' [yes I know UKIP has other policies, but no one knows them, and no one cares]'
To be fair I rather like the uniforms for taxi driver's policy but don't know if Farage's plan to privatize the NHS is his own policy or UKIP's
Is Farage going to up the ante on Eds Owl Policy - perhaps a Golden Eagle or Osprey for every voter?
Personally i think Cameron's gurus idea of abolishing maternity leave will be a vote winner (with child hating misogynists anyway). Charging car parking fees in Supermarket car parks was another good one. Abolishing job centres would seem to be a winner as well as does centrally controlled regional pay.
Of course the idea that government should use cloud busting technology to make the weather better probably tops the lot!
The best work on the Thirty Years War I've ever read was CV Wedgewood's. You should probably start by reading Geoffrey Parker on the Dutch Revolt to set the scene...
There's a new Parker about Seventeenth Century Europe which might be good. It's on my Kindle, and I'm hoping to read it over Christmas :-)
So Panorama are finally running the Fake Sheikh story and we are hit with the sob story of former page 3 girl stitched up by him to get him coke.
Except not mentioned on the website, and only briefly covered in the VT.
Firstly, she admits she was drug users and take drugs on tape (as well ultimately procuring drugs for Fake Shriek), and has also since been found guilty of being a drug producer, but in her words she isn't a criminal.
I do find these stories very odd. If somebody came up to me and said get me some coke, I wouldn't know where to get some, certainly not in the next few hours. It is claimed in this story that the dealer was also in the pay of Mahmood, but again nobody forces you to go to this guy and get drugs.
I hope Panorama have more than drugs producer / drugs takers says Mahmood encouraged me to buy drugs, so I did, but I'm not a criminal.
Mr. Me, Theodore Dodge has a biography of Gustavus Adolphus (not sure if it's only available as an e-book or not).
I've got the sample on my Kindle but have only read a little. I should stress that I really like his ancient biographies, and am far less taken with his work on Napoleon, so I'm not sure how it'll stack up.
Thanks Morris - there are some physical copies knocking around, but it doesn't seem to be currently in print.
Apart from the fact that he didn't say that. And he seems to be making Ed an offer he can't possibly accept, that is correct. In other words, small spherical objects.
Conservatives see Ukip in the same way that LDs are seen by Labour - a subservient party to the real masters . Their irritation when they realise they are mistaken makes their brains scramble.
I may never vote Conservative but I gave them credit for having a realistic view of the world. Bur some are now acting as daft as Tony Benn on acid.
While the Protestant reformation and Catholic counter reformation does have a degree of resemblance to the internal conflicts in the Middle East, it does have some major differences.
The Protestant reformation was a fundamental threat to the state and Catholic church as the basis of Protestantism is to go back to the source material and study it directly which meant translating the Bible into common tongues. This was the driver for mass education and also for a culture of self improvement, and hence the capitalist and Industrial revolutions. The Catholic church preferred to keep the Bible in obsolete languages so that interpretation and dogma could be controlled by the organised Church.
In practice studying the Koran seems to displace other study and self improvement; such as Boko Haram or ISIS, with little room for individual interpretations.
Christopher Hill wrote a very interesting tome on how political and revolutionary conflict was expressed in religious language in Seventeenth century England, I quite recommend it:
I think Farage has made a huge strategic mistake with his Miliband comments. It won't affect R&S but it will hurt UKIP's chances of converting Tories at the GE.
6 weeks of this coarse braggard on tv every night during the GE campaign ? What could go wrong ?
Especially if he has had a good lunch.
I suspect there are going to be some very unwise words during the election from some of their lower tier candidates. The press are going to lap them up - and enjoy Nigel having to tell us "that candidate does not represent the party" five times a day!
So a repeat of the 2014 EU Parliament election campaign then?
Way more candidates. Greater scope for meltdown.
If the 2015 election campaign is all about UKIP, Con/Lab will have already given up.
UKIP will be a story in 2015, for sure. Whether it is the story they want it to be is still very much up in the air....
