before he got to the bridge.
    I disagree.
    Most here were sure that Murphy would be the salvation of SLAB, only a very few (including my self) predicted that he would make matters even worse because he is a bad fit for the average scottish voter.

    Murphy was such a bad captain he sunk his ship before it even hit the reef.
    According to the latest ratings, it's debateable whether Murphy or Miliband is a bigger liability in Scotland. Murphy has better net ratings, but only because he polls well among Tories. Among the crucial 2010 Lab voters group (and presumably among Lab->SNP defectors), Miliband rated better in the last YouGov.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    GIN1138 said:

    Shocking what's going on in Scotland...

    If we do get an EU referendum (which is won by IN) will UKIP get a similar boost in 2020?

    Great question. I'd be looking to back UKIP for wins in their strong areas for c.20 seats in 2020 if a 2nd Tory/LD coalition is formed.
    Anecdotal - Still not a single Labour poster up in my very strong Labour ward, plenty of England flags still up. No UKIP posters either, mind.
  • Ishmael_XIshmael_X Posts: 3,664

    Mr. X, that's possible. What's certain is that, as Mr. Ghedebrav states, legislating in this way is crackers. It's madder than a box of frogs.

    Quite so. I was looking for an explanation, not seeking to excuse it.

    How do you enforce it btw? Injunct HM the Q against signing a Finance Act?
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    Pulpstar said:


    Salmond must really be regretting resigning too quickly.

    No. His resignation was one of the most politically brilliant tactical moves ever. He has passed the baton to Sturgeon who is reaching the voters that Salmond couldn't.
    Agreed. Astonishing year in Scottish politics. An upheaval not seen since before WW2.
  • marke09marke09 Posts: 926
    .
    +1 for 'Ballot Monkeys' - it was obviously written, filmed and edited only a couple of hours before it went out, while remaining impartial enough to lampoon everyone. Great work by the production team at C4.

    the stars of the show were on The One Show last night said they get the scripts at 11am
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736

    dr_spyn said:

    BBC Brand doesn't vote...POEMWAS.

    As was pointed out on the utterly brilliant 'Ballot Monkeys' last night, even if Brand had come out and told all his supporters - that he had previously told not to vote - to now vote Labour, the chances are they wouldn't be able to because Miliband was so stupid he waited until after the last registration date had passed before he made an approach to Brand.
    So far today Miliband is crap, dangerous, loony, unconstitutional, patronising, stupid, mad.

    I will add underestimated as 35% appear willing to vote for him and EICIPM is still favourite according to Betfair and Kelner
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Shocking what's going on in Scotland...

    If we do get an EU referendum (which is won by IN) will UKIP get a similar boost in 2020?

    Great question. I'd be looking to back UKIP for wins in their strong areas for c.20 seats in 2020 if a 2nd Tory/LD coalition is formed.
    Anecdotal - Still not a single Labour poster up in my very strong Labour ward, plenty of England flags still up. No UKIP posters either, mind.
    Tbh, I've only seen one poster in my town all campaign. And this is a semi-marginal. Don't recall seeing many in 2010 either though.
  • RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737

    RodCrosby said:

    RodCrosby said:

    What about the scenario where Labour join the SNP in voting down a Tory queen speech, but then decline to form a government themselves. That would lead to a second election, right? One in which the SNP's "vote us, you'll still get Labour" argument would be diminished, and the Tories' "vote Labour, you'll get SNP" will be dead.

    Problem with that is Labour would be perceived as

    i) gutless
    ii) wreckers, trying to force a re-run of an election they had just lost

    I would go so far as to say the the Constitution expects the Leader of the Opposition to step up to the plate in such a scenario, or not bother bringing down the government...
    Yeah, if Labour were significantly behind this would likely be the case. If it was closer, I'm not so sure. I think in England Labour would get credit for not doing a deal with the SNP if that was clearly an option.
    Ludicrous. It would sanction parties bringing each other down, with repeated returns to the polls until someone secured a majority. UK Plc would meantime go down the U-bend...
    Exactly, that's why this country must never accept your cockamanie idea of changing voting to PR.
    Under PR, a majority is almost impossible, so there would be no point trying that gambit.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Sigma Squawk ‏@SigmaSquawk

    US GDP Data (Q1 A):
    GDP - Annualized Q/Q +0.2% v +1.0% expected, previous +2.2%
    Personal Consumption +1.9% v +1.7% expected, previous +4.4%


    Helpful context for the Tories, perhaps.
  • Bob__SykesBob__Sykes Posts: 1,179
    edited April 2015
    I've never believed that the SNP is going to do quite as well as the polls suggest. I can well see canny Scots telling pollsters they'll vote SNP even though they have no intentions of so doing.

    But on these sort of numbers, clearly swathes of Labour and LD seats will fall.

    And of course, that's as much a disaster for Dave as it is Ed, because he needs LD seats to either go Tory or stay LD if he wants to re-boot the Coalition - his only chance of survival realistically. Seeing them go Labour or SNP is a disaster for him.

    What the STV reporting might do is stiffen unionist resolve and encourage more tactical voting.
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    Danny565 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Shocking what's going on in Scotland...

    If we do get an EU referendum (which is won by IN) will UKIP get a similar boost in 2020?

    Great question. I'd be looking to back UKIP for wins in their strong areas for c.20 seats in 2020 if a 2nd Tory/LD coalition is formed.
    Anecdotal - Still not a single Labour poster up in my very strong Labour ward, plenty of England flags still up. No UKIP posters either, mind.
    Tbh, I've only seen one poster in my town all campaign. And this is a semi-marginal. Don't recall seeing many in 2010 either though.
    I'm in a marginal (Brentford and Isleworth) and despite being in a Tory part of the constituency, I've only seen a couple of Labour and one LibDem poster.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,500

    Speedy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Speedy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Murphy must be close to having a breakdown live on National TV now.

    Which channel?
    Talking generally. His count should be fun to watch.
    I know.
    PB's "The Future Leader of Labour" losing his seat will be a nice dessert after the Clegg main course.