Lab might give up by then, with Ed at the helm. Us Tories? Like hell we will...
'Everything but the kitchen sink'?
Primaries? Smearing? Attack Ads? Push Polling?
Primaries won't (or shouldn't) be a thing this late, need candidates in place by now.
Most of the rest, quite probably.
Doesn't seem to be working as yet does it?
Not really.
You have any read on what UKIP's local organisation is like (either general or seat specific), I suspect it'll be patchy and that'll hit UKIP's overall vote total if not necessarily its seat total.
All I have seen is Clacton, but that is a one off which couldn't be replicated at a GE
Thurrock is meant to be very good, probably the best they/we have
I have nothing to compare them with though, as the politics game is v new to me
I am now off to Upton Park to watch a load of immigrants play football, 50% of whom will be Eastern European!
@kle4 A Labour UKIP coalition? Can't see it. Which ministerial positions would Labour be prepared to give Farage? Confidence & Supply, maybe. For about 6 months.
Apart from the fact that he didn't say that. And he seems to be making Ed an offer he can't possibly accept, that is correct. In other words, small spherical objects.
Conservatives see Ukip in the same way that LDs are seen by Labour - a subservient party to the real masters . Their irritation when they realise they are mistaken makes their brains scramble.
I may never vote Conservative but I gave them credit for having a realistic view of the world. Bur some are now acting as daft as Tony Benn on acid.
"Apart from the fact that he didn't say that"
Hmmm...
Reminds me of something...
Oh yes! The cast-iron guarantee "broken" by Cameron.
This was a promise he made before the Lisbon treaty was in force. Kippers propagate the ridiculous idea that he could or should have held a referendum on something that was already signed and sealed.
He had to adjust his stance once Brown had signed it. The only way he could have undone it was by having a referendum on our membership of the EU. Which, guess what, he's planning to do. He couldn't have done it sooner because we don't have a Tory government and the LDs wouldn't have ever agreed to it.
Kippers know this, yet they persist with their nonsensical spin. They pretend to be different from other parties, but things like this prove they're the same.
And they wouldn't be any different to any other political party if they were, god forbid, ever to get their hands on any levers of power.
The reformation was part of the enlightenment or a heresy depending on your viewpoint. But to be fair to Catholicism, it did try to move with the scientific times. In fact, it helped it along. Apart from Gregor Mendel, there was also the "Father of the Big Bang theory", George Lemaitre.
"The Catholic church preferred to keep the Bible in obsolete languages so that interpretation and dogma could be controlled by the organised Church."
Yes, the lack of potential control was seen as a route to every man and his dog making up his own dogma. Yet science was seen as a route to advancement.
Islam somehow lost the urge to study "God's handiwork" and fell behind in the sciences. So Boko Haram is a logical conclusion.
Never mind Farage says he would do a deal with Labour. Would Labour be mad enough to do a deal with Farage?
If that's what it took to gain a majority? Possibly.
Won't happen because Miliband would not agree to an EU referendum up front and that is Farage's minimum price for support. Furthermore can you imagine the uproar? The Guardianista wing of the Labour Party would have an apoplectic fit. Islington and Primrose Hill would riot. There would be meltdown in Maida Vale!
So BBC Panorama, why do you keep having to show the same 20s of irrelevant footage showing recent film of Mahmood's face, over and over and over again, which has nothing to do with what they are talking about. That noise you can hear is a massive axe being ground.
Panorama, like Newsnight, used to be a serious and good programme. That 30 mins was all smear, all innuendo, all testimony from individuals who admit they undertook criminal acts.
That isn't to say his methods aren't dodgy and there is shit coming down the pipeline, anybody who saw the proper documentary CH4 did a while back would know that.
You 'orrible lot have always been a fabulous source of recommendations for history books, so I wondered whether anyone had come across any decent tomes on the Thirty Years' War?
It's a gap in my historical knowledge, one branch of the family comes from that way, and I'm curious about the - admittedly superficial - parallels that might be drawn with the escalating Sunni-Shia conflict in the Middle East.