    I really dislike leaders who lead their party to sure oblivion.
    When the ship sinks the captain must go with it.
    If it happens, it will hardly be Murphy's fault. The ship was set on course for the reef and the steering disabled ages before he got to the bridge.
    Who was the captain of the ship who set the course & struck the reef ?

    Miliband took over a party in 2010 in a commanding position in Scotland, and has presided over one disastrous decision after another. It was the win by the SNP in Holyrood in 2011 that led to the Indyref.

    Behind the scenes, there must be some Labour apparatchniks absolutely furious with Miliband.

    Miliband isn't fully to blame either. He was on the previous watch, despite not knowing anything about navigation. He mistook a bank sheet of paper for a maritime chart.

    It's probably a longstanding thing: as someone said on here recently, Scottish Labour just thought that saying "We're not the Tories" would work forever. They were utterly complacent and lethargic.

    The fact that utter numpties like Jim Devine could become SLab MPs (and in fact he was even party chairman) shows the problem they had. As does the Falkirk controversy.

    And there's a thought: I wonder if some of their problems have been accentuated by Falkirk?
  • BannedInParisBannedInParis Posts: 2,191
    Plato said:

    I was taught by our very keen pre-history teacher about cubits and hands and all things unmetric.

    It's so wonderfully colourful. I hate metric bar millimetres which are great for tiny things in DIY or centilitres for chemistry calculations - otherwise, I'm all Imperial and mentally turn everything metric back into Imperial to get a visual feel for it.

    Miss Plato, a few days ago I explained the pre-decimal system of currency we had to an American (he'd read something about Thatcher looking forward to decimalisation), and his gast was utterly flabbered by it.

    I rather like the bonkers old systems. There's something soulless about the metric system.

    I like:

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c8/English_length_units_graph.png
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,688
    Plato said:

    It's been a long time since C4 was like that - Drop The Dead Donkey was utterly brilliant and filmed within hours of broadcast.

    Sandpit said:

    dr_spyn said:

    BBC Brand doesn't vote...POEMWAS.

    As was pointed out on the utterly brilliant 'Ballot Monkeys' last night, even if Brand had come out and told all his supporters - that he had previously told not to vote - to now vote Labour, the chances are they wouldn't be able to because Miliband was so stupid he waited until after the last registration date had passed before he made an approach to Brand.
    +1 for 'Ballot Monkeys' - it was obviously written, filmed and edited only a couple of hours before it went out, while remaining impartial enough to lampoon everyone. Great work by the production team at C4.
    Same writers. And yes DTDD was brilliant.
  • FernandoFernando Posts: 145
    Miliband becoming PM but losing his shadow foreign secretary is not unprecedented. I happened to Wilson in 1964 when Patrick Gordon walker was defeated at Smethwick. Patrick Gordon walker was still made foreign secretary, IIRC, but finally had to stand down when he lost a by-election at Leyton. I wonder what the future holds for Dougie.
    The youth of his opponent might be no barrier as I remember a 21 year old called Charles Kennedy surprising everyone by ousting Hamish Gray in the Highlands in 1983.

  • MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584
    edited April 2015
    Anorak said:

    Danny565 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Shocking what's going on in Scotland...

    If we do get an EU referendum (which is won by IN) will UKIP get a similar boost in 2020?

    Great question. I'd be looking to back UKIP for wins in their strong areas for c.20 seats in 2020 if a 2nd Tory/LD coalition is formed.
    Anecdotal - Still not a single Labour poster up in my very strong Labour ward, plenty of England flags still up. No UKIP posters either, mind.
    Tbh, I've only seen one poster in my town all campaign. And this is a semi-marginal. Don't recall seeing many in 2010 either though.
    I'm in a marginal (Brentford and Isleworth) and despite being in a Tory part of the constituency, I've only seen a couple of Labour and one LibDem poster.

    I haven't seen many posters, but I have been deluged with mail (mostly from Labour) exhorting be to vote for them.

  • I'm not sure if Labour are really letting the change in Scotland sink in. At the moment they have not lost yet. All those time servers and heavyweights are still drawing salary. The equaivalent of someone heading to bankruptcy, hoping against hhope that the lottery will come through as the reality of it all is too awful.

    The day after on the other hand, with all those P45's and no power of status the bunfight will truly begin and the blame game will begin. At the same time the strategic geniuses in London will be trying to secure Downing street at all costs. I have no belief that will do anything that will be better for the long term. As they believe they are the god guys anything that needs to be done at whatever short term cost to the country, and long term cost to the Union.

    As to Scotland I'm sure they believe they can win those seats back, that it's all a short term problem etc. But so far the SNP have barely put a foot wrong they are on course to breaking peoples long term party loyalties, they won't give up these seats without a fight and I'm sure new grievences against the English can be manufactured with a little bit of provocation.

    I suspect the Labout party will move through the stages of grief, changing back and forth from denial to anger, blame and then acceptance. At the end of it (assuming this change in Scotland is permanent) then the Labour Party might as well be known as London Labour with all the potential problems that will provide in the Long term for it's Northern heartlands.

    UKIP or something like them could provide an alternative to Labout there if they are not careful. People don't like being taking granted for, as soon as they see a viable alternative they can break old allegiances.


  • PongPong Posts: 4,693
    Lennon said:

    Pong said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    Alistair said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    This proposed whitewash is almost impossible. Orkney & Shetland is about as safe a seat as the LDs have, and I suspect they'll hold on to a couple more at least.

    By "they'll hold onto a couple more" do you mean LDs or non-SNP?
    Ha! LDs. Not 'LibLabCon'. In terms of a couple more, I was thinking Thurso plus one of Kennedy, Swinson or Alexander.
    Swinson is the only one who remotely has a chance of those three.
    The labour vote is going to drop off a cliff in East Dunbartonshire, IMO
    Any betting worth doing on Labour lost deposits in Scotland?
    Sadly, Nae.

    The only reasonable bet I could find was on labour to drop below the tories in ayr carrick & cumnock.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    edited April 2015

    I've never believed that the SNP is going to do quite as well as the polls suggest. I can well see canny Scots telling pollsters they'll vote SNP even though they have no intentions of so doing.

    But on these sort of numbers, clearly swathes of Labour and LD seats will fall.

    And of course, that's as much a disaster for Dave as it is Ed, because he needs LD seats to either go Tory or stay LD if he wants to re-boot the Coalition - his only chance of survival realistically. Seeing them go Labour or SNP is a disaster for him.

    What the STV reporting might do is stiffen unionist resolve and encourage more tactical voting.

    With Labour on 20% it is unclear in places like Ayr if the correct tactical choice even is Labour !

    They'll be hopeful in Edinburgh West too. The borders all have 2 unionist challengers, except DCT and they'll be expecting to come second now in Murphy's seat. This poll makes Tactical voting less likely than before imo.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,688

    dr_spyn said:

    BBC Brand doesn't vote...POEMWAS.

    As was pointed out on the utterly brilliant 'Ballot Monkeys' last night, even if Brand had come out and told all his supporters - that he had previously told not to vote - to now vote Labour, the chances are they wouldn't be able to because Miliband was so stupid he waited until after the last registration date had passed before he made an approach to Brand.
    So far today Miliband is crap, dangerous, loony, unconstitutional, patronising, stupid, mad.

    I will add underestimated as 35% appear willing to vote for him and EICIPM is still favourite according to Betfair and Kelner
    So you think it was a bright idea to wait until after registration had closed before trying to persuade the main advocate of non-voting to change his mind?

    No wonder you support Miliband.
  • Blue_rogBlue_rog Posts: 2,019
    RodCrosby said:

    RodCrosby said:

    RodCrosby said:

    What about the scenario where Labour join the SNP in voting down a Tory queen speech, but then decline to form a government themselves. That would lead to a second election, right? One in which the SNP's "vote us, you'll still get Labour" argument would be diminished, and the Tories' "vote Labour, you'll get SNP" will be dead.

    Problem with that is Labour would be perceived as

    i) gutless
    ii) wreckers, trying to force a re-run of an election they had just lost

    I would go so far as to say the the Constitution expects the Leader of the Opposition to step up to the plate in such a scenario, or not bother bringing down the government...
    Yeah, if Labour were significantly behind this would likely be the case. If it was closer, I'm not so sure. I think in England Labour would get credit for not doing a deal with the SNP if that was clearly an option.
    Ludicrous. It would sanction parties bringing each other down, with repeated returns to the polls until someone secured a majority. UK Plc would meantime go down the U-bend...
    Exactly, that's why this country must never accept your cockamanie idea of changing voting to PR.
    Under PR, a majority is almost impossible, so there would be no point trying that gambit.
    Rod, even PR^2?
  • Plato said:

    And compare his sins to later MPs who held on. Can't bear him myself. Losing 22k - wow.

    Sandpit said:

    Plato said:

    What's the biggest safe seat overturn?

    Anorak said:

    RobC said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pong said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    TGOHF said:

    Alistair said:

    TGOHF said:

    Mildly amusing that just as UNS is being discarded at Uk level that it is assumed it will come to pass in Scotland.

    snip

    Swing in Sotland isn't Universal, Ashcroft polls suggest SNP do better than Universal Swing.
    Alistair said:

    TGOHF said:



    snip

    Swing in Sotland isn't Universal, Ashcroft polls suggest SNP do better than Universal Swing.
    They do better than UNS in every constituency ? Only "Natlogic" could come up with that..
    No, they'll do worse than UNS in Edinburgh. But lower swings are needed there. They'll outperform in Glasgow and the west where the 50+% majorities need to be toppled. They also do worse in LD/Con seats - hence Berwickshire and DCT having lower swings.
    How will they do in the five straight SNP/Con seats? That's an interesting dynamic
    The SNP seats are easy holds. Perth North Perthshire is not a 1-1000 shot though.
    Oh yes, I wasn't suggesting they would not take them! More I think the swing may be rather small in Perth, Angus, Moray, Banff etc - their opposition is holding on as opposed to collapsing there.
    I'd expect Dundee East and Western Isles to have comfortably the largest majorities in Scotland.
    We could have a PB competition, predict SLAB's best performance with a tie breaker on who comes closest to the actual majority %.

    I'd have the top contenders down as;

    Glasgow NE
    E. Renfrewshire
    Ed S
    Aberdeen S

    Any I'm missing?
    Dumfries Galloway
    Dumferline West Fife
    Rutherglen, Hamilton ?
    Which seat is Dougie Alexander and his 17000 majority? Apparently he's standing against a 20 yr old student. Must have a chance surely?
    A chance maybe, but a slim one. Mhairi Black is sweeping all before her (and good for her!).
    Neil Hamilton had a 22,000 majority overturned in 1997
    http://www.totalpolitics.com/print/3783/top-tenshock-election-results.thtml
    Hamilton is now UKIP.

    Figures.
  • DanielDaniel Posts: 160
    SLAB was already taking on water before Murphy turned up. 2011 Scottish Elections was the first major sign - all the polls said the SNP would be out of office. In fact, they got a majority. Labour's election campaign just collapsed and was unable to keep up with the rising SNP popularity.

    History is repeating itself.

    As one Labour activist put it to me, SLAB couldn't "organise a piss up in a brewery". There was no structure, no organisation or local leadership to deal with the SNP. All SLAB MP's more or less focus on Westminster, not Scotland.

    And this is killing the party.

  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860
    Plato said:

    I was taught by our very keen pre-history teacher about cubits and hands and all things unmetric.

    It's so wonderfully colourful. I hate metric bar millimetres which are great for tiny things in DIY or centilitres for chemistry calculations - otherwise, I'm all Imperial and mentally turn everything metric back into Imperial to get a visual feel for it.

    Miss Plato, a few days ago I explained the pre-decimal system of currency we had to an American (he'd read something about Thatcher looking forward to decimalisation), and his gast was utterly flabbered by it.