It also seems like it would be nearly as good a setting for a computer game as the Sengoku Jidai.
Both recommendations (Wilson and Wedgewood) are well worth reading. It's a tough subject as is made clear in the intro to Wilson's where he notes that in a recent poll, that conflict was ranked by Germans as their greatest national tragedy ever (rightly, IMO). There are parallels with the current Sunni-Shia conflicts, though as with all historical parallels, one should be very careful as to how and when to apply them. If anything, the biggest one is that 'it was (is) a lot more complex than that'!
I tend to agree. Cammo's so-called pledge gave him wriggle room and he took it. I understood what he meant and still can't see what the fuss was about. At worst, he was being a little slippery. In other words, he was being a politician.
It's the same with the £1.7bn from Europe. He won't be paying the full amount on December 1st.
At all seven general elections 1945-1966 the majority was always less than 800 votes, and twice lower than 100. It changed hands 4 times, twice against the national tide.
Large concentration of organised agricultural workers in many rural areas led to Labour representation.As agriculture mechanised those who worked on the land lost numbers and political influence.
On topic, I don't think it's been noted that the Mori poll is another reasonable one for the Lib Dems by their recent standards: 9% is their best with Mori since May and hasn't been higher with them since March. It may just be a blip but it's not the only series to have nudged upwards of late. I wouldn't read too much into the trend yet but it's worth keeping an eye on.
Mr. CD13, it was not always so. In the 15th (and other) centuries, the Ottoman Empire was at the heart of scientific advancement (notably, for the Byzantines, in the field of gunpowder and cannons).
I tend to agree. Cammo's so-called pledge gave him wriggle room and he took it. I understood what he meant and still can't see what the fuss was about. At worst, he was being a little slippery. In other words, he was being a politician.
It's the same with the £1.7bn from Europe. He won't be paying the full amount on December 1st.
The "victory" painted of getting the rebate applied to the £1.7bn really pi$$ed me off, having initially quite vociferously defended Cam&Os over it.
But..
It does seem to have worked quite well for them. I'm still annoyed that they fooled me, but have been quietly pleased that they haven't taken the hit I thought they deserved over it.
Regarding the 30 Years War, Schiller wrote a trilogy about the commander Wallenstein. If you can't face the trilogy, then there is a single play adaptation by Mike Poulton, which I saw at Chichester a few years ago and would recommend. I find it a fascinating period. I was thrilled when I visited Prague to see the window where the famous defenestration which sparked the war took place (although it isn't that high above the ground.)
Ref UKIP and Labour, if you're a minor party, you do a deal with whoever is prepared to give you most of what you want, providing that you believe that they will deliver and that in cutting the deal you won't upset too many of your own activists and supporters.
From his point of view, Farage is right to say he'd deal with Labour; he can't allow UKIP to be seen as only being willing to support the Tories in Westminster. In reality, I very much doubt that Labour would be prepared to offer UKIP anything like what they'd accept or anything like what the Conservatives would but that's not the point.
Odd line by Farage. Can't imagine him being open to a deal with Labour would go down well with ex-Conservatives or ex-Labour types.
Also, amused he said he'd do a deal with the Devil to get a referendum, given it'll (almost certainly) be in the Conservative manifesto.
Depends what the deal is. Farage has previously said that the minimum price for a deal is an EU referendum within months of a new government being formed. He has also indicated he would probably only consider a confidence and supply arrangement. Therefore he would still be free to block any contentious left wing proposals outside the budget. In many ways its the best of all worlds.
There will be tens of thousands of Labour voters in what will notionally be Tory/ UKIP marginals. Indicating that he would not rule out a deal with Labour under the right circumstances only enhances the 'Vote UKIP get Labour' narrative that the Tories have so kindly created for him.......
And as an ex conservative that doesn't bother me one iota particularly when the Tories have collaborated with the likes of Milburn, Hutton, Hoey, Adonis, Field etc during this government.