    I rather like the bonkers old systems. There's something soulless about the metric system.

    While I broadly enjoy the colourful nature of imperial measures (the pint, most of all), I draw the line at currency, fun as crowns, ha'pennies and guineas are.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,049
    Sandpit said:

    dr_spyn said:

    BBC Brand doesn't vote...POEMWAS.

    As was pointed out on the utterly brilliant 'Ballot Monkeys' last night, even if Brand had come out and told all his supporters - that he had previously told not to vote - to now vote Labour, the chances are they wouldn't be able to because Miliband was so stupid he waited until after the last registration date had passed before he made an approach to Brand.
    +1 for 'Ballot Monkeys' - it was obviously written, filmed and edited only a couple of hours before it went out, while remaining impartial enough to lampoon everyone. Great work by the production team at C4.
    They were excellent a few days ago, on Milifandom -1 when the American one from Episodes consultant said: we must expose Ed more and lo...the next day - Milifandom.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    Worth recalling the massive SNP surge and Labour collapse shown in the opinion polls for Holyrood 2011. Then, as now, lots of people couldn't believe it, and thought that on the day Labour would do better than the polls were predicting.

    It didn't work out like that. In fact if anything Labour did slightly worse than most polls were showing:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_in_the_Scottish_Parliament_election,_2011
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,932
    RodCrosby said:

    RodCrosby said:

    RodCrosby said:

    What about the scenario where Labour join the SNP in voting down a Tory queen speech, but then decline to form a government themselves. That would lead to a second election, right? One in which the SNP's "vote us, you'll still get Labour" argument would be diminished, and the Tories' "vote Labour, you'll get SNP" will be dead.

    Problem with that is Labour would be perceived as

    i) gutless
    ii) wreckers, trying to force a re-run of an election they had just lost

    I would go so far as to say the the Constitution expects the Leader of the Opposition to step up to the plate in such a scenario, or not bother bringing down the government...
    Yeah, if Labour were significantly behind this would likely be the case. If it was closer, I'm not so sure. I think in England Labour would get credit for not doing a deal with the SNP if that was clearly an option.
    Ludicrous. It would sanction parties bringing each other down, with repeated returns to the polls until someone secured a majority. UK Plc would meantime go down the U-bend...
    Exactly, that's why this country must never accept your cockamanie idea of changing voting to PR.
    Under PR, a majority is almost impossible, so there would be no point trying that gambit.
    Under PR a strong coalition is quite likely and, more to the point people can vote for their first choice rather than tactically.
    In Scotland the unionist parties would get their ~50% rather than 0%.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    Pong said:

    Lennon said:

    Pong said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    Alistair said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    This proposed whitewash is almost impossible. Orkney & Shetland is about as safe a seat as the LDs have, and I suspect they'll hold on to a couple more at least.

    By "they'll hold onto a couple more" do you mean LDs or non-SNP?
    Ha! LDs. Not 'LibLabCon'. In terms of a couple more, I was thinking Thurso plus one of Kennedy, Swinson or Alexander.
    Swinson is the only one who remotely has a chance of those three.
    The labour vote is going to drop off a cliff in East Dunbartonshire, IMO
    Any betting worth doing on Labour lost deposits in Scotland?
    Sadly, Nae.

    The only reasonable bet I could find was on labour to drop below the tories in ayr carrick & cumnock.
    Labour could do with losing some deposits - the sublime efficiency of their previous 41% becomes a terribly inefficient 25% now or w/e.
  • RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    Blue_rog said:

    RodCrosby said:

    RodCrosby said:

    RodCrosby said:

    What about the scenario where Labour join the SNP in voting down a Tory queen speech, but then decline to form a government themselves. That would lead to a second election, right? One in which the SNP's "vote us, you'll still get Labour" argument would be diminished, and the Tories' "vote Labour, you'll get SNP" will be dead.

    Problem with that is Labour would be perceived as

    i) gutless
    ii) wreckers, trying to force a re-run of an election they had just lost

    I would go so far as to say the the Constitution expects the Leader of the Opposition to step up to the plate in such a scenario, or not bother bringing down the government...
    Yeah, if Labour were significantly behind this would likely be the case. If it was closer, I'm not so sure. I think in England Labour would get credit for not doing a deal with the SNP if that was clearly an option.
    Ludicrous. It would sanction parties bringing each other down, with repeated returns to the polls until someone secured a majority. UK Plc would meantime go down the U-bend...
    Exactly, that's why this country must never accept your cockamanie idea of changing voting to PR.
    Under PR, a majority is almost impossible, so there would be no point trying that gambit.
    Rod, even PR^2?
    A majority would be possible, but about as unlikely as currently under FPTP.
  • RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    Fernando said:

    Miliband becoming PM but losing his shadow foreign secretary is not unprecedented. I happened to Wilson in 1964 when Patrick Gordon walker was defeated at Smethwick. Patrick Gordon walker was still made foreign secretary, IIRC, but finally had to stand down when he lost a by-election at Leyton. I wonder what the future holds for Dougie.
    The youth of his opponent might be no barrier as I remember a 21 year old called Charles Kennedy surprising everyone by ousting Hamish Gray in the Highlands in 1983.

    Kennedy was 23.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    dr_spyn said:

    BBC Brand doesn't vote...POEMWAS.

    As was pointed out on the utterly brilliant 'Ballot Monkeys' last night, even if Brand had come out and told all his supporters - that he had previously told not to vote - to now vote Labour, the chances are they wouldn't be able to because Miliband was so stupid he waited until after the last registration date had passed before he made an approach to Brand.
    So far today Miliband is crap, dangerous, loony, unconstitutional, patronising, stupid, mad.

    I will add underestimated as 35% appear willing to vote for him and EICIPM is still favourite according to Betfair and Kelner
    So you think it was a bright idea to wait until after registration had closed before trying to persuade the main advocate of non-voting to change his mind?

    No wonder you support Miliband.
    You only had to register to vote if you weren't already registered at your address didnt you?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    Worth recalling the massive SNP surge and Labour collapse shown in the opinion polls for Holyrood 2011. Then, as now, lots of people couldn't believe it, and thought that on the day Labour would do better than the polls were predicting.

    It didn't work out like that. In fact if anything Labour did slightly worse than most polls were showing:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_in_the_Scottish_Parliament_election,_2011

    A wiki page of horror for SLAB.
  • BannedInParisBannedInParis Posts: 2,191
    edited April 2015
    marke09 said:


    +1 for 'Ballot Monkeys' - it was obviously written, filmed and edited only a couple of hours before it went out, while remaining impartial enough to lampoon everyone. Great work by the production team at C4.



    did like the little bit about the rebutting the rebuttal and checking the rebutted rebuttal. it was like some of the posts on here.
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,780
    Milbrand interview is live....
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    edited April 2015
    MiliBrand videoy wookie doo..booo Google tax dodgers...oh do I get revenue from this..shhh don't tell anybody...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDZm9_uKtyo&amp;
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,149
    edited April 2015
    Plato said:

    I was taught by our very keen pre-history teacher about cubits and hands and all things unmetric.

    It's so wonderfully colourful. I hate metric bar millimetres which are great for tiny things in DIY or centilitres for chemistry calculations - otherwise, I'm all Imperial and mentally turn everything metric back into Imperial to get a visual feel for it.

    Miss Plato, a few days ago I explained the pre-decimal system of currency we had to an American (he'd read something about Thatcher looking forward to decimalisation), and his gast was utterly flabbered by it.

    I rather like the bonkers old systems. There's something soulless about the metric system.

    Maybe it's my interest in WW1 and WW2 battleships as a teen, but I know without Googling that 12 inches is 305 mm (eg. main guns on HMS Dreadnought), 13.5 inches is 343 mm (eg. HMS Iron Duke), 14 inches is 356 mm (eg. HMS Canada), 15 inches is 381 mm (eg. HMS Hood), 16 inches is 406 mm (eg. HMS Nelson) and 18 inches is 457 mm (eg. Japan's Yamato).

    :)
  • Bob__SykesBob__Sykes Posts: 1,179

    Anorak said:

    Danny565 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Shocking what's going on in Scotland...

    If we do get an EU referendum (which is won by IN) will UKIP get a similar boost in 2020?

    Great question. I'd be looking to back UKIP for wins in their strong areas for c.20 seats in 2020 if a 2nd Tory/LD coalition is formed.
    Anecdotal - Still not a single Labour poster up in my very strong Labour ward, plenty of England flags still up. No UKIP posters either, mind.
    Tbh, I've only seen one poster in my town all campaign. And this is a semi-marginal. Don't recall seeing many in 2010 either though.
    I'm in a marginal (Brentford and Isleworth) and despite being in a Tory part of the constituency, I've only seen a couple of Labour and one LibDem poster.

    I haven't seen many posters, but I have been deluged with mail (mostly from Labour) exhorting be to vote for them.

    Very few mailings still in Bury South. Apart from the Labour leaflets, some time ago now, we had a UKIP leaflet at the weekend. Which caused some amusement - the candidate openly confirms he is an Irish immigrant who came to the UK to study French and German, no less, at Salford University and has stayed ever since, and used to work as an immigration officer.

    I think you must have joined the wrong party, Seamus...

    http://seamusmartin.com/about-seamus
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143
    edited April 2015

    Plato said:

    I was taught by our very keen pre-history teacher about cubits and hands and all things unmetric.

    It's so wonderfully colourful. I hate metric bar millimetres which are great for tiny things in DIY or centilitres for chemistry calculations - otherwise, I'm all Imperial and mentally turn everything metric back into Imperial to get a visual feel for it.

    Miss Plato, a few days ago I explained the pre-decimal system of currency we had to an American (he'd read something about Thatcher looking forward to decimalisation), and his gast was utterly flabbered by it.

    I rather like the bonkers old systems. There's something soulless about the metric system.

    I like:

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c8/English_length_units_graph.png
    Most of my skeins of yarn are a bit short (or long?)! Confused now...
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    Pulpstar said:

    Worth recalling the massive SNP surge and Labour collapse shown in the opinion polls for Holyrood 2011. Then, as now, lots of people couldn't believe it, and thought that on the day Labour would do better than the polls were predicting.

    It didn't work out like that. In fact if anything Labour did slightly worse than most polls were showing:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_in_the_Scottish_Parliament_election,_2011

    A wiki page of horror for SLAB.
    But very happy betting memories!

    Pity about the Victor Chandler account, though..
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Millsy said:

    Apparently more Lord Ashcroft constituency polls out today?

    Hallam, Thanet South and another one which I can't recall.
  • DanielDaniel Posts: 160
    Russell Brand is interviewing Bennett today, from the Greens. He's trying to interview as many politicians as he can.

    Interesting, Labour Press Team are not acknowledging it. Don't know why. Brand admits it wasn't a perfect interview, but he didn't bury him.
  • RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737

    RodCrosby said:

    RodCrosby said:

    RodCrosby said:

    What about the scenario where Labour join the SNP in voting down a Tory queen speech, but then decline to form a government themselves. That would lead to a second election, right? One in which the SNP's "vote us, you'll still get Labour" argument would be diminished, and the Tories' "vote Labour, you'll get SNP" will be dead.

    Problem with that is Labour would be perceived as

    i) gutless
    ii) wreckers, trying to force a re-run of an election they had just lost

    I would go so far as to say the the Constitution expects the Leader of the Opposition to step up to the plate in such a scenario, or not bother bringing down the government...
    Yeah, if Labour were significantly behind this would likely be the case. If it was closer, I'm not so sure. I think in England Labour would get credit for not doing a deal with the SNP if that was clearly an option.
    Ludicrous. It would sanction parties bringing each other down, with repeated returns to the polls until someone secured a majority. UK Plc would meantime go down the U-bend...
    Exactly, that's why this country must never accept your cockamanie idea of changing voting to PR.
    Under PR, a majority is almost impossible, so there would be no point trying that gambit.
    Under PR a strong coalition is quite likely and, more to the point people can vote for their first choice rather than tactically.
    In Scotland the unionist parties would get their ~50% rather than 0%.
    Quite.
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    Pulpstar said:

    Worth recalling the massive SNP surge and Labour collapse shown in the opinion polls for Holyrood 2011. Then, as now, lots of people couldn't believe it, and thought that on the day Labour would do better than the polls were predicting.