Reality is Miliband would never do such a deal. So all Farage is doing is not alienating a whole group of voters who are pretty much closed to voting Tory but who at a push might vote UKIP to get rid of the Tories. In fact based on policies the Tories are generally closer to the Labour position than UKIP
At all seven general elections 1945-1966 the majority was always less than 800 votes, and twice lower than 100. It changed hands 4 times, twice against the national tide.
Large concentration of organised agricultural workers in many rural areas led to Labour representation.As agriculture mechanised those who worked on the land lost numbers and political influence.
Especially so in Norfolk which had great landed estates and consequently plenty of poorly paid, landless agricultural workers.
Suffolk by contrast was dominated by small holdings and tenant farmers and so Labour never had much appeal in the rural areas there.
Ref UKIP and Labour, if you're a minor party, you do a deal with whoever is prepared to give you most of what you want, providing that you believe that they will deliver and that in cutting the deal you won't upset too many of your own activists and supporters.
From his point of view, Farage is right to say he'd deal with Labour; he can't allow UKIP to be seen as only being willing to support the Tories in Westminster. In reality, I very much doubt that Labour would be prepared to offer UKIP anything like what they'd accept or anything like what the Conservatives would but that's not the point.
It also makes him sound like a serious player at Westminster, which he isn't yet and might not be at all.
The reformation was part of the enlightenment or a heresy depending on your viewpoint. But to be fair to Catholicism, it did try to move with the scientific times. In fact, it helped it along. Apart from Gregor Mendel, there was also the "Father of the Big Bang theory", George Lemaitre.
"The Catholic church preferred to keep the Bible in obsolete languages so that interpretation and dogma could be controlled by the organised Church."
Yes, the lack of potential control was seen as a route to every man and his dog making up his own dogma. Yet science was seen as a route to advancement.
Islam somehow lost the urge to study "God's handiwork" and fell behind in the sciences. So Boko Haram is a logical conclusion.
Just my two pennyworth.
There have certainly been many good Catholic scientists, but mostly after the Protestant revolution had made going back to the old world impossible, scientifically as well as politically. Mendel incidentally is thought to have falsified his results to meet his theories on inheritance! Certainly some Catholic countries were more interested in science, Gallileo in Padua for example, but this was in part driven by commercial interest. Astronomy being important for navigation, and interestingly Venice was not an absolutist state. Gallileo's problems began when he ventured into the Papal states...
Studying theology and studying science are quite separate and often conflicting domains, it was more the Protestant ethos of education, study and challenging orthodoxy that set the seed for modern scientific method.
My thanks to those Conservative supporters who this morning responded to my asking if they thought the government's responded to the Rotherham report was acceptable or not.
It's unfortunate for Labour that they should have a penchant for selecting MP's whose ambition exceeds their abilities. There is no doubt that Brown was an outstanding chancellor but not a leader. Ed even less so. Cameron armed with his public school/Eton ethos might believe he was born to rule......but Ed?
I thought Brown had a plan. I even-with no evidence whatsoever-thought Ed might have one. Possibly keeping his powder dry. I thought his conference speech might be a wolf whistle that I couldn't pick up on.
..........Well we're now looking at Christmas and even I as a Labour supporter can't think of a single reason why I should vote Labour. Well maybe not being Tory but the Greens aren't Tory either.
Labour have chosen a lemon and it's time to make a move.....
This is despite supporting a party which campaigns entirely on the negative platform of how terrible the EU and various brown people are.
So you're saying I'm too, er, "brown" to vote UKIP (like wot I did at the Euros back in May)?
How racist of you!
Except thats not what he is saying. But a leading UKIP MEP did call another of her brown supporters a 'ting tong' and then had the nerve to say they were being selfish in complaining. Its your saddo problem if you want to associate with that kind of party.
Well, perhaps it would be better if they didn't name their restaurants Ting Tong, then?
This is despite supporting a party which campaigns entirely on the negative platform of how terrible the EU and various brown people are.