    It didn't work out like that. In fact if anything Labour did slightly worse than most polls were showing:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_in_the_Scottish_Parliament_election,_2011

    A wiki page of horror for SLAB.
    Nice to see Yougov overstated Labour and understated the Conservatives.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736
    Brand seems quite impressed.

    Awaits DH disaster for Ed tweets
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    edited April 2015
    SeanT said:

    @zerohedge 4m4 minutes ago
    US Economy Grinds To A Halt: Q1 GDP Tumbles Below Expectations, Grows Only 0.2% http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-04-29/us-economy-grinds-halt-q1-gdp-tumbles-below-expectations-grows-only-02

    I think that's 0.2% annualised, so actually zero growth, in essence.

    That puts our 0.3% in context. We are growing much faster than the USA, but the world economy is slowing.

    Krugman is as we speak busy penning an article saying how awesome Obama handling of the economy is despite tough conditions and how the UK Coalition has trashed ours.
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,780
    thats a utter shocker for the US economy.
  • BannedInParisBannedInParis Posts: 2,191
    SeanT said:

    @zerohedge 4m4 minutes ago
    US Economy Grinds To A Halt: Q1 GDP Tumbles Below Expectations, Grows Only 0.2% http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-04-29/us-economy-grinds-halt-q1-gdp-tumbles-below-expectations-grows-only-02

    I think that's 0.2% annualised, so actually zero growth, in essence.

    That puts our 0.3% in context. We are growing much faster than the USA, but the world economy is slowing.

    cue all the slowdown headlines ... right ... ?
  • NemtynakhtNemtynakht Posts: 2,329
    NoEasyDay said:

    The VAT law move, like the foreign aid budget law, is pathetic and ridiculous in equal measure.

    I agree problem is though, after the Blair Brown years nobody believes in a politicians promises. So they have to find a way to make them stick....
    Cameron - VAT
    Clegg - tuition fees
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    Daniel said:

    Russell Brand is interviewing Bennett today, from the Greens. He's trying to interview as many politicians as he can.

    Interesting, Labour Press Team are not acknowledging it. Don't know why. Brand admits it wasn't a perfect interview, but he didn't bury him.

    If Cameron agrees to that, I'll march to Downing Street and shoot him myself.

    [Note to MI5: this is a joke, m'kay]
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Jim Murphy’s performance as Labour leader in Scotland has failed to impress voters in its working-class heartland, according to participants in the third of the Financial Times’ pre-election focus groups.

    None of them said they were pleased with Mr Murphy, on whom Labour has pinned its hopes of a renaissance in Scotland.

    “He is very rightwing for a Labour leader,” said Craig Johnstone, a call-centre manager planning to vote for the Scottish National party in next month’s general election. Mr Johnstone’s comments suggested the SNP’s attempts to highlight Mr Murphy’s background on the Blairite wing of the party are having an impact.

    Others said Mr Murphy’s style of delivery might be failing to engender confidence. “He looks like a bag of nerves now,” said Natalie Dines, a former Labour voter now thinking of moving to the Conservatives.

    One risk for Mr Murphy appears to be his association with the party in Westminster; he served in a number of front-bench positions in the last Labour government. Tommy Fulton, another Labour voter, said: “His appointment has put me off voting Labour . . . he has just come up from London.”
    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/5fba7d30-ed91-11e4-987e-00144feab7de.html#axzz3YhYsZT1O
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    Brand seems quite impressed.

    Awaits DH disaster for Ed tweets

    Did the 9/11 truther section stay in ? Any mention of a boycott of Israel ?
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Ace

    Plato said:

    I was taught by our very keen pre-history teacher about cubits and hands and all things unmetric.

    It's so wonderfully colourful. I hate metric bar millimetres which are great for tiny things in DIY or centilitres for chemistry calculations - otherwise, I'm all Imperial and mentally turn everything metric back into Imperial to get a visual feel for it.

    Miss Plato, a few days ago I explained the pre-decimal system of currency we had to an American (he'd read something about Thatcher looking forward to decimalisation), and his gast was utterly flabbered by it.

    I rather like the bonkers old systems. There's something soulless about the metric system.

    I like:

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c8/English_length_units_graph.png
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143

    Plato said:

    I was taught by our very keen pre-history teacher about cubits and hands and all things unmetric.

    It's so wonderfully colourful. I hate metric bar millimetres which are great for tiny things in DIY or centilitres for chemistry calculations - otherwise, I'm all Imperial and mentally turn everything metric back into Imperial to get a visual feel for it.

    Miss Plato, a few days ago I explained the pre-decimal system of currency we had to an American (he'd read something about Thatcher looking forward to decimalisation), and his gast was utterly flabbered by it.

    I rather like the bonkers old systems. There's something soulless about the metric system.

    I like:

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c8/English_length_units_graph.png
    Unfortunately there appears to be at least one mistake. The nautic[al] mile is defined both as 6080 and 6000 (10*100*2*3) feet.
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,780
    SeanT said:

    Milbrand interview is live....

    And God it's boring. It will shift not a single vote, for or against. I expect most of his viewers will turn it off after 3 minutes.

    Tho if I was a tabloid journo I'd be jumping on the chat about "inequality". Two kitchens Miliband talks in Russell Brand's two million pound house about poor people who don't, like Miliband's wife, earn £200,000 a year.
    Russell Brand does have a very nice kitchen
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,416
    Short lunch, quick question. Posters may recall my previous questions about sites that offer spread betting on politics, and the consensus seemed to be that there were only two: spreadex and Sporting Index. Neither company's spreads are captured by oddschecker nor archive.org. Are there any online archives of either company's spreads? Free or for pay, doesn't matter.
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621

    Brand seems quite impressed.

    Awaits DH disaster for Ed tweets

    Well I'm impressed that you got through a 15 minute interview within 6 minutes of its release. Bravo.
  • KentRisingKentRising Posts: 2,917
    Danny565 said:

    Jim Murphy’s performance as Labour leader in Scotland has failed to impress voters in its working-class heartland, according to participants in the third of the Financial Times’ pre-election focus groups.

    None of them said they were pleased with Mr Murphy, on whom Labour has pinned its hopes of a renaissance in Scotland.

    “He is very rightwing for a Labour leader,” said Craig Johnstone, a call-centre manager planning to vote for the Scottish National party in next month’s general election. Mr Johnstone’s comments suggested the SNP’s attempts to highlight Mr Murphy’s background on the Blairite wing of the party are having an impact.

    Others said Mr Murphy’s style of delivery might be failing to engender confidence. “He looks like a bag of nerves now,” said Natalie Dines, a former Labour voter now thinking of moving to the Conservatives.

    One risk for Mr Murphy appears to be his association with the party in Westminster; he served in a number of front-bench positions in the last Labour government. Tommy Fulton, another Labour voter, said: “His appointment has put me off voting Labour . . . he has just come up from London.”
    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/5fba7d30-ed91-11e4-987e-00144feab7de.html#axzz3YhYsZT1O

    So someone accusses of him of being too right-wing, while another intends to switch from Lab to Con....
  • Check out the party funding chart embedded in this:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/general-election-2015/politics-blog/11570792/The-historic-link-between-Labour-and-the-trade-unions-is-about-to-break-thanks-to-the-SNP.html

    How is that ALL the public funding of political parties goes to Labour? Any wonks out there who can explain?
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    edited April 2015
    Reuters is fairly cautious on the US GDP figures - special factors including the particularly severe weather:

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/04/29/us-usa-economy-idUSKBN0NK08520150429
  • NemtynakhtNemtynakht Posts: 2,329

    dr_spyn said:

    BBC Brand doesn't vote...POEMWAS.

    As was pointed out on the utterly brilliant 'Ballot Monkeys' last night, even if Brand had come out and told all his supporters - that he had previously told not to vote - to now vote Labour, the chances are they wouldn't be able to because Miliband was so stupid he waited until after the last registration date had passed before he made an approach to Brand.
    So far today Miliband is crap, dangerous, loony, unconstitutional, patronising, stupid, mad.

    I will add underestimated as 35% appear willing to vote for him and EICIPM is still favourite according to Betfair and Kelner
    If Labour get 35% I will be very surprised. The problem with targeting a solid lump of 35% left leaning voters is you allow yourself to be chipped at by the other parties. Labour have probably lost 2.5% to the SNP, losing almost all seats but probably gained 2.5% red liberals to gain next to no seats across southern England
  • ItwasriggedItwasrigged Posts: 154
    I am beginning to think that not even Orkney and Shetland is safe now. My flabber is well gasted.
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    edited April 2015

    Plato said:

    I was taught by our very keen pre-history teacher about cubits and hands and all things unmetric.

    It's so wonderfully colourful. I hate metric bar millimetres which are great for tiny things in DIY or centilitres for chemistry calculations - otherwise, I'm all Imperial and mentally turn everything metric back into Imperial to get a visual feel for it.

    Miss Plato, a few days ago I explained the pre-decimal system of currency we had to an American (he'd read something about Thatcher looking forward to decimalisation), and his gast was utterly flabbered by it.

    I rather like the bonkers old systems. There's something soulless about the metric system.

    I like:

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c8/English_length_units_graph.png
    Unfortunately there appears to be at least one mistake. The nautic[al] mile is defined both as 6080 and 6000 (10*100*2*3) feet.
    It's been a very 'variable' unit through its history. Now standardised to about 6076 feet (1852m exactly).
  • KentRisingKentRising Posts: 2,917

    Anorak said:

    Danny565 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Shocking what's going on in Scotland...

    If we do get an EU referendum (which is won by IN) will UKIP get a similar boost in 2020?

    Great question. I'd be looking to back UKIP for wins in their strong areas for c.20 seats in 2020 if a 2nd Tory/LD coalition is formed.
    Anecdotal - Still not a single Labour poster up in my very strong Labour ward, plenty of England flags still up. No UKIP posters either, mind.
    Tbh, I've only seen one poster in my town all campaign. And this is a semi-marginal. Don't recall seeing many in 2010 either though.
    I'm in a marginal (Brentford and Isleworth) and despite being in a Tory part of the constituency, I've only seen a couple of Labour and one LibDem poster.

    I haven't seen many posters, but I have been deluged with mail (mostly from Labour) exhorting be to vote for them.

    Very few mailings still in Bury South. Apart from the Labour leaflets, some time ago now, we had a UKIP leaflet at the weekend. Which caused some amusement - the candidate openly confirms he is an Irish immigrant who came to the UK to study French and German, no less, at Salford University and has stayed ever since, and used to work as an immigration officer.

    I think you must have joined the wrong party, Seamus...

    http://seamusmartin.com/about-seamus
    I have migrant friends who are voting UKIP.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    thats a utter shocker for the US economy.

    Shit, just moved my pension a bit more into the Dow !

    Still awaiting Miliband to collapse Sterling ;)
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031

    MiliBrand videoy wookie doo..booo Google tax dodgers...oh do I get revenue from this..shhh don't tell anybody...

    youtube.com/watch?v=RDZm9_uKtyo&

    Michael Deacon's spoof wasn't too far off
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ed-miliband/11568071/Russell-Brand-interviews-Ed-Miliband-exclusive-transcript.html
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    Reuters is fairly cautious on the US GDP figures - special factors including the particular severe weather:

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/04/29/us-usa-economy-idUSKBN0NK08520150429

    You're losing your touch Richard.