So you're saying I'm too, er, "brown" to vote UKIP (like wot I did at the Euros back in May)?
How racist of you!
Except thats not what he is saying. But a leading UKIP MEP did call another of her brown supporters a 'ting tong' and then had the nerve to say they were being selfish in complaining. Its your saddo problem if you want to associate with that kind of party.
Well, perhaps it would be better if they didn't name their restaurants Ting Tong, then?
Comments
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/vat-food-childrens-clothes-conservative-2806605
The best work on the Thirty Years War I've ever read was CV Wedgewood's. You should probably start by reading Geoffrey Parker on the Dutch Revolt to set the scene...
There's a new Parker about Seventeenth Century Europe which might be good. It's on my Kindle, and I'm hoping to read it over Christmas :-)
Mark Reckless ✔ @MarkReckless
@GregHands @GuidoFawkes @DouglasCarswell ... being trolled by Conservatives' Deputy Chief Whip
Retweeted by Douglas Carswell MP
re this one...
Greg Hands@GregHands · 1 hr1 hour ago
Farage says he will prop up Miliband. Carswell voted with Labour last week. Where does this leave @MarkReckless? http://order-order.com/2014/11/12/red-ukip-farage-claims-he-will-prop-up-miliband/?utm_source=Guy+Fawkes'+Blog+List&utm_campaign=8652112268-happy+hour&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_547885726c-8652112268-225748877 …
Except not mentioned on the website, and only briefly covered in the VT.
Firstly, she admits she was drug users and take drugs on tape (as well ultimately procuring drugs for Fake Shriek), and has also since been found guilty of being a drug producer, but in her words she isn't a criminal.
I do find these stories very odd. If somebody came up to me and said get me some coke, I wouldn't know where to get some, certainly not in the next few hours. It is claimed in this story that the dealer was also in the pay of Mahmood, but again nobody forces you to go to this guy and get drugs.
I hope Panorama have more than drugs producer / drugs takers says Mahmood encouraged me to buy drugs, so I did, but I'm not a criminal.
"Farage says he will prop up Miliband."
Apart from the fact that he didn't say that. And he seems to be making Ed an offer he can't possibly accept, that is correct. In other words, small spherical objects.
Conservatives see Ukip in the same way that LDs are seen by Labour - a subservient party to the real masters
.
Their irritation when they realise they are mistaken makes their brains scramble.
I may never vote Conservative but I gave them credit for having a realistic view of the world. Bur some are now acting as daft as Tony Benn on acid.
1.Mitt Romney
2.Jeb Bush
3.Hillary Clinton
4.Paul Ryan
5.Chris Christie
6.Rick Perry
7.Rand Paul
8.Joe Biden
9.Marco Rubio
10.Ted Cruz
http://cdn.defenseone.com/defenseone/interstitial.html?v=2.1.1&rf=http://www.defenseone.com/politics/2014/11/national-security-professionals-pick-mitt-romney-2016-poll/98774/
More fat to cut off the public sector !
While the Protestant reformation and Catholic counter reformation does have a degree of resemblance to the internal conflicts in the Middle East, it does have some major differences.
The Protestant reformation was a fundamental threat to the state and Catholic church as the basis of Protestantism is to go back to the source material and study it directly which meant translating the Bible into common tongues. This was the driver for mass education and also for a culture of self improvement, and hence the capitalist and Industrial revolutions. The Catholic church preferred to keep the Bible in obsolete languages so that interpretation and dogma could be controlled by the organised Church.
In practice studying the Koran seems to displace other study and self improvement; such as Boko Haram or ISIS, with little room for individual interpretations.
Christopher Hill wrote a very interesting tome on how political and revolutionary conflict was expressed in religious language in Seventeenth century England, I quite recommend it:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-World-Turned-Upside-Down/dp/0140137327
Hmmm...
Reminds me of something...
Oh yes! The cast-iron guarantee "broken" by Cameron.