    Normally you'd have told us it's lucky we have Osborne and his blistering 0.3%. :-)
  • Blue_rogBlue_rog Posts: 2,019

    Plato said:

    I was taught by our very keen pre-history teacher about cubits and hands and all things unmetric.

    It's so wonderfully colourful. I hate metric bar millimetres which are great for tiny things in DIY or centilitres for chemistry calculations - otherwise, I'm all Imperial and mentally turn everything metric back into Imperial to get a visual feel for it.

    Miss Plato, a few days ago I explained the pre-decimal system of currency we had to an American (he'd read something about Thatcher looking forward to decimalisation), and his gast was utterly flabbered by it.

    I rather like the bonkers old systems. There's something soulless about the metric system.

    I like:

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c8/English_length_units_graph.png
    Unfortunately there appears to be at least one mistake. The nautic[al] mile is defined both as 6080 and 6000 (10*100*2*3) feet.
    Oh please, everyone knows a nautical mile is one arc second!
  • JonnyJimmyJonnyJimmy Posts: 2,548
    SeanT said:

    Milbrand interview is live....

    And God it's boring. It will shift not a single vote, for or against. I expect most of his viewers will turn it off after 3 minutes.

    Tho if I was a tabloid journo I'd be jumping on the chat about "inequality". Two kitchens Miliband talks in Russell Brand's two million pound house about poor people who don't, like Miliband's wife, earn £200,000 a year.
    If only Miliband talked about inequality; no, he talks "inequali'ee", "national 'ealth", says Brand is "to'ally wrong", asks if he accepts his "fundamen'al point" .. I can't watch any more or I might punch my screen
  • dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786
    edited April 2015
    I've been taking a closer peek at the three border seats......

    Dumfries and Galloway - three way battle. Labour defending from 45% but at half 2010 support. Tories coming from 31% in a strong area for them they held notionally in 2001 on boundary changes and have 'won' in scot elections, SNP from the teens surging. Should be SNP gain, Lab can hold if they can energise but why there rather than elsewhere? Tories would take it on a perfect storm if adding 6% to go above 2005s share and Labour holding off an SNP charge

    DCT - looks like Tory hold IF Mundell retains share and can pick up say 4% from the Lab/Lib collapse, otherwise SNP gain

    BRS - weakest constituency in Scotland for SNP and heaviest No presence IMO, however Liberal and Tory are battling each other to a standstill at ca 30%, leaving a relatively low hanging target for minority yessers to take it - perm any one of three.

    Conclusion - I'd back 2-1 with the two and the one goung to SNP and Tory - your choice which way round!
  • kjohnwkjohnw Posts: 1,456

    Danny565 said:

    Jim Murphy’s performance as Labour leader in Scotland has failed to impress voters in its working-class heartland, according to participants in the third of the Financial Times’ pre-election focus groups.

    None of them said they were pleased with Mr Murphy, on whom Labour has pinned its hopes of a renaissance in Scotland.

    “He is very rightwing for a Labour leader,” said Craig Johnstone, a call-centre manager planning to vote for the Scottish National party in next month’s general election. Mr Johnstone’s comments suggested the SNP’s attempts to highlight Mr Murphy’s background on the Blairite wing of the party are having an impact.

    Others said Mr Murphy’s style of delivery might be failing to engender confidence. “He looks like a bag of nerves now,” said Natalie Dines, a former Labour voter now thinking of moving to the Conservatives.

    One risk for Mr Murphy appears to be his association with the party in Westminster; he served in a number of front-bench positions in the last Labour government. Tommy Fulton, another Labour voter, said: “His appointment has put me off voting Labour . . . he has just come up from London.”
    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/5fba7d30-ed91-11e4-987e-00144feab7de.html#axzz3YhYsZT1O
    So someone accusses of him of being too right-wing, while another intends to switch from Lab to Con....

    it would be hilarious if Labour lost all its Scottish seats and the Tories managed to get 1 - 2 seats. Just imagine the Tories outnumbering Labour in Scotland, that would have seemed like a pipe dream 12 months ago
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    edited April 2015

    Normally you'd have told us it's lucky we have Osborne

    The way things are going I don't need to make that point - it will be obvious enough to all shortly.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,500
    Anorak said:

    Daniel said:

    Russell Brand is interviewing Bennett today, from the Greens. He's trying to interview as many politicians as he can.

    Interesting, Labour Press Team are not acknowledging it. Don't know why. Brand admits it wasn't a perfect interview, but he didn't bury him.

    If Cameron agrees to that, I'll march to Downing Street and shoot him myself.

    [Note to MI5: this is a joke, m'kay]
    I can't see Cameron doing it, particularly after his comments yesterday. But it might be fun to see Boris go up against Brand...
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Patrick said:

    Check out the party funding chart embedded in this:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/general-election-2015/politics-blog/11570792/The-historic-link-between-Labour-and-the-trade-unions-is-about-to-break-thanks-to-the-SNP.html

    How is that ALL the public funding of political parties goes to Labour? Any wonks out there who can explain?

    So called Short Money goes to opposition parties to pay for opposition research. Theoretically I assume to hold the government to account and the government is considered not to need it due to having the Civil Service at their disposal.

    Normally the Lib Dems would get a chunk of the Short Money but since they are a part of the government they're ineligible now.

    Curious if it means the SNP could get a chunk of it next time.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    SeanT said:

    Milbrand interview is live....

    And God it's boring. It will shift not a single vote, for or against. I expect most of his viewers will turn it off after 3 minutes.

    Tho if I was a tabloid journo I'd be jumping on the chat about "inequality". Two kitchens Miliband talks in Russell Brand's two million pound house about poor people who don't, like Miliband's wife, earn £200,000 a year.
    If only Miliband talked about inequality; no, he talks "inequali'ee", "national 'ealth", says Brand is "to'ally wrong", asks if he accepts his "fundamen'al point" .. I can't watch any more or I might punch my screen
    Some regional accents are more equal than others
This discussion has been closed.