This was a promise he made before the Lisbon treaty was in force. Kippers propagate the ridiculous idea that he could or should have held a referendum on something that was already signed and sealed.
He had to adjust his stance once Brown had signed it. The only way he could have undone it was by having a referendum on our membership of the EU. Which, guess what, he's planning to do. He couldn't have done it sooner because we don't have a Tory government and the LDs wouldn't have ever agreed to it.
Kippers know this, yet they persist with their nonsensical spin. They pretend to be different from other parties, but things like this prove they're the same.
And they wouldn't be any different to any other political party if they were, god forbid, ever to get their hands on any levers of power.
The reformation was part of the enlightenment or a heresy depending on your viewpoint. But to be fair to Catholicism, it did try to move with the scientific times. In fact, it helped it along. Apart from Gregor Mendel, there was also the "Father of the Big Bang theory", George Lemaitre.
"The Catholic church preferred to keep the Bible in obsolete languages so that interpretation and dogma could be controlled by the organised Church."
Yes, the lack of potential control was seen as a route to every man and his dog making up his own dogma. Yet science was seen as a route to advancement.
Islam somehow lost the urge to study "God's handiwork" and fell behind in the sciences. So Boko Haram is a logical conclusion.
Just my two pennyworth.
Also, amused he said he'd do a deal with the Devil to get a referendum, given it'll (almost certainly) be in the Conservative manifesto.
Panorama, like Newsnight, used to be a serious and good programme. That 30 mins was all smear, all innuendo, all testimony from individuals who admit they undertook criminal acts.
That isn't to say his methods aren't dodgy and there is shit coming down the pipeline, anybody who saw the proper documentary CH4 did a while back would know that.
I tend to agree. Cammo's so-called pledge gave him wriggle room and he took it. I understood what he meant and still can't see what the fuss was about. At worst, he was being a little slippery. In other words, he was being a politician.
It's the same with the £1.7bn from Europe. He won't be paying the full amount on December 1st.
But..
It does seem to have worked quite well for them. I'm still annoyed that they fooled me, but have been quietly pleased that they haven't taken the hit I thought they deserved over it.
I find it a fascinating period. I was thrilled when I visited Prague to see the window where the famous defenestration which sparked the war took place (although it isn't that high above the ground.)
From his point of view, Farage is right to say he'd deal with Labour; he can't allow UKIP to be seen as only being willing to support the Tories in Westminster. In reality, I very much doubt that Labour would be prepared to offer UKIP anything like what they'd accept or anything like what the Conservatives would but that's not the point.
There will be tens of thousands of Labour voters in what will notionally be Tory/ UKIP marginals. Indicating that he would not rule out a deal with Labour under the right circumstances only enhances the 'Vote UKIP get Labour' narrative that the Tories have so kindly created for him.......
And as an ex conservative that doesn't bother me one iota particularly when the Tories have collaborated with the likes of Milburn, Hutton, Hoey, Adonis, Field etc during this government.
Reality is Miliband would never do such a deal. So all Farage is doing is not alienating a whole group of voters who are pretty much closed to voting Tory but who at a push might vote UKIP to get rid of the Tories. In fact based on policies the Tories are generally closer to the Labour position than UKIP
Suffolk by contrast was dominated by small holdings and tenant farmers and so Labour never had much appeal in the rural areas there.
Studying theology and studying science are quite separate and often conflicting domains, it was more the Protestant ethos of education, study and challenging orthodoxy that set the seed for modern scientific method.
As he's onsite perhaps: would like to say if he thinks the government's response to the Rotherham report is acceptable or not ?
And likewise anyone else if they would like to answer.
I thought Brown had a plan. I even-with no evidence whatsoever-thought Ed might have one. Possibly keeping his powder dry. I thought his conference speech
might be a wolf whistle that I couldn't pick up on.
..........Well we're now looking at Christmas and even I as a Labour supporter can't think of a single reason why I should vote Labour. Well maybe not being Tory but the Greens aren't Tory either.
Labour have chosen a lemon and it's time to make a move.